Retaliation on James Posey (UPDATE: Posey Suspended)
[UPDATE: Posey suspended one game. -Matt]
This guy is a complete chump. Whats even worse is he acts like he didn't mean it. He puts his hands up like "oh I didn't mean to do that", he's a chump.
But the bigger chumps will be the Bulls if there is not an immidiate retaliation on Posey during their next meeting on Sat. January 27th at the United Center. I was pissed that Ben Wallace, who was standing a few feet away, didn't at least give Posey a good shove. I understand you want to keep a cool head and the game was close and everything like that but you need to stand up and defend yourself. Are we going to wait until Posey breaks Ben Gordon's arm? WTF?! Scott Skiles is supposed to be a badass that challenged Shaq to a fight when they were teammates. He sounded pissed after the game. But I want to see action taken on Jan 27th, if not, this team is a bunch of sissies. And I want to see it on POSEY not Wade or someone else. That's how I feel. You don't let the same guy, on three seperate occasions, try and injure one of your players and just sit there and do nothing.
Then Pat Riley had the nerve to cry about Kirk Hinrich grabbing Wade's hand and that's how he got hurt. Pat Riley is one of the biggest hypocrites I've ever seen. He used to whine and cry when the Pistons would beat the hell out of the Lakers. Then he becomes the Knicks coach and applies those same bad boy tactics with his Knicks teams. Pat Riley can go to hell as far as I'm concerned.
Now to Stern and Jackson. The Bulls should be sending a tape to the league office with all three of those cheap shots. If Anthony gets 15 games for throwing one punch, Posey should be getting multiple games for this. I think it's safe to say there is a pattern here. Heat are losing, Posey can't handle it, Posey delivers cheap shot. And an even more disturbing pattern, Bulls do nothing to retaliate.
If Stern and Jackson are serious about cleaning up dirty play with excessive suspensions, then I would expect Posey to at least get three games. But I doubt it.
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139 comments
Comments
The Knicks/Nuggets 'Brawl'
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 10:38 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
So
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 10:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, fantastic
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on Dec 28, 2006 10:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Don't use Wallace then
Losing Posey will not affect the Heat all that much especially with the emergence of Dorrell Wright.
But knowing Pax, he'd never advocate using a thug a la John Chaney.
by james@lifeinthecell on Dec 28, 2006 12:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
dont use tyrus
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 4:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Here's the difference...
by defensive indifference on Dec 28, 2006 11:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ugh
A hard foul will probably be made if the situation presents itself...but what do you exactly want to see? A Heat player hurt and a shoving match? Maybe a few punches so everyone can write articles about what a black-eye it is for the sport?
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 10:48 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Was Kirk responsible for injuring Wade?
by paxson43 on Dec 28, 2006 12:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hate to steal Matt's thunder,
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 12:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed: Kirk's not that talented...
by paxson43 on Dec 28, 2006 12:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
it's hardly worth
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 12:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Come on now.
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Amen
by Freethefro on Dec 28, 2006 1:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know
So is Kirk dirty? I doubt it, at least not more than the average player. But this is the NBA, not some choir boys playing pick up.
by jamestkirk on Dec 29, 2006 5:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If they retaliate
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 10:51 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Benny the Bull
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 4:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
It's like in the 92 conference Finals when Danny Ferry took a couple swings at Jordan. Was Jordan the one that did the retaliation in game 6?? NO, it was Stacey King who took out Ferry on a break away.
Again, do you just let James Posey keep taking cheap shot at the Bulls players. Are you happy with that? Will you be happy when one of these cheap shots results in a lengthy injury? It could of happened to Deng. Than goodness it didn't. A message need to be sent. Or else, we're the Bulls, take your shots and don't worry nothing will happen as a result.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 10:58 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
ummm...
I was pissed that Ben Wallace, who was standing a few feet away, didn't at least give Posey a good shove.
