I've been told that the Los Angeles Clippers could trade their No. 8 pick to Chicago for Luol Deng and the Bulls' 17th pick.
almost 2 years ago
Juiceboxjerry
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I would literally die of happiness if this happened
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
I would be upset for a few minutes, then go right back to being dead from happiness
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
heh
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jun 23, 2010 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
heh
I love the notion that you would come back to life just to be upset for a few moments, that’s a funny thing to picture…
Ask me about Tom Thibodeau!!!
www.kidronmusic.com/podcast.html
We'd have mad cap room
a number 8 pick, and the ability to completely rebuild the team around Rose and Noah. I would never say a bad word about Kirk Hinrich again. He can retire a Bull for all I care. This deal is perfect.
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:34 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Not to mention that this completely eliminates one of the teams with cap space
So that means more of a chance for us to get Lebron and other free agents. What’s not to like?
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Kind of an "eye of the beholder" thing after pick #5
Henry could be taken that high
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd take Henry or George. We need a shooter, especially if we're getting LeBron.
Let's sign LeBron and dance our way to the NBA championship. It'll be so crazy!
So can Henry
And he’s a better spot-up shooter, not as streaky
Which is why this rumor can't have legs....can it??
the timeline is assbackwards as the Clips will at least want to make a pitch to LeBron. By that time the Clips will have drafted someone we surely won’t want. Why the hell would they leave the race now?
Because they're the Clippers!
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Deng seems expensive to us
But if he were a free agent, at just 25 years old, with his APM numbers, he’d easily command a bigger contract than he’s getting, and Deng at his current contract would probably be a top 5 FA. Definitely top 4 on the Clippers board.
I think its a smart move for the Clips. Bulls fans want to get back to the championship years, while LA just wants the Clips to be relevant again. Plug Luol in and they’re a playoff team if healthy.
by YaoPau on Jun 23, 2010 8:58 PM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
I just can't get my head around their half of the trade
I mean the timing is horrible AND they’re giving up a top 10 pick
On the plus side…holy rebounds (Deng+Griffin+Kaman)
holy rebounds indeed
also
holy injuries (deng+griffin+kaman)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Also you have to look
at it from this side, Deng would start for a lot teams.
He would start for:
Orl
Miami
Hou
San Antonio
Milwaukee
Clippers
Minn
Sac
Washington
Utah
GS
NY
NJ, I might be leaving some teams out.
by QUINTEN DALEY on Jun 24, 2010 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions
With his injury history?
To be perfectly honest, I think he’d get more or less exactly the same amount of money he’s currently getting. Agree that it’s a good deal for the Clips though.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions
His injury history?
I don’t get this, I posted in another thread, this is really overblown. He misses 10 or so games a year, outside of the one bad year. It’s not like he has a torn ACL or something though.
by Grinder in Training on Jun 24, 2010 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Yep
Deng has a 4 year, $50 million contract remaining. I’m hearing Ray Allen is trying to get around that, ha.
And compare that to a guy like Boozer, who could easily get a 4 year, $60 mil contract, despite a similar injury history. And Luol is 3 years younger. And APM says Luol is the better player.
by YaoPau on Jun 24, 2010 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Still, it's almost more worth it to just pretend like you have a shot just to appease the fanbase
If you make this move before even attempting to sign Lebron, there could be a revolt. Then again, it is the Clips
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I think getting Deng would appease the fanbase
more than striking out on Lebron and still having a giant hole at SF.
You can't really call it a revolt
If it only involves 7 or 8 people
heh, I do too!
I have reliable info that says Lebron James won’t sign with the Clippers, it’s my own damn common sense.
Ask me about Tom Thibodeau!!!
www.kidronmusic.com/podcast.html
i think the clips realize lebron isnt going there
http://ExtendtheGame.blogspot.com
Trade Kirk for Gordon
too.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Jun 23, 2010 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
Gordon is gone.
Let it go. He was sacrificed so the Bulls could have max cap space this summer and make a run at Lