[UPDATE] Kobe Talks Stalled Because We Won't Include Deng (10/31 Kobe Thread)

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 11:39 AM CDT Comment 133 comments

[UPDATE. Dan Bernstein from 670AM's midday show has his own sources and claims that a deal is actually on the table. Read below. -Matt]

Last night, on TNT, Magic Johnson said that "A deal can't get done because they won't include Deng, and without Deng, a deal can't get done." (For full details, check out
the story about it in the Sun-Times).

Unless Tyrus Thomas emerges this season (unlikely, given the reports we're hearing about his inconsistent effort), it looks like we won't be able to get Kobe without giving up Deng unless the Lakers get a lot more desperate.

Pretty much everyone on this forum would give up Gordon, Thomas, and assorted scraps for Kobe. I've always hated Kobe too, but that would be a steal. Kobe is a sure-fire superstar now, Gordon's ceiling is borderline All-Star, and Thomas may never turn into anything.

But more and more, I'm thinking that we should make the deal for Kobe even if it means giving up Deng, as long as we can keep the deal to Deng+Gordon without giving up much else.

Right now, our team lacks direction. We have a lot of great pieces, but we don't have enough to contend for a title -- even if we do get out of the East, no one seriously thinks we have a chance in hell against the Spurs, Mavs, or Suns.

Yes, our team is young. But do we have any hope of turning into a contender with the pieces we have now? I don't see Hinrich, Gordon, or Nocioni getting much better than they are now. Deng can and should make a leap, but it's no guarantee that he'll ever be a MVP-caliber player. Even if he turns into an All-Star, that's not enough for us to win a championship.

At this point, our hopes of becoming a championship team rest on Deng making a huge leap and Thomas turning into a star. Plus some luck. That's a lot of "ifs".

I think that if we want to win an NBA championship, as opposed to just coming out of the East, we need to take some chances. I was more excited about getting Pau Gasol for relatively cheap, but that ship has sailed. Right now our only chance of getting an MVP-caliber player is Kobe.

Kobe gives us a player that would alter other team's gameplans. He's probably the best closer in the game. And when he isn't shouldering the whole offensive burden, he can be an amazing defender, as he showed for Team USA this summer.

Obviously Kobe is older, since he's 29 with a lot of mileage. But he has at least 3-4 good years left in him. We would have Kobe and Ben Wallace in their primes, Kirk Hinrich, and Nocioni (yes he's overpaid, but he's underappreciated here), Tyrus, and Noah at the forward spots. Thabo would provide some backcourt depth. That's a team that just might win a championship. At the least, we would be one piece away, and we might be able to get that by trading young-for-old.

Yes, trading Deng for Kobe isn't a guarantee that we'll win a championship. And we'll have maybe a 3-4 year window. But at least we'll have a legitimate shot at a championship. If we don't pull the trigger on a trade for a dominant player and take a shot at a title, we might be stuck paying four borderline All-Star players (Hinrich, Deng, Gordon, and Wallace) $10 mil+ a year without much flexibility to turn a good-but-not-great playoff team into a real championship contender.

FanPosts are user-created posts from the BlogABull community, and are to be treated as the opinions and views of that particular user, not that of the blogger or blog community as a whole.

0 recs | Comment 133 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Any thoughts?

I figured a new thread was in order, because now it's clear where negotiations are at. The only way we will be able to get Kobe without giving up Deng is if Kobe says he won't go any other team able to make a comparable offer, refuses a trade to the Bulls if Deng is included, and acts like a cancer.

I suspect that if we're not willing to give up Deng, the Lakers will just sit tight and wait for better opportunities at the next draft.

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 11:50 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

First, Kobe apparently wants to play with Deng.

So the idea of trading Deng for Kobe may be a nonstarter.

But even if we could do it, we need three superstars to win a championship, not two. Right now we are hoping that Wallace doesn't decline before Deng and Thomas and perhaps Noah improve. But if we trade Deng and Thomas then we place all our faith in Noah improving very quickly, and in the long term we will have to rebuild that much sooner.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 11:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm not so sure

I agree that it looks like Kobe might not accept a deal involving Deng. If he doesn't, and sticks to that, we might have a chance at a better deal if the Lakers get desperate. (Although I suspect they'll just wait until the off-season.)

