Kind of Unconventional Trade Idea(s) Thread
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 8, 2011 12:38 PM CST
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We all have been disappointed with the Bulls play over the last couple of weeks. With Noah being out a slight downturn had to be expected, but still these losses have been discouraging if you thought the Bulls were among the first tier in the East. Boston has lost Rondo and Garnett and when they have at least 1, they keep chugging along. We've seemed to have hit a speed bump. Yet I think this period has also been illuminating. Without Noah, it is allowed to examine some other parts of our roster. We now know...
1. Kurt Thomas isn't completely done, but he's close. He played well over the first couple of games he was inserted into the starting lineup, and he matches up well with big, physical centers. But if his jumper isn't falling, he a complete train wreck on offense and he can't move his feet worth a damn so he is mostly useless as a help defender even if he knows where he should be.
2. Bogans sucks in every way possible. We have a gigantic hole at the 2 guard which Ronnie Brewer and Korver cannot fill, although one of them should at least get a chance.
3. Thibs values defense above all else. To the point where he will ignore obvious offensive deficiencies in the hope of getting a smidgen more defense on the floor. You either bow to that or idiot proof the lineup so decisions like Bogans starting can't be made.
4. Rose still needs help. He is carrying too much of the perimeter burden.
5. Deng will either be an Iron Man this season or explode into a million pieces like Mr. Glass.
So some trade ideas to help out Thibs, this roster, and my boredom... These trades aren't all that unconventional. Just names we haven't really heard thrown around before.
1. Ben Gordon and Dajuan Summers for Kyle Korver, Bogans, JJ and Kurt Thomas.
Bulls move Brewer to the starting lineup and use BG as the main scorer off the bench for 25 minutes a game. He only has 3 years left on that contract and he is the type of player who can give you 15 pts off the bench and come up big in key moments. The Bulls could use 2 guys like that, you are allowed to have more than just 1. I have no idea who Dajuan Summers is. I'd rather they throw in Jerebko, even though he is out for the season, but I don't think they'd do that. You can also have Terrico White too, another guy who I have never heard of. Bulls would be thin up front until Noah got back, but long term Kurt Thomas isn't the answer to anything but a Knicks trivia question. He can be replaced by a D League all-star.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2uv5f84
2. Luol Deng and Taj Gibson for Omri Casspi, F. Garcia, C. Landry, J. Thompson.
I know Deng defenders and Gibson lovers will be upset, and perhaps rightly so. But this trade gives the Bulls considerable moving parts, more outside shooting and a deeper bench. Bulls would start Rose, Garcia, Casspi/Brewer, Boozer, Noah. Off the bench you have Watson, Casspi/Brewer, Korver, Landry, Thompson and Asik. You have players who you can mix and match, you have a 2nd post scorer, 2 more 3 pt shooters to pair with Rose, and another physical banger. Would Sacramento do this deal? It helps establish a more clear rotation with Udrah, Evans, Deng, Taj, Cousins as your clear starters. You get better defensively immediately. And Deng is under contract so he can't run away.
With the Bulls do this deal? Yes, you lose 2 players you value highly. But you are not committed to as much salary going forward (a Reinsdorf favorite) and I believe in short term its a better team.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2czcgx3
3. 3 teamer. Bulls get James Harden. OKC gets Anderson Varejao and Leon Powe. Cleveland gets Omer Asik, JJ, Daquen Cook, Bulls 1st round pick and Charlotte pick.
Would the Bulls give up a 1st round pick, the Charlotte pick, and Omer Asik to get James Harden? Probably not, but I would. I'd probably be willing to give up more. Harden is exactly the type of guard the Bulls need. He is a 40% 3pt shooter, he gets to the line, he is a capable defender, and he doesn't need a ton of shots to be effective. He would fit in really well as our 3rd scorer.
