Shouldn't the Bulls be the frontrunners for Dwight Howard?
Nice to have the NBA back (unofficially) and nice to do my first fanpost in months.
Anyways, before I get to the main part of the post, I just wanted to throw a few things out there...
1. I like Noah and Deng, any upcoming trade hypotheticals are not a knock on their game.
2. You guys are sick of reading about stupid hypotheticals like Boozer and Bogans for Howard, so I will try to make my trades logical.
3. This is all contigent on Howard agreeing to an extension with Chicago. But if he would go to the Nets or Clippers, then why not Chicago. It's a big market, he's friends with Rose, chance for a championship, etc.
With all that being said, Chicago has to do anything possible outside of trading D Rose to get Howard. That duo would set the franchise up for multiple positions, and having 2 of the top 5 players in the NBA is a no brainer. Now that's not brilliant anaylsis, I think most people would agree with that, so the question is why isn't Chicago the frontuunner?
ESPN reported the other day that the Nets are preparing an offer of Brook Lopez and two first rounders for Dwight Howard, plus they will take back Turkoglu's contract. Now this is by no means a done deal, but if this is a leading offer, than the Bulls could blow it out of the water. A lot of people are speculating that the Lakers will offer something like Bynum and Odom for Howard and Turkoglu, but I still think the Bulls could make a better offer. I'm biased, but tell me if I'm wrong.
Trade 1: Joakim Noah, Luol Deng, and Taj Gibson for Howard and Turkoglu. The Bulls can also throw in 2 or 3 first rounders, including the Charlotte one that will be good in about 2 years. This trade is about a million dollars off in the ESPN trade machine, but tha trade machine doesn't reflect the new trade rules.
-Orlando would get two good pieces in Noah and Deng, a promising/cheap player in Gibson, and draft picks for the future. Thats better than Brook Lopez who is a slightly above average scorer, but a weak rebounder and defender. I also think it's better than Bynum/Odom becuase Bynum is injury prone and Odom is starting to get old. Plus the Charlotte pick the Bulls could include would be good, and the Bulls could throw in a guy like Nikola Mirotic if necessary. Additionally, after the Magic amnesty Arenas and get rid of Turkoglu here they would have no horrible contracts on their team.
Trade 2: Joakim Noah, Luol Deng, Carlos Boozer, and Kyle Korver for Howard, Turkoglu, Redick, and Quentin Richardson. Bulls also include some first rounders mentioned above.
-Orlando immediately gets 3 starters to go along with Jameer Nelson, they get some pieces for the future, and is a playoff team. The problem with this deal for Orlando is they are taking back a lot of cap, but except that Boozer deal, none of them are bad contracts. Plus Otis Smith has traditionally paid tons of money for his team.
Trade 3: Joakim Noah, Taj Gibson, Omer Asik, and Ronnie Brewer for Howard. Bulls would also include the first rounders I mentioned above earlier. -This one is unlikely, but if Orlando doesn't want Deng or Boozer's contract then they may want do this.
I sincerely believe that deals 1 and 2 specifically are better than any other offer that the Magic will get for Howard from the Lakers, Nets, Knicks, Mavericks, Clippers. I only mention those teams because those are the realistic places that Howard would consider signing an extension, but if the Clippers offer Griffin then all bets are off.
For any fans that think the Bulls are offering too much in deals 1 and 2, all I can say is that the opportunities to trade for once in a generation Centers like Dwight Howard are pretty rare. As for how the Bulls would look after lets say deal 1 because that is the best offer in my opinion, they would be great.
PG: Rose, Watson
SG: Brewer, Korver, Jimmy Butler
SF: (Richardson, Prince, Caron Butler), Turkoglu
PF: Boozer, Thomas
C: Howard, Asik
The Bulls could still get a scorer with the MLE, and then they could sign another big man for a little more depth. I think that right there is a title team though. This may all be an unrealistic dream, but I'm not sure why. Let me know what you guys think.
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My heart says yes, but my head says no
The facts:
1) The Bulls can compose one of the best (maybe the best) offers for Howard
2) Dwight’s going to LA (70 / 30 Lakers)
I just don’t think Dwight wants to play in Chicago. The weather, the women, and the org are problems.
My heart says no!
screw this trade! Howard is an oversized man-child and I will not support anything that he does!