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 11:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
no good can come of this line of thought:
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 1:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Love
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 11:00 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
yeah
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 11:01 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
So
What if the league just gives a fine with no suspension? That could happen. The NBA is so incosistent with their puishments. I wouldn't be shocked if Posey gets nothing.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 11:03 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
he's already getting 10K fined
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
wow
by CookDing on Dec 28, 2006 2:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i didnt say it means anything
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 4:20 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That could happen
by Big D on Dec 28, 2006 12:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
okay
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 11:05 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I gotta go guys
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 11:06 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
beat them don't fight them
by NY Chicago Fan on Dec 28, 2006 11:11 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I agree
That's my whole problem. It's the same guy threee different times.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 12:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Send Khryapa out there to punch Posey
by Big D on Dec 28, 2006 12:04 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
retaliation
What would that do or accomplish you ask? Well, I'll use this anology. Maybe it makes sense. A bully steals a kids lunch money on Mon, Tues, and Wed. He goes to take it on Thursday but the kid punches him in the face when he tries to do it. On Friday, the bully thinks twice about taking the money. Posey is intentionally trying to hurt our guys without any consequence. If he had it in the back of his mind that there would be consequences for his actions he wouldn't do it, in my opinion. He obviously not worried about league consequences because he continues to do it. A different sport, but guys knew never to touch Wayne Gretzky because it would mean they would get their butt kicked for the rest of the game by Marty McSorely and guys like that. Again, hockey is a different animal but guys had that in the back of their mind. All Posey knows is, I take my cheap shot and nothing happens. He did have the one game suspension in the playoffs but that obviously hasn't done much to stop him.
Now I made a comment that the guys who hit big Marty in the NBDL should be banned. Now the fact that I made that statement should mean I should know better. Especially with the big suspension in the Knicks/Nuggs brawls. But what I think should happen, and what actually happens, are two completely different things. Carmelo suspension was excessive in my opinion. Now does that mean that any punch thrown in the NBA will result in 15 game suspension? I doubt it. The only reason those penalties were so extreme was because it was in NY. If the brawl was between the Warriors and the Supersonics it wouldn't have been nearly as long. Hell, Ray Allen and Keyon Dooling had a fight that went into the front row last January. Allen got only 3 and Dooling got 5.
One cheap shot, okay. 2 cheap shots, eh not good. 3 cheap shots, something needs to be done. I said Ben Wallace should of gave Posey a shove, I still think so. Would a shove result in a 15 game suspension and loss of home court, no. But something that could result in a loss of home court is a broken wrist to Luol Deng. It could of happened, thank God it didn't. Next time Skiles needs to send out the goon to send a message to Posey. Again, who's the goon on the Bulls I don't know? Sign Kendall Gill to a 10 day like Sue said :) I'm curious to see what the league will actually do here.
Just remember one thing, WWNVLD? If that happened to Stormin Norm I think there would have been an all out brawl.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 12:21 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
First time caller
I'm curious to see what the league will actually do here.
Shouldn't an expert like Brian Kush know exactly what's going to happen to Posey?
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 12:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The Knicks fight didn't start with a punch.
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on Dec 28, 2006 12:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And that is the problem...
by corey williams corey benjamin on Dec 28, 2006 12:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The league doesn't give a crap about consistency
by Big D on Dec 28, 2006 1:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
The NBA doesn't want people riled up. Talk less about a story and it will go away in the minds of the general public.
But not here at Blog-a-Bull.
We're beating this donkey to death.
by james@lifeinthecell on Dec 28, 2006 2:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Terrific point
by Freethefro on Dec 28, 2006 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh God..
What will happen to Posey? I think the league is inconsistent with there punishments. So if I had to bet on it, I think Posey gets 1 game.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 1:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know you're not an expert,
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 1:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not really
I think the guy who punched Marty should be banned. Punching a guy and having it result in a fractured skull is pretty bad. I know that probably wasn't the intent but that was the result. Will it happen? Probably not.
That doesn't mean I don't think a message being sent to a cheap shot artist shouldn't happen. The league is cracking down with the Knicks brawl. Thats what we assume, but we'll see what happens with the next fight or punch thrown.
Everyone is assuming that if Wallace did what I suggested that it would result in NY brawl. Chances are it wouldn't. It could, but there have been several hard fouls, shoving matches, punches thrown, in the NBA that haven't resulted in 10 man brawls.
So Paxson Jackson, your cool with Posey just taking cheap shots at the Bulls? I'll wait to see what the league does. I'm very curious to see, considering it's the same team and three different incidents.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 1:24 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's just ridiculous
Who cares what they think now? As long as the Bulls can keep beating them, that's all that matters. Remember the Bad Boy Pistons? By getting into it with them, the Bulls were playing their game. The Pistons sure went away quick when the Bulls stopped caring and just beat them.
by Moses Taylor on Dec 28, 2006 2:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Do you
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 12:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
by defensive indifference on Dec 28, 2006 1:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Fighting
It sounds bad but I can't wait until another punch is thrown in the NBA. Just because I want to see what the suspension is. If it's 10-15 game, like Anthony, then I'll change my opinion. But until I see that I don't think a message being sent via a hard foul would result in a lenghty suspension.
