Someone on "Ask Sam" proposed an interesting Tyrus trade involving Golden State.  Here are two variations that would work:

Trade #1: Tyrus and Salmons for Anthony Randolph and Stephen Jackson

Trade #2: Tyrus and Hinrich for Randolph, Jackson, and Speedy Claxton (for salary matching purposes)

There are definitely some problems with both scenarios - not the least of which is Tyrus' injury - but given Don Nelson and the Warrior's general dysfunction, it could have some legs.

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I know it's only 6 games in but the Bulls are looking great(except offensively but that should come). I mean like some of you I miss BG some he filled a need while he was here, but man our defense is even more impressive than the year we swept Miami. Lol I refuse to VDN, Player development, and PaxGarDorf any credit for this start but they may deserve a little. Given that our defense(with Tyrus back and playing level headed which is how he plays more towards the end of the season) is looking like a lock for top 5 defensive fg%. Minus BG and the minutes Jack'em Pargo plays we can night in and night out match up with most teams because A: The "top heavy" Luol Deng is playing Lock Down right now he's crashing the boards he's guarding the no. 1 or 2 scorer every night ( Fish is just as impressive so far his length is a nightmare pure shooters and Noah and TT are our nightmares for all slashers not named D-Wade,KB 24). On another quick note I hope we can figure out how to keep TT around but as a bench player if he doesn't explode when he returns I think his realistic role for this team minus him being a superstar, is that Lamar Odom type of 6th man( You know he does alot of things good, nothing really great) and in his limited time a sf he guarded his man well. Granted our offense sucks right now I really feel that the way our D is we will gain more and more confidence as Rose condition builds. I feel if we can get our defensive image up too very good or even great it will be a piece of cake to will in a Ufa but I dont think It will be a Stat/LbJ/ or Bosh that comes I think our No. 1 target as of now is more like Joe Johnson whom still is a great fit with his shooting and length. I want to ask some you cap experts If it is possible to trade for a PF b4 the deadline, sign Ufa Joe John/D-Wade, and keep TT? I just want to know if that is possible if we go into the cap. I'll keep this one kinda of brief and leave with this... Bulls fans stop being so short with this team, becuase no matter how bad the coach and organization is they will continue to play hard and they are not giving up to anyone. So we should stop giving up on them ala preseason Deng, rookie yr Noah, anytime Pargo. We really need the best from everyone THIS YEAR. I can't wait for trade season. And don't forget Ty is 22 and still has plenty of time to bud as a star even if it isn't for the bulls any one remembers Jermaine O'neal in Portland? Tyrus has more potential than that. PS Kirk is playing amazing too minus the shooting. Noah's a Beast and is as far along offensively as D12 so far D12 is just pure force. Laters Bull watchers.   

Allen Iverson is apparently having some serious issues in Memphis.  Perhaps the Bulls should bring him in.  I know many of you will throw this idea away immediately, but I think it deserves a little consideration.  My idea would be to trade Salmons for him.  I know the salaries don't match, but I believe they are close enough that it could be worked out rather easily.  Now for the big question:  Why?

A few reasons.  The first, and most important, is scoring.  Let's face it, this team has underperformed wildly in this area.  John Salmons has been awful (other than the Bobcats game) and Derrick Rose, whether it be health related or not, appears to have taken a step back as opposed to the superstar leap we were expecting.  I don't know how much Iverson has left in the tank, but if he does he could be a real nice scoring option on a team that is in  dire need of someone like that.  Even at his age he could probably give us comparable numbers to Salmons.  Which brings me to my next point...

John Salmons is having a bad year (I know it's early).  We really need him to opt out of his contract at the end of the season to achieve the maximum amount of cap space.  I'm not sure what we can expect from him the rest of the way, but I am afraid that if he continues to underperform we could be stuck with him next year and essentially kill our chances at landing a big time free agent.  So by doing this trade we'd be getting comparable talent, but be completely free of the contract at the end of the 09-10 season.

Next, many people won't want him here because they believe he'll be a malcontent.  I don't think this will be a problem.  The guy wants to start, and on this team that will not be an issue.  He would jump in and immediately be our starting two.  We would obviously lose a little something defensively, but let's face it, to win in today's NBA you gotta put up points.  He's been through the battles and could possibly  be a good mentor for a guy like Derrick.

So there ya go.  I've really been thinking it over and I just don't see many drawbacks.  A lot of this obviously comes down to how much or how little you think Iverson has left in the tank, but for one year I think it could be worth a shot.  Not to mention that this is a year where basically everyone, including the organization, is expecting us to kind of run in place.  Besides, AI in a Bulls jersey could be kind of fun.  So what do you think?

First and foremost it is in the Bulls' best interest to win this year. I know that statement is painfully obvious, but that includes winning over developing talent. They need to win as much as possible and get as deep as possible in the playoffs to show off their team for potential free agents. I'm on board with any way they can achieve this while simultaneously keeping cap space for 2010. That includes being happy with Taj Gibson being in the lineup while Tyrus Thomas sits. As long as Tyrus continues to put himself before the team he is compromising the Bulls' ability to win games. And in my opinion Tyrus has clearly been looking out only for himself. The Bulls need all hands on deck.

Remember going into the summer of 2000 the Bulls had Artest, the ROTY Brand, & 2 lottery picks, yet McGrady & Hill still went to Orlando. Why? Orlando went 41-41 while the Bulls went 17-65. It didn't matter that their best player was Darrell Armstrong (Don't believe me? Click Here) . The reason they went to Orlando was that the Magic had proven that they have the ability to win. Don't you think that if the Bulls could do it over they wouldn't have dealt Kukoc? I'm talking about this separate from the fact that the 2000 draft sucked. Just purely from the standpoint of marketing the team to free agents. We would have won more games if he stayed. But I digress...

And I think we, both the fans and the organization, have learned the lesson of the summer of 2000. To free-agents it doesn't matter "what could be" with teams. It matters what is. I don't care if Taj Gibson's career ceiling is a PJ Brown-type. Even if that Brown-type is one minus the leadership elements and maybe some important intangibles. As long as Taj keeps hitting at least 40% of his 12-15 footers and worries more about staying in front of his man than getting the show-stopping block I want him to be the one playing over Tyrus. Period. The Bulls have a better chance of winning that way.

Obviously losing Tyrus to injury isn't great from a personnel standpoint. I'm not happy about that. Having him healthy, with this current roster, is better than having him hurt. At the worst he is another big body. And he does have the ability to present certain threats that no one else on the team possesses by virtue of his combination of size and athleticism. But I feel like every single other player on this team is on the same page, right down to James Johnson (who has gotten 0 meaningful minutes). They all seem to be putting winning above everything else. Maybe if Tyrus is separated from that situation, through his injury, he can gain some perspective and realize how different his current mindset is from the rest of the team. Maybe he will buy into the team first thing. But I think that's being overly optimistic. I haven't seen that version of Tyrus since his rookie year. And even then I may have just been blinded by his potential when he was a game changer off the bench with his athleticism and dazzling highlight dunks. Even then it was probably just him showing off his athleticism rather than realizing the general benefit it was providing the team.

The Bulls have a unique advantage in free agency: the draw of the opportunity to play with a budding unselfish point guard. Who, by the way, most think will be a superstar. No other team with cap-room has that. If they show the ability to win on top of that, the Bulls will have stacked the deck in their favor for 2010 free agency. Someone will come here. It may not be 'Bron, Wade, or Bosh. But whoever it is, they will be better going forward than Tyrus. Even if it's Rudy Gay or Joe Johnson.

