Carlos Boozer, now and through 2015
5 years, $76 million officially, according to KC Johnson. That leaves us with enough room to sign LeBron to the max (and maybe bring over Asik too), and considering the need to make a last ditch effort for LeBron, and the other contracts handed out this offseason, the signing made most of BaB very happy.
But what do the stats say? How might Boozer impact the Bulls next season, and from then on? A bunch of bullet points:
BOOZER ON OFFENSE
Scoring
With a career 23.6 USG% and .577 TS%, we know he's an elite scorer. But how does he score, and what else does he bring offensively? First, a table of his 82games scoring stats over the years.
(Note: "J" stands for jumpshots, "In" stands for inside shots. Att is % of FG attempts that are that shot type. Astd% is percentage of those field goals made that were assisted.)
| Year | Jatt | JeFG% | JAstd% | InAtt | IneFG% | InAstd% |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2010 | 49% | 0.448 | 75% | 51% | 0.673 | 74% |
| 2009 | 53% | 0.387 | 63% | 47% | 0.605 | 63% |
| 2008 | 54% | 0.447 | 72% | 46% | 0.666 | 70% |
| 2007 | 47% | 0.395 | 71% | 53% | 0.715 | 69% |
| 2006 | 50% | 0.410 | 70% | 50% | 0.688 | 69% |
I'm surprised by that 74 Astd% inside. When I think Boozer I think "post-up isolation scorer", but the stats say that's not how he gets his points. To see how extreme that Astd% number is, here is a list of big men who scored over 8ppg on inside shots this year:
| Player | Shot | Att. | eFG% | Ast'd | Blk'd | Pts |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Andrew Bogut | Inside | 84% | 0.562 | 52% | 0.06 | 12.5 |
| Dwight Howard | Inside | 87% | 0.665 | 50% | 0.07 | 11.8 |
| David Lee | Inside | 51% | 0.656 | 58% | 0.12 | 10.4 |
| Pau Gasol | Inside | 61% | 0.631 | 58% | 0.08 | 10.1 |
| Andrew Bynum | Inside | 73% | 0.650 | 62% | 0.07 | 10.0 |
| Amare Stoudemire | Inside | 49% | 0.669 | 61% | 0.09 | 10.0 |
| Carlos Boozer | Inside | 51% | 0.673 | 74% | 0.13 | 9.6 |
| Brook Lopez | Inside | 58% | 0.593 | 54% | 0.09 | 9.4 |
| Zach Randolph | Inside | 49% | 0.578 | 48% | 0.14 | 9.3 |
| Chris Bosh | Inside | 46% | 0.612 | 48% | 0.09 | 9.3 |
| Chris Kaman | Inside | 49% | 0.578 | 63% | 0.08 | 8.9 |
| Shaquille O'Neal | Inside | 79% | 0.623 | 58% | 0.05 | 8.6 |
| Luis Scola | Inside | 51% | 0.623 | 50% | 0.10 | 8.5 |
| Nene | Inside | 74% | 0.657 | 73% | 0.09 | 8.5 |
| Marc Gasol | Inside | 65% | 0.654 | 64% | 0.08 | 8.0 |
Boozer's Astd% tops the list, putting him even higher than Nene's. Weird. Here's what Synergy Sports has to say about his scoring:

Again, an oddly low amount of Isolation attempts. Most of Boozer's efficient scoring comes from Cuts and Pick and Rolls. Here's a look at Bosh's numbers for comparison:

Just two completely different scoring styles. Bosh is the efficient player in the post and in isolation while Boozer is getting points within the flow of the offense. Here's one more table, this time showing Boozer's post-scoring PPP (points per possession, which I think is just Pts/(FGA + .44*FTA + TOV) compared to other notable big men.
| PPP | FG% | SF% | TOV% | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Bosh | 1.09 | 52.5 | 16.4 | 10.0 |
| Nowitzki | 1.06 | 49.8 | 11.6 | 8.1 |
| Randolph | 1.01 | 48.6 | 9.2 | 7.3 |
| Duncan | 1.00 | 49.5 | 13.3 | 7.0 |
| Pau | 1.00 | 48.8 | 10.7 | 8.5 |
| Stoudemire | 0.99 | 50.8 | 13.8 | 14.3 |
| Horford | 0.94 | 45.8 | 9.3 | 8.6 |
| West | 0.94 | 48.5 | 8.0 | 12.5 |
| Nene | 0.94 | 47.5 | 9.8 | 11.8 |
| Bynum | 0.93 | 48.3 | 8.2 | 11.0 |
| Marc | 0.93 | 51.4 | 9.7 | 14.1 |
| Jefferson | 0.92 | 47.0 | 7.6 | 8.5 |
| Howard | 0.91 | 52.7 | 17.8 | 19.3 |
| Aldridge | 0.91 | 44.1 | 10.0 | 7.5 |
| Lopez | 0.91 | 42.6 | 16.2 | 13.5 |
| Scola | 0.91 | 49.8 | 6.9 | 14.1 |
| Garnett | 0.90 | 44.9 | 8.6 | 11.9 |
| Boozer | 0.87 | 47.5 | 9.0 | 15.8 |
| Shaq | 0.85 | 48.9 | 11.7 | 14.7 |
| Millsap | 0.83 | 45.7 | 10.7 | 19.7 |
| Noah | 0.83 | 40.7 | 11.6 | 8.9 |
| Bogut | 0.80 | 43.3 | 5.1 | 11.7 |
| Lee | 0.80 | 44.2 | 3.1 | 12.8 |
| Kaman | 0.77 | 41.5 | 5.7 | 15.0 |
| Perkins | 0.74 | 44.7 | 10.3 | 19.6 |
Damn this is becoming a long post. The numbers show Boozer's post scoring last year wasn't impressive. While his FG% was strong, his inability to draw fouls and his high turnover rate in those situations brought his overall average down.
