Why can't someone do half a day of journalism and report what other GMs anonymously think of him? That used to be the job. But maybe never was in Chicago with the Bulls especially.
The problem with the Athletic's coverage of the Bulls is that it is getting less and less by the day. Not sure if that is by design or a symptom of something else. Darnell may crank out one piece of content a week, if that. He seems more interested in promoting his own blog than his Bulls content.
This is a problem all it's own in that the overall Bulls media coverage is lacking.
KC = good but just goes along with whatever the team says
Cowley = stinks and nobody cares about his content
McGraw = stinks and not enough content
Cody = good but not enough content
Darnell = good but not enough content
CHGO = a lot of content but seems to be limited
Sam Smith = doesn't do the beat, just writes whatever crazy stuff he feels like writing
Definitely agree. I probably should have clarified that I don't actually expect Darnell to write a piece with the opinions of other GMs. I was more saying that if any beat reporter were to do it, I think Darnell would be the most likely with how frustrated he seems to be with this FO.
Ah ok, I missed that. And that would explain Darnell's lack of access and content.
I agree with your take on Will and CHGO. He does a really good job putting out content and asking good questions at the pressers. I just wish he had a bigger push behind him.
I don't follow traditional sports media anymore but there have been some epic YouTuber rants about the Bulls after the trade deadline. Hoping at least one of them goes viral!
No time for that kind of journalism. I think there are still a couple unheard hot takes about Jerry Krause's widow that need to be aired (sorry if that's rude but I guarantee you not a single person who bloviated about The Horror at The United Center last month knows her first name either).
Worst thing to happen to this team was narrowly losing to the Heat before Miami made its improbable run to the Finals. Never thought AK would be so delusional to think that was indicative of how close the Bulls were to winning playoff series, but here we are.
I think the thing we are all so confused about is that AKME came into their first two seasons guns ablazin'. They went bold with Patrick Williams, traded for Vuc, acquired Lonzo, acquired Demar, signed high upside guys in DJJ and Javonte, and found a diamond in the rough with Ayo.
I think we all saw a front office willing to go bold and use every avenue available to improve the roster. It was as if we had seen technicolor for the very first time.
And then for whatever reason, they stopped. Like, it feels like we are being gaslit. AKME legitimately just stopped trying. I've never seen a front office go from so aggressive to so conservative so quickly. It's as if after Lonzo got hurt they said "sorry, ran out of ammunition."
I think we all have our suspicions as to why they have holed up - but it doesn't make the whiplash any less alarming. Watching those videos of AK, I can't help but feel he doesn't believe in anything he is saying. He looks so dejected. My theory - and what I believe is most likely - is that AKME came in, said they can change things but needed to do it their way. They tried it their way, it crashed and burned when Lonzo got injured, Zach didn't take the next step, and Pat never became anything more than promise. Because of that, Jerry has them on a leash again. He's not going to let them spend his money unless the product affects his pocketbook.
This team will not even sniff the Larry O'Brien until Jerry is gone.
The problem with that theory is that AK clearly isn't worried about this summer's cap situation which I would imagine Jerry would be quite worried about if he had AK on such a tight leash regarding finances.
I think he's real worried about it. So worried that he won't even dip his toes into the topic publicly. "Those conversations are at the end of the season" means his having those conversations in the media. Right? RIGHT??
I think simplest explanation is that Arturas Karnisovas isn't a good General Manager. A separate issue, that doesn't help the first, but doesn't entirely inform the first, is that Jerry Reinsdorf isn't a good Owner.
The other problem with Jerry, aside from him just being bad at his job, is that he is an absentee governor. He's just a 'sign the checks' and 'final decision' guy. He's not a day-to-day involved governor, which is Michael Reinsdorf's supposed role. So Jerry, as much as we want him to be involved, he never will be.
I imagine he tells Michael something along the lines of, 'as long as we aren't operating in the red and as long as we can put butts in the seats, we are fine'. And it appears they run the Bulls under that scenario.
I'm not gonna relitigate AK's tenure as it has been done to death, but he's simply a bad VP. You can just compare payrolls across the league and evaluate based on standings and future upside - the resulting picture does not reflect well on AK's ability to spend intelligently. Reinsdorf isn't the only cheap owner in the league. He is definitely a problem but it doesn't change the fact that AK straight up sucks.
The Bulls currently have the 10th highest active payroll in the league.
To your point, like, yeah, yes--I get it, Reinsdorf likes money, is cheap.
But there's no amount of breaking up the dynasty talk from thirty years ago, no amount of historical luxury tax avoidance, no amount of selling off second round picks to start a "rebuild", no amount of Jerry Reinsdorf specifically that can really explain or absolve AK from being bad and very demonstrably bad (i.e. re-signing Vucevic), asleep (i.e. never turning over the bottom of his roster) and shameless (i.e. the above-mentioned press conference) re: his job.
This is not entirely accurate because 80% of Lonzo’s salary is repaid to the Bulls by league wide insurance, and that $16 million drops the Bulls down to 17th.
The Lonzo salary could and should have been excised from the salary cap - he is never going to play NBA ball again and the NBA allows those contracts to get removed from the cap calculations, even as the players get paid. But it is cheaper (less expenses) and more profitable (in terms of narrative and false hope sold to the fan base) to pretend that Lonzo could return.
The $20 million of dead money is useful to AKME and the Reinsdorfs insofar as it offers the perpetual false hope for future performance and is a convenient excuse for current performance, comes in at 20 cents on the dollar while handcuffing the team right at the luxury tax line where they are very obviously never going to go over.
For the Bulls, does the marginal benefit of adding a player exceed the additional cost?
Keep in mind that the Lonzo money isn't truly "dead". They could trade it to another team that's looking to shed payroll and save money.
Just to give an example, I have 0 doubt they could have called up the Jazz and Ainge would have given them John Collins (owed ~$75M) for Lonzo (owed $8M - $24M depending on if he ever plays again).
Just for this year, the marginal cost of adding collins would be $16M.
What would the marginal benefit of adding a middling PF to this team? Maybe a couple wins. Maybe not. Probably about the same.
This is a cost to ownership’s bottom line and to management’s ability to claim deus ex machina injuries, but not a cost that is externally material. From the perspective of the NBA’s CBA rules Collins and Lonzo are effectively the same.
