I watched it this morning. Giddey is doing his best Pat impersonation - be terrible for like five straight games and then have one good game. Now all the Giddey stans are saying he had a good game because Billy stopped misusing him.
So uh....what do y'all think about a Zach for Zion trade. Like I over the past month I've been entertaining it mentally....and I think it's my preferred strategy.
I know I should know better to dream up scenarios for the bulls where they do something...but Zach for Zion just seems so...bullsian. trade for a quasi star that, if you ignore the obvious elephants in the room, sort of meets every requirement that folks have been asking for (young, technically a big name, plays like a star when he plays, isn't breaking the bank, etc)
With our luck the bulls get him by trading their pick for him and Zach cuz why let fans even pretend to be happy
Zach has become talked about about how he's 'underrated' so much he's now overrated
like "how could a contender not want Zach LaVine?!?!", I know, with all that playoff and crunch-time success...
he may be undervalued by other GMs, or overvalued by the Bulls, but he's properly rated. He gets hurt a lot but is pretty consistently good and maybe his flaws are covered up more on a better team (and he'd try harder)...how has that 'rating' changed?
I'm up for looking at Zion in the offseason, especially if Bulls don't get top-4 lottery selection. Because they need to try for a star, and this would be a desperate attempt at one but they should be desperate.
The Bulls are awful, desperately need to turn over the whole roster, and need top of the draft talent, but they basically need to lose out to get in the top five. It's been 10 years since they were good.
I never dreamed that Karnisovas would make me miss GarPax.
The comment you shared is a parody of the classic Simpsons meme from the episode "Last Exit to Springfield" (Season 4, Episode 17). In that episode, Lisa explains Mr. Burns's unethical behavior by saying:
"At least I'm not a crook. I've always gone by the book. They are stupid, uncreative, pigheaded, but they're not criminal!"
Your comment puts a humorous twist on it by swapping out the context and characteristics for "GarPax" (likely referring to Gar Forman and John Paxson, the former Chicago Bulls executives) to mock their management style. It's a clever use of the original meme!
There’s not much to say about the current team at this point. The all-star veteran players (LaVine and Vooch) have been in the league for a combined 25 years and have won a total of 4 playoff games between the two of them. This is who they are. They do not impact winning on a significant level and if they’re the best players on your team, you’re going nowhere.
What’s funny is that I think AK’s previous bad trades are now making it difficult for him to trade LaVine and Vooch. Like, dude…the whole world just watched you trade Caruso for Giddey. Of course front offices aren’t giving you good offers now. They know you’ll accept bad offers!
The long term hope for this franchise is largely tied to the fact that I don’t believe the Reinsdorfs feel the same sense of loyalty to AK as they did with Pax. If the Bulls miss the play-in tournament for a couple of consecutive years, that might be it for AK. However, that would require Philly stepping up and actually taking this 10 seed that we’re trying to give away. Come on, Philly!
There's no hope in that idea. It's like saying there's hope in the fact that at least I'm almost done drinking this cup of tainted water when the well itself is poisoned. This franchise is ruined until someone else owns the team.
Maybe I'm being too optimistic, but I don't think that's necessarily true. It's pretty clear Jerry, and presumably Michael, don't really care what the front office does with the team as long as the team continues making them money and stays out of the luxury tax.
In theory, if the Reinsdorfs canned AK because he's been so bad that he's embarrassing them, they could go out and hire someone who is good at the job (again, solely to save face) and that person could decide they actually want to try to build a good team within the confines they're given.
It's certainly not impossible. AK absolutely could have built a good team with what he was handed. He just has no idea what he's doing, so he didn't. The Reinsdorfs suck and not much is likely to change until they no longer own the team, however I'm not sure I'm ready to say there's absolutely no way someone could build a good team while the Reinsdorfs still own it.
I guarantee a ton of the people buying Bulls merch don't actually follow the team. I live on the East coast and pretty much every time I see someone in Bulls gear and ask them if they're a fan, they tell me they don't really follow basketball. It's just cool to wear Bulls merch.