Would OKC give up Harden? Probably not. But I heard Chad Ford or somebody speculate about him in a trade for big man help so that got me drooling. Varejao is the type of defense first, hustle big man they have in Ibaka, but they still need more size down low. OKC doesn't seem to hip on taking on salary, but I would still try to do something. I'd offer Asik, Taj, and 2 first rounders straight up. I don't know if they would bite or not.
Would Cleveland give up Anderson Varejao and Powe? They'd be stupid not to.
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trade two probably helps us the most
Trade 1: No way, no how, never. Ben Gordon doesn’t play any defense. He isn’t hitting his shot this year. And he makes way TOO much money.
Trade 2: I don’t like losing deng or gibson. We get two bigs to help bolster our depth, but Thomson probably doesn’t play as soon as Noah is back. With Bogans still on the roster, there is still a chance he keeps playing and starting. Our defense will surely suffer. Landry is a player but not the defender Taj is. Same for Casspi and Deng. So we upgrade our 2 spot and our depth, but we lose Deng (our most consistent non-rose players this year) and Taj. I would do it, but it probably helps us the most out of these trades
trade 3: It will never happen. We lose any depth we had at center, before we get noah back. We add another guard, where we have 5 guys getting minutes. We already need to dump a guard (bogans). Not only do we lose a competent center, but we have to give up 2 first round picks on top of that. There is no way the bulls will ever do this deal.
I would do #1 in a heart beat
2 just doesn’t seem logical to me. We would be getting weaker in defense and rebounding and only be adding an average shooter and Landry, who is having a fairly disappointing campaign. I can see why all teams would do #3, but the Bulls would be giving up too much for an SG who is only shooting 41% from the field. Especially disappointing is the fact that he isn’t thriving from all the attention being paid to KD/Westbrook on defense, so he probably isn’t our answer at the 2.
I've started to hear
rumblings on the radio from guys like Bernstein. Also the other night from Kendall Gill about Ben Gordon. Not that the Bulls are interested, but just comments from them about the thought of what BG would do on this team. I know his defense is an issue along with his money, but he really would be the perfect fit for what this team is trying to do and what is needed.
I know there’s not a chance in hell of it happening because of the money and Reinsdorf’s ego in not wanting to admit a mistake, but I have to believe that Detroit would love to trade him back.
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
I just think that all of these trades
would either be lateral moves or make us worse. The James Harden idea I am actually not so opposed to, it would be a pretty smart gamble actually, IMO. I don’t really see OKC biting though, but I definitely wouldn’t be up in arms if we made that deal.
by Basketball on Jan 8, 2011 2:47 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
I don't see why Brewer would start over BG7 if we got him
Still I voted for the Harden trade.
James Harden is an actual Top 5 talent. He'll be starting for OKC before the end of next year.
Westbrook – Harden – Durant – Aldrich is going to be an unbelievable starting four.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
i'm not a believer in Aldrich
but the other 3 are darn good.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 8, 2011 5:12 PM CST up reply actions
If Harden was so good, how is he not starting over Thabo yet?
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
why isn't Brewer starting over Bogans?
they like Harden’s scoring off the bench I suppose. Its hard to have 3 high usage perimeter guys all in the game at the same time. That wouldn’t be a problem in Chicago. PER 36 he is averaging 15, 5, and 4 while shooting 5.5 free throws on 10 shots. Numbers like that mean he is a 2 guard with a TS% over 60% – that is damn impressive. With Westbrook and Durant, he just doesn’t see the ball enough. He is basically a guy hitting double figures almost every game while shooting only 7 times per game.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 9, 2011 12:36 PM CST up reply actions
While these are valid points
and I feel that Harden would be a good fit here, I still think it’s fair to be skeptical of a guy who was the #3 overall pick in the draft 2 years ago and still hasn’t cracked the starting lineup, irrespective of fit issues. Fortunately he’s only 21, so there’s definitely room for him to grow, and his PER is slightly above league average which means he’s at least decently productive. I’d trade for him, but I don’t think I’d give up the haul that you would. Probably just Asik, JJ, and the Charlotte pick…I think that should suffice, although I’d guess OKC would want more given how highly they drafted him.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
Dude, c'mon. By now, you gotta know coaches have their pets, especially on defense.