We have our core. Any trade that breaks up the Noah/Deng/Rose trio should be off of the table. At some point you have to stop salivating for superstars and start playing actual basketball. Let those jokers in Miami and NYC put together superteams and watch them crash and burn because they do not have enough depth. Chicago is in the team building business and we should not knock this over now that we are one piece away. I will not watch a year of Rose + Howard + scrubs putzing around and pulling a disappointing first round exit. I will watch the Bulls win a championship THIS season. No superman required.
by THEKILLERWHALE on Dec 5, 2011 5:16 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Partially Right
Here’s my issue with that though. I actually like how the Bulls created a team properly with defined roles, and I hate what the Knicks did. But the Bulls would have two superrstars and not just a bunch of scrubs. If deal 1 were to happen then we still have Boozer, Asik, Korver, and a guy we can sign at the MLE.
There are ways for us to take the Arenas contract off their hands if they want...
You can do something like…
JoNo, Booz/Deng, Backups, picks
For
Howard, Arenas
And I think they’d take it.
They need to take on about $18mil if they trade Howard.
They can either take crappy benchwarmers and bad draft picks, or they can take a decent core starting with JoNo.
Salary
I think the Bulls would rather take back Turkoglu than Arenas, plus Magic will amnesty Arenas.
if they can find someone to take Arenas contract, they will jump at it.
if they amnesty him, they are still on the hook for his contract.
it took the wizards to take on rashard lewis
for someone to take Arenas.
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
maybe a three team trade
where that third team gets deng and sends expirings to orlando?
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
Given the proclivity Christians seem to have for
waiving their wieners at people, I don’t see what difference that makes. I think Howard is one of the nicest pro-athletes around, but he probably also has a normal NBA sex life too.
To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch
by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Dec 6, 2011 9:56 AM CST up reply actions
srs?
I always thought of him as having a Grant Hill persona off the court.
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
by hedonism bot on Dec 6, 2011 12:29 PM CST up reply actions
Who whips it out for porn stars
Maybe he was trying to spread the word, and that’s where the word was written.
by runningman on Dec 6, 2011 10:47 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
links?
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
by hedonism bot on Dec 6, 2011 12:29 PM CST up reply actions
Even Christians doink the team cheerleader
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:48 AM CST up reply actions
Never
bet against chicks in bikinis
And Van Gundy is on the bottom of the pile!
by Jud Buechler on Dec 4, 2011 11:50 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Fuck those sauceboxes.
We could give him rings.
Or he could go to LA and get the clap. We got that here too.
by Dogfishhead on Dec 5, 2011 12:06 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
meh, then he can enjoy gettin his ass kicked by the thunder in the playoffs
kobe is getting old and so is freekin pau gasol. Odom is prob going to be involved in this trade as well as bynum.
maybe we can get pip to throw in his wife
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Dec 5, 2011 12:30 AM CST up reply actions 5 recs
we cant trade boozer
hes part of the lure for dwight. there was some articles last season that were written about how boozer and dwight are good friends supposedly. (from team usa and booz living in miami in the offseasons)
i still think dwight will wake up. adidas will get in his head. big market. championships. chance to create a legacy.
Should've traded for Melo.
by sin on Dec 5, 2011 12:31 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
Yes Boozer iz a lure, at least until you have to play with him.
by adocarbog on Dec 5, 2011 9:48 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
umm...hmm...the more people that boozer lets by
the more blocks there are for howard to get?
Should've traded for Melo.
with our frontcourt depth we could make a GREAT offer
but who knows how its received…thats why i hate this early FA bullshit
...and we're back
I'm all for throwing anything but Rose for Howard
It’s a superstars league. I know that’s an overstated phrase, but I would be all for rebuilding around those two even if it meant we aren’t as immediately good as we are now. I would think it would be a one step back, two step forward kinda deals.
eh it was a cannon-armed quarterbacks' league until tebow won a million improbable games
we’re coming off a finals where a bunch of tough veterans beat the superstar team. id at least hesitate to blow up such a good core
...and we're back
by paddyfairview on Dec 6, 2011 12:42 PM CST up reply actions
Yes but
I can’t see that happening.