Passing
Still, the mere reputation of Boozer as a post threat might be what the Bulls need most, as it'll help spread the floor for Rose. And besides that threat, Boozer brings another skill that might make him elite in the post overall: his passing.
Statistical APM regressions shows a stronger correlation between AST% and team offensive rating than PER and WS suggest, and Boozer's 15.8 AST% last year ranked 3rd in the NBA behind Duncan and Lee among players that average 9+ reb/36. That's nice to have, especially with how well Rose/Deng/Noah move off the ball. Boozer and Noah inside will probably mean we'll see the same great interior passing we saw in Miller/Noah lineups the past two years.
Overall
Boozer's 6-year offensive APM (2004-2009) was +1.34
Boozer's 4-year offensive APM (2006-2009) was +3.13
Boozer's statistical APM in 2010 (my regression using 6-year data) was +2.94.
I think it's safe to say we're getting at least a +2 player offensively, and maybe one as good as +3. In a list of the top bigs by 2010 statistical APM:
| Player | sOAPM |
|---|---|
| Duncan | 4.10 |
| Bosh | 4.10 |
| Lee | 3.46 |
| Gasol | 3.43 |
| Boozer | 2.94 |
| Love | 2.76 |
| Nowitzki | 2.49 |
| Randolph | 2.45 |
| Nene | 2.25 |
| Howard | 2.11 |
| Horford | 2.09 |
Boozer stacks up as expected. (Note: Amare is at 1.89, Brook Lopez 1.25).
BOOZER ON DEFENSE
Defensive ability is hard to gauge, but here's everything I could dig up.
Defensive Tools
Using draftexpress measurements to compare Boozer to similarly-sized PFs:
| Player | Height | Weight | Wingspan | Reach | MaxVert |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Boozer | 6'9" | 258 | 7'2" | 9'0.5" | 28.5 |
| Taj | 6'9.5" | 214 | 7'4" | 9'1" | 30.0 |
| Griffin | 6'9.5" | 248 | 6'11" | 8'9" | 35.5 |
| Collison | 6'10" | 255 | 7'1.5" | 9'0" | 33.0 |
| D. West | 6'9.5" | 226 | 7'4" | 9'0.5" | 31.5 |
| Amare | 6'9.5" | 233 | 7'2" | 9'0.5" | 35.5 |
(Note: I used height w/o shoes + 1" since shoe thickness was all over the map with these guys.) The consensus here seems to be that Boozer is a bit undersized and lacks the tools to be a good defender, but he stacks up fairly well to some other players who are either viewed as having good size or have a good reputation on defense.
I usually trust DraftExpress' scouting reports, and here's what they say about Boozer's defense:
A solid, but unspectacular defensive player. Has the strength to hold position on the block, but lacks the length and quickness to contest shots and effectively defend the high post. Is prone to stay on his feet defensively, a sign of good fundamentals, but also a characteristic that makes the fact he is a bit undersized that much more pronounced.
Offers little as a shot blocker, but does a great job grabbing loose balls in the paint. Has great hands, strength, and anticipation making him one of the League’s best rebounders on the defensive end. Boxes his man out every play and can rebound a pretty big area. Will close out hard when he has to recover to the ball, and while he gets beat of the dribble sometimes, he won’t take himself out of the play very often. A decent option defensively because of his ability to rebound the ball and not take risks, but limited by his quickness and size.
A couple things worth noting here:
- Despite being a rock-solid 258lbs with a good wingspan and reach, maybe the combination of lacking quickness and jumping ability is too damning a disadvantage for a 6'9" PF.
- Boozer is more awesome at defensive rebounding than I thought. His 26.9 DREB% career ranks 3rd among active players and 6th all-time. With Deng/Boozer/Noah inside now, we've gone from a 2009 team that couldn't keep the Celtics off the glass to an 2011 team that should be among the best in the league in that category.
- Boozer sounds like a decent post defender, but mediocre at help defense because of a lack of quickness and shotblocking ability. Because of that, Utah might have been an awful fit for him defensively, with a plodding SF/C combo in Kirilenko and Okur. Surrounded by a great help defender in Noah, and a SF in Deng who's pretty good at keeping players in front of him, Boozer may be able to just stick to what he does best.
Overall, Boozer's 6 year (2004-2009) defensive APM stood at -1.80, with a 4 year APM (2006-2009) at -2.02. (2008-2010 APM numbers coming when I increase my dying RAM supply!!). Those numbers aren't pretty, but with his okay tools and great defensive rebounding numbers, I wouldn't be surprised if he starts rating a bit better than that with the improved Chicago fit.
BOOZER'S VALUE
APM
Here's his total APM numbers from three low-noise sources and a high-noise 09-10 source:
04-08 5-year (weighted toward 2008): +1.97 on offense, -1.95 on defense, +0.02 overall
04-09 6-year unweighted: +1.34 on offense, -1.80 on defense, -0.46 overall (Boozer had a crappy 2009)
06-09 4-year unweighted: +3.13 on offense, -2.02 on defense, +1.11 overall.
09-10 2-year (basketballvalue.com): -1.75 overall.
08-09 2-year (basketballvalue.com): +0.34 overall.
Another indicator of value is looking at 82games net plusminuses over time:
2010: -2.2
2009: -5.9
2008: +1.1
2007: +0.6
2006: -0.5
2005: +2.8
2004: +9.4
2003: -3.1
Each 82games number by itself doesn't mean much, but when a big name player hasn't had a good Net plusminus season in five years that might be telling. Add in the much more accurate APM numbers, and it looks like Carlos Boozer has been an average NBA player on the Jazz.