I mean, OKC is playing for the long-term future. There is no need to rush the guy into the starting lineup. And Thabo is productive. And younger than Bogans. And Harden is less proven. I agree that it doesn’t make complete sense, but Diaw over Thomas, Bogans over Brewer, Thabo over Harden, the last almost makes sense.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Harden doesn't have top 5 in the NBA talent.
by fundamentallysound on Jan 8, 2011 9:52 PM CST up reply actions
I did. Sorry about that.
Johnny Flynn – NOT top 5 talent.
Thabeet – NOT top 5 talent
James Harden – YES top 5 talent
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I'd rather have Rose/Deng/Boozer/Noah
I’m not sure how you can say Aldrich is going to be part of anything “unbelievable” when he hasn’t showed anything yet.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
Aldrich is Aaron grey
nothing more
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
That shows complete ignorance.
I mean, completely.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I'm of the school that believes big men typically develop slower than perimeter guys.
Especially those known for their defense. Aldrich has played 55 mpg in the NBA. I’m not ready to write him off.
Meanwhile in 11 starts in the D-League, he’s done well, although that’s been nothing special. I don’t think he’ll ever be very good on offense, and for that, I think he’ll be contantly underrated. I do think he will end up starting for a Top 5, though, and being the defensive anchor. He’s got a ways to go, sure, but based on 2+ years of college ball, I try not to write off players after 55 min in the NBA.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Man, I like that number three, even though I don't think it will ever happen
OKC would almost definitely not trade him. I’d also love to bring BG back. I think he’d re-gain his swag on this team. The second trade in interesting too. Some good out of the box stuff here. Although, as always, I would gladly settle for Brewer taking over for Bogans in the starting lineup (at least for the time being)
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
ummm i liked trade number 1 except
ben gordon needs to start!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Derrick Rose is a motherfucking ninja.
I like Sacramento as a trade partner.
I just don’t like that particular trade (#2). Casspi and Landry are poor defenders, so if your third point (Thibs values defense above all else) is correct, they won’t be utilized well on the Bulls. I think this would make more sense:
Taj Gibson, CJ Watson, and James Johnson for Francisco Garcia, Jason Thompson, and Pooh Jeter.
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3×3m9qx
Garcia is a very good defender and also a major upgrade over Bogans offensively. He’s an excellent shooter who could space the floor and score an efficient 10 points per game in 24 minutes. Hopefully Bogans would become a cheerleader and victory cigar post-trade.
Jeter is much more of a pure point guard than CJ. One of the most frustrating things about watching Bulls games is watching CJ run the point. He’s more like a SG who dominates the ball. He doesn’t put other players in a better position to score, though he’s not a bad scorer himself. Jeter averages a couple more assists per 36 minutes and slightly fewer turnovers. He’s not the shooter CJ is, but as long as we’re only looking for a backup PG and not a SG, I think Jeter is a better fit.
Thompson is a lot like Taj. The main difference is that he’s played C/PF while Taj plays PF almost exclusively. The Kings should greatly prefer Taj because he’s cheaper, he has an extra year of team control, and the Kings have Cousins/Dalembert at C.
This deal would save the Kings money in the short-term and even more in subsequent years. I think both the Bulls and Kings would prefer this to the trade proposed above.
Regarding the other trades in the original post, I would not make the Gordon trade, and I would consider the Harden trade. James Harden could be a great fit for the Bulls. He might be the best semi-attainable player out there for the starting SG spot. The rest of the deal just seems strange. Would there be another trade lined up to add a C? Also, OKC’s frontcourt would be overloaded. Maybe add something like Krstic to the Bulls, Brewer to the Cavs, and Daniel Gibson to the Thunder?
by from the window to luol on Jan 8, 2011 6:20 PM CST reply actions
How about
Bogans to the end of the bench and more minutes for Brewer, Korver and Asik. We don’t even have to get another GM to buy in.