To me it is clear that Rose wants to be the alpha dog, the way Rose played last FA period
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 5, 2011 7:20 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Alpha Dog
I’m glad Rose has that mentality but if he were to reject the Bulls doing a trade like this solely because he wants to be the alpha dog then that is selfish. Plus Rose would still handle the ball as much, and probably take nearly as many shots, its just that Howard would improve D/rebounding and would be an offensive threat
if anything Dwight would make Rose look better
when he feeds him in the post, he’ll hit his shots, improving Rose’s assist totals. Not that that will happen.
by NerdVernacular on Dec 5, 2011 8:23 PM CST up reply actions
I don't think he would reject. It's just that he would not fight for it or bow down
and Howard also wants to be the alpha dog. And rightly so
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 6, 2011 7:33 PM CST up reply actions
Rose would still be the Alpha dog
esp in crunch time, end of games, because of Howards ft%
by Trey23 on Dec 5, 2011 10:06 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
One can always dream
Something on the order of Noah, Deng, Gibson, the Charlotte first, and the rights to Mirotic for Howard and Turkoglu seems like a pretty good offer, actually. (We might have to throw in a bit more – maybe Korver or Brewer- to make it work salary-wise; I haven’t checked.) If I were the Magic, I would probably prefer that to the alleged NJ offer of Lopez plus two firsts. (How good will those firsts be if Howard and Williams are both playing for NJ?) I would definitely prefer it to any LAL offer that did not include Gasol as well as Bynum and might even prefer it to the sorts of offers LAC might be in position to make. It has also crossed my mind that the Bulls apparent interest in Caron Butler makes even more sense if they are entertaining the thought of trading Deng. From the Magic’s point of view, however, I can well imagine them wanting to get Howard out of the East even at the cost of accepting a slightly worse deal. And from Howard’s point of view, he might just prefer LA to Chicago. If he wants to win, a lot and for a long time, teaming up with Rose and Boozer (reportedly a good friend of his) would probably make the most sense. So far, however, there is very little that seems to indicate that such thoughts are on his radar.
by thelivingant on Dec 5, 2011 9:26 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Sam Smith thinks the Bulls has the best to offer (as always)
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 5, 2011 9:44 AM CST reply actions 3 recs
I like Sam's offer better
Noah/Taj/Deng and a pick for Howard/Bass. That’s enough. You might think that more is needed to get a superstar, but that trio is far superior to anything anyone else with a team that could be attractive to Howard will offer ORL. The Lakers, Knicks, Nets and Clippers can’t touch that offer.
There is no question about Dwight’s talent, but I have a lot of questions about his desire to be an NBA champion more than having a home in a warm climate. I’m not interested in anyone doing a sales job on the city of Chicago or this Bulls team to Dwight Howard. You really have to question the motivation of someone who would rather play in LA with Kobe’s ghost and Mike Brown over playing in Chicago with Rose and Thibs. If temps in the mid-60s > championships, then LA can have him.
by Stay Chisel on Dec 5, 2011 1:13 PM CST up reply actions 5 recs
Me too
Of course I would rather see the Bulls give up less and still get Howard. It just seems unlikely to me that the Magic would make a deal that did not involve a combination of high first round draft picks, a promising player or two on a rookie contract, and significant salary relief in addition to some established players. The Charlotte pick is likely to be a good one, Mirotic is at the very least intriguing, and whoever gets Howard is quite likely to have to take the corpse of Tukoglu in the bargain. My point is just that the Bulls are in position to make a very competitive offer. This point may be completely moot, however, since Howard may not want to come here and the Magic might rather get him out of the Eastern than take the best offer.
Howard will be a UFA so ORL will have little leverage
So I think the best they could hope for is a haul of legit starters. Asking for starters, picks and cap relief will be too much when Howard can just walk away for nothing. If Howard had years left on his deal, what you are suggesting would be more likely.
I hope that you are right
It really depends on what others are willing and able to offer; especially those teams with whom he would agree to sign an extension. I can imagine the Clippers offering quite a bit, for example. At the end of the day, though, if the Magic were willing to trade him to Chicago and he would agree to sign an extension with the Bulls, I think that the Bulls should give them whatever it would take to get him (short of Rose). If they can get him for less than I fear might be needed, so much the better.
Leverage
They do have some leverage though because they know that if Howard walks in FA, then he wont be able to sign with the teams that he wants to because those teams wont have salary cap room. Only like the Nets would.
True
If he’s not traded, he’s going to give up significant money and an extra year on his next contract. They widened the gap between what your old team and new team can pay you, from what I’ve read of the CBA.
That said, the Nets are not a bad consolation prize. Even better, if the Clippers don’t give DeAndre Jordan an extension or sign any significant FA contracts, they’ll be able to give Howard the max too. With Dwight and Blake as a tandem they can increase tickets 50% and sell out every game. They’ll only have 24 million in guaranteed contracts next year, while keeping Blake, Eric Gordon, Al -Farouq, Ryan Gomes, Eric Bledsoe, and Mo Williams. If I was the Clippers, I’d try to sell Orlando on Jordan, Kaman, and Aminu for Dwight, and find a way to take back Turkoglu if needed. They also have Minnesota’s unprotected 2012 first round pick.