Seems like what they value in a GM is actively detrimental to the on court product. Run an efficient operation. Keep the money coming in. Stay out of the news one way or another. Seems like an ideal fit for a fast food franchise tbh
I go back to my thought that this team's assets (I won't say talent) is sufficient for a capable GM to build with. Meaning there's clay here. You just have to work with it and create a path to building a better team. It's just between the bad deals AKME do and doing no deals at all that we're f****** doomed.
nah the kids left the playdough out overnight and now it's absolutely rock hard. Last year they could have traded Demar, Caruso, Pat, Drummond at the deadline for actual assets.
I genuinely don't think I see pieces worth saving.
I don't want to speak for Rich, but I read that as him saying there are assets that could be sold. Like as of right now, Coby, Ayo, Vooch, and Lonzo could probably all be traded for a decent amount of picks/bad contracts.
I still don't think Zach can be traded for any sort of reasonable return simply because his contract is so bad. In my opinion, AKME should (so they definitely won't) trade all of the players I listed above by the deadline and keep Zach unless someone gets really desperate and actually offers a decent return. Let Zach score 30 per game for the remainder of the year and try to trade him in the summer.
Without all of those other guys, the team will be truly terrible and they'd drop at least a place or maybe two in the standings, which would basically guarantee they keep their pick. Plus, they'd remain incredibly bad next year and hopefully keep their pick again.
yeah I guess I agree with that, but it's sort of moot when you have a FO that seems totally uninterested in making those trades.
I have to imagine there's a trade out there somewhere for Zach. Like, he's the 17th highest cap hit in the league. That's not crazy. He's currently got the 4th highest eFG% of any 20 point scorer in the league after Sabonis, Kat and Vuc. The Wolves, Magic, Heat, all sure seem like teams that could use that player.
It seems unlikely that the team that was willing to accept Josh Giddey straight up for Caruso and bypassed taking an unprotected pick swap for DeMar is suddenly going to go all in on trading for draft picks.
I don't disagree. But man, the Magic are right there. there 23-19 despite bottom five offensive rating. They have a ton of middling meh contracts and surplus draft picks. Lavine would be a seamless fit for them. You could take KCP and send back Ayo to replace his defense and tertiary ballhandling, then re-route KCP for more long term assets.
He'd be seamless on the court but not on cap. If he was a free agent and Magic had space would they sign LaVine to 3/$138M? I don't think they would, even if you threw in the benefit of him helping their playoff run this season
yfbb is right that this is a total financial no-go for the Magic.
They have $170M on the books for 26-27, and Banchero counts for $0 of that. If they sign him to the max that they obviously will, they'll be at around $212M.
No way they'd add Zach's $50M on top of that. If they trade for Zach now, it'd basically force them to trade away Banchero, Franz, or Suggs in a couple years. Plus all their depth.
Maybe that's a deal they'd make for a much better and younger player, but no way they'd do that for Zach.
this is where I'm at. given it seems like nothing even remotely positive is coming for Zach, just trade the rest of the useful players and they will sufficiently suck really bad. even Vucevic and Lonzo alone would almost certainly tank this roster. the impact Lonzo has made when he's on the court is honestly astonishing (he's got like a +12 on/off net rating swing in his favor)
“(He said) stop doing the dumb stuff that we’ve been doing. Stop not boxing out, not rebounding, stop with the switch confusion, stop being back cut. Vooch is 100% correct. He spoke up, and he dug into us."
This is what Coby White said about it. I think it's funny that he mentioned two things he's really good at as things everyone else needs to do better, and then he mentioned bad switches and allowing back-door cuts which are two things Vooch is supposed to help with since he's the paint protector.
So essentially he said "Everyone needs to do the things I do well and also stop making me have to work as much on defense." Good pep talk, bud.
But this news doesn't matter: even if Sixers did get it together and get tenth seed, AK needs to merely to be 'in the hunt' for play-in to keep him from making stepping-back moves this deadline.