That of course could change a bit now that he's a Bull (APM can't adjust for defensive fit), and it's conceivable that he could be a +1, maybe even a +2 player immediately. But I don't see anything there to say he's worth $15 mil when healthy.
Health
I like using Minutes Per Team Game (MPTG) to put into perspective how much floor time a player is actually giving his team. The formula is simple, just minutes played per year divided by 82. MPTG per year for Boozer:
| Season | Age | Tm | G | MP | MPTG |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 2002-03 | 21 | CLE | 81 | 2049 | 25.0 |
| 2003-04 | 22 | CLE | 75 | 2592 | 31.6 |
| 2004-05 | 23 | UTA | 51 | 1772 | 21.6 |
| 2005-06 | 24 | UTA | 33 | 1025 | 12.5 |
| 2006-07 | 25 | UTA | 74 | 2557 | 31.2 |
| 2007-08 | 26 | UTA | 81 | 2827 | 34.5 |
| 2008-09 | 27 | UTA | 37 | 1197 | 14.6 |
| 2009-10 | 28 | UTA | 78 | 2673 | 32.6 |
| Career | 28 | TOT | 510 | 16692 | 25.4 |
Boozer's been fairly healthy the past four years, with just one stretch of significant time missed. But at 25.4mptg played over his career, he's been off court nearly half the time. Just for perspective, Chris Bosh has averaged 32.8mptg over his career, meaning Bosh has given 130% of Boozer's value from minutes played alone, and it's not like Bosh has been that healthy.
tsn.ca is my go-to site for player injuries. Their list for Boozer includes injuries to his right ankle, left knee, left knee again, right ankle again, hamstring, quad, right foot, calf, and right ankle a third time. And that was when Boozer was 21-28 years old.
Projecting forward, it's not pretty. Here's a list of big men who missed about as many games as Boozer has by age 28. Of them, only Shaq (28.6mptg), Webber (25.7mptg), and Cartwright (25.4mtpg) averaged as many minutes from age 29-33 as Boozer did from age 21-28, and Webber and Cartwright's numbers went way, way down after age 30. Others like Cliff Robinson (not uncle Cliffy, the other one), Brad Daugherty, Jeff Ruland, Charles Smith were out of the league by age 31.
Obviously using comparables in basketball is inexact, and maybe Boozer holds up like Shaq did. And if by some chance Boozer's injuries are a thing of the past, there are many star post players who've been effective through age 33. But because of the way Boozer has missed time (lots of little injuries to his lower body), and considering Shaq was the only player on the comparables list to remain a healthy, impact player through age 31, my guess is there's a really good chance Boozer hits a wall soon. Even if he doesn't, paying $15 mil/year to a +1/+2 player who will fade as Rose moves into his prime seems like a poor decision.
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Wet. Blanket.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 8, 2010 5:03 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
i wish hollinger's articles looked as pretty as yours
and were half as intelligent
someone teach me how to get Sam Smith's job when he retires
Yep.
Boozer had a great passing PG in Derron Williams. If you’ve seen some of his highlight videos, you’ve seen how awesome Williams is. People say Derrick Rose will get there. He won’t be that good this year, and he might not be for another year or two, when Boozer starts losing his abilities.
People suggest that David Lee’s stats might have been inflated due to D’Antoni’s system. So, too, should they suggest that Boozer’s production was inflated due to having Derron Williams and being a part of the notoriously pro-PG/PF offense of Jerry Sloan’s Utah Jazz.
After Joe Johnson, Boozer was probably one of the worse signings. Man, Bosh would have been a get.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Boozer was fine in Cleveland on a team that had nothing, but him, a rookie LeBron, and Ilgauskas.
He’s not great, but this is nothing like the Joe Johnson signing.
by Scotter on Jul 8, 2010 5:33 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
The voice reason chimes in…Seriously, we have all seen Yao’s write-up on Johnson, it will be one of the worst contracts in the NBA when we can shop Boozer’s expiring deal.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
And the player pairs data indicates that
Boozer consistently put up the exact same numbers when Williams was off the floor versus on. Obviously the sample size is much smaller, but it’s a consistent pattern for every season Boozer has been in Utah.
by Scotter on Jul 8, 2010 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Fair enough.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
BTW, just to show that I did know what I'm talking about, at least in the contract area...
… I said “after Johnson” “one of the worst” meaning, “he’s in the group of bad-but-not franchise-killing signings”
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I really don't think he's a bad signing.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 8, 2010 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
There's a pretty big gap between Joe Johnson level of disaster, and signing Carlos Boozer for 15 million less than the max.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 8, 2010 6:35 PM CDT up reply actions
right, but AFTER Joe Johnson, as I stated.
There is only one other bad contract after Joe Johnson: Rudy Gay. I think Boozer’s is in that area. So, technically, “After Joe Johnson, Boozer was probably one of the worse signings”
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think he's a much better deal than Gay. Gay is worse than Deng, but got paid like Boozer, who's better than Deng.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 8, 2010 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
It's a Luol Deng contract.
He’s not severely over paid, but he is paid market value. And everyone will therefore hate him after the first time he misses a couple of games with an injury.
by Scotter on Jul 8, 2010 8:53 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Except he's 6 years older than Deng.
With Deng, there should have been some potential improvement built into the payment along with “overcoming” the injury history. With Deng, built into the price was that you were going to get him for six years of which it was extremely likely that he was going to have his best seasons. That can’t be said for Boozer. In fact, it’s likely (statistically and comparables speaking) that his best seasons are behind.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I think the opposite, in some ways.
I think Boozer isn’t going to get any isolation post-up opportunities in Sloan’s offense, which is and always has been predominantly pick-and-roll.