My question to everyone I guess is, are you okay with Posey continuing to do this? What if it happens again? What then?
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 1:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Of course we're not o.k. with it.
And what was so horrible about the Knicks/Nuggets fight anyway? There was one punch thrown and no one was really hurt. Yeah, it was a big mess, but nothing remarkable.
I wouldn't feel good about the Bulls sending a scrub to play enforcer and stooping to Isiah's level either. I don't really care if it would be more justified in their case.
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on Dec 28, 2006 1:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay
by corey williams corey benjamin on Dec 28, 2006 1:23 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It doesn't sound bad,
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 1:25 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
No the next time they play I think someone should give Posey a hard foul. Not a star but the 11th or 12th man can do it.
Whats it going to take, Posey hurting Gordon or Noce? Hell, I'm suprised he doesn't have a towel like that Packer player that hurt Jim McMahon:)
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 1:35 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Save it for the podcast,
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 1:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay
I think there should be retaliation. I don't think that's wrong.
A majority of the people who have responded don't think there should be retaliation because of a possible suspension that might result. They're not wrong either. So thanks or acknowledging the podcast and keep the insults for James Posey.
Let me ask you this. Possible suspensions aside. Do you think there should be retaliation agaisnt Posey? Yes or No.
Example - Send in Khryapa like someone suggested. Khryapa delivers a hard foul to Posey, similar to the one on Deng. Khryapa gets a 5 game suspension. Would you object to that?
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 2:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
'message'
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 1:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree.
But how about some lip service from one of Deng's teammates? Somebody say something! Anything!
Wallace had something for Riley's ears when it affected him, why not something for Posey's ears too?
Such a big deal was made about the brawl with the Wizards a few preseasons ago, and how it brought the team together. Wouldn't this have been the ideal time to at least say something to Posey?
by james@lifeinthecell on Dec 28, 2006 2:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hinrich and Haslem
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 2:13 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just looked that up
The way Tom Dore reported it, I thought they occurred earlier in the game.
by james@lifeinthecell on Dec 28, 2006 2:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
right, so they 'said something'
I just don't see what exactly people want. Seems like most want 'a message'...well great. I'm just happy they won this game and I'm sure if they want to retaliate they will in the next game. While still winning.
And despite what was reported I don't buy into the team coming together after Eddy Curry punched a Wiz in the nuts. Was that the year they started 0-9, or 12-19?
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 2:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Matt I think we have to take it into our own hands
...OK so I really don't know any Gambino Boys but my wife came with one bad @$$ shit-zu that I can send to nip at Posey's heels. Don't laugh that Shit-zu used to kick both of my Dobermans butt. It didn't take a hard foul to get that Shit-zu going just try taking her dog bone.
But I digress the only thing that the Bulls players could do and even Stormin Norman said that this is what he would do back in the day is return the favor by Hard fouling one of their players to send a message.
Now thanks to my beloved Bears I hope to be going down to Miami in early Febuary, so if anyone has Posey's address I will bring the dog and take care of this matter with no suspensions.
by boerwinkle on Dec 29, 2006 8:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
ha!!!! perfect solution, shit-szu his ass!!!
by GWKD on Dec 29, 2006 10:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You guys make great points
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 1:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
"hasn't changed," actually never was
What truly has always happens, is to bait someone into protecting their machismo by getting under their skin, and making them retaliate. This gets the other team off their game, and possibly off the floor with an ejection or a suspension. Rodman, Lambier, Nocioni, are masters at this.
So kudos to the Bulls for not falling for that trick. If they had, they probably would have lost the game last night.
by GWKD on Dec 28, 2006 1:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
True
When I saw Deng holding his wrist I freaked out. I don't know if it was the same wrist he had surgery on but it was just a scary moment.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 3:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It was the same wrist, according to the papers
I mean, some players jawed at the Heat players (didn't see the telecast but I know there were technicals to Hinrich and Haslem), and Posey got kicked out of the game and the Bulls won. Hopefully the league can look and see this isn't an isolated incident with Posey and the Bulls and he gets suspended.
And if the Bulls see it fit to retaliate in their next meeting I don't mind, but I equally don't mind if they decide to do nothing and just play their normal game, which in my opinion is plenty 'tough', as of the toughest teams in the NBA, in my opinion.
