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Pax answers his cellphone, and his critics

This isn't a type of trade that gives Paxson a 'genius' label (or restores it?) but it is officially an end to the jokes about his phone charger being lost, or his 'internet rumors' paranoia.

His number one goal was (and should've been) to dump Ben Wallace, and he did it. Along with his fellow superdelegate Adrian Griffin, as well as Joe Smith.

Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden, Shannon Brown, and Cedric Simmons are in. The Bulls also sent an '09 2nd round pick to the Cavs (remember they still have the Knicks '09 2nd rounder).

There are a lot of angles to this move by Pax. Time for Bullets!!

  • Freed up frontcourt time. Wallace (did I mention they dumped Ben Wallace?) and Smith were 'earning' nearly 55 minutes of time in the frontcourt combined. And while Drew Gooden will take some of those minutes at the 4, Noah now starts (and gets most of his minutes) at center, shifting Tyrus Thomas up the depth chart at the 4. Getting more time for those two (and to a-much-lesser extent, Aaron Gray) was always the most important benefit to dealing Wallace. And Smith for that matter.

    Gooden should fit right in with the Bulls this season: he's having his worst year as a professional, shooting the lowest from the field in his career. He's hitting only 51.7% of his close shots which is below average, yet should be an improvement compared to this current bunch, and he does attempt more non-jumpers than the departed Joe Smith. He's more than capable as a rebounder at the position, especially defensively (9th among PFs). He's always had a rep of being a space cadet on defense (can't find it, but there's that story of a Cavs huddle basically telling Gooden twelve times not to leave his feet to block a 3-point shooter, and he went right out and did just that), and he's a bit undersized. In fact, a Gooden-Noah starting frontcourt will be pretty slight, but very quick. We know Tyrus Thomas can add shotblocking to that mix, and for behemoths there's always Aaron Gray, but lack of strength in the frontcourt is one void Ben Wallace is leaving. But for a league (and a team, it seems) that likes to go small, having Gooden-Noah-Thomas-Gray-Nocioni in all sorts of permutations can work. Although between Gooden taking over the 'scoring four' role, and Thabo moving into the 'backup three' role (next bullet), Nocioni should see a dramatic minutes cut.

    Off the court, there's reason to like Drew Gooden as a Bull. There's a chance he will make the Mopey Iowan disappear forever (they're college teammates and seemingly good pals), and he is growing a sweet beard as part of a bet with the Wiz's DeShawn Stevenson.
     
  • Larry Hughes and the backcourt. Cavs fans hated Larry Hughes as much as we hated Ben Wallace, as they're both overpaid and underproductive. And Hughes adds 'always hurt' to make it a trifecta. So really it's not much of a question of if he's any better than Wallace, but how he's at least different. In his contract year with the Wiz, Hughes had a PER of 21.6 and hasn't topped 14 since, and Hollinger explains (before this season) the dropoff :
    Upon closer examination, the key to Hughes' decline is how infrequently he gets to the basket compared to his heyday in Washington. His shooting percentage is down from that season, but even more importantly his free-throw attempts are way down -- Hughes had one of the highest free-throw rates in the league while a Wizard but now is barely above the league average for shooting guards. Hughes's rates and percentages on jump shots are almost exactly what they were in Washington, and he's actually shot a little better on 3-pointers since coming to Cleveland. But by having to play off LeBron James, he's not getting the slashing opportunities to the basket that made him so dangerous in Washington, and as a result he's languished in mediocrity.
    So yes, maybe simply not having to defer to LeBron will bring back the old Larry Hughes, but it's also likely that his final year in Washington was no emerging season but a career one. Hughes is only 29 but is in now his tenth season, a point at which players rarely improve. At least with the Bulls there's a role for him to use whatever strengths he used to have, while Hinrich and Gordon can play off of him. He's a big guard who is decent defensively and gets most of his value on that end off of steals (which isn't good). The big question will be how his spot is 'earned' in the guard rotation. One of the major issues with Wallace was that no matter his play he was given an entitlement spot in the starting lineup as well as the healthy dose of minutes. Hughes is similarly high-paid, but doesn't have the pedigree coming in that Wallace did, so you'd hope that nothing is given to him. He can take over Thabo's current role, with a better chance for an offensive outburst as well as a better ability to play the point. Thabo has the edge on defense as well as rebounding (and therefore ability to play the SF as well) yet also needs development minutes. I would be fine with having Hughes as the 4th guard (way to survive the deadline Duh, but you're buried) who plays emergency point and then working from there.

    And of course, as all things usually do, it leads back to Ben Gordon. Hughes should not be seen as Gordon replacement, but insurance. Before getting Hughes, if Gordon left for nothing this offseason the Bulls would be stuck with nobody even serviceable beyond Sefolosha.  The goal should be first to wait for the anticipated (I swear, I am) 2nd half Gordon bonanza and re-sign him to a reasonable long-term deal. Then worry about deciding (or more accurately, see what the trade market decides) between Hughes and Thabo then. And even at that point, with the idea that Hughes is a 1/2 while Thabo is a 2/3, it'll could mean keeping both and ditching Duhon and Nocioni.
     
  •  I'd immediately send Brown and Simmons to the D-League. The coaching staff will be taxed (especially this group) with integrating Hughes and Gooden, might as well keep those two out of sight and mind. Use whatever scout/development apparatus the team has set up in the d-league to monitor them from afar. The Bulls have a full roster and could use another backup center, and since I doubt Simmons fits that bill (listed as only 6'9", 235) they could waive one of PeeOn, Nichols, or Brown (who I sincerely doubt will be re-signed) to get one. Yes, the Bulls should have an eye on development, but it's on developing Thomas, Noah, and Sefolosha, not who they received today.
     
  • Money talk. Even if we can hold out hope that there are situations where the Bulls are willing to exceed the luxury tax, they will always be mindful of it. Here's the salary breakdown (thanks to ShamSports):
     
    2007/2008 2008/2009 2009/2010
    Wallace $15,500,000 $14,500,000 $14,000,000
    Smith $5,205,000 $4,795,000  
    Griffin $1,593,000    
         
    Hughes $12,000,084 $12,827,676 $13,655,268
    Gooden $6,453,416 $7,151,183  
    Simmons $1,629,120 $1,742,760  
    Brown $1,044,120    
         
    Savings $1,171,260 -($2,426,619) $344,732
    So it isn't the classic salary dump that is the desired end to most contract mistakes, and there's actually more money owed next season (Griffin's salary next season was unguaranteed, and Simmons' option was already picked up). The important thing was that Paxson dumped Ben Wallace without taking back contracts with greater length than Ben Wallace (and didn't receive players named Ben Wallace). There is also some nice trade flexibility, as now Gooden's a fat expiring deal for next season, and Hughes the one after that.
     
  • The Boylan factor. So far, as has been harped about many times here, Boylan's been a disaster. But it's possible that some of it (and if so, I don't excuse how much of it) was driven by trade showcasing. But while I've mapped out what I think are logical ways to reshuffle the rotation, we've seen Boylan defy logic many times before. It gets back to the central theme of this lost season: there's a way to maintain an organizational drive for the playoffs while still getting the youth minutes. It's even easier after this trade. However I can see an over-reliance on Gooden, Duhon, and Nocioni mucking things up and down the depth chart. Sometimes 'versatility' just means more places to screw up, heh.

And the best part (if not that important) is that it means there's interest back in the team for these final 30 games. The Bulls are now once again amongst the youngest teams in the league, and have a lot of players who can do a lot of things, meaning that there is plenty of evaluation as to who should stay and who should go moving forward. And a very interesting cap situation to look forward to this summer, with Hinrich and Nocioni off of base-year contract status with Gooden (and Simmons) as expiring deals. There's still plenty of problems that had nothing to do with Wallace, but between the minutes he was sopping up as well as the disturbing amount power he was wielding, it was nice to check that one off first before moving on to the rest.

And just more interest in watching the games, for the rest of this season they should be better with more intriguing players getting the chance to make them so.

Kudos to Pax for swiftly undoing (as much as he could) his biggest mistake. Especially as a division rival, it'll be worth watching to see how Wallace and Smith help the Cavs, and I happen to think they can. But Pax rightfully didn't worry about what it does for them, it's about how it helps his team, whether he's declared a trade 'winner' or not.