This isn’t a great signing; it was a decent one given the market THIS year, but probably not a good one in a broader context.
And you can’t really blame the Bulls for not getting Bosh. All signs seem to point to the trio planning this a long way back.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 9, 2010 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions
True, but then again you hear Gar Forman say Boozer was their #1 rated power forward in the press confernece
And you want to just rip your hair out (and they can spare me the bullshit about Bosh playing as a center). Do they really believe this? If so, how the hell do we trust this team to continue to get Rose the talent around him to succeed?
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 10, 2010 3:50 AM CDT up reply actions
That's a fair point.
But you also have to take those things with a grain of salt. I don’t think they really believed Boozer was the number one power forward out there. And we all would have loved this signing if it meant getting LeBron or Wade. It didn’t, but it’s still far from the worst signing of the offseason.
"You teach me baseball and I'll teach you relativity...No, we must not. You will learn about relativity faster than I learn baseball." - Albert Einstein
by Shawn Domagal-Goldman on Jul 10, 2010 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
Can't open the list of Boozer comparables
Who are some of the other names in your list? Comparing him to an 80’s player like Jeff Ruland seems laughable considering the advancements made in the field of medicine.
Brad Miller is god.
Chris Webber also was one of the first players to have microfracture surgery
so his sharp decline could be explained by having one massive injury.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 8, 2010 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions
I was wondering how he compares to the Antonio's
McDyess and Davis?
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
The data might all be on sheet2 for some reason
and it’s a 2007 Excel file. Other guys include McDyess, Coleman, Joe Barry Carroll, LaPhonso Ellis, Zo, Grant Hill, Keith Van Horn, Ralph Sampson. By no means is it as good a list of comparables as the Joe Johnson one which is why I didn’t post it until now, but if I could find even a couple examples of players that missed as much time as Boozer early on and then stayed healthy I’d give him a better shot of it.
Here’s the B-R play index of the most successful big men from age 29-33. The best example I can find is Donyell Marshall, though he extended his career by becoming a 3pt shooter.
Why doesn't he compare to Zydrunas Ilgauskas?
Z missed a ton of games with injury and went on to be a fine, injury-free player even into his 30’s?
Brad Miller is god.
Ha, I tried thinking of all the ways he doesn't compare
“Z is more physically gifted relative to his position, easier for him to hold up after losing a step, etc etc”, but the answer is he does compare, and I think that’s a good example of someone retooling their style to stay healthy and effective. I thought of Brad Miller too, and although he dropped off significantly he was still a starting caliber player through age 32. I could see Boozer following Miller’s style.
Yeah, slow plodding, but crafty.
Another thing that is not in your all stats report is that Boozer seems to have his head on straight, unlike a lot of these other players with really bad contracts. And while JJ isn’t a terrible character guy, he doesn’t give you much leadership, being so quiet. And I am a firm believer that if you give a guy max money, that he has to be a leader as well as a producer. I think that Carlos will decline some, but I also think that he is a good character guy who is a hard worker and a vocal leader. All those things, including being a solid All-Star veteran, contribute well to this signing. He is the right type of guy for a Thibs team and I think will mesh much better than STAT would have. If the alternative is David Lee, I would have been happy with that as well, due to his age and lack of injuries, but he doesn’t have all of the leadership and veteran “juice” that Booz has.
I realy appreciate this being put together
I started looking at the various sources last night, but this puts most of the things I wanted to look at in one place.
I’m not that pessimistic about Boozer, but I also don’t disagree that he’s not a super great addition. He’s in the great mess of players that have about equal ability.
20 and 10
I wouldn’t say theres a great mess of players who put up those numbers while playing 34 minutes in Sloans share the ball offense..
How much longer can he put up numbers that close? Who knows?
Oakley, Thorpe, Rodman, Dale Davis, Antonio Davis were still good PF in thier latter years. Plus Boozer is much better offensively than those guys
Career wise he has played 32 minutes a game, He’s not like KG, Duncan, or Amare, upwards of 38 minutes a game, I would assume, Im not gonna look it up
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
Nice work putting this together.
Regardless of how he ages, I’ll be excited to see him play on offense this coming year. The prospect of wiping the boards clean makes me giddy.
As usual, YaoPau brings the thunder.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
I hope Chris Wallace is still a GM in a few years
If we needed to, who else could we even dump Boozer onto?
great post
There are some things that can’t be measured by stats…. like how bad would next season have been if we signed no one and JR pocked the cash savings next season. At a minimum with Boozer we have a psychological win. Add Childress to the team and you’ve got a solid starting 5 that is better than any other team in the east other than Miami and Orlando… and actually, I think we would match up well against Orlando.
So we should have gotten Lee then?
Hooray!
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
boozer was the bigger name
seemingly fit a need, made more noise, couldve attracted lebron….i can understand the logic of signing boozer, but the fact we did not give him the max is really what makes this worth it…the worst case scenerio was boozer at the max…..this isnt the worse case scenerio
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
meh
im speaking of after the joe johnson signing (or else hes it) but realistically were chicago dammit…were getting somebody…and that sounds like a joke of an answer but its true….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Perhaps the high % of assisted buckets is a function of Utah's style...
They ran a ton of pick and rolls with Williams and Boozer. And both were really good at it. So they didn’t need to run as much isolation for Boozer.
I would expect to see more pick and roll with the Bulls next year. But Boozer is still a big upgrade as an isolation scorer over what we had before.