Howard can be signed and traded after this season
He has to exercise his out clause on 7/1/2012.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
Consider the tax rates
Just by going to California Dwight Howard will give back 10% of all salary earned to the state. It’s 4.5% in Illinois. It’s 0% in Florida. Does he care about this? 10 million for bikinis? 10 million for LA’s exposure to the far east?
The Magic have a pretty good shot at using Howard to rebuild into a contender right away. The Lakers just don’t have the pieces to make that happen.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:36 AM CST up reply actions
It's not quite that much
since half of their games are on the road. It is significant, though. One of the best writeups I’ve seen on the subject is here.
by runningman on Dec 6, 2011 11:17 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Holy smokes.
Very interesting read – I didn’t know about ‘jock tax’ before.
To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch
by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Dec 6, 2011 11:43 AM CST up reply actions
WTF if he just wants a warm climate and doesnt care about rings why is he leaving Orlando???
...and we're back
by paddyfairview on Dec 6, 2011 12:44 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
The only thing he has said is that he wants to be in a position to win championships.
That is literally the only thing he says whenever anyone has asked about his contract situation in the last year and a half.
yeah i was just pointing out a stupid argument
all these guys are gonna stick to the company line, who knows what they want
...and we're back
by paddyfairview on Dec 6, 2011 12:52 PM CST up reply actions
As far as I can tell, there is absolutely no hint that Howard is interested in Chicago.
And apparently there have been lots of hints that he is interested in NY or LA.
he doesn't have a NTC
you trade him this season, Chicago has this season and the next to coerce him into an extension. And as sam smith point out, all championship ready teams aren’t going to have the cap space to sign him outright.
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
i thought this is his final year on his contract?
If the Bulls get him this year, they get to offer him an extra year, 5 year extension.
BUT
Orlando will not trade him to Eastern conference.
If he does go to LA, whos’ to say Bynum won’t leave and choose where he wants to play when he is 24 years old?
That's a big gamble to take.
And financially, there’s no real reason for Reinsdorf to take it, and lots of reasons not to do so.
Is there a reason
we would have to give them Deng? I would think Noah, Taj and picks would be attractive enough. Deng is a pretty key piece for us, overpaid or not, especially when we are often going to be facing Lebron and Melo deep in the playoffs in the future.
by tomas21 on Dec 5, 2011 1:09 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
lol
Melo?
The Knicks are going nowhere. They are going to be easy outs in the playoffs. They don’t have the roster to compete at both ends. The Celtics bounced them with a flurry of activity at both ends.
The Knicks are playoff pedestrians.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:32 AM CST up reply actions
The Bulls may not be among the frontrunners for Howard, but possibly the sleeper
Per Woj’s article:
What’s more, the Chicago Bulls are still a sleeper for Howard, several league executives believe. "Chicago may tell Orlando to take any two players – or three – besides [Derrick] Rose," one GM said. Howard isn’t keen on the cold weather, but the Bulls would have the best point guard-center combination since Magic and Kareem.
The Bulls have Omar Asik developing fast as a potential replacement for Joakim Noah should the Bulls include Noah in a package. Noah would have to be a part of it, but would a combination of Noah and Luol Deng or Carlos Boozer – bringing back Howard and one of those bad Orlando contracts – be enough? The Magic need a force to replace Howard, an anchor.
by bryield on Dec 5, 2011 1:44 PM CST reply actions 3 recs
I really don't understand the weather of a particular city being such an important
aspect for a player to sign/being traded to that team. Like some people have already pointed out, if your concern is more about weather and fame than winning a championship, than you’re not really that dedicated to begin with.
You play half of the games on the road, and when you’re at home you’re not going to be spending that much time hanging out, unless you don’t give a shit. I don’t think Jordan or any of the other greats gave a shit about the weather of the city, they dedicated all their time on improving their game, pushing themselves to the limit, making their teammates better.
I’m all for getting Howard though. But who would replace Luol if he gets traded? Would Thibs start the rookie or would the F.O. sign one of the vets available from free agency?
On the J.R. Smith bandwagon until otherwise advised.
by BlackStar on Dec 5, 2011 3:27 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
Caron Butler?
