What offends me most about AK's treatment of 2nd rounders is how specifically helpful they are to a GM playing the game he's playing:
- Imagine all the credit he could take for "squeezing" a 2nd rounder out of a lopsided trade, calling it "draft compensation."
- Imagine all the ways he could use those extra second rounders to get off contracts he secured because he doesn't have a feel for player value, then gloat about how he created cap flexibility for "just a few second rounders."
Gaslighting is your thing, AK! Why miss out on a good time?
They are hopeless and I just don’t care anymore. Until Reinsdork and his pathetic hires are dead or gone I will not bother watching them unless I am bored to death and cannot find anything else to do.
If people cared about the Bulls anymore, AKME would be getting raked over the coals every time they talk about "player development." PWill's been here how long? Dalen's got how many years in "our program?" Is Julian Phillips good enough yet to get 10 minutes a game on a roster that is wholly devoid of wing talent? I already know this Olbrich guy is never going to play in games until they give him his 2nd contract, and maybe not even then.
There is obviously no development taking place other than what the players themselves accomplish. Billy's a 'win now' coach who doesn't win much. It's perfect for these idiots.
they are treating roster spots 11-15 not as future swings at long-term replacements at roles 1-7, but short term injury replacements for spots 8-10*
so they don't really have upside or development attention to improve much, which is fine by them: stay just good enough to where there's no huge dropoff due to injury where you go from 38 wins to 36
* (and whatever Jevon Carter does as a 'locker room guy' and 'community ambassador'...not the worst thing but obviously not at double the minimum)
and yes, Billy did play Matas and the young (25) Tre Jones more down the stretch last season, but that was only after injuries to Pat, Ayo, Lonzo. Jalen Smith was benched for Zach Collins, Billy was not treating it as development time
It's a long time gone, but for the record, when the Bulls said that their draft board dried up, they were the following players were on the board and selected slightly after the Bulls pick (which was #38):
42-Thomas Bryant
43-Isaiah Hartenstein
45-Dillon Brooks
51-Monte Morris
I point this out, because there's almost always somebody worth taking a look at if you're willing to work hard enough to identify them.
Billy isn't the problem beyond the fact that he's willing to put up with AKME's BS. He might not be the right coach to win an NBA championship facing a better team, but he's fully competent and by far the most competent of the public facing part of management.
AKME pride themselves on wanting to create a destination for players, treating players well, etc... I am SHOCKED to hear that of all the places with hard negotiations with RFAs, the Bulls are the only one where the relationship with their RFA (Giddey) is strained! Another sign of the utter incompetence of AKMW? (I agree with them refusing to pay Giddey the full bag by the way, but it seems they are the only ones who can't do it without fully upsetting the player)
While I'd love to find another thing to be mad at AKME for, my guess is Giddey's "growing frustration" is more of a tactic being used by his representatives to place more pressure on AKME than anything else.
They have basically no leverage so they're scraping the bottom of the barrel. If that means leaking that their client is upset with his team's front office, that's what they'll do.
What? Warriors are basically telling Kuminga they don't want him on their team. They just want to sign him to a contract low enough that they can trade him in 90 days.
Thomas is so pissed he's lobbing f-bombs on his x feed that he is under-appreciated, and the Nets are offering 2 years at the MLE.
BN Bulls just published a piece expressing confusion over the fact that there’s no trade market whatsoever for Vuc.
Here’s what so many Bulls fans are overlooking when discussing the nonexistent Vuc market: the lack of quality offers has less to do with Vuc’s faults and more to do with AK’s faults.
AK has zero understanding of leverage and other front offices are taking advantage of that. He’s had Vuc on the trade block for over a year at this point. Why would a buyer be eager to make a good offer when they know the seller is desperate to move on from a low value asset?
This is why those talking points about “laying the groundwork” for a Vuc deal at the trade deadline were nonsense. There’s no such thing as a long runway when selling an asset with a shrinking value.
How are these basic econ concepts hard to understand for the president of a multi billion dollar franchise?
I agree with the vast majority if your comment, but do have one question... Is Vuc's value shrinking? I figure it's about as high as it has been in years. He's on an expiring and just came off what is statistically his best offensive* season in years. Seems like a good fit for a team that needs a backup center who can score or a team that needs a tank commander.
* Yes, YFBB... every season with Vuc is offensive :-P
maybe if Valanciunas finds a way to weasel out of his deal with Denver and go back to Europe....Vuc could offer an approximation but with more stretch....JV is pretty subpar defensively as well
Yeah, Vuc could have some value as an expiring contract that can play a bit, but not so much unless the Bulls take some bad contract in return (and they never do that).
Looks like most of the front office staffers who chimed in thought Giddey was worth $20-25M/yr for 3-4 years. Quite a few were happy to lock him in for 5 years at that rate. That seems in line with what people are saying here.
One particular staffer is more negative than almost everyone here. They thought Giddey was worth $12.5M/yr... "less than the midlevel exemption". Oof.
So we’re now a few days into August and it still doesn’t sound like Giddey and the Bulls are remotely close to an agreement.
Still a few weeks away from this becoming a serious question, but how close to training camp could this get dragged out?
At some point this has to be pretty embarrassing for Giddey’s agent. AK is one of the true morons of this league and even he doesn’t want to give you the money you’re looking for.
But this front office is also finding a way to make themselves look foolish, because they’ve been outright telling the media that they want to bring Giddey back since the trade deadline press conference. Eversley even listed him as one of the players who would be coming back during his post draft interview on the radio! These guys have somehow found a way to give away leverage in a situation where they should have all of it!
So the front office is holding firm despite the fact that they made it clear they are going to sign him and Giddey’s agent is holding firm despite the fact that no other teams have money. Truly a battle of wits here.
Nobody is talking about counting stats except you. His EPM, BPM, PER, WS/48 and DARKO ALL look very good. Do you ever look at any stats anyway? And as far as winning, his team finished 15-5 after the Lavine trade. Doesn't that matter to you?
Bulls were 18 - 15 after the LaVine trade (feb 3). They were 17 - 8 after feb 24. They were 1 - 6 in the immediate aftermath of the trade.
15 - 5 is the cherry picked yet happily round 20 number of games to finish the season. Doesn't include the play-in game.
Of those final 20 games, Giddey played in 13, going 10 - 3.
Bulls were 5 - 2 without Giddey in those games.
Giddey had some great performances down the stretch but also some awful ones, Dallas in particular, 3 - 12 8 pts in a game they lost by 1 and was pulled in the final quarter.
I do think he can be a big part of a winning Bulls team this year, but he shouldn't get paid 30m/yr based on 11 good games out of the last 33.
Yeah I mean I don't think many people are arguing for the 30 mil a year. I think the shorter deal in the low 20s average makes a lot of sense for both sides honestly.
BN had a post this week about how 'the market' is what changed for Josh Giddey
like with Vuc, the simpler and more correct explanation is that Giddey just isn't that good and thus not valued around the league like the Chicago Bulls value them
doesn't make sense to bring up comps like Jalen Green, Suggs or Quickley without mentioning that Giddey is the worst player of that cohort. Like I don't think the Raptors would trade Quickley for Giddey even if Giddey was signed at a contract $10M less. I don't think the Bucks would prefer Giddey (at $20M or $25M) in a Giannis return over picks or those other players either.
now them and Chuggo are citing just some random Hoopshype list as a data point for Giddey's value, they put him 15th best PG in the NBA ahead of Suggs, Quickley, FVV, Andrew Nebhard. Kinda odd Peyton Pritchard is on the list as is Kyrie Irving
There is zero world where any team trying to win would rather have Giddey instead of Nembhard.
“I mean sure, Nembhard was playing elite defense against the MVP in the NBA finals and Giddey got torched in a play-in game, but did you see that half court buzzer beater?”
and then when you take out the tankers or capped-out teams, you can see why Josh Giddey has zero market and even $20M is very generous and potentially immediately untradeable
Vuc and Giddey are similar in that they’re both players who trick people into thinking they’re better than they are because they can stuff a stat sheet, but they actually only generate those stats because the Bulls give them more minutes than they deserve.
What offends me most about AK's treatment of 2nd rounders is how specifically helpful they are to a GM playing the game he's playing:
- Imagine all the credit he could take for "squeezing" a 2nd rounder out of a lopsided trade, calling it "draft compensation."
- Imagine all the ways he could use those extra second rounders to get off contracts he secured because he doesn't have a feel for player value, then gloat about how he created cap flexibility for "just a few second rounders."
Gaslighting is your thing, AK! Why miss out on a good time?
They are hopeless and I just don’t care anymore. Until Reinsdork and his pathetic hires are dead or gone I will not bother watching them unless I am bored to death and cannot find anything else to do.
dang so it's whomever dies first?
Kinda makes it more interesting ngl
If people cared about the Bulls anymore, AKME would be getting raked over the coals every time they talk about "player development." PWill's been here how long? Dalen's got how many years in "our program?" Is Julian Phillips good enough yet to get 10 minutes a game on a roster that is wholly devoid of wing talent? I already know this Olbrich guy is never going to play in games until they give him his 2nd contract, and maybe not even then.
There is obviously no development taking place other than what the players themselves accomplish. Billy's a 'win now' coach who doesn't win much. It's perfect for these idiots.
they are treating roster spots 11-15 not as future swings at long-term replacements at roles 1-7, but short term injury replacements for spots 8-10*
so they don't really have upside or development attention to improve much, which is fine by them: stay just good enough to where there's no huge dropoff due to injury where you go from 38 wins to 36
* (and whatever Jevon Carter does as a 'locker room guy' and 'community ambassador'...not the worst thing but obviously not at double the minimum)
Thus keeping intact the roster-full-of-rotation-guys dream.
and yes, Billy did play Matas and the young (25) Tre Jones more down the stretch last season, but that was only after injuries to Pat, Ayo, Lonzo. Jalen Smith was benched for Zach Collins, Billy was not treating it as development time
Can’t polish a turd
Olbrich is just Cameron Bairstow again
It's a long time gone, but for the record, when the Bulls said that their draft board dried up, they were the following players were on the board and selected slightly after the Bulls pick (which was #38):
42-Thomas Bryant
43-Isaiah Hartenstein
45-Dillon Brooks
51-Monte Morris
I point this out, because there's almost always somebody worth taking a look at if you're willing to work hard enough to identify them.
https://youtu.be/UcbXCMvpmWo?si=oPGDSYN9Mi1T3Gl6
Related: Adama Sanogo signing in Europe
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2025/07/international-notes-sanogo-procida-mirotic-beverley.html#ref=home
Another Billy extension. At this point I don't care about the team enough to watch any games. But news about the stupidity of the org never gets old.
Billy isn't the problem beyond the fact that he's willing to put up with AKME's BS. He might not be the right coach to win an NBA championship facing a better team, but he's fully competent and by far the most competent of the public facing part of management.
Make or miss league
AKME pride themselves on wanting to create a destination for players, treating players well, etc... I am SHOCKED to hear that of all the places with hard negotiations with RFAs, the Bulls are the only one where the relationship with their RFA (Giddey) is strained! Another sign of the utter incompetence of AKMW? (I agree with them refusing to pay Giddey the full bag by the way, but it seems they are the only ones who can't do it without fully upsetting the player)
While I'd love to find another thing to be mad at AKME for, my guess is Giddey's "growing frustration" is more of a tactic being used by his representatives to place more pressure on AKME than anything else.
They have basically no leverage so they're scraping the bottom of the barrel. If that means leaking that their client is upset with his team's front office, that's what they'll do.
What? Warriors are basically telling Kuminga they don't want him on their team. They just want to sign him to a contract low enough that they can trade him in 90 days.
Thomas is so pissed he's lobbing f-bombs on his x feed that he is under-appreciated, and the Nets are offering 2 years at the MLE.
It would be easy to be skeptical of this Billy Donovan extension by noting:
In 5 seasons, he's had 1 winning record, 1 playoff appearance, and 1 playoff win.
And those "good" things happened 4 years ago.
BN Bulls just published a piece expressing confusion over the fact that there’s no trade market whatsoever for Vuc.
Here’s what so many Bulls fans are overlooking when discussing the nonexistent Vuc market: the lack of quality offers has less to do with Vuc’s faults and more to do with AK’s faults.
AK has zero understanding of leverage and other front offices are taking advantage of that. He’s had Vuc on the trade block for over a year at this point. Why would a buyer be eager to make a good offer when they know the seller is desperate to move on from a low value asset?
This is why those talking points about “laying the groundwork” for a Vuc deal at the trade deadline were nonsense. There’s no such thing as a long runway when selling an asset with a shrinking value.
How are these basic econ concepts hard to understand for the president of a multi billion dollar franchise?
I agree with the vast majority if your comment, but do have one question... Is Vuc's value shrinking? I figure it's about as high as it has been in years. He's on an expiring and just came off what is statistically his best offensive* season in years. Seems like a good fit for a team that needs a backup center who can score or a team that needs a tank commander.
* Yes, YFBB... every season with Vuc is offensive :-P
Anything times zero is still zero
maybe if Valanciunas finds a way to weasel out of his deal with Denver and go back to Europe....Vuc could offer an approximation but with more stretch....JV is pretty subpar defensively as well
That was a weird post by BN
The Bulls also simply don't have obvious goals in a trade. OK, sure, let's trade Vuc? What is a realistic return that would help the Bulls?
Any trade I can imagine from another team's, I wouldn't see the upside for the Bulls.
Maybe if the other team included picks, but why would you include picks just to get Vuc? You wouldn't.
Yeah, Vuc could have some value as an expiring contract that can play a bit, but not so much unless the Bulls take some bad contract in return (and they never do that).
bulls could have prob gotten a second or two for him last year
Interesting article on Giddey's contract value: https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6519192/2025/07/28/josh-giddey-nba-free-agency-bulls/
Looks like most of the front office staffers who chimed in thought Giddey was worth $20-25M/yr for 3-4 years. Quite a few were happy to lock him in for 5 years at that rate. That seems in line with what people are saying here.