Stockton and Malone
What it should indicate is that Boozer is an excellent finisher, especially since defenders didn’t have to overcommit on Deron as much as they would a Rose. If Rose and Boozer can execute the high screen pick-and-roll, it will open things up tremendously for Rose, who is even more able athletically to beat the switch or the belly up than Williams was, and Deron is magnificent. If Boozer had that much success as the roller with Deron, imagine how much more he will when defenders will be forced to overcommit on Rose due to his athleticism. If Rose’s jumper continues to improve, this should be the best screen and roll combo in the league. Teams will almost have to abandon the trap as a means to defend this.
by messwiththebull on Jul 9, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't discount Williams's passing ability
Williams is a better shooter and passer than Rose at this point. Rose is the better driver/finisher. It’s hard to say whether Rose will be as good/better/worse at the pick and roll than Williams. But I agree that Boozer makes a much better pick and roll partner than anything we’ve had for Rose before.
Willams is a better passer
But i’m not sure he’s a better shooter from the area where the pick and roll is usually executed.
So…gotta say it: this sort of vindicates the Ben Gordon thing.
-by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 1:20 PM PDT
He is definitely a better shooter
At least, last year he was. Maybe Rose has surpassed him by now, who knows.
by ChiTownSportsMaster on Jul 10, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
You guys do know there are stats you can look at to see, right?
They’re even.
Go to “Shot Locations,” 16-23 ft. Essentially even, but Williams is assisted about twice as much more on the shots, indicating to me that Rose’s are more often off the P’n’R pull-up and Williams is coming off of screens.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
It's the 3pointers where Williams currently has an advantage
Perhaps if Rose gets more looks from Boozer out of the post, his 3 point shot will start dropping more.
Derrick's problem wasn't open looks from 3 (guys left him alone out there constantly, dared him to shoot from deep)
it’s that he doesn’t get enough lift or arc on his jumper. It’s very flat.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 12, 2010 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, inside the arc, there's a case for Rose being better.
If Rose shot 3’s like him next year, he’d probably become a better player.
by Stacey_Is_King on Jul 10, 2010 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions
I would never discount Deron's passing ability
the man is magnificent, I love his game. But he is clearly not the athlete Derrick is. He cannot do this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYA59x-P_yM
Notice how Derrick and Miller run the high screen roll. Derrick is able to go right, but jabs fakes right, and is able to beat explode down the middle once the defender briefly leans right anticipating the pick. You’ll notice how Kirk curls down the lane, bringin the defender with him, leaving the right wide open if Derrick did want to use the pick Miller set. Zach Randolph sees that and assumes Rose will curl right off the Miller pick, but Rose is able to take this split second and explode, beating a half aware Zach Randolph to the rim. Deron can’t quite do things like this.
by messwiththebull on Jul 17, 2010 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Now Taj could also have gone to the rim once Zach left him
and Rose could have had the option to throw an alley oop. One reason why Rose’s AST totals aren’t where we’d expect them to be is because he is too damn quick. Taj couldn’t react fast enough, just like Zach.
by messwiththebull on Jul 17, 2010 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions
more likely this was a designed play
and Taj would have gone to the rim if Rose wasn’t able to beat his defender so badly.
by messwiththebull on Jul 17, 2010 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions
"designed play"
hah good one!
something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.
-MarketMaker
by blackoutsox on Jul 17, 2010 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions
You're right. He can't
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsaHYUk6hH4
Not even close.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbcvGM8us0Q&feature=related
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
That's not actually the same thing.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 19, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Tyger has no idea what he sees on the court
let him post his negativity away under some delusion that he’s actually clever.
by messwiththebull on Jul 22, 2010 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Come'on
Derrick is a far superior athlete. Williams might be a little bit underrated as an athlete, but even on those plays you linked he is barely above the rim.
I'll agree that he can't jump his high, but I'll disagree that's the only way to measure athleticism.
I think he’s stronger, and uses his strength better than Rose. That, combined with a difference in 5" of vertical, I think it I think he’s as athletic. And I think he’s quicker on defense.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Yeah
He has less obvious athleticism. He’s not one of those high-jumping/blazing speed guys. But, he’s very strong and very deceptively quick
by ChiTownSportsMaster on Jul 21, 2010 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions
From a statistical, body, and injury standpoint,
the closest comp I can come up with for Boozer is Derrick Coleman. Of course, with Coleman, it was always about his attitude, and in that department he’s not comparable at all. Since Coleman never kept himself in shape, he probably contributed to his own injuries more than Boozer has, and his general laziness probably contributed to the length of time he spent off the court as much as the actual injuries. Now, if he wouldn’t have been such a bum, his production would probably have been closer to the Barkley/Malone level than the Boozer level, so he wouldn’t have been a comp anyway. Just thought I’d throw his name out there.
Doing some searches in B-R.com for players with similar age, height, and production, it’s hard to find a suitable comp (as Yao said). Malone is pretty close, but he was better (although I wonder if the difference in stats could be explained through pace? PER suggests not) and healthier. Most other guys besides Malone and Coleman were not as good at rebounding as Boozer (Jamison, Larry Nance) or not as good at scoring (Horace Grant, Brian Grant, Kermit Washington). Or, they were better defenders (McHale, Dan Roundfield). Or they had other attributes that make them disparate (Kemp with his explosive athleticism, Webber with his overal agility and passing, Schrempf with his skinniness and perimeter game).