Does ownership care about winning games or maximizing profits? Obviously, we know the answer.
Speaking of Marc Eversley potentially trying to keep his head down in hopes of not going down with a sinking ship, apparently he has been linked to the Hornets new front office opening. To be fair, a ton of people have been linked to it, but it seems pretty likely Eversley is trying to get out of Chicago as soon as he can.
I saw Cowley had that. Maybe ME is Cowley's source for "we don't all agree with what AK is doing" trade deadline info, so then as a favor Cowley floats ME's name for this job
Honestly wouldn't surprise me in the least. It's crazy how quiet ME is. Makes me think he's clearly not happy here (can't blame him) and he's doing everything he can to stay out of the shit show that is this organization.
I've read one interview with him during his entire tenure, and he was pushing back on the idea that he wasn't invested in the job by claiming his kids went to public school here and that he lived within the city limits (Lakeview).
He reiterated so many AK talking points right out of the gate — #ButLonzo, #competitive, #14-9, etc etc — that I think he's surrendered the right to be considered separate entity with anything like agency over decisions. I'm sure if we found the next Jokic in the second round, he'd claim ownership, just like his boss did (just kidding they traded away all our second round picks ha ha 😒)
One other thing I'd note is the Reinsdorfs have a long memory. One thing they looked pretty bad by doing what trading Luol Deng for literal nothing back in the middle of the season.
Among many completely valid reasons to shit on this transaction was that they were doing a bait and switch on all the folks that bought tickets for the 13-14 season expecting to see competitive basketball.
As far as I can tell, that's pretty much the only time the Bulls have done that. If they plan on being trash, they at least have the courtesy to let you know it ahead of time.
I'm curious about the role of two aspects that make AK suck: language and being accountable only to Jerry Reinsdorf. He didn't speak a word of English when he arrived at college in the U.S., and Lithuanian has very different phonetics and grammar. This obviously hampers his ability in press conferences, but more significantly, I wonder how effectively he's able to communicate within the boy's club of NBA executives -- he's the only foreign-born person in those ranks other than Masia Ujiri, who spent high school in the U.S. So I tend to think a lot of what reads as dumb is a combination of a limited English vocabulary and an introverted personality style. Working in the Reinsdorf's organization brings all the dynamics of operating in a family business. One of my favorites is called "cordial hypocrisy," the art of carefully avoiding discussions of tough issues and hard decisions. AK has likely instinctively internalized the mannerisms that enabled Kenny Williams to rack up a mediocre 30+ year career, be called a son when he got fired and get 3 sons drafted/hired by the Sox. Aligning with Reinsdorf's views automatically results in contempt for fans and anger toward the media.
I do think you're right here. English is this guy's second (?) language and his pressers need to be graded on a curve. I do think, though, given his position, the math on "competitive" has to be clearer than, well, getting the standings wrong and citing a 23 game sample from last year to build on.
He has to understand that more teams than not actually make the playoffs. That part isn't clouded by language barriers.
I agree, I think that's where the family business aspect comes in. If winning more games than other teams and being a championship contender was important to Reinsdorf, Kenny Williams and GarPax would have been fired much more quickly. Somehow, the dynamic of the Reinsdorf organization is so addled that AK's justifications must be what Reinsdorf wants to hear. That's confusing, because it can't be reduced to "Reinsdorf is cheap," since the cap results in all teams spending in the same general range. "Reinsdorf doesn't care" doesn't make sense either, because it seems he would cash in the enormous equity of the team if it didn't interest him any more. Bidding against yourself to sign Vucevic to a $20M deal doesn't maximize profit or on-the-court success. There's a stubborn illogic to how Reinsdorf operates, and opaque motives. He was the only person on Earth who thought hiring Tony LaRussa was a good idea, LaRussa included, and he strikes enough fear into his obsequious troops that he went ahead and did it, motivated solely by decades-old remorse over firing LaRussa. It may be as hard for AK to figure out what Reinsdorf wants as it is for us on the outside, and what we're seeing is based on some offhand Jerry comment about not wanting to see different players every year. I've seen lots of people twist themselves into knots by turning CEOs and business owners into their mommies and daddies. AK seems very ill-equipped to achieve measurable success while navigating in this environment. Paradoxically, that seems likely to give him a long career until boycotts and billboards cause Jerry enough embarrassment.
> He was the only person on Earth who thought hiring Tony LaRussa was a good idea, LaRussa included, and he strikes enough fear into his obsequious troops that he went ahead and did it, motivated solely by decades-old remorse over firing LaRussa.
He was about to do precisely the same thing with Doug Collins in 2008.
But dunno about Reinsdorfian ambiguity. I think the Bulls front office is working within very clear guidelines, it's just that they are just only somewhat concerned with winning basketball games.
For instance, I don't think Reinsdorf prohibits his team from going into the tax. It's just that collecting luxury tax payments is a unique mechanism for collecting a big chunk of Reinsdorf's annual operating profit. Payment from the luxury tax is guaranteed: spend less than $165 million, get (by pre-season estimates) $12 million. What else is guaranteed? If you don't get the 6th seed or greater, you might not get more than a single game of playoff revenue. That won't be $12 million for sure. If you could come up with a similar projection that spending into the luxury tax — for instance, the existence of Derrick Rose was a pretty good indicator that you could potentially gain more than $12 million by aiming for a high playoff seed — I think they'd go along with it. (They might have done so the summer after he was injured.)
Jerry's statements corroborate this kind of thinking. When the front office wanted to acquire Pau from the Grizzlies, he said he wouldn't pay for his salary unless he was on a contender for a championship. If you forego the tax windfall, you better have plans to get that money back some other way.
Herein is the sweet spot which Jerry has become so boastful about: finishing not-first, but good enough to get playoff revenue, give hope to fans and STILL collect his $12 million for the Warriors' folly.
This demand for his yearly operating profit is not at all a flexible or even sound business approach. Mark Cuban was sued when the Mavs were at their height by Ross Perot's nepo baby because the team was unprofitable. That was part of the plan: the team was unprofitable temporarily because they were in a small window to win a title. I would assume virtually every contending NBA team follows this pattern.
Actually writing this makes me question why I would follow this team at all. I have some good memories but they have the 20th best record in the NBA and are doing everything possible to inform us that this is all they want out of the game. Maybe we should believe them.