One particular staffer is more negative than almost everyone here. They thought Giddey was worth $12.5M/yr... "less than the midlevel exemption". Oof.
That low end isn't far off if you asked in February
So we’re now a few days into August and it still doesn’t sound like Giddey and the Bulls are remotely close to an agreement.
Still a few weeks away from this becoming a serious question, but how close to training camp could this get dragged out?
At some point this has to be pretty embarrassing for Giddey’s agent. AK is one of the true morons of this league and even he doesn’t want to give you the money you’re looking for.
But this front office is also finding a way to make themselves look foolish, because they’ve been outright telling the media that they want to bring Giddey back since the trade deadline press conference. Eversley even listed him as one of the players who would be coming back during his post draft interview on the radio! These guys have somehow found a way to give away leverage in a situation where they should have all of it!
So the front office is holding firm despite the fact that they made it clear they are going to sign him and Giddey’s agent is holding firm despite the fact that no other teams have money. Truly a battle of wits here.
Brett Seigel apparently thinks they are right now finalizing a 3 year deal in the high 60s.
that seems pretty good compared to some of the rumors.
max they should do is 3/66 and honestly that's sketch to me.
his true value is more around $20MM, counting stats be damned if they don't actual engender winning
Nobody is talking about counting stats except you. His EPM, BPM, PER, WS/48 and DARKO ALL look very good. Do you ever look at any stats anyway? And as far as winning, his team finished 15-5 after the Lavine trade. Doesn't that matter to you?
Arturas please don't interrupt
Bulls were 18 - 15 after the LaVine trade (feb 3). They were 17 - 8 after feb 24. They were 1 - 6 in the immediate aftermath of the trade.
15 - 5 is the cherry picked yet happily round 20 number of games to finish the season. Doesn't include the play-in game.
Of those final 20 games, Giddey played in 13, going 10 - 3.
Bulls were 5 - 2 without Giddey in those games.
Giddey had some great performances down the stretch but also some awful ones, Dallas in particular, 3 - 12 8 pts in a game they lost by 1 and was pulled in the final quarter.
I do think he can be a big part of a winning Bulls team this year, but he shouldn't get paid 30m/yr based on 11 good games out of the last 33.
Yeah I mean I don't think many people are arguing for the 30 mil a year. I think the shorter deal in the low 20s average makes a lot of sense for both sides honestly.
BN had a post this week about how 'the market' is what changed for Josh Giddey
like with Vuc, the simpler and more correct explanation is that Giddey just isn't that good and thus not valued around the league like the Chicago Bulls value them
doesn't make sense to bring up comps like Jalen Green, Suggs or Quickley without mentioning that Giddey is the worst player of that cohort. Like I don't think the Raptors would trade Quickley for Giddey even if Giddey was signed at a contract $10M less. I don't think the Bucks would prefer Giddey (at $20M or $25M) in a Giannis return over picks or those other players either.
now them and Chuggo are citing just some random Hoopshype list as a data point for Giddey's value, they put him 15th best PG in the NBA ahead of Suggs, Quickley, FVV, Andrew Nebhard. Kinda odd Peyton Pritchard is on the list as is Kyrie Irving
There is zero world where any team trying to win would rather have Giddey instead of Nembhard.
“I mean sure, Nembhard was playing elite defense against the MVP in the NBA finals and Giddey got torched in a play-in game, but did you see that half court buzzer beater?”
it's a poor list even if it made sense.
a more practical one would be 'what teams would prefer Josh Giddey this season over their current offensive engine-starter or whatever?'
so not taking into account contract or tanking ambitions:
Jazz
Wizards
Mavericks (w/o Kyrie)
Bucks
Nets
Pelicans
and then when you take out the tankers or capped-out teams, you can see why Josh Giddey has zero market and even $20M is very generous and potentially immediately untradeable
Vuc and Giddey are similar in that they’re both players who trick people into thinking they’re better than they are because they can stuff a stat sheet, but they actually only generate those stats because the Bulls give them more minutes than they deserve.
Nembhard is more a SG/combo guard. Same goes for Suggs. Minutiae be damned, both are obv superior to Giddey
Reminds me of how Duncd On only ranked Giddey at SF, because that's his defensive position
I keep seeing rumors posted as fact on fb and I am sad they are not true lol.
How do you keep love alive?
Unfortunately Bob Love died last year.
Jazz get two more 2nd rounders for just taking Georges Niang off of the Celtics' books
Niang would help the Bulls 9th seed chase, too!
new post! we have a Giddey rumor https://www.blogabull.com/p/josh-giddey-tries-to-generate-leverage