Sure, having Noc (or somebody) shove Posey in the back afterwards would've been gratifying to see, but he would've gotten kicked out and the Bulls may have lost. PLUS, from the looks of it I don't think that would've been enough to satisfy the majority of the vocal commenters in this thread. I'm completely against the idea of now headhunting the Heat, as a premeditated retaliation will get a pretty severe punishment.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 3:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sure
Kirk Hinrich made a comment during training camp that I found interesting.
Kirk Hinrich said, and I'm paraphrasing, the addition of Ben Wallace is like getting kicked around the playround and then big brother shows up.
Something along those lines. What did Hinrich mean by that? He meant that Ben Wallace is there to be an intimidator and protector. You need a guy like that when you have a chump like Posey taking cheap shots. Just like we had Antonio Davis to jump in there and mix it up with the Wizards.
I think there should be retaliation. People are taking my comments to the extreme. I don't mean go to center court for the jump ball and punch Posey in the face. Find your spot to take a hard foul. Just like Stacy King did in the 92 East Finals and that will do.
You can turn the other cheek the first time. Bite your lip the second time. But three times? Come on.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 6:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think Hinrich
I was furious that James Posey has now taken three cheap shots at Bulls players.
I think there should be retaliation.
Really?
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 28, 2006 6:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Let's wait and see about League suspensions
by GWKD on Dec 28, 2006 3:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
retaliator always punished more
exception: the only time I think that wasn't true was the a Celtics-Pistons Eastern Conference Finals. Lambier did something dirty to Robert Parrish. Chief pummeled Lambeier at mid court, with overhand punches (somewhat awkwardly). He didn't even get a foul called on him. (So those of you out for blood should advocate bringing Chief out of retirement for some retaliation)
by GWKD on Dec 28, 2006 4:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
chief's already on one banner
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 4:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
pistons-celtics fights
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6SSK9dHfasQ
by GWKD on Dec 28, 2006 7:14 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did you notice Bird's throw?
by jamestkirk on Dec 29, 2006 6:17 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
At this point
Of course, Riley's susbsequent squawking diverted enough attention that I don't see Posey getting a multiple-game suspension. At that point, I would advocate a little mercinary action on the part of the Bulls. I'm not saying a shove or a punch, but definitely a message foul to let Posey know he can be had too.
Look, I'm a purist and believe the game should just be played and that thuggery is a joke. Unfortunately, it's clear that Posey does not. Do we want to suffer the same fate as Tyrus again? How about Monta Ellis? What if it's worse?
It's clear that Posey intends to level hard, unnecessary fouls on the Bulls if his team is losing to us. He's done it three games in a row. This time, he nearly ended Deng's season (any Bulls fan that saw the play and Deng clutching his right wrist had to was the case). I don't see how a player can stand by and let that continue. If the league refuses to punish Posey, than why shouldn't someone like Khryappa let Posey know that sort of crap won't fly any longer? With the established pattern of behavior, the alternative would seem to be losing one of our important players to injury.
by CookDing on Dec 28, 2006 2:30 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
YES
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 2:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I wish all
I want to thank Riley for showing the inner woman in him by blaming Kirk for Wades injury. Kirk has to be pissed off today and I'm sure he had a great practice. No doubt on Jan. 27th he will have a great game.
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 3:59 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
Is there anything bad that happens because of that? Headhunters from around the league will now take cheap shots at the frail wimpy Bulls because by not retaliating they've implicitly condoned it? really? The Heat will be galvanized over being dirty players and surge towards the playoffs, while the Bulls will be embarrassed and lose confidence?
Does this have any significance at all ON THE COURT?
Or is it just an excuse to either reminisce over the old-school days of NBA basketball or bring up your own amateur athletic endeavors to form some sort of lame parallel?
I personally think it's just the latter...and none of this has to do with the Bulls getting to a title.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, there's a few shots aimed my way...
I can understand why Ben Wallace didn't do anything: 1) he was crucified for the Palace brawl and 2) he doesn't know of the history because he wasn't on the Bulls last season.
When mentioning Jordan's X-Man confrontation, it was to identify a way to combat the problem without resorting to violence. The right word at the right time from the right guy can have a profound affect on any other players who might suffer from a case of shrinking balls. Yes, the majority of NBA guys are not shrinking violets, but the gravity of MJ's "shut up or else" carried just enough weight to make other Knicks think before attacking.