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did you read all that?
If you want to talk about the other sides (i.e. other teams) of this trade. I set up a seperate diary just for that purpose:

http://blogabull.com/story/2008/2/22/0323/55606

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 21, 2008 11:33 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Shannon Brown is already trying to make friends
Among his new teammates.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/cs-080221-shannon-brown-bulls-trade,1,4574091.story

"I'm glad to be coming home, and I appreciate the Bulls for having faith in me," Brown, 22, said. "There weren't many opportunities for me in Cleveland, but I can bring some athleticism and toughness to the Bulls. There is not much athleticism on the Bulls right now."

Not that he isn't right, but it's pretty funny to hear it from a guy who'll be in the D-League or overseas next year.

by Big D on Feb 21, 2008 11:38 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

a guy who'll be in the D-League or overseas
Yeah, one would think...
but this is a Bulls team who treated A-Drain like an all star at times...(I'm SO glad he's gone!)
Spring training....FINALLY!!

by Bluelou on Feb 22, 2008 12:04 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Found this on an MSU student blog:
Nobody stays in college forever.

He'll go down as one of the greatest dunkers in MSU history.
______
Conquest!

http://www.spartantailgate.com/forums/msu-red-cedar-message-board/187837-tofficial-say-goodbye-shann on-brown-thread-2.html

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 12:14 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Problem is, that's all he does
Brown was the classic case of the really good college player that needed to stay in school.  Izzo gets guys into the league.  Brown could only benefit from staying in school.  I think he went pro early for the money.  He was being told he was a lottery pick.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 11:32 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Brown
I think Brown is a gem the Bulls should really hold on to.  He is an athletic energry guy who does enough other things well that I think he can make some valuable contributions off the bench, and that assumes that he doesn't develop further than he has.  He was a big part in getting victories of the games he played for the Cavs.

But hey, I might be a little partial to anyone who plays with passion after the Wallace debacle.

by Air Kukoc on Feb 22, 2008 12:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought he'd get cut
But I forgot about the buyout of Veektor earlier.  That created an open roster spot that allowed us to send out 3 and get back 4.

I'm not ready to give up on Brown, but the Cavs didn't pick up the option on his rookie deal so it expires after this season.  Maybe they thought they could resign him for less money.

I'd like to see his draft measurements.  Is he really 6'3"?  His hands are huge though which is a tremendous asset for a dribble penetrator.

Better than Duhon?  Probably.  I just don't know about the defense.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 1:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I looked for them last night
on DraftExpress's PreDraft Measurement link, but he wasn't there.  I wonder if he wasn't even invited?  I think I remember when he and Ager came out, Ager was the better scorer but Brown was considered the better athlete.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 1:24 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Forget his hands, Brown isn't a dribble penetrator
That he couldn't do it was always a problem for him as a player.  He's another great athlete that can't create off the dribble or get open off the ball like Gerald Green or J.R. Smith, but not as tall, athletic, or as good.

by Scotter on Feb 22, 2008 1:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm glad that Pax pulled the trigger.
Corpse is Gone!!!
My fave 5:
Hinrich
Sefo
Deng
Gooden
Noah
Bench:
Gordon
Huges
Nocioni
Tyrus
Gray
It is interesting to watch the Bulls again.
And if Pax will find a good coach...Ahhh!!!!
"YES,WE CAN!"-B.OBAMA.

by Azabullsfan on Feb 22, 2008 12:41 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Clean-up the summer of 2006
Paxson
Is cleaning up the problematic summer of 2006.
1.) Ben Wallace is history..
2.) Draft 2006, Trading down to get Viktor.  Viktor is history...
Yet to happen, but will...
3.) Signing Kirk to excessive contract far beyond his contribution, Kirk will be history soon ...
4.) Not drafting Brandon Roy, and Tyrus might not be able to really beat out Gooden for much playing time. And next year he performs the same as he does this year shooting .387 for an under-sized big averaging 16.6 mpg.  

by exult463 on Feb 22, 2008 12:46 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for your pessimistic, unfounded,
inane prediction about Tyrus.

And Hinrich won't be "history" any time soon.

LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 2:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm scared to see this lineup
Hinrich
Hughes
Sefolosha
Gooden
Gray

1:30 to go at the end of the first 2 quarters, would he really not try this?

Jokes aside, I agree that Hughes' production on the court is a result from him not being in the correct role. His TS% has steadily been declining since his last ('04-'05) season with the Wizards(53.3%, 50.4%, 48.0%, to this seasons' 46.7%), which also goes along with his lack of getting to the FT line(6.9, 5.4, 4.3, to this seasons' 3.2).

Hopefully he'll slash more often while he's on the Bulls-- which is what they need-- and hopefully be a legitimate option at the end of games besides of Gordon all the time.

"Jerome James PER.. is 46.68... Do that trade now! Screw Horford, we don't need him. Jerome is a monster!!!!!!!!!" - BNeL21

by NittanyBull on Feb 22, 2008 12:51 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Scary?
Even scarier, Duhon instead of Hinrich, since no one has "earned" their starting spot.

by BradBanks4ever on Feb 22, 2008 1:19 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

If it's any indication...
This new squad is a lot more fun to play in NBA 2k8 than the previous incarnation. :)

by Mike Aparicio on Feb 22, 2008 1:06 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Do you know when they're supposed to be updating
the rosters?  I got the game a couple weeks ago, but only found one roster update available.  I'm ready to start from scratch with the new squad.

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 8:53 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No clue
I am the type of basketball nerd that spends two hours updating the rosters manually. There's a fair amount of missing players, so I had to fudge a bit. (No Curry, Gray or Nichols for the Bulls.)

Noah is an absolute stud in 2k8.

by Mike Aparicio on Feb 22, 2008 10:48 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

What a great trade!
I see a starting line-up with

Noah
Gooden
Deng
Hughes
Hinrich

First off the bench: Gordon

Hopefully this means less minutes for Nocioni, who can now be played on his good nights and benched the rest of the time.

by BradBanks4ever on Feb 22, 2008 1:18 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Nocioni is
one of few on the previous team, that would at least attempt to take it to the iron.  Unfortunately, his kickouts often end up in the second row.  His D is tenacious, often getting under the skin of his opponents, thus affecting their game.  He just has not been utilized properly by this ridiculous excuse for a coaching staff.  Hughes is no real prize....  Thabo is going to have to get minutes to continue his growth.  I'm not sure I would start those guys right away.

by BiNgO on Feb 22, 2008 1:38 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

nocioni
Is there a way we can, before the game, test Nocioni for "good night," or "rest of the time?"  Gentlemen, set your breathalyzers to "Flop."

by calvinshields on Feb 22, 2008 1:40 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It appears that
Nocioni usually flops when there are those moments where the team is just standing there like Deer in headlights.  Wallace would do it constantly....We've seen that a great deal this season.....BAD COACHING!..... He tries to do too much runs around like a freak and takes bad shots.  He often appears to make up for the others lack of effort and comes off looking and playing like a bafoon.

by BiNgO on Feb 22, 2008 1:50 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Besides age,
I am not sure what the big difference will be between Gooden and Smith.  Losing Ben Worthless was the ultimate goal, so goodbye Joe.

by BiNgO on Feb 22, 2008 1:45 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Defensive rebounding!!!
And fewer jumpers, more inside shots.  And someone that can run the floor, and who's fast enough that he constantly won't give up fastbreak layups to the guy he's guarding.  Gooden could continue to struggle, but he's closer to what this team needs from the 4 and the 5.

by Scotter on Feb 22, 2008 8:56 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

One thing i wonder
is didnt TT have a strong relationship with PJ then when we signed Joe Smith they became good friends and maybe sort of a mentor to TT. Interesting to see how TT acts now that Joe is gone. Thought Joe had a great 50 games for the Bulls.

by eross226 on Feb 22, 2008 2:22 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I think thats
what Mike Brown is for

by Ed on Feb 22, 2008 2:44 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Matt I happen to think youre a genius
(And this is coming from a guy who doesn't hand that title out lightly.)

