(UPDATE: Brad Miller signs with Rockets) Next step names for Bulls
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 17, 2010 1:14 PM CDT
273 comments
UPDATE: Marc Stein is reporting Brad Miller has signed with the Houston Rockets.
KC:
"The Bulls now have nine players under contract and roughly $7.8 million of cap space left. They remain in discussions with Brad Miller and Kurt Thomas for big-man depth and have had talks about Rafer Alston and Jason Williams as a backup point guard."
NBA sources said the Bulls have had discussions with representatives for Josh Howard, Shannon Brown, Rasual Butler and even Tracy McGrady...Once they've shifted their attention from guards, they probably will try to re-sign a couple of their own free agents, specifically backup center Brad Miller.
(via K_yle33's destroyed fanshots)
0 recs |
273 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
Shannon Brown is a name that hasn't been thrown out there too often.
And I’m not sure why. I think he’d be an excellent backup to Rose. He’s a poor man’s Rose in many ways as it is, but his work ethic seems really good and he seems to enjoy and appreciate interaction with the fans. Signing Brown now would be a good makeup for letting him go in the first place.
Otherwise, Howard and McGrady are fine as low paying fliers. One of them could return to starter quality status, and if that happens we have quite a bargain (and with a short contract, if they don’t’ fit in the starting lineup we could probably deal them as well for something that fits us better/plugs an injury hole).
Miller and Thomas keep getting mentioned. Fine by me if it’s cheap. Brown-Miller-Howard is a fine way to end the offseason in my mind. But if Houston gives Miller too much and Thomas signs elseware, who are our other options besides Richard again?
Backup point guards other than Brown look to not be a huge worry, as Alston or Williams both should be capable of playing 10-15 minutes a game.
I’d almost think about grabbing Alston or Williams AND Shannon Brown, provided Williams or Alston were happy with playing mostly garbage minutes until somebody gets hurt. I’m not sure they would be for the minimum.
he's been a pretty valuable player for the Lakers
I wonder if they’ll resign him. He’s definitely a solid 15ish minutes per game guy.. I just don’t know if he’s a need for the Bulls at this point since he and Brewer bring a similar skill set.. I guess it would depend on what the Bulls think in terms of each player’s ball handling abilities. It seems like we’re searching for more of a true point.
Jason Williams or Shannon Brown Make the most sense at pointguard.
If we are looking for a beyond the arc shooter then Williams is our guy, if its a pg in the mold of rose then Brown is our guy. Either way we still need to pick up a 3 point shooter at SG. Korver is good, but relying on 1 3point shooter isn’t going to get the job done. I think because of Ronnie Brewers ball handling and athleticism Jason Williams should be the pick because that fills our 3 point need and having brown and rose or brown and brewer on the floor at the same time doesnt give us any ability to stretch the floor . If you were to ask me which one is the better pg and fits our team better I would have to go with Shannon Brown because we are building our team around rose, so having a point guard in his mold makes the most sense.
So in a nut shell…. If we get another 3 point SG/SF then Go with Brown
If we don’t then Go with Jason Wiliams..
Shannon Brown and D league 3pt Shooter
Plus Lucas as a deep reserve and thats a solid Guard core. Get Thomas and maybe another guy as an inactive (Read the Bulls talked to Morrison) and the Bulls are set for the time being.
Rose-Brown-Lucas
Brewer-(Almond or Byars or etc)
Deng-Korver-Johnson-Morrison
Boozer-Gibson
Noah-Asik-Thomas
Probably looking at Brown taking guard minutes along with Korver and having that MiscShooter getting some garbage minutes when Korver is at SF. Gibson/Asik/Thomas are your frontcourt rotation and James Johnson becomes your 12th man since he can pick up junk minutes at the 3 or 4. Lucas and Morrison are your inactives.
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions
What?
Since when is shannon brown in the mold of Rose? Brown’s a mediocre ballhandler and incapable of running the point in any NBA offense besides the triangle.
Brad Miller is god.
Exactly, no idea where this stuff is coming from.
He can jump high. That’s it.
by Stacey_Is_King on Jul 17, 2010 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions
But
can he jump out of a pool?
Jeff from Cleveland wrote- I've figured out the moral of the story: Stay in school. Wade: 3 years at Marquette, Bosh: 1 year at Georgia Tech, the kid from Akron: no college. The most educated guy convinced his dumber friends to come play on his team for less money.
Lmao!
Is it me,or do the Packers really suck???
by I love football! on Jul 17, 2010 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions
Shannon Brown's pure point rating last year was 0.25
his first year with out a negative number.
For reference, Pargo’s was 1.05
Unless someone whose watched him a lot can provide strong evidence to the contrary, I’m fairly certain he can not play point at all. Especially on this team with so few secondary ball handlers.
Shannon Brown is NOT a point guard....
I watched him play 3 years in college- his handles are average for a 2-guard, poor for a PG.
He does brings some good skills to the table: very athletic, good defender and rebounder at the guard spot, a decent outside shot, and toughness.
I love SB, and would love to see him on the Bulls, but he is not the man to back up D Rose.
Shannon Brown is the same as he ever was. Don't be fooled by his breakaway dunks on TNT. It's all he can do.
The Bulls will win 50 games this year and (hopefully) the Central Division for a top 3 seed.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 17, 2010 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Yea, I'll just repeat what I said earlier
I can’t remember the last time John Jackson has written anything important, or reported anything of interest that hadn’t been reported in 50 other places first. It sounds like he’s just throwing out the names of a few guys that have been rumored in other people’s articles, not bringing anything new to the table
Superteams suck.
so we have had talks with Rafer Alston???
that’s exciting, we have all said we wanted somebody that can move the ball and definately fits that description, he played very well in Orlando before Jameer Nelson came back… I’m definately all for Skip to My Lou!!!!!!!!
Combine our remaining needs into one trade?
Bulls receive:
Rudy Fernandez, Ramon Sessions
Wolves receive:
Vladimir Veremeenko (from Bulls)
Blazers receive:
James Johnson, Charlotte (lottery protected) 2012 1st-round pick (from Bulls), Wolves 2013 2nd-rounder, cash from Wolves (Blazers are over the cap)
Wolves do this for salary dump. After the Ridnour signing, way too much money on PG’s for even Kahn. Sessions is the most likely to go.
Portland wants a lot for Rudy; taking on Sessions gives the Bulls more assets to make that trade more appealing to the Blazers. Here, James Johnson takes over some of Martell Webster’s minutes and they stockpile lots of assets in exchange for an unhappy Rudy. Bulls fill 2 needs with quality players.
Bulls cap space:
7.8 – 5.3 = $2.5 million left for 2 or 3
(maybe sign AC Law & Kurt Thomas or Brad for cheap)
PG – Rose / Sessions / Law
SG – Fernandez / Brewer
SF – Deng / Korver
PF – Boozer / Gibson
C – Noah / Thomas / Asik
by kthrapp on Jul 17, 2010 12:36 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
I would love to see Rudy Fernandez
on this team, even with the signing of Brewer as it is; The case has been made before but, I think there would be plenty of playing time to go around in between Brewer and Fernandez. I know it’s been said that Brewer never was needed bring the ball up playing along side D-Williams, but we know Rudy can help with the handling abilities too. He’s a good shooter from range, a good athlete, and has the length to be disruptive definsively. I think if the Bulls could pull it off, the only way I would’ve been happier this offseason is obviously landing one of the top three targets; but fuck them, I digress. I’m not sure we can predict what Kahn will do next even in light of what might make sense.
by Dogfishhead on Jul 17, 2010 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Kahn is very motivated to give Sessions away
and if we fill the void at backup PG and it enables us to get Rudy, it makes sense for all parties.
