If Aaron Gray is starting this team is in big goddamned trouble

I kind of like the idea.  I could see it being a situation kind of like Curry in years past where they'd have someone to throw the ball into at the start of the game and try to establish something in the post.  Then work outwards to our perimeter players.

He still might only get 20 minutes a game, starting the first and third quarters, and then bring in Noah and Thomas for energy and athleticism off the bench.  I assume he'd see no time in the crunch.  Certainly something to try out and see what happens.  If it fails, we've dealt with slow starts before and always recovered.

If he does start, he probably won't be out there very long.  He'll be on the bench in a few minutes after picking up two fouls.

if Skiles wants to give it a try with starting Gray again, then tonight (vs. the Mavs) is the night to do it.  

These last couple of games of the preseason is when most of the teams start to give their regulars more minutes and are using more of a set rotation...this will show us what Gray can do against some polished starters.

If he stinks up the place tonight, then at least you still have one more preseason game to try Tyrus, Joe, or Noah in the starting lineup.  

I'm hoping for the Milwaukee game, that our regular starting five can be on the floor at least ONE time together

If you look at the minutes that our  forward and center positions will play after our starters and Nocioni get their minutes, you will find that Gray, Thomas, Smith, Griffin, and Noah will average about 10 to 12 minutes each until one steps forward to outplay the others in game situations.

Gordon, Deng, Hinrich, and Wallace-35 minutes each=140 minutes
Nocioni 25 minutes
Thalbo 15 minutes
Duhon 10 minutes

That leaves 50 minutes for everone else. Hopefully, TT will step forward and grab 20 to 25 minutes with outstanding play. At this point, I have no idea how Skiles will divide up these 50 minutes of playing time.

for me, I just hope that it's this simple:
production=playing time.  
I'm not as upset about the idea of tinkering in the first few weeks as long is it's not terribly dramatic.  Ten preseason games can't be too helpful for getting a solid lineup.
I do agree with the idea that starting a rookie at Center is not very inspiring.  A possible bright points of such a move:
Ben getting some minutes at PF which should help him keep from wearing down.

and I'm not against this idea.  He was out there against starters as well as backups, and he was one of the most consistent players we had.  

His lack of speed didn't hurt him much.  He was certainly in his spot on offensive sets, was able to make baskets against all competition, usually had good rebounding position, and was there to challenge the shot on defense.  He didn't get the flashy blocks, but he definitely changed shots.  Gray's one negative was being foul prone.  That's not too bad since he was never going to play 40 minutes a game anyway.

Gray is far more ready to start than Noah, I don't care where they were picked.  Not only does he know the plays a lot better, he can contribute consistently in more ways.  Noah might have a back to the basket move, but we'll never see it because he will get stripped every single time he starts backing someone down.  His awareness and decision making is really lacking.  If it was up to me, i'd send him to big man school for the first half of the season and have him learn post moves, how to hold the ball so it's protected, how to distinguish a high % shot from a low one.  It's true that Noah has good ball handling and passing skills, but if he dribbles in traffic and can't see the open man, those skills mean nothing.

Tyrus is disappointing.  He's still depending too much on his athleticism to make up for not being in the right spot.  He's still has really poor shot selection.  He did actually hit a few midrange jumpers, which I didn't see at all last year.  He might be a better option than Gray in the starting lineup, but it's far from clear.

that Tyrus somehow has put himself in the notorious Skiles dog house, the Alcatraz of dog houses, from which it is impossible to escape, from which no mere mortal has ever escaped?

We can't have the most athletic (and exciting) player on the team sitting the bench because he didn't earn his Skilescouts merit badges over the summer.

He has to play to improve, like he did last year.

I already have a headache.

We know they are one of the hardest working and effective teams on defense and have been for years. They are clearly lacking consistent scoring and have not upgraded significantly during this offseason. THe opportunity that Gray is being given is solely due to the severe shortage of skilled players on offense.