If they sign Caron Butler, he would be the obvious candidate to replace Deng. The Bulls can’t make a pitch for Howard until later in the season, however. (Noah would almost surely have to be included in any deal and he is a base year compensation player until sometime in January, I think.) Which may be fine, because most people assume that Orlando will not be willing to deal Howard until after the All Star game. And anyway, Howard has given no indication that he would be willing to sign an extension with Chicago.
Does anyone else just feel like caron butler:bulls as mike miller:heat?
I have this serious feeling that if we sign him, he’ll end up injury plagued and we’ll regret not going after someone more reliable. The Boozer bag injury may have traumatized me.
There are the guys who get you the need baskets," says Bulls reserve forward Brian Scalabrine, referring to the vital hoops that stop runs and close out games. "I have a different word for killers. I call them mother-------. And right now, Derrick Rose is the baddest mother------ in the league by far. He is the reason we win.
Dwight is a baby when it comes to the weather
That’s why
"Violence is not always the answer."
"Violence is the question, and the answers always YES!"
Maybe thats why guys like Butler and Hill
are getting talked to
WCG's Resident Nickelback and Boy Band fan
Also rated Worst WCG Blogger by Dr. Steven Schweickert's extensive "Total BR" (Blogger Rating)
"Oh Dilfer, give me the strength...
to be as bad a WCG Contributor as you are an announcer/authority on anything. Peace be with you. " (JoetheBoss)
If the Bulls acquire Dwight Howard
replacing Luol Deng will be like replacing Chris Harris.
Focus on what the Bulls have to beat – the Heats. Any team that gets Dwight Howard and improves his FT% to around 80% acquires an unstoppable player at both ends.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:30 AM CST up reply actions
just to link for those who didnt read the full
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-wojnarowski_chris_paul_dwight_howard_lakers_120511
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
also, Omar Asik makes me sad because its definitely Omer.
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
id be so sad if we lost noah for dwight
but so happy at the same time..just would feel weird seeing him pumped up in a magics uni or us winning w/o him
MIA cuz I just got a ps3....BONG!
Howard isn't going to LA, he's going to HOLLYWOOD
This guy LOVES being on camera, plus his girlfriend is a musician so of course wants to be in LA for her stuff too. Howard (although not douchey) is a pretty Hollywood-guy, I’ve seen him going to the Lakers for two years.
Howard is going to LA, pretty much the Shaq migration
by J Flash on Dec 5, 2011 4:55 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Remember when the players went where they want to go
and not their freaking girlfriends wanted to go?
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:27 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
his pimp hand is not as strong as his overall arm strength
which is way he want to throw the ball down instead actually dunk it when he took off from the free throw line.
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
by hedonism bot on Dec 6, 2011 12:31 PM CST up reply actions
Can we trade Noah now?
Thought w/ his BYC we had to wait until Jan. 15 or something like that.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Dec 5, 2011 5:32 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
um....very good question
and you may be right.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 5, 2011 7:12 PM CST up reply actions
From the 11/26 memo
Base Year Compensation (BYC) in connection with the Traded
Player Exception is eliminated, except in sign-and-trade
transactions. Trades of players who otherwise would be subject to
BYC prohibited until January 15. Criteria for whether a player is
subject to BYC same as under 2005 CBA.
Continued from the Salary Cap FAQ
71. What is the Traded Player exception?
As described in question number 70, exceptions are the mechanisms that allow teams to function above the salary cap. Any trade which results in the team ending up over the salary cap requires an exception. This is true even if the team is moving downward in salary. For example, if the salary cap is $50 million, a team has a team salary of $55 million, and they want to trade a $5 million player for a $4 million player, they still have to use an exception. Even though their team salary would be decreasing by $1 million, the fact that they would still be over the salary cap ($54 million) means that an exception is required.
The Traded Player exception is the primary means used by teams over the cap for completing trades. It allows teams to make trades that leave them over the cap, but it places several restrictions on those trades. Trades using the Traded Player exception are classified into two categories: simultaneous and non-simultaneous. As its name suggests, a simultaneous trade takes place all at once. Teams can acquire up to 125% plus $100,000 of the salaries they are trading in a simultaneous trade. For example, a team trading a $5 million player in a simultaneous trade can receive one or more players whose salary is no more than 125% of $5 million, plus $100,000, or $6.35 million in return.
A non-simultaneous trade may take up to a year to complete, but the team can only trade away one player, and can receive no more than $100,000 more than the salary they trade away. Non-simultaneous trades are described in question number 72.