Just so you know I considered Paxson a trade "loser" because he took Ferry's crap and helped Ferry build a winner out of the trade. I think I should change the diary to "lost the trade because the original vision sucked so hard to begin with" category existing solely of Pax.

Great analysis, and all that.

Here's the for those choosing to read my "knucklehead" analysis.

Michael Jordan is overrated...except for those 6 titles 4 MVP's DPY and other things like Bryon Russell's ankle...

by pookeyguru on Feb 22, 2008 2:51 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Practically A New Season
Nice way to shake off the dust from the all star break. It's great to be able to shake off Wallace. We all expected loads from him, too bad he never delivered. If in the last year he had put up numbers like Smith's we'd actually be happy.

On that note, bye bye Joe... We'll miss you.

醉生梦死

by blackmage71 on Feb 22, 2008 5:05 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Paxson cast a couple votes in this trade
for Boylan and Noah by getting rid of both Griffin and Wallace.

It was pretty clear who the clubhouse leaders were when Griffin and Wallace organized a team meeting that eventually convinced Boylan to suspend Noah another game.

Paxson sent his two clubhouse leaders packing, which is a BIG statement to make this late in his team's development.  Look for Boylan to push for more leadership from Hinrich, Gordon, and Deng, and himself.  In my opinion, this is how it should've been all along.

Great great great analysis Matt.  I'd say I even liked it better than the trade, but this is my favorite Bulls trade in a long, long time.

by YaoPau on Feb 22, 2008 6:53 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

One aspect that hasn't been mentioned
is that BW, as we all know, is declining quickly, so by 2009-2010 he'll be absolutely atrocious for that 14 million, whereas Larry Hughes might still be serviceable (for slightly less).  As long as LH doesn't fall off a cliff too, he'll hopefully be a more valuable chip at that point than BW, who will have taken on the title of "player-coach."  

::retch::  

by Freethefro on Feb 22, 2008 7:49 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

5 blogabull bucks says
Duhon and Hughes become Boylan's favorite backcourt.
Fire Boylan!

by hscs on Feb 22, 2008 8:00 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

you bastard
This comment was better left unsaid.  Now it's going to happen and it will be all your fault.

I don't see Du falling out of Boylan's rotation.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 8:09 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Lineup
I'm imagining a lot of:

Gooden
Nocioni
Hughes
Hinrich
Duhon

Matt is rolling over in his grave. (Anyone else watch Inside the NBA last night? Har!)

by Mike Aparicio on Feb 22, 2008 11:06 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

That was pretty funny!
I love it when they have to explain what they are doing, and why it is funny, to the guest hosts, too.
Maybe I'll take up hockey.

by wjb1492 on Feb 22, 2008 12:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I need to read more Hollinger
I was writing the exact same thing all day yesterday after the trade for Hughes.  He needs the ball.  He needs to dribble penetrate to set up his shot.  This also gets him to the line.  He's not a spot up shooter.  He never has been.  He has an excellent midrange game but it all depends on handling the basketball.

It was almost impossible for Hughes to do this in Cleveland.  Lebron dominates the ball and rightfully so.  He's really stinking good with the ball in his hands.  Hughes was the wrong compliment to sign in the summer of '05, but he was the best of the crop.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 8:12 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

you can start here...
with Hollinger's trade reviews. This is still on the Insider Free Preview at the moment by the by. It's not exactly glowing... but it's not as bad as admitted Cleveland homer Broussard's. The one real negative point worth mentioning is that Hollinger (as well as nearly every other columnist as you all know) believes this is the end of the Gordon years. Which I personally think is a huge mistake...

by micah on Feb 22, 2008 9:02 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know
I do think one guard will be out.  It could be Gordon or Hinrich or Hughes.  But Gordon will remain the most likely departure due to the failure to reach a deal on an extension and how much more money it would take to reach a deal.

Gordon may end up a Knick this summer in a deal to acquire the expiring contract of Marbury.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 9:10 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Gordon/Marbury
How would that work exactly?

by Mike Aparicio on Feb 22, 2008 11:23 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

sign and trade deal
Talk to Knicks.  Find out what they want to offer Gordon.  Sign that deal with Gordon.  Then trade him to NYK for Stephon Marbury's expiring contract.

Right now, if Marbury expires for NYK it won't even help them clear cap space.  So it's worthless to let it happen.  The Knicks could hold Marbury if they want and try to get a better deal, but they can't keep him to expire.  He's worth more as a trade.

Marbury wouldn't play for the Bulls.  We'd just keep him around if we wanted to trade him or just wait it out and let it expire.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 11:31 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Wha?
How would that help us? The whole point of an expiring contract is cap relief. Why max out Gordon and then take on Marbury only to not have him play when you can just NOT SIGN GORDON in the first place?

Gordon will be a restricted free agent this summer and there are very few teams that will have cap space to offer him the deal he wants (or even the deal the Bulls already offered him, for that matter). If by some chance he's signed by another team for an amount equal to or less than what the Bulls offered him last summer, I'd expect Pax to match. More likely, Gordon will get no offers that match his over-inflated sense of self-worth and will sign the one-year tender in hopes of cashing in in 2009.

by Mike Aparicio on Feb 22, 2008 11:42 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

you'd package Gordon with someone
like Nocioni for the expiring contract.

Not that I think that's a good idea. With a package like that they should get a real player instead.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 12:59 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You and Hollinger on the right track, but
it's not simply Hughes needing the ball more.  He's not efficient enough with the ball in the half court to deserve the ball.  When Hughes had his one career season, he took 51% of his shots in the 1st 10 seconds of the shot clock where he had an 3FG% of 51.4.  This year he was down to getting 32% of his shots in the 1st 10 seconds and only had 43.7 eFG%.  Hughes's needs transition points a lot more than he needs the ball in his hands.

by Scotter on Feb 22, 2008 9:32 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

This team is built to run again
While the offense hasn't been above average the last few years, they've at least run.  Right now the Bulls are middle of the pack in Pace.  I wouldn't be surprised to see them steadily climb over the remainder of the season.

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 9:45 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

They should have played faster
than they did last year from the very start.  I've done the pace calculations before and Smith and Wallace in the starting lineup significantly slowed the team down.

by Scotter on Feb 22, 2008 9:59 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

surprise
Wow, what a shock seeing this post.  I'd given up on the idea of getting a trade only to see this post.  If we weren't going to a land a superstar, this seems like the next best thing.  I'm not thrilled about Gooden (outside of next year's  contract), but overall  I am very pleased with this trade.  Hughes won't be as good as he was in Wash but it's hard to believe he could remain as bad as he was in Clev.  Plus, any trade that eliminates Wallace is a net-plus.  
As for cleveland, this is actually a nice trade.  It's about as good a fit for Wallace as there could be.  Of course, the patented standaround-n-watch'bron offense is one he'll fit in perfectly.
"...Keeping 'SlowHand' alive since aught-five"

by CookDing on Feb 22, 2008 8:51 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Does this mean Paxson has job security?
I've read rumors from time to time that signing Wallace was Reinsdorf's idea, not Paxson's, which might mean that Paxson will not take as much heat for it as one might expect.  

Whatever the truth may be, by trading away his veterans and betting on youth, Paxson is not acting like someone who might lose his job this summer.  Then again, I suppose he didn't have much choice.  Standing pat certainly would not have secured his job.  But at this point I think he has bet the future on his young players, and if a couple or three of them don't turn into real stars in the next couple of years, Paxson may be out.

by Tim S. on Feb 22, 2008 8:52 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Redemption is right around the corner
Paxson still faces some heavy challenges.
  • What do you do with Deng?
  • What do you do with Gordon?
  • Who will coach the team?
  • Who will the Bulls draft?
  • Where will the Bulls draft?
  • Who gets a new contract and who departs in free agency?  The Shannon Brown, Demetrius Nichols, Chris Duhon game.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 9:07 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Keep Gordon and Deng
Worry about coaching now that the trade deadline is passed.
Worry about the extensions AFTER the new coach is brought in.
Don't worry about the draft until a coach is signed, at the earliest.

A new head coach probably isn't the single most important thing (re-signing Deng at a reasonable rate is, imo), but because of time frame and possible tactical strategy changes, it should be first.

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 9:24 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sign Deng. Let Gordon go, unless he caves.
And he won't cave, because too many teams are willing to over pay for scoring.

The only proven great coach available is Larry Brown, and he has a high price tag and lots of baggage and doesn't honor his commitments.  Maybe Paxson should hire himself as coach!  If not, he should hire someone more patient than Skiles -- and more patient than Brown, for that matter.  Maybe it is someone we've never heard of, like the young Phil Jackson.  And maybe Paxson should hire some old assistants for a young coach.  It worked for Jackson.

I'm quite comfortable with Paxson's ability to draft and evaluate players, although I'm worried that he falls in love with them later.  I'm less confident in Paxson's ability to trade for a great player, particularly when Reinsdorf, unlike Buss, isn't willing to pay the luxury tax.  I don't think the Bulls should tank for a lottery pick.

by Tim S. on Feb 22, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I keep reading that Hughes
has a hard time staying healthy.  What have his injuries been?  Leg? Knee? Ankle? Back? Or what?  Does anybody know?

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 9:19 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

The Chad Ford speculation about Hughes...
...being the sticking point for so long needs to be considered. Remembering that point after I said BG is gonzo has given me renewed up.

If Pax was really, really reluctant to take Hughes, then it means:

A) the move was mostly about getting rid of Wallace and freeing up minutes for Noah/Thomas

and

B) Pax may not have "given up" on Gordon w/ this trade and might still want an "extended look" at him this year. As Matt says, I hope Hughes is the insurance to signing Gordon (and the way overpriced, yet still better, replacement to Duhon) not the excuse not to. A properly used backcourt of Hinrich, Gordon, Hughes and Sefolosha won't be the best, but should be among the top 1/3 overall.

----Oh, and the Bulls just lowered their average age by 1 1/2 years to 23.9 and now have no one 30 years old or older. BOLD MOVE PAX!!!

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 9:21 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

yup
I really don't understand the giving up on Gordon sentiment. Getting rid of Wallace was the goal; adding Larry Hughes was collateral damage. The Bulls might as well use him instead of Duhon and maybe Sefolosha, but he's not good enough to warrant shoving anyone else out the door.

Plus - if Gordon does go, it wouldn't be shocking to see Hughes packaged with him.

Fire Boylan!

by hscs on Feb 22, 2008 9:39 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Other than Hughes
Paxson could have been asking for Ira Newble, Damon Jones, and Donyell Marshall if the Hughes contract was so bad.  But Cleveland was dealing with Seattle too.  Jones and Marshall's contracts expire after next season.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 9:41 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

the chad ford trade chat
yesterday (half of it can be found in the BaB trade deadline thread)had Pax trying to not end up with Gooden. How much truth was really leaked to Ford is up in the air, but I doubt anyone was asking for Hughes.
Fire Boylan!

by hscs on Feb 22, 2008 9:47 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought the chat
said Pax was reluctant to take Hughes.  Which would prove the point that he hasn't given up on Gordon..

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 9:50 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

i typed the wrong name
I'm very confused today.
Fire Boylan!

by hscs on Feb 22, 2008 9:53 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Glad he didnt go back to marshall
too many bad memories of not trading him to move up and get a certain ringbearer
For along the way, the once-popular general manager lost his mojo and made a series of poor decisions, starting with his reluctance to relinquish long-gone Donyell Marshall in a manuever that would have allowed the Bulls to move ahead of Miami in the 2003 draft and select, um, Dwyane Wade.  - Jay mariotti

funny thing is, this is probably the first time I agreed with this dude.

"We are who you thought we were"

by Thirdrock on Feb 22, 2008 9:59 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

we
could have made up for it by drafting brandon roy a couple years back...

by leeac on Feb 22, 2008 12:50 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

good trade, great write up
I would say great trade, but Bulls didn't receive a superstar.  This trade doesn't solve all problems, but I do believe this trade will help both teams.  Larry & Ben didn't fit with thier old teams because of the team's personal.  The new rotations should be exciting & scary at the same time.  This trade does give the Bulls flexiblity with a trade and also doesn't paint them in a corner with BG.  Also, I look forward to seeing Gooden's post game and chemistry with Kirk.  I am hoping to see plenty of Tyrus too.  

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the chance of Noah becoming the leader of this team.  I like the timing of this trade, & the fact that BW & Adrain are gone.  Noah has taken some punches and did his time this season, so I can see him stepping up and getting the respect needed from the team to lead.  

by Jesse07 on Feb 22, 2008 9:56 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

My worry is that Thabo
is going to be buried.  We can't give quality minutes to five guards, especially when one of them is a coach's crutch.  I think it could also end up poorly if Thomas A) ends up the third power forward behind Gooden and Noc B) is shifted over to 3 behind Deng.  

What I'm getting: glad as I am that Wallace is gone, this is still a VERY poorly constructed team.  If the point is to play the youngsters minutes, that's fine, but somehow, with Boylan, I worry.  The good news is, if he buries them now - after Paxson's public comments indicated this is a youth movement - then Pax will have to realize the goals of his coach are at odds with the long-term prospects of the organization.  And then we can bid Mr. Boylan adieu.

by Freethefro on Feb 22, 2008 10:25 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Even after this trade
which may bury Thabo a little (but I'm really hoping Du is the one whose minutes are taken) and opens up minutes for Tyrus... I am not convinced boylan should be coaching.  he sucks.  he should be fired regardless of what happens the rest of the season and if he comes back again I may have to stop watching the bulls unless he proves somehow he can do the job.

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 10:33 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I read that they tried
to trade Duhon but just couldn't fit him in the deal.  On top of that, I never heard Duhon's name mentioned by Paxson yesterday as being one of the players in the mix at guard.  I think (hope?) it's fairly safe to assume that Duhon is the big minutes loser in this deal.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 11:24 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah
Sam Smith said the cavs actually wanted him.  well, they got a better player (west) instead.  unless they wanted both.  but yeah, he said the money didn't work... and plus his contract is expiring so hopefully this is the last we see of du.

he's a good guy, and a serviceable enough player, but just was played too many minutes.

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 11:28 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

agreed
And with the (supposed) reluctance of taking Hughes... I hope it means Hinrich, Gordon, Sefo to the end of this year. Let's see what the best, youngest team can do.
Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 11:29 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Only poorly constructed...
...when you have idiot coaches who are coaching for their future.

Most important aspect of the last 30 games:

Whether it's true or a lie, Paxson needs to tell Boylan his future depends, absolutely DEPENDS on how well Deng, Thomas and Noah, along with Hinrich and Gordon, work together. If he can convince Boylan of that, and then fire him anyway, I'll have high hopes.

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 10:47 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yup: that communication between Paxson and Boylan
is the key to this trade (imo).  I don't like our duplication of combo guards (3), our overabundance of PFs, and the fact that our only centers are rookies.  But - but! - if Boylan does get the memo, I'm all for it.  Tyrus, Noah and Thabo would help out by playing well today.  Now I just need to figure out how to use this "sopcast" thing so I can watch the game!

by Freethefro on Feb 22, 2008 10:52 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Next 2 games are on ESPN, one after those is NBATV
3 games in the next 4 days on national TV works for me.

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 11:04 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I believe tonignt's game on espn
was dropped by ESPN.  They're going to have Cavs/Wiz.

by KT on Feb 22, 2008 11:14 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought that was the case for both games this
weekend actually.  espn.com still shows both as being on ESPN which had me wondering.  Maybe they just don't update the TV schedule on the website.

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 11:31 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

darn
that would've been a lot of fun.  Now I can only study while keeping a passive eye on gamecast.  (and, of course, relying on the dutifull posters of BaB for color commentary!)

by Freethefro on Feb 22, 2008 1:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It's on WGN tonight
I don't know if that means they will broadcast it on the WGN superstation though.  I'm guessing it's a likely NO since ESPN originally had it on the NAT TV lineup.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 1:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Snap!
I can't watch it unless it is on the Superstation.  :(  And they were going to be forced to have good lineups tonight too.  We usually win the games I can't see so I guess this bodes well for the rest of you.

by cranscape on Feb 22, 2008 4:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Identity... Identity... I cant say it
enough the Bulls during Paxson's regime have yet to create an identity. At least when Jerry Krause (Jamal, Eddy, Tyson) was here we had an identity. I don't understand how we got here. Depending on Loul Deng to save our franchise... you're nuts to ever have the thought in your mind. (the dude cant dribble) But anyway what's done is done at this point I think the best our only option is to bring in Larry Brown. If the player's don't shape up he'll for sure ship them out.  And he won't care about fan reaction or team fallout.  To end with all this buddy stuff nice guy crap that's been going on here lets get some basketball real players.

by Takeaseat on Feb 22, 2008 10:40 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I think this
is actually a really good comment.  Since Paxson took over, every game it seems like the coaches wait to see who's feeling it that particular day, and the offense runs through that player.  One day it'll be Hinrich, one day Gordon, another day Deng, with no consistency, no flow to the offense.

Skiles didn't help the situation by benching Gordon and playing 11-man rotations.  Boylan looks like he's doing the same.  As a result, we don't have an identity, and as a result of that, we've become inconsistent and streaky.

I think our best bet is to play up-tempo with this new, smaller team.

by YaoPau on Feb 22, 2008 2:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

i
couldnt agree more about firing Boylan. He's just not NBA coaching material. This trade does scare the crap out of me because who knows what he's going to do. I really can see him playing the crap out of hughes and gooden and burying TnT for the rest of the season. I hope that doesnt happen. Tonight i would love to see Noah, TT, Noc, Thabo, and Kirk step it up and get a W. Then Sunday see about incorporating the new guys. I would like to see S Brown stay up here rather than go to the D league because I do think he can help. I would much rather send down Simmons and Nichols or just cut both of them. I really hope not to see Duhon that much anymore. Its not that i think hes a bad pg its just that it seems to come at the expense of thabo getting time.

by Bulls4Ever on Feb 22, 2008 10:41 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

My Opinion
I love the trade. 1st it opens up time for our young bigs, and it gets Wallace's loafing ass up outta here.  It crazy to me that so many of the so-called experts like this trade for the Cavs.  They must not have been paying much attention to the way Wallace has been playing all season.

Hopefully, Boylan sends Duh to the bench for good, I'm dreaming of seeing Hinrich/Thabo to start and Hughes/Gordon off the bench.

But lastly, I think people are turning Simmons and Brown into just leftovas too soon.  Here's Simmons draft profile from DraftExpress: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Cedric-Simmons-609/
Seems like a big body that I wouldn't mind keeping around.  
Brown could become our new version of Jannero Pargo, only with more athleticism.  
Give me both of these guys ova Nichols or Curry
 

by Ceasaleo on Feb 22, 2008 11:15 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Holy crap
This team more-than-seriously needs a Big Man Camp Genius. STAT!!!

They now have three overly-athletic, offensively-challenged, very young BIGS. If they can develop all three to at least above-average offensively....

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 11:28 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Simmons has guaranteed money next season
so that's reason enough he gets a leg up over the rest of the roster fillers.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 11:52 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You know what the best part of this trade is
it brings an end to stupid trade diaries.
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 11:00 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't get my hopes up for that
The roster as currently constructed surely won't be the same at the beginning of next season.  I'm sure a lot of posters will want to chime in on that.

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 11:06 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah
but they probably won't start up again until after the season.

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 11:07 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

doubt it
1 relatively good game from Hughes = 5 Gordon is worthless, trade him for blank diaries.
Fire Boylan!

by hscs on Feb 22, 2008 11:15 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ahhh
so i was thinking optimistically.. I hope you're not right.  :P

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 11:16 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Pax was on with Hanley this morning
Interview at http://www.670thescore.com shortly.  I didn't hear it, I heard people commenting on the interview.  One said Paxson was transparent, and another said Hanley and Holmes were too soft on Pax.  

Hanley defended Pax, saying a lot of the criticism he's getting on trades are from people who really don't understand what trading in the NBA is like.  

by KT on Feb 22, 2008 11:16 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Kendall Gill
said last night that Thabo should stay in the starting lineup and I agree. He has earned a starting spot and Kirk plays well when Thabo is in there. Boylan please make that happen.

I have a feeling that tonight Noah will have a crazy ass good game. I'm really excited to see how they play tonight.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 11:16 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Skip Bayless
I don't know if he likes to disagree just for the sake of argument, but this morning he said the Bulls got the two best players in the deal.

I didn't realize Larry Hughes was 1st All-Defense a couple years ago.  A Hughes/Thabo back court might just be impenetrable.  

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 11:31 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

note on the 1st team all defense
That was the 04-05 season, Larry's best as a pro and his second open contract year.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 11:37 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I can't figure out what to make of that.
On our team you have Deng and Gordon who are sucking in their contract years.  Then you have Hughes whose best year was his contract year.  Given the choice, I'm almost thinking I'd rather have the guy who doesn't wilt under the pressure.  But I think in the end I probably agree with what you're saying...a guy who gives up after getting paid is not much use either.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 11:46 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Contract year, shmontract year
It's largely irrelevant.
Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 11:52 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think Hughes gave up
with the Cavs.  I think his game was an ill suited compliment to Lebron's.  They were trying to make it work with Hughes as the point guard.  It's impossible to do that because Lebron dominates the basketball.

There are 10 guys that would be awesome compliments to Lebron, Gordon is one, but almost all of these player are defensive liabilities.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 1:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I love it
when you talk dirty like that.   ;-)
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 11:39 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I loathe Bayless
and take everything he says with a grain of salt.  I think he's paid to to be loud and annoying and doesn't believe anything that comes out of his mouth.  I hope whoever had the bright idea to put him and Stephen A. Smith on tv together has already been tarred and feathered.  

by upther on Feb 22, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not sure why that'd be the case
I think if anything, getting rid of all the players over 30 would make the team an even worse fit for a patented Brown quick turnaround.  Plus, I don't recall ever hearing that the two of them had issues in Detroit.  I think Wallace was known as a good soldier until Saunders came to town.  

by snley on Feb 22, 2008 11:40 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

dont be surprised
if the suns dont make it to the finals again this year, i wouldnt be surpirsed if d'antoni leaves phoenix.  i would like him coaching the bulls, but who would you like to see on the bench?

by Conor on Feb 22, 2008 12:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not about who starts
It is about who finishes the game in the 4th quarter.  
Gordon and Hughes will be dangerous together at the end of games and able to score more than any other combo of guards.  I think the plan for the starting lineup is Kirk and Hughes.  I think Hughes is going to be good on the Bulls, if he earns his contract I will be happy. Maybe Gordon even takes minutes from Kirk at point,  with Sefo backing up Hughes.  I think Tyrus benefits most from this deal.

by Zac23 on Feb 22, 2008 11:36 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Lebron
Lebron definitely had to have some impact on Hughes' stats.  Hughes and Arenas on the Wiz torched the Bulls in the playoofs.  Has Lebron commented on the trade or Hughes?

by Zac23 on Feb 22, 2008 11:49 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

The only problem with
BG taking any minutes from Kirk at the point is that BG sucks at the point. I know it's what you wish for every night when you go to sleep Zac but I don't see it happening.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 12:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I just hope that by the end of the season
somebody really stands out and obviously claims the job.  I don't care who it is.  Play 'em all.  That's what the rest of this season should be about.  Let the chips fall where they may.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 1:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Here we go with the battle
for the 'World's Tallest Midget' again.

Neither Sefolosha nor Gordon should run the point.

by RogersPark Kris on Feb 22, 2008 1:02 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

like I said in the post
use Hughes as the backup point guard. Give Duhon fake plane tickets.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 1:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not fake
Real tickets to get him out of the view of Boylan.

by kingj41 on Feb 22, 2008 1:09 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I never said
Thabo was better.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 1:26 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe
we should do to Gordon what Cleveland did to Varejao.  Let him hit free agency with his ridiculously high demands, then watch as nobody signs him to the megadeal that he was expecting.  Wasn't he asking for something like 15 mil per?

by jpchi on Feb 22, 2008 11:56 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I saw a line in the Paxson transcripts
from yesterday where Pax said Gordon is valuable to the Bulls for his scoring, but only as a 6th man because he's too short.  I don't know if other GM's think the same way, but if they do, BG will have a hard time getting a mega deal.  

