Not fully relevant to this thread but any idea why Buzelis didn't play at the end of the game? As well as PWill and Huerter played, I would have rather had him out there. He could ice those Kornet lobs and to be totally honest I'd rather put him out on iso against VWemby then Vuc.
“The two bigs out there and then him having to be in coverage, I think that was really challenging for him quite honestly,” Donovan said. “We weren't switching. We had been switching earlier in the game with Barnes.”
I love Buzi but yeah, I agree with Billy he was not matching up well defensively with the Spurs in the 4th quarter.
He had some definite lapses but I feel like Billy is a disapproving dad with this poor dude. He shot better than Huerter from yesterday and has for the season. Matas played Wemby pretty darn well. He stayed close enough to make shots uncomfortable while also not having the lead feet of Vuc. I would have also preferred Jalen in this situation but it is what is is.
Bulls Spurs is an instructive comparison. The Spurs had young 'talent' in Vassell, Sochan, Keldon Johnson that was supposed to be their new core. They are still on the roster but replaced with better players...obviously Fox but also clearly Castle and Dylan Harper. Their young core is now their bench. The Bulls started that same process last year with Matas for PW. They SHOULD have drafted another ready replacement this year instead of Noah (I believe they had Cedric Howard in their sights but Memphis jumped in front of them with a smart trade, while AKME sat back as usual).
What was clear last night and its good to be reminded was who can play when the game is on the line and who can't. Not surprising, but soooo clear. Yes: Huerter, Jones, Jalen Smith (Giddey and Coby fit that group too; Ayo also, but he either wasn't healthy last night or Wemby scared him away from the rim; I think Zach Collins is also a fine backup center). Clearly no: Okoro, PW, Vuc + the bench long-tail). Matas missing in the final lineup was clearly Donovan over-thinking; Matas is playing way too lose right now, yes, but he's aggressive with talent. PW and Okoro have the same sloppy downside with much less upside). Good start but they need to clean that all up.
And also: Wemby to me seems like a dick. A talented dick, but I found myself rooting hard against him last night to fail. Unfortunately, those final threes shut me up. Probably just jealous :)
I'm not sure the Bulls' situation in regards to drafting players is the same as San Antonio's. The Spurs drafted Wemby #1 in 2023, drafted Castle #4 last year and then drafted Harper at #2 this year. All three of those guys were known quantities with high upsides, hence being such high draft picks.
The Bulls continue to draft outside of the top 10 where known quantities are all but gone or have limited upside. Since the Bulls don't currently have a Wemby-type player (young, superstar upside) to build around, they kind of have to take swings at unproven, but high upside young guys like Matas and Essengue. Sure, Coward is good, but the expectation is that his ceiling is fairly low. What does that do for the Bulls?
I'm not saying we'll look back in 10 years and say Essengue was the better player than Coward. It's quite possible he won't be. But Essengue clearly has a way higher ceiling than Coward and that's kind of what the Bulls need to prioritize right now.
Regarding your final paragraph, I'm not sure I see how Wemby seems like a dick. He seems way more humble than most superstars in the league to me.
Honestly Coward has a higher floor and ceiling imo. I liked Coward a lot and we shoulda traded up for him. I think he could be a Jimmy Butler type player. I struggle to see what Noa is going to be even at his possible best. And don't say Giannis bc that is ludicrous
I probably should have worded my initial comment better. Essengue may not actually have a way higher ceiling than Coward, however I think the consensus pre-draft was that he had a higher theoretical ceiling than Coward.
As you point out, it's certainly possible Coward turns into the next Jimmy. But Jimmy also wasn't looked at as having a high ceiling coming out of college. You get those occasional guys that just totally blow past whatever ceiling was placed on them. Jimmy was one of them and maybe Coward is too. We'll just have to wait to find out.
My overall point wasn't about Essengue being better than Coward though (or having a theoretical higher ceiling). My point was pushing back against Rich's assertion that the Bulls should have prioritized drafting an NBA-ready player instead of a project because that's what San Antonio did and they're having great success with that. San Antonio's been able to do that because they keep drafting in the top 5. The Bulls are not drafting in the top 5. The prospects outside of the top 10 are much different than those in the top 5. That was my point.
Coward is 22 and Essengue is 19. How do you figure that Coward's ceiling is higher? I would say the odds are extremely good that in 3 years Noa will be better than Coward is right now.
Age doesnt mean shit. Older prospects can be successful,again look at jimmy. Ppl get caught up in oh hes only 19, hes only 20. PDub was only 19 at one pointtoo.
Coward is already a plus shooter, solid defender and decent playmaker, good athleticism too...at worst he is an above average starting SG. If he can sharpen his handle, strong possibilty of Allstar level player.
Noa just looks like an energy big. I dont see what skills he is going to sharpen. What do you think he could be realistically? I have just seen a lot of prospects like him that stay potential guys forever....maybe he could he a taller Brandon Clarke.
Also we already have Matas as our future 4 so Noa would have to be the 5 which i dont see...unless you want Matas at 3 which i dont think would be optimal
Interesting you say age doesn't matter. But when Coward was 19 he was a sub coming off the bench at Eastern Washington. Now at 22, he may be the next Jimmy Butler. It sure seems to me that he got a lot better in the last 3 years.
I was going to put in a bit about Buzelis losing playing time, especially to end games, but will wait and see on the Pistons game
this shouldn't be too surprising: Billy played Buzelis last year only because others got hurt, even when he was contributing more than veterans Billy didn't 'trust' it. And he may be right on that, but it is a '43 wins by any means necessary' mindset versus 'building while competitive'
Some of the amazing "recovery" plays Buzi makes on defense tend to cover up a real lack of defensive awareness that I've been noticing quite often (e.g., head often turned the wrong way when guys make basket cuts, not understanding his assignment, switching communication issues, etc.). Like, blocking your own man's shot from behind is a pretty incredible thing he can do consistently, but why is he behind that guy consistently?
He's young and learning (and still too skinny to body up bigger guys). I feel like he's going to get better, unlike Zach who we finally understood was a lost cause. But I understand what Billy is seeing on that end, and that's why Billy sat him (as Billy explained).
Now the alternative was PWill, and, well...different strengths there (literally) but not sure I like seeing him play crunch time minutes on offense. In fact, I kind of hated that.
This is something I don't see many people talk about. Yes, Matas makes some great defensive plays that we all like to mention, but, like you say, often times he's making these highlight plays because he's out of position. His defensive fundamentals aren't very good.
With that being said, it's clear he wants to get better and I fully expect him too. But we shouldn't act like he's actually a really good defender, because he currently isn't.
A big part of Donovan's job this year is developing Matas. That doesn't necessarily mean giving him starter minutes, but unless He is looking overwhelmed out there, I think he needs to play. I expect Donovan sees it that way too.
well he's getting pulled after defensive mistakes and not closing a couple games. Do you think that indicates Donovan feels he's overwhelmed, and do you agree?
You know me, I've always believed you need to try to put young players in situations where they can succeed and gain confidence. I've never been a fan of just putting your prospects out there and let them learn from their mistakes, because you don't want them to learn how to lose and accept losing.
I'm not too concerned about Matas right now. He's athletic, he has a lot of tools and he seems coachable. But he does seem a little frustrated right now.
The Bulls franchise is not "perpetually running in place; a third of the NBA franchises are perpetually without an NBA championship.
I suppose injuries matter for all teams except the Bulls.
Coby White is a major cog in the wheel; call him and Josh Giddey 1A and 1B if you will. Now they're both out.
The biggest predictor of a team's chances in their next game is the quality of their next opponent. The Bulls schedule was easier, now it's harder, next it'll be easier. Let's see if they revert to winning if they're healthy.
I've leaned into the "well, fine, let's just see what happens if we try to be good" side of my Bulls fan brain/heart this year, and honestly whatever happens the rest of the way, I think 6-4 to start the year, against that schedule, and with our best scoring option out all 10 games, was an absolutely incredible achievement -- especially considering we were competitive in all four of those losses, with 2 coming down to the wire. And all losses against arguably top 10-or-12 teams in the NBA, with three on the road. Games where all but the most elite teams come in as underdogs.
I think we probably would have won last night with a healthy Giddey. And while the analysis about Coby White in this post is also probably correct (his replacements have been balling out at a high level), Coby is the closest thing on our roster to a star that can counter the "superstar effect" in 4th quarters. He's also the guy who dunked over Wemby last year -- nobody else came close to trying that last night.