Management made their bed by not re-signing Gordon. They essentially decided "we are not going to win a title with Ben Gordon nor will we have any cap-space to improve our team moving forward". It was a bold move, but the right one. Not that we don't all miss Ben's scoring, but by tying up all of their cap-space in Ben the Bulls would be signing up for mediocrity. If mediocrity eventually comes the Bulls' way in the form of tying up cap space with Rudy Gay, then so be it. Nothing will be lost in the difference between Gay and Gordon. Thomas' tenure with the Bulls will have been the casualty. And like it or not it is over. If the Bulls even want to attempt to lure free agents to Chicago they will have to renounce his rights to clear up the cap space. That means that even if the Bulls can't convince any of the big guns to sign with them, they still can't fall back on matching whatever offer sheet Tyrus may get. And it's not going to be abundantly clear whether or not any of them will sign before it happens. Because if the Bulls have the cap space they'll all visit ('Bron, Wade, Bosh etc.). None of them would pass up the chance to be worshipped by each city as they visit. To grab all of the sports headlines for a month across the country. To be wined and dined. Their agents won't let them. And they'll either use us to get what they really want or be legitimately interested. The only way the Bulls will get that opportunity, barring a miraculous trade, is by renouncing Tyrus.

The worst case scenario is that Tyrus signs a 3 year 25 million dollar deal with OKC and becomes another brilliant move-notch on Sam Presti's belt, while the Bulls get spurned by everyone. (And move-notch is a word in this context.) As long as the Bulls show me that their plan is to win as many games above all else, they will have done the best that they could have to increase the odds in their favor. The season will have been a success. It's like when I'm playing blackjack: If The dealer is showing a 10, I will feel better when I lose after the person to the right of me hits on 16, than I will when I win & he/she stayed. We played the odds, and in the long run if we continue to play like that there will be more good outcomes than bad ones. The intangible factor of luck will come as it may.

That being said: it better work. That's the only caveat.

[Thanks to Prevenge for today's game preview. -ed.]

Which Team will get over 80?

Today, at 8 EST [probably a bit later, because of the nature of NBA games], the Chicago Bulls, currently first in the Central Division [thanks, Shaq!], face the Charlotte Bobcats in what promises to be the best basketball matchup this side of the Bulls-Bucks game.

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joining the Bulls next year.  In terms of basketball decisions, would there be a better young roster with cap space this offseason than the Bulls?

Rose

Deng

LeBron

Taj? (I'd rather a serviceable, veteran 4 with a post game with the mid level exception)

Noah

Hinrich, JJ, 2010 rookie, and a SG that can hit the 3 off the bench, and a backup center.

This team would be in contention for titles for the rest of LeBron's career.  The Knicks and the Nets both look absolutely dreadful this year.  The Bulls have a younger, more talented roster than the Cavs do right now.  And I don't see LeBron and Wade ever playing on the same team, they both need/want to be the main playmaker on their respected teams.  This plan would require the Bulls to make an upgrade in coaching as well, obviously. 

Michael did just fine becoming the biggest sports icon of the century in Chicago, I don't see why he needs NYC to obtain that.  Why isn't there more mention of Chicago as a contender for LeBron?  I heard Avery Johnson reference Houston, without mention of Chicago, as a possible destination  for James this offseason?  That's ridiculous.

With everyone speculating about what The Org will be able to accomplish this summer with regard to free agents, Tyrus' extension, etc., I'd be interested to know the answer to this question:

Let's say (hypothetically) that the Bulls are able to create enough cap space to sign a max free agent without moving Tyrus or renouncing his rights, and the first thing they do this summer is sign Wade.  Obviously this assumes that they have been able to create enough cap space around Tyrus' cap hold to sign Wade (probably not possible, but let's assume it is for now).  Once the ink is dry on Wade's contract, can they then go ahead and sign Tyrus to a contract greater than his cap hold, thereby going above the cap due to the fact that the Bulls still own Tyrus' rights (and you're allowed to go above the cap to resign your own players)?

If this is legit, then this only works in that order: sign Wade first (so that total payroll is under the cap), then sign Tyrus (and legally go above the cap).

In reality, this is probably a moot point, as Tyrus' cap hold is likely to be greater than he is worth anyway, and the Bulls are unlikely to make the moves necessary to free up max FA cap space around his cap hold.  However, if Tyrus has an underwhelming or injury plagued year - or the market for his services is quiet - maybe the bulls could sign him to a highly discounted deal (well below his cap hold), and still have room for Wade/Bosh/Johnson.  In this scenario though, I think we're more likely to see Taj Gibson as starting PF rather than resigning Tyrus the rabble rousing trouble maker.