But I don't think you need three superstars to win a championship. The Lakers won their three championships with just two. The Spurs won some of theirs with just one superstar, really.

You definitely need at least one dominant player. But I think that the rest of the Bulls (minus Deng and Gordon but with Thomas/Noah) is probably enough of a supporting cast to make us a championship contender.

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who is the Bulls' dominant player?

Perhaps you are correct that we do not need three superstars if we have one, for lack of a better term, superduperstar, i.e. one MVP-level star. But who is that for the Bulls? I suppose Kobe lovers argue that he would be that superduperstar, but I disagree.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm saying Kobe

My point is that we don't have a dominant player now, but that Kobe would be that player.

I don't love Kobe, or even like the guy. I've gotten used to rooting against him, and I hate the comparisons to Jordan. But he's obviously a dominant player. Clearly one of the top 5 in the game right now. Is it possible to seriously dispute that?

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

KOBE

IMO he is the best player in the WORLD!!

by tyrus4prez on Oct 31, 2007 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He is one of the top scorers in the game.

But no, I would not call him one of the top five players in the game. But then I believe that scorers are seriously overvalued in the NBA.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Please

he's the best player in the league. By far.

by Chad on Oct 31, 2007 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

not enough hyperbole

try again.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He can defend too

Kobe has been selected to the All-Defensive Team seven times (five First Team and two Second Team selections).

Some of his recent selections were not justified, because he's been coasting on his reputation a bit. Lately he has admittedly not been expending much energy on the offensive end because the Lakers need him to do so much there. But I think it's hard to argue that he's a one-dimensional player who can only score.

Pretty much every statistical measure (PER, adjusted plus-minus) puts Kobe in the top few players in the league. Here's a snippet of John Hollinger's evaluation of his last season (ESPN Insider only):

Kobe had an amazing season, in a way that I'm not sure is fully appreciated. Bryant came into the season cold after having knee surgery in July. He didn't play any preseason games or anything -- he just went into the lineup for the second game of the regular season and started balling.

He spent the month of November getting into game shape, averaging "only" 26.2 points per game -- again, he'd played no competitive basketball for nearly four months leading up to this -- and, in a strange twist, had people talking him up for MVP because he was allegedly playing more of a team game. Um, no ... he just wasn't in peak condition yet.

After the All-Star break, Bryant showed just what "game shape" means in his world. In the 27 games after the break, Bryant averaged 36.7 points per game, including three straight games with 50 or more points. Over the final two months of the season, he was the best player in the league, hands down.

He couldn't be the MVP because it's a full-season award, not a 27-game honor, but that closing stretch should inspire fear throughout the Western Conference. Here's another scary thought: He was actually in a bit of a shooting slump during this stretch -- his lowest 3-point numbers of the season came in the final two months.

Because of the slow start, Bryant's full-year numbers weren't quite as good as the year before. But in some ways, they were more impressive. He shot the ball less but was a more efficient player, greatly improving his rate of free-throw attempts per field-goal attempt and shooting a higher percentage from the floor. He improved his assist ratio, turnover ratio and rebound rate.

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hollinger values scorers highly.

I think he values scorers too highly.

And I never said Kobe was just a scorer. That would be Allen Iverson. Kobe has more to his game than scoring, and is an excellent player, but I believe those people who call him a top five player overvalue him because of his scoring.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Overvalue?

What more do you want? He can score with the best of them and can play defense. What else is there? Rebounding? Is that what you want out of your shooting guard. that's what power forwards and centers are for.

by Chad on Oct 31, 2007 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So maybe he is a top-five shooting guard.

But that's different from saying he's one of the top five players in the league. And as much as Kobe gets double or even triple teamed, why shouldn't he get more assists? How about reducing turnovers and increasing shooting efficiency? How about more steals? And why not rebounds? Jason Kidd is a rebounding machine. What about blocks, even? Jordan and Pippen had a high number of blocks for their positions, usually from behind, along with a tremendous number of steals.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

top 5

I think most followers of NBA would consider Kobe a top 5 player if you look at players right now.