(Anyone else have mega on the mind today?  Mega millions lotto is up over $270 million and I'm in!)

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 12:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

and powerball is up to $115
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 12:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh shit.
I better go buy one before tomorrow.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 12:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

plus
I get nervous when BG dribbles the ball in the 4th quarter hoping he won't turn it over. I think Hughes  should have the ball in his hands while BG just spots up.

by T2fan on Feb 22, 2008 12:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Magic Game
How about that Magic game where Dwight Howard pressured BG into coughing it up at the end?  I think may have been my most frustrated moment this year.

by Air Kukoc on Feb 22, 2008 1:02 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

ha!
it's funny how people always zero in on Ben's turnovers and cough-ups and but Kirk's go un-spoken of...why is that?  I'll tell you why...double-freakin standard, that's why.

Gordon gets flamed for doing the same exact stuff that Hinrich does on a nightly basis.  I'll never understand that...

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 2:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It's true
they do have similar TO/game.  what I would like to know is who handles the ball more?  because if you think about it, wade is #1 in TO/game i believe, yet it's because he handles the ball so often. no one would argue that his high TO rate isn't made up for by his assets.  Maybe it just seems that ben turns it over at worse points in the game.  or maybe it really is that hinrich turns it over less compared to how much he handles the ball.  I don't know..

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 2:28 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

that's pretty much it
Gordon has problems handling the ball when pressured.  We've seen it all season.  Hinrich handles the ball a lot more...and anyone can see he is a better dribbler in terms of not coughing the ball up.  Sure, he's got his turnovers...but how many times do you see Hinrich slip and fall on the court with the ball in his hands?  How many times do you see Hinrich dribbling the ball off his leg or foot like Gordon?  It's gotten to the point where if we need a game winning shot and we hand Gordon the ball at the top of the key...I honestly don't if we can even get a shot off.

by Parrotman on Feb 22, 2008 2:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Last mistake will always trump
any previous mistakes.  Ben wants the ball to close games.  Better not screw it up repeatedly.

Dwight freaking Howard stole the ball from Gordon.  Tell me you know why that happened.  I believe you do know.  And that answer is the reason why Ben Gordon is NOT a point guard.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 2:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Get off it.
Dwight freakin' Howard may end up being one of the most physically-gifted athletes in the history of the NBA. In terms of pure athleticism, he's Scottie Pippen or Tyrus Thomas in a filled-out 7-foot body. The moment I saw that play, I knew someone would bitch. If you go back and actually observe the play, you'll see that it has much more to do with Dwight freakin' Howard's freakin' freaky athletic ability than BG's horrible dribbling.*

*This is not a defense of Gordon's handles, but don't use that example again because it's woefully lacking.

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 22, 2008 2:46 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It's not about the dribbling either
I have the play saved on the DVR.

The reason Gordon turned it over was because he was trying to play point guard.  He was scanning the court checking spacing, position, the clock, etc.  He's going to shoot it.  Everyone knows it.  Ben knows it.  Dwight Howard knew it.  He just jumped the play, closed the gap between his opponent, and attacked first before he was attacked by Gordon.

Gordon cannot maintain a dribble, observe the floor, identify the spacing and passing lanes, exploit the defense, and move with the basketball looking for a shot.  He doesn't have this skill set.  He's never had this skill set.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 3:04 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

hogwash
you're talking about a guy (Hinrich) who is running a fast break alone but throws the ball behind him to absolutely NOBODY!?!?  No turnover that Gordon has ever had stacks up to that.

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 3:52 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You don't really think
that TOs in the middle of the game are more significant than TOs at the very end of the game, that are nail biters, and those TOs are instantly converted into fast break buckets which cost Chicago the game?

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 4:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

you don't really think
that Gordon is the ONLY Bull to make a late-in-the-game turnover??  I can recall tons of times where good-ol' captain Kirk has done the same exact thing.

A turnover is a turnover...yeah, ones at the end hurt a lot, but ones done in the middle of a game can be the beginning of a 10-0 run that can lead to the team getting blown out.

It really has nothing to do who does them or when they are done.  They all hurt.

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 4:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

No you can't
BG's performance in the last 30 seconds of the quarter or the game is where he demonstrates why he is worth more than 5/50.  Since his first year, when he was lights out, he has really underperformed.  And it's not like the bulls don't call his number 95% of the time.  Kirk rarely has the ball in those situations.  And while all TO's are bad, TO's at the end with the game on the line are going to get you ridiculed.  Why you can't figure that out is beyond everyone.
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 4:54 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think getting ridiculed
has anything to do with it.

In fact, I'm sure Gordon still caries the 'clutch' label from his rookie year around most league observers (to use a Sam Smith term). Which shows how silly it works both ways.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 4:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sure he does
why would the bulls keep calling his number in those situations?  Same reason they keep bringing him off of the bench: he's a former Sixth Man of the Year Award winner.  :-p
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 5:10 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

"Worth more than 5/50"
I'm sure we can have someone else stumble on his face and turn it over to end quarters... ;)

Guys making 10 or less per year:
Richard Hamilton
Chauncey Billups
Tony Parker (ok, he's at 10.5)
Tayshaun Prince (8.7)
Manu Ginobili (9)

Do you still think Ben(ch) Gordon is worth more than 10 per year?

He's not even worth that... 5-8/year IMO.

by Bass on Feb 22, 2008 6:40 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

yes i can
And yes, while some turnovers come at less opportune times than others (that's true) you will never convince me that one turnover is worse or better than another...both you and Mr. Observer can go stuff your lil "BG turnover" in a sack.

And since when have contracts started being based on what you do in the final 30 seconds?  Or any 30-second span during any game?  If that was the case, Brian Cardinal is the best clutch performer in the history of the game.

The only so-called "core" player who might actually be worth their contract (or future contract) is Lu...Kirk has "underperformed", well since ANY year...Noce has underperformed, and so has Ben.

Kirk rarely has the ball in those situations because he can't and he hasn't produced in them.  Don't you think if the staff had confidence in him producing in those situations he would've gotten more of an opportunity??

What does being ridiculed have to do with anything?  I'm sure no player worries (or should worry) about that.  You never make any sense dude.

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 7:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm curious
why do you always want to talk about Kirk?  He has nothing to do with BG's performance at the end of the quarters.
Baby Bulls II?

by bullshooter on Feb 24, 2008 9:49 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Does he get more points, then...
...for points scored in the 3rd quarter when no one else can hit a basket? Or how about in the fourth when the team is losing a lead with 6 minutes left and he comes in and hits back-to-back threes?

You figure out the positive values to the flip-side of your Negative Nancy stat book and maybe I'll consider it.

Let us prepare for glory! --Michael Redd

by tyger1147 on Feb 23, 2008 8:30 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

uhh
you kinda skewed his quote a little...but I know what you meant.

What he said was:  "Ben has been our sixth man, and he'll continue in that role. He provides a huge component for us as a scorer."

In any event...I doubt that he was really asking for $15m...since when does Sam Smith become the all-reliable source??

GMs aren't crazy...if they let him "sit" someone will come in and sign him to an offer sheet.

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 12:48 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I'll look for the quote again,
but I'm almost positive there was something in there about Ben's size being what kept him from being a starter.  

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 12:51 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

It would not
surprise me at all if BG wants $15m a year. I think he has a huge ego and self worth and feels he's worth that much.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 12:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I like that about him
The Bulls need more guys who think they're good. It's a step towards actually being good. Should I feel better that Kirk may think he's not worth his $10m?