[UPDATE by your friendly BullsBlogger, 11/05/09 2:19 PM CST: Tyrus Thomas is flying commercial and going to meet the Bulls in Cleveland tonight. May or may not play. I give up.

Thanks to wjb1492 for today's game preview. My initial thoughts on this game is that the Murder Train A Comin'. Then I figured that the Bulls do have a chance to out-hustle and out-run an especially immobile Cavs team. Then I figured that without Tyrus Thomas they don't really have this especially athletic roster conducive to running. Hinrich, Salmons, Taj, Miller, gimpy Rose.... even though Deng is effective in transition he's not a superior athlete. It's basically just Noah at this point. -ed.]

So I really don't want to relive Tuesday's Milwaukee game, from which the Bulls managed to scrape a W in spite of collectively playing like garbage much of the night.  The exception was Luol Deng, who has managed to silence most of his critics with his play so far this regular season.  Suffice it to say that, after getting our hopes up with a nice win over a San Antonio team many have predicted to be a serious contender this year, the Bulls' next three games have fans once again predicting doom and gloom for the season.  A blowout loss, a 4th quarter choke, and a slim two-point victory over a predicted cellar dweller don't exactly inspire confidence, even with the team sitting at .500 for the season.

Through four games, the Bulls offense is ranked 27th in the league, and guys expected to play key roles in the offense are struggling - Tyrus Thomas (47.1%), Derrick Rose (44.2%), James Johnson (41.0%), Kirk Hinrich (41.0%), and John Salmons (33.9%) all have sub-.500 true shooting percantages so far.  John and Kirk have been particularly frightening, as our "3-point threats" are currently shooting 18.2% and 13.3% from 3 respectively. It's no wonder that people are having flashbacks to the miserable 07/08 season!

(I've left out Lindsey Hunter, since he's not  expected to play a key role in anything but honorary titles this season - but for the record, Captain Hunter is shooting 0% and sporting a PER of -20.  True, he's only played 7 minutes and attempted 2 shots, but anytime you can be in the "Top 5" of something deserves mention, right?  Even if the category is Worst PER in the League....)

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After watching the Heat - Wizards game tonight, I'm convinced that the Heat are even more of a one man team, than I believed them to be.  There's no way D. Wade stays after this year, and we should really be doing everything in our power to align things to get him next year.

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I wasn't as high on Tyrus as some, but I would've never, ever guessed he'd be in the doghouse 3 games into the season.  Now I wouldn't be surprised if we trade him for next to nothing.

With this coming on the heels of letting Gordon walk, it's easy to see a trend developing.  But the sad thing is this has been going on for years.  Here's the long line of talented young players the Bulls have traded for pennies on the dollar, or let go for nothing:

ELTON BRAND

• Bulls Performance: Two 20/10 seasons on the Bulls
• Bulls' Publicized Concern:  Elton wasn't happy, there were rumors he didn't want to extend, Krause didn't think he was a superstar.
• Trade and Aftermath: Brand for Chandler, Brand goes on to make two all-star games during six straight 18/9 seasons.
• String o' Trades: Brand -> Chandler ... Chandler -> PJ Brown, JR Smith ... JR Smith -> Aaron Gray.

RON ARTEST

• Bulls Performance: Started nearly every game over 2.5 years playing 31mpg.  Terrible shooter, but defensive star with the ability to penetrate and pass.
• Bulls' Publicized Concern: Artest's maturity, and like Brand, Jerry Krause didn't think Artest was a superstar to build around.
• Trade and Aftermath: Artest and 26-year old Brad Miller for Jalen Rose.  Artest became crazy, but also one of the league's elite complementary players, making an all-star team.  Miller made two all-star teams.  Jalen fizzled immediately and was traded two years later for Antonio Davis.
• String o' Trades: Artest, Miller -> Rose ... Rose, Donyell Marshall -> Antonio Davis.