How many players would be considered better at this minute? Duncan and James I'll give .. who then.. Dirk? KG? Nash? It seems Kobe is right in that bunch

I'll admit I haven't seen Lakers play much the last few seasons, so mostly going on what I read and hear. Team USA sure seemed happy to get Kobe and he seemed to be one of best players there

by NY Chicago Fan on Oct 31, 2007 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Duncan and James no way...

I'll still take Kobe of LeBron right now.

Kobe is still the best player in the NBA.

And remember, that now matter how good a center is, he still needs a guard to get him the ball.

by Chad on Oct 31, 2007 5:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you want to get your center the ball,

get a better point guard, not Kobe. I think Jason Kidd may be the best player in the NBA today.

by Tim S. on Oct 31, 2007 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

not Deng and Thomas

I think above meant that Bulls would trade Deng/Gordon but not include Thomas / Noc / Noah / Thabo. So 2 really good players and pieces for Kobe but don't give up any of the cheap talent with potential (Noah/Thomas/Thobo) and keep Noc to start at SF. I'm not sure how that works with salary matching as Deng/Gordon don't count as much, probably have to include Duhon in trade and maybe Krappy or Smith +?

Basically boils down to playing roster of
Current Proposed
Kirk/Duhon Kirk/Curry
Ben/Thabo Kobe/Thabo
Deng/Noc Noc/Thabo
Thomas/Smith Thomas/SmithorKrappy
Wallace/Noah Wallace/Noah

It seems to me that Bulls would not want to make this trade this year as they would like to see how team plays this year. By giving Deng/BenG for Kobe its saying that Bulls need the 1 dominate go to go on offense who can shoot and draw fouls / double teams. I think Pax would rather see his built team take one more shot at East

by NY Chicago Fan on Oct 31, 2007 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What the hell I posted this already?

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 12:08 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Um

Ben Wallace is not in his prime.

I could only wish.

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 12:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

UPDATE

670 The Score just reported that a deal is in place right now that would involve a three team deal between Chicago, Los Angeles and Sacramento.

They didn't get into specifics but the cornerstones are that Hinrich and Artest go to Los Angeles. Kobe comes to the Bulls. I'm sure there are a lot more to the trade like . . . who goes to the Kings. This is just what I heard on 670.

They also mentioned that the trade for Kobe has never been more real than it is now and that the deal is for Kobe to approve.

I'll leave the rest to speculation . . . .

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 2:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

trade machine

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=3198~2381~285~1981~3032~110~1998~3197~1031 ~25&teams=23~13~13~13~13~4~23~23~23~13&te=&cash=

it was tough to just make the money work...its not perfect but kobe comes to the bulls with deng, noah, and wallace all intact (which im not fully in favor for) lakers get alot of future talent, including a backcourt that has played wiht each other. It can turn itno a really hard nose defensive team, and has some expriing contracts next year worht a fortue. As for sacto they get some immediate PG help, a scorer to replace bibby, and some upside in crittenton....the lakers could be a 7 seed or somethin in the west, and have some upside...the kings would be blowing up the team and fully into rebuilding mode. Furthermore, it would open up a trade for bibby to the cavs for talent (brown, gibson, pavlovic, varejao, whatever)...

Im sure there would eb junk players and draft picks thrown in there too.....let's see if we can make this somewhat more realistic

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hope that

they're wrong.

by KT on Oct 31, 2007 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You and me both.

I feel sick.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm pumped

If we keep Deng, I'm willing to trade away Hinrich, Gordon, and Thomas for Kobe.

Kobe, Deng, Wallace, Noah, and Nocioni is good enough to give us a legitimate chance at the title.

Our current core isn't enough to win a title against the likes of the Spurs and Cavs. I think a trade for Kobe is a no-brainer if we don't lose Deng.

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 3:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good for you.

I'm a Hinrich fan more than a Bulls fan so if he leaves so do I.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wait! You

...go w/ Kirk? What's your cap number!!??

"...Keeping 'SlowHand' alive since aught-five"

by CookDing on Oct 31, 2007 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

JK

you should stick around even if Kirk goes.

