Dwight-to-Bulls: "Only one team rep I encountered was prepared to list Chicago as the favorite to land Howard, but a couple others openly wondered why Howard is so reluctant to add the Bulls to the Nets, Lakers and Mavericks on his list of preferred destinations.
The only plausible theory, unless Howard is so vehemently averse to Chicago weather, is the theory in circulation about adidas urging Howard not to play alongside Derrick Rose so its two biggest shoe-sellers don't wind up in the same city.
One source in Reno said of the Bulls: "They've got so many pieces to work with [headlined by Joakim Noah] and they're very interested. I don't think [the Bulls] are going away, either. They're not going to be convinced they can't get Dwight until he goes somewhere else."
4 months ago
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This last few lines are interesting
and at least indicate the Bulls are still trying to be active in the Howard story.
by bryield on Jan 13, 2012 1:44 PM CST reply actions 4 recs
Ya know, if Bynum keeps playing this well, it might not even matter if he changes his mind or not
He’d be better than anything the Bulls can offer. Even if we can offer more solid pieces, it’s always better to add the best player. Plus they’d be getting him out of the conference.
It is pretty funny though, how a guy that seemingly can’t make up his mind about shit, is remaining steadfast that he doesn’t want to go to a surefire Championship contending team, in the third biggest market in the country, to play with the league MVP.
If he would gladly pass that up to play for a team like the Nets or Mavs, maybe he really isn’t the guy that we “need”. Even Lebrick was smart enough to have the Bulls very high on his short list
Sadly, my self worth is almost entirely based upon the outcome of the previous night's Bulls game.
I somewhat agree on Bynum
but his injury history would have to be a concern for Orlando (Noah’s might, too, honestly). But, I still think a Dwight-Lebron swap is the most interesting, even if it’s really unlikely to happen. It came up in Bucher’s chat today, and this is what he had to say:
Chris (Oregon)
Ric, no one from ESPN wants to step up and take on this question/trade scenario. If I were Miami I’d consider a Lebron for Dwight Howard deal. It works for Miami and for Orlando, can you land anything bigger than LBJ for Dwight, signed for another 5 years? I just see that deal being great for both teams, what do you think?
Ric Bucher (1:57 PM)
It’s a very intriguing idea and I floated it to someone in Dwight’s camp. They said, “Hmmmm. Interesting.” Which is better than no. By the way, scratch the Dwight with LeBron scenarios. I’m told he doesn’t want to play with him for a variety of reasons.
I’m told he doesn’t want to play with him for a variety of reasons.
well, ain’t that some shit.
by obnoxious american on Jan 13, 2012 2:28 PM CST up reply actions
If I was Deron Williams or Kobe, I'd be insulted right now
Apparently Dwight doesn’t want to play with anyone too good.
the first in the "variety"
is likely that Lebron is a jerk. Just a guess. No sources.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
What I don't get...
is why even mention the LeBron WITH Dwight scenarios? Who’s even floating that idea out there? No way the Heat ever trade Wade so then you’re looking at a Bosh and stuff for Dwight? Really?
If Howard isn't the guy we "need", nobody else
Maybe he isn’t the most driven guy in the league. I still really want him, because he’s really fucking good.
Pat Riley is the devil.
no kidding. i say howard and his passionless 30/20 games are perfect for our needs. besides, derrick
is driven enough for 2 people anyway.
"We would look at each other with a glint of recognition and one of us would say, 'So you worry about ASIK, too,' as if admitting a secret vice. Then we would share our crazy ideas-- because all ideas about ASIK that are not immediately wrong turn out to be crazy."
No need to tell me that
I’ve long been a member of the drooling throng of Bulls fans that want him to play here. I’m just at the bargaining stage, where I’m telling myself things to feel better.