What is the matter with this picture? Will there ever be an opportunity where Thibs explanes his thinking?
I would #1 or #3, don't like #2
- As well as KT has played, he is expendable when Noah comes back. I like Korver’s shooting, but BG while not quite the poor shooter is overall the better player. I like the idea of him as the anchor of our bench the way Thibs uses the hockey-style subs. Although, I’m not sure how he and CJ would play together. Bogans and JJ are obviously expendable as well. I like DaJuan Summers too as a throw-in. He is a good athlete and a decent shooter.
- I would do this as well. But I am skeptical about whether OKC would be willing to give up Harden 1-year after spending a top 5 pick on him. Disappointing to give up Asik and the Charlotte pick, but you got to give up something to get something. I could see Cleveland making this trade.
- I think this hurts our defense too much. Perhaps the guys we got from Sacramento would be able to play solid defense for Thibs, but it seems like too much of a risk without that much upside. I also don’t like that we give up the best player in the deal in Deng.
We need some BG7 up in this mofo!
Get ’er done GarPax.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
no to 2 or 3, #1 i would have to consider
Deng and Bogans to Denver for JR Smith and Al Harrington
I know Al is not loved much around here, but I want a true stretch 4, while his contract is long, its less than 6 million a year.
Rose
Jr Smith ( never has gotten a chance to start, cuz he’s crazy erratic I know)
Al harrington
Boozer
Noah
Bench: Brewer and Korver at the 2 and 3 depending on match ups, Taj, Asik, CJ
I know everyone would not do this, but Jr and Harrington can actually dribble the ball.
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
JR can also shoot the ball
from halfcourt!!
Also, Al Harrington is just … no. NOOOOOOOO.
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
Al Harrignton can Ball, yo
working off of Rose, Booz and Noah? He would be highly effective.
Him at 6 million or Deng at 12 million, hm (strokes chin)?
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
Al Harrington is an unreformed Zach Randolph
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
You mean he is involved in criminal thuggery?
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
no, but he takes great shots
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
I'm talking basketball, not gangbanging
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
I don't think I would do this
We already struggle with outside shooting and Harrington is a worse outside shooter than Deng. He has a bigger body, but Deng is a better wing defender at this point. Deng can guard the quicker 3s. I don’t think Al can. Harrington is a better rebounder. Oh, and Harrington is old.
And I don’t trust JR.
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 1:02 AM CST up reply actions
Better one for ya.. (Unless you fiend for BG7)
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3a58ka7
Breakdown:
4-Team Trade between Chicago, Philadelphia, Cleveland, and Sacramento.
Sixers Get: JJ from CHI, Anderson Varejao from CLE, and Carl Landry from SAC, with CHI 1st round pick
Cavs Get: SF Luol Deng, SG Keith Bogans, and PG/SG CJ Watson from CHI with a 2nd round pick from SAC
Kings Get: PF Elton Brand from PHI, PF Leon Powe, SF Jamario Moon, and PG/SG Manny Harris, with the CHAR pick from CHI, and 2012 CLE 1st round pick (Top 10 protected)
Bulls Get: SG Andre Iguodala from PHI, SF Omri Casspi and PF/C Jason Thompson from SAC, and PG Daniel Gibson from CLE, with 2nd round pick from CLE
New Rotation by Feb 20th
PG D.Rose / Gibson
SG Iggy / Brewer
SF Casspi / Korver / Brewer (any of the 3 could start there)
PF Booz / Taj / Thompson
C Noah / Thompson / Asik / Thomas(on ice for the playoffs)
Interesting Trade, doubt Kings or Cleveland would do it
That looks like a nice trade for the Bulls. Basically the Bulls get a better defensive 2 and a worse defensive 3. But, keep the outside shooting steady and add better playmaking at the 2 and the 3. Gibson is an upgrade over CJ (knock-down outside shooter) and Thpmpson is a nice back-up big man. Give up Deng and Charlotte pick.