Is this an attempt to reminisce? Hardly! I'm over those days and would consider a new title just as impressive as any of the 90's teams. It's just easy to recall incidents from those days because they're so ingrained in the memory. I think were Tyson on the team still and on the court at the time, there might have been some other actions.
And if you're telling me that there's no credence to the "survival of the fittest" mentality on the court even down to the park district level, then you're being very naive. Getting into the head of an opponent is just as much a part of game as lacing up the sneakers or shooting a jumper. Be it in the form of a hard foul or some trash talk, engaging the enemy in any way to make them less competitive is a huge part of the game. And anyone -- me, you, the guys you do anything competitively -- who's played the game can relate. So the parallel is apropos, and not a lame excuse to type a few words.
The question is does it make the Bulls a soft team? I'm not sure exactly. They didn't fall off the wagon and lose so kudos to them for being mentally tough, but is it possible that something will happen again because of the lack of a response? Absolutely. Sharks smell blood in the water, a boxer focuses on a particular opening in his opponent's defense, and a Pat Riley-led team will take advantage of any mental plus it can garner, including having Posey take cheap shots whenever possible.
Retaliation is in today's NBA is just as Skiles said in the postgame -- politically incorrect; Stern and Jackson, et.al., have sent enough messages to the players that it's definitely gotten thru. But fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me...fool me three times and watch everyone steal my lunch money. That makes the situation so disparaging; it keeps happening. eventually someone is gonna get hurt; it's either a Bull from Posey's continued thug tactics or Posey cuz the league doesn't allowing a certain degree of policing their own by the players.
by james@lifeinthecell on Dec 28, 2006 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Bulls win three times, and who gives a damn?
How about this....the fact that Heat players are losing their cool and getting ejected mean that the Bulls are in THEIR head?
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 12:37 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
on the court
plus, i prefaced everything by saying that if the league acts, it should be left at that.
i'm going to assume the potshots were aimed at somebody else and suggest that they be left out of any discussion because they don't aid anything.
as for the retaliation debate, all i care about is the physical well-being of our players. posey, quite clearly, threatens that. if the league refuses to act as a deterrent for him, i just think somebody else needs to. the alternative, it would seem, would be the loss of one of our key players. i know it's dirty and stupid. i know that. i just don't think posey leaves much of a choice. look at Monta Elliss (a result of a Posey undercut). it's not about sinking to someone's level, at this point, it's about protecting one's own health and that of one's teammates.
by CookDing on Dec 29, 2006 8:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
also
by CookDing on Dec 29, 2006 8:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Fuck ESPN
by Big D on Dec 28, 2006 3:10 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
the online coverage is pathetic as well
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2709897
But what do you expect from the worldwide leader?
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2006 4:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
God..
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 28, 2006 3:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Wow
I agree with you though, where the f**k was Maalik Allen? If Khryapa is looking to work his way into the rotation, this would have been a good way to prove he was serious (you don't think that Skiles would appreciate Khraypa playing his role?) A couple of Charles Barkley windmills by our bench and the whole thing would be over. If you let Posey get away with this kind of shit, our guys will start looking over their shoulder everytime they go to the hole. That's half the reason Deng takes so many of those 20 footers now. If Posey hadn't clotheslined Deng, we win that game by 20. Bottomline, Posey needs to get his skull thumped albeit preferably by one of our scrubs.
by bullshooter on Dec 28, 2006 9:04 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What did you want Khryapa to do exactly
by Moses Taylor on Dec 29, 2006 10:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Inactive?
by bullshooter on Dec 29, 2006 1:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i'm..
i think their next game will be a doozy to watch.
by leeac on Dec 28, 2006 3:50 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Pathetic.
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on Dec 28, 2006 3:50 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Wade/Hinirch & Posey points not yet brought up
Two. No one has brought up (including wade or hinrich) the rather obvious point as to why hinrich would desire to hurt wade. They were Team USA teammates, and they seemed to become good friends (Hell; if Gilbert "Hibachi" Arenas says hinrich and the bulls are some good guys, then clearly there was something in the water over in Japan) They pasts crossed paths in numerous ways...both grew up big bulls fans; both went to Midwest basketball schools, both were prized by the heat and bulls in the draft....they both are converse guys! It just seems like there is nothing for kirk to gain by taking down the posterchild
by milesgmsu on Dec 28, 2006 5:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Kirk did
On CTL tonight Sam Smith and KC Johnson were on the panel and they talked to reporter from Miami. Of course he said that Posey's foul was not that bad. It was a hard foul but not that flagrant and the guys on the panel didn't let him get by with that. They asked him about Rileys comments on Kirk and the reporter said Riley was off base on that one. The reporter thought a one or two game suspension was in order but the CTL panel said it needed to be 3 - 5 or more.