Sadly, my self worth is almost entirely based upon the outcome of the previous night's Bulls game.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 13, 2012 3:15 PM CST up reply actions
Agree that Howard is not committed to winning
He is a great player, but winning is not his priority. He is focused on having a good time. He will probably change his focus eventually, but right now he is not a winner. His best chance is to go to the Lakers and let Kobe kick him in the ass.
by Gorditadog on Jan 14, 2012 12:59 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Remember this? Dwight Howard, acting like a clown.
During the 4th quarter of last weeks Bulls-Magic game.
by Gorditadog on Jan 14, 2012 1:02 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
that last bit is encouraging
keep trying, convince him this is the place to be. Sell better than Derrick Rose can, anyway.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jan 13, 2012 2:05 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
True - but given the Adidas narrative that isn't going away, we have to ask:
“Is it the shoes?!”
The shoes.
Another way Jordan’s legacy hangs over the Bulls.
No one would give a shit about basketball shoes were it not for Jordan and Nike.
"Smith stripped. Smith stopped! Smith stopped again by Pippen!"
by ColonelFatheart on Jan 13, 2012 2:39 PM CST up reply actions
It's stupid.
His adidas deal is almost done, and he’d have three offers on his desk 10 seconds after it lapses.
I would also advise sending him a pair of Jordan's
and asking him to fill them…I can’t remember who did that, but I kinda think LeBron was put off by it. I know it wasn’t a Bulls official or anything, but I think stuff like that can scare him off.
Chicago, A Drinking Town With A Sports Problem
"I can accept failure, everyone fails at something. But I can't accept not trying."
Michael Jordan
So you think sending him a shopped photo of me and him running on a beach in Bulls' gear was a bad idea???
Sadly, my self worth is almost entirely based upon the outcome of the previous night's Bulls game.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jan 13, 2012 3:18 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
is it rocky style
or are you naked in this one?
Either way…yes. Yes it was.
Chicago, A Drinking Town With A Sports Problem
"I can accept failure, everyone fails at something. But I can't accept not trying."
Michael Jordan
by MRubio52 on Jan 13, 2012 3:19 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
your theory is pretty insulting to Joakim
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jan 13, 2012 2:52 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not saying it's likely but I've been trying to find a reason why he stopped caring for a bit now
im with you a lil
i hate to believe it, but on a business standpoint it makes sense. I think he’s gettin tired of the trade rumors every year
noahs smarter than that
hes doing it on purpose so we cant trade him. no one wants the noah thats shown up this season.
Should've traded for Melo.
yup like i said in the game threads
noahs an evil genius.
driving down his trade value as fast as possible so he can stay on the bulls
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Jan 13, 2012 2:34 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
More likely he's a stoned conspiracy theorist.
And reverse psychology is as deep as his strategies go.
"Smith stripped. Smith stopped! Smith stopped again by Pippen!"
by ColonelFatheart on Jan 13, 2012 2:39 PM CST up reply actions
i kinda dont want him
but i want him cuz he’s good..only thing i hate is his childish attitude..like stop acting like your trying to get out of biology class dude and play fukin ball.
still take him ..esp if we can keep taj or/and asik
I know Stan Van is supposedly a hardass, but I think that's mostly the bluster of a clown.
Thibs is as serious as a heart attack, and I think Howard would respond well to his style, especially because it favors defense.
Howard under Thibs’ defensive tutelage would equal some Hakeem/Dikembe shit.
"Smith stripped. Smith stopped! Smith stopped again by Pippen!"
by ColonelFatheart on Jan 13, 2012 2:41 PM CST up reply actions
If he thinks Stan is a hardass
Then Thibs will make him cry
"Violence is not always the answer."
"Violence is the question, and the answers always YES!"
by T.Moore on Jan 13, 2012 2:56 PM CST up reply actions 7 recs
nah. thibs is hard, but hes not as sarcastic and grating. SVG is a straight up prick at times.
"We would look at each other with a glint of recognition and one of us would say, 'So you worry about ASIK, too,' as if admitting a secret vice. Then we would share our crazy ideas-- because all ideas about ASIK that are not immediately wrong turn out to be crazy."
whats dwight's adidas contract status?
honestly if adidas was being such retards couldnt howard just threaten to not sign with adidas when his contract runs up and threaten to go to nike/jordan etc?