Other teams perspective:
Kings:
Why the hell would they want Brand? Trade to me makes no sense from their perspective
Sixers:
They would probably do it just to get rid of Brand. Seems like they would rather have Andy V over Iggy because of their backlog in the backcourt and their lack of defense.
Cleveland:
Why would the Cavs give up Gibson to acquire CJ? That doesn’t make any sense to me. Not sure if they would rather build around Deng than Andy V. They might do it, but if they were going to trade Varajeo seems like they could get something more interesting than Deng.
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 1:09 AM CST up reply actions
heres another
Granger and Dante Jones for Deng and Bogans and our 2011 ist rounder if we still have it
Indy is taking offers.
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
My Thinking
Kings: One of the few teams with cap space to spend this season. Dalembert is gone after the season, and you stick Brand in there with Cousins, you still have a combo. Plus, Brand is a much better vet presense than anyone they have currently. Get him back out West, he might do something. And they get 2 future picks to stock pile.
Sixers: Exactly, this is nothing but the consequences of having to dump Brand. They get an extra 1st round pick this year and Varajao to play PF.
Cavs: The only thing they are going to get for Varajao is a 1st. Adding CJ gives Scott 3 interchangable guards, all 6’3. I think Watson brings a little more to the table as far as being a scorer goes too. And basically, I think Deng is the best they’ll get that will actually play for them and not dog it.
Totally disagree
Andy V definitely has value. He is a homeless man’s Noah, but there still aren’t many players like him in the league. He’s worth much more than a first. I also don’t see why they would want Deng. He’s a good 3rd option on a winning team, but he is pretty bad as the best player on a team.
Brand is one of the worst contracts in the NBA. No way a rebuilding team with money issues like the Kings wants to take on that financial obligation. That’s a non-starter for them.
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 2:26 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Here's another way to look at it
If you’re Cleveland, you will never obtain a franchise builder in trade or free agency, because no one wants to go there. So instead you grab pieces to hopefully complement one of these lottery picks you are going to have. Would you rather have a non scoring PF or a nice all around talented SF? Remember you still have Hickson. I’d take the SF, especially considering I’ll be paying the PF, your homeless man’s Noah, $7 mil for the next 5 years if I don’t.
For the Kings, they are in pretty much the same boat. They go get Brand to ease the burden on Cousins and act as mentor to the young dude and by the time they are ready to compete, he’s expiring. They still have Dalembert coming off the books this offseason.
by Ceasaleo on Jan 9, 2011 3:12 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
As I've said before
I kind of buy the Cleveland thing. I just think they could get something more interesting than Deng for Varajao. But, I could see them doing it.
Really don’t see how the 76ers would take on Brand’s contract. That bad boy runs through 2012-2013. He is already washed up.
Bulls get: Casspi, Udrih, Garcia
Kings get Deng, CJ Watson
Beno and Garcia have higher PERs than Deng. We lose the Dengs 4 year deal for these 2 players.
In the long run Casspi may be an overall better player than Deng
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
I really want to get rid of Deng
he’s a kitty kat. Does not have the dog!
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
You're nuts for wanting to dump Deng for back-ups
Do you not value defense and rebounding? You know the two things (along with Rose individual brilliance) that this team is built on?
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 2:22 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
U have to get more for Den if you are going to trade him
Try this instead:
4 Team Trade – Bulls, Timberwolves, Kings, and Rockets
Do you think about other teams needs/wants when making up these trades?
No way the TWolves would want Deng. Their best scorer is a 3 (Michael Beasley) and they just drafted another 3 in Wesley Johnson.
No way the Rockets give up their best player in Kevin Martin for a worthless player (Bogans) a back-up PF they just traded (Landry), a chronic underachiever (Darko) and a first round bust who can’t find the court (JJ). A total pu-pu platter.
I don’t really see how the trade helps the Kings, but at least it seems like fair value for them.
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 2:34 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Yea I do, once again think out the box..
Minnesota’s best SCORER is a SF, so true, but that player does little else than score and he isn’t their best PLAYER. If you look at what they already have a Deng-Love combo looks better than Beasley-Love. They swing the deal and flip Beasley for a big and/or draft pick. They picked him up for a 2nd rounder.
As far as the Rockets go, I’m pretty sure their management values Brooks and Scola more than Martin. Plus, they have Lee and TWill there ready to step in. JJ might not be able to make it off our bench, but he would be a nice combo forward for them and insurance in case Battier doesn’t resign. Darko has actually played pretty well this year, and with all their injuries in the paint, they can use a young big. Landry has already said that he wants to come back to HOU, trade him get something back.
by Ceasaleo on Jan 9, 2011 3:33 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Sorry
But that really makes no sense. Beasley makes 1/2 of what Deng makes. I don’t really see how a Deng-Love combo is better than Beasley-Love. Neither Deng nor Love can really create their own shot. Beasley is much better than Deng off the dribble.
And that still doesn’t explain what they do with Wesley Johnson who they just drafted with at top 5 pick. If they were inclined to flip Beasley for a big, then they would do just that and see if Wesley Johnson can play.
Finally, this leaves them without a point guard, as they just moved Flynn and Ridnour. Deng isn’t worth that.
Rockets
Regardless of whether they value Martin, Scola or Brooks the most, this is a horrible trade for them. I realize Darko has played well this season. He still is nowhere close to Martin’s quality as a player. I don’t need to re-hash my thoughts on the other young guys.
"I’m pretty sure their management values Brooks and Scola more than Martin."
This is dead wrong. Every report out of Houston says that they’re trying to move Brooks. They have Lowry locked up at a reasonable price and they prefer him as the starting PG. Also, Daryl Morey LOVES Martin (with good reason). Martin is having a sensational year. He’s top-5 in the league in 3s made, while also LEADING THE LEAGUE IN FTs MADE. He’s been an amazingly efficient scorer.
There are rumors of a trade centered around Brooks for Landry. You could incorporate that into a proposal to make it more realistic. The Bulls aren’t getting Martin plus a couple good young players on rookie contracts in exchange for Deng and garbage.
by from the window to luol on Jan 9, 2011 12:27 PM CST up reply actions
I'm staunchly against moving Deng unless we get back a wing player who is definitively of equal or better quality
The Sacramento deal you proposed essentially trades Deng for depth. While we might be a better overall team, it’s easier to improve upon a team with consolidated talent, given the nature of the NBA cap structure.
I’d prefer a much simpler deal with Sacramento: Gatcia + Casspi for Korver + Johnson.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Jan 9, 2011 2:43 AM CST reply actions 2 recs
Agree
I know Deng is the whipping boy around these parts, but he is a legitimate NBA starter. Guys that can score 17 ppt semi-efficiently while rebounding and playing good defense don’t grow on trees. Trading Deng for back-ups isn’t a good idea.
by JSB on Jan 9, 2011 2:48 AM CST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I feel that Casspi can replace him
and We lose his 4 year 50 million dollar contract
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
Because of Dengs contract you have to give the other team more
Or take they other teams bad contracts
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
Casspi had a dream once that he was nearly as good as Deng…
Then he woke up. You should too. He couldn’t even remotely replace Deng.
JR has a super fat wallet. I think he can afford Deng’s salary. I’ve been a Bulls fan for a long time, and if they made a pure cost cutting move under the current circumstances I would find that almost unforgiveable.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
by kingles on Jan 9, 2011 11:52 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
its not a cost cutting move. Its reality.
