Quick thought on 'Whack-A-Wallace' strategy

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 14, 2007 11:02 PM CDT in News

Detroit Coach Flip Saunders made an interesting--and by interesting, I mean suspect--decision after Billups' three pointer made the score 90-83 with 2:46 left. The Bulls had made just two shots in the previous two and a half minutes but he decided to employ the "Hack A Ben," intentionally fouling Ben Wallace. Supposedly, this strategy is "playing the percentages" but I think that somebody needs to recalculate the math on this one. If an NBA team scores on 50% of its possessions it is doing well; that works out to a point per possession (or slightly more once you add in the occasional three pointer or three point play). So as long as Wallace makes at least one out of two free throws, the "Hack A Ben" strategy is not likely to produce any advantage. From a non-mathematical standpoint, this strategy takes away any chance of forcing a turnover or missed shot, takes your own team out of its natural offensive rhythm and allows the Bulls to set up a half court defense as opposed to possibly having to stop a transition score. Also, the hacked player often seems to concentrate more because he resents being singled out. Sure enough, Wallace made three out of four free throws and the Pistons failed to score on either of the following possessions. What kind of message is Saunders sending to his team if he doesn't think that they can come back from seven down with 2:46 left without resorting to gimmicks? That is just a three possession game. Even if the Bulls used up the whole shot clock, the Pistons would have gotten the ball back with 2:22 left. Score quickly and it is a two possession game. One more stop and one more score and it is a one possession game with more than one minute left. This is the kind of decision that may not make a difference in this series but could matter in a closer series. It is interesting that one of the bones of contention between Ben Wallace and Saunders last year was that Wallace felt like the Pistons were getting away from their identity as a strong man to man defensive team. Now the Pistons play zone and resort to the "Hack a Ben."

I found it interesting, anyway.

Even DetroitBadBoys found the strategy 'ugly', but I wish it were just illegal.

It may seem like sour grapes now that the Bulls have Wallace, but I never really understood how intentionally fouling a player wasn't called an intentional foul (which is 2 shots and the ball? or something). The best example was in the '04 Western Conference Finals when Mark Madsen would bearhug Shaq while telling the refs he's trying to foul him. If I were a ref I'd say "you sure? ok", and call an intentional foul.

They partially rectified this by penalizing off-the-ball fouls before the last 2 minutes, but it really should be the whole game. One problem is giving the refs the ability to subjectively determine 'intentional', but in the case of Shaq or Wallace it's pretty obvious.

The league should realize nobody watches games so they can see the 'strategy' of Flip Saunders. Hell, they shouldn't want to subject the viewer to seeing a Ben Wallace free throw either. I don't begrudge Flip for using the ploy as long as the NBA allows him to. Plus, the very use of the strategy means the game is close in the first place.

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It looks stupid now

but the Pistons wouldn't have fouled Wallace if they thought he was going to make even 2 out of 4. It's a better play if the Bulls are going well on offense. I also agree that when the Bulls are struggling on offense, it isn't a great idea. If nothing else, it lets the Bulls catch their breath and regroup.

by bullshooter on May 15, 2007 12:02 AM CDT 0 recs

He went 3/4 when they started it

Rasheed Wallace likes to comment about guys' butts. -"Them butt holes got tighter and TIGHTER."

by NittanyBull on May 15, 2007 12:45 AM CDT up 0 recs

you were doing so well

and then you post this.

by bullshooter on May 15, 2007 8:57 AM CDT up 0 recs

hah, totally misread that

Deserved that one

Rasheed Wallace likes to comment about guys' butts. -"Them butt holes got tighter and TIGHTER."

by NittanyBull on May 15, 2007 10:09 AM CDT up 0 recs

Speaking of Big Ben

I was on Wikipedia, confirming that the Bulls did in fact draft Carl Lewis in the 80s (they did), and noticed that Big Ben's picture has been switched back to the Pistons one. I'm not so sure that it was done by a petty Detroit fan, because I checked earlier versions of the page and the image is defunct (meaning they could have regressed to the old photo). NittanyBull called attention to this issue a while back, while also fixing it. Can someone out there do us all a favor and fix this again?

by Craig Hodges Explosion 3000 on May 15, 2007 12:31 AM CDT 0 recs

It turns out that you can't take AP photos

for their Wikipedia page, or you have to message the person who took it, and literally ask them to use it on Wikipedia. I did it for a couple other Bulls, and they all got defunct because of that. They gave me a freaking ear-full about it too. Pricks.

Rasheed Wallace likes to comment about guys' butts. -"Them butt holes got tighter and TIGHTER."

by NittanyBull on May 15, 2007 2:40 AM CDT up 0 recs

So...