2nd half Ben Gordon bonanza. It's coming :)

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Regardless if it's coming
Pax has made a pretty definitive statement that Gordon's never going to be more than a situational role player here. At least unless Paxson goes somewhere else.

by Sports2 on Feb 22, 2008 1:07 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ben's "Self Worth"
Could likely come from Paxson.  Do you think Gordon looks at the deals given to Chandler, Noce, Hinrich, and Wallace and assumes that's he's done way more than those guys when it comes to winning games?  I would if I were him.  

by Jobu on Feb 22, 2008 1:27 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ben isnt dumb he
knows he's the best scorer on the team in fact if he could handle the ball without coughing it up all the time he'd be a all-star every year.

by Takeaseat on Feb 22, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Futhermore
when it comes to Ben its really all about development. The Bull should have been working him in as a PG and now it maybe to late. Kinda reminds me of what happen to Chanucey Billups in Boston. Bring in Kirk then following up that with Ben Gordan always a bad idea.

by Takeaseat on Feb 22, 2008 1:50 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think point guard is the position
least able to be taught.  Point guards are born not made.  Yes, a player can learn to dribble better, but without innate pointguardness, teaching will only get him so far.  I'd rather see the Bulls go after a natural-born point guard.  Laugh at me if you want, but I still think they'll look at Marcus Williams after the season.  If not, they could get a good one in the mid-lottery.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 2:06 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

BG as PG
I would agree with you to an extent.  However, I think BG has better playmaking abilities than we get to see because his ballhandling is so bad and his shooting so good that he gets pigeonholed (and maybe rightfully so - the man just cannot dribble) into the role he inhabits for the Bulls.  I like Kirk much more as a PG but I don't think that trying to teach Ben some PG skills would be impossible.

by Air Kukoc on Feb 22, 2008 2:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know about Chauncy Billups,
but I recently saw some footage showing Nash was already demonstrating spectacular pg skills in college.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 2:28 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

But if I'm wrong I'm wrong.
I'm just guessing.  I'd like nothing more than to be wrong.  If Ben could actualy practice and become Chris Paul I'd be thrilled.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 2:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

LOL!!
I just don't see that happening.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 2:42 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

heh
;)

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 2:46 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, gotta go!
Ugh--tutoring session...though I think there's probably a thing or two I might learn from you guys (and girls).  Hope we win tonight!  And don't forget your mega millions tickets!

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 2:59 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Good luck
with the tutoring.

Hubby is buying Power Ball tickets on his way home. Now if we would just win. :-)

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 3:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with u eGirl
in the sense of making Ben in to a true PG that would not be possible at this stage of this career.  Being a PG takes scrifice and Ben has been a scorer for more than half of his career. Now to make him a service able PG that can be done. Just look at Chauncy  or Jason Terry for that matter. Both are shoting guards trapped in a PG body. If Skiles would have taken time to let Ben work his way into the role from the start things would be different at this point. In the NBA there are plenty or serviceable PG's.

by Takeaseat on Feb 22, 2008 2:50 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

A bit before that
He and his brother played in differnt leagues if i remember right...he had a very strange run & gun type of playing the point, very flashy, it was questionable if he could ever use that style of play in the nba. When he was first drafted, i dont think the coaches really liked the way he played point, so he sat more than he played, worked on his shot, and eventually his unique way of running the point became a model for future generations. Or at least, i believe thats how that story goes.
im trying hard to become the next kirk hinrich, therefore im doing nothing more than being the next chris duhon.

by piccolomair on Feb 22, 2008 3:33 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree
I think you can teach the PG position.  The problem with teaching the position is you need a player to work with that has shown signs that he or she can become a point guard.  So few players are good at it because the PG position is essentially running three simultaneous jobs at once.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 2:32 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Mindset
A lot of the PG position has to do with mindset as well.  I think this is where people are coming from when thye say PGs are born rather than made (which is a little dramatic for my tastes).  Some guys are just innately confident in their own abilities first and never gain that trust for their teammates.  Even if they had a PG's abilities they probably would not be incredibly successful as a pure point.  Even if we made Ben do all the Pistol Pete Homework Basketball drills in the world this summer, I don't think he would have the mindset to really be a point.

And yes, Nash was amazing in college, it just took him time to transition to the NBA and fill out the rest of his game.

by Air Kukoc on Feb 22, 2008 2:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Oops, actually I agree
Misread your statement.  The PG position is the LEAST likely position to learn.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 3:31 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

i do
agree with you here...it's obvious that if the PG position were able to be taught, Hinrich would know how to run it by now...it's evident that he doesn't.

So you are right.  It can't be taught.

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 3:55 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

that's why I don't get upset
that he has high contract demands. This team has shown lots of 'loyalty' (i.e. money) as long as you play like garbage. That seems to be the criteria. Why wouldn't Gordon look at this team (and the league) and think he can get a lot of money?

I don't understand why Bulls fans seem so personally offended by Gordon. He'll get whatever money he gets. If he turns down 5/$50 and signs for 6/$60 this offseason, it was the right decision for him. He turned down the early extension offer because he thought he'd have a big season, so I can't fault him for that. I can fault him for being wrong and having the worst season of his career, sure, and it'll effect him in negotiations. So, like, be happy if you want to see the egomaniac get his comeuppance.

And he hasn't bitched in the least(that's what I do) about being a sixth man, even though he gets to hear from the team that it doesn't matter if he comes off the bench if he's getting minutes, and then from the media that he's a 'situational' player now and should be paid as such.

If they liken the situation to Manu, then pay him like Manu (although not as much because he's not as good). They can give him an extension and keep up this stupid bench player charade simultaneously if they must.

Again, it passes the simple building plan: keep your good players and get more of them.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 3:14 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't
I was going to add a little caveat at the end there that I, in fact, am not a huge Gordon fan.  I don't get caught up in the hysteria around him.  He's a good shooter. Plain and simple.  Better than Steve Kerr, not as good as Ray Allen.  I believe his NBA destiny is a great 6th man.

My man-love is extremely monogamous when it comes to Tyrus. :)

by Jobu on Feb 22, 2008 1:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually I was
replying to Matt but it's nice to know there are others who are not fans of BG like me.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 1:50 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

tell us
something we DON'T know...good grief

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 2:17 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Dude
you don't have to read what I post.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 2:29 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

NOW
you tell me

by ScottieCartwright on Feb 22, 2008 3:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Why cant
Ben just be like a Manu Ginobili. I dont know how much Manu makes ,but BG can be just as or better than Manu.

by eross226 on Feb 22, 2008 1:46 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Manu!?
No WAY can Gordon be as good as Manu (barring a complete overhaul of his ballhandling).  He's a better shooter and...well...that's it.  Ginobili is a versatile intensity player who would easily be starting on most teams in the NBA no questions asked.  You just can't say that for Gordon.

by Air Kukoc on Feb 22, 2008 1:57 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Manu
Season Team G GS MPG FG% 3p% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
07-08 SAS 48 12 31,1 0,459 0,421 0,833 1,0 4,0 5,0 4,5 1,7 0,4 2,85 2,50 20,5
Career   408 221 27,6 0,453 0,384 0,808 0,9 3,1 4,0 3,5 1,6 0,3 2,08 2,40 14,5

and Ben

07-08 CHI 43 26 34,9 0,422 0,387 0,916 0,7 2,6 3,3 2,8 0,8 0,1 2,23 2,50 19,8
Career   287 127 30,3 0,430 0,413 0,855 0,6 2,3 2,9 2,9 0,8 0,1 2,48 2,90 18,1

(Not too experienced with posting stats like these. Hopefully it will be legible.)

To summarize: Manu is a better shooter from the field and from 3 this year. Ben is only a better shooter from 3 for his career. (41 vs. 38 %)

by Bass on Feb 22, 2008 6:55 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Not to mention
that Ben's per is 14.7 and Manu's is 20.73...

by Bass on Feb 22, 2008 6:58 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

oh lord no
Ben cannot be Manu.  Manu is way better than Gordon.

Manu could be the man on almost any team if he so chose, but it's hard to walk away from playing with Tim Duncan and accepting less money doing so.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 2:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ben Gordon used to be
my favorite player.  Then when he turned down the Bulls contract offer last summer I had to choose between player or team...and I chose team.

I hope you're right about Ben, but I don't have that good a feeling about the rest of his season.  I think his minutes will steadily decline, and I wouldn't be surprised if he had the fewest minutes of any 30 game stretch of his career.  