To keep Boozer, Noah, Rose, and i guess Taj, and upgrade the shooting guard, Deng has to go. You can get a small forward on the side of the road to do what Deng does.
Casspi, given 40 minutes a night would get you 18 and 8.
Your sig is garbage
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
LOL
I’m Sure JJ would give us 18 and 8 in 40 minutes too, just Deng’s blocking him from starting! Man, if only he was gone all our problems would be solved
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
Your sig is ok.
Unfortunately everything else you wrote is wrong. We have no need to get rid of Deng other than to possibly get a replacement BETTER than Deng. Trading Deng to get any of the SG’s i’ve seen mentioned would not improve the Bulls at all. Casspi couldn’t get 18 and 8 for the KINGS in 40 min, much less a Bulls team with other actual good NBA players on it.
You really don’t realize how good Deng is because you like many others are hung up on what he does NOT do, rather than paying attention to what he actually DOES.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
so you rather keep taj and lose Deng?
Did you vote for the ASG today?
by JustAnotherFan on Jan 11, 2011 7:47 AM CST up reply actions
actually he makes 9/4 points in 25 so he would need 50 to match 18/8
and to prove things are not that easy his career high is 24 points.
Did you vote for the ASG today?
by JustAnotherFan on Jan 11, 2011 7:50 AM CST up reply actions
are we talking about Sacramento's Casspi here?
Did you vote for the ASG today?
by JustAnotherFan on Jan 10, 2011 2:15 PM CST up reply actions
Man, you really value Varejao don't you?
Plus as much as I hate to admit we need Kurt Thomas. Otherwise we gonna be destroyed by shaq and dwight in the playoffs
Did you vote for the ASG today?
its time for Deng to go...but not that way
PNobleDaLyricist
Purely unprovable speculation on my part but
1. The Bulls evinced a very personal disinterest in Ben Gordon… one that even guys like KC Johnson and Sam Smith seemed to make note of in various ways. So I think hell will freeze over before that happens.
While I’m speculating, I mentioned in a post that got destroyed that the Bulls seem to have very little interest in Melo. I also notice that Melo and the aforementioned former Bull share the same agent, and there were rumblings that the Bulls didn’t like him much. Maybe because he asked for and got better offers for his client, which is, you know, what agents are legally and ethically obligated to do. But I digress.
2. I kind of like 2 on the surface, but I don’t think it works because for the Dulls to actually be better in the short run, they’re gonna have to trust Luol’s replacements, and I don’t see that happening. It’s not enough of an obvious win for us to run the risk of trading Luol, I guess. If they really want a young guy like Luol on a longer deal, then I want a clear win coming back. How’s about Luol, CJ, JJ for Udrih, Landry, Casspi and Garcia? We roll with
1- Rose, Udrih
2- Garcia, Brewer/Korver/Rose/Udrih
3- Brewer, Casspi/Korver
4- Boozer, Landry
5- Noah, KT, Taj, Asik
Udrih is not at all a terrible player. He’s pretty good sized, can shoot, and can much more legitimately run a offense than CJ Watson can. I really like this trade because we really end up bringing in three guys who can pass and shoot (Udrih, Garcia, Casspi), so we’re creating a lot more options for our sweet passing scorers (Rose, obviously, and also Boozer). I also think this allows us to do something much more natural in making use of Brewer’s talents, since, with more shooters on the floor, he can play a more mid-range game that will actually make him somewhat dangerous on the court (unlike Bogans, who camps out to no effect).
3. If a deal brings in James Harden, I’m probably for it.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
I understand what you are saying in regards to Gordon
but when we look at every other trade proposed for a 2 guard, it inevitably leads to the Bulls giving up Taj, Asik, or the Charlotte pick. I don’t believe it will be possible to get a 2 guard of Gordon’s skill level or above at this low of a price.
Getting a talent like Gordon without giving up our young bigs or the Charlotte pick would be such a huge bonus. I think he’d fit right in with this team. All the plays and action we are running to get Korver shots would be much better served with Ben Gordon. If you consistently gave him those opportunities with the 2nd unit he’d average 14 pts a game easily.
On the court I see nothing but positives. So what we are really talking about is a battle of egos, particularly Reinsdorf’s ego. Perhaps Gordon comes back a little humbled and the Bulls are a bit more appreciative of having a 6th man of the year candidate on the bench. They don’t really have to be best friends.
I actually believe the impediment to this deal would be more Gordon’s salary than Reinsdorf’s ego. The Bulls seems to want to maintain flexibility for after the new CBA. That is why Korver, Brewer and CJ all have buyouts after their 2nd year.
by Basketball Smurf on Jan 9, 2011 2:18 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, its his salary. And despite what others say, he's a negative on defense
The Bulls wanted to bring BG back. At 10 million a year. He said no. The first day of free agency he jumped on the Detroit offer.
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
Yeah but that's water under the bridge
Fact is that he’s been injured and lost in Detroit and we have Bogans as our starting SG so it’s not like either side really got what it was after. No one is in a position to have large egos right now. Enough about his defense, the Bulls need quick offensive production.
This team is now set up for a SG with quick scoring ability (a la Vinnie Johnson) to come in and carry our second unit while Rose can rest. Also by the way, he’s an excellent free throw shooter which is something else we desperately need. Thibs got it done with Ray Allen, don’t tell me he can’t hide BG for 15-20+ mins a night. If the Bulls have a chance to get a former 20ppg scorer while keeping the core of the team intact. I’d say do it.
Hey Rose. I don't see the appeal!
I would welcome BG back
Its the salary that might be a sticking point.
Can i do Deng for BG?
Rose
BG
Brewer
Boozer
Noah
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
It's true, but I just don't see anyone checking their ego at the door.
Perhaps more importantly, the Pistons the Pistons seem poised to finally, two years late, trade Rip Hamilton, so I’m pretty pretty sure Gordon’s not as easily available as we might think.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
Udrih and Garcia have higher PERS than Deng, (this year)so its not like trading him for crap
And those can can flourish playing off of Boozer and Rose, esp Casspi. Deng can’t dribble. He can’t catch in traffic. He can’t finish in the paint. He his free three shooting is a serious fault right now.
I would start Brewer though. Start the game with a positive going to Boozer and Rose. Then bring in Garcia, Korver, and Udrih.
Who would get more minutes, Landry or Taj?
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
You talk a lot about what he can't and never what he can
Nash has a higher PER than Rose
Tyrus Thomas and Zach Randolph have higher PERs than Noah
would you make those trades?
Did you vote for the ASG today?
by JustAnotherFan on Jan 10, 2011 2:21 PM CST up reply actions
I use PER as part of the evaluation process
I’m sick of Lu’s inconsistent play, from game to game. from quarter to quarter, and from possession to possession.
I can get that from a first contract player making 1.5 mil.
"I love you, mommy!" - Joakim Noah
well then, tell me a few wing players who qualifies for your “I can get that from a first contract player making 1.5 mil.”
Did you vote for the ASG today?
by JustAnotherFan on Jan 11, 2011 7:51 AM CST up reply actions
or just one
I can’t think of a single player like that
The Miami Heat: Like ants and a magnifying glass. ... OH NO! CHRIS BOSH’S BEAUTIFUL FACE!!!!!!!!
LANDRY FIELDS!
obviously the answer to every question. But seriously, there’s no one else.
by drock8686 on Jan 12, 2011 12:25 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
again with BG7?
Anagram time !
BlogaBull = BG Luol Lab.
Cos you’re all like a bunch of scientists trying to figure out how to get rid of Deng and bring in BG.
Boom! Asik, Asik, Asik the room.
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