In short:
A simultaneous trade gives the team more money but less time
A non-simultaneous trade gives the team more time but less money.
But wait! There’s more!
76. What is “Base Year Compensation?” How does base year compensation affect trades? Why does it exist?
Base year compensation (BYC) prevents another salary cap loophole. Without BYC, a team over the salary cap that wants to trade a player, but can’t because of the Traded Player exception (which says teams can’t take back more than 125% of the salary they trade away), could just sign the player to a new contract that fits within the desired range, then do the trade. BYC says “if you re-sign a player and give him a big raise, then for a period of time his trade value will be lower than his actual salary.”
BYC defines the salary that’s used to compare players for compliance under the Traded Player exception (see question number 71 for more information about the Traded Player exception). Usually the salary used for comparison is the player’s actual salary. But under either of the following circumstances, a different salary is used when comparing salaries for trading purposes:
The team is over the salary cap, used the Larry Bird or Early Bird exception to re-sign the player, and the player received a raise greater than 20% (unless it’s the minimum salary).
The team is over the salary cap, it extended the player’s rookie scale contract, and the player received a raise greater than 20%.
If either of the above apply, then the player is considered a base year player. A player remains a base year player for six months, or until June 30, whichever comes later. When trading a base year player, the salary used for comparison is the player’s previous salary, or 50% of the first-year salary in his new contract, whichever is greater.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
What I don't get is... why does the Jan. 15th date exist?
Is it a calendar-year thing?
Any chance they allow an exception to the exception due to the lockout?
This is the most I’ve thought about anything in a while.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
IDK about the Jan 15 date
That’s 30 days later than it was under the previous CBA. It must be some sort of adjustment for when the season was expected to start when the memo was drafted.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:25 AM CST up reply actions
On paper, sure. But Dwight doesn't want to come to Chicago.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 5, 2011 5:44 PM CST reply actions
Quote him
Show me a quote where Dwight Howard says he doesn’t want to come to Chicago.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:26 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
would be sad to see Noah go if it did happen
i can care less if Deng or taj got dealt.
Headbands not allowed
I think Dwight
is thinking about the super models he will be hanging out with at his pool in LA and the irish girls stumbling out of neighborhood bars in chicago.
Does this bring into question his dedication? Sure, but what would you do….
And Van Gundy is on the bottom of the pile!
or
dwight to lakers
cp3 to knicks
dwill to clippers
rollin’ with bogans in chicago
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 5, 2011 8:50 PM CST up reply actions
hell yeah, we still be rollin with Rose's homeboy Bogans
please make this the new tagline
GarPaxDorf need to keep it cool. Just call Otis Smith and say:
We are not pursuing a trade for Howard. See what you can get from nets or lakers and if you like that do it. If you don’t then call us, tell us what you are getting from them and we’ll see if we want to top that.
We just won 62 games. We don’t need an overhaul but will take Howard if the price is right. I don’t think we want Rose-Shit-Shit-Shit-Howard as our starting lineup.
by adocarbog on Dec 5, 2011 9:46 PM CST reply actions 4 recs
Wrong
The whole point is that we wont be Rose Shit Shit Shit Howard as you so eloquently put it. Lets say Deal 1 happens, we would still have Boozer at the 4, a guy like J Rich or Butler that we get with the MLE, and then a guy like Brewer at the 2.
Howard could not beat Zasa Puchillia
SO what makes anyone think he can win it all as the best player?
If he wants to win, create a legacy and have Epic battles against the Heat, he should consider the Bulls.
He absolutely annihilated the Hawks. Your boy Jason Richardson and the rest of the Magic wing players shit the bed.
But I forget on BlogaBull the only superstar who does no wrong is Derrick Rose. Everyone else is mentally weak or a prima donna.
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 5, 2011 11:58 PM CST up reply actions 5 recs
Yes, Dwight certainly controlled those games
more to it than points and rebounds, let me go check the stats……
3 assists the whole series. THE WHOLE SERIES
less than 2 blocks per game.
33 Turnovers
So yes he gets his share of blame, and yes the Magic wings sucked
by Trey23 on Dec 6, 2011 12:12 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Players need to make shots in order to get credit for an assist. Unless you want to watch the whole series again, some of that blame lies on the wings.
Less then 2 blocks per game against a team that does nothing but shoot contested jumpers seems on target.
I’m not exonerating Dwight and nothing annoyed me more than the idiots on the Magic blog who acted as if he was a flawless player. But he more or less did his job and Nelson, Redick, Arenas, Hedo and Richardson all crapped out.
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 6, 2011 12:31 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Fair enough
I can’t argue about the poor shooting, and not a big fan of SVG’s offensive philosophy
by Trey23 on Dec 6, 2011 1:07 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't know
3 assists is pretty damning especially with the amount of minutes Howard plays and how much the ball is in his hands. Guys get 3 assists in 6 games on accident.
by Basketball Smurf on Dec 6, 2011 10:58 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
In two of those 6 games
Howard played all 48 minutes too.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 11:03 AM CST up reply actions
The assist thing is bad
but it’s impressive as hell that he played all 48 minutes. Is there another center in the league that can play 48 and still be effective?
ORL perimeter players shot in the 30%s in that series. Assists only happen when shots are made.
He also gets quite a few hockey assists as his pass goes to the perimeter and then is kicked around the arc to another person who is also wide open.
The Magic's best play in the series was the game where Howard played the least number of minutes
The Hawks had a great playoff run last year. They were pretty good against the Bulls too.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:19 AM CST up reply actions
Lakers
I don’t think there is any doubt that the Lakers are the biggest competition for Dwight, and I hope they get Chris Paul. They would have to trade Bynum for that cause I heard the Hornets won’t just take Gasol. That would limit the competition and make Chicago the favorite in my opinion.
If Orlando had any balls
they would not trade him, let him serve out his contract.
Now, if he wants that extra money he has to stay with O
Thats why Carmelo was fuming to get traded before the deadline, it allowed him to get a bigger contract.
I would only trade him for an all-star that wants to play for Orlando.
That's Why Your Not A GM
That’s pretty dumb, if Denver just let Melo walk they would have got cap room, but now they have a lot of young pieces, even though many are in China right now.
young pieces, even though many are in China right now.
so they’re working in sweatshops then?
"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Dec 5, 2011 11:36 PM CST up reply actions
Thats not what Im talking about, I liked the trade they got for melo
Orlando cannot trade him for non allstars, or any players that will be able to leave in 1-2 years, leaving them with nothing.
Bynum for Dwight is not a good trade for Orlando. Better than nothing I guess.
My point is for management to take a stand and not allow players so much control.
Doesn’t Orlando then play one year without howard and suck, get a top 10 pick and have 20 million under the cap?
The players have control
Every GM in the league is looking at the Lebron/Bosh/Wade moves only to realize that the players run the show. The players sign the contracts. All the GMs can do is present them with contract offers.
Then factor in Chris Paul and the alleged trade demands from a team that is owned by the other 29 teams in the NBA.
The owners may not lose as much money anymore with the player give backs, but they control very little of player movement in the long run.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:14 AM CST up reply actions
I would discount all rumors of trades made by the Hornets
The team is owned by the NBA. Trading Paul to the Lakers would kill the Hornets. The Lakers have nobody that can maintain whatever value is left in the Hornets in exchange for Paul.
The Magic are another story.
Frankly, the Lakers biggest worry should be the Clippers. The Lakers have a marquee brand to protect with Kobe at 33 and no other stars in the making. They need another established or budding star. The Clippers on the other hand are in the drivers seat to remake the Southern California basketball market with a superstar highlight machine and 20 million dollars in cap space.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:23 AM CST up reply actions
MAKE IT HAPPEN. I SAID MAKE IT HAPPEN GODDAMMIT

"And thank you to God for making me an Atheist." - Ricky Gervais
by MichaelClutchtree on Dec 5, 2011 10:16 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
No! We have to keep Deng!
remember that during the Kobe trade rumors?
“I like Kobe……but Deng is improving!”
by Trey23 on Dec 5, 2011 10:34 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Fuck lebitch, Fuck wade
Dwight ok
"Violence is not always the answer."
"Violence is the question, and the answers always YES!"
Just noticed that
I didn’t realize the trade machine didn’t use previous/current record as a baseline for that calculation.
can we haz blake griffin as well?
Let us cavort like the Greeks of old! You know the ones I mean.
by hedonism bot on Dec 6, 2011 12:32 PM CST up reply actions
Plus 36 wins?
Is that T-Mac math?
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 6, 2011 8:03 PM CST up reply actions
i say try shooting for howard by offering deng and boozer
or deng and noah. seriously, the bulls can still sign another player even after this move. Sign a SG….and boom! you got a sick 1-2 combo that not even Wade-LeBrom combo cant even match
well, i would assume we would have to take a big contract in return to even out the salary
shoot, i dont want Hedo!