"...Keeping 'SlowHand' alive since aught-five"

by CookDing on Oct 31, 2007 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Goodbye...

... it's been a pleasure.

by Vangelis on Oct 31, 2007 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

poor Sue

Time Warner Cable: The Place to Be, if you want to see no preseason games even after paying for League Pass.

by preverbal on Oct 31, 2007 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

bwahahaha

heh. yeah.

This site is populated with some 'kirk fans' as opposed to 'bulls fans'. I'm not in that category.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd be sad to see our youngbloods go, too

it would be strange rooting for a Duhon/Kobe backcourt. I've never been a Duhon fan and now he's our starting point? I've spent the last year or so hoping to see LESS Duhon.

by Freethefro on Oct 31, 2007 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd be all for that if

they could Keep Tyrus.

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hinrich and Artest to LA?

who would play shooting guard? Hinrich? Artest? Fisher?

There HAS to be more than this...

by ScottieCartwright on Oct 31, 2007 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm for it

IF DUHON DOESN'T START IN HIS PLACE!

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 2:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh man

I hadn't thought of that. uh...get Jordan Farmar? yipes.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

or

start Thabo?

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

that deal doesn't move bibby

I would think he'd be moving too.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

why trade

an injured player? He wouldn't pass the physical.

by ScottieCartwright on Oct 31, 2007 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

besides being injured

his contract is massive and that throws a huge wrench itno three team negotiations...it will prolly be a 2 way deal with cle if it happens

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

god i would love to have farmar

baddest jew since moshe dayan

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ralph Kaplowitz disagrees

Hinrich's value aside, this could make resigning Deng and Gordon a huge problem.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

how so...

this would be a super championship caliber team and uncle jerry would be willing to go over the tax

not to mention, kobe would pay for himself in endorsements, ticket costs, and TV rights, and exposure.

finally, im pretty sure our saviour pax, if this trade is going through, ahs ok'ed future contract extensions for deng and gordon, otherwise it would be foolish to trade

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

Reinsdorf seems to be able and willing to pay if there's success. They also should be a tax-payer (at least), although we've all heard weird quotes to the contrary.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

whip out your adding machines

Kobe and Wallace would be a combined 36 million in 08-09. Deng and Gordon conservatively getting 10 million each would make it 56 million. Plus Nocioni's 7 or 8 million. 60-65 million, maybe 70 tied up in 5 players? Not likely.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gordon

will most likely be gone if Kobe comes

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

not really

If this deal doesn't include him he'd still be on the team, and Paxson would be a total fucktard to lose a good player for nothing.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm pretty sure

he'd trade for more than a box of dunkin donuts.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Bulls

are not gonna get Kobe for just Kirk. There are still more players that were not reported. Best guess is Ben is one of them

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

then it's a bad trade

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yep

no need to trade BOTH Kirk and Ben

by ScottieCartwright on Oct 31, 2007 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

agreed

Kirk & Ben & Thomas seems like a bit much

Thats 3 lottery picks, 2 with experience, proven skills and 1 with youth/upside

by NY Chicago Fan on Oct 31, 2007 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

wondering about deal

Bulls getting Kobe and losing Hinrich/Gordon/Thomas?

Is that what we suppose is on the table?

Personally I'd be little worried about Bulls not having enough shooters to go along with Kobe. With Duhon at PG you have a guy who passes up 3 pointers when teams leave him open and Thabo hasn't shown a great 3 stroke yet. Other big point I see here is that if Bulls are willing to include Thomas then they must really like Noah and think JSmith can start at PF with Noc playing a lot there too.

by NY Chicago Fan on Oct 31, 2007 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

that was just suggested

by a poster above using the trade machine. I don't see how this benefits the Kings other than shipping out Artest.

"...Keeping 'SlowHand' alive since aught-five"

by CookDing on Oct 31, 2007 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would think

that Shareef would be moved as well. If they cut salary and pick up future picks, they'd probably consider that a successful parlay.

by kingj41 on Oct 31, 2007 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

wallace's contract comes down

the salary cap and L-TAX comes up to...i beleive noch's is front loaded...plus you would have young guys like thabo tyrus noah gray, and curry with only a couple million...granted around 2010 or 11 it would get really hairy, but until then it would be a mosnter payroll team but no worse than the mavs or the c's

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was looking at the hoopshype salary page

All the salaries were rounded off in my head, and taken from 08-09. Except Nocioni, who isn't listed. If he's frontloaded that's a lot of moolah. The C's actually have a smaller payroll (mid 70s) than Dallas and NYC (85-90). It's still tough to imagine the Bulls going that high.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

how about

Javaris Crittenton? He's young, but he's a solid defender and he's 6'4"-6'5"... you'd have a ginormous backcourt

by peterbredenberg on Oct 31, 2007 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

just to play

a few mins a night anyway

by peterbredenberg on Oct 31, 2007 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's a darn good reason

not to see Kirk leave.

by KT on Oct 31, 2007 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Also worth mentioning

The deal is probably a done deal if you notice Kirk out of the line up tonight.

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

where did you hear that

or read it? Please Pax! Don't trade Tyrus Thomas! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

by JoJoEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

670

Now they just "confirmed" that it is all up to Kobe now.

Apparently the Bulls REALLY don't wanna give up Hinrich but it's out there.

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

for the record

i dont buy this....it reminds me of kevin days

but if the score is saying its all upt o kobe, you think they would mention what the trade is....

finally, something to think about; if the trade goes through we're more or less guarnateed to lose tonight given kirk wont be out there

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe it will

be an open audition for the next starting PG job? lol

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

if true

it gives some insight into who the lakers value I think. Sounds like BG is at least third on that list because I would assume that Pax offered him first.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

God I hope not

I'm going to the game and if I see a Duhon/Thabo backcourt...that will be not so competitive.

by Freethefro on Oct 31, 2007 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Where does

it say that Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? He practiced with the team today.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"if you notice Kirk out of the line up"

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

They reported

that if Kirk is out of the line up tonight, then the deal is probably going to go through. They didn't say he's out.

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

OK, I

read it wrong. I hope like hell Kirk starts tonight.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

just heard

same report out at lunch, he seemed very confiedent that the deal woudl happen within the next 48hrs assuming Kobe accepts it. He said it's all on Kobe...

by tyrus4prez on Oct 31, 2007 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Does

anyone else find it strange that there's no word on this trade... I can't find it anywhere, except on The Score???

by tyrus4prez on Oct 31, 2007 3:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

That is strange

None of the national writers on ESPN, SI, or anywhere else has picked up on this . . . but the frickin' Score has? I'm not accusing Option of making this up, but I wonder if maybe the Score is exaggerating how close the deal is to being done.

by Big D on Oct 31, 2007 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

ESPN doesn't get any scoops

They just don't credit the original source and call it a scoop.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"ESPN.com's Ric Bucher has learned..."

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

If it was Mark Stein

I'd have a lot more confidence.

He breaks stories. Everyone else, not so much.

by KT on Oct 31, 2007 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

hence the 'has learned'

which is their way of getting around jacking some other organization's report.

I agree with you, Stein seems to be the best. Bucher is just a Laker doof, which is why I used his name.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bucher is saying WSCR is full of crap

according WMVP.

by hscs on Oct 31, 2007 4:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

realgm is reporting the same thing

on the threads...

here's what i can't wrap my head around

at the least we'd be giving up 5 players and getting back 1 meaning our roster is cut from 15-11...so we need 4 players fast.... we do the trade, and especially given noahs injury, we get thin fast...although that may explain why bulls mgmt was talking to howard....he could come in and replace a body like tyrus or veektor in the rotation

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Howard

Miles, Howard signed with the Mavs all ready.

by kingj41 on Oct 31, 2007 3:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i didnt make myslef clear

i was speaking in the past sense. It botherded my why bulls mgmt was talking to howard...we're already stacked at the bench PF spot, and we essentaily have howard in Joe Smith...why would we need another one, and who is he gonna replace on the peg. With the trade, it woudl make sense because we would lsoe some of our fornt court depth

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm watching

CSN and they have said nothing. I really hope this is just ugly rumors.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I heard the same thing on the score

so he's not making it up, but i just dont see it anywhere. Not even on the Lakers Blog, is there mention of it becoming a reality.

by tyrus4prez on Oct 31, 2007 3:49 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

At this point...