But...<screeches tires>...a quick left turn, let's pivot to the Mavs GM news. AD trade rumors are swirling. Probably worth a post of its own, but is there any world where we get AD and we're thrilled about it? (I mean the real-life current version of AD who's aging, constantly injured, and paid a boatload -- not the platonic ideal of what AD can be.).
I highly doubt the Bulls would go for Davis anytime soon. He has a a hit of 53k over the next three years and even assuming a swap for Vuc it would put them over the first apron and close to the second.
This year they'd take a hit, but could potentially offset most of that with outgoing salary (assuming the Mavs would take Vuc, maybe Coby and/or other expirings plus picks). Then they should have plenty of room to stay below that apron next year and beyond -- we've got over $70 million in space, at least. But hypothetically, what if the 'Dorfs decided to open up their checkbook for a hometown kid who could conceivably take them to the next level? Would you want them to do that?
Pros: Outside of Giddey (who they won't trade) the Bulls don't have many guys on the roster who are irreplaceable. Regardless of how a trade shakes out, it's gonna basically be Vuc for AD in terms of the Bulls' lineup impact. The Giddey-AD connection could be pretty special. And AD would immediately become the team's best "closer" on both the defensive and offensive ends. And who are we gonna get with all that cap space next year anyway? Just max out Coby, extend Huerter, overpay Ayo, give Vuc a 2-year extension, sign a couple MLE-level guys and be done with it?
Cons: If the Bulls' new playing style is what's keeping them afloat, how would AD fit with that? And of course, when trading for AD you're also trading for a robust wardrobe of street clothes that he'll be regularly seen wearing behind the bench during critical games.
My verdict: NO, but mainly due to injury concerns. (And also because AK would send out three Firsts when he could get AD for one.)
I guess it all depends if you think Davis can be healthy, and that is a big if, but I think the trade Lowe proposed could be a good one for us. Vuc, White, Pat, the Portland 1st and our 1st is not a lot. I would give Portland's 1st to anyone that would take Pat's contract, so what's left is Vuc, Coby and a 1st for AD. Vuc is gone anyway and Coby may be too, so it's not a lot for us to give up.
The deal as Lowe proposes it would leave us with about $32 million of cap space going into the offseason. We could sign a free agent for that, add a $9 million player for the room (or re-sign Ayo with that), pick up Philip's option, sign a $6 million player with the biennial and fill out the roster with minimum contracts. We would lose Huerter, which would be a shame, as well as Collins.
A better option may be to expand our trade with the Mavs. They are $16 million over the tax line right now and probably are looking to get under. We could take in Naji Marshall (who is good) and Jaden Hardy (who is not good) for a couple 2nd round picks by using our MLE and the $6 million exception we have left from the Lavine trade.
Marshall is on the books for $9 million next year and Hardy $6 million. If we did that, it would make the deal a lot palatable for Dallas while bringing back another useful player on the wing for us.
It would also put us in a position where we would operate above the cap next year, which means we could retain the rights to Ayo and Huerter next year (and Collins too, if we wanted). We would also have the full MLE of $16 million to use, instead of the $9 million room.
This would be a huge change of strategy for us, going from a young rebuilding team (with two potential 1st round picks this year) to a more veteran team with Davis as bonafide star. I think It all depends on whether Davis has a decent chance of staying healthy and productive over his next 3 years.
Something like that (maybe with a protected first) could potentially get it done, depending on the new Mavs front office's attitude -- do they just want to move on from AD as quickly as possible, given that he'll always carry the stain of the Luka trade with that fan base, and they want to pivot to building around Flagg? Or will they want to hold out for something that seems more valuable to appease fans angered about getting swindled in the previous deal? (I mention the fans twice here because their revolt was no small part of why Nico Harrison got fired.)
I'm not sure if AK is capable of making insultingly low offers. He traded a haul for Vuc, and our next big trade acquisitions were DeMar and Lonzo -- for which we sent a combined total of one 1st rounder, three 2nds, Garrett Temple, Tomas Satoransky, Thaddeus Young, and Al-Farouq Aminu. Which doesn't sound that bad until we remember that those assets were sent out to acquire players who were FREE AGENTS AT THE TIME. And that doesn't count the 2nd-rounder we lost for the Lonzo tampering penalty. Most of AK's other dealings have involved dumping guys well after their market value had declined (vs trying to acquire the big prize in a trade).
essentially what one (specifically: me) is worried about with AK and his identity > talent words. AD does not fit Giddey or this fun vibe whatever. But should that matter?