It’s kind of surprising, but from a statistical standpoint, Malone really is the closest comp. Comparing their careers through age 28, there are quite a few similarities: True Shooting % (Malone .580, Boozer .577); FT% (Malone .719, Boozer .728); Rbs/36 (Malone 10.6, Boozer 11.2); Ast/36 (Malone 2.6, Boozer 2.7); Stl% (Malone 1.8, Boozer 1.6); Block% (both at 1.1); Offensive Rating (Malone 111, Boozer 112); Defensive Rating (Malone 101, Boozer 104). The big disparities, of course, are in scoring and usage, but the usage helps explain the scoring disparity. Malone was better at drawing fouls (almost double Boozer’s per36 rate), which also increased his scoring punch. And, again, Malone was a tank; he played no fewer than 80 games a season for the first 13 years of his career. But ignoring the fact that Malone was more of a centerpiece and that he was super healthy, the comparison is really close.
by arjoseph on Jul 9, 2010 9:58 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Yeah the games played is amazing
From age 22-34, Malone missed 5 games. What. It’s pretty crazy thinking about how great players get when you start talking top 20 all-time or so. Not only were they among the best offensively, but defensively too, and they were the healthiest. It’s hard for me to wrap my head around how the same person could be elite at all three. Defensively, Malone has a big edge over Boozer, but I won’t argue that, offensively, Boozer probably has some eye-popping comparables.
add in stockton's iron man ways and that team was basically impervious to fatigue/injury.
"If I was to answer that question honestly, I would have to lie to you."
- Isiah Thomas, when asked if any teams were interested in trading for Shandon Anderson
This is not a bad move for the Bulls.
Boozer had a solid back-up in Gibson and is playing next to a defensive Center in Noah. Booz’s game is based on his power and power does not go away with age. Look at his positives. Power, Passing, Post-game and mid-range shooting. When Boozer hits 32 the Bulls will need someone else to step up and become the 2nd scoring option, but I still think Boozer would be good for 18 and 10 at minimum after age 32.
Bosh 2010!!!!!
This makes sense to me
Boozer is a very nice complementary piece and he fits our other pieces. I think he could be ok aging as he doesn’t rely on supreme athleticism. When I look around at the other contracts signed both this off-season and in other off-seasons, it doesn’t strike me as a bad contract. Maybe average, but in this market the Bulls could have done much worse (Stoudemire, Johnson, Outlaw, Gooden, Salmons). The only other contract that has been signed to this point that I think is close to a good deal was the Steve Blake contract.
by JSB on Jul 9, 2010 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions
This is a key point
Boozer already plays a bit of an old man’s game. So he’s less due for a precipitous decline than a player who relies more heavily on being an explosive athlete.
Moreover, playing alongside a lanky, athletic, defensive-minded guy like Noah will reduce some of the concerns about his defense. He won’t be asked to defend the Gasols/Boshes/Howards of the world (at least not primarily), and few teams have two dominant post players.
I also think he’s a better isolation scorer than the stats suggest. I just feel that the Utah system goes to an extreme in utilizing the pick and roll game with Williams.
He might be asked to defend Howard
With his strength, he’s probably better equipped to push Howard out of the low post, with Noah coming over as a weakside helper to alter shots.
So…gotta say it: this sort of vindicates the Ben Gordon thing.
-by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 1:20 PM PDT
Probably trickier given that he's been in Greece the past two years...
It seems like it’d be hard to get a good read on his value as an NBAer, even if good data are available for his overseas stats.
I'll probably write something up if they sign him
My only thing with Childress is the Bulls better be damn sure he can guard SGs before signing him, because I don’t think he’ll be much help on offense with his iffy shot and low assist numbers. I don’t see much that shows he’s the lock down defender some people think he is.
I agree
Aside from the fact that he’s a fresh name, I’m not sure what the excitement is over him. He’s not a shooter, so he doesn’t help us in a “spread the floor” sense. And he’s not a playmaker, so he doesn’t help us in a “take the pressure off Rose” sense. And I’m not convinced he’s even really a SG, but rather is a SF forced to play some at the SG spot because the Hawks had 8,000,000 wing players.
He probably is a better defender than Morrow, but I don’t remember him being a great defensive player (or even a really good defensive player). It seems to me that his appeal is that he’s 6’8" and has been listed at SG. Other than that, I’m not sure what the excitement is.
I’d rather have either a lockdown defender at the SG spot or a sharpshooter at the SG spot. Well, ideally I’d like to have a guy who does both. But that’s probably not an option. Childress doesn’t really seem to do either.
Ya, agreed on that
Let’s look at Rondo and Wade: two guys considered to have solid defense.
Rondo: DRtg: 101 STL%: 3.2 BLK%: 0.4 Stl+Blk: 2.4
Wade: DRtg: 102 STL%: 2.6 BLK%: 2.1 Stl+Blk: 2.7
Childress: DRtg: 110 STL%: 1.7 BLK%: 1.3 Stl+Blk: 1.8
Ya, Childress does not really compare at all to these guys. The DRtg of 110 is very telling. Although 60% TS is pretty darn good, especially for only being a career 36% 3pt shooter.
I like him, but his defense seems not great and can he guard a two?
the problem with his offense is that he's not a stretch the floor player...
So does he fit at all with what we’re trying to do?
He doesn’t appear to be a great defender, may or may not even be really suited to defending SG at all, and he’s not a great shooter from distance. That doesn’t seem to fit any of our needs.
He might be a fine player, but perhaps he’s not the right fit for this team.
josh childress has 258 3pt attempts
in 285 career nba games.
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
I know you hated the Boozer pickup
But you put together an extremely well researched, unbiased post that shows his potential strengths as well as the weaknesses.
It made me rethink some of the things I believed about Boozer.
So…gotta say it: this sort of vindicates the Ben Gordon thing.