If it ends up that nothing at all comes out of this, I think Chicago will break the record for most ever simultaneous cases of blueballs...

by Hiryu on Oct 31, 2007 3:55 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Apparently

There is another source on 670 The Score, that has HIS sources that says the deal isn't likely to go down.

Jesus!

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 4:06 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Dang this sucks

I'm sick of being disappointed by these almost-trades for stars. One of these needs to work out sooner or later.

by RM on Oct 31, 2007 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

here we go again

Can we find a reporter/writer to give us real news. I nominate Matt!!

by tyrus4prez on Oct 31, 2007 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

heh, not interested

BTW, if you guys want more up-to-the-second craziness, the legions at RealGM are in full force. I read there that Ric 'ginger balls' Bucher did appear on one of ESPN's tentacles, and indirectly peed all over what the Score is reporting.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

They just said

on The Score that this trade is one of many possible trades that have been thrown out there. They also said it probably won't happen.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 4:06 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

THANK YOU

I know ive been pushing the trade..but...with no kirk then whats the point of kobe...my love of basketball would again be dead...i suppose...

im trying hard to become the next kirk hinrich, therefore im doing nothing more than being the next chris duhon.

by piccolomair on Oct 31, 2007 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I couldn't understand

trading Kirk either. I don't want Kobe but if they are destined to get him I will still follow them if Kirk stays.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Eddy Curry was my favorite player in the league

then got traded. It hurt a lot but eventually I almost got over it. You will too.

by philosoball on Oct 31, 2007 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No I won't.

If Kirk leaves so do I.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well still see you at Bleed Cubbie Blue right? :)

by philosoball on Oct 31, 2007 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

For sure.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

At least I'd know someone at the new place!

Geez - spend the afternoon in class then get out to read all of this? I just about had a heart attack.

For the record, Lu's grown on me enough that I'd stick around, but it sure wouldn't be the same.

"They had me do a psychology test and I asked Coach Skiles if that affected his coaching. He laughed and said, `No way.'" (Joakim Noah)

by wjb1492 on Oct 31, 2007 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think

Kirk is going anywhere, at least I hope not. Much to Matt's dismay I'll probably still be here.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

jeez, where'd that come from?

If I were to hold commenter executions there'd be a long long long list before getting to Sue369.

Plus you help in my SBNation diversity evaluations.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks, I think.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Are Sue and I the only females on this site?

Although I'm both a Bulls fan and a Kirk fan. I survived (barely) the nightmare years, I could survive Kobe.

Hard to route for someone who comes off as cold and calculating.

by KT on Oct 31, 2007 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

wjb is

a female too.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 7:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

hey! a weblink!

Daily Herald.

(found on Sactown Royalty, a place I've successfully gotten into the frenzy, muahaha.)

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 4:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

yahoo sports is reporting

that kobe for gilbert is going down sometime tomororw

wait for it...

IN MY FANTASY LEAGUE

AOOOO!

by milesgmsu on Oct 31, 2007 4:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

On Sportscenter right now:

They're saying the deal has fallen through.

by Big D on Oct 31, 2007 5:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Apparently it would have involved

The Lakers getting Artest and Ben Wallace, the Kings getting Gordon and P.J. Brown, and the Bulls getting Kobe.

by Big D on Oct 31, 2007 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

when did they say it fell through?

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess a Higher power than Paxson

wants Kobe. Oh they almost traded Ben Wallace?

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

this shit is frustrating now!

I don't think I can take much more of this crap!

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i just heard

Both Ben's, little to Sactown, big to LA, bulls get Kobe and artest. That was on sc.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 5:24 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I meant

bulls get kobe, LA gets Artest.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

what a lot of crap

Scoop fever! Catch it!

I wonder if lights are out at the Paxson residence for Halloween? I can see someone showing up and asking Pax (or Mrs. Pax) all about the trade.

by KT on Oct 31, 2007 5:24 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I would think he would be in his office at the

Berto?

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think it's

all a Halloween prank. ;-)

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No

the Lakers would get Artest.

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

If they traded Wallace wouldn't that give them

more money for free agents?