It's a more critical question if AD was younger/healthier. Since he's old and injured all the time, it's not worth it I agree. Sadly I have to think similarly with Zion and Ja, they are not old but do look diminished.
I don't really buy the "fit" concerns as Giddey's style of play right now isn't really all that different than LeBron's approach (just with a different level of athleticism) and LeBron and AD won a ring together. And while things might not be quite as fun during the regular season with AD around, he immediately addresses some of the things that keep us from being a serious playoff team.
But, yeah, old. Injured. Not a hard pass, but still a pass.
If the Bulls were to actually trade for AD, I think they'd basically need to hide him on the bench and then dust him off if they make the playoffs. Which actually might not be the worst strategy since the East is hot garbage anyway.
I'm mostly a Vooch defender generally (especially last year and over the past month) but last night was just awful. He looked like he was playing old-man pickup ball at the Y and a bunch of young college kids came in trying to run him off the floor, and he just didn't want to deal with that.
He managed only 6 points against Paul Reed and Tolu Smith. How does thata happen? And then on the other end Reed and Smith shot 14-17, including 10-11 inside 3 feet.
I agree Vuc was even worse. But there was some 'maybe PWill back?' thoughts to start this year whereas I have just accepted that Vuc will be here regardless of performance, forever
Not fully relevant to this thread but any idea why Buzelis didn't play at the end of the game? As well as PWill and Huerter played, I would have rather had him out there. He could ice those Kornet lobs and to be totally honest I'd rather put him out on iso against VWemby then Vuc.
Billy's words:
“The two bigs out there and then him having to be in coverage, I think that was really challenging for him quite honestly,” Donovan said. “We weren't switching. We had been switching earlier in the game with Barnes.”
I love Buzi but yeah, I agree with Billy he was not matching up well defensively with the Spurs in the 4th quarter.
He had some definite lapses but I feel like Billy is a disapproving dad with this poor dude. He shot better than Huerter from yesterday and has for the season. Matas played Wemby pretty darn well. He stayed close enough to make shots uncomfortable while also not having the lead feet of Vuc. I would have also preferred Jalen in this situation but it is what is is.
Bulls Spurs is an instructive comparison. The Spurs had young 'talent' in Vassell, Sochan, Keldon Johnson that was supposed to be their new core. They are still on the roster but replaced with better players...obviously Fox but also clearly Castle and Dylan Harper. Their young core is now their bench. The Bulls started that same process last year with Matas for PW. They SHOULD have drafted another ready replacement this year instead of Noah (I believe they had Cedric Howard in their sights but Memphis jumped in front of them with a smart trade, while AKME sat back as usual).
What was clear last night and its good to be reminded was who can play when the game is on the line and who can't. Not surprising, but soooo clear. Yes: Huerter, Jones, Jalen Smith (Giddey and Coby fit that group too; Ayo also, but he either wasn't healthy last night or Wemby scared him away from the rim; I think Zach Collins is also a fine backup center). Clearly no: Okoro, PW, Vuc + the bench long-tail). Matas missing in the final lineup was clearly Donovan over-thinking; Matas is playing way too lose right now, yes, but he's aggressive with talent. PW and Okoro have the same sloppy downside with much less upside). Good start but they need to clean that all up.
And also: Wemby to me seems like a dick. A talented dick, but I found myself rooting hard against him last night to fail. Unfortunately, those final threes shut me up. Probably just jealous :)
I'm not sure the Bulls' situation in regards to drafting players is the same as San Antonio's. The Spurs drafted Wemby #1 in 2023, drafted Castle #4 last year and then drafted Harper at #2 this year. All three of those guys were known quantities with high upsides, hence being such high draft picks.
The Bulls continue to draft outside of the top 10 where known quantities are all but gone or have limited upside. Since the Bulls don't currently have a Wemby-type player (young, superstar upside) to build around, they kind of have to take swings at unproven, but high upside young guys like Matas and Essengue. Sure, Coward is good, but the expectation is that his ceiling is fairly low. What does that do for the Bulls?
I'm not saying we'll look back in 10 years and say Essengue was the better player than Coward. It's quite possible he won't be. But Essengue clearly has a way higher ceiling than Coward and that's kind of what the Bulls need to prioritize right now.
Regarding your final paragraph, I'm not sure I see how Wemby seems like a dick. He seems way more humble than most superstars in the league to me.
Honestly Coward has a higher floor and ceiling imo. I liked Coward a lot and we shoulda traded up for him. I think he could be a Jimmy Butler type player. I struggle to see what Noa is going to be even at his possible best. And don't say Giannis bc that is ludicrous
I probably should have worded my initial comment better. Essengue may not actually have a way higher ceiling than Coward, however I think the consensus pre-draft was that he had a higher theoretical ceiling than Coward.
As you point out, it's certainly possible Coward turns into the next Jimmy. But Jimmy also wasn't looked at as having a high ceiling coming out of college. You get those occasional guys that just totally blow past whatever ceiling was placed on them. Jimmy was one of them and maybe Coward is too. We'll just have to wait to find out.
My overall point wasn't about Essengue being better than Coward though (or having a theoretical higher ceiling). My point was pushing back against Rich's assertion that the Bulls should have prioritized drafting an NBA-ready player instead of a project because that's what San Antonio did and they're having great success with that. San Antonio's been able to do that because they keep drafting in the top 5. The Bulls are not drafting in the top 5. The prospects outside of the top 10 are much different than those in the top 5. That was my point.
Coward is 22 and Essengue is 19. How do you figure that Coward's ceiling is higher? I would say the odds are extremely good that in 3 years Noa will be better than Coward is right now.
Age doesnt mean shit. Older prospects can be successful,again look at jimmy. Ppl get caught up in oh hes only 19, hes only 20. PDub was only 19 at one pointtoo.
Coward is already a plus shooter, solid defender and decent playmaker, good athleticism too...at worst he is an above average starting SG. If he can sharpen his handle, strong possibilty of Allstar level player.
Noa just looks like an energy big. I dont see what skills he is going to sharpen. What do you think he could be realistically? I have just seen a lot of prospects like him that stay potential guys forever....maybe he could he a taller Brandon Clarke.
Also we already have Matas as our future 4 so Noa would have to be the 5 which i dont see...unless you want Matas at 3 which i dont think would be optimal
Interesting you say age doesn't matter. But when Coward was 19 he was a sub coming off the bench at Eastern Washington. Now at 22, he may be the next Jimmy Butler. It sure seems to me that he got a lot better in the last 3 years.
I was going to put in a bit about Buzelis losing playing time, especially to end games, but will wait and see on the Pistons game
this shouldn't be too surprising: Billy played Buzelis last year only because others got hurt, even when he was contributing more than veterans Billy didn't 'trust' it. And he may be right on that, but it is a '43 wins by any means necessary' mindset versus 'building while competitive'
Some of the amazing "recovery" plays Buzi makes on defense tend to cover up a real lack of defensive awareness that I've been noticing quite often (e.g., head often turned the wrong way when guys make basket cuts, not understanding his assignment, switching communication issues, etc.). Like, blocking your own man's shot from behind is a pretty incredible thing he can do consistently, but why is he behind that guy consistently?
He's young and learning (and still too skinny to body up bigger guys). I feel like he's going to get better, unlike Zach who we finally understood was a lost cause. But I understand what Billy is seeing on that end, and that's why Billy sat him (as Billy explained).
Now the alternative was PWill, and, well...different strengths there (literally) but not sure I like seeing him play crunch time minutes on offense. In fact, I kind of hated that.
This is something I don't see many people talk about. Yes, Matas makes some great defensive plays that we all like to mention, but, like you say, often times he's making these highlight plays because he's out of position. His defensive fundamentals aren't very good.
With that being said, it's clear he wants to get better and I fully expect him too. But we shouldn't act like he's actually a really good defender, because he currently isn't.
True. But has anybody ever said Matas is a really good defender? He had a hard time tonight again.
Yes, I regularly see Bulls fans talk about Matas being a great defender. Maybe not on BaB, but we're a special breed here haha!
A big part of Donovan's job this year is developing Matas. That doesn't necessarily mean giving him starter minutes, but unless He is looking overwhelmed out there, I think he needs to play. I expect Donovan sees it that way too.
well he's getting pulled after defensive mistakes and not closing a couple games. Do you think that indicates Donovan feels he's overwhelmed, and do you agree?
You know me, I've always believed you need to try to put young players in situations where they can succeed and gain confidence. I've never been a fan of just putting your prospects out there and let them learn from their mistakes, because you don't want them to learn how to lose and accept losing.