(of course if he’s locked in like rose this idea is gone)
Should've traded for Melo.
I stand by my case...
I don’t really want him.
THEO!
by wrigleyrocker12 on Jan 13, 2012 2:47 PM CST reply actions
I wont gut the team for him anyway
"Violence is not always the answer."
"Violence is the question, and the answers always YES!"
by T.Moore on Jan 13, 2012 2:56 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
two years later when rose begins to enter his prime years
when noah is avging 5ppg and 8rpg and deng’s body is constantly broken, are you going to still wish you didnt gut the team for dwight?
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Jan 13, 2012 3:13 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
I hate to agree with sin, but I agree with sin.
"Smith stripped. Smith stopped! Smith stopped again by Pippen!"
by ColonelFatheart on Jan 13, 2012 3:15 PM CST up reply actions 10 recs
When he's right, he's right
Even if this is a blip on Noah’s career path, he doesn’t become anything close to resembling Dwight Howard.
Chicago, A Drinking Town With A Sports Problem
"I can accept failure, everyone fails at something. But I can't accept not trying."
Michael Jordan
if noah's out droppin three's
i will buy you a cadillac.
by obnoxious american on Jan 13, 2012 4:46 PM CST up reply actions
I said "just in terms of how good he'll be"
To cover my ass on the dissimilarity of their games. I failed.
More like six words: Team-building the old fashioned way.
Nikola Mirotic, Charlotte pick, Omer Asik resigned to a lengthy contract, low first-round picks developed into worthwhile assets, free-agency, trading the expiring contracts belonging to our current core…
In short, the Bulls have assembled a contending team through shrewd, conservative moves. They should continue doing so. This is not a James Dolan run organization. Look at the crap team that actually did trade for Melo! They will be mildly relevant for 2 years before injuries and a lack of fresh assets from the draft turn them into the Nets.
Schindler's List is, at the most basic level, a remake of Jurassic Park... ~Zizek
by THEKILLERWHALE on Jan 15, 2012 3:50 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
rose and howard are a shit ton better than melo and amare in absolute terms and
perhaps moreso in synergistic terms. they’d be set for the next 7 years and they’d win 2-3 titles easy.
"We would look at each other with a glint of recognition and one of us would say, 'So you worry about ASIK, too,' as if admitting a secret vice. Then we would share our crazy ideas-- because all ideas about ASIK that are not immediately wrong turn out to be crazy."
If it's really about the shoe contract, it's a pretty stupid reason. If adidas is urging him
not to, he can finish the contract out, and then I’m sure Nike would love to step in and offer the only true, exciting center in the league a lucrative contract. Something just doesn’t add up. Maybe it’s more about being the focal point of the team than it is about winning. The clock is ticking so we’ll find out soon what his true intentions are.
As far as Noah goes, I think these trade rumors might be getting to him. He might be over thinking things, and trying to do too much. And visually he seems to be winded after 10 minutes of playing. Maybe these two things combined are the reasons he’s having a down year? Over thinking and fatigue, maybe a lingering injury that he’s trying to play through?
On the J.R. Smith bandwagon until otherwise advised.
think Ewing is discouraging him from coming here
cause we stopped him from getting a championship?
I'd only want him if...
he began to shoot free-throws underhanded. Otherwise, let him clank elsewhere.
I have zero respect for players – no matter how “great” – who refuse to improve their game, and their team’s chances of winning, because they’re afraid that they won’t look cool. Pathetic.
While I agree to some degree...
If teams want to blow a bunch of fouls hacking Dwight they are more than welcome to. Makes it easier for Rose to do what he wants. And in the 4th quarter Rose should have the ball more any ways.
I can’t find it right now but someone on ESPN’s NBA twitter page linked to an article calling for a ban on FT and blah, blah, blah, but the more interesting part was an article that that guy linked to that pointed out that with very few exceptions, FT shooting is not an improvable skill. The same things that make guys like Dwight Howard and other good basketball players (long arms, big hands) are a hindrance to consistently making FTs.
actually...
from a scientific standpoint, it’s pretty clear that underhand is a superior free-throw shooting style for big men…
http://discovermagazine.com/2008/the-body/07-physics-proves-it-everyone-should-shoot-granny-style
by Paul Warfield on Jan 14, 2012 11:15 AM CST up reply actions
I'm not sure I agree with that
Their assertation is that the flatter shot of big men makes the basket effectively smaller. Going granny style allows the player to “use” more of the basket.
But the study (unless I missed it) misses that the granny style shot has more moving parts. The free throw is easy to replicate because you are really only moving your elbow and wrist, and you are doing it in one plane. You should only really miss a free throw short or long if you are using proper form.
The granny style shot means you have to coordinate the movements of 2 shoulders, 2 elbows and 2 wrists. You have to ensure that you use both arms symmetrically or your shot will go off to the left or right (in addition to short or long).
I think big men would be better off just putting more arc in their shot. It would achieve the same effect as shooting granny style but introduce fewer moving parts. Or they could just practice more.
I don't believe...
that there is any evidence that the underhand style is either more difficult to execute, or more complex for the reasons that you suggest.
Another problem that many big men suffer from (in the context of free-throws) is oversized hands. Have you ever tried shooting free-throws with a tennis ball? Very big hands can be a hinderance, and that issue is completely mitigated with the underhand style.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 14, 2012 7:27 PM CST up reply actions
I don't know that you
need evidence to prove that using a two-handed style introduces more room for error than a one-handed style. There is a reason people have been shooting one way for the past century.
I’m not looking for an argument on this.
ah, I see...
because something has predominately been done a certain way for a long period time, no evidence is necessary to support the wisdom of it. The physicians who performed bloodletting over the span of 2000 years would have agreed completely with your position.
More to the point, we are talking about a very small subset of players who face very specific challenges when shooting free-throws, so the style used successfully by the vast majority of players is not fully relevant.
Finally. my main point is that Howard (and Shaq, etc.) refuse, for reasons of vanity, to even attempt a different style, even though there is evidence to suggest that it would help to raise percentages and win games.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 14, 2012 8:17 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
did you just equate bloodletting to shooting a free throw?
Chicago, A Drinking Town With A Sports Problem
"I can accept failure, everyone fails at something. But I can't accept not trying."
Michael Jordan
We've been doing ______ for years. Who are you to argue?
fill in the blank. It’s valid to use as an analogy.
"Shame he’s such a goofy fuckface."
-JBJ, referring to Dwight Howard
by SidM on Jan 15, 2012 7:53 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Dude
Not wanting Dwight Howard because he doesn’t shoot free throws granny-style might be the single most ridiculous reason for not wanting a player ever.
Second, there are 7 foot centers who make 80% of their free throws shooting conventionally. So with practice, one can be a good free throw shooter even at 7 feet tall.
Third, all the “physics” discussed in the article is about getting a shot with more arc and more backspin. You can accomplish the same physics by shooting the ball, with proper form, with more arc and snapping your wrist more.
Fourth, perhaps Barry, the 70s era player who was a great granny-style shooter, shot well because he PRACTICED it a lot, not because of physics. There are plenty of really tall players in the NBA who are really great free throw shooters. They practice a lot. And they all shoot overhand.
Fifth, sometimes things are done one way because of tradition and inertia. Other times they are done because it is a superior way of doing it. Shooting conventionally with proper form should make you only miss short or long. Shooting two handed WILL make you miss in all 4 directions, short/long/left/right. There are more moving parts to coordinate.
Sixth, the article PROVES nothing. It hypothesizes that granny style shooting is better using poorly controlled variables and one person’s success as evidence. The “proof” that MMR caused autism was based on better evidence than that, and that hypothesis has since been widely disproven.