I'm with you...
It’s just that, David Kahn…does things.
by Dogfishhead on Jul 17, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Brewer should be starting over Fernandez, honestly
He’s the better player of the two right now and he plays vastly superior defense. I’d give them both heavy minutes, though.
Sessions would be very interesting. I like him as a starter pretty much anywhere. His numbers dipped last year because he was being used as an off guard in the triangle, because Kurt Rambis is a fucking retard. He’d be an elite back-up point guard, and would be awesome at creating for guys like Boozer and Noah. Plus, he plays some pretty good defense, and he’s big enough to guard most shooting guards.
"Detroit Bad Boys is full of HOMOS ,JACKASSES and NON-sports fans."
-ralphgoblue/thunder_god08
by Thom_not_Tom on Jul 17, 2010 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think I would agree with that assesment; to each his own, though.
Brewer may be the superior defender, but Fernandez is more well rounded when he gives a shit. He’s athletic for his size, a career 38% shooter from range, can pull up, handle the basketball and isn’t at too much of a disadvantage defensively with his frame. Granted he’s not the most laterally quick guard, but he can finish too. I understand he wasn’t engaged last year because he was disatisfied over pt/being a bitch, but I’d want Thibs to play the shit out of him as this team is suited, whether it be off the bench or in the starting line-up.
Yeah, I see your point
"Detroit Bad Boys is full of HOMOS ,JACKASSES and NON-sports fans."
-ralphgoblue/thunder_god08
by Thom_not_Tom on Jul 17, 2010 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Doesn't matter who starts, we have a range of skills at the 2 then.
And basically whoever fits better with the starting lineup will probably start, whoever plays best for long periods will get the most minutes.
I could definitely see the two of them getting anywhere from 18 to 30 minutes each.
Rudy can be a starter on a top 10 team, Brewer? Meh.
Just another slasher with 12 feet of range on his crooked-arm jumper. Whoever gets the 2 job becomes the third scoring option by default, on a team with no dominant superstar scorer. I’m not willing to settle for a guy who can’t score more than a leash length from the net just because he hustles like Michael Curry on D. Rudy’s got legit 3 pt. range and his laser back door cuts make Brewer look like he has cinder blocks for feet. We don’t have enough offense not to have a no-excuses starter at 2 and Rudy is about the only one left on the shelf. To me this is a critical move.
brewer gets a lot of points off cutting to the basket
and would be the fourth offensive option behind boozer, rose and deng.
Doesn’t seem very moral to me. Might as well take Satan’s autograph while you’re at it. - N.C.
I hear you
But I’m wondering how much room there is baseline/paint adding Boozer to Noah hanging out there vulturing off rebounds. This seems like a team that needs to space the floor and I’d just sag the heck off Brewer and dare him to hit that ugly J. To me, it’s scary that a workmanlike guy like latter-day Luol is the second option for Rose to feed. I’m seeing a need for more creativity and range than Brewer’s lob and layups game brings to the table.
I believe this is the best idea I have heard so far!
Very nice Job… Call up Reinsdorf right now!! With the left over cash we could sign Lucas, Miller, and a young SG/SF.
you really think this is a realistic trade for anyone but the Bulls?
because I don’t think the Wolves would do this. You can call Kahn crazy and be correct, but he’s not THAT crazy. And wtf? I know Portland has a new GM, but you really think a deal where the Bulls get the 2 best players in the deal, the blazers receive an OK draft pick, a crappy one from the Wolves, and JJ, and the Wolves get… essentially, nothing, has even a fraction of a chance of being accepted?
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
The Wolves are about to give away Sessions
That’s generally what teams looking to dump salary expect to receive in return: nothing. They give up a 2nd and cash so the Bulls are willing to take Sessions salary.
Portland isn’t going to be playing Rudy this year out of spite. It’s a horrible situation for him so I’d say getting a bunch of assets + a little cap relief is about the most they can expect for a player they plan on using sparingly.
this would be a very solid move, and is within the realm of possibility
i’ve gotta think Portland is getting these types of offers for Rudy right now. while Portland probably doesn’t want to give him away, i don’t think anyone’s gonna step up and blow them away right now knowing the situation there. and there’s certainly a bit of risk in acquiring Rudy if he decides he wants to take his talents to south beach Europe.
by M 80 on Jul 17, 2010 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
According to BallinEurope
Rudy definitely wants out. European teams mentioned are Panathinaikos, Real Madrid and Barcelona. Working out a deal to send him to Europe seems to be a bit tricky though. So I guess we might see him back in the NBA next season. According to Frank Isola, Fernandez gave Portland a list of 5 NBA teams he would like to be traded to: the Knicks, Nets, Bulls, Celtics and Heat.
So I guess he won’t be a Bull.
by LeBryaneWosh on Jul 17, 2010 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions
um Bulls are one of the teams on According to Isola
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
you have bulls in your list
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 6:38 PM CDT up reply actions
I was referring to this
According to Frank Isola, Fernandez gave Portland a list of 5 NBA teams he would like to be traded to: the Knicks, Nets, Bulls, Celtics and Heat.
So I guess he won’t be a Bull.
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 19, 2010 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Love this trade, but...
so far none of our “good ideas” have materialized.
I think it’s foolish to spend major cap space of 2nd and 3rd tier players at this point – especially given that this team will have a hard time getting past the top teams in the East (Orlando, Miami, Boston). We’re better served keeping cap flexibility for the future.
Brewer was a nice pickup but he alone doesn’t round out the SG position (and Korver is – repeat after me – not a SG). Luther Head would be a cheap option (he agreed to a 2yr, $2.3M deal with NO before failing his physical) – if he’s actually healthy. Having Brad Miller back would have been nice, but not at $5M per season. There are enough vets out there to be had for the minimum that will be enough to spell Noah. I also think we need a PG that can take on 25-30% of the minutes in order to not wear out DRose for the stretch run. Dooling would be a good fit but might be a little too pricey.
Here’s how I see it (along with the % team minutes total from last year – from 82games.com to show where our minutes are heavy/light; *Brewer’s minutes limited due to injury):
PG: Rose/Dooling (72/18% = 90% total)
SG: Brewer/Head/Korver (28*/20/13=67%)
SF: Deng/Brewer/Korver/Gibson/Johnson (56/14/10/9/4=93%)
PF: Boozer/Gibson/Johnson/Noah/Deng (37/42/12/10/9=110%)
C: Noah/Old Guy/Boozer/Asik (37/24/30/(5)=100%)
I think we have good front court depth which always seems more critical come playoff time. We’ll see if Thibs can generate enough O to go along with his D…
by bengaljohnboy on Jul 17, 2010 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I wouldn't mind the Bulls taking a shot at resigning Flip Murray
He was good for us in stretches and can handle the ball a little bit as well. He would be a nice scoring option off the bench for us but I’d imagine he would be looking for more minutes with another club.
I’d definitely like to see the Bulls go back after B-Rad.. I think he brings a good toughness and personality to this team that fits right in with our current front court of Noah/Booz/Gibson. I wonder if the addition of Asik and the idea that he will be getting minutes for this team right out of the chute is a factor in Miller not yet resigning with the Bulls. Perhaps he is having some playing time issues. Still, I don’t know if he’s going to find many more minutes elsewhere.
Brad is one of those guys that I'd rather have a beer with
at this point. I guess I’ll preface by saying if we can get him for cheap, fine, but I hope we don’t bid over whatever Houson may offer. The guy is tough, he’s funny; It’s noon right now, he’s probably hammer-timing the Jager right now as I type, but he’s not much for ballplaying anymore. I’m tired of the obligatory ball-fakes, three point-clanks, and the crazy passes. If he wasn’t such a Brad-ass, I’d say don’t offer him much at all.