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

except that

kobe makes $6 mil more per year than Wallace.

Nocioni-Khryapa in '08

by bullshooter on Oct 31, 2007 5:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who's listening for the contract extentions?

While I know they don't need to extend them now, I'm worried about it. I want at least one signed, and in all honesty, don't care which. I have more confidence that they'll sign Deng in RFA or FA, so if they extend Gordon now, they'll still get Deng, IMO. If they extend Deng now, even better.

So... any news?

Yes, of course.

by tyger1147 on Oct 31, 2007 5:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Haven't heard any

on their extentions. I would like to see Deng signed today.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah but you wouldn't

have to sign BG? I guess Deng would cost you.

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I will Kill

Dan Berstiens sources!

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:30 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

it was Wallace and Kirk?

Everyone has different combos.

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 5:40 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

They just

said on CTL that it was Wallace and Hinrich but it was shot down.

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

midseason

seems makes more sense to wait until Midseason when they could trade Noc for salary matching and gives them time to evaluate team and Noah / TT more

by NY Chicago Fan on Oct 31, 2007 5:58 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Jesus!

They just said on pregame that some of the players heard about their names in the trades during warmups tonight. They said Lu didn't look real happy coming off the floor. Dammit!

Racecar spelled backwards is racecar.

by sue369 on Oct 31, 2007 6:07 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I wouldn't worry about the mindreading

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Great timing.

I'm sure NJ fans were happy to share the news with them. Hopefully all that talk about the guys being used to trade rumors and able to shut them out is true.

"They had me do a psychology test and I asked Coach Skiles if that affected his coaching. He laughed and said, `No way.'" (Joakim Noah)

by wjb1492 on Oct 31, 2007 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

this is really strange!

not sure what to do I can't stand this any longer I am going to just......what the hell is going on? Thats it! I'm going to drive to the Berto and see if the lights are on.

''This whole parties out of control!''-Moose

by joejoeEnglish94bulls4ever on Oct 31, 2007 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting notes...

Like most Bulls fans I'm tired of the rumors and would rather something, ANYTHING, happen already but the proposed trade that fell through does reveal some interesting tidbits. According to Bucher and ESPN it was Gordon and PJ Brown to SAC, Wallace and Artest to LA, and Kobe to the Bulls.

If that's true than it seems PJ Brown is willing to partner up with the Bulls in some form of a trade. It would essentially be a trade of Bens for Kobe. Are you kidding me?? I'd take that in a half a heartbeat. Hinrich, Kobe, Deng, Thomas/Smith, Noah/Gray?

The whole point of any trade that happens shouldn't be to win the East. It should be to win the TITLE!! I don't want the team to sacrifice the next 5 years of title shots for one appearance this year.

by CubFan81 on Oct 31, 2007 6:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Anyone here

catch on to the best news about all this?!

If this deal was in the works, that means the Bulls have talked Brown into being part of a sign and trade!

That would also mean the Bulls wouldn't have to give up too much!

WOO HOO!!

by Option27 on Oct 31, 2007 6:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I assume PJ would be bought out afterwards

If he turned down offers from teams like Dallas, Phoenix, and Boston, it's hard to imagine him wanting to actually play for a rebuilding team like Sacramento. It would essentially be a nice retirement gift for him.

by Big D on Oct 31, 2007 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

there is a provision

in the CBA about rejecting trades due to 'cap circumvention'. I don't know what it takes to trigger such a provision, but this would have to be close.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 31, 2007 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That would suck for PJ

If he ended up like Antonio Davis a few years ago, when the league wouldn't allow him to be bought out by the Knicks and resign with the Bulls after the Eddy Curry trade.

And then to make matters worse, he got traded to the Raptors, and had to deal with that damn Canadian metric system again.

by Big D on Oct 31, 2007 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Something needs to happen soon

The whole matter is obviously a huge distraction to both the Bulls and Lakers players. I can't see them dragging it out to December. There has to be some resolution one way or the other right now.

I was trying to be excited watching the season opener, but I found myself feeling like I was looking at a temporary team. Either make a move or don't make it.

by Hiryu on Nov 1, 2007 9:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs