We're Talking Draft! Wait, what? Why?
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 12:34 PM CST
Email
PrintSeriously, why?
I love this team. I really do. I think it's exciting to see them play so friggin' tough every day. While I might prefer to see offensive efficiency, fluidity and execution in an entertainment sort of way, in the long run, winning games in any manner is good entertainment.
However, while the Bulls may be the 2nd-best team in the NBA, I have a firm belief that being "good" (even pretty good), is not an excuse to not try and get better. The trade deadline has passed with a minor but helpful move, and the Bulls made their waiver wire signing.
There's a lot to be excited for this season. The Bulls have a legitimate chance to win the NBA Championship, even if they aren't the favorites.* But how, after this season, do the Bulls become the favorites?
*are people going to "believe" Hollinger's rankings now that they say the Bulls have the 2nd-best chance of winning it all--higher than most "traditional" writers, or is he still an idiot?
My first and highest preference is for the Bulls to trade whatever tradeable assets they have and acquire an ideal, established SG like Andre Iguodala or Kevin Martin. My second choice is to get a less-studly or less-proven person that's already in the NBA, e.g. J.R. Smith, Courtney Lee, Brandon Rush or Wilson Chandler (there's a lot of "potential" guys). But those two things come with two main caveats: Reinsdorf's willing to spend now (for Iggy or Martin or Smith or Chandler and the like) or later (for Lee, Rush, others) and b) the other team's willingness to make the trade.
So that brings me to the 2011 NBA draft. (This will happen as the current CBA doesn't run out until June 30, 2011.) Going the draft route does a couple of things: it allows "this" team to gel for another year and b) will keep the payroll more controllable, the SG not needing a raise until (likely) 4-5 years from now.
With the Bulls addition of the Miami1st-round pick in the James Johnson trade (another reason to root against the Heat, if you didn't have enough already), the Bulls have two strategies. Draft for quantity and hope one or two pan out into legitimate role players. Or trade the farm to get into the lottery or Top 10.
The Bulls most-tradeable assets to a team in the lottery (hence, not good, rebuilding, likely want cheap contracts) are: Taj Gibson, all draft picks this year, next year's first round pick* and the Charlotte Bobcats' pick. (*They couldn't trade their own first both this year and next.)
My preference is that the Bulls trade away their two first-round picks this year, the Bobcats' pick and Taj Gibson for a pick anywhere in the lottery. However, I would be fine them saving all the picks and using them this year. I would NOT be cool with Reinsdorf selling off the picks for $3 million.
If the Bulls move into the lottery, I would like them to go after:
Harrison Barnes:
A player struggling mightily in the early part of the year causing his stock to drop from a pretty consensus No. 1 pick to going as low as 11th in some mock drafts. He's an athletic player (although not on the Derrick Rose, Tyrus Thomas level) that has a strong all-around game. His shooting was bad to start the year, but it's been better lately. I don't think he's as good as everyone though to start the year (and just playing poorly), but I do think he's a legitimate ball-handler and defender that will eventually learn to shoot well from the outside.
Jordan Hamilton
I'm not sold on Hamilton as a defender, but I think he is a very good shooter. In this draft, at this position, I'm taking offense over defense right now. As much as I love Ronnie Brewer, I don't think the No. 1 defense in the league is hinging on he and Keith Bogans. Hamilton still has a lot of work to do to be a good NBA player (and especially a starter), but keeping Watson, Brewer and Korver around for another 2 years could bridge that gap.
Alec Burks
I think Burks is clearly the better player over Hamilton. He is a better all-around offensive player, a better defender and probably still has more potential. He flashes effort and positioning on defense. He can handle the ball, pass it and drive to the hoop (although he struggles finishing). But he has two big draw backs as a Bull: Shooting (he doesn't take many threes and doesn't make many that when he does) and playing off the ball (he's the primary guy at Colorado). Burks is often compared to Evan Turner because of his strengths and weaknesses. We've seen how that's gone. If, however, the Bulls feel he can learn to shoot and play off the ball, he could become a 3-pt version of Rip Hamilton, virtually a perfect fit.
Those are the only three guys I see the Bulls trading up for, essentially because they are the only ones that I see having a high-ish probability of a being a starter. While in a vacuum, the Bulls would be giving up a lot (two firsts and a valuable role player) to get some obviously flawed candidates, I think that, in a specific context, it's worth it. Taj Gibson is replaceable, and the two firsts are going to be low or far in the future.
If the Bulls decide to stay where they are, I like (using two picks):
Nolan Smith PG/SG
Some compare him to CJ Watson. I think he's more Kirk Hinrich. Either is fine by me.
Kyle Singler SF
I said it. Two Dukies. Yeah, I hate myself, too.
Markieff Morris PF
A very good defender with potential to be awesome. Improving offensive potential with with a chance to be good. (He would allow the Bulls to trade Taj Gibson a year from now. But he might not last to 26-28 range).
JaJuan Johnson PF
Pure potential pick. Could really suck and never be anything in the NBA. But could end up defending and rebounding well enough with his offensive abilities actually translating to the next level. It doesn't seem like he could ever replace Boozer, but then, Boozer was a 2nd-round pick, too. It would be interesting if, four years from now, the Bulls could make the decision to hand the PF spot over to him and letting Boozer go.
There isn't a lot of PG/SG or SG/SF projected to go late in the first round. There are few in the middle (mentioned above, among others), and then a ton in the second round that could be a fit for the Bulls as back-ups: David Lighty, Malcolm Lee, Scotty Hopson, Brad Wanamaker, Gilbert Brown, Marshon Brooks, Demetri McCamey, E'Twaun Moore, LaceDarius Dunn.
While giving up two firsts and Taj Gibson might be considered a lot for the three guys mentioned above, I think they have legit starting SG potential (even if small), especially on this team, and finding a back-up PF and back-up PG/SG, either in the draft, undrafted rookies, or in free agency, wouldn't be too much of an issue.
I think the last thing any of us should want, though, is for the team, even a "young" one coming off a very good season, to stand pat. The biggest reason is stated above: being good shouldn't be an excuse to not get better. The second reason, though, is almost as important: this team won't be the same in 2-3 years. Bogans, Watson, Korver and Brewer (and even Gibson???) are all likely to be gone in a few, and Boozer won't be far behind them. They will be really good for the next couple of years, but to continue to do that into Rose's prime, they need to start the "re-building" process now so that it can be in full swing when these other guys leave.
What say you? (aside from my ramblings, feel free to make this a general draft thread, too, if you'd like)
FanPosts are user-created posts from the BlogABull community, and are to be treated as the opinions and views of that particular user, not that of the blogger or blog community as a whole.
229 comments
|
6 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
This draft seems like a bad time
Why move significant assets like Taj and the Charlotte pick for an unknown quantity (i.e. a late lottery pick) before the new CBA is negotiated? Depending on what happens in the new CBA, there could be a bunch of known quantities available that will cost neither Taj nor the Charlotte pick. The Bulls seem really well positioned to make a move AFTER the new CBA is negotiated. Doing it before that seems like shooting in the dark.
by thelivingant on Mar 9, 2011 12:54 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
So... they shouldn't take a risk on an known unknown (late-lottery) because of a known unknown (the CBA)...
…but they should take the risk on unknown known knowns (players that aren’t available now might be in the future) because of the known unknown (the CBA)?
While I recognize that post-CBA, things will be more certain, I don’t see how there’s any certainty (from our point, of course, but even from the players and owners point) of what those things will be. If they make a hard cap of $80 million w/ the only exception being Bird Rights, wouldn’t it have been vastly more prudent to get the potential starters on the team BEFORE it came about (i.e. they could get draft a potential starting SG this summer—or trade for one—AND keep Rose and all the other current Bulls.)
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Depends on cost
But no, I would not give up Taj, the Charlotte pick, and two late first rounders for a late lottery pick, which is you state as your preference.
I voted to keep the picks and draft back-ups
My first choice is to hit the home-run and get Iguodala. Even though he’s playing awesome now, if the Sixers get smoked in the first round, I don’t see it as impossible that that he gets moved.
Otherwise, I think they should sign one of those potential guys and draft the solid back-ups late in the first round. There is a lot of quality guys that would fit on this team including Smith, Singler, either Morris brother from KU, Jeff Taylor (Vanderbilt), Travis Leslie (UGA), Klay Thompson (Washington State) etc.
I don’t think that either Burks or Hamilton is worth 2 late first-round picks + 1 future mid-to-lottery-pick + Taj. Just don’t see either of them as being that good. Those guys also could easily fall into the mid-to-late-teens or even the early 20s. Especially in the case of Burks. In that case they might be available for just 2 picks.
I would probably give up that package to get Harrison Barnes. But, he’s still probably going to go top 8. Not sure if a team is going to be willing to give up that pick without getting a major piece in return.
by JSB on Mar 9, 2011 1:18 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
I agree with that.
I stopped cuz it was already ridiculously long. They could trade a first and a second to move up four or five spots if they want Nolan smith and think he’s going. Or a first and cash. But I guess part of my point in this (instead of just opening dialog for the draft), is that I don’t value Taj all that greatly nor a future asset compared to a current one.
I guess, let’s say they see Burks as a really good fit for the Bulls. Better than anyone else thinks. Like they saw with James Johnson and Taj Gibson. If you’re willing to trade 2 late first to move up from (say) 25 and 28 to 20, but then you hear the team sitting at 16 is definitely going to take him. If the team at 13 is willing to trade down but they want the Charlotte pick and Gibson but will give you their 2nd round pick, too, what is the marginal value of that Charlotte pick and Gibson?
I mean, this team is already really good. I don’t see how adding back-ups as rookies makes them better. It will save them money in the long-run, but I don’t see how they would have the cap space to draft a starter. OTOH, they’ll probably be able to add back-ups.
I don’t know.I understand the risk, and I guess i’m willing to accept it. If the Bulls can find a good starting SG without giving up any other starter or Asik, I just don’t think the price would be ridiculous, especially since they’d have two picks inthe 2nd and still have their own first for next year.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I dont see the point is moving up in this draft
since even the guys in the lottery arent all that great, i think you can find some decent players later in the draft that would help make the bulls better as well…..
I see u didnt mention justin holiday, someone i think would fit nicely for the bulls
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Justin-Holiday-6336/
good size, known as a defender, and has really good shooting mechanics so with some practice in the nba probably will turn out to be a nice shooter. At the worst id imagine hes a younger and more athletic version of keith bogans.
Also, i think nolan smith is more athletic than kirk hinrich, worse shooter, and tends to drive in more, and doesnt play the same type of defense…but thats just me….maybe hes more duhon than kirk? or probably neither….
i dont mind them getting rid of the assets you mentioned, but i dont know if it should be to move up in the draft, how about instead trying to make a deal for one of those restricted free agent shooting guards like rudey or lee again…
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Mar 9, 2011 1:20 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
what are the chances that Burks is available outside the lottery?
Considering payroll and the possibility of doing a two for one to move up to get him at 15+, even on draft day, maybe we can get him with a lower paycheck without having to give up Taj. I like Burks a lot, and agree that he’d be a really good fit if he developed more of an outside game and could accept the new role he’d have on the Bulls.
I basically don't believe option A is possible
(trading draft picks to find a starter quality rookie) so I went with option B. We obsess about this every year but we never land Harden or Turner or any other guy (and neither does anyone else). Even in a weak draft, lottery teams are relunctant tot trade down.
The way I see it, the Bulls best bet to get a real starting quality 2 guard is to package one of their assets along with draft picks and trade for a guy or, if the mid level exception exists – just bid for a guy. Since I see that as the most likely scenario, you need to pick guys who can either fill in for traded assets (like Nolan Smith for CJ Watson or Tompkins for Taj Gibson) or who may have value themselves (Singler).
One guy I like that may fit the Landry Fields bar (2nd round pick who didn’t wow but could surprise in the NBA) is Justin Holiday, older brother of Sixers guard Jrue Holiday. He is a 50% shooter, 40% 3pt shooter who plays really solid defense. Because the pac 10 is down a guy like him could be overlooked. But as an early 2nd round pick (right now draftexpress has him going #15 in the 2nd round) he could be a steal with the potential to play minutes right away. And he plays smart basketball on a team built to play in chaos. (Don’t the Bulls have a 2nd round pick from Washington or Utah this year?)
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 9, 2011 1:56 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
We actually have 3 2nd round picks
http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/detailed
Our own, Utah’s and Phoenix’s (they gave us one for Warrick for some odd reason).
Pat Riley is the devil.
Actually, nvm
From the same link, we owe our own 2nd rounder to the Bucks and the lesser of the other 2 to Golden State.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Mar 9, 2011 2:04 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think there could be some good pickups in the 2nd round for the Bulls
If Marshon Brooks actually falls all the way to the 2nd round, I don’t see how the Bulls can pass him up. He’s been one of the best scorers in the country, while playing in the toughest conference in the country and yet gets overlooked because the Friars suck.
While we’re in the Big East, I’ll throw in my mega-homer vote for Jimmy Butler. He’s got a solid jumpshot, is good off of the dribble, finishes well at the basket and is an above average defender. I think he would be a great option to back up Luol.
by darksmokepuncher on Mar 9, 2011 2:00 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
On the subject of mega-homer picks:
I’d like to see the Bulls take a second-round flier on Chandler Parsons from UF.
He’s not especially great at any one thing, but he’s a long (6-10), heady senior who does a lot of things quite well, including defend, rebound (8.0 per-36 in 2009-10; 8.3 per-36 so far in 2010-2011), pass creatively (3.8 assists per-36 this season), and shoot the three (.358 in 2009-10, and .393 this season, on 3.1 attempts per game each season), with his three-point shot-selection and (thus) accuracy having really improved each of the last two seasons. He can play either forward position effectively, allowing him to provide adequate backup minutes for Luol Deng, both at SF (primarily) and at PF in smaller lineups; in the latter scenario, he could even play the Deng-at-PF role while Deng is still in the game at SF (if match-ups dictate).
He was also just named SEC Player of the Year, which is the first time (in its 78 years of SEC competition) that any Florida player has garnered that accolade.
Plus, he sounds like a Thibodeau-tailored player, anyways:
"I think this is the greatest compliment you can ever give a player: Chandler Parsons has never, ever had a bad day of practice or game in my opinion," coach Billy Donovan said in his pre-Alabama press conference. "He may not have always shot the ball well, played well, or done everything I asked him to do but he has always given me 1000 percent of himself all the time.
"I never worried about him, all the way from his freshman year to now. I don’t worry about him coming to practice and working hard, I do not worry about him giving a great effort."
its amazing that those two fla championship teams or even the early 2000 final four team
didnt have an sec poy. esp. the second championship team
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Mar 11, 2011 1:32 AM CST up reply actions
I also would like to pick up butler
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Mar 11, 2011 1:31 AM CST up reply actions
Maybe we could draft guys playing abroad.
It worked with Asik, and San Antonio seems to do it all the time.
The draft is such a crap shoot that I don’t see the point in trying to move up to the lottery.
by Tim S. on Mar 9, 2011 2:17 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
That's a pretty crap analogy, or at least a shite use of it.
If you want to keep it, at least acknowledge that there are some outcomes that are much more likely than others.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
The way you used it, you're basically saying that one pick is as good as any other.
And that no one really has any clue about anything. Even if that’s true (which it isn’t), that’s not what the actual games of craps is all about. A 7 has a higher probability of hitting than a 2, for instance. And if that’s the analogy you want to use (which might actually work), then that that is the opposite of what you said. We know that the higher a player is picked, the more likely he is to be better. And that would support my idea of moving up for a more-sure thing. But I don’t think you meant to do that.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 4:01 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
"Crapshoot" is commonly used
to describe a risky and uncertain venture. The NBA draft is by nature a risky and uncertain venture. Teams suck at predicting who will succeed and who will not. Even the top picks regularly turn into busts, while many of the best players get drafted farther down in the draft, overlooked by numerous teams. Some even go undrafted.
There may be some drafts where everyone wants a top pick, but even there you sometimes get a player like Bowie or Oden who doesn’t measure up to what everyone expected. But in this draft there are no such players, and I think multiple picks are worth more than one lottery pick.
I disagree with everything you said in the first paragraph.
I’ve read plenty of statistically-based analysis to say the opposite. I guess I don’t understand how giving up one risky and uncertain future for an even riskier and more uncertain future is a good thing.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
AndI was just pointing out that that is a particularly bad cliche that is stupid...
…as it means the exact opposite of what people intend.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think you misunderstand the term and what I said.
“Crapshoot” does not mean all choices are equivalent, and I did not mean that one pick is as good as another. It does mean that draft picks are risky and uncertain, and I would love to read the analyses that say otherwise.
Even so-called “sure things” are not sure, as we have seen in recent history, but this year no one is even claiming that there are any sure things. In light of that fact, I think it is reasonable to suggest that multiple draft picks outside of the lottery are worth more than one pick in a weak lottery.
I know exactly what you're saying, but it's wrong.
You’re saying that there are no sure things in life, then I agree. There are never sure things, ever. And as you would agree, some things are more or less probable than others. Saying something is uncertain is too obvious to not be dumb. As in, it’s not even certain the Bulls make the playoffs this year.
But your point that because there are risks in the draft, that quantity is better than quality is lost on me. Just about every year there is a “weak” draft. Remember when Rose’s draft was a 2-man draft of Rose and Beasley? What do Westbrook, Love, and Eric Gordon have to say about that. Over the years, of players drafted 10-16, about 1 in 6 become stars, with over 3 of 8 (~37.5%) become borderline starters or better. In the last five spots, though, (where the Bulls will likely draft) 6% become stars and only 13% become borderline starters or better. If you get two players there, that’s still less of a chance that drafting in the late lottery. In fact, there’s a 1 in 4 chance that a team draft’s a bust or worse in the last sixth of the draft while there’s only a 1 in 10 chance that it happens in the latter third of the lottery.
http://www.82games.com/nbadraftpicks.htm
While you’re unlikely to get a star at any spot, you’re much more likely to get a solid 6th man in the lottery than in the last part of the first round. My guess is that you’ll completely ignore this, though.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 6:01 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Do you think the value of European players in the 2nd round/late 1st is properly valued?
Or would you still go for a kyle singler or so… (if we kept our picks)
I think it is properly valued for the time it's considered, but I don't think it takes a big enough picture.
So yeah, if there’s a stud guy they can draft and stash, go for it. But I think, when drafting guys for a championship-caliber team that still has holes, I would draft high-floor guys that can contribute with 1-2 years. I think that’s Singler. I think we should know what we’d get with him.
For every Omer Asik, there’s a Tiago Splitter (who’s been injured, but still…) he was more hyped, more ready and supposed to be a better ocntributor right away but just gasn’t been.
The teams’ have seemed to draft better lately, but there’s still your Alexis Ajincas, Joel Freelands… so I don’t know. Teams have been much more willing to scout and draft overseas players and take them in the late-first,early-second. It would be interesting to see how those would stack up.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 7:06 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That is an interesting article, but I have some questions
about how it rates the players. From what I can tell there is no accounting for efficiency. Players drafted in the lottery are more likely to start, and to get the green light to shoot, but that doesn’t always mean they are genuine stars.
Also, you are assuming that this year’s draft is no weaker than normal, but from everything I have read that is not the case.
Nevertheless, I cannot be certain you are wrong. I am just skeptical about your certainty that you are right.
efficiency is irrelevent to the point, especially considering that the article uses career numbers.
And from what I’ve seen, this draft is weak on star potential but not so much in terms of solid contributors/role players. It’s possible, and easier to find a quality non-star starter the higher you go in the draft
I agree and think that's key to what the Bulls "should" want.
If they concentrate and draft exactly what they KNOW they’re getting, they’ll have a better chance. If they try to draft for super star potential in the late lottery, that’s where a lot of busts seem to happen. Tyler Hansbrough migh disagree, though.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 7:16 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I can live with that.
As I’ve stated before, I think just about every year is considered a weak draft in the year leading up to that draft. 2009 was considered a weak draft but the 10-20 range produced Brandon Jennings, Ty Lawson, Jeff Teague, Jrue Holloday, Eric Maynor. Of course, it also produced Austin Daye, Terrence Wiliiams, Gerald Henderson and yup, James Johnson. But still, I like those chances.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
How do you call Iguadola an "ideal SG"
when he can’t shoot?
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
Iguodala*
TS% this year: .535
Keith Bogans’ TS% this year: .542
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
One - because I don't believe in single-season sample sizes like, apparently, you do.
Iggy career TS% – 55.6
Bogs career TS% – 51.4
Two – because I think his shooting percentage could increase, even if slightly, by being on a better team and a non-primary scorer. Bogans has always been on good teams and never a primary option. The one year he wasn’t, he stunk. Iguodala has almost always been the primary option. His first two years, when he was with Iverson, he had TS% of 58 and 59.5. The next year Iverson was traded, Iggy’s USG skyrocketed and his TS went down (a little). I see little reason to think that if his USG gets down to 15-18, his TS won’t be around 56-57.
Three – yes, ideal is the wrong word. I should have said “best realistically available SG the Bulls might acquire”.
Four – I don’t consider “shooting” the only requisite to being a good SG. Kevin Martin is a much better shooter than Iggy is (as is Korver), but I don’t consider either to be better fits at SG than Iggy because of their bad defense.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 3:17 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm not saying that I "believe" in single-season sample sizes
but after 60 or so games, you’re most likely going to shoot what you will during the course of a season, or a couple seasons. And that 5% difference is worth the $10M more that Iggy is going to make compared to Bogans? Not that I’m a Bogans supporter by any means, he’s just the current SG.
I’d much rather have Martin or Steph Curry if they could get him. Barring that, go young and find someone who can either backup Brewer if they’re going to hang onto him or someone who can produce better than Bogans for a relatively cheap price (DRose gonna get paid soon).
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Mar 9, 2011 3:36 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think it is. There is a lot more to offense than just just shooting.
For example, Bogans AST% = 9; Iggy’s = 26%. Bogan’s TO% = 11.8; Iggy’s TO% = 12.3. Iggy is better than Bogans at just about every aspect of the game of basketball OTHER than shooting. Shooting is important, of course, but it’s not the be-all, end-all or even an overwhelming factor when you’re talking about a guy who does so many other things well.
Being able to handle the ball and drive to the basket would be huge next to Rose. They need another player who can handle the ball regularly. I guess I’m just looking at a bigger picture than a single season (or two) and a single aspect of 1/2 of the game.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 3:55 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
especially considering bogans effectively never shoots
compared to a high usg guy like iggy
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Mar 11, 2011 1:39 AM CST up reply actions
What's so funny to me is
The same people who don’t want us to go for Iggy, are probably the same ones who want Brewer to start. Iggy is super-Brewer, meaning in every aspect of the game he’s better than Brewer.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 11, 2011 4:45 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
agreed
Maybe not quite the defender,but I don’t really know. I think it is true that whatever you say Brewer can do, you would probably say that Iggy is better.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Why is that inconsistent?
Bulls have someone who gives them most of the defense and some of the offense for a fraction of the cost. The massive disruption to this roster that it would take to fit his salary would, in my opinion, not be worth the upgrade.
Is it even possible assuming the cap stays the same? This is what rotoworld says the contract is: 2011/12: $13,531,750, 2012/13: $14,718,250, 2013/14: $15,904,750 (Player Option). 16 mil in 13/14? Sheesh.
by Heaper on Mar 11, 2011 5:30 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
because the bulls aren't a perfect team, but they're realy good.
getting better than really good means being great.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
EXACTLY!
I think Iggy is just as good, and can most likely be better than Brewer at D under Thibs. Don’t forget that Iggy was basically the defensive stopper on the World Championship team this summer. If Coach K thinks highly enough of him to put him in that role, I’m convinced about his defensive skills. And I can’t see any area on offense that, he wouldn’t be an improvement on Brewer.
The disruption in the roster really isn’t that great, we only Taj in a deal like that. Maybe you can include CJ as a loss, but I just don’t see how they aren’t replaceable. Vet PG’s like Earl Watson will be out there and I think we can replace Taj in Free Agency or through the draft.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 11, 2011 10:18 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
The Bulls are on pace for 55+ wins and the 2nd seed with a SG who can't shoot.
Might as well get someone who can defend, rebound and pass.
by Ozzie Montana on Mar 9, 2011 4:13 PM CST up reply actions
Exactly...especially after YaoPau's post.
We have a team that buys into Thibs’ system, are deadly on defense, and score more points than there opponents. We need to go for the best talent available.
He took his what to where?!
I think my ideal situation, would be...
…getting Wilson Chandler by not giving up anyone other CJ Watson, Keith Bogans, Kurt Thomas or Scalibrine and then using all of the draft picks to get back-ups. I don’t know if/how that’s possible.
A preferred lineup next year might be:
Rose – Nolan Smith
Wilson Chandler – Brewer – Korver
Luol Deng – Brewer – Kyle Singler (srsly)
Carlos Boozer – Taj Gibson
Joakim Noah – Omer Asik (some draft pick)
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 3:38 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
i like Singler's basketball IQ
but it worries me that he isn’t a better shooter and I have my doubts about his defense. Nice NBA body, but I don’t think the skills match up to the hype.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 9, 2011 3:52 PM CST up reply actions
I don't either, and that's why he's dropped off tremendously in the draft stock.
But I think as a late-first, early-second, he’s fine. I’ve watched him play a lot because Duke’s been so good and because my cousin is a crazy fan of theirs,and I thought you’d be hard-pressed to find a higher-floor guy to back-up Deng at the 3/4. Besides, while his shooting is bad/mediocre this year,it was 38.3 and 39.9% from the 3 the previous two years. So yeah, I don’t know.
I think it would be awesome (in a weird sort of way), if they drafted two Duke seniors back to back in the late first.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 4:07 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That's a lotta dookies
for one team. I like it, but that’s a whole lotta blue devil.
"What do you think, I just dunked my whole career?" Jordan asked Henderson after making a 3.
"You’ve got to miss eventually," Henderson told him.
"That’s what Cleveland said," replied Jordan
Its a lot of 6'9" Forwards from Duke
Luol Deng is confused as it is without adding Singler.
by JockstrapNoah on Mar 10, 2011 2:06 PM CST up reply actions
We need more 6'9 forwards from duke
I want our team to be ‘A 6’3 point guard from chicago’, ‘A 7 foot(?) center from Florida(assuming? I haven’t heard Noah’s intro), and then THREE 6’9 FORWARDS FROM DUKE.
It would be amazing. lol. Who goes out first? Who knows? Confusion!!
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
by Prevenge on Mar 10, 2011 6:36 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
all go out together
id hope.
it would be awesome
and i hate duke
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Mar 11, 2011 1:42 AM CST up reply actions
draftexpress says 7'0'' in shoes.
also, as a side note, noahs draftexpress card says noah’s “best case” is “marcus camby meets boris diaw” which is both funny and, to my mind (assuming that means defense and rebounding meets offensive versatility), pretty accurate aside from the fact that diaw has better range on his shot than noah.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
I think that's a potentially great team
Wilson Chandler makes so much sense. He plays hard, is at least a willing defender and is a threat from distance.
Only question is whether or not he can guard some of the smaller, quicker 2s, but with Brewer and Nolan Smith on the team, I don’t see that as a big problem.
I like the idea of drafting college seniors to be back-ups. Another possibility is Norris Cole from Cleveland St.
by JSB on Mar 9, 2011 4:26 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
if you're going for back-ups, i want high-floor guys like taj gibson
which is why I don’t understand james johnson, unless they thought he had a chance to be a starter.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I voted other
I believe an hybrid of your 1st 2 ideas would be ideal. I also would target Iggy in trade talks this summer. They have Turner, Holiday, Meeks, and Williams in their backcourt. All young guys, and with Holiday and Turner especially, players that they can build around.
If we can package Brewer, Bogans, Taj, and CJ along with Charlotte’s pick and our own 1st this year for Iggy, Meeks, and their 2nd this year. I would do it in a heartbeat. Philly would be getting a player they can slot in at the SF position, who plays great D in Brewer. A young, cheap big that they can replace Brand with. You replace Meeks with CJ, and they can cut Bogans to save cap space. Plus an extra pick in this year’s draft and a potential lottery pick with the Charlotte pick.
At this point, I’d rather have an all-around player and plus defender, then a shooter. Just think of the defense Thibs’ could throw out there with Iggy at SG. He shoots well enough to be a threat out there, and he can get his own shot.
That would leave us with holes at the backup PG and PF roles and we’d still have 3 picks in this year’s draft. Miami’s 1st, Philly’s 2nd and Phoenix or Utah’s 2nd.
With our 1st I would target Markieff Morris, who has been slated as between picks 15 and 25 in mock drafts. If he isn’t available, then I would turn to someone like JaJuan Johnson, or Keith Benson.
With the 2nd round picks, I would go after a PG and swingman. Some combination of Malcolm Lee, Demetri McCamey, or Darius Morris at the PG, and as a swingman, my options would include Klay Thompson, Scotty Hopson, or Justin Holiday
And sign a veteran SF to back up Deng, someone like Battier or Caron Butler.
In my perfect Bulls’ world, we go into next season with this lineup:
PG DRose / McCamey
SG Iggy / Korver
SF Deng / Battier / Holiday
PF Booz / Morris
C Noah / Asik
You sign a couple of vets looking to chase some rings to fill in the remaining roster spots. That team looks like it can score and defend pretty damn well. And is ready to go on a run of Championships.
yikes! i like it.
mccamey scares me, though.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Last year's McCamey scared me
The one who looked like he wanted to be the next Iverson. I admit I’ve only seen him a couple of times this season, because I’m in Big East / ACC country, but the couple of times I have seen him it looks like he’s much more under control. And I forgot to add Meeks to my depth chart at SG.
So the team would look like this:
PG DRose / McCamey
SG Iggy / Korver / Meeks
SF Deng / Battier / Holiday
PF Booz / Morris
C. Noah / Asik
by Ceasaleo on Mar 10, 2011 12:50 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Last year's McCamey scared me
The one who looked like he wanted to be the next Iverson. I admit I’ve only seen him a couple of times this season, because I’m in Big East / ACC country, but the couple of times I have seen him it looks like he’s much more under control. And I forgot to add Meeks to my depth chart at SG.