TYSON CHANDLER

• Bulls Performance: Averaged 25mpg from ages 19-23, starting 50 games his final year with the Bulls.  He was below average offensively, but gained a reputation as a top rebounder and defender while anchoring the 2nd rated defense in 2005.
• Bulls' Publicized Concern:  Endurance issues made him tire late in games and limited his minutes.  And at the time, he wasn't Ben Wallace.
• Trade and Aftermath: Chandler for PJ Brown and JR Smith.  Chandler finished top-10 in the league in DReb% the next two seasons before injuries limited him last season.  He's still just 27.
• String o' Trades: Chandler -> PJ Brown, JR Smith ... JR Smith -> Aaron Gray

JR SMITH

• Bulls Performance: None.
• Bulls Publicized Concerns: Bulls coaches didn't like him.
• Trade and Aftermath: Smith for what turned out to be Aaron Gray.  Smith is still a poor defender with legitimate maturity issues, but he scored 16ppg in the playoffs over the past two years.  He's grown into one of the league's best 3pt shooters, making 40% while attempting 9 per 36min.

BEN GORDON

• Bulls Performance: Averaged 18ppg for five seasons as a top sharpshooter, led the Bulls in points scored all five years.
• Bulls Publicized Concern: Rumored "me-first" attitude, rift with VDN, below average defense, debatable fit with Derrick Rose.
• Trade and Aftermath: Bulls let him walk for nothing.

OTHERS...

Jamal Crawford - Averaged 17ppg for us at age 23 before we traded him essentially for Othella Harrington after Paxson cited improving team defense and commitment.

Matt Bonner - Now the starting PF for the Spurs.  We traded him for Chris Duhon.

Chris Duhon - Now the starting PG for the Knicks.  Played 25mpg for us for four years. We lost him for nothing after numerous reports that he missed team meetings.

Roger Mason - Was never given a shot here.  Started 71 games for the Spurs last year, making 42% of 3s.  We lost him for nothing.

Thabo Sefolosha - Decent defender, good rebounder, terrible offensively, but still just 24 years old when we traded him for Taj Gibson.  Currently starts for the Thunder.

!!!!!!Eddy Curry!!!!!!! - The one time we've actually benefited from identifying a guy was going to suck!  Traded him for Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah. 

OVERALL

The Eddy Curry ripping of Isiah Thomas aside...

We've Traded/Let Go: 

Elton Brand
Ron Artest
Brad Miller
Tyson Chandler
Ben Gordon
JR Smith
Jamal Crawford
Matt Bonner
Chris Duhon
Roger Mason
Thabo Sefolosha

And Got in Return: 

Tyson Chandler
JR Smith
PJ Brown
Jalen Rose
Aaron Gray
Othella Harrington
Chris Duhon
Taj Gibson

Which Turned Out To Be: 
PJ Brown
Antonio Davis
Aaron Gray
Othella Harrington
Taj Gibson

Which Currently Is:
Aaron Gray
Taj Gibson

No wonder VDN wants to play Taj so bad! Since the Brand/Chandler trade, we've posted a combined record of 287-373, with two winning seasons and one playoff series victory.

TYRUS' SITUATION

Now another young, talented player looks to be halfway out the door before getting a chance to develop.  Like Brand's happiness, Artest's maturity, the staff's not liking Smith, Gordon, Crawford (weird how often this happens), there are concerns, some probably legitimate.

But to me in these situations, there should be two options.  

1) Play the guy a ton, recognize internally that he's not going to develop into a star, then move him for better young talent (like we did with Eddy Curry and tried to do with Brand), or

2) Play the guy a ton, and extend him.

The worst, worst, WORST thing to do is bench him, leak your concerns about him to the press, and then try to trade him or let him walk.  Especially with a guy like Tyrus who, with his filled box scores and highlight reel plays, would make some GMs salivate.

In my $20 fantasy football league, this tactic is obvious to everyone - when you want to trade someone, put him in your starting lineup and say you like the guy, then when you make him available good offers will pour in.  You'd think a $500 million dollar franchise would figure out the same.