If i took a picture of Ben Wallace you could use it right?

by SRQman on May 15, 2007 9:44 AM CDT up 0 recs

Exactly

If you take a look at the other pictures of basketball players, none of them have AP photos, but photos taken exclusively by the user.

Just take a look at Nocioni's

Rasheed Wallace likes to comment about guys' butts. -"Them butt holes got tighter and TIGHTER."

by NittanyBull on May 15, 2007 10:12 AM CDT up 0 recs

Darn

The best I have of Wallace is a shot kinda far away.

by SRQman on May 15, 2007 1:22 PM CDT up 0 recs

Matt Watson is cool with any strategy

that gets the Pistons national attention.

by Paxson Jackson on May 15, 2007 9:10 AM CDT 0 recs

is that a fanhouse jab?

(f'real, I'm not sure what you're getting at)

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 15, 2007 9:54 AM CDT up 0 recs

in reference

to this.

by Paxson Jackson on May 15, 2007 10:00 AM CDT up 0 recs

You missed the point of that post

I meant that I was happy to see the guys who made the song get national recognition. I could care less about what kind of recognition the Pistons as a team receive.

by Matt W on May 15, 2007 4:42 PM CDT up 0 recs

"couldn't care less"

Apologies.

by Paxson Jackson on May 15, 2007 4:52 PM CDT up 0 recs

weeee!

things are getting chippy!

bring on the game 5 post! make it good! make it worth remembering until next season!

weeee!

by Boney on May 15, 2007 4:52 PM CDT up 0 recs

ah, now I see why you don't have a blog

but kudos for recognizing your limitations.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 15, 2007 6:19 PM CDT up 0 recs

I'll make the easy joke myself

No, I don't heed my own advice on that one :-D

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 15, 2007 6:27 PM CDT up 0 recs

I got no problem with it

Personally, I'd rather watch a free throw shooting contest between Shaq and Ben Wallace than the Cavs-Nets series. Fans love to see millionaire basketball players missing free throws because it makes them feel better about themselves. It allows fans to say "Hey, I can make a free throw and (insert name of highly paid basketball player) can't!" while ignoring the fact that they weigh 300 pounds and haven't done anything athletic since high school.

by Big D on May 15, 2007 11:05 AM CDT 0 recs

HEY!!!

I did one thing athletic. Gimme a break.

by tyger1147 on May 15, 2007 11:09 AM CDT up 0 recs

Intentional fouls...

...can the league change that name? Please? A lot of fouls aren't intentional; a player gets a little too aggressive or physical, a players gets faked out and gets caught reaching, etc.

But there are a LOT of intentional fouls. "As long as he looks like he's going for the ball, that's okay." What the hell is that? A guy who gets beat on an ISO and grabs the guy's jersey (:cough: Kirk :cough:), that's not intentional?

But yeah, as Matt pointed out, fouling Wallace or Shaq is about as intentional as it gets. Put it to four or five minutes out and I'm fine. No team is going to intentionally that far out--at least I wouldn't think so.

by tyger1147 on May 15, 2007 11:09 AM CDT 0 recs

Intentional Fouls

I believe that is only a rule for college ball. The NBA has flagrant fouls, but I don't think I've ever seen an intentional foul called. I don't believe it exists in the NBA. Otherwise, these would surely be called intentional.

This strategy has NEVER worked in an NBA game. Flip never liked Wallace and I can't help but suspect hew as hoping Ben would blow the game. It's a dumb strategy, especially when your team is already in the midst of a comeback. Why change the momentum? Bush league...

Deng 4 MVP, 2008!

by corey williams corey benjamin on May 15, 2007 11:23 AM CDT 0 recs

I think you're right

that's why I was vague on the call and penalty. But whatever they do for 'clear path' fouls should apply in this case too.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 15, 2007 11:28 AM CDT up 0 recs

Ben could have put a nice touch on it

He was running around by the Detroit bench to prevent a foul. Had he accidentally run into the 5'11" 175lb Flip Saunders and put his scrawny ass in the hospital for playing such pansy tactics, I would have gained respect for Big Ben.

{Bell Sound after Flip is pushed into Sheed's lap}

"Always turn a negative situation into a positive situation." -Michael Jordan

by cubbybear on May 15, 2007 11:42 AM CDT up 0 recs

Ben said

he has been working hard on his free throw shooting and he has improved some. Doesn't bother me if they foul him.

History..you can either read about it or be part of it. GO BULLS!!!!!

by sue369 on May 15, 2007 11:50 AM CDT 0 recs

Here's all I'm going to say on this topic

instead of getting sour grapes about it, just know the "hack a ben strategy" was used by Riley in the playoffs AGAINST the Pistons. Why wouldn't Saunders try to exploit something that was used against him? Skiles would do the same thing...