Josh Howard for me
I read the comments from Dallas fans after he was traded to Washington and there was a strong consensus from the Dallas fans that Washington obtained a real gem in Josh Howard. I was intrigued and watched Howard in Washington via NBA League pass. He was terrific. He wasn’t just good but terrific. He was carrying a terrible team. He also can hit a shot in crunch time. There are downsides. Marijuana, stupidity, won’t be able to start the season and age 30. For the right price and a 2 – 3 year deal he would be a great SG or backup SF.
Dogfishead Has Plan A
Plan B would be Josh Howard, Brad Miller and Shannon Brown( or Jason Williams)
I say make runs at
Fernandez, Flip, or Delonte…in that order.
It looks like West’s legal issues will be behind him soon (won’t be serving any time)…so at that point it just becomes an issue of his mental issues…which seem to be somewhat under control.
Flip did alright towards the end of the season, though I’m not sure if he’ll want more minutes someplace else. I wouldn’t overlook him.
Brad Miller signs with the Rockets
It’s strange how some of these vets are signing for way more than we anticipated (Ray Allen as well), yet the guys we did sign seem to be at relative bargain prices.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 17, 2010 1:12 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
Yeah
I still don’t know what the fuck Kahn’s problem is. And according to ESPN.com’s salary machine, I’d have to work 365 days to earn what Joe Johnson makes everytime the ball goes through the hoop.
Yesss!
hopefully that means Kurt Thomas to the Bulls.
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Kurt Thomas??? Really?
A 39 year old 6-9 230 pound center?
We might as well have Taj playing center..at least he can block and rebound.
Yeah....
No thanks… Take an undrafted free agent in the 7 foot range who has a decent jump or knows how to raise his hands when shot on….
what are you guys sniffing?
Kurt Thomas was really useful last year. better than any unsigned guy you could find. per 36 minutes he averaged 10 rebounds and 1.6 blocks. DRtg of 100. he’d be a good addition. and as much as i don’t like signing a guy as a “mentor”, he could be one for our young bigs.
by M 80 on Jul 17, 2010 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
great teammate and super smart vet
totally different (actually effective!) defender compared to brad. can still bury the 18 ft jumper, without jumping, lol!
he’s really old, so i hope thibs wouldn’t lean on him too much. he was running out of gas last year at the end in place of bogut. that’s when he won’t look good.
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
we got that
he’s asik. thomas is the veteran help, you know, the surefire thing
We have Chris Richard to provide that utility.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Funny how 4 of the 5 of guys starting against Sacremento looked good.
Richard wasn’t one of them.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Kurt Thomas was pretty excellent filling in for Bogut this year. His PER sucked, but he was great on interior D.
The Bulls will win 50 games this year and (hopefully) the Central Division for a top 3 seed.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 17, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions
Kurt Thomas is gross, man
All I want in life is for UC fans to chant: Deeeeeloooonte during Heat games
by Belize on Jul 17, 2010 1:22 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I have a personal hatred of Brad Miller
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
thats sucks...
Brad should never be hated by a Bulls fan…just sayin
All I want in life is for UC fans to chant: Deeeeeloooonte during Heat games
by Belize on Jul 17, 2010 4:15 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
WTF? How can you hate Brad Miller?
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
by Illini15 on Jul 17, 2010 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree
but 3 years for 15 mil. that’s too much to be paying a 34 year old man like Miller, that’s the same contract the bulls gave Korver………………..well, i’m glad the bulls are learning from previous past mistakes
by Jermal on Jul 17, 2010 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I have a feeling that 3rd year isn't guaranteed
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 17, 2010 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions
No doubt...
No longer the bulls of old its seems.. You have to look at it this way though. It’s a lot easier to sign good contracts when you don’t have to overpay players to come to your team. Being a legitimate title contender during the contract has a lot to do with those salaries ..now if we could just get denver to trade anthoy for deng!
He's more valuable to Houston
than to us, because of Yao’s injury history and their utter lack of height aside from Yao. Miller would be capable of starting in Yao’s absence, so some of the $15 mil is “insurance,” sts
Bring on Kurt Thomas?
I guess that would give us the best defensive frontcourt depth in the league, as Asik, Taj and Thomas are all solid (are at least supposed to be) defenders.
The way I see it.
Noah, Asik, Taj, Kurt = rugged, tough, defensive minded.
Boozer = offensive talents of the previous 4 combined.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
I would rather have A.J . Ogilvy off of our summer league roster then kurt thomas...
He was top 3 best center in the SEC…and for those of you that don’t know..that was the conference Demarcus cousins was in at Kentucky
he's looked terrible in summer league
really terrible.
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
that means nothing
that’s like saying “Jannero Pargo was one of the 3 best point guards on the Bulls last season…and for those of you that don’t know…that was the team Derrick Rose was point guard for.”
Ogilvy has not looked good. At all.
I’d take Samardo Samuels over Ogilvy or Chris Richard. Possibly even Kurt Thomas.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
The NBA where amazing happens
I never thought he would get a three year deal. He will be 37, yes 37 years old in the 3rd year. The NBA where amazing happens.
was def hoping to bring him back
but not at that price… how’d they afford that anyway?
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
Fuck
Lebron, Redick and now this. I am upset.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 17, 2010 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
New sig now for you?
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
by Illini15 on Jul 17, 2010 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
The one Morey signing I disagree with
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
NOOOOOOO
He’s my fav bulls not named rose or noah. Man, this suck..really wanted him back. But glad he got what he wanted..money wise that is. Gonna miss ya bradass. Pause
All I want in life is for UC fans to chant: Deeeeeloooonte during Heat games
by Belize on Jul 17, 2010 1:21 PM CDT via mobile reply actions 2 recs
Boozer
played between a third and a half of his minutes at C the last 3 years. Even if Omer can play, I expect some lineups will feature Boozer at C alongside Taj at PF.
A third and a half?
If you mean 1.5/3, it should just be a half lol.
by Stacey_Is_King on Jul 17, 2010 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Read one word earlier
“Between”. Some years he was closer to a third. Some years he was closer to a half.
I would like to think that part of the reason we let Brad go
was due to how pleased the org is with Omer’s workouts, but I’m pretty sure it’s just the $$$. Which is ok. Hate to see B. Mills leave, but that is just too much.
There are really only two plays: Romeo and Juliet, and put the darn ball in the basket.
-- Abe Lemons
Now to me the burning question is...
Will the Bulls bite on the Miller eyebrow raise/pump fake when they play Houston?
by dbrown25 on Jul 17, 2010 1:35 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Bulls can put their worst their worst defender on him, probably Korver
and still be okay
Reminds me of some of the "tells" in Mike Tyson's Punch Out
Maybe if the defender punches him when he raises his eyebrows, he’ll get a star.
I bite on it just watching on TV
It’s unstoppable…
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Jul 17, 2010 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I'll miss his personality, but I'm fine with the Brad thing...
besides the obvious money issue…just having 1 decent performance every 10 games isn’t a ratio the team needed. His offensive efficiency towards the end of the year was atrocious
by NormVanBeer on Jul 17, 2010 1:36 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Good for Brad
getting that kind of money at the tail end of his career is awesome.
by JockstrapNoah on Jul 17, 2010 1:45 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
I agree I mean I'm glad that he got paid.. He definitely has a good agent!
But..there is no way i would want to pay him over 2 mil a year to play center that is fighting for second string..
There's a good chance
that Yao doesn’t play 82 games this year. They probably wanted a decent backup. He’s more valuable to that team then he is to the Bulls.
by JockstrapNoah on Jul 17, 2010 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions
No, any team starting Brad Miller at center should probably be thinking "lottery" over playoffs anyways.
In December that is.
I don’t hate Houston’s signing all that much, just because if Miller is really not guaranteed for a third year, he’ll be easy to move as early as this February.
Teams get desperate for bigs, and Miller had a good career and doesn’t suck to the extent that a coach will tell him not to shoot. So you have a veteran big that can justify taking shots (though look at his 3 pt %, and that’s mostly wide open 3s, OUCH), making 5 million a year, not hard to move.
That said, damn, 5 million is about twice as high as his performance probably justifies here.
That would be Chicago Jazz and no...
The good players from utah are finally seeing the light and makeing the right choice..
that is awful lot of money for Brad Miller
more power to him, but stat geek Morey may have blown a gasket here. I know Adelman probably likes Miller, but the guy can’t move anymore. He is a year away from being done.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 1:47 PM CDT reply actions
He was pretty done this year. He was below average on offense and terrible on defense.
The Bulls will win 50 games this year and (hopefully) the Central Division for a top 3 seed.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 17, 2010 9:21 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes he would,
After reading all of the comments and looking at Shannon Brown, he’s got to be the Bulls top target. He can back-up Rose, and also do the combo thing like Hinrich last year and get some minutes at SG. He’s not a thirty-something year old journeyman point guard who can “hold the fort” while Rose takes a breather, he can actually help the Bulls win games, and at 24, hopefully his best years are ahead of him. He would really fit in with a team mentality of a swarming defense and getting points in transition. They should collect as many good athletes as possible.
Are his ball skills good enough to run the point?
I ask because I honestly don’t know. My gut feeling is that they are not, but I could be wrong.
Well
You didn’t see much of him handling the ball in L.A. becuase of the roster (Odom/Farmar/Fishcer) so I don’t know either.
i follow the lakers. regarding shannon
tremendous athlete but
1. decent handle, but not under pressure
2. no confidence passing into the post
i think he’svery coachable, though. he’s not boneheaded.
he just isn’t fundamentally sound in some areas.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
He would be a good defensive complement to Brewer
Supposedly some of the quicker 2 guards give Brewer some problems. Brown would be ideal to match up on those guys.
I think Brown can only play the 2 guard. He has very little point guard skills
and only played the point when Kobe was in the game handling the ball.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
So we would need Brown + a back-up for Rose?
That’s ok with me considering Rose and Brewer (maybe Korver) are the only guards on the roster right now. The only question is if we are better off w/ someone that can shoot like Eddie House than Brown. If we get Brown we end up with:
Rose/Backup PG/Brown
Brewer/Brown/Korver
Deng/Korver/Johnson
Boozer/Taj/ Backup Big Man
Noah/Asik/ Back-up Big Man
Gets us to a roster total of 12
Well, I think the Bulls need more talent at back up guard than
the guys currently on the market. I’d be happy with CJ Watson as a back up point guard, but I like to see the Bulls use their cap space to grab a Sessions or Lou Williams. Someone who can run the 2nd team and provide a lift out there – not just a placeholder until the starters get back in.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Holiday is the starter
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=phi
but they were playing about equal minutes. I don’t think getting Williams would be cheap, I think you would have to include a draft pick and perhaps Philly doesn’t want to trade him at all, but they will be over the luxury tax when the season starts meaning they are going to give away someone at some point.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions
If they got rid of Lou Williams
It would be a religious ammount of faith they put into Jrue Holliday (last year’s youngest player) to run the show for them.
by Dogfishhead on Jul 17, 2010 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
well, they made him the starter
if you look at the season splits, they cut Williams minutes every month as the season went further and further along while Holiday’s steadily went up. I think they’ve already made their choice, the question is whether they want to hold onto Williams to be the back up or not. I’m not saying they won’t want to keep him, I would just explore the idea of getting him.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeah,
I like Lou Williams. And I like his contract. But if Phila got rid of him, and sent him over here to be a solid back-up pg here, I think they’d be in the same situation we are in.
Honestly
I don’t consider CJ Watson much worse than Lou Williams. Sessions is easily the best of the three, but I would be happy with Watson.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
With easily being the operative verbage there.
I don’t think Sessions dwarfs Lou Williams, but—carry on!
I've just never been big
on Lou. I guess I’m underrating him a little.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
Lou Williams of Philly?
He’s the best of the three. Easy.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I remember at the begining of last season
Kobe was really high on Shannon Brown saying that he’s improved greatly and is a key to their winning. I’m not a Kobe fan boy or nothing but I take what he says seriously he’s got some major air also.
He could just be trying to build Brown’s confidence, after all Kobe claimed faith in Smush Parker until the bitter end.
by chowder on Jul 17, 2010 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Bye Brad.
We still love you. Don’t kick Yao in the knees during practice.
So the Heat got LeBron. Thought of hittin' the Booze, but then I realized I don't give a Deng. We've got long Rose of banners and we'll be getting some more. You Noah I'm sayin?
by Osaka on Jul 17, 2010 1:55 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Bon voyage, Mr. Miller.
It’s been swell!
eat. sleep. hoop. repeat. become legendary.
by Sir Buckets on Jul 17, 2010 1:59 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Take a chance on a cancer?
Rashad McCants
Just read the article about him from ESPN Mag.
Physically, he seems perfect for the Bulls. Emotionally, he sounds like a total bummer.
Probably not worth the trouble…but the skills, man, the skills. Wonder if he could handle being a backup, or if he would just sulk.
that's why i'm a little surprised about Williams and Alston
don’t both have histories of being douchebags?
Stay away!
I just went to the McCants website and there is section about Mental Illness. As Seinfeld would say, “there is nothing wrong with that” except it does not mix well with basketball.
by chgobr on Jul 17, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Alston more than Williams, I think
Williams coexisted pretty well on a conference finals team last year and has a ring. Alston got cut by Miami last year because he couldn’t handle being a back up point guard.
"Detroit Bad Boys is full of HOMOS ,JACKASSES and NON-sports fans."
-ralphgoblue/thunder_god08
by Thom_not_Tom on Jul 17, 2010 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd be tempted to
McCants seems to suffer from the disappointment of not being the star he thought he could be or believes he should be. But as you said, his game is tantalizing.
by messwiththebull on Jul 17, 2010 4:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Yeh it’s a shame, McCants should be in the league. He can play, kinda one dimensional but he’s a good enough scorer to justify a rotation spot. Crazy scorers don’t last long in the league, look at Kirk Snyder and Von Wafer.
Also Shannon Brown isn’t good at basketball, he can dunk and do spectacular blocks. Not that great at team or man to man D, can’t really shoot, iffy ballhandling and passing skills. But man he can JUMP so he must be good. He’s not.
Williams or Alston wouldn’t be a bad choice for backup, his handles are excellent and he can run a team, bad on D and can’t shoot but he’s a backup so that doesn’t matter….some attitude issues tho…
You're wrong about Shannon Brown
If he had to play big time minutes, he would make enough plays to win.
If he can play for the Lakers, he can contribute for the Bulls.
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
You don't start for Tom Izzo for 3 years....
……without being a good man-to-man defender.
Brown can D up.
josh howard was a legit all-star
a big key to a 60 win team. he’s still not too old, but he’s always getting severe ankle turns or worse leg injuries. and the knucklehead (maryj, race talk on camera) occurs on court too.
for years he’d terrorize the suns in the first half, only to pull multiple bone headed plays or moves out of his dumb dumb bag. it was hilarious how he could be counted on for this, handing it back. so i don’t know.
doubt thibodeau is gonna run out a five man second unit. still say they need a true combo kirk replacement, and i think they consider brewer and korver 2/3s. shannon brown seems like a point only in the triangle. i think it’s interesting that he had so much trouble with that offense and with defensive rotations and yet phil gave him the minutes, even when his shot wasn’t there. has anyone mentioned the bulls have any interest in delonte (best choice) or keyon dooling (second best)?
rasual always impressed me when playing the suns, but then a lot of guys did when they weren’t being defended on the perimeter and i wasn’t expecting anything from them in the first place. same with rashad, i’d like to read that article…
after delonte, and perhaps dooling, it’s a bunch of blah for me. they could try howard, or the romain sato guy…
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
I wanted Delonte too
but with all the jokes about him possibly railroading moms…I just don’t know if I could put up with a season of that.
Steph Curry
Plays for Golden State. Your argument is invalid.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
i think dooling would seem consistent compared to brown
they had shannon not long ago at all, so gotta assume they know what he’s about.
as far as delonte’s craziness goes, was rodman less crazy?
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
damn sb nat page moves - reply to chgobr
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
Touche!
We barely held Rodman together with MJ, Scotty and Phil. My understanding is that Delonte has Manic-Depressive Illness and without medication can be a risk to harm self or others. I believe he has been non-compliant with his medicine when he goes off. I’ll take Marionette as our backup verses Delonte.
marionette?
not recommended! but if you have a hot tub time machine….
and you were supposed to say, “but rodman was 3x the player” and i would reply he was 3x as crazy. :-)
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
The whole rudimentary
risk/reward thing applies here I think.
Not to mention MJ
literally bitchslapping fools. Ask Steve Kerr.
Rodman didn’t want none.
Dooling
Dooling has his own baggage at 6’3" from HoopsHype
Great athlete… Very long… Could develop into a pretty good defensive player… Not a good shooter… Not a great playmaker… Makes wrong decisions very often.
I think that's an old assessment. Isn't he like 28-29 now?
I think that may have been a rookie profile. Anyways, yeah, he’s about what we need for a low-paid backup. We could probably nab him for the vet’s minimum. So, put a deal in place with him and then use the remaining 7.8 million on a backup center and SG.
Carlos has provided us with a great winter drinking game. Evertime Booze puts up a shot, you put one down.
by Another Afflicted Chicago Fan on Jul 17, 2010 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions
i'm apparently in the minority in not wanting to use it all
i think they need to hit a home run at this point ( to really make a difference), and would hate to have an opportunity missed because they were just outside the 125% on a trade.
that’s the appeal of josh howard. but nothing’s perfect, at least nobody out there being mentioned is. hopefully whoever is coming will be cheap.
look, i figure there’s only about 18 minutes left available in the rotation. i don’t want to blow all the money on insurance, as much as insurance is nice.
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
by marionette on Jul 17, 2010 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It's kind of the "two in hand is worth two in the bush"
but with a potential lockout looming, your reasoning is better.
Some team will likely be desperate to shed a cumbersome contract, almost regardless of team depth, on their way to the lottery.
Carlos has provided us with a great winter drinking game. Evertime Booze puts up a shot, you put one down.
by Another Afflicted Chicago Fan on Jul 18, 2010 7:50 AM CDT up reply actions
You got the cliche wrong...
“one in the hand, is better than two in the Bush”
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 18, 2010 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions
OK, 15 million over 3 years for Brad and 12.5 for Brewer?
That’s it! I’m officially sold on Gar.
Brad was a great backup but just remember how the the game seemed when he was on the court.
I also remember the games where he was out only big man with 4 guards runnin on his side.
I aint gonna miss him too much, especially at that price.
He’d be a fool not to jump on that contract
by Option27 on Jul 17, 2010 3:05 PM CDT via mobile reply actions 1 recs
Great Pickup by Houston
We’ll miss you, Brad! Have fun playing with your own coach Rick Adelman in H-Town. Sorry u had to endure Vinny D & Joke Paxson wh are trying to devalue you.
Finish strong & enjoy playing with chase budinger!
by bbmichal on Jul 17, 2010 3:42 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Like 1996
Fricken Hilarious.
Carlos has provided us with a great winter drinking game. Evertime Booze puts up a shot, you put one down.
by Another Afflicted Chicago Fan on Jul 18, 2010 7:51 AM CDT up reply actions
What the hell is this stuff about Shannon Brown??
The dude does nothing above average. We’d be better of with Lucas.
Rest of Offseason
7.8 mil remaining
1. Trade James Johnson ANYWHERE for 2nd rounder (7.8 + 1.7 = 9.5)
1. Sign Josh Howard to 3 year 12 mil contract (9.5 – 4 = 5.5)
2. Sign Shannon Brown to 3 year 12 mil contract (5.5 – 4 = 1.5)
3. Sign Kurt Thomas to a 2 year 3 mil contract (1.5 – 1.5 = 0)
4. Sign Matt Bouldin, Samuels, and Almond to league minimum
PG: Rose, Brown, Bouldin
SG: Brewer, Howard
SF: Deng, Korver, Almond
PF: Boozer, Taj, Samuels
C: Noah, Asik, Thomas
by K_yle33 on Jul 17, 2010 4:00 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I would not trust Shannon Brown as the back-up to Rose...
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Yeah, not sure what universe Shannon Brown is a PG
Cuz in mine he’s a swingman.
Carlos has provided us with a great winter drinking game. Evertime Booze puts up a shot, you put one down.
by Another Afflicted Chicago Fan on Jul 18, 2010 7:53 AM CDT up reply actions
KC Johnson: Brad Miller on Joakim Noah: “"He was a big reason I would’ve stayed. He’s a great person on and off the court.” Over 1 hour ago.
All I want in life is for UC fans to chant: Deeeeeloooonte during Heat games
by Belize on Jul 17, 2010 4:14 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
AKA "He's got good weed hookups. Don't know if I can say the same about Luis Scola."
Pat Riley is the devil.
weak
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Jul 17, 2010 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
Ouch! That hurts
to hear Brad say that. I really liked having him here, as he brought that old-school “Rick Mahorn” vibe to this front court—earth bound, wiley, and with a rough streak.
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
“It’s my favorite coach [Adelman] I’ve ever played for. I know [Martin] real well from our Sacramento days. Luis [Scola] had a heck of a year. And I finally get to play with Yao [Ming] instead of guarding his big butt. The team is pretty solid,”
All I want in life is for UC fans to chant: Deeeeeloooonte during Heat games
Godspeed Brad
I’ll miss watching you lumbering down the lane in a Bulls jersey.
by ToroToroToro on Jul 17, 2010 5:05 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
Bulls Organization goes Cheap
Sure Brad’s contract was big, but Orlando just paid JJ Redick $40 million over the next 3 years. The team is better and I should be happy about that, but it’s sad when Chicago is the small market team and teams like Utah, Miami, Orlando, and others are being the big market teams.
After 2 years of tanking for a failed offseason, JR is going to hold his chips so that he doesn’t have to go over to re-sign D-Rose and Noah.
you think brad miller should have got 5 mil a year when we already have 2 centers?
I’d rather spend that 5 million on a backup PG and backup SG….
by K_yle33 on Jul 17, 2010 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
No backup PG/SG costs that much
I’d call ourselves the Utah Jazz of the East, but their owner spends money.
by Niwrad on Jul 17, 2010 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
why wouldn't a backup
PG/SG cost that much? we just paid our backup SG/SF the same contract brad got.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
Who is available that costs money?
Most guys left are min salary.
Great job by Gar Foreman and Paxson
Gar Foreman and Paxson have put us as a possible top ten NBA team with a good chance to get to the ECF and an outside shot at the NBA finals. Marionette above points out how well Gar and Paxson have done this summer considering we had little chance of getting the top three.
i’m apparently in the minority in not wanting to use it all
i think they need to hit a home run at this point ( to really make a difference), and would hate to have an opportunity missed because they were just outside the 125% on a trade.
look, i figure there’s only about 18 minutes left available in the rotation. i don’t want to blow all the money on insurance, as much as insurance is nice.
Foreman and Paxson did a great job. It appears they upgraded this team without trading for or signing a FA to a terrible contract. Now for the negative Nancy’s to try to construe this into the Bulls are cheap. It really gets old hearing that same tune over and over again. The tune I’m hearing is the “org” has done a terrific job this summer.
by chgobr on Jul 17, 2010 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
Miller would have helped this team
More than Asik. They chose money over winning in this scenario. No other way to argue it.
Fight the Negative Nancy's
Everything I hear about Asik is he is a significant upgrade to Miller. Asik is young, big, athletic and I hear a beast on defense. I take Asik over Miller and I like Miller.
Niwrad don’t get sucked into the distorted bias against the “org” on this site. I know it is hard to go against the sites leadership culture of bashing Foreman and Paxson. All GMs make mistakes. You do not have to agree with every move the organization makes but BaB leaderships’ bias against the org, constantly looking for reasons to bash them is so different than other SB Nation blogs. I agree with Marionette above, we hit a home run this summer. The org kept us well positioned for the future. Look at other teams that have the albatross of a horrible contract stifling their ability to improve. Look how long it took to get out of Ben Wallace’s contract. The contracts we signed this summer can be used as great chips if we see a trade opportunity. The are valuable because they a steals.
The org did a great job this summer. The drone of the Negative Nancy’s can be heard in the background.
You've never seen Asik
So saying he’s a better player right now than Brad Miller is a stretch. And this isn’t a big contract, it’s essentially 2 years with a team option for the 3rd.
It’s not just Brad Miller. It’s a team that would rather sit on $7 million in salary cap space than pay for a guy who will help. Look at the other teams in this league that win. They spend and sometimes have to overpay for a guy who helps (look at Orlando).
This is Chicago, we shouldn’t have the attitude of some small market team who cheers being fiscally responsible and saving money.
You've never seen Asik
The guys running the Bulls have.
by Grinder in Training on Jul 17, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Good points
Good pick-up regarding the option for the third year. I did not realize that. I have never seen Asik and get information from other writers. It is only my opinion that Asik is a Miller upgrade. I plead guilty to loving NBA basketball and the Bulls. I agree we should be objective about what the org does. I cannot stand the small market press sucking up to the team when they make terrible moves. I’ve criticized the Chicago beat writers for doing just that. I was the Org’s biggest critic regarding the Wallace signing. I called him The Corpse during his latter tenure here. My sense is BaB leadership is not objective about Paxson and Foreman. I do praise Matt for his ability to be provocative and stir up dialogue. At times the provocativeness gets awfully close to downright hatred of the Bulls not seen on any other SBNation blog.
The Corpse
Yeah, that was me leading the early charge on this nickname.
Just saying. : D
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
um, while i think they did well
i actually said they need to hit a home run, as in now, to make a difference.
this place can be oppressively negative, though. i probably should join “the background”, since i was notoriously anti-booz and blasted korver as uni-dimensional as well. but i was pro-thibodeau two years ago, and with all these utah guys on board, i can’t believe he’ll watch all that film and ignore implementing what they did well: the awesome utah offense. that, plus the fact this will only benefit deng (who’s rep’s been damaged more by the coaches post-skiles than his injuries) has me optimistic for thibs’ teachings being implemented.
the org has been smart with money lately, and that is the best habit to have when trying to build a consistent winner. (actually learned this, in part, from blogabull!) i’m hoping they stay smart for the rest of this summer (and henceforth, why not?).
want to add: my favorite thing about this place might be the affirmative effects of the continual realization there are actually more negative people in existence than me!
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
oh yeah...
my “home run” addition would realistically (?) be a little solo shot. like rudy or xavier.
The name of the team is ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS - "I tried to convince them that what they were doing was an aberration, an imbecility, a stupidity without name"
Brad Miller at 3 years does not help this team.
Even the biggest supporters of him would know that. If we really end up needing a back up center, we can find someone similar to Brad Miller at the deadline. He’s nice and all, and a good guy to root for, but come on, 3 years at 15 million? Ridiculous waste of cap space. You can call it cheap, but the fact is it’s also smart.
by Grinder in Training on Jul 17, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions
That's why it's basically a 2-year deal
Only $1 million is guaranteed in the final year. It’s a 2 year deal that would have helped this team. But hey, Chris Richard will be fun to watch.
I doubt Richard next year is that much different than Miller.
That’s less extreme than your pro Miller points.
Look, besides the constant whining to the refs and the Perkins like “I have a shit in my pants that won’t come out” faces, I liked Brad Miller.
But if you watched Bulls games last year, you’d notice how much he’s deteriorated. He just rolls to the 3 point line on the pick and roll and takes wide open 3s, a shot he hits under 30%, which also removes some offensive rebounding from the set.
He’s too careless with his passes and some of his dribbles for a veteran big man and he can’t play defense anymore. How many lazy hacks did he send at players shoulders and waists as they completed a bucket and foul shot last year? Is there a stat for that?
Brad Miller is somebody who can play 10-15 minutes per game at center if you need it. It will be a major step down from a decent NBA center. He can hit an open jumper and he’s not retarded, nor will he cause trouble in the locker room. He may actually help with younger guys.
That’s all he really offers at this point. 5 million a year, even for one year is too pricey. In a perfect world, sure we sign Miller for 2 years, 5 million TOTAL. But for anywhere near 5 million, you wish him the best and move on, so not worth it.
by RyPac13 on Jul 17, 2010 7:35 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Helped this team?
Using up your valuable cap space on a guy who is nearing retirement that has skills that can be found at the deadline? That is not helping the team. There will be better deals out there if Asik ends up being a bust.
by Grinder in Training on Jul 17, 2010 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
How do you know Miller would have been better than Asik?
First of all, we have not seen Asik play a minute of NBA basketball, and secondly, Asik only cost 1.3 million. Stop thinking “cheap” and start thinking “opportunity cost”. Asik’s contract gives us the opportunity to sign or trade for a player with that extra 3.7 million/yr. The next best alternative might be BETTER than Miller.
I’m more with marionette now that I re-think our situation. Think about those teams leery of a lockout that don’t want to pay their higher priced players whether there is a stoppage or not.
I’m still of the opinion that we trade for Rudy Fernandez with the Bobcat’s pick and a couple of second rounders, if possible. Also, if Portland wants to have the opp to flip picks with us, give them that, too. We’re going to be close, if not ahead of Portland in the overall standings. They’ll probably improve and have like the 5th or 6th best record in the league while we’re sitting at the 6th to 10th best record. We’ll obviously be good, but that Portland org tends to inflate their abilities like “the annoying friend at the bar.” If we get Fernandez, we will inevitably increase his value with the new system, 30 min/gm as backup SG and PG (a.k.a. Kirk Hinrich). I see Brewer getting about 25-30 min/gm
Trade possibilities for mid-feb that are potential difference-makers:
Monta Ellis (of course)
Iguodala (heh)
Any CAVS player
(step right up and choose your mediocre player, any player)
Ben Gordon? Rodney Stuckey? “De-troit sucks”
Jose Calderon, Leonardo Barbosa
Chris Paul & Okafor (What a whack backcourt that would be)
David West (Give up Gibson) Rudy and DW form best bench in league
Jason Thompson (see above)
Paul Millsap (asks for trade buried behind Al)
Carlos has provided us with a great winter drinking game. Evertime Booze puts up a shot, you put one down.
by Another Afflicted Chicago Fan on Jul 18, 2010 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions
Trading for Paul Millsap after signing Boozer would be fucking hilarious
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 18, 2010 11:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm an Asik fan.
There’s definitely no way this is going cheap over talent.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Knowing nothing of Asik.......
…..the Bulls made the right move by not trying to match Houston’s offer to Miller. Does anyone remember how gawd-awful Miller looked at the beginning of last season???
That’s going to be more of the norm than the exception over the lenght of his new contract. Give it a year, and Houston will regret that contract.
I like Brad, and wish him well, but he was not worth that kind of $$ to the Bulls. Regardless of who else they have signed or not signed
don't make me get the hose
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 17, 2010 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Huh?
We tried to pay Redick, but he got matched.
I’m glad we didn’t blow 3/15 on Miller.
by RM on Jul 17, 2010 5:59 PM CDT up reply actions
You're glad JR makes more money this year?
That is pretty much the option at this point.
If its not spent it also leaves flexibility for any trade deadline moves
Like bringing back the Captain!
And Brad Miller was great to watch as a fan. Except the times where he couldn’t get across the lane, and watched someone lay it in. Or the times he couldn’t jump to get a rebound.
From what I hear Asik is a suitable replacement
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
if the wiz take james johnson and picks
why not get kirk back and clean up the rotation a little bit if nothing comes to fruition, he is getting 8.5 mil this year? so subtract johnsons salary of 1.7 (i think) and it takes up only 6.8 leaving the Bulls a little over the cap but no where near the tax. I think they are allowed to take back 125%? throw in whatever point guard the bulls had as a back up and it could be feasible
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Not till December if I recall correctly.
But I was joking, no way in hell the I want Kirk back. Physically, he is done.
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
He's not physically done. He's 29.
And with his style of play and work-ethic, Hinrich will be an effective player in this league for many years to come.
Still, I don’t want him back either. :P
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Jul 17, 2010 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions
to be honest
I’d like him back when his contract is up and hopefully Rose has hit superstar levels (about 2 seasons from now)
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions
assuming a far cheaper contract of course
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess this is to be expected.
The “bring back BG” stuff was louder, so it’s only natural there is some “oh trading Kirk was dumb, we should bring him back.”
So we’d pay him his 9 million this year, and go over the cap, taking away a few more million the org would make for staying under the cap?
Does that effectively mean we’d pay Hinrich 11-13 million next season?
Also, we’d lose any potential Johnson had (ok, that one isn’t a big deal) but we’d also lose out on the ability to add another big to the team, something that I think should be a priority.
Look, if we’re going to go over the cap, we could do some better things than this.
And can you even go over the cap in a trade like that? i thought you had to stay under if you weren’t matching within 10%?
he is on a declining contract
and has Brewer now to keep him on less minutes a game so he’ll be fresh, plus his contract expires in two seasons, he gets 8.5 this year and 8 the next.
This would be a trade deadline move, so its more of a last resort before the playoffs
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Jul 17, 2010 7:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Kirk would be a good fit on this team now
He’s a good 3rd/combo guard and the Bulls could definately use someone like that now. This is not going to happen this season anyway. Washington is not going to ‘salary dump’ him back to us. I pretty much take them at their word that they brought him in for the reasons they said. They’ll want to keep him for at least this season.
We could certainly use someone to fill the 3rd/ combo guard role this year, Sessions maybe…
i think we have to see what the Bulls do over the rest of free agency and
before the trade deadline. But i agree, if they end the season with a bunch of cap space its a mistake and proves the organization won’t spend money.
(Although I think 3 years, $15 million is way too much for Miller)
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I think they need one more quality piece.
At that point they would have 8 proven quality players (sorry Asik, JJ) which would be a perfect number if all were healthy come playoff time. Given that, I think they should overpay at this point for quality.
To me that means outbidding everybody else for Jason Williams. He’s a competent ball handler and can hit the three (38%).
by JockstrapNoah on Jul 17, 2010 6:43 PM CDT up reply actions
i agree with everything you said except the "outbidding everyone else for Jason Williams" part.
To me, the Bulls should look for a trade to get a combo guard who can play the 1 or 2 off the bench and score the basketball. I mentioned a couple earlier – Bayless or Rudy also fit. Hell, i’d even take Andre Miller since Portland fans hate him so much. But this teams really needs one more quality guard, and I’m talking Brewer level or better.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 17, 2010 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
more $ for the Sox
Oz on Swish HR celeb: "That's the way he is. Good for him, enjoy it. I wish he could do it for me, he was a very horseshit player for me.''
I think it's a mistake to not get another big man, but I'm waiting for someone to use non-sentimental reasons as a reason for Brad.
He was pretty terrible last season.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 17, 2010 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions
You don't think there are guys in the D-League capable of playing 10-15 minutes
And providing the same production Brad did last season?
And, if they’re looking at the savvy vet then Kurt Thomas on a 1-year deal is fine.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 17, 2010 8:11 PM CDT up reply actions
The chances of finding a D-League big man with the same shooting and passing ability as Brad are slim to none.
Pat Riley is the devil.
Except last season Brad couldn't shoot, much less defend a stationary object.
And passing ability? He really fell off a cliff last year in overall ability, if Adelman can rejuvenate him then that’s awesome. I don’t want $15 million devoted to a guy who barely tries and gets by because he’s a nice guy.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 18, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
His shooting fell off
But he was still more of a threat out there than most bigs. And his mere reputation as a shooter made him very valuable at times last year. And as for his passing, he may have tried to force stuff at times, but I’m gonna chalk that up at least partially to the ineptitude of VDN’s offense. I’m not saying he’s $15 million good, but we’re not gonna just be able to “find” a D-Leaguer of his caliber.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 18, 2010 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Who's that getting buckets, boards and blocks?
R-o-d B-e-n Son!
Rod Benson. Now.
"I want people to fear me"- Derrick Rose.
"That boy is BAD"- Stacey King.
For the love of all that is good and holy in this world
Can we stop this “They paid JJ $40 mil” bullshit? You are dead wrong. They are paying him $20 mil over the next 3 years. That’s all that JJ will receive. As a result of this contract, they will add another $7 mil to their luxury tax payment to the league this year, if the don’t change their team between now and the end of next season. They could makes moves to dump salary at the deadline, etc. Plus, there’s no guarantee that they’ll maintain this salary level in the second and third years of JJ’s deal, so they might not pay luxury tax those years.
The pessimism around here since that contract was matched is bad enough – can you at least stop being so fucking ignorant?
by torch on Jul 18, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
this is gold
yeah jj redick’s contract inflates by the minute on this board. next week he’ll cost the same as joe johnson
Looking for Asik info
from his wiki
he went 27-33 in the euro tourny last year in 3 games against Lithuania, Poland, and Bulgaria. Yeah they all suck, Gortat played for Poland. But it shows you he knows what to do with the ball.
That’s Waltonesque!!!
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
The part everyone is missing
This is our window to stock up. In a couple years, we’ll need to extend Noah and Rose. That would be our best chance to win as we can go over the cap to do so. What they are doing is staying under just enough that they’ll never have to fall into that luxury tax territory to re-sign those guys.
JR will never go over the cap. He’ll never spend money like other owners to put winners on the court anymore. This was his chance to go big. Waiting for something down the line won’t matter when we have to re-sign Noah and Rose.
Back to the half empty half full dilemna
How do you know the Bulls are not aggressively looking at all options to use the $7.5 million cap space to make the team better? Everything in the press indicates they are looking at Howard, McGrady, Mason Jr, etc. I haven’t heard a name that I find can that clearly would help us with the 18-20 minutes available except possible Josh Howard who would come with baggage. Who is out there that you think the Bulls should go after that you think the Bulls are not looking at? This is a glass half full half empty question. Are the Bulls really tying to avoid going into the luxury tax after signing Rose and Noah by not filling the $7.5 million cap room or they are really looking and you assume they aren’t. I do not know the answer but plead guilty to erring on the side that they are looking at everyone to try to make the team better. I still think we will end up with a 3rd Center and backup PG. John Lucas Jr has looked good in summer league and Derrick Beyers may help. I do not know who can be a serviceable Center.
I will eat my words if a big deal is coming
But if we waited through 2 years of tanking for John Lucas and Derrick Byers, I’ll be pissed.
And it's not 18-20 minutes
It’s not like Dwyane Wade is playing SG for us. It’s Ronnie Brewer. He can find his way onto the bench if we can get a SG who is good.
I will put ketchup on mine if the Bulls do nothing.
One of us will have to eat our words. Let’s see what happens. This is what makes life interesting. Some people like chocolate and others vanilla.
by chgobr on Jul 17, 2010 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I also think it's silly to say "oh keep the space going into the season, we don't have but 10-15 minutes to fill in anymore."
We have at least 10 minutes a game of backup point guard to fill.
Last I checked Brewery and Korver are probably not going to be filling 48 minutes per game at shooting guard (especially if JJ can’t play and Korver backs Deng up for 10-12 minutes a game).
Asik is unproven, so we could use another big, rather than play thin all season with a 3 man rotation (Boozer and Noah at PF or C, Taj at PF).
Beyond that, having one guy that can legitimately shoot a 3 pointer (I don’t count Rose yet, contrary to that report), particularly off the bench, is probably a little lacking.
So the 7.5 mil or so should clearly be used (in my mind) to fill in some holes and add depth. We really have a lack of depth right now in a few spots. We have intriguing players, but remember, not everybody is going to fulfill their potential.
Brewer, Korver, Asik and Taj won’t all play well enough to justify over 15 minutes per game. Some are more likely than others in that department, but remove one of those guys from the rotation and you have a pretty big depth problem at a certain position.
And we have one guy that can really handle the ball well (Rose). So yes, this team is nowhere near complete, though promising and intriguing. Don’t pull a fucking “Pargo, Hunter, Gray” please, org. We paid for that last year.
by RyPac13 on Jul 17, 2010 7:45 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
How about if we took on a short, bad contract and a low rookie contract
such that when the low, rookie contract was up for renewal and the guy turned out to be good, it would be more than worth it to go over the cap with him, Noah, and Rose.
For example, Pryz and Rudy, Mayo and ???
Fuck Houston!
3/15m are you shitting me?!! I’m way more depressed about this than I thought I’d be. If we didn’t have Asik, I’d be pissed, but you can’t even get upset about this, that’s way too much money for Brad.
Superteams suck.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jul 17, 2010 8:09 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
Considering how perfect a fit he is for them
And considering the uncertainty regarding Yao Ming, I understand the move. They probably went a little on the high side, but it’s not like the contract’s big enough where it’s gonna severely hamper them.
Pat Riley is the devil.
Yea, I guess it does make some sense for them
Superteams suck.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jul 17, 2010 9:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Kurt Thomas FTW
The Bulls will win 50 games this year and (hopefully) the Central Division for a top 3 seed.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 17, 2010 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm officially on the Shaq bandwagon.
Why not?
Superteams suck.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jul 17, 2010 9:32 PM CDT up reply actions
I like Shaq too but
he would only join the bulls, if he could start and he wouldn’t over Noah
To avoid him giving Rose some fool-ass nickname
Other than that, I have no problem with it. :-P
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Jul 17, 2010 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh, because
he still thinks it’s all about him, still over-promises and under-performs, and still manages to wear out his welcome wherever he goes.
He also will slow down the running game, and clog up the lane, thus getting in the way of: Boozer’s low-post offense, Noah’s rebounding and shot-blocking, and Rose’s drives.
I am entertained by Shaq, but I also love the fact that he’s not on the team that I root for.
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
Because he'll command too much money for a third or second string center and I'd rather play Asik.
The Bulls will win 50 games this year and (hopefully) the Central Division for a top 3 seed.
by fundamentallysound on Jul 18, 2010 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Im guessing Brad really wanted to join us again
and the rockets really wanted to take him. dont blame him for taking that money at 50 years or whatever he is. Ill miss those halfcourt layups
something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.
-MarketMaker
by blackoutsox on Jul 17, 2010 9:58 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Wow. Just read this.
Any news on Reinsdorf issuing an open letter and saying Brad “betrayed” Chicago?
$15 buys a lot of beer and shotgun shells...
I remember when the Bulls brought Brad back I was psyched, and surprised at the amount of grumbling on this board. Looks like that has changed. I loved having Brad on the Bulls. Loved his toughness, attitude, professionalism, and his hilarious slow motion drives to the basket.
You sir, will be missed!
Most all of the things Brad Miller did (that were cool) were kind of like abstractions.
See above: toughness, attitude, profesionalism; It’s not like we’re all, Brad I’m going to miss the way you went right after guys on the block, exploded toward the rim and grabbed boards, finished in traffic, etc. I’m all about his grit, moxie, savvy, dumpy hick-town rural-I play in the NBA and change my own oil-type of shit. And I would’ve loved to see him back. But, let’s put it to rest, not for what Houston paid.
Good luck, too, Bradass. Keep living the high-life.
by Dogfishhead on Jul 18, 2010 9:48 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Agree with everything you just said
I’m in the camp that won’t miss Brad one bit because I’m actually looking forward to guys at that position that are interested in playing defense and rebounding. Though others found it endearing, I never thought it was cute that we had a center that thought he was a SG, taking the ball off the dribble at least 3-5 times a game. Nor did I care for his 3pt shooting.
Truth is Brad Miller is not only not worth that contract, he may also be done. Yeah I wish him well and all but I put him in the same category as Kirk Hinrich: A beloved figure (for what reason I’m still not sure) that made this FA period worth it and a success by finally leaving.
Would you rather have James Johnson or
what’s behind door #1? Oh, Door #1 you say? OH, look what you’ve won: A new fucking thread!!! A new thread, everyone!!!
To lead off the new thread...
How come no one is mentioning Josh Boone as the Bulls’ potential fourth big man…he has proven to be solid back-up big man in NJ.
In the backcourt, there are a couple of guys no one is mentioning who could be had for the minimum…Mardy Collins or Javaris Crittenton.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
To lead off the new thread?
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 18, 2010 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Does the "No state income tax" argument come into play for Brad like it did for LeBron?
States with no state income tax: Alaska, Florida, Nevada, South Dakota, Texas, Washington, Wyoming
The 15 million dollars argument came into play for Brad.
Our tax rate is 3%.. if that was the problem, we would have just offered 15,463,917 and then the taxes would have been a non issue. The difference is basically 150K per year. If we thought 5 million was reasonable (which it’s obviously not), we would have paid 5.15 per year.
The tax rate didn’t matter for LeBron either. He took more than a 3% paycut (IL rate, or 5.9% in the case of Ohio), so if it was the amount of money he cared about, he would have just stayed in Cleveland or gone to Chicago or New York for the increase in advertising opportunities, and the chance to lead a team which also leads to more money than being a number two option
The state income tax isn’t that big a factor, yeah it’s a nice bonus for playing in those states, but it’s not really a difference maker when you look at their situations. Especially in these two cases.
by Grinder in Training on Jul 19, 2010 8:19 AM CDT up reply actions
Thanks for the reply.
Also, I’m surprised a team offered him 3 years. I thought he would be signing 1 year contracts for the remainder of his career.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
Related FanPosts on Blog a Bull
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