Deng + Noah + Charlotte First Rounder
The Magic are going to want a present and a shot at the future. Howard is the most valuable trade piece in the NBA if he commits to a contract extension with the destination club.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 6, 2011 10:10 AM CST up reply actions
The org is too stubborn
they aint gonna blow up all thier genius, just to chase Howard.
Lu-Deng Clan Aint Nuttin ta Fuck Wit !
This is really a tough thing
To be honest, any of these trades do not guarantee a Bulls Championship by any stretch. In fact, the Bulls will be a year behind the Heat essentially. Rose/Howard will need time to gel and Thibs defensive system will basically need to be reimplimented. That said, it’s still a no brainer. Best trade I can think of that the Magic might actually take would involve Noah,Gibson, the rights to Mirotic, the Charlotte Pick, another pick, and any combination of Brewer, Watson, Korver, and Bogans it takes to make salaries match for Howard and Hedo. I just don’t see the Magic taking on Deng’s contract or Boozer’s. It is still a better offer than any other team can make. Noah is better than Bynum. Gibson is starter quality. Mirotic could be very good as could the Charlotte pick. They wouldl actually get some young players to replace Howard as opposed to Bynum and some elderly people.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
so
we’re left with howard, boozer, deng, mvp, and some mle candidates? you sure that doesn’t guarantee a championship?
at least its hockey season now
by comebackkirk12 on Dec 6, 2011 12:35 PM CST up reply actions
When their competition is...
LeBron, Wade, Bosh, MLE, and ring chasing vet, no, I am not certain. And again, that’s assuming they don’t want Deng.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
not sure how the amnesty works
but theoretically, if we were able to trade for howard, couldnt we take on turkoglu’s salary then hit him with the amnesty?
at least its hockey season now
it's been reported that the player needs to have been with the team at the signing of the CBA in order to be amenstied by that team
by MagicMark on Dec 6, 2011 12:35 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Extend Howard
See if Javaris Crittendon is available to play booray with Gilbert Arenas.
The usual.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
couldn't we just wait for next offseason, amnesty Boozer, sign Howard outright
then, after Boozer doesn’t get signed because he is out with injury for exactly 3 months, sign Boozer back for the minimum to come off the bench? just sayin…
Haha, any one see this?
Orlando GM stepping down after drunk dialing Howard.
http://deadspin.com/5865587/orlando-magic-ceo-steps-down-allegedly-after-a-late-night-drunk-dial-to-dwight-howard
I think your 3rd trade is the most realistic
I don’t believe the Magic are going to want to take on Deng or Boozer (and especially not both).
If Howard gives the okay for Chicago, I think the Bulls have a very good chance. From a basketball standpoint, its hard for me to see Howard having a better chance to win on any other team. If its the weather, well, what can we do. Its cold in Chicago…
As far as trades, Bulls should offer Noah, Asik, Brewer, Korver, Watson, and the Charlotte pick for Dwight Howard and Hedo (not sure how the new rules will totally work, there is a $3 mil gap there, Bulls could throw in Bogans to close it).
This trade works for the Bulls because it gets them Howard. Simple. I believe you choose to keep Taj over Asik because I think Asik will have more value to Orlando because of his size and Taj will have more value to the Bulls because he can play with Howard. Also you probably don’t want to pay what Asik is worth for him to sit on the bench 42 minutes a night in the playoffs.
Orlando gets 3 young guys (Asik, Noah, high draft pick) and clears out a host of salary. Getting young bigs who can play the center position is pretty valuable. If they amnesty Arenas they would than only have 1 guy (Noah) making over $10 million a year. Brewer, Korver and Watson can be bought out for a combined $500k at the end of the season. That would save the Magic $11 million and make them immediate players in free agency. . No other team on Howard’s list (except the Clips) will be able to offer a top draft pick. And if the Clips aren’t willing to throw in Gordon, I think our offer is better. They would have the ability to rebuild quickly.
So yea, if Howard wants to play here, we should be among the frontrunners. But I think he is more worried about the weather than having a chance to win the next 5-7 championships.
by Basketball Smurf on Dec 7, 2011 11:14 PM CST reply actions
My Trade Proposal
Bulls Get:
Dwight Howard & Hedo Turkoglu
Magic Gets:
Joakim Noah, Luol Deng, Omer Asik, & Multiple Draft Picks

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