I think the whole "intentional foul" thing is weak. If it's a loose ball foul, that's one thing, but to just hug a guy is ridiculous. It takes no strategy other than just saying "ok, FOUL HIM FOUL HIM FOUL HIM!". Who cares whether Ben hits the shots or not, it's a drain on the fluidity of the game.

Don't blame Flip for doing it though, he's not the first, and he won't be the last. Wallace needs to hit more then 50% before people will stop.

by Boney on May 15, 2007 12:25 PM CDT 0 recs

We're not "blaming" Saunders.

We're saying he's stupid for doing it. Do we blame Skiles for going with Duhon and Noc? No, the blame is obvious. We say (with disagreements) that he's not being smart in doing it.

As pointed out in the piece... with the time remaining, and Bulls already struggling offensively. He was taking a big risk.

Heh... No one said Saunders should change the rule or that he shouldn't do it cuz it's not nice. Just that it's bad strategy, just like what you said.

The NBA should change the rule. That's who to "blame."

You're stupid.

by tyger1147 on May 15, 2007 12:41 PM CDT up 0 recs

I'm stupid?

(I know that's setting up some run on sentence with Paxson "The Thesaurus" Jackson agreeing with the subject line).

I didn't blame anyone for it. Who cares if the "strategy" didn't work this year? In the past it has worked, so (and read carefully) how can you blame Flip for resorting to hack a ben? If you read if carefully you'll realize that I'm not telling you to actually blame Flip, I'm asking how can you blame him for using it? It's not bad that he did, because the rules allow it.

In fact, I'd go to it tonight if I were him. It's a shady way of doing it, but it has worked in the past.

by Boney on May 15, 2007 2:48 PM CDT up 0 recs

do you just read the comments?

Friedman's point was fouling Wallace might be hurting the Pistons, and it's not just the FTA.

by Paxson Jackson on May 15, 2007 2:52 PM CDT up 0 recs

ahh

I guess that's why I didn't "get it" because there is no point to not "hack a ben" when it's worked in the past. I don't see how it's hurting Detroit, they did it in one game in which they were down by double digits.

by Boney on May 15, 2007 2:57 PM CDT up 0 recs

Wow! You are an idiot!!!

Didn't I just write (and Matt repeated) that no one here BLAMES Saunders for doing it?!?! We (the few who have voiced their opinion) BLAME THE NBA! Not Saunders. God, you're a moron. Jesus effin' Christ. Wow. the stupidity is unbelievable.

Yes, you're stupid.

by tyger1147 on May 15, 2007 4:13 PM CDT up 0 recs

instead of worrying about what you'll say

try reading first.

"I don't begrudge Flip for using the ploy as long as the NBA allows him to. "

ugh, you're tiring.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 15, 2007 12:52 PM CDT up 0 recs

hmm

I stated my overall OPINION on it. I could post a "diary" telling everyone why I, personally, don't like the hack a ben strategy but that would be redundant.

I read it, I realize the guy says it probably wasn't a good idea... in years past it was though, it got the results the teams wanted (see the Heat winning the series last year... umm against Detroit since some of you guys are literal).

It sucks because Ben actually made the free throws this year, and last year I be he airballed a few.

by Boney on May 15, 2007 2:39 PM CDT up 0 recs

Hey

You're stupid. Just wanted to see how that would feel. Yup, felt pretty good. Sorry - a little self-indulgence on my part. I've gotta get myself at least a little happy before the Bulls' season ends tonight.

[Dreading this game - worst case scenario is that they choke it away like Game 6 vs. Washington - that took me weeks deal with. If they're gonna lose, I hope that Detroit just beats them and not that Chicago gives it away - I can't take that on a season ender again.]

Deng 4 MVP, 2008!

by corey williams corey benjamin on May 15, 2007 5:25 PM CDT up 0 recs

Hell yah!

I hang my head in shame for doubting my team. But they picked it right back up for me. Bring on Game Fuckin' 6!

Deng 4 MVP, 2008!

by corey williams corey benjamin on May 15, 2007 9:49 PM CDT up 0 recs

Also...

... and I'm just saying this, not arguing with what anyone has already said, it's worth pointing out that Ben is so historically bad with his free throws that Miami was using this strategy when Miami was ahead last year, and it worked for them. As I'm sure you know, the guy has never hit 50% in a season and shot just 27% in the playoffs last year -- putting him on the line last year was a very effective way for Miami to preserve their lead, which is why Wallace never left the bench in the final quarter of his last game as a Piston.

But hey, more power to him that he's hitting 57% in this postseason -- hopefully that'll prevent us from having to see Hack-a-Ben anymore.

by Matt W on May 15, 2007 4:56 PM CDT up 0 recs