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 7:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I meant
by milesgmsu on Dec 29, 2006 10:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Pax on Posey
"I'm confident when talking to the league this will be addressed in an appropriate way."
Pax already talked with Stu Jackson this morning.
Deng, btw, went to Toronto early because of visa issues. He hasn't had an MRI.
by KT on Dec 28, 2006 7:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
CSN
CSN also said that it was felt an MRI was not necessary on his wrist. The x-rays showed nothing which is good. Deng seems like the nicest guy and I hate that someone would intentionally hurt him.
by sue369 on Dec 28, 2006 7:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Goons, Thugs and Pat Riley
Riley's denigrating Hinrich as a thug (without necessarily using that word) while defending Posey, who IS a thug and seems to have it in for the Bulls given his history with Hinrich AND Tyrus Thomas and now Luol Deng, definitely suggests a pattern and I'm heartened to hear that this has been addressed with Stu Jackson. I hope something comes of it.
by soonerterp on Dec 28, 2006 10:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The Moral High Ground
You need to meet force with force. It is easy to sit at the computer and take the moral high ground, transposing delicate sensibilities onto the basketball court. But Bullies rarely respect that and the Heat are trying to bully us. Without their starters it makes sense that the Heat were looking down the road and trying to either hurt Deng or just instill fear the Bulls.
Any retaliation be it a shove or a chest bump is sure to result in a suspension. The Knickerbockers have been on a tear since the fight. A Young Bulls team lacking size needs to show that when you mess with the Bull you're gonna get the horns. I wish hard fouls and the need to retaliate were not part of the game, but they are.
If the league is serious about its image it should give posey at least a five game suspension, not just to punish Posey but to reward the Bulls for not retaliating.
by Zac23 on Dec 29, 2006 12:21 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I think it's just as easy
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 12:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Glory of the internet
by Zac23 on Dec 29, 2006 9:17 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
tee-hee
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 29, 2006 9:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i lost the bet....
by milesgmsu on Dec 29, 2006 10:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I feel like PaxJax saying this, but . . . .
- the "no retaliation" people on this board aren't appealing to morals. If anything, it is amoral. We are just talking wins and losses here, and retaliation, in the past game or in the future, will probably cost the bulls games. Would you rather protect your machismo or risk a a bulls loss? I'd take the bulls win and "send a message" by playing in June. Look at the Spurs for a good example of this.
- you are assuming that the league will do nothing to Posey. In light of Artest, Davis, Knicks, that is a pretty bad assumption.
- If you go after Posey in the next game, say with Sweetney, you risk losing the game. What if the bulls lose by 2 because of the foul. Would you rather have the loss or the foul? What if that one game is the difference in a higher seed in the playoffs? Posey's actions were by a desperate team, whose only tactic was to distract the Bulls from winning. You would fall for that?
- If you look at the youtube link I posted above, or any other of the NBA fights on youtube, you'll see how ridulous they are. It's one or two wild punches and a shove, and then they are pulled apart. And frankly, not worth having in any sort of premeditated fashion (which is what you are advocating). If you are asking a team with Ben Wallace, who was involved in the worst fight ever, to start something, you are basically saying you'd rather have your "retaliation" and machismo, than a winning season. You'd rather risk losing him and Skiles for the season than a win.
- The Knicks have been on a tear because the fight shortened their rotation and got David Lee on the floor. It has nothing to do with the fight.
- Maybe back in the day, Wallace slugging Posey would have been the right thing to do after that foul, but not after what happened two years ago (Artest v. Pistons, Wallace), one year ago (Antonio Davis in stands), or last week (Knicks v. Denver). It's a totally different environment now. If Wallace had done something, the bulls season would have been over. If you don't think Posey was trying to bait him into something like that, you are a fool.
- If anything, this shows that the league's heavy suspensions for fighting are a little ridiculous. Heavy suspensions, means players can't stick up for themselves on the court, which means assholes like Posey can deliver the first blow with impunity, and get players injured. If the league doesn't have at least a 5 game suspension on Posey, direct your anger at the league, not the Bulls. If anything, it takes more of a man to show some restraint in this situation than to fight. The league has made itself responsible for protecting the players from injury now that it has zero tolerance for fighting.
by GWKD on Dec 29, 2006 9:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
When u start to feel like Packs Jax u got problems
"Posey's actions were by a desperate team"- true, but also the reigning NBA Champions. The Heat realized the game was more about a possible meeting down the road.
"If anything, it takes more of a man to show some restraint in this situation than to fight"- i love jesus and ghandi as much as the next guy but they never played hoops.
"If the league doesn't have at least a 5 game suspension on Posey, direct your anger at the league, not the Bulls."- the Bulls are a team in the NBA and have to play the hand they are dealt. A slap on the wrist for this foul (which BTW is getting no air time) means that they did not think it was a big deal ala "he was going for the ball". The Bulls on the other hand most likely take the foul seriously as an attack on not just their team but also their safety and a slap on the wrist would prove that if they are not going to defend themselves nobody else is.
"the "no retaliation" people on this board aren't appealing to morals. If anything, it is amoral. We are just talking wins and losses here, and retaliation, in the past game or in the future, will probably cost the bulls games." - strong opinions on what might have happenned in a hypothetical situation. Would having stars out for 10-15 games (meaning the Bulls retaliated even more than I am advocating) hurt our chances of winning? yes i'm sure vegas oddsmakers would say so, but that is why they play the game(s). We won that game against their scrubs woo frickin whoo. Maybe the experience for the bench would be invaluable come playoff time. different situation, but having amare gone last year paved the way for Diaw who otherwise woulda been sitting on the bench. Maybe Sweets is our David Lee...(ok prolly not)
Hypothetical losses as a result of an imaginary fight are meaningless. The Heat wanted to punish us, wanted to play rough and we backed down.
by Zac23 on Dec 29, 2006 10:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Now it's just your vanity I am arguing with
by GWKD on Dec 29, 2006 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Also meaningless:
And explain how 'we backed down'. (First of all, is there a mouse in your pocket?) The Bulls did the opposite of backing down, they won the game.
And if you want to play amateur sports psychologist some more, what's more likely occuring:
-The Heat 'play rough' on the Bulls, and the Bulls don't retaliate signifying they're not tough.
or.
-The Heat 'play rough' becuase they're frustrated that the Bulls ARE tough.
The fact that you could go for either proves that it's the results that matter. Fights either 'bring teams together' or 'tear teams apart' depending on how they fare in the next few games. It's complete hindsight.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 10:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Very well said, damn gwkd
Think about how much support the Bulls engendered from, say, Celtic and Laker fans at the end of that game. Oh, and six titles in eight years for The Bulls. That was good, too...
by corey williams corey benjamin on Dec 29, 2006 10:18 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
perfect example
by GWKD on Dec 29, 2006 10:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Otstanding point
But I think it had more to do with the Bulls being a far better team at that point. But you're right.
But late in the 91 season Scott Williams got in a fight with Bill Laimbeer. Why? Because of Laimbeer's cheap play. Do you think Phil, Scottie, or MJ cared that the Tank decided to mix it up with Laimbeer? I enjoyed that one!
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just love
In game 7 of the 92 East semi finals Michael Jordan got in the face of Xavier McDaniel. The two were practically nose to nose cursing at each other. This was an elimination game! Was Michael Jordan a fool for putting himself in that situation? Jordan said that he was standing up to the bully. The quote was something like that, it's in the Michael Jordan Airtime video. Pat Riley's Knicks, had taken several cheap shots in that series. Starks clothesline on Pippen, we've all seen the highlites. So was Jordan wrong? Would he have been suspended? No, but what "if" it escalated into something more? No one wants retaliation because of the possibility it would escalate. What if Jordan got kicked out of game 7? The game might have been a blowout at the time but what "if" he got suspended for game one of the East Finals. I just want to get people's thoughts on that.
And please stop trying to turn the fact that we want retaliation into "we don't want the Bulls to win" or "we don't care about players getting suspended" give me a break.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:16 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
I would like to see...
by corey williams corey benjamin on Dec 29, 2006 10:20 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well no,
What if Deng broke his wrist and was out for the season? Talk about wins and losses then. I think some people would be thinking a little differently.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Ben Wallace
I would have liked to see him go over and give Posey the kind of shove he gave Ron Artest at the Palace. Just like Ron Artest, I feel that James Posey wouldn't even think of going at Ben Wallace because he knew he would probably get destroyed. Would Ben Wallace get suspended for a shove? I don't think so. Ben Wallce didn't start the Palace brawl. The guy that thrwe the cup at Artest started the Palace brawl. Ron Artest going into the stands started the Palace bralw, not Ben Wallace.
People keep saying that because of the Palace Ben Wallace can't respond in a aggressive manner. So if Ben Wallace gets a cheap shot from someone will he not do anything to defend himself because of what happened at the Palace? An incident that wasn't his fault. That makes no sense to me.
What would the Heat do if a Bulls player took three seperate cheap shots at Heat players? I think Shaq or obviously Posey, would be looking to return the favor. Now people will say "let's not stoop to their level". Well they won the championship. In a way did we stoop to a certain level when we got Rodman and he did some dirty plays? It's like Rodman said in his first book "It's basketball, not boy scouts"
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:28 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
The Heat won the championship
I think the whole idea of psychological warfare through dirty tactics and retalitaion is completely overblown in terms of winning in the NBA. Just a way for people to pretend it's more complicated then this: Better teams win.
That's my disconnect with most of yous arguing the other side.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not exactly
Plus, I seem to recall Shaq tossing an elbow in like game one and giving Stackhouse (or some Mav) stitches. I also recall the physical nature of the Heat and how Avery Johnson repeatedly stated that the Mavs were being intimidated out of contention.
by CookDing on Jan 2, 2007 8:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
okay Matt
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:43 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
(FYI: hit 'reply' to the comment next time)
I took that as to mean that them inflicting cheap shots helped them win a title.
My point is that it doesn't help or hurt, it's pretty much meaningless. I don't see how the league would view the Bulls as being any less tough now than they were on Tuesday. They probably still brace for playing against Nocioni and his flying 'bows.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 10:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Can someone
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:45 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
No
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 29, 2006 10:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:53 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's because
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 29, 2006 10:59 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 2:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wilt had retired by then,.
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 29, 2006 3:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
You still haven't answered the question J-Pax?
Was Jordan foolish for doing that? Yes or No? It's a simple question that you could even answer.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 3:49 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's a stupid question
by Paxson Jackson on Dec 29, 2006 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
your point
But after the fact I don't see any validity in thinking that doing 'nothing' hurt the team.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 10:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's true too
Matt, I got to get you on to talk about this. I sent you an email. Let me know if you can do something this weekend. Later guys, gotta get back to work!
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 10:54 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
POSEY!
by Goostafer on Dec 29, 2006 12:21 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
not enough
I read somewhere that Rasheed Wallace did a Wade imitiation before a game at Miami - he fell down and whined that someone pushed him. That would be great to show to every ref in the league.
Posey's going to really hurt someone one of these days, and the league will be embarrassed.
by KT on Dec 29, 2006 12:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Weak
This doesn't change my opinion that I don't want the Bulls to head hunt now. Be above it and take the high road. If Posey happens to get fouled hard, fine. But I don't want anyone going out of their way to do something just for the sake of doing something.
by Moses Taylor on Dec 29, 2006 1:02 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Totally disagree
by bullshooter on Dec 29, 2006 1:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There is no reason
by Goostafer on Dec 29, 2006 1:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Riley
by chgobr on Dec 29, 2006 2:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No justice
by sue369 on Dec 29, 2006 3:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
How long was Hinrich suspended...
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on Dec 29, 2006 12:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Intentional hand holding
by Freethefro on Dec 29, 2006 12:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
1 GAME! 1 FU*&%ING GAME????????
by dcarioca on Dec 29, 2006 1:17 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Well so much
Well the one game suspension in the playoffs last year didn't stop Posey. I don't expect this slap on the wrist to make a difference either.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 2:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Don't think a shove from Malik Allen would either
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2006 2:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
suspension too short
At least ESPN put this on the cover of the NBA page and didn't bury it....but it still was below the hinrich/wade piece
by milesgmsu on Dec 29, 2006 6:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Right
To me what Posey did is just as bad as Anthony's one sucker punch.
But NY hype is the difference.
by Kerrminator25 on Dec 29, 2006 2:52 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
An easy formula to determine suspension
What if Deng is out two or more games because of his wrist? Then Posey should be suspended for the same amount of time.
It's a simple formula that can be applied to all Type 2 flagrant fouls. Maybe you want to put a cap on the suspension if the guy who was fouled ends up being out for the season, but this could be a deterrent to unnecessary fouls once this kind of rule is enforced.
by Evam on Dec 29, 2006 5:48 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

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