Last, how do you know Howard won’t shoot granny style because of vanity? Did you talk to him? Get in his soul? Maybe he doesn’t do it because there is no real evidence to say that shooting that way, with the same amount of practice as shooting conventionally, will give better results. Maybe he doesn’t do it for the same reason he doesn’t shoot free throws well—because it will involve practicing free throws a lot.
by tomas21 on Jan 15, 2012 10:25 AM CST up reply actions 5 recs
I'm guessing that completely changing his shot in his 8th year in
the NBA won’t provide him with the confidence needed to step up and hit that shot consistently.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 15, 2012 11:26 AM CST up reply actions
It would require a mental toughness...
that Howard may lack. I don’t disagree with that.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 11:36 AM CST up reply actions
Too nuanced for you, apparently
It’s remarkable how you continue to fail to understand the fundamental points of my assertions.
It is completely irrelevant that some big men shoot well from the line. Some people never attend high school and become rich; would you suggest that as a good prescription for success?
Howard has presumably practiced free-throws for many years, and yet he is a sub 60% shooter for his career, is shooting less that 46% this season from the line, and recently missed NINETEEN in one game.
If you don’t see that shooting underhand would likely improve those percentages, and that it is therefore both selfish and ridiculous for him not to try the method, then there is no point in discussing it any further.
I never offered the article as “proof”, but rather as a clear, scientific explanation for why big men in particular would likely benefit from the underhand style. Howard (and plenty of other big men) lack the touch to create a high arcing, normal shot. The underhand style is intrinsically superior for such players.
Rick Barry, who has offered to coach Howard, said that he “would be shocked if I couldn’t get him up to 75 or 80 percent from the line”. Even if he were to only raise him to 60-70%, it would have a huge impact.
As to how I know of Howard’s reluctance, it’s been well reported:
“I’ve got good form and I have confidence in my shot,” he insists. “I don’t need to shoot underhanded free throws.”
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 11:28 AM CST up reply actions
You have like 15 posts
on this site, and more than half of them are you being a condescending asshole.
The article states that it is proof. You claimed it is scientific evidence. It really isn’t scientific evidence, it is speculation based on a scientific theory and one example.
I don’t think shooting underhanded would improve his percentage unless he spent a lot more time working on free throws than he does now. If he switched styles without increasing his practice time, his percentage would likely go down. If he spent that extra time practicing shooting conventionally, his percentage would likely go up.
As for Rick Barry’s claims, if he said he could make Howard shoot 100% with his coaching and form, would you believe that too?
I understand the points you are making, I just don’t agree with them, and I don’t think you are offering the scientific evidence that you think you are. I also think you come off like a dick.
Excellent!
You resort to ad hominem attacks, and I’m the one who is a “dick” and and an “asshole”.
You complain about the article not being “proof” of anything, then claim (without a shred of evidence, of course) that Howard’s only problem is that he doesn’t practice enough.
As far as Rick Barry goes, this may come as something as a surprise to you, but most people (myself included) would trust his judgment on this topic over yours.
Finally, I welcome challenges from those with opposing views, but the ones you’ve offered on this thread just aren’t very persuasive. (Now that was condescending.)
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 2:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
well no one actualy trusts Rick Barry's judgment on this
b/c know one is doing it like him. just saying.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 15, 2012 2:31 PM CST up reply actions
…shooting underhand would likely improve those percentages…
This is the part people aren’t agreeing with.
"Shame he’s such a goofy fuckface."
-JBJ, referring to Dwight Howard
that's fine...
although it’s a mystery to me on what basis they might disagree. One of Rick Barry’s teammates, George Johnson, was shooting around 40% from the line, and four years later was up to 80%, having switched to the underhand style.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 7:47 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
well, he also had rick barry to teach him
"Shame he’s such a goofy fuckface."
-JBJ, referring to Dwight Howard
I dont think anyone said they didnt want him because he didnt change to granny style
I think it was more, some dont want him because he doesnt put the leader’s effort in, as evidenced by his unwillingness to improve his free through or change anything about that 10 second wait we have to bear with.
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
Practice makes perfect
If Howard wanted to be a better player he would shoot free throws underhand
refuse to improve?
have you watched any of dwight the past season or so and this season?
dude has a decent post up game now and is working on his face up jumper next along with free throws.
might not be a yao ming at the line yet but hes working.
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Jan 14, 2012 7:21 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
hello??
I was obviously referring specifically to free-throw shooting, and in that context my assertion obviously stands.
Furthermore, free-throw shooting is clearly Howard’s greatest weakness, and yet, for reasons of vanity, he refuses to use a style that would almost certainly help him to improve, and help his team to win.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 14, 2012 8:20 PM CST up reply actions
yeah so free throw shooting is the reason we shouldnt want the best fucking center in the league and a top 3 player in the league
cause you know.. shaq never fucking won with his 50% ft shooting right??
oh wait whats that ?? shaq has 4 rings ?? HOW DID THAT HAPPEN?? HE NEVER IMPROVED IT!!
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Jan 15, 2012 1:24 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
your reading comprehension skills leave a lot to be desired
I never said, nor implied that Howard wouldn’t make the Bulls a stronger team on balance. What I said was that I wouldn’t want him on the team because he is more concerned about how he looks than improving his game and helping his team win.
I have the impression that Derrick Rose would wear pink shoes with frilly bows for shoelaces if he thought that it would help the team win, and I’d prefer to see the Bulls attempt to win championships with players who display that type of attitude.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 8:59 AM CST up reply actions
So you are less interested
in winning than acquiring players with a certain mentality?
I want to win. You have strange priorities has a fan, and you are REALLY married to this granny-shot thing. Did you write that article?
by tomas21 on Jan 15, 2012 10:29 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes...
I would find it far more satisfying to see the Bulls win with Rose’s and Thibs’ mentality, even if it might be tougher to do so without trading for Howard.
And your obsession with the article has reached the point of silliness.
by Paul Warfield on Jan 15, 2012 11:34 AM CST up reply actions
It might not just be tougher
to do it without Howard, we might not do it at all. If you don’t want to win a championship if it means winning with a career 60% FT shooter, then you and I have different priorities for the Bulls. I want them to win. If obtaining Howard helps them win a title, then he can miss every free throw he ever takes again. I would prefer he put in more time practicing free throws, but I don’t feel like I’m in a position to tell Dwight Howard how to spend his time, he is a pretty accomplished player.
It’s not like he’s a lazy player. He just isn’t a good free throw shooter.
Get over yourself.
Ive said this before and ill say it again
Fuck DHoward, he doesnt want to come here, he doesnt care about winning, wed have to take him out of the game in tight 4th quarters (hackahoward), and we already have tbr best record in the NBA.
it would realistically take Noah, Asik. Mirotic, brewer, and maybe our charlotte pick. For Howard and Turk. If you think that I’m exaggerating just remember what Denver got for Melo last year.
by MartyMondays on Jan 14, 2012 3:55 PM CST via mobile reply actions
And on top of that that fool doesn't even want to play here!
So kick rocks Howard! We got the best record in the NBA! With Mirotic and the Charlotte pick in our back pocket, the Bulls are cooking with good grease!
by Pepp23 on Jan 14, 2012 4:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
yeah, and while im sure some wont agree
I think we got a steal in jimmy butler I see him being a damn good player in a year or two
by MartyMondays on Jan 14, 2012 4:31 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Cooking with good grease...
I like this analogy.
Schindler's List is, at the most basic level, a remake of Jurassic Park... ~Zizek
by THEKILLERWHALE on Jan 15, 2012 3:54 PM CST up reply actions
yeah we would have to take him out of the 4th quarter
you know why?
because we’d be blowing like 90% of the league out
Should've traded for Melo.
no we wouldnt
I forgot to mention Orlando would probably take deng in that trade as well. I’m not sure if rose.Hamilton.Turk.boozer.Howard and a bench that sucks is any better than we are now.
You shouldn’t fall into believing that starpower is everything, your beloved Melo in ny is a direct example of that.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 12:41 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
even i can admit theres a difference between a top 15 guy like melo
and a top 3 guy like dwight.
youre comparing apples and oranges with melo and dwight. please dont tell me you think they can impact a team in the same ways.
howard alone makes the magic a top 4 team in the east yearly and thats without a single all star caliber player.
Should've traded for Melo.
they are not a top 4 team in the east
And haven’t been since Turk was still effective and the year they went to the finals it was Turk who led them there. Howard had the better numbers but in a close 4th quarter he needs to be carried to a win.
You don’t ever see the magic throw it to dwight in the post with the game on the line, why? Cause he can’t really do anything consistently.
At the end of the day it would still be derrick at the top of the key with lebron on him with the game on the line, except this time his right hand man would be a clown who doesn’t care about winning. Forget him is rather suck than be at the mercy of dwight and worrying about him signing his next extension or if he’s unhappy.
He’s not a top 3 player, he’s the best center in the league the problem is a center is not nearly as important as it used to be. The NBA is different now, there are no more Ewings, Hakeems, and Shaqs. This is a guards league now.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 2:19 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
you'd rather suck?
I wouldn’t. I’d prefer we not suck.
"Shame he’s such a goofy fuckface."
-JBJ, referring to Dwight Howard
great answer to every point i made
If you guys like and want Howard I respect that, I’m just saying be realistic. Howard. Rose, boozer < Lbj, Wade. And Bosh.
I understand why you guys want him though
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 12:04 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
They lead their division and have the 4th best record in the East.
Last year they were a top 4 team, the year before that they were top 4, the year before that they were top 4.
It was a big man’s league in the 90s, guess who won most of the titles in that decade? The goal is to get the best team possible. If Howard can’t be “counted” on to close a game out then you pair him with one of the best closers in the game. I think that just might work.
by Ozzie Montana on Jan 15, 2012 9:33 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
they are top 4 via record and always have a pretty good record
But with Howard leading the way they’re a first round exit team you get what im saying?
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 12:06 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
No because you said they weren't a top 4 team.
Maybe actually write what you mean?
by Ozzie Montana on Jan 15, 2012 12:31 PM CST up reply actions
im not an idiot
You think I don’t know that the magic have homecourt in the first round every year? Maybe you should adress that teams can hack a Howard instead of just saying pairing him with rose should work?
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 2:11 PM CST up reply actions
but Orlando has got out of the 1st round
3 of the last 4 years, with 2 trips to the conference finals and one trip to the finals. Your claim that Howard can’t lead a team out of the 1st round is more inaccurate than your claim that they aren’t a top 4 team in the East.
And hack a Howard didn’t work. Orlando won that game.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 15, 2012 2:35 PM CST up reply actions
what has he done recently?
The NBA got better, the heat, trailblazers, nuggets, thunder, are very very good. Yeah Orlando won that game against golden state, in the playoffs it could be devastating.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 4:02 PM CST up reply actions
We are talking about what he HAS done
This season is like 10 games old. Which one is a better indicator? Handful of games of his career thus far? Stop changing your argument. First its they aren’t a top 4 team. Then when someone proved you wrong you say he can’t get out of the first round and when some shot that down now you’re resorting to what has he done lately. Give it up unless you have a real argument.
Should've traded for Melo.
We are talking about what he HAS done
This season is like 10 games old. Which one is a better indicator? Handful of games of his career thus far? Stop changing your argument. First its they aren’t a top 4 team. Then when someone proved you wrong you say he can’t get out of the first round and when some shot that down now you’re resorting to what has he done lately. Give it up unless you have a real argument.
Should've traded for Melo.
you should be the last person telling me this
99% of the shit you say is just flat out ridiculous. My final statement is this, why are the fans of a team with the best record in the NBA so eager to dismantle for a player who doesn’t want to play on our team.
It sucks that there’s no loyalty around here
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 7:20 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
because we are the best team THIS year
but if youve been paying attention youd realize we need to pay taj and omer soon while still being locked into noah deng rose and boozer.
rose is the only one out of that core that i can see playing at a high level for the next 10 years. noah is already showing he has issues. deng cant possibly play the minutes hes been playing for much longer. and booz is already shitty as he is.
with dwight and drose youd have a core that would contend for the next 10 years.
Should've traded for Melo.
Howards game relies heavily on athleticism
And in case you guys have forgotten he has played a lot of minutes for a center. I wouldn’t be surpried if his game started declining a couple years from now.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 4:04 PM CST up reply actions
and once again
By record alone they are a top 4 team in the east. Do you really think they could beat let’s say the hawks in a playoff series? No way in hell.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 4:06 PM CST up reply actions
a couple years ago they beat the hawks in the playoffs with an average margin of like 40.
its pretty much the same team.
"We would look at each other with a glint of recognition and one of us would say, 'So you worry about ASIK, too,' as if admitting a secret vice. Then we would share our crazy ideas-- because all ideas about ASIK that are not immediately wrong turn out to be crazy."
i think the magic will be beaten in the playoffs first round once again
i think the bulls, heat, pacers, and knicks (who actually might take them to 7 games and have a good chance to beat them). Hawks would have been ablke to but they dont have horford.
why would our bench suck when we only give up noah and deng and get dwight?
if we get turk in return, i’m sure the bulls will trade him to another team for nothing. they don’t want his contract.
brewer/jimmy
boozer/taj
dwight/asik
rip/korver
rose/cj
as you see, we still have a strong bench, jimmy gets more minutes, and i know he’ll do fine in that role.
we wouldnt only give noah and deng
Cmon be reasonable
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 12:02 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
noah, deng, and picks should be enough.
i just mentioned noah and deng because they’re our rotational players, who the bulls will involve. i doubt they give up asik or taj if they’re giving up noah
orlando wont do Bynum for howard
They want Gasol too, and I dont necessarily agree but Bynum’s worth alone is equal to Noah and Deng. Were in a weird league man.
It would probably be something like this. Deng,Noah, Charlotte first, and Taj, for Howard, Turk, and Duhon. I personally don’t think that improves us.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 12:11 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Deng & Noah > Bynum
Bynum still has health issues and he hasn’t prove he could be consistent all season. Deng and Noah have proven that they can make an impact on both ends of the floor. Now is Gasol is part of the trade, Bynum/Gasol > Noah/Deng. Lakers wouldn’t do that for sure anyways.
I still don’t think Otis will trade Dwight to LA, because of the whole Shaq scenario.
Deng & Noah may be better than Bynum to us
but it’s very unlikely that Orlando will think that way. Bynum is a sure all-star and the consensus 2nd best center in the league, and Luol might not even make the all-star team. In addition, Bynum makes a lot less than the other two combined. Top-end talent is key when you’re trading a star, and Orlando would certainly demand a lot more than just those 2. They’ll try to saddle the Bulls with every bad contract they have in addition to taking Asik + Mirotic and draft picks.
Bynum hasn't prove he can be healthy all season.
Orlando is very concern about Bynums knees. They are also not fond of sending Dwight to the same franchise that stole Shaq from them. I think the only way Dwight heads to LA is if Lakers offer both Bynum and Gasol, which I know they wouldn’t do. Deng so far is proving he’s an All-Star caliber player, and Noah despite his struggles is a double-double machine who’s also a tenacious defender. Include the fact that the Bulls can offer future assets, like the Bobcats pick. If necessary, Asik or Taj will be there for the taking.
by RoseFTW on Jan 16, 2012 1:42 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
no, the magic will ask for a fortune
the magic are going to need either asik or taj in this trade. however, i agree with you. Deng and Noah plus picks does seem like its enough, but they are gonna try to get the most out of the bulls.
definitely
And were in the same conference, they’re not giving us Howard unless we give up A LOT.
by MartyMondays on Jan 15, 2012 4:25 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
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