So the team would look like this:
PG DRose / McCamey
SG Iggy / Korver / Meeks
SF Deng / Battier / Holiday
PF Booz / Morris
C. Noah / Asik
by Ceasaleo on Mar 10, 2011 12:50 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
mccamey bothers me. ive only seen him play a few times, but he looks like a shorter greivis vasquez
to me. hes fat, he supposedly doesnt have a great work ethic, and he doesnt look like an nba athlete to me, which is kind of a pity as getting past your defender is pretty much a prerequisite in the nba for being a playmaker, the role that primarily recommends mccamey to our attention in the first place.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
Yeah, I don't think McCamey has a future in the NBA either
he’s just not that good.
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
yes.
i’ve seen guys put it together at some point in the league, but after watching him for 3.5 years, i just don’t see it in him.
Doesn’t seem very moral to me. Might as well take Satan’s autograph while you’re at it. - N.C.
he can put together good long-range shooting and decent passing along with below-average everything else to turn into Chris Quinn
Hooray, Chris Quinn
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
After the Bulls win the championship this year
They should redraft Dickey Simpkins
2011 Draft is generally viewed as a weak draft year
so I wouldnt waste assets like Taj and the Charlotte pick to trade up into it.
The Bulls could have 4 picks (2 1st and 2 2nds) in this draft, so I would try to consolidate some of those picks. Can they trade up to the teens with their 2 first rounders?
If the Bulls stay where they are, I do like Kyle Singler to backup Luol. With the other pick, I like Kemba Walker. I am still not sold on CJ Watson as DRose’s backup.
i'll be honest, I honestly can't think of a draft that was called "strong" going into that draft year.
A lot have been called strong when referred to in the year before, like “This year’s draft isn’t that strong, but next year’s is.” But then somehow, the next year, i always hear “it’s a weak draft, but next year’s is better.”
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 6:07 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
most pundits liked 03, as i recall.
07 as well
"Sportsmanship is just loser talk for losing."
by boyonthedock on Mar 11, 2011 1:44 AM CST up reply actions
03, yeah. that was a strong draft going into it. that's true
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't even need links, but if you can remember one that you think people referred to as "deep" or "strong"
going into that draft, I want to know.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Yeah, last year's
I didnt do a lot of digging, but this is what Andy Katz wrote about the 2010 draft in 2009.
“The one certainty is that the 2009-10 season will offer plenty of tantalizing stars for the 2010 draft. The tag “weak” won’t apply to this crop."
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=4288761
And this is what Marcus Spears wrote about 2011 draft in November.
“NBA scouts project the 2011 draft to be lean on top talent, and the pool of prospects could be even more shallow if some college underclassmen and international prospects don’t enter the draft for fear of a potential lockout. One scout likened this year’s class to the 2006 draft, when the Toronto Raptors took Andrea Bargnani(notes) with the No. 1 pick.”
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=mc-afterthebuzzer111210
I am not saying that the 2011 NBA draft will be awful, because the draft is a crap shoot anyway. I just think the Bulls should not trade known assets (like Taj) or future assets (like the Charlotte pick) for this draft.
That Andy Katz quote is exactly my point.
He says, in 2009, that NEXT YEAR’s draft will be strong. But then, when it came to it, you had likely lottery picks like Kyle Singler (he cost himself a ton of money going back, I believe), Jan Vesely and Donatas Motiejunas (two definite lottery picks from Europe).
here’s Ian Thomsen about a year ago:
I reached out this week to four NBA scouts for their opinions on the elite players in this year’s draft (assuming those players declare for it). They agreed on two points: That this will be a weak draft, and that three players at the top have separated themselves from the pack. Based on their analysis, I am now viewing this as a three-player draft, with a big drop-off thereafter.
The grass is always greener “next year”. “This year’s draft is weak.” is a common refrain.They may say next year’s might be good or bad, but they almost always say that “this year’s” is bad. That’s why I don’t put stock into what people are saying about this year’s draft being weak. Especially outside the top 10. It comes down to fit.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 6:53 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
i think Rose and Durant's drafts were considered strong
but generally the strength of a draft is judged by how good the top 9 picks are. At the Bulls position, I don’t think they are overly concerned about a weak draft.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 9, 2011 6:43 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, i thought of that as soon as I typed the above.
It’s usually about the top 5-10 picks whether a draft is strong or weak, or deep.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
How are only the top 5-10 picks considered
if you are considering the depth of a draft?
I'm not saying that's right, but I'm saying that's what people generally think about.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
b/c people aren't scouts
and if they don’t see a lot of big names in the first few picks they start to believe the depth of the draft sucks. They assume because picks 1-7 may not be all-stars that picks 21-30 can’t be quality NBA role players. Its a faulty assumption but it happens a lot.
I mean consider why the drafts of Rose and Durant were considered strong. Durant’s draft supposedly had 2 franchise players. Rose draft featured guys 1-8 who were college stars and who people thought would be impact players in the NBA.
I read article asking if Derrick Williams of the UofA was the #1 pick? I watch a bunch of UofA basketball – he isn’t a top 5 pick most years. The strength isn’t the same at the top so people think its weak.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 9, 2011 6:54 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Kemba Walker is not worth what the Bulls would have to pay to acquire him
He is going to be an early lottery pick. If the Bulls want to upgrade back-up PG, they can do so without expending a lottery pick. Remember that Watson is only playing 12-15 minutes. Walker would be doing the same, maybe even less. I can’t see Rose and Walker ever playing together for substantial minutes.
by JSB on Mar 9, 2011 6:37 PM CST up reply actions
There seem to be a lot of varied opinions on Kemba Walker
NBAdraft.net has him going 26th to the Lakers.
http://www.nbadraft.net/2011mock_draft
Hoopshype has him going 25th to the Bulls.
http://hoopshype.com/draft.htm
But Draftexpress has him going 7th to the Pistons.
http://www.draftexpress.com/mymock.php
Lets see how well he does in the tournament. If his stock skyrockets, then I agree that the Bulls should not trade up for him.
I can't see Walker not going in the top 10
a guy with that ability to score won’t last long. He reminds me of Gilbert Arenas.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 9, 2011 6:57 PM CST up reply actions
isnt he closer to a Ty lawson?
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
maybe in height
he is averaging 23 pts and 4ast though
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 10, 2011 5:20 PM CST up reply actions
fair enough
if Lawson slipped to 16 I can see Walker getting picked in the top 10.
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
yeah but Brandon Jennings went 10th
that is the more apt comparison. And Lawson was in a loaded pg draft, Kemba Walker is one of the few college players with name recognition
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 10, 2011 9:17 PM CST up reply actions
hes ben freakin gordon
uncanny ability to score, great feet and flexibility, cold blooded assasin….same size same questions on defense, maybe a bit more talkative is all
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
his ability to handle the ball separates him from
Gordon plus he isn’t near the shooter.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 11, 2011 2:39 PM CST up reply actions
i agree
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Lets be honest Walker is a 2 guard
and at 6 ft 1 with worse assist ratios then Tyrekes college numbers…we could be around late in the first to pick him up.
Did you guys hear about the new Lebron James Iphone?
You have to keep it on vibrate because it has no rings.
You're pulling that out of your ass
No way he last until the late 20s. Perhaps he falls out of the lottery. Even Nate Robinson went at 21.
The assist stats
???
No why would I make that up? He plays less PG then Tyreke, he is a 2 guard. (more of a pg then Watson though)
Did you guys hear about the new Lebron James Iphone?
You have to keep it on vibrate because it has no rings.
The part about him being around in the last five picks of the first round
No chance that happens. I agree he is a combo guard. But those guys still get drafted early.
Yea u R right
people are gonna draft the few “names” out there
Did you guys hear about the new Lebron James Iphone?
You have to keep it on vibrate because it has no rings.
I think it's just the new "scoring PG" league.
They used to be called combo guards. Allen Iverson was always called a SG. But now Derrick Rose is called PG. Is there much difference between the roles that Eric Snow and Keith Bogans have played? I’m not sure.
The olderish model was a SG who was your scorer and a PG who could bring the ball up and defend and distribute well.That was the mold Hinrich was pushed into. The new model (to me, at least),is to have a PG who can score from anywhere on the court, distribute okay and then a SG in the Bruce bowens/Keith Bogans mold.
So I think that’s why a guy of Kemba Walker’s size, but with his abilities, will get drafted early now, instead of in the late first/early second like a Gilbert Arenas or Jason Terry. Those guys would be Top 10 picks the past few drafts.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 11, 2011 5:23 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Thanks for the input
Did you guys hear about the new Lebron James Iphone?
You have to keep it on vibrate because it has no rings.
I just watched Alec Burks play against (shitty) Iowa State.
He had a bad first half, but an incredible 2nd half.
He had 29 pts on 16 shots, 14 FTA, 15 rebs, 6 asts, 3 stls and 1 block. He is fast and fluid and a very good athlete. After watching him, and looking more at his shooting stats, I think this year from three might be an aberration. He has a smooth, good-looking shot. He shot 35% from 3 last year not taking even one full shot less per game. He’s shot 77 and 82% from the FT line the past two years, indicating his a good shooter.
At just 3.2 threes per game, over 31 games, the difference between his 28.6% 3pt% this year and a more respectable 36% is nine shots. That’s one extra miss every 3-4 games. That’s relevant, but I don’t think it’s significant. I think by his third or fourth year, in the right situation, he’ll be a 35%+ 3-pt shooter. And I’ll also go back to Scotter’s thoughts from a few years ago that, for the best all-around player, it’s better to have a guy who can drive out of college than one who can shoot. He argued, and it made sense, that players are more likely* to develop a shot than a handle/driving ability.
I’m fully behind getting him if his “character” is right, which there is nothing to show that it isn’t (from my vantage point).
*not that it’s necessarily “easier” just that it’s more likely.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 9, 2011 7:29 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
more
Unlike most big-time scorers from small(er) colleges, Burks is a fairly unselfish player who is more than capable of making the extra pass. Even if he’s often asked to be the one creating and finishing shots for his team (particularly late in the shot clock), he’s a nice weapon to have in a half-court offense thanks to his solid court vision and good basketball IQ. When Colorado’s starting point guard goes to the bench, Burks will man the position, which is a good indication of the versatility he brings to the table.
Defensively, Burks is somewhat of a mixed bag, but he shows good potential on this end of the floor. With his good size, nice length, excellent lateral quickness and solid anticipation skills, he has all the tools needed to guard his position successfully in the NBA.
From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Alec-Burks-5819/#ixzz1G9jtQNvG
http://www.draftexpress.com
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Defensively...mixed bag
I saw him against Oklahoma @ OK. He didn’t challenge guys driving the lane when he was in a good position to do so. Like Bosh and Melo.
He took his what to where?!
Yeah, and watching him yesterday, he definitely took off a number of defensive plays.
But a large part of that was because he was already trying to get the offense started. If that’s intentional, then fine, it’s wha he, or his coach, thinks he needs to do and it can be almost certainly be corrected. If it’s just because he’s being lazy or trying to be offensive “just cuz”, then it’s more of a worry.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think you're right
when you say he was conserving energy on D for his offensive game. But I’ve seen him play multiple times (on TV and in person) and he always steps up his intensity at the end of games. If he was on a better team, he’d likely be a much better defender.
He’s the guy I’m hoping for most.
Yeah, I really think he'd be perfect, but the Bulls obviously won't get him without a major move.
I won’t get upset if they don’t do it, because it’s somewhat risky. But, as others have pointed out, we’re talking about guys that will be 9th and 10th on the bench next year. I know Taj is awesome on defense, I really do. And I know the Charlotte pick could be great, BUT, I think the two late-round picks aren’t worth much tothe Bulls, the Charlotte pick won’t actually turn into anything great, and Taj is replaceable, at leats in part or in some way, by guys like:
Troy Murphy
Carl Landry
Glen Davis
Josh McRoberts
Chuck Hayes
Craig Smith
Ike Diogu
Reggie Evans
Tyson chandler
Joel Przybilla
Nazr Mohammed
Kurt Thomas
Eddy Curry (hahaha)
Most are worse than Taj. Some are better. Some are different. Point is, he’s not irreplaceable in my eyes.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't disagree that Taj is replaceable
but I question the assumption that he would have to be traded in a deal for Burks. How are you figuring the trade value of a low lottery pick?
And from that list, considering what I think they might cost, I most like McRoberts or Hayes.
I have no idea what it would cost. I'm naming what I would be willing to give up.
I don’t expect many, if any, to agree with me. Out of context, two 2011 firsts, Charlotte’s first and Taj Gibson is way too much to give up for a SG that’s only going to get drafted in the 10-20 range. But, since I think Taj is replaceable with the players listed above and I’m leery of the Charlotte pick turning into anything more than a late lottery pick, and the Bulls are so stacked already, I think it’s worth it. Maybe it would take less. If they could give up only picks to get into that spot, that would be great. Or maybe they could pull a reverse Hinrich.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 10, 2011 9:26 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Other
Save the picks and take the best available player. See Asik,Omer
He took his what to where?!
This draft has very good depth at PF
I’d say that’s its biggest strength by far. Perhaps a dozen of the top 30 prospects are PFs. With the Bulls first pick, it’s possible that Markieff Morris or Kenneth Faried will still be there as teams above them go for more raw, project-type players. I think either Morris or Faried could step into the Taj role immediately to free up Taj for a trade. Also, I like Jon Leuer and Justin Harper as shooting PFs. It would be nice to have a big man who can stretch the floor. Harper is shooting a ridiculous 48% from 3 this year (68-142) and 61% inside the arc (139-229). Most mock drafts have Leuer and Harper in the very late first round to mid second round range.
I am quite skeptical that the Bulls could find a starting-caliber SG in this draft. Setting their sights a bit lower, an extra sharpshooter off the bench would be useful, and I think the draft can deliver in that respect. Just as Denver has 3 potential starters at the position who are set to be free agents, Ohio State has 3 potential backups in David Lighty, William Buford (junior), and Jon Diebler. All of them can shoot. Diebler is the least athletic but his historic recent stretch leaves him currently with the highest true shooting percentage season in the 6 years on record at Ken Pomeroy’s site (73.9%). I haven’t seen him in mock drafts, but he kinda reminds me of Korver. If Klay Thompson declares, he’s another reasonable option. I wonder if his recent suspension for marijuana possession makes him more or less likely to leave school early.
by from the window to luol on Mar 10, 2011 12:19 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
Late round 1sts are essentially worthless imo
The hit rate on those prospects is about the same as the hit rate on picking up D-League free agents. If we could somehow package them for a young NBA SG I’d do that.
I haven’t watched much college bball this year, but I’m surprised Singler’s stock has fallen this much. I don’t think he’ll be much in the NBA, but he’ll stick, and guys guaranteed to stick usually aren’t available in the 2nd round. Haven’t watched Markieff Morris at all, but if he’s really 6’10", with per40 stats of 22ppg, 13rpg, 2.5apg and a 29 PER for the #2 team in the nation, I’d like to know why he’s only projected to go 25th.
And I liked this quote by Bruce Weber after the Illini got crushed by Ohio State:
Asked what his team was missing this season, Weber said, “Lighty. If you have a Lighty, a heart and soul who comes every day and does what you need. We just don’t have that toughness, that leadership — that difference-maker.”
Lighty also can hit the 3, pass, dribble, defend, and he’s 6’5". Seems like someone the Bulls would consider.
very glad you mentioned both those guys. especially morris, who is a stretch 4 who can rebound, defend and pass.
like josh mcroberts, whom i like.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
i like the lighty idea very much because i think coachability matters more the better your coach is.
i could easily see a guy like thibs saying “ok david, youre our SG, so we really need you to do A, B, and C, and do them well” and a guy like lighty would make it his sole mission in life to do precisely those things. and in this respect it also helps hes a very nice athlete.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
I think coachability, character/work ethic, and high "floor" are qaulities the Bulls should and will look at.
The safer (but not easier) picks would be to stand stay put and take their high-floor, good-program, upper classmen, like:
David Lighty
Kyle Singler
Brad Wanamaker
Markieff Morris
Nolan Smith
Imam Shumpert (defensive wiz)
Tyshawn Taylor
E’twaun Moore
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Yeah, I realized after making the list, that I didn't stick to that criteria.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Yeah, I don't love him either.
I think he could maybe figure it out and be a good back-up, but I think he has a lot of growth to go. He’s not that fast or athletic as someone like Ty Lawson, and he’s just not that big either. I wonder if Ashton Gibbs would come out. He’d be awesome.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
ooo, i like shumpert too.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
"The hit rate on those prospects is about the same as the hit rate on picking up D-League free agents."
I’ll take your word for it that that’s true, generally speaking, but when you consider the track record of the Bulls’ FO (they’ve drafted well but haven’t really found anybody good out of the D-League), you have to alter your perspective, no?
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Mar 10, 2011 11:07 AM CST up reply actions
I don't think so.
The only late first they’ve drafted is Taj Gibson.Granted that’s 1 to none, but I don’t think it’s significant. I think 2nd rounders are different because of the non-guaranteed contracts, but even if you include it, it’s still Chris Duhon, Omer Asik, Jackson Vroman, Aaron Gray and JamesOn Curry.
I don’t think you can include Top 10 picks when someone specifically mentions “late firsts.”
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
That's true
But Pax’s overall drafting record has still been good. I don’t think you can say that making good decisions at the top of the 1st round has nothing to do with making good decisions at the bottom of the 1st round.
Pat Riley is the devil.
"nothing"? I'd agree.
But I doesn’t think it has as much of correlation. Top 10 picks are very likely to succeed. I’m not sure that Gordon, Hinrich, Thomas, Rose, Noah, Deng is definitively better than the average GM at getting production. Not so much that we would say he would definitely or even probably be better than the average GM at making late picks.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I disagree
If you look at those drafts, Pax got just about the best guy possible that he could have gotten in each of those drafts. That’s definitely not the norm.
No complete busts in the top 10 either. His biggest mistake was Thomas over Aldridge.
by JSB on Mar 10, 2011 4:02 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Okay, then we'll look at all of them.
Gibson over Blair
Johnson over Lawson, Holiday, Maynor
Sefolosha over Ronnie Brewer
Thomas over Aldridge, Roy or Gay
Gordon over Iguodala
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
"Just about the best guy possible"
Jesus. If you pick any GM in the league they aren’t going to be perfect. And we’re talking about degrees. Also if you read what I wrote, it was about top 10 picks. The Johnson, Sefolosha, and Gibson picks weren’t included.
At points in time Gordon was arguably better than Iguodala.
Sefolosha and Brewer are basically a push. Really not that huge of a difference there.
I acknowledged the Thomas miss. Johnson was a miss as well.
Gibson vs. Blair, not really a huge difference either.
I know you said top 10 picks but that's already out of the original discussion.
If we’re going to use the Top 10 picks to evaluate drafting ability by a GM when discussing the late-first round picks… I don’t understand why you would eliminate the 10-20 picks. I don’t understand the logic behind that one.
“If you pick any GM in the league they aren’t going to be perfect.” That was my point!!!! Paxson has not been perfect. And he hasn’t been significantly better than the “average” GM to say that we should dismiss the averages of busts in the late part of the first round. If only 1 in 10 late firsts turns into anything more than a role player (9-12th man), I see no reason to think Paxson would outperform that, as Polo initially advised. I’m not saying Paxson is a bad drafter, and I hope that’s not what you think, but it does seem like that.
Sefolosha is a non-factor on offense. Brewer hasn’t been. It’s not a wash.
I’ll give you Blair and Gibson. Blair’s been a lot better on offense, Gibson on defense. But since Blair is 4 years younger, he’s still the better prospect. But I give it a wash.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think Paxson is better than average
I agree that his 10-20 draft picks shouldn’t be dismissed. But when I made the statement that he hasn’t missed, we were talking about his top 10 picks.
He also seems to do better picking established college stars rather than players that projects. All his misses fall into the latter category. Although Johnson and Thomas were pretty good college players, they were drafted more on potential.
Another thing to consider. Perhaps both Thomas and Johnson weren’t necessarily bad picks, just that the coaching staffs failed to properly develop them.
I agree that Brewer is better than Sefolosha. But, considering that Sefolosha is a rotation player on a very good team, I don’t think you can call him a bust.
I trust that Gar-Pax will get rotation players at the back-end of the first round.
by JSB on Mar 10, 2011 10:41 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't think you're giving Paxson enough credit
Granted, we haven’t really introduced any data. But, I think that no total busts, and only 1 miss out of all his top 10 picks is pretty good and probably above average.
Thabo is a key rotation player for a top 10 team. That’s not too bad for where he was picked. I agree Brewer is better, but it’s not like Brewer is miles better. It’s close.
Another thing to consider is that with his two biggest misses the coaching staffs inability to develop might have had something to do with the failure.
Finally, Gar-Pax have done best when picking established college players, rather than projects. That’s probably the type of player that they would be getting with those late picks.
I went back and looked
I’m not sure one should be so dismissive of the possibility of finding someone at the back end of the first/ beginning of the second. Looking at picks 25-30 with approx 5000+ minutes
2001: Wallace, Dalembert, Tinsley, Parker, Arenas
2002: Salmons, Mason
2003: Delfino, Perkins, Barbosa, Howard
2004: Allen, Martin, Vujacic, Udrih, Varejao
2005: Petro, Maxiel, Kleiza, Lee
2006: Farmar
2007: Brooks, Afflao, (Landry was 31)
2008-2010: not many have reached 5000 yet but plenty certainly will.
Some good names there. I believe that it is completely reasonable to believe that the bulls (with their record of good drafting) will be able to hit with at least one of their picks with a rotation back-up.
Interesting
That 2001 draft was unreal. I went back to check, and the 25-30 picks were better than any group from the first 9 picks, haha.
I think draft picks should be judged based on whether they provided positive value to the teams that drafted them, since that’s what we’re hoping with the Bulls picks here. Gerald Wallace and John Salmons look like great picks in retrospect, but they didn’t do anything for the Kings or Sixers. Carlos Delfino and Roger Mason eventually found their niche, but that was after leaving the Pistons and Bulls. So in my opinion, it’s more like:
2001: Dalembert, Tinsley, Parker, Arenas
2002:
2003: Perkins, Barbosa, Josh Howard
2004: Tony Allen, Kevin Martin, Varejao, maybe Udrih
2005: Lee, Maxiell, Kleiza
2006: maybe Farmar
2007: Brooks
2008: Batum, George Hill
2009: Taj, Douglas
2010:
That’s 18 guys and counting in 10 years, and the hit rate was much higher from 2001-2005 than from 2006 on.
In comparison, NDBL/undrafted guys since 2001 who’ve stuck on NBA rosters include Chuck Hayes, Chris Andersen, Wes Mathews, Haslem, Calderon, Morrow, Alston, Barnes, CJ Watson, Tolliver, Joel Anthony, Simmons, Barea, Azubuike, Reggie Williams, Wafer, Udoka, Dahntay Jones, Moon, and I’d give maybes to Amundson, Will Bynum, Mikki Moore and Smush Parker.
Looking at all that, I think you’re right. The upside of a late 1st round pick (I’d take Parker, Arenas, Josh Howard, Lee, Martin and Batum over anybody on the undrafted list) makes it worth more than nothing. I’m not sure where I got the idea that hit rate was the only way to judge value.
by YaoPau on Mar 10, 2011 5:19 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
Yeah..
but if we are searching for a player to fit, what you are saying about the NBADL may be correct, all of those players work in the NBA because they found a spot where they can succeed; every single one of those guys is flawed in some way.
Basically, what I am trying to say is I wouldn’t draft a high floor guy with my late draft picks based on your logic. It seems the benefit of having a draft pick versus using the D League is you get guys with better max potential who have some knock against them. If we want to scour for a high floor backup, we should just get better scouts into the D League.
by Basketball on Mar 10, 2011 6:34 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
um... aren't there that many in college?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
No, I mean how many NBDL players are there that get shots on NBA rosters
I think YaoPau’s argument here is that you are as likely to find a contributor off an NBDL roster as from the last 10 picks of the first round. HIs basis is that there are as many contributors out of the NBDL as there are out of the last ten picks of the first round.
How many NBDL players per year are given opportunities on NBA rosters each year? Seems like the hit rate is probably a lot higher on the draft picks.
well, there certainly aren't hundreds that get called up
there have been 18 late firsts out of 100 that have stuck in the nba. How many NBDL guys get called up every year?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
How many are there that are at least on summer camp rosters?
This isn’t really an apples to apples comparison. But, I think my point stands. You can’t just point to the number of NBDL guys on rosters and say it’s just as easy to get a rotation player from the NBDL as with the last 5 picks of the first round.
by JSB on Mar 11, 2011 2:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
but you've shown nothing to the contrary, you've just stated it.
(I understand that’sall YaoPau did,too) Forgive me for not being convinced.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
How much do you value upside?
Even if you grant that low picks have a slightly higher bust rate than dleague (which I disagree with though you’re right that that has not been proven one way or the other in this thread), don’t you feel like the chance to get a more talented player factors in?
I don't want them drafting "high upside" guys.
I’d rather they draft high floor guys.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I never made a definitive statement
I have neither the time nor the desire to find the answer. Actually, I wonder if the data is even available.
No, I mean how many are there that get shots at an NBA roster
I think YaoPau’s argument here is that you are as likely to find a contributor off an NBDL roster as from the last 10 picks of the first round. HIs basis is that there are as many contributors out of the NBDL as there are out of the last ten picks of the first round.
How many NBDL players per year are given opportunities on NBA rosters each year? Seems like the hit rate is probably a lot higher on the draft picks.
a few points
I’m not sure I agree that we should limit our look to impact on first team. The question for me is whether there’s more talent in the last five rounds of the amateur draft than there is floating around the dleague. It’s not how capable that team is at recognizing that talent.
I think we have to assume that if the bulls front office draft someone who can be successful in the league, the coaching staff will play them. Without that assumption, Pax could draft MJ 2.0 and you wouldn’t count that as a hit if for some reason he were not played.
Your point is well taken though that for what the bulls are looking for (value during the rookie deal) maybe we should limit our look at those first 4 years of the rook contract. If that’s the case I think you have to bring back Wallace, Salmons, Vujacic, Petro and absolutely Afflalo. Also, if we are opening up 2008/2009 for speculation, you should add Darrell Arthur, Donte Greene, Rodrigue Beaubois, and Wayne Ellington. Probably others too since it is still early.
So that’s 29+ guys in 9 years by my count, some who are all-stars/future a-s. Frankly, I think that that blows the dleague list out of the water is terms of both depth and upside.
Actually, more than anything, going through all this has convinced me that taking a shot with these picks at filling in the gaps of our team makes the most sense. There seems to be way more talent down there than I realized. At least enough that it may not make sense to trade half the team for a marginal sg upgrade.
I've been mentioned his name for a few years now.
Honestly, I thought he was a better player than Turner.
great post by the way, tyger. i always like your take on the draft.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
thanks
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
While doing "outlines" today, I hope to see the following teams play over the next couple of days:
Kansas: Morrises (PF), Taylor (PG), Selby (PG/SG) (don’t like him, but, meh)
Colorado: Burks (SG) (he’s soooo fun to watch)
Duke: Singler (SF/PF), Nolan Smith (PG/SG)
North Carolina: Harrison Barnes (SG/SF), Zeller (PF/C), Henson (PF) (not that they need big men)
Pitt: Wanamaker (PG), Gilbert Brown (SF
Mich St.: Lucas (PG) I’ve watched him a lot, and he doesn’t impress this year, but he has impressed me in the past
Ohio State: Lighty (PG/SG/SF), Diebler (SG)
Washington: Justin Holliday (SG)
Probably won’t see all of them, of course, but I want to see a few good ones.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
What ever happened to Durrell Summers?
I see he’s not on your Mich St. watch list. That guy always went off during their tourney runs.
Yeah, he and Kalin Lucas have gone.... somewhere.
Summers does not impress me much.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
At this point, I don't think Selby will be entering the draft
He’s been pretty bad lately, and he’s barely even played down the stretch for the Jayhawks this year. His stock will most likely decrease, and with Kansas losing two of their starting guards next year, he will be starting for the whole year. He’s got a great attitude about everything though.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Mar 12, 2011 11:53 AM CST up reply actions
Harrison Barnes
I watch alot of acc ball, and Barnes has really been fantastic lately. His 3-pt dagger at the buzzer to beat FSU (tear) was an exclamation point, and just a hint of what I think is to come in the tourney. Basically he has his shit together now and I think he’s going to really impress soon. If he leaves, I would not doubt at all that he’s a top 3 pick.
I hope so. I like him.
On draftexpress.com, they have him mocked at 13, and I think that’s ridiculous. If the Bulls could move up to 13 and take him, I couldn’t imagine they wouldn’t give up something of value to get him.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
2011 nba draft will be weak
but it probably will be weaker if Barnes and some of the other college players decide to stay in school………i think the bulls should keep their 2 first round draft picks and draft the best player available(sf, sg, pf), wait and see who comes out.
This draft is going to be strong.
Not a lot of stars but a lot of really good players.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I agree
The draft is weak where the Bulls have no picks (top 5) and strong where the Bulls have lots of picks back-half-of-the-second round. I see no reason the Bulls can’t get two rotation players out of their 2 firsts and 2nd round pick.
Those are very high expectations, but to each his own.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I haven't been able to watch enough NCAA ball this yr to make an informed opinion...
on the quality of players being drafted, so my parenthesis just were meant to reflect that. I have no idea but the experts keep calling it weak. But it’s not tourney time yet, and we don’t even know who’s going to be in the draft, so I’m not really listening to predictions as of right now.
I'm going to be completely biased just because I'm watching him play, but Alec Burks is the real deal.
He might be playing himself into the Top 10. I don’t think his outside shot will be a problem. He has poor mechanics, not always getting square, but I wonder if, as he adds more strength and can spend time with NBA coaches, that he’ll straighten it out. He has a knack for getting the ball in the hoop. And he’s a very, very good free throw shooter.
2 mins into the second half, in 3 halves of the BigXII Tourney, he’s got:
47 pts
58% FG (15-26)
2-4 3pts
15-18 FTs
17 rebs
9 asts
5 stls
2 blks
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Has he rotated into the lane and leveled someone trying to drive to the basket?
He took his what to where?!
I don't think there is any room for any rookies in the rotation
Sure as heck don’t want a rookie pg as a back up
SG won’t produce better than Korver/Brew combo
the rest of the positions are accounted for. You move these first rounders (don’t want the guaranteed money) or stash em overseas.
Ideally, we trade for an Iggy, or sign Jr Smith (after checking to see if his priorities have improved)
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
I don't think you need to stash them overseas.
If there is someone that could be great, fine. I do agree that there probably won’t be any minutes ofr the guys next year, andI know the Bulls don’tlike to use the D-League, but I think that would be a great option. Then they have guys getting playing time that could come up for back-up roles if starters or back-ups get hurt. I’d rather have rookies with potential in 3rd PG, 5th big role next year than Keith Bogans or Kurt Thomas. Keither Bogans minutes should be given to Brewer, Watson and Korver, and only if one of those guys or Rose get hurt, would your rookie even be dressing.And that’s fine because he’d still be the fourth guard. And Asik should be able to fill in as a starting C if Noah or Boozer gets hurt.
Otherwise, if you don’t prepare for the future, in 2-4 years when all those guys are leaving, you’re having to find rookies to get major minutes or trying to find cheap veterans. the guaranteed money is minimal for late 1st draft picks.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 10, 2011 5:31 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That's exactly why I say mix and match
As much as Burks is growing on me, he won’t be ready to start over Brewer or Korver next year. So there’s no need to package Taj and the 1sts to move up for him.
We should go after Iggy hard, in my opinion it’s a nobrainer, but Martin would be fine too. Whoever you go after make the package revolve around Taj, the Miami pick, our 2012 1st, and the Charlotte pick. Just make sure you get 2nd rounders for this year and next, along with your SG.
That way at the end of the day, you still have our 1st, and 2 early-mid 2nd round picks to fill in as youth to develop. And I’m confident that we could come out with at least 1 solid contributor.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 10, 2011 11:34 PM CST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
harrison barnes would be a godsend at the 2 spot considering what we have
i hope he stays in that 5-10 range. we can definitely nab him if we give up some picks + taj or asik
The ultimate fan experience is no longer courtside seats, it's Keith Bogan's job.
many people here are underrating Taj
unless we get a top 5 pick out of it, not worth Taj, who will be backing up Boozer and covering for his horrible defense for years to come
Where 79-44 lead turns into a 4 point loss Happen(ed)
As much as I like Taj
He can easily be replaced, if he needs to go to get us an actual player at SG, then he’s gone.
Agreed
Taj is good. but he’s not irreplaceable. Especially on a championship-caliber team with resources. There are loads of guys who, although not identical to Gibson, are within his range of overall win-contribution that the Bulls could afford (this ignores any changes that could occur in the CBA)
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Look at the teams in the Top 10
None of them need Taj, and Asik isn’t going anywhere. Plus, why would they give up a top 10 pick for 2 late 20’s, and some future lottery pick(maybe)? The only way I see the Bulls trading up in the draft, is if a player they really like falls into the 17-20 range. Barnes definitely won’t fall that far, and I’m starting to think Burks won’t either.
new orleans did it last year with aldrich and the thunder.
the thunder had to take on one year of mo peterson’s contract, which the Bulls can definitely do. Maybe not in the Top 10, which I’m certain Barnes will go in, but in the 11-15 range, I could see a team giving up that pick if they get picks back and can get rid of aa bad contract.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think our best range to trade up is 14-20
I don’t know of any bad contracts any of those teams may have though.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 11, 2011 5:24 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
so does no one else like justin holiday for the bulls
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzxpYfLHtIc
above i posted the draft express link, he seems perfect for the bulls, a high floor, good character and does the things the bulls need out of the sg position (defend and shoot) his inability to handle the ball might refrain him from being the ideal starter, but a younger more athletic bogans would be a nice pickup from the draft no?
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Mar 11, 2011 4:32 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
He's in my Iggy plan(look further up)
One of those 2nd round prospects, the Bulls should definitely look at no matter what they do before.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 11, 2011 5:01 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
sure took him a while to get good though. and really, he hasnt even been that good. 19 PER
for a senior is not impressive. i agree there are things to like about him (he can shoot, rebound, defend and doesnt turn the ball over) and he does remind me a little of paul george (who is having a good rookie season), but he also reminds me of wes johnson, who isnt very good.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
as a 2nd round pick
you’d fall over yourself to find someone with Wes Johnson’s potential. I hyped Holiday up thread too but his potential to disappear in college games scares me. Still as a 2nd rounder, there could be worse.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 14, 2011 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
strictly second rounder
what about say pick 25-28 (which is about where the bulls would be slotted) i think holiday is going to be one of those players that a team like the spurs likes to draft. Good hard working guy with established skills, not much upside but he will fit a role and compliment your own pieces. Its why i sort of like him for the bulls. I dont know if he will ever pan out as a true starting sg for the bulls, but he could contribute for the bulls right off the bat, and fit a role on this team at the sg spot, even if its a reserve role, almost a seamless transition, and while it wont make the bulls much greater, it would improve them. I guess at this point id rather have something like that then have to deal with another potential project like james johnson or tyrus thomas. I dont think this organization or coaching staff has the patience for those low floor high cieling type guys. Ill take a guy who can contribute meaningful minutes and just try to trade for someone by the next trade deadline
(for example if it turns out hes as good a shooter as kyle korver for the bulls, but better at defending, maybe you trade kyle korver taj gibson and a future first to go after someone capable of starting at sg)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Mar 14, 2011 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Nobody has mentioned Jimmer Freddette
He scored 52 points tonight, making 7 3 pointers and only 1 free throw.
Please don’t tell me he’s another Adam Morrison.;
I ;would love to see him in a Bulls uniform.
If you can't answer a man's arguments, all is not lost. You can still call him vile names.
Elbert Hubbard
by Tyrusmancrush on Mar 12, 2011 12:08 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
There are mixed reviews about how he projects as an NBA talent.
I think he can be JJ Reddick, I won’t go as far as saying that I’d love to have him, but I wouldn’t decry it. I think he can contribute, but a lot has to go right.
"What do you think, I just dunked my whole career?" Jordan asked Henderson after making a 3.
"You’ve got to miss eventually," Henderson told him.
"That’s what Cleveland said," replied Jordan
I'm surprised nobody has spoken of OSU's wonderful cast of guards.
Buford, Lighty, and Diebler are all great shooters, Buford probably being more of a rebounding guard than a defender, and Diebler is most likely the bes shooter, but he’s not very athletic. David Lighty can do all of those, but is a very streaky player. I’m going to say Buford is the best bet of those three.
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Mar 12, 2011 11:56 AM CST reply actions
Buford would be most likely in the late 20's
You must have me confused with someone else, I have never been to Chicago.
[whispers] I sexually assaulted Scottie Pippen in 1997.
Our pick is in the late 20's...
never forget...
1.7%
anything is possible...
by wrigleyrocker12 on Mar 12, 2011 3:10 PM CST up reply actions
I was agreeing with you
Taking Buford would most likely occur since the pick is in the late 20’s
You must have me confused with someone else, I have never been to Chicago.
[whispers] I sexually assaulted Scottie Pippen in 1997.
by DocPepper on Mar 12, 2011 3:16 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Lighty has been mentioned a few times here.
I’d be surprised if Telly ever played in the NBA.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 12, 2011 3:05 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
yes
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Who am I? I’m the motha-fuckin virgin surgeon.
by NittanyCub on Mar 13, 2011 1:33 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Seriously, though, does he not look EXACTLY like him?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Yea they do
At first, I was like is that him all grown up? Then, I realized how old the movie was and axed that idea. Maybe, a little brother though lol
by Ceasaleo on Mar 13, 2011 12:42 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Singler or JuJuan Johnson seem most probable-
finally in position to take a senior in the late 1st
then maybe Lighty with the 44th
I don’t think this team needs to trade picks at all to try and get a development project in the lottery
You must have me confused with someone else, I have never been to Chicago.
[whispers] I sexually assaulted Scottie Pippen in 1997.
I'm skeptical on Singler
He just doesn’t seem to have the skill set to be a rotation player in the league to me. He’s not quick enough for the SF position and he’s not even close to being strong enough to be on the block. He can shoot and he’s smart, but will that be enough?
by Ceasaleo on Mar 12, 2011 6:50 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Currently watching the Vandy-FL game
And it makes me think the Bulls will end up with an “intangibles” guy like Chandler Parsons
You must have me confused with someone else, I have never been to Chicago.
[whispers] I sexually assaulted Scottie Pippen in 1997.
by DocPepper on Mar 12, 2011 3:11 PM CST via mobile reply actions
I mentioned him earlier in this thread
As a strong candidate for a second-round selection. I think he could be a really nice SF/PF for the bench, defending, rebounding, and shooting the three.
Watching the Heat-Memphis game
and its making believe that OJ Mayo wouldn’t be such a bad fit in Chicago. If you could get him for draft picks, cap space and Bogans (who contract isn’t guaranteed) I think you have to do it. He has enough scoring/shooting ability to keep defense’s honest, he doesn’t need to dominate the ball, he can pass ok and handle the ball pretty good.
I don’t know how much Iggy will be available in Philly. He is playing so good right now – if you can get him, go for it. But I think they’d be crazy to trade him.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 12, 2011 3:19 PM CST reply actions
Don't think we can.
Memphis GM hates the Bulls.
"What do you think, I just dunked my whole career?" Jordan asked Henderson after making a 3.
"You’ve got to miss eventually," Henderson told him.
"That’s what Cleveland said," replied Jordan
i think its the owner, not the GM
his hate makes zero sense.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 13, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Almost forgot about OJ
I think he would be my 2nd trade target, after Iggy and before Martin. Maybe by the summer, they won’t be so stuck on getting a big, and just looking to dump salary in order to resign ZBo and Gasol.
If that’s the case, send them Bogans and our 1st this year and the Charlotte pick.
I think Iggy will be available, they didn’t trade him this year because they needed to keep him to make a playoff run. But, they will have to get rid of either/or both of Iggy and Brand. I would think Brand’s contract is the harder one to move.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 12, 2011 7:01 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
What about this lineup?
Rose – Watson – Imam Shumpert
Mayo – Brewer – Korver
Deng – Brewer
Boozer – McRoberts – JuJuan Johnson
Noah – Asik
(assuming they trade Taj, if they need to) Is this team better or worse than last year’s team?It’s definitely younger.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
i like the lineup
assuming you can work Mayo into the rotation with no disruption. i wouldn’t assume they’d take on Taj though. How much better than Darrell Arthur is he really? I think taj is a better fit with Gasol and Randolph, but Arthur has some skills.
by Basketball Smurf on Mar 13, 2011 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions
True. They are very similar.
I like four-man rotations up front, but maybe they don’t. Gasol, Randolph and Arthur have gotten the vast majority of minutes at PF & C. Taj is cheap for one more year. And I do think you could work Mayo in. If he’s the only change to the starting lineup for next year, why not? Korver is used to being on the bench, and if you tell Brewer he’ll still get his 25-30 mins backing up SG/SF, I wouldn’t think it would be that bad.
What I think would be “special” about this lineup, if it doesn’t work next year, you could probably trade Boozer + Watson + Brewer + Korver to get possibly a stud PF or C. All those unguaranteed contracts would be enticing, I’d think. Maybe take Duhon, Richardson, etc. off the Magic’s hands to get Dwight. I don’t know.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't know how good this team is compared to the current one, but that starting lineup is unstoppable.
Who scores on this team?
Rose – Duhon – Shumpert
Mayo – Reddick
Deng – Richardson
Noah – McRoberts – JuJuan Johnson
Howard – Asik.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't think you need to or should give up Taj for Mayo
At this point, Memphis has already played it’s cards by bungling the trade at the deadline. Yes, they were trading to get McRoberts, but he’s an expiring. They were really trying to shed salary.
Resigning ZBo and Gasol is their objective. So at draft time sending them Miami’s pick, our 2012 pick, and the CHAR pick plus Bogans (non-guaranteed) should get it done.
Oh and get some 2nd’s, I think they’re hidden gold.
by Ceasaleo on Mar 13, 2011 3:33 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Before Tyger takes us too far in the future
If we can’t use the picks to grab a SG and have them to use. Then I think it would probably be better to try to trade up for a targeted player. But who would the Bulls target?
Do you trade up for Alec Burks, Markieff Morris, or Nolan Smith? If not them who?
by Ceasaleo on Mar 13, 2011 3:54 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Harrison Barnes would be my number one choice, but the Bulls don't have the assets to get him.
Especially if he puts up another good game or two.
Alec Burks is my guy. I’m pretty sad CO didn’t get into the tournament so we could see him play more. But maybe a deep run in the NIT does just as well. I think he’ll develop above-average handles for a NBA SG, and I think he can puton10-15 lbs. He’s got a 6’10 1/2" wingspan at 6’5 1/2" tall. I think the biggest things he lacks are shooting and defensive consistency. On the former, I think his free throw shooting and 3pt% from last year are just indicative. I think a reduced role and NBA shooting coaches will make him a 35+% 3 pt shooter in the NBA. And Id like to think Thibs could get his attention on defense.
Burks is the only one I trade up for unless I think Morris or Smith can turn into a starting-caliber PF or SG, respectively. Otherwise, I don’t give up “that much” for back-ups. Burks may only be a back-up, too, but I’m confident he has a higher ceiling than the other two. If they can’t move up to get Burks or Barnes, I think I’d be fine with them taking chances on guys like Travis Leslie, Iman Shumpert, JuJuan Johnson, William Buford and the like and hoping one of them pans out as a back-up.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
His choices for us are GARBAGE!!
If we stood pat and ended up with McCamey as our 1st pick and Buford as the 2nd, I think I’d be highly upset.
Looking at his draft that Miami pick should be Nolan Smith. And then, whoever their favorite SG prospect was no matter where he was slotted. It looks like from his draft, that the Bulls’ would have first dibs on the SG’s after Barnes and Burks. I like Holiday in that scenario, but I guess Buford would be ok too.
Colorado got jobbed.
I won’t get to see my new-found hero Alec Burks.
On the other hand, my bracket was saved. I probably would have had Colorado going a round (or two or three) further than they should have if they had made the tourney. Now, they’ll win the NIT.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
look at the brightside
he won’t have an opportunity to increase his draft stock (making it slightly more possible he lands with the bulls)
Doesn’t seem very moral to me. Might as well take Satan’s autograph while you’re at it. - N.C.
Ridiculous upside
You underestimate the allure of the unknown. Now his flaws will be less exposed and people will think about the upside…Oh the upside!
But seriously. I feel (that is I have no evidence) that athletic versatile guys like Burks are probably not going to be hurt that much by not being in the tourney. I am guessing he’ll be a workout stud and the fact that he’s 19 will certainly get people (at least pundits) excited for his future.
By the way, you should know better, the bulls only draft players in the final four.
"Had to leave my own open thread. Felt dumbness and meanness rising inside me."
I love YFBB
by Jamaicanpi on Mar 15, 2011 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Does this mean Notre Dame is going to make us get Hansbrough'd?
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
Why not take a look at Hansbrough?
I’m sure he isn’t even projected to be drafted but he looks to be a pretty damn good ball player. He can obviously shoot the ball well and can also handle the ball well, and I would imagine that he would completely buy into Thib’s defensive philosophy. Why not take a chance with a second or pick him up in FA after the draft?
True
probably not hurt by not being in the tournament, since these types will probably do well in workouts/measurements/etc., but the tournament is a great opportunity to increase draft stock. See generally, Thomas, Tyrus.
Doesn’t seem very moral to me. Might as well take Satan’s autograph while you’re at it. - N.C.
Just like how I slotted BYU into the Final 4, eh?
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
Yeah, I go to Creighton and there are a ton of Mormons in the law school.
I’m trying to get them into my gambling bracket (it’s working, somehow!) and I hope they all pick BYU. And that BYU goes out early of course. :)
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 15, 2011 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I am not a mormon
I just have a desire to watch teams that are almost completely talentless except for one guy go far. Davidson was pretty awesome. :P
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
Kenneth Faried
First I’d say that picks are nice assets to move around and get what we need. I don’t think many guys in the draft will be able to step in and help, and I hope we stop with drafting projects that will never be developed. I also don’t think Thibs seems to be a coach interested in a raw player. They should stick to guys who can add a piece or two off the bench.
One guy that interests me is Kenneth Faried out of Morehead State. Some have called him Rodman 2.0. While he wouldn’t start, I think he could be a nice backup PF who could give strong rebounding and defense off the bench. This would in turn make Taj expendable in a trade for a better SG.
I think when you’re a good team, the goal of the draft should be getting cheap backups. Taj is a perfect example of that. Not only is he valuable on the court, but his contract is great for now. A SF would be nice too off the bench, and I’d also be interested in any guard who can shoot 3’s coming off the bench.
Faried would be awesome.
Agreed with this idea.
I only post cotton candy. Because it's delicious.
If they had a complete starting lineup, I'd agree.
As it is, they have a gaping hole at SG. The guys they have will be gone in 2 to 3 years. As I mentioned, if they can trade their assets for legitimate two like Kevin Martin or Andre Iguodala (or others, if one were to make the case), I’d be for that first. On the other hand, they can’t sit around do nothing, because they, almost certainly, won’t have the cap space to bring anyone in the future. It will have to come from within. If they have a chance to get a player that can eventually start, they have to go for it.
And as I also said above (somewhere), because of the way the contracts are structured, the Bulls essentially lose nobody next year, so there’s no need to draft someone who can come in and help right away (unless they were to trade Taj, Brewer, Korver, etc. for a better player, of course).
My “ultimate” lineup three years from now is: name – age in 3 years
Rose – 25; Wanamaker – 24
Burks – 22; David Lighty – 25
Deng – 28; ?
Noah – 28 (with an improving jump shot); McRoberts – 26
Asik – 27; ?
If the team’s current level a play isn’t a fluke (which, I don’t think it is by more than a game or two, if at all), then I see no reason that they couldn’t be title contenders over the next 2-3 years and then CONTINUE to be so over the next 3-5 years.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
You seem to be under the impression that Noah's jump shot is improving to the point where it's almost good
I can’t say I agree. He hit 43% from 16-23 ft last year, but that was over a pretty small sample and he’s back down to 35% from that range. Plus, he has a slow and low release which makes it easier to close on him, which further limits his floor-spacing ability.
Pat Riley is the devil.
well, the Bosh, Garnett and Boozer all shoot at 45% or lower.
Maybe he is a true 35%, but if he just takes 3 jumpers from that range per game and makes 35-40%, I’m good with that. Boozer only shot 38, 44, 46, 38, 41 from that range the past 5 years and taking about 3.0 – 3.5 attempts per game. If he can make 35% on four attempts per game, I think that’s enough to get him “respect.” Your point about his release is taken.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Mar 20, 2011 7:38 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
God I hope not
I watched the entire Michigan-Duke game (Michigan fan btw) and basically all my opinions about Singler were strongly reinforced by what I saw. I just don’t see what talents he has that make him any better than a D-Leaguer. He definitely doesn’t have the skills to create his own shot at the NBA level and he doesn’t have the size/athleticism to ever become more than an average defender. He’s got a nice quick release on his jumper, but he’s not an elite shooter by any means. I think you’re looking at the next Brian Scalabrine except instead of being a fun sideshow/good locker room guy, Singler’s a whiny prick.
I like what I saw out of Nolan Smith though, especially on the defensive end.
Pat Riley is the devil.
I would have said the same thing if Hansbrough hadn't been coming on lately.
In the right situation, I think Singler could thrive. Maybe not a starter, but definitely a 3/4 tweener back-up. At least I think so.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't buy the Hansbrough comparison at all
Hansbrough was a dominant scorer in college. He had an extremely polished post game and was a .600 TS% player who averaged double-digit FTAs/40 min. That ability to get his own shot has translated to the NBA and is what makes him a valuable player.
Singler, on the other hand, has never come close to demonstrating that type of offensive prowess. Go to draft express, check out his TS% and FTAs/min and compare them to Hansbroughs. Hansbrough was simply on another level, statistically.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Mar 20, 2011 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'm holding my opinion on Psycho T for now.
The league will adjust and I want to see how he does after that.
"What do you think, I just dunked my whole career?" Jordan asked Henderson after making a 3.
"You’ve got to miss eventually," Henderson told him.
"That’s what Cleveland said," replied Jordan
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
NBA Playoffs Content Module
Related FanPosts on Blog a Bull
Related FanShots on Blog a Bull
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Shaquille O’Neal is in a Chinese beer commercial, too (VIDEO)
- ‘Deep Thoughts’ and Cheap Thoughts: San Antonio Spurs vs. Oklahoma City Thunder
- C-a-C: This is probably as close to LeBron James working with John Waters as we’ll ever get
- Dwyane Wade’s hot pink pants: The kind of thing you can get away with when you drop 41
- Lamar Odom to New York? Dwight Howard on the move? For now, it’s all talk