I know AKME is trying to brainwash us that planning future player movements is bad, but I'm pretty sure Presti understands that he can plan to trade a player in the future. Particularly one who will be on an expiring contract.
Trying to look at this from the perspective of a Rockets team that wants to really jump and has its sights aimed high, but probably isn't going to get a better player.
The obvious wrinkle here is that they keep Jalen Green. You'd think he'd go out with Zach coming in, but if the Rockets really want to have a snowball's chance in hell in the playoffs, what they actually need is both of them to maximize their firepower in the playoffs. Both of these guys are prone to disappearance, so the smart move is to keep them both.
If it doesn't work out, Green you trade one of them in the summer.
I watched it this morning. Giddey is doing his best Pat impersonation - be terrible for like five straight games and then have one good game. Now all the Giddey stans are saying he had a good game because Billy stopped misusing him.
yea he had his good game per week thing. Yawn
Vuc seems like an annoying teammate but a fun hang for media members, and thus you get that perspective
So uh....what do y'all think about a Zach for Zion trade. Like I over the past month I've been entertaining it mentally....and I think it's my preferred strategy.
I know I should know better to dream up scenarios for the bulls where they do something...but Zach for Zion just seems so...bullsian. trade for a quasi star that, if you ignore the obvious elephants in the room, sort of meets every requirement that folks have been asking for (young, technically a big name, plays like a star when he plays, isn't breaking the bank, etc)
With our luck the bulls get him by trading their pick for him and Zach cuz why let fans even pretend to be happy
Ah well...damn....so much for that I guess
Zach has become talked about about how he's 'underrated' so much he's now overrated
like "how could a contender not want Zach LaVine?!?!", I know, with all that playoff and crunch-time success...
he may be undervalued by other GMs, or overvalued by the Bulls, but he's properly rated. He gets hurt a lot but is pretty consistently good and maybe his flaws are covered up more on a better team (and he'd try harder)...how has that 'rating' changed?
I'd be into it. Not sure why the Pels would be though. Zach would be a real weird fit on that team.
The Pelicans are just too far behind for that to make any sense. They have no hope of even catching up to the play-in teams, so why take on Zach?
I'm up for looking at Zion in the offseason, especially if Bulls don't get top-4 lottery selection. Because they need to try for a star, and this would be a desperate attempt at one but they should be desperate.
The Bulls are awful, desperately need to turn over the whole roster, and need top of the draft talent, but they basically need to lose out to get in the top five. It's been 10 years since they were good.
I never dreamed that Karnisovas would make me miss GarPax.
At least GarPax wasn't stupid. They were surly, resentful, secretive, stupid, but they were not criminal!
yfBB, I'm always here to upvote classic Simpsons memes
I never got the sense that Gar was particularly bright. AK makes him look like freaking Einstein though.
The comment you shared is a parody of the classic Simpsons meme from the episode "Last Exit to Springfield" (Season 4, Episode 17). In that episode, Lisa explains Mr. Burns's unethical behavior by saying:
"At least I'm not a crook. I've always gone by the book. They are stupid, uncreative, pigheaded, but they're not criminal!"
Your comment puts a humorous twist on it by swapping out the context and characteristics for "GarPax" (likely referring to Gar Forman and John Paxson, the former Chicago Bulls executives) to mock their management style. It's a clever use of the original meme!
(I like that ChatGPT appreciated the context)
There’s not much to say about the current team at this point. The all-star veteran players (LaVine and Vooch) have been in the league for a combined 25 years and have won a total of 4 playoff games between the two of them. This is who they are. They do not impact winning on a significant level and if they’re the best players on your team, you’re going nowhere.
What’s funny is that I think AK’s previous bad trades are now making it difficult for him to trade LaVine and Vooch. Like, dude…the whole world just watched you trade Caruso for Giddey. Of course front offices aren’t giving you good offers now. They know you’ll accept bad offers!