Paxson's quotes really make me think the team is trying to pigeon-hole him as a 6th man.  I'm sure they still want him and value him, and will probably match any offer they get for him...but I also think they would rather those offers were for 6th man money and not starter money.

by eGirl on Feb 22, 2008 1:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I feel kind of similar
I had a high opinion of Gordon before this season.  This epic collapse has made me put more Bulls players under the microscope than ever before.  This coupled with the fact that I barely miss a game this season as well...has made me re-evaluate our personnel.  My conclusion is that Ben Gordon is just an extremely flawed player.  This season, he's like the SG version of Eddy Curry.  Is he valuable to this franchise? Yes, he is.  Do we want to pay him a huge contract that it looks he's asking for?  I don't think he's worth it.

by Parrotman on Feb 22, 2008 2:22 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Paxson's quotes are also accurate...
Gordon's lack of size is a major detriment.

I am not criticizing Gordon because he is short, as if mere diminutiveness were itself a cardinal sin. Rather, Gordon's lack of size has an appreciable impact on his game:

(1) It's part of the reason he can't finish consistently in the lane;

(2) It's part of the reason he gets his shots blocked so often;

(3) It's part of the reason he can't create his own shot at the end of games when he is guarded by a taller player;

(4) It's part of the reason he is such a defensive liability.

 

LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 3:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Sure
But how's it more or less of a detriment whether he starts or comes off the bench?  It's a detriment when he's on the court, just like his benefits are only benefits when he's on the court.

So the only way this ends up making sense is if Pax really means "situational guy we don't want to play more than we have to".

by Sports2 on Feb 22, 2008 6:19 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I own a liquor store
Sadly, that's the 2nd thing on my mind.

It's insane in here today!

by Option27 on Feb 22, 2008 3:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Okay. Paxson has EXPLICITLY stated that
this trade was executed, in part, to allow Noah and Tyrus to develop. He wants to "see what the [Bulls] have" in their young players.

Shouldn't that mean that Boylan is now forbidden from burying Tyrus on the bench behind Gooden, Noc, ridiculous three guard combinations, Duhon and two of his friends from RedNoFive, Noc and a grisled Green Beret who survived the Nam, and various other nonsensical personnel brigades?

If Boylan still refused to play Tyrus, can I take that as a sign of open defiance? Will Boylan obey Paxson's edict or will he stubbornly go with the vets?

LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 2:26 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I think he will play TT
so you can relax.  At least for the first game tonight.
Goodbye Viktor, and Godspeed.

by bullshooter on Feb 22, 2008 4:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Ive got who would be a perfect coach for the Bulls
Scott Skiles!

He does wonders with a young roster, getting them to play hard and maximize their potential.  He also does a good job of managing minutes when there's a logjam.

by rexisourqb on Feb 22, 2008 2:34 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I've never heard of this guy
The only Scott Skiles I know loves throwing inane lineups on the court

by Parrotman on Feb 22, 2008 2:39 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah I heard of that guy before
he was on cheaters... apparently he was caught professing his love for some guy named Chris Duhun. Turned out to be just a misunderstanding but it didn't look good.

by Takeaseat on Feb 22, 2008 3:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Team Rules and Drew Gooden
We don't have a no Grizzly-Adams beard rule, do we?
Interest Level = Wins - Losses + 2*Tyrus Time + 1.5*(Thabo + Noah Time) - .4*Bricked layups + 3*Red Kerr Candies

by cubbybear on Feb 22, 2008 3:13 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I don't think
it's been voted on yet.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 3:15 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

dunno
however Gooden and Hughes do wear headbands. and the 'rule' was only for Wallace.

(what a joke of a franchise this is sometimes...)

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 3:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought I heard
they wore headbands because Lebron did
Things can only get better! http:\playahatersblog.blogspot.com

by TMD on Feb 22, 2008 3:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Was that rule
just a Skiles rule or a franchise rule? If it was a Skiles rule they should be able to wear them.

by sue369 on Feb 22, 2008 3:20 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I was
just about to ask the same question.

by Jaina on Feb 22, 2008 3:21 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Franchise
Rule, when the Headband scandle happened, paxson came out and said that it wasnt skiles being an ass, but it was something that the franchise didnt want, because headbands created some kind perception of urban thugs or something or another about charachter.....
im trying hard to become the next kirk hinrich, therefore im doing nothing more than being the next chris duhon.

by piccolomair on Feb 22, 2008 3:38 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

it was a franchise one
although I'm sure Skiles had a part in it.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Feb 22, 2008 3:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

it was a pax rule
back to the days of E-Rob.

by KT on Feb 22, 2008 3:36 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Who was a worse signing?
E-Rob or Big Ben
Things can only get better! http:\playahatersblog.blogspot.com

by TMD on Feb 22, 2008 3:44 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I say Robinson
At least Wallace had one semi-productive year.

by RogersPark Kris on Feb 22, 2008 3:46 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I will wager that
Paxson won't revoke the rule for Hughes and Gooden.
LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 3:37 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Wait, the rule is still there?
They just gave Wallace the exemption?

I thought they rescinded the rule altogether.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 3:59 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I can't wait for tonight's game.
Given that the new players won't be with the franchise yet, there is almost no way that Boylan can avoid playing my personal fantasy lineup for extended minutes:

Noah
Tyrus
Deng
Gordon
Hinrich

IMO, that lineup puts the best five players on the court and is the perfect balance of skill and athleticism.

Unbelievably, I don't think that lineup has been on the court together for more than five or six minutes over the course of the entire season thus far.

Last game, that lineup was used for (I kid you not), thirty-three seconds, between 1:26 left in the first (when Tyrus came in) and :53 left in the first (when Noce was substituted for Deng).

LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 3:26 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Good Point
The easiest way to deal with a coach who has horrible substitution patterns is to just deal away all his favorite players.  

by Jobu on Feb 22, 2008 3:45 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I would rather see
Thabo start and have Gordon come off the bench
Things can only get better! http:\playahatersblog.blogspot.com

by TMD on Feb 22, 2008 4:00 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

You could start Gordon
against the Nuggets.  It's AI and Anthony Carter in the back court.  Just don't let Ben anywhere near AI.

by NBA Observer on Feb 22, 2008 4:02 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

God, great freakin' post '58
I checked 82games a while ago for this 5man setup(have wanted to see it myself), and they've never had a lineup like that this year for over 24 minutes. Pathetic really: you would think they would try it more often.

Hopefully it gets a lot of burn tonight

"Jerome James PER.. is 46.68... Do that trade now! Screw Horford, we don't need him. Jerome is a monster!!!!!!!!!" - BNeL21

by NittanyBull on Feb 22, 2008 4:13 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I would
like to see the headband rule thrown out immediately. I thought it was stupid before and caused a bunch of grief and i think its dumber now. I wanna see those head bands. Lets go Bulls. Lets get this right..

by Bulls4Ever on Feb 22, 2008 3:33 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Larry Hughes
I'm a supporter of this trade.  I found this website extremely funny though...not sure if this had been previously posted on the other message boards:  
www.heylarryhughespleasestoptakingsomanybadshots.com

by davebino on Feb 22, 2008 4:20 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Kinda funny
[This wallpaper up at Bulls.com looks like how the Bulls celebrated after the traded with Noah leading the charge]

::Minus Joe Smith::

by Option27 on Feb 22, 2008 4:51 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Ha! Statistical evidence that the Bulls really
can't finish at the rim.

All season I've complained that the Bulls miss more layups and dunks than any other team in the league. That complaint was based solely on my anecdotal observations.

Today, I followed Matt's link and finally unearthed some statistical support for my observations.

At 82games.com, under In-Depth Team Statistics, there is an effective field goal percentage for "close" shots and "dunks." (I can't find the definition of a "close" shot on the site.)

Based on my cursory review, the Bulls have the second worst effective field goal percentage for close shots (.485) and the worst effective field goal percentage for dunks (.86!)in the entire league.

It's not merely that the Bulls shoot a high percentage of jumpers (67% of their shots), but they can't convert when they do get to the rim.

http://www.82games.com/0708/0708CHI3.HTM

 

LSU 38 OHIO STATE 24 - LSU IS THE NATIONAL CHAMPION AND I AM THE KING OF BOURBON STREET!!

by 1958ChiTown on Feb 22, 2008 5:15 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

I think the biggest upside of the trade...
...is that Noah will get more playing time. I think we will definitely make the playoffs now, but we are still not good enough to go far (I would love to be wrong).

by bullsfaninbigapple on Feb 22, 2008 9:00 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

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