Yeah. It's more than being cheap. I don't know of other NBA owners that see the team so purely as a cash cow. It doesn't make a ton of financial sense either (he could sell the team, after all).
I believe I read this on Reddit, so take it with a HUGE grain of salt. Someone said that Jerry would be taxed to the high heavens if he sold the team; however, if he dies and the team is passed on to Michael, he could then sell it and either not be taxed or be taxed very little on it since he wasn't the one who originally paid for it.
I'm not tax expert and this was just some random comment on Reddit, so I'm not entirely sure if that's true or not. If it is, there's no way in hell Jerry sells this team. Maybe Michael decides he's sick of living in Chicago and "running" a basketball team and decides he wants to move to Mars with the $4+ billion he'd sell the team for.
NBA probably needs more financial incentives for winning. Maybe the under-the-cap money should be paid based on how many wins you got? I also think the draft lottery should be equal weight random draw for all 14 teams in it. There should be a pot of cash paid out to the 16 playoff teams that increases with each round you win, etc. NBA needs to fix every hole that allows losing to be more profitable than winning.
I dunno, teams already get playoff revenue as an incentive to win and the brand awareness/prestige. If that's not enough to get an owner like Reinsdorf to actually try, then it would probably take a mountain of cash so big that the league would go under.
I'm halfway through the second quarter (couldn't watch last night) and Dominique has said Coby White took a bad shot three times. All three shots were wide open. They just happened not to go in. 😂
Shout-out to the other Hawks commentator saying "Boy this Bulls team sure does struggle to score" near the end of the first half only for the Bulls to go on to score their season high. 😂😂
just a shame that AK doesn't believe in Ayo, as if he couldn't have replaced Caruso and kept the team "competitive" AND you'd have two first-round picks
IMO, you have to look at Arturas's boss, Jerry Reinsdorf and understand that he is just an investor and to him, owning the Bulls team is an investment like the stock market. He has no love for basketball and like the guys he hired, probably spends little time watching it.
Arturas job is to get guys on the team that fit chemistry wise without over paying for them like they did for Lavine. I heard that they had 1.7 million available and an open spot on the roster. They need a real 3 point shooter like Joe Harris who is now available but they always wait too long because they are scared to spend Reinsdorf's money.
He doesnt care about what the fans want but he better start caring because they want some wins and not word salad. Reinsdorf really should sell the Bulls to someone who loves basketball and wants more than notible players hired initially to sell tickets.
It is frustrating because of the way it looks from the outside. JR finds a player that looks good at first and doesn't go deep enough to know if this guy is going to work long term and over pays him. Then if things dont work out immediately or the guy gets injured, he lets everyone know that they are in a hurry to trade him.
They do not look at how bad the coach is and usually that is the problem. If they used careful evaluation when looking for a coach and not jump to conclusions, they would not have to try to sell the lie that the team is trying to find its identity. Donovan needs to get serious coach training or the Bulls need to find a coach that knows how analyze his players and use them correctly. Spend the money for a good coach Jerry! Then you won't have to overspend on players.
It really irritates me to see that Donovan does the same thing over and over again expecting different results and doesn't seem to listen to his players and it also looks like the players gets minutes according to how much money the make. Vucevic is not as good a center as Drummond and makes 20 times more money so Drummond gets 10-15 mins playing time and Vuch gets 30-35 mins.
They would win more games if they were paired as starters. Drummond can guard the rim much better than Vuch alone and close the door for every good guard on opposing teams that can score. It has been proven. If a guard from an opposing team scores 70 points against the Bulls, someone is overlooking a problem regarding rim protection and you keep your best rim protector on the bench. There's about 6 teams that would love to have Drummond and pay him better but Donovan keep this 2 time allstar on the bench limiting him to 10-15 minutes. If Donovan has a beef against a player, he cuts their minutes.
Reinsdorf needs to ask Donovan what the hell is going on. Even the fans can see this.
I don't understand why so many people think Drummond is some great defensive center. I mean, he's a better defender than Vooch but Vooch is a terrible defender.
Drummond may be underpaid but he's definitely not massively underpaid. He likely won't get more than $8 million a year on whatever contract he signs this summer.
The center position has evolved. Being a versatile defender and rim protector is the most important thing by far. Even rebounding isn't as important anymore since guards and forwards crash the glass a lot more than they used to.
Look at what Drummond is good at. He's a great rebounder and a decent defender by some metrics (a bad defender by others). He has zero offensive game. He's not a threat to score or distribute the ball.
That's not a great center right there. He can be a more than serviceable backup, but let's not pretend he's some amazing center just because other teams were interested in him at the deadline. Notice all of those teams wanted him as their backup.
Drummond is a great center with massive focus issues. We've seen what he can do when he's engaged, and we see what happens when for whatever reason he isn't there. If he had his focus dialed in, he's a top-10 center. Certainly he's the type of center where certain matchups are better than others but on balance he's clearly a huge advantage in those focused moments.
Sure, but that's like saying Zach would be a top 15 player if he had better basketball IQ. Those are things you just can't change. When Drummond is locked in, he's a great player. When he's not, he's quite bad. Unfortunately he's usually somewhere in between those two extremes.
It's an interesting comparison. They both have top-tier talent. Zach seems to faze out in phases, even when he's engaged he forgets to make a second defensive effort or look for someone to box out. He can sabotage the team with these lapses but still get you 30.
Drummond's skill set is undeniable, he's the best rebounder in the league without doubt. He can defend on the perimeter, and many have of his steals come from straight rips, but he's either in the game or he's not, and when he's not, it's nothing. It's either 16 and 16 or 4 and 5 and yeah that's a big drop off and many teams will not want the inconsistency. I've been impressed really with how Donovan has set him up to be successful and really he's gotten more out of him than anybody else in the past 5 years.
Feb 13·edited Feb 13Liked by your friendly BullsBlogger
Shoutout to Bulldog on the Bulls Talk Podcast for calling out AK for using "competitive" as a way to justify being mediocre and just AK's general use of vague goals. That's probably the most direct criticism of the front office I've heard on that podcast.
Edit: Following up on this as I continue to listen through this podcast. Actually all three hosts (including KC) have pretty directly criticized AK's actions at the deadline and even criticized his lack of a long-term plan. It's not good when even the media partner that is 50% owned by Jerry is straight up criticizing AK...
I continue to believe that the Bulls have a long-term plan, it's just that nobody likes it.
How long-term do the Bulls actually think? My guess is that they see their next point to really change as summer 2025. Lonzo will be off the books, Vuc will be expiring. It's their first year to potentially have to give their pick to San Antonio.
This summer, they'll sign DeMar to a shorter contract (although maybe not as short as they should). 1+1 with a TO would be great. 1+1 with a PO is probably what they'll give.
They'll move Zach for savings if they can, and re-sign Pat to probably more than I'd like.
They'll likely finagle with Lonzo to get under the tax if they can't move Zach. If they can't finagle with him, the'll plan his "comeback" for late in the year so they can reap more insurance off his contract. Or, he'll play a few games and hang em up early. Either way..
Next year, we'll probably see Vuc/Pat/DeMar/Ayo/Coby again, and they'll be mediocre enough to probably get the Spurs pick money off our back and give them the pick.
Then, for '25, you might see them be more active. No more Lonzo, and with DeMar and Vuc as expiring contracts, you could see them move off them and make a bigger tilt towards "rebuild". Or they could let everyone suffer through 25-26 and basically start from ground zero.
I think this is basically right. Reinsdorf sees the Bulls as a cash cow, so everything comes down to the yearly profit. If the Bulls have an average or higher payroll but below luxury tax, then you need to make the play in to compensate. If they are above luxury tax, then they need to make the conference finals at least. It's only when they have a really low payroll that management has the freedom to tank. So the FO will move from the mediocrity forever approach only when they have the chance to shed payroll on a massive scale.
I mean, they've had chances to shed their payroll on a massive scale for a while now. There was considerable interest in Zach at last year's trade deadline and also likely some this past summer. AK just overvalued Zach way too much. They could have traded both Vooch and DeMar at last year's trade deadline too. They didn't have to re-sign Vooch to a bloated contract this past summer. They could have traded DeMar again at this year's deadline.
If MikeDC is right, and I tend to think he is, when Vooch's contract ends in 2026, along with DeMar's if he signs a two year deal, that money comes off the books but they also then have to pay Coby and Ayo as their contracts end that same year. If both of them continue on their current trajectories, those guys are going to deserve pretty big contracts. So yeah, $45-50 million will come off the books from DeMar and Vooch, but there's a good chance Coby and Ayo will command more than that combined.
Yeah, this is likely pretty close to accurate, sadly.
Side note - do I not know what expiring means? I thought if someone's contract is expiring, that means their contract is ending. Vooch's contract ends in the summer of 2026 and if DeMar signs a 1+1, his contract would end then too. Does expiring just mean they only have one year left on their contract?
The way seasons span years make it hard to write clearly. What I mean to say is:
1. The 2024-2025 season is going to see the resolution of the Lonzo ordeal and that gets one monkey off our back.
2. During the summer of 2025, Lonzo will be off the books one way or another. Vuc (and maybe DeMar) will have their final contract year ahead of them. That is, Vuc will be expiring in the 25-26 season. So maybe they can unload him for that last year. Or maybe they just ride it out.
Ahh, that makes sense. Yeah, I don't see them unloading Vooch and DeMar in their final seasons. They've done nothing so far to prove that would even be a consideration. "Riding it out" seems to be AK's life goal.
So in 2026 when those guys expire and all their money comes off the books, it'll be time to re-sign Coby and Ayo to significantly larger contracts than they're currently on. This never ending circle of mediocrity will continue...
part of the issue is these guys have a totally different sense of time than much of the league, that re-sets their core every other year and tries to improve/not every transaction period. I don't doubt that's ownership mindset permeating the whole organization, that it was better in the old days where players didn't change teams so much
Paxson would do this too, say players were staying on the team because "they're under contract"
I think it makes sense that you didn't list Caruso, as he might _finally_ get moved in the offseason. I can imagine the conversation was that the Bulls think they can get the same offer or better for him over the summer, so why not keep him for the play-in(s). We'll see if they can have their cake and eat it too. Or they'll just keep him, I guess, because as yfbb says, "he's under contract."
Jesus, this is bad. I'd throw in on the "we do cap gymnastics at the end of the year" that this deadline was about two things: 1) getting marginally better for contending teams (after Indiana and NYK got noticeably better prior) and 2) teams doing cap gymnastics right now.
I'd like to think I can handle most conceptual ideas in sports pretty well, but this one had my eyes swimming. Granted, it's speculation by Hollinger, but I also think it's quite obvious that teams were making trades or not making trades solely based off of whether they'd be an over-the-cap team, have cap space, or what-not.
I don't think anyone could say that Artuas Karnisovas is smart enough to comprehend all these possibilities.
Why can't someone do half a day of journalism and report what other GMs anonymously think of him? That used to be the job. But maybe never was in Chicago with the Bulls especially.
Darnell seems pretty fed up with this front office. He may be our best shot at something like this actually happening.
The problem with the Athletic's coverage of the Bulls is that it is getting less and less by the day. Not sure if that is by design or a symptom of something else. Darnell may crank out one piece of content a week, if that. He seems more interested in promoting his own blog than his Bulls content.
This is a problem all it's own in that the overall Bulls media coverage is lacking.
KC = good but just goes along with whatever the team says
Cowley = stinks and nobody cares about his content
McGraw = stinks and not enough content
Cody = good but not enough content
Darnell = good but not enough content
CHGO = a lot of content but seems to be limited
Sam Smith = doesn't do the beat, just writes whatever crazy stuff he feels like writing
Definitely agree. I probably should have clarified that I don't actually expect Darnell to write a piece with the opinions of other GMs. I was more saying that if any beat reporter were to do it, I think Darnell would be the most likely with how frustrated he seems to be with this FO.
I think it was sometime last season that The Athletic stopped budgeting for Darnell to travel with the team
I think Will Gottlieb at Chuggo is really good, but also isn't traveling
Ah ok, I missed that. And that would explain Darnell's lack of access and content.
I agree with your take on Will and CHGO. He does a really good job putting out content and asking good questions at the pressers. I just wish he had a bigger push behind him.
though ironically it appears Darnell is on THIS road trip
I don't follow traditional sports media anymore but there have been some epic YouTuber rants about the Bulls after the trade deadline. Hoping at least one of them goes viral!
No time for that kind of journalism. I think there are still a couple unheard hot takes about Jerry Krause's widow that need to be aired (sorry if that's rude but I guarantee you not a single person who bloviated about The Horror at The United Center last month knows her first name either).
Worst thing to happen to this team was narrowly losing to the Heat before Miami made its improbable run to the Finals. Never thought AK would be so delusional to think that was indicative of how close the Bulls were to winning playoff series, but here we are.
I blame DeRozan's daughter, otherwise would've lost in Toronto
I do love taking it to the craptors though, and that was very funny
I think the thing we are all so confused about is that AKME came into their first two seasons guns ablazin'. They went bold with Patrick Williams, traded for Vuc, acquired Lonzo, acquired Demar, signed high upside guys in DJJ and Javonte, and found a diamond in the rough with Ayo.
I think we all saw a front office willing to go bold and use every avenue available to improve the roster. It was as if we had seen technicolor for the very first time.
And then for whatever reason, they stopped. Like, it feels like we are being gaslit. AKME legitimately just stopped trying. I've never seen a front office go from so aggressive to so conservative so quickly. It's as if after Lonzo got hurt they said "sorry, ran out of ammunition."
I think we all have our suspicions as to why they have holed up - but it doesn't make the whiplash any less alarming. Watching those videos of AK, I can't help but feel he doesn't believe in anything he is saying. He looks so dejected. My theory - and what I believe is most likely - is that AKME came in, said they can change things but needed to do it their way. They tried it their way, it crashed and burned when Lonzo got injured, Zach didn't take the next step, and Pat never became anything more than promise. Because of that, Jerry has them on a leash again. He's not going to let them spend his money unless the product affects his pocketbook.
This team will not even sniff the Larry O'Brien until Jerry is gone.
The problem with that theory is that AK clearly isn't worried about this summer's cap situation which I would imagine Jerry would be quite worried about if he had AK on such a tight leash regarding finances.
I think he's real worried about it. So worried that he won't even dip his toes into the topic publicly. "Those conversations are at the end of the season" means his having those conversations in the media. Right? RIGHT??
I think simplest explanation is that Arturas Karnisovas isn't a good General Manager. A separate issue, that doesn't help the first, but doesn't entirely inform the first, is that Jerry Reinsdorf isn't a good Owner.
These are two separate line items.
The other problem with Jerry, aside from him just being bad at his job, is that he is an absentee governor. He's just a 'sign the checks' and 'final decision' guy. He's not a day-to-day involved governor, which is Michael Reinsdorf's supposed role. So Jerry, as much as we want him to be involved, he never will be.
I imagine he tells Michael something along the lines of, 'as long as we aren't operating in the red and as long as we can put butts in the seats, we are fine'. And it appears they run the Bulls under that scenario.
They might be separate but I think they're pretty intertwined.
I'm not gonna relitigate AK's tenure as it has been done to death, but he's simply a bad VP. You can just compare payrolls across the league and evaluate based on standings and future upside - the resulting picture does not reflect well on AK's ability to spend intelligently. Reinsdorf isn't the only cheap owner in the league. He is definitely a problem but it doesn't change the fact that AK straight up sucks.
The Bulls currently have the 10th highest active payroll in the league.
To your point, like, yeah, yes--I get it, Reinsdorf likes money, is cheap.
But there's no amount of breaking up the dynasty talk from thirty years ago, no amount of historical luxury tax avoidance, no amount of selling off second round picks to start a "rebuild", no amount of Jerry Reinsdorf specifically that can really explain or absolve AK from being bad and very demonstrably bad (i.e. re-signing Vucevic), asleep (i.e. never turning over the bottom of his roster) and shameless (i.e. the above-mentioned press conference) re: his job.
This is not entirely accurate because 80% of Lonzo’s salary is repaid to the Bulls by league wide insurance, and that $16 million drops the Bulls down to 17th.
The Lonzo salary could and should have been excised from the salary cap - he is never going to play NBA ball again and the NBA allows those contracts to get removed from the cap calculations, even as the players get paid. But it is cheaper (less expenses) and more profitable (in terms of narrative and false hope sold to the fan base) to pretend that Lonzo could return.
The $20 million of dead money is useful to AKME and the Reinsdorfs insofar as it offers the perpetual false hope for future performance and is a convenient excuse for current performance, comes in at 20 cents on the dollar while handcuffing the team right at the luxury tax line where they are very obviously never going to go over.
"[Ball] is never going to play NBA ball again."
IDK. Did you see him getting shots up last week?
Bro, he can’t run in a straight line yet and it’s been over 2 years since his bone bruise.
I have it on pretty good authority he can stand up out of chairs without experiencing knee pain though, so potato-po-tah-toe. That sorta thing.
I did the calculations of Spotrac and came out to the Bulls actually being at 23rd in salary payroll. Last year they were 27th!
This kind of thing is part of why there's such a huge disparity between how fans perceive AKME and how Reinsdorf perceives AKME.
From the ownership perspective, he's getting a middling result out of a rebuilding level expenditure.
Everything is marginal.
For the Bulls, does the marginal benefit of adding a player exceed the additional cost?
Keep in mind that the Lonzo money isn't truly "dead". They could trade it to another team that's looking to shed payroll and save money.
Just to give an example, I have 0 doubt they could have called up the Jazz and Ainge would have given them John Collins (owed ~$75M) for Lonzo (owed $8M - $24M depending on if he ever plays again).
Just for this year, the marginal cost of adding collins would be $16M.
What would the marginal benefit of adding a middling PF to this team? Maybe a couple wins. Maybe not. Probably about the same.
This is a cost to ownership’s bottom line and to management’s ability to claim deus ex machina injuries, but not a cost that is externally material. From the perspective of the NBA’s CBA rules Collins and Lonzo are effectively the same.
Does ownership care about winning games or maximizing profits? Obviously, we know the answer.
"From the perspective of the NBA’s CBA rules Collins and Lonzo are effectively the same."
Yes, but it's essential to understand that the CBA rules are only a subset of things everyone cares about.
The fact that the CBA rules treats them the same doesn't make them "the same" or "externally immaterial". In fact, it's what makes them valuable.
Because, as you point out, we know that ownership cares about maximizing profits. That's not just true of Bulls ownership.
Other owners might prioritize winning more, but they all, even the Clippers and Warriors, care about both.
There's some truth to this. I don't think Jerry ever had them off a leash.
Speaking of Marc Eversley potentially trying to keep his head down in hopes of not going down with a sinking ship, apparently he has been linked to the Hornets new front office opening. To be fair, a ton of people have been linked to it, but it seems pretty likely Eversley is trying to get out of Chicago as soon as he can.
I saw Cowley had that. Maybe ME is Cowley's source for "we don't all agree with what AK is doing" trade deadline info, so then as a favor Cowley floats ME's name for this job
Honestly wouldn't surprise me in the least. It's crazy how quiet ME is. Makes me think he's clearly not happy here (can't blame him) and he's doing everything he can to stay out of the shit show that is this organization.
I've read one interview with him during his entire tenure, and he was pushing back on the idea that he wasn't invested in the job by claiming his kids went to public school here and that he lived within the city limits (Lakeview).
https://theathletic.com/4791020/2023/08/21/marc-eversley-interview-bulls/
He reiterated so many AK talking points right out of the gate — #ButLonzo, #competitive, #14-9, etc etc — that I think he's surrendered the right to be considered separate entity with anything like agency over decisions. I'm sure if we found the next Jokic in the second round, he'd claim ownership, just like his boss did (just kidding they traded away all our second round picks ha ha 😒)
A. Ignorant
B. Lying
C. Doesn't look as bad from ownership perspective
D. All of the above (CORRECT ANSWER)
=====================================
One other thing I'd note is the Reinsdorfs have a long memory. One thing they looked pretty bad by doing what trading Luol Deng for literal nothing back in the middle of the season.
Among many completely valid reasons to shit on this transaction was that they were doing a bait and switch on all the folks that bought tickets for the 13-14 season expecting to see competitive basketball.
As far as I can tell, that's pretty much the only time the Bulls have done that. If they plan on being trash, they at least have the courtesy to let you know it ahead of time.
AK year two: "We will not settle for mediocrity here."
AK now: "5-5 over the past ten isn't bad considering we only lost by a couple of points sometimes! We're only a few games away from the 6th seed!"
AK redefining mediocrity as we know it.
I'm curious about the role of two aspects that make AK suck: language and being accountable only to Jerry Reinsdorf. He didn't speak a word of English when he arrived at college in the U.S., and Lithuanian has very different phonetics and grammar. This obviously hampers his ability in press conferences, but more significantly, I wonder how effectively he's able to communicate within the boy's club of NBA executives -- he's the only foreign-born person in those ranks other than Masia Ujiri, who spent high school in the U.S. So I tend to think a lot of what reads as dumb is a combination of a limited English vocabulary and an introverted personality style. Working in the Reinsdorf's organization brings all the dynamics of operating in a family business. One of my favorites is called "cordial hypocrisy," the art of carefully avoiding discussions of tough issues and hard decisions. AK has likely instinctively internalized the mannerisms that enabled Kenny Williams to rack up a mediocre 30+ year career, be called a son when he got fired and get 3 sons drafted/hired by the Sox. Aligning with Reinsdorf's views automatically results in contempt for fans and anger toward the media.
I do think you're right here. English is this guy's second (?) language and his pressers need to be graded on a curve. I do think, though, given his position, the math on "competitive" has to be clearer than, well, getting the standings wrong and citing a 23 game sample from last year to build on.
He has to understand that more teams than not actually make the playoffs. That part isn't clouded by language barriers.
I agree, I think that's where the family business aspect comes in. If winning more games than other teams and being a championship contender was important to Reinsdorf, Kenny Williams and GarPax would have been fired much more quickly. Somehow, the dynamic of the Reinsdorf organization is so addled that AK's justifications must be what Reinsdorf wants to hear. That's confusing, because it can't be reduced to "Reinsdorf is cheap," since the cap results in all teams spending in the same general range. "Reinsdorf doesn't care" doesn't make sense either, because it seems he would cash in the enormous equity of the team if it didn't interest him any more. Bidding against yourself to sign Vucevic to a $20M deal doesn't maximize profit or on-the-court success. There's a stubborn illogic to how Reinsdorf operates, and opaque motives. He was the only person on Earth who thought hiring Tony LaRussa was a good idea, LaRussa included, and he strikes enough fear into his obsequious troops that he went ahead and did it, motivated solely by decades-old remorse over firing LaRussa. It may be as hard for AK to figure out what Reinsdorf wants as it is for us on the outside, and what we're seeing is based on some offhand Jerry comment about not wanting to see different players every year. I've seen lots of people twist themselves into knots by turning CEOs and business owners into their mommies and daddies. AK seems very ill-equipped to achieve measurable success while navigating in this environment. Paradoxically, that seems likely to give him a long career until boycotts and billboards cause Jerry enough embarrassment.
> He was the only person on Earth who thought hiring Tony LaRussa was a good idea, LaRussa included, and he strikes enough fear into his obsequious troops that he went ahead and did it, motivated solely by decades-old remorse over firing LaRussa.
He was about to do precisely the same thing with Doug Collins in 2008.
But dunno about Reinsdorfian ambiguity. I think the Bulls front office is working within very clear guidelines, it's just that they are just only somewhat concerned with winning basketball games.
For instance, I don't think Reinsdorf prohibits his team from going into the tax. It's just that collecting luxury tax payments is a unique mechanism for collecting a big chunk of Reinsdorf's annual operating profit. Payment from the luxury tax is guaranteed: spend less than $165 million, get (by pre-season estimates) $12 million. What else is guaranteed? If you don't get the 6th seed or greater, you might not get more than a single game of playoff revenue. That won't be $12 million for sure. If you could come up with a similar projection that spending into the luxury tax — for instance, the existence of Derrick Rose was a pretty good indicator that you could potentially gain more than $12 million by aiming for a high playoff seed — I think they'd go along with it. (They might have done so the summer after he was injured.)
Jerry's statements corroborate this kind of thinking. When the front office wanted to acquire Pau from the Grizzlies, he said he wouldn't pay for his salary unless he was on a contender for a championship. If you forego the tax windfall, you better have plans to get that money back some other way.
Herein is the sweet spot which Jerry has become so boastful about: finishing not-first, but good enough to get playoff revenue, give hope to fans and STILL collect his $12 million for the Warriors' folly.