The long term hope for this franchise is largely tied to the fact that I don’t believe the Reinsdorfs feel the same sense of loyalty to AK as they did with Pax. If the Bulls miss the play-in tournament for a couple of consecutive years, that might be it for AK. However, that would require Philly stepping up and actually taking this 10 seed that we’re trying to give away. Come on, Philly!
There's no hope in that idea. It's like saying there's hope in the fact that at least I'm almost done drinking this cup of tainted water when the well itself is poisoned. This franchise is ruined until someone else owns the team.
Maybe I'm being too optimistic, but I don't think that's necessarily true. It's pretty clear Jerry, and presumably Michael, don't really care what the front office does with the team as long as the team continues making them money and stays out of the luxury tax.
In theory, if the Reinsdorfs canned AK because he's been so bad that he's embarrassing them, they could go out and hire someone who is good at the job (again, solely to save face) and that person could decide they actually want to try to build a good team within the confines they're given.
It's certainly not impossible. AK absolutely could have built a good team with what he was handed. He just has no idea what he's doing, so he didn't. The Reinsdorfs suck and not much is likely to change until they no longer own the team, however I'm not sure I'm ready to say there's absolutely no way someone could build a good team while the Reinsdorfs still own it.
it boggles my mind that the team is still making money. Just a profoundly bland, boring product.
I guarantee a ton of the people buying Bulls merch don't actually follow the team. I live on the East coast and pretty much every time I see someone in Bulls gear and ask them if they're a fan, they tell me they don't really follow basketball. It's just cool to wear Bulls merch.
pun intended lol on Jeff
I hope you're doing your part and berating them so they learn their lesson that it is not in fact cool to wear bulls merch.
Haha maybe I should start!
Stealing Ricky's joke, but it's like seeing Nirvana t-shirts at Target
The chance that Reinsdorf would make a good hire is less than random.
You're not wrong, unfortunately.
A good hire, agreed. But better than half chance that he'd make a bad hire still better than AK
Seems like what they value in a GM is actively detrimental to the on court product. Run an efficient operation. Keep the money coming in. Stay out of the news one way or another. Seems like an ideal fit for a fast food franchise tbh
I go back to my thought that this team's assets (I won't say talent) is sufficient for a capable GM to build with. Meaning there's clay here. You just have to work with it and create a path to building a better team. It's just between the bad deals AKME do and doing no deals at all that we're f****** doomed.
nah the kids left the playdough out overnight and now it's absolutely rock hard. Last year they could have traded Demar, Caruso, Pat, Drummond at the deadline for actual assets.
I genuinely don't think I see pieces worth saving.
I guess Buzelis.
I don't want to speak for Rich, but I read that as him saying there are assets that could be sold. Like as of right now, Coby, Ayo, Vooch, and Lonzo could probably all be traded for a decent amount of picks/bad contracts.
I still don't think Zach can be traded for any sort of reasonable return simply because his contract is so bad. In my opinion, AKME should (so they definitely won't) trade all of the players I listed above by the deadline and keep Zach unless someone gets really desperate and actually offers a decent return. Let Zach score 30 per game for the remainder of the year and try to trade him in the summer.
Without all of those other guys, the team will be truly terrible and they'd drop at least a place or maybe two in the standings, which would basically guarantee they keep their pick. Plus, they'd remain incredibly bad next year and hopefully keep their pick again.
yeah I guess I agree with that, but it's sort of moot when you have a FO that seems totally uninterested in making those trades.
I have to imagine there's a trade out there somewhere for Zach. Like, he's the 17th highest cap hit in the league. That's not crazy. He's currently got the 4th highest eFG% of any 20 point scorer in the league after Sabonis, Kat and Vuc. The Wolves, Magic, Heat, all sure seem like teams that could use that player.
It seems unlikely that the team that was willing to accept Josh Giddey straight up for Caruso and bypassed taking an unprotected pick swap for DeMar is suddenly going to go all in on trading for draft picks.
I don't disagree. But man, the Magic are right there. there 23-19 despite bottom five offensive rating. They have a ton of middling meh contracts and surplus draft picks. Lavine would be a seamless fit for them. You could take KCP and send back Ayo to replace his defense and tertiary ballhandling, then re-route KCP for more long term assets.