-by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 1:20 PM PDT
Hm...it does appear this pickup wasn't the best move
But then again, it seems more and more like there was never really a chance to get bosh, so I mean, isn’t Boozer the best that the Bulls could do?
by ChiTownSportsMaster on Jul 10, 2010 1:01 PM CDT reply actions
Ok, that was awkward phrasing
BUt I guess i’m saying that there was really no other move that made sense in my opinion. I still believe this was a very solid pickup considering the conditions
by ChiTownSportsMaster on Jul 10, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Here is the problem with that logic
There is never an excuse for creating a bad contract. I understand the point that this cap space is only available once, but that is not exactly true. First, there are other things that could be done with cap space. The Bulls could trade for a big contract on a team looking to save money or get into next year’s free agency. Also, the Bulls could have simply signed serviceable players like Redick, Korver, Brewer, Amir Johnson, Josh Childress, Luis Scola, Udonis Haslem, Al Harrington, Matt Barnes, Ian Mahini etc. You take as many of these guys as you can sign to three year deals. In three years, Rose will still only be 24 years old and Noah will be entering his prime. Rose will be at a max deal and Noah will be at something short of the max. There would be plenty of room with which to sign a big name or even one big name and one near big name. Also, since they signed several players to three year deals, they would own those players bird rights and could sign them back to be role players.
Never sign players to bad contracts. Period.
Boozer will help a ton! However, he won’t help 15 million dollars worth.
Thats a very valid point Drose01
But Boozer is being paid market value. I think we can all say he’s an All-star caliber PF right? Olympic team member, etc… One of only 5-6 guys that will give you close to 20 and 10.
When a player is in demand, you have to outbid other teams, and overpay. This signing will not haunt us.
Heck Paxdorf was able to move The Corpse’s terrible contract.
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
Agreed somewhat
This is not a terrible contract, but it is also not a good contract. Boozer will help a ton, if he stays healthy. If his defense gets better under Thibs, this could end up being a pretty solid contract. I also understand the supply and demand issue.
I’m still somewhere in the middle. I just don’t agree with the logic of sign the best player you can and way overpay if you have to to get that player. If the PF market sucked, but you really needed a PF, should you pay the max to an average player just because you need the spot filled and you need to outbid other teams? No. You sign a player that’s going for a reasonable price or make trades.
That said, I don’t hate this signing. I also don’t love it. Unless Boozer stays perpetually injured, this is an ok signing.
And for the record: Howard, Randolph, Lee, Gasol, Bosh, Duncan, GWallace, Kaman, Stoudemire, Jamison, Lopez, and Boozer all get pretty darned close to 20 and 10. Granted Kaman sucks and I like Boozer, but still :)
We didn't sign Boozer to the max
That’s why I think this is a good deal. In this market I bet if he had held out until after LBJ decided, he could have gotten the max from someone.
Yup
If we did, it’s probably a bad signing. We didn’t, but that still doesn’t make it a good contract.
I really don't see it being that bad of a contract
I still haven’t seen any contracts for comparable players that are much better values (see above) that were signed under similar circumstances (open-market, proven performer).
For the record, DSMok over at APBRmetrics board came up with a great advanced statistical adjusted plus minus
sort of like what YaoPau attempted to do with EOPM.
His ASPM has Boozer as the 15th best player in the league last year and a +3.99 (right near as valuable as Pau Gasol):
Rnk Tm Player G MP SPM 1 CLE LeBron James 76 2966 12.16 2 MIA Dwyane Wade 77 2792 9.69 3 NOH Chris Paul 45 1712 6.51 4 ORL Dwight Howard 82 2843 6.31 5 SAS Manu Ginobili 75 2150 5.57 6 LAL Kobe Bryant 73 2835 5.38 7 OKC Kevin Durant 82 3239 5.32 8 SAS Tim Duncan 78 2438 5.21 9 BOS Rajon Rondo 81 2963 4.82 10 LAC Marcus Camby 51 1596 4.81 11 UTA Deron Williams 76 2802 4.42 12 ATL Josh Smith 81 2871 4.32 13 DAL Dirk Nowitzki 81 3039 4.07 14 LAL Pau Gasol 65 2403 4.01 15 UTA Carlos Boozer 78 2673 3.99 16 WAS Gilbert Arenas 32 1169 3.90 17 DEN Nene Hilario 82 2755 3.77 18 TOR Chris Bosh 70 2526 3.62 19 CHA Gerald Wallace 76 3119 3.53 20 DEN Carmelo Anthony 69 2634 3.51
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 14, 2010 7:24 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Also interesting that Boozer rates as better than Bosh.
Other Bulls players of note:
Rose: + 1.52
Deng: +.71
Noah: +1.9
Taj: -.44
Brad: -1.2
Also of note, Ronnie Brewer rates out fairly significantly better in a down year battling injuries (+1.05) than Redick in his career year (-.24). So yeah, let’s hope the Magic match that offer.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 14, 2010 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions
I really want them both
Even if Redick signs we still have $8 million to play with and very little depth in our back-court. With the recent signing of Raja Bell, I think we could Brewer for 3/$15 million. That would be a very good deal in my opinion and still leave some money left over for a backup C such as Brad. Then fill out the last few spots with minimum guys. I would rather spend on 1 serious rotation player like Brewer than on 2 fringe guys.
Meh. I'd be fine rolling with Brewer and Eddie House and keeping some cap space open for trades later.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 14, 2010 9:07 PM CDT up reply actions
So you hope the Magic match for Redick
I might be inclined to agree that a defensive stopper is more important than another 3PT shooter. I would take Brewer/House over Redick/Scrap heap athletic guard.
Interesting work
But statisticals can’t measure defense, I’ve tried everything in the book and haven’t gotten an r^2 over .5. It looks like his solution was to neutralize defensive impact as much as possible so it wouldn’t skew his final results, which is why you don’t see anybody worse than -2 and nobody above 2.5. It’s easy to see why Boozer was rated higher than any of his APM numbers.
Really interesting that he divided contributions into three categories instead of two: offense, defense, and rebounding. Not sure what to make of that, except that with the way APM defines possessions, I’d think offensive rebounding is definitely offense. Either way, cool link.
I'll counter that I think Boozer will be much better defensively here, because he won't be asked to help defend
as much with Noah and Taj in the fold. Boozer is a solid post defender and boxes everyone out on defense (defensive rebounding is a pretty significant part of defense, imo). He struggles with shot blocking because of his pedestrian athleticism and he’s not that fleet of foot laterally so his help D isn’t good. I think his defensive fit here is much, much better.
I would think that given how much better he fits and Thibs’ particular expertise on that end should help turn him either at least into a neutral defender. Probably not a plus defender, but still much better than he has been.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 14, 2010 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions
When are these stats taken from?
They still have Camby listed as a Clipper…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Hmmm
Pretty cool stuff. But I have to be really skeptical about any statistic that rates Camby higher than Carmelo. Nene is also higher than Bosh? Many of these others I could believe (Arenas obviously an outlier due to low number of games), but it still leaves me skeptical.
I think Camby over Carmelo makes sense
I get interested in how people come to conclusions. We have such a limited amount of data to go on with most of these guys, only seeing them in highlight reels and 5 on 5 games a handful of times each year when they’re on TV, all within their coach’s offense, playing only with the teammates provided for them. So it makes sense to try to break that ridiculously complex problem of rating a player into something more manageable, and start looking to see if a player meets certain basic criteria:
(1) Does he look and move like a star athlete? Check.
(2) Do media experts consider him a star? Check.
(3) Does he put up big box score numbers? Check.
(4) Does his team win games? Check.
And if players meet all four criteria, chances are they’re pretty damn good. And, if we’re taking APM and statistical APM as references, that checkoff system works 90+% of the time.
But with any rating system based on just a few categories, players will slip through, and in this case the exceptions will be those who don’t play defense and have talented teammates. From looking at advanced numbers, I’d guess the list of players who’ve slipped through is Amare, Boozer, Carmelo, and probably Derrick Rose so far.
Look at Carmelo’s advanced numbers, and nothing really stands out. Career .544 TS%, turns the ball over a decent amount, not a great passer. For perspective, take the following comparison of Per36 numbers from this season:
Player A: 26.6pts, 6.2reb, 3.0ast, 22.2 PER, .548 TS%
Player B: 24.0pts, 6.5reb, 3.0ast, 20.3 PER, .615 TS%
Pretty similar, right? Player A is Carmelo, Player B is Corey Maggette. Both players rate out as poor defenders, both players are big and super athletic, and their 6-year APMs were similar as well (+1.20 for Carmelo, +1.15 for Maggette). The difference in their perceived value, I think, comes from Carmelo winning a NCAA title and having a great supporting cast in the NBA. Neither of those things mean much imo. Rant complete.
Once again owned by YaoPau
I guess I take guys like Melo, Wade, Bryant and other big name guys for granted. While some of them live up to the hype, some really are just not all that spectacular. Or perhaps more importantly, players that play solid defense, rebound well, and are efficient but not stat stuffers get overlooked.
I’ve got a question though. If the Camby over Melo makes sense, what doesn’t quite make sense about this then? It seems as if you have had a relatively low view of Boozer, but this rates him as the number 15 player in the league. Do you disagree? Is there something this statistic is over/undervaluing? My guess would be that rebounding might be overvalued a bit since it had its own category.
Just curious. I like learning more about these stats.
Here's the problem with the ranking
The ranking is based solely on box score stats, which means it does a poor job of measuring defensive contributions. Now, the rankings do take into account blocks and steals, meaning that some good defensive players who rack up steals and blocks (guys like Josh Smith, Marcus Camby, and Gerald Wallace) will see their defensive contributions accounted for. However, the rankings don’t measure any facets of defense outside of steals and blocks. This means that guys who are good defenders that don’t get an inordinate amount of steals and blocks won’t be separated in the slightest from guys who are bad defenders.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 15, 2010 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Ya, I understand that
Again, the reason why Shane Battier or Bruce Bowen could very well be undervalued. Would creating a stat that used matchup PER be helpful?
I guess
But there are obvious inherent flaws with that too since defense doesn’t solely consist of man-to-man play.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 15, 2010 11:13 PM CDT up reply actions
Fair enough
It just makes me mad that we can statistically show a guys offensive worth, but defensive worth is just so much harder to show.
Still, it’s nice to see a fairly comprehensive statistical tool rating Boozer so highly. One thing is for sure, if Boozer stays healthy, the Bulls will have an excellent frontcourt.
One thing that concerns me about Boozer
The Jazz are a very well run franchise. When I thought they were letting Booz go because they didn’t want to go into the luxury tax, it didn’t make me think that they though something was wrong with Booz. The fact they let him go, and after acquiring Jefferson and Bell are likely to be even higher into the luxury tax concerns me somewhat. What do they know that we don’t? I like Boozer as a player, but I am wondering if the better move would have been to pick up Jefferson (whose contract expires in 3 years). If we had Al Jeffferson, then all of our contracts would be rolling off the books in 3 years, allowing us another shot to run at some big free agents to surround Noah and Rose as they enter their prime.
Well age matters and Boozer is 28 and on a 5 year deal and Al Jeff is on a deal with 3 years left and is younger.
I’d still rather have Boozer.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 14, 2010 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions
The situation with Chris Paul and Deron Williams being so upset...
…(so I’ve read, I don’t have any links) about them losing guys (Matthews, Korver, Brewer, Boozer), maybe they felt they had to do something to keep Deron Williams appeased. If they don’t compete the next 3 years, he’ll be gone.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
You can also look at the situation from this perspective:
Boozer profiles as a PF type; Jefferson a center. Using that premise, Utah might think it be better to use a front-court of Millsap-Jefferson over Millsap-Boozer. I think Boozer is the better player, but all it takes for Utah to let him walk is for them to think he can’t play center. That doesn’t make Booz any less of an option for us.

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