Is giving too much playing time to the Duhon/Gray "hustle" types in favor of more talented players.  That was fine a few years ago when the more talented players weren't really that good themselves (hello Eddie Robinson), but it's not going to cut it now.  I don't care how hard Aaron Gray works or how lazy Tyrus Thomas is - Thomas is the better player.  Hell, if Thomas really is that lazy, then play Smith (wasn't that the point of giving him the midlevel?) or Noah.  Gray's had a few decent preseason games, but come on, there was a reason he was the 49th pick in the draft.  You mean to tell me that Paxson is such a genius that he can find a good 7-FOOTER in the 2nd round (who played four years of big-time college basketball), and that none of the other 29 teams in the entire league had any idea that the guy can play?  Paxson is smart, but he ain't that smart.  Maybe Gray can eventually become a serviceable backup center (which is nothing to be ashamed off, since those guys last seemingly forever), but to start him?  On a team that thinks it can go to the Finals?

I'll admit 1st that I have seen zero mins of Bulls preseason basketball.  Not even 1 sec of highlights.  Although I did watch many games and all playoffs last year so I think I know what they had.  I don't think a few preseason games mean anything.  I do think Skiles and assistants probably learn just as much or more in practice on who improved and where rookies are at.

All that said, the only time I would think Gray should be inline for mins is when Bulls go against a BIG center so not to tire Wallace down so much in 1st half of games and reg season in general.  But other then Shaq, Ming, maybe Zydrunas how many BIG centers are there

The majority of time I think Bulls are better off going young and athletic with Thomas/Noah or 3pt shooting with Noc so they can play uptempo game.  I remember seeing something about Skiles saying Bulls might add some full court pressure, it would seem thats due to Thomas/Noah playing at PF with Wallace and not Gray at C.

Overall I would wait to make judgements until Bulls play a few games, although I do hope 1)Bulls get off to better start and 2)Thomas does become productive part of rotation as Bulls should be contending for East and not still finding their way

instead of italics, I might have been convinced.

I never thought I would click on this website and find:
(a) the serious notion floated by Skiles that might start Gray; and
(b) reference to both live and dead Mikan <<<cringes with memories of Mikan drills in high school>>>

I have not seen one second of preseason play, but it sounds like there are two motivations here:  1) light a fire under Tyrus and Noah; 2) Gray may be filling the role that Michael Sweetney should have filled last year, namely, to play about 5-10 minutes to get a couple easy post buckets to get some momentum going and to open the floor for the jumpshooters.
I am also willing to accept a third possibility from reading about preseason games, summer play, and Gray's weight loss: he may actually be that good.

...find a happy medium??  :)

I don't think it's as bad as Matt is putting it and it's not as good as JoJo is putting it...it's definitely somewhere in between

I don't think that Gray is a "legitimate" starter (whatever that means) but at the same time I don't think he deserves to be the 12th man either (that's Viktor's job).

We might all change our minds after tonight's game...whether for the good or the bad.

I think you guys who are so agaisnt Gray starting are way too focused on starting vs. coming off the bench.  What matters to me isn't that Gray should start, but that he and Big Ben compliment each other well.  Big Ben and Tyrus definitely do not.  I do not want to start the games with two guys in the front court who can't score a lick.  I don't want to see Tyrus Thomas shooting jumpers.  Joe Smith is a different story but he's been hurt.

I've watched the last two preseason games and Gray looked head and shoulders above Thomas and Noah on the offensive end.  Do I think that means he should play more than Thomas?  No.  But he can definitely start, give us a few minutes, set the tone and be a threat to score to open up the jump shooters.  Will he get double teamed?  No, but Big Ben and TT can't even dribble the ball in the post effectively enough to even give the mirage that they might try to score.  Plus Gray can hit the jumper that PJ Brown used to hit.  

Meanwhile, Thomas can come off the bench, play more minutes than Gray and get teamed up with guys like Nocioni and Joe Smith who have offensive capabilities and allow TT to do what he does best, grab boards, disrupt on defense and dunk the ball.  Not shoot jumpers like he'd be forced to do while on the floor with Ben.

If Gray can't cut it and Joe Smith heals quickly, throw him in their but I just am not in favor of TT and Big Ben playing extended minutes together at all.  Obviously you can't bench Wallace so that means Thomas can't start IMO.

What the hell? The season really needs to start...

I am just going to call Aaron Gray, the reincarnation of Ken Mastrole until further notice.  

(bears fans should remember the reference to a preseason savior who outplayed a starter, briefly became a local hero, and was cut before the season)