He'd be seamless on the court but not on cap. If he was a free agent and Magic had space would they sign LaVine to 3/$138M? I don't think they would, even if you threw in the benefit of him helping their playoff run this season
yfbb is right that this is a total financial no-go for the Magic.
They have $170M on the books for 26-27, and Banchero counts for $0 of that. If they sign him to the max that they obviously will, they'll be at around $212M.
No way they'd add Zach's $50M on top of that. If they trade for Zach now, it'd basically force them to trade away Banchero, Franz, or Suggs in a couple years. Plus all their depth.
Maybe that's a deal they'd make for a much better and younger player, but no way they'd do that for Zach.
this is where I'm at. given it seems like nothing even remotely positive is coming for Zach, just trade the rest of the useful players and they will sufficiently suck really bad. even Vucevic and Lonzo alone would almost certainly tank this roster. the impact Lonzo has made when he's on the court is honestly astonishing (he's got like a +12 on/off net rating swing in his favor)
Guys, we got angry locker room Vooch last night!!
“(He said) stop doing the dumb stuff that we’ve been doing. Stop not boxing out, not rebounding, stop with the switch confusion, stop being back cut. Vooch is 100% correct. He spoke up, and he dug into us."
This is what Coby White said about it. I think it's funny that he mentioned two things he's really good at as things everyone else needs to do better, and then he mentioned bad switches and allowing back-door cuts which are two things Vooch is supposed to help with since he's the paint protector.
So essentially he said "Everyone needs to do the things I do well and also stop making me have to work as much on defense." Good pep talk, bud.
My stepfather's name is Daeqwon.
Well crap, no Embiid for 2 more weeks
But this news doesn't matter: even if Sixers did get it together and get tenth seed, AK needs to merely to be 'in the hunt' for play-in to keep him from making stepping-back moves this deadline.
Sixers ten point underdogs in Indianapolis today 😒
Paul George sat out too (of course), as did Caleb Martin and Yabusele. but Andrew Drummond returned
#SixersWatch
Looks like OKC is hurting for centers right now. Any chance we could pawn Vuc off on them?
I'm not spotting any obvious flotsam they'd want to part with who would match salary-wise, but maybe you guys see something I don't?
I say flotsam because:
1. This is Presti deal with AKME. Of course he'd convince AKME to take flotsam. Chances are, de'd trade anyone worthwhile for someone better than Vuc.
2. I'd take flotsam for Vuc... he's a net negative for this team and getting rid of him is addition via subtraction, no matter what the return.
they're hurting for centers 'right now', but Vuc is signed through next season
I know AKME is trying to brainwash us that planning future player movements is bad, but I'm pretty sure Presti understands that he can plan to trade a player in the future. Particularly one who will be on an expiring contract.
Zach, Craig, THT, Phillips to Rockets
Reed Sheppard, Adams, Green, Landale to Bulls
Trying to look at this from the perspective of a Rockets team that wants to really jump and has its sights aimed high, but probably isn't going to get a better player.
The obvious wrinkle here is that they keep Jalen Green. You'd think he'd go out with Zach coming in, but if the Rockets really want to have a snowball's chance in hell in the playoffs, what they actually need is both of them to maximize their firepower in the playoffs. Both of these guys are prone to disappearance, so the smart move is to keep them both.
If it doesn't work out, Green you trade one of them in the summer.
Trade 2: Vucevic for Gafford and O. Max Prosper
Trade 3: Redirect Steven Adams to Grizlies for Konchar+ Aldama
Trade 4: Redirect Landale, Aldama to Pacers for Isaiah Jackson (out for year) and Jarace Walker
End result is the Bulls add three guys still on the front half of rookie contracts (Sheppard, Walker, Prosper).
Do they work out? No idea. Is it better than now? Yup.
Matas is going to be in the dunk contest. I'll finally have something to cheer for this season!