This demand for his yearly operating profit is not at all a flexible or even sound business approach. Mark Cuban was sued when the Mavs were at their height by Ross Perot's nepo baby because the team was unprofitable. That was part of the plan: the team was unprofitable temporarily because they were in a small window to win a title. I would assume virtually every contending NBA team follows this pattern.
Actually writing this makes me question why I would follow this team at all. I have some good memories but they have the 20th best record in the NBA and are doing everything possible to inform us that this is all they want out of the game. Maybe we should believe them.
Yeah. It's more than being cheap. I don't know of other NBA owners that see the team so purely as a cash cow. It doesn't make a ton of financial sense either (he could sell the team, after all).
I believe I read this on Reddit, so take it with a HUGE grain of salt. Someone said that Jerry would be taxed to the high heavens if he sold the team; however, if he dies and the team is passed on to Michael, he could then sell it and either not be taxed or be taxed very little on it since he wasn't the one who originally paid for it.
I'm not tax expert and this was just some random comment on Reddit, so I'm not entirely sure if that's true or not. If it is, there's no way in hell Jerry sells this team. Maybe Michael decides he's sick of living in Chicago and "running" a basketball team and decides he wants to move to Mars with the $4+ billion he'd sell the team for.
I have to admit, that game was enjoyable, because Young is so annoying lol
Ayo was incredible too. He's been on fire since getting into the starting lineup. It's fun to see players growing and stepping up.
Yes it was really fun to watch him, and also see Terry actually maybe look like an NBA player lol.
NBA probably needs more financial incentives for winning. Maybe the under-the-cap money should be paid based on how many wins you got? I also think the draft lottery should be equal weight random draw for all 14 teams in it. There should be a pot of cash paid out to the 16 playoff teams that increases with each round you win, etc. NBA needs to fix every hole that allows losing to be more profitable than winning.
I dunno, teams already get playoff revenue as an incentive to win and the brand awareness/prestige. If that's not enough to get an owner like Reinsdorf to actually try, then it would probably take a mountain of cash so big that the league would go under.
Bulls move to 3-0 in competitive games post-deadline
2-1?
That's win-loss record, they've been competitive in all 3
I realized that might be what you were saying after I wrote this 😂
Hornets 2-0 with 5 of their 9-man rotation being new players and still missing their starting PG and C. We suck
I'm halfway through the second quarter (couldn't watch last night) and Dominique has said Coby White took a bad shot three times. All three shots were wide open. They just happened not to go in. 😂
Shout-out to the other Hawks commentator saying "Boy this Bulls team sure does struggle to score" near the end of the first half only for the Bulls to go on to score their season high. 😂😂
just a shame that AK doesn't believe in Ayo, as if he couldn't have replaced Caruso and kept the team "competitive" AND you'd have two first-round picks
What's the point of draft picks if you don't know how to draft?
- AK stans
IMO, you have to look at Arturas's boss, Jerry Reinsdorf and understand that he is just an investor and to him, owning the Bulls team is an investment like the stock market. He has no love for basketball and like the guys he hired, probably spends little time watching it.
Arturas job is to get guys on the team that fit chemistry wise without over paying for them like they did for Lavine. I heard that they had 1.7 million available and an open spot on the roster. They need a real 3 point shooter like Joe Harris who is now available but they always wait too long because they are scared to spend Reinsdorf's money.
He doesnt care about what the fans want but he better start caring because they want some wins and not word salad. Reinsdorf really should sell the Bulls to someone who loves basketball and wants more than notible players hired initially to sell tickets.
It is frustrating because of the way it looks from the outside. JR finds a player that looks good at first and doesn't go deep enough to know if this guy is going to work long term and over pays him. Then if things dont work out immediately or the guy gets injured, he lets everyone know that they are in a hurry to trade him.
They do not look at how bad the coach is and usually that is the problem. If they used careful evaluation when looking for a coach and not jump to conclusions, they would not have to try to sell the lie that the team is trying to find its identity. Donovan needs to get serious coach training or the Bulls need to find a coach that knows how analyze his players and use them correctly. Spend the money for a good coach Jerry! Then you won't have to overspend on players.
It really irritates me to see that Donovan does the same thing over and over again expecting different results and doesn't seem to listen to his players and it also looks like the players gets minutes according to how much money the make. Vucevic is not as good a center as Drummond and makes 20 times more money so Drummond gets 10-15 mins playing time and Vuch gets 30-35 mins.
They would win more games if they were paired as starters. Drummond can guard the rim much better than Vuch alone and close the door for every good guard on opposing teams that can score. It has been proven. If a guard from an opposing team scores 70 points against the Bulls, someone is overlooking a problem regarding rim protection and you keep your best rim protector on the bench. There's about 6 teams that would love to have Drummond and pay him better but Donovan keep this 2 time allstar on the bench limiting him to 10-15 minutes. If Donovan has a beef against a player, he cuts their minutes.
Reinsdorf needs to ask Donovan what the hell is going on. Even the fans can see this.
I don't understand why so many people think Drummond is some great defensive center. I mean, he's a better defender than Vooch but Vooch is a terrible defender.
Drummond may be underpaid but he's definitely not massively underpaid. He likely won't get more than $8 million a year on whatever contract he signs this summer.
The center position has evolved. Being a versatile defender and rim protector is the most important thing by far. Even rebounding isn't as important anymore since guards and forwards crash the glass a lot more than they used to.
Look at what Drummond is good at. He's a great rebounder and a decent defender by some metrics (a bad defender by others). He has zero offensive game. He's not a threat to score or distribute the ball.
That's not a great center right there. He can be a more than serviceable backup, but let's not pretend he's some amazing center just because other teams were interested in him at the deadline. Notice all of those teams wanted him as their backup.
Drummond is a great center with massive focus issues. We've seen what he can do when he's engaged, and we see what happens when for whatever reason he isn't there. If he had his focus dialed in, he's a top-10 center. Certainly he's the type of center where certain matchups are better than others but on balance he's clearly a huge advantage in those focused moments.
Sure, but that's like saying Zach would be a top 15 player if he had better basketball IQ. Those are things you just can't change. When Drummond is locked in, he's a great player. When he's not, he's quite bad. Unfortunately he's usually somewhere in between those two extremes.