I'm not too concerned about Matas right now. He's athletic, he has a lot of tools and he seems coachable. But he does seem a little frustrated right now.
The Bulls franchise is not "perpetually running in place; a third of the NBA franchises are perpetually without an NBA championship.
I suppose injuries matter for all teams except the Bulls.
Coby White is a major cog in the wheel; call him and Josh Giddey 1A and 1B if you will. Now they're both out.
The biggest predictor of a team's chances in their next game is the quality of their next opponent. The Bulls schedule was easier, now it's harder, next it'll be easier. Let's see if they revert to winning if they're healthy.
I've leaned into the "well, fine, let's just see what happens if we try to be good" side of my Bulls fan brain/heart this year, and honestly whatever happens the rest of the way, I think 6-4 to start the year, against that schedule, and with our best scoring option out all 10 games, was an absolutely incredible achievement -- especially considering we were competitive in all four of those losses, with 2 coming down to the wire. And all losses against arguably top 10-or-12 teams in the NBA, with three on the road. Games where all but the most elite teams come in as underdogs.
I think we probably would have won last night with a healthy Giddey. And while the analysis about Coby White in this post is also probably correct (his replacements have been balling out at a high level), Coby is the closest thing on our roster to a star that can counter the "superstar effect" in 4th quarters. He's also the guy who dunked over Wemby last year -- nobody else came close to trying that last night.
But...<screeches tires>...a quick left turn, let's pivot to the Mavs GM news. AD trade rumors are swirling. Probably worth a post of its own, but is there any world where we get AD and we're thrilled about it? (I mean the real-life current version of AD who's aging, constantly injured, and paid a boatload -- not the platonic ideal of what AD can be.).
I highly doubt the Bulls would go for Davis anytime soon. He has a a hit of 53k over the next three years and even assuming a swap for Vuc it would put them over the first apron and close to the second.
This year they'd take a hit, but could potentially offset most of that with outgoing salary (assuming the Mavs would take Vuc, maybe Coby and/or other expirings plus picks). Then they should have plenty of room to stay below that apron next year and beyond -- we've got over $70 million in space, at least. But hypothetically, what if the 'Dorfs decided to open up their checkbook for a hometown kid who could conceivably take them to the next level? Would you want them to do that?
Pros: Outside of Giddey (who they won't trade) the Bulls don't have many guys on the roster who are irreplaceable. Regardless of how a trade shakes out, it's gonna basically be Vuc for AD in terms of the Bulls' lineup impact. The Giddey-AD connection could be pretty special. And AD would immediately become the team's best "closer" on both the defensive and offensive ends. And who are we gonna get with all that cap space next year anyway? Just max out Coby, extend Huerter, overpay Ayo, give Vuc a 2-year extension, sign a couple MLE-level guys and be done with it?
Cons: If the Bulls' new playing style is what's keeping them afloat, how would AD fit with that? And of course, when trading for AD you're also trading for a robust wardrobe of street clothes that he'll be regularly seen wearing behind the bench during critical games.
My verdict: NO, but mainly due to injury concerns. (And also because AK would send out three Firsts when he could get AD for one.)
I guess it all depends if you think Davis can be healthy, and that is a big if, but I think the trade Lowe proposed could be a good one for us. Vuc, White, Pat, the Portland 1st and our 1st is not a lot. I would give Portland's 1st to anyone that would take Pat's contract, so what's left is Vuc, Coby and a 1st for AD. Vuc is gone anyway and Coby may be too, so it's not a lot for us to give up.
The deal as Lowe proposes it would leave us with about $32 million of cap space going into the offseason. We could sign a free agent for that, add a $9 million player for the room (or re-sign Ayo with that), pick up Philip's option, sign a $6 million player with the biennial and fill out the roster with minimum contracts. We would lose Huerter, which would be a shame, as well as Collins.
A better option may be to expand our trade with the Mavs. They are $16 million over the tax line right now and probably are looking to get under. We could take in Naji Marshall (who is good) and Jaden Hardy (who is not good) for a couple 2nd round picks by using our MLE and the $6 million exception we have left from the Lavine trade.
Marshall is on the books for $9 million next year and Hardy $6 million. If we did that, it would make the deal a lot palatable for Dallas while bringing back another useful player on the wing for us.
It would also put us in a position where we would operate above the cap next year, which means we could retain the rights to Ayo and Huerter next year (and Collins too, if we wanted). We would also have the full MLE of $16 million to use, instead of the $9 million room.
This would be a huge change of strategy for us, going from a young rebuilding team (with two potential 1st round picks this year) to a more veteran team with Davis as bonafide star. I think It all depends on whether Davis has a decent chance of staying healthy and productive over his next 3 years.
I think it works out very well cap-wise, because the Bulls have that long-sought flexibility of not having to pay star players
but paying Davis >$50M doesn't work with their 'paying players gives Jerry indigestion' ethos. David Eckstein didn't make $50M in his career!
Jerry has always liked signing over-the-hill stars to fill the seats.
I would not be thrilled. If I were AK, my offer for AD would be insultingly low.
Like, Pat, Noa, Ayo and Collins
Something like that (maybe with a protected first) could potentially get it done, depending on the new Mavs front office's attitude -- do they just want to move on from AD as quickly as possible, given that he'll always carry the stain of the Luka trade with that fan base, and they want to pivot to building around Flagg? Or will they want to hold out for something that seems more valuable to appease fans angered about getting swindled in the previous deal? (I mention the fans twice here because their revolt was no small part of why Nico Harrison got fired.)
I'm not sure if AK is capable of making insultingly low offers. He traded a haul for Vuc, and our next big trade acquisitions were DeMar and Lonzo -- for which we sent a combined total of one 1st rounder, three 2nds, Garrett Temple, Tomas Satoransky, Thaddeus Young, and Al-Farouq Aminu. Which doesn't sound that bad until we remember that those assets were sent out to acquire players who were FREE AGENTS AT THE TIME. And that doesn't count the 2nd-rounder we lost for the Lonzo tampering penalty. Most of AK's other dealings have involved dumping guys well after their market value had declined (vs trying to acquire the big prize in a trade).
here was Zach Lowe's take https://roundtable.io/sports/nba/bulls/opinion/could-the-chicago-bulls-be-an-anthony-davis-trade-candidate
essentially what one (specifically: me) is worried about with AK and his identity > talent words. AD does not fit Giddey or this fun vibe whatever. But should that matter?
It's a more critical question if AD was younger/healthier. Since he's old and injured all the time, it's not worth it I agree. Sadly I have to think similarly with Zion and Ja, they are not old but do look diminished.
I don't really buy the "fit" concerns as Giddey's style of play right now isn't really all that different than LeBron's approach (just with a different level of athleticism) and LeBron and AD won a ring together. And while things might not be quite as fun during the regular season with AD around, he immediately addresses some of the things that keep us from being a serious playoff team.
But, yeah, old. Injured. Not a hard pass, but still a pass.
If the Bulls were to actually trade for AD, I think they'd basically need to hide him on the bench and then dust him off if they make the playoffs. Which actually might not be the worst strategy since the East is hot garbage anyway.
I would not for AD, but if I were the Bulls I would be interested in Zion for sure.
I was going to keep replying but instead made a big ol' post: https://www.blogabull.com/p/considering-a-bulls-trade-for-anthony
From the firing of Nico Harrisson, do we have to wait for AKME trading away a generational talent to be freed from their torment ? ^^
can't be fired for tearing down a contender if you never build one...
well boo, tonight's game has been thrown in the junk pile. No Bulls credit if they win.
https://open.substack.com/chat/posts/4c32ac9c-5176-4899-88fe-c74033978c01
But they are likely to get the win, and they don't seed teams based on what BlogABull determines is real
Do they also avoid discredit for that loss then? What a nightmare of a game. 48 minutes of summer league garbage time.
yep
though I think Patrick Williams's performance was informative (negatively)
And Vooch looked completely disinterested on both ends against the Pistons B squad.
I'm mostly a Vooch defender generally (especially last year and over the past month) but last night was just awful. He looked like he was playing old-man pickup ball at the Y and a bunch of young college kids came in trying to run him off the floor, and he just didn't want to deal with that.
He managed only 6 points against Paul Reed and Tolu Smith. How does thata happen? And then on the other end Reed and Smith shot 14-17, including 10-11 inside 3 feet.
I agree Vuc was even worse. But there was some 'maybe PWill back?' thoughts to start this year whereas I have just accepted that Vuc will be here regardless of performance, forever