It's an interesting comparison. They both have top-tier talent. Zach seems to faze out in phases, even when he's engaged he forgets to make a second defensive effort or look for someone to box out. He can sabotage the team with these lapses but still get you 30.
Drummond's skill set is undeniable, he's the best rebounder in the league without doubt. He can defend on the perimeter, and many have of his steals come from straight rips, but he's either in the game or he's not, and when he's not, it's nothing. It's either 16 and 16 or 4 and 5 and yeah that's a big drop off and many teams will not want the inconsistency. I've been impressed really with how Donovan has set him up to be successful and really he's gotten more out of him than anybody else in the past 5 years.
well, his short stint on the nets was decent and also with more minutes
"They need a real 3 point shooter like Joe Harris who is now available"
Available and freshly washed.
What about Chimezie Metu? 26 and 6’9” with per 36 of 15 and 9. Worth a flyer as a backup C/PF.
Shoutout to Bulldog on the Bulls Talk Podcast for calling out AK for using "competitive" as a way to justify being mediocre and just AK's general use of vague goals. That's probably the most direct criticism of the front office I've heard on that podcast.
Edit: Following up on this as I continue to listen through this podcast. Actually all three hosts (including KC) have pretty directly criticized AK's actions at the deadline and even criticized his lack of a long-term plan. It's not good when even the media partner that is 50% owned by Jerry is straight up criticizing AK...
I continue to believe that the Bulls have a long-term plan, it's just that nobody likes it.
How long-term do the Bulls actually think? My guess is that they see their next point to really change as summer 2025. Lonzo will be off the books, Vuc will be expiring. It's their first year to potentially have to give their pick to San Antonio.
This summer, they'll sign DeMar to a shorter contract (although maybe not as short as they should). 1+1 with a TO would be great. 1+1 with a PO is probably what they'll give.
They'll move Zach for savings if they can, and re-sign Pat to probably more than I'd like.
They'll likely finagle with Lonzo to get under the tax if they can't move Zach. If they can't finagle with him, the'll plan his "comeback" for late in the year so they can reap more insurance off his contract. Or, he'll play a few games and hang em up early. Either way..
Next year, we'll probably see Vuc/Pat/DeMar/Ayo/Coby again, and they'll be mediocre enough to probably get the Spurs pick money off our back and give them the pick.
Then, for '25, you might see them be more active. No more Lonzo, and with DeMar and Vuc as expiring contracts, you could see them move off them and make a bigger tilt towards "rebuild". Or they could let everyone suffer through 25-26 and basically start from ground zero.
I think this is basically right. Reinsdorf sees the Bulls as a cash cow, so everything comes down to the yearly profit. If the Bulls have an average or higher payroll but below luxury tax, then you need to make the play in to compensate. If they are above luxury tax, then they need to make the conference finals at least. It's only when they have a really low payroll that management has the freedom to tank. So the FO will move from the mediocrity forever approach only when they have the chance to shed payroll on a massive scale.
I mean, they've had chances to shed their payroll on a massive scale for a while now. There was considerable interest in Zach at last year's trade deadline and also likely some this past summer. AK just overvalued Zach way too much. They could have traded both Vooch and DeMar at last year's trade deadline too. They didn't have to re-sign Vooch to a bloated contract this past summer. They could have traded DeMar again at this year's deadline.
If MikeDC is right, and I tend to think he is, when Vooch's contract ends in 2026, along with DeMar's if he signs a two year deal, that money comes off the books but they also then have to pay Coby and Ayo as their contracts end that same year. If both of them continue on their current trajectories, those guys are going to deserve pretty big contracts. So yeah, $45-50 million will come off the books from DeMar and Vooch, but there's a good chance Coby and Ayo will command more than that combined.
Yeah, this is likely pretty close to accurate, sadly.
Side note - do I not know what expiring means? I thought if someone's contract is expiring, that means their contract is ending. Vooch's contract ends in the summer of 2026 and if DeMar signs a 1+1, his contract would end then too. Does expiring just mean they only have one year left on their contract?
The way seasons span years make it hard to write clearly. What I mean to say is:
1. The 2024-2025 season is going to see the resolution of the Lonzo ordeal and that gets one monkey off our back.
2. During the summer of 2025, Lonzo will be off the books one way or another. Vuc (and maybe DeMar) will have their final contract year ahead of them. That is, Vuc will be expiring in the 25-26 season. So maybe they can unload him for that last year. Or maybe they just ride it out.
Ahh, that makes sense. Yeah, I don't see them unloading Vooch and DeMar in their final seasons. They've done nothing so far to prove that would even be a consideration. "Riding it out" seems to be AK's life goal.
So in 2026 when those guys expire and all their money comes off the books, it'll be time to re-sign Coby and Ayo to significantly larger contracts than they're currently on. This never ending circle of mediocrity will continue...
part of the issue is these guys have a totally different sense of time than much of the league, that re-sets their core every other year and tries to improve/not every transaction period. I don't doubt that's ownership mindset permeating the whole organization, that it was better in the old days where players didn't change teams so much
Paxson would do this too, say players were staying on the team because "they're under contract"
I think it makes sense that you didn't list Caruso, as he might _finally_ get moved in the offseason. I can imagine the conversation was that the Bulls think they can get the same offer or better for him over the summer, so why not keep him for the play-in(s). We'll see if they can have their cake and eat it too. Or they'll just keep him, I guess, because as yfbb says, "he's under contract."
yeah this was good, he gives a pretty mildly delivered but well articulated rant.
KC steps in ::chuckles:: "oh u mad"
Jesus, this is bad. I'd throw in on the "we do cap gymnastics at the end of the year" that this deadline was about two things: 1) getting marginally better for contending teams (after Indiana and NYK got noticeably better prior) and 2) teams doing cap gymnastics right now.
Hollinger goes into a very deep and esoteric dive here: https://theathletic.com/5268831/2024/02/12/furphy-whitmore-nba-trade-deadline-hollinger/
I'd like to think I can handle most conceptual ideas in sports pretty well, but this one had my eyes swimming. Granted, it's speculation by Hollinger, but I also think it's quite obvious that teams were making trades or not making trades solely based off of whether they'd be an over-the-cap team, have cap space, or what-not.
I don't think anyone could say that Artuas Karnisovas is smart enough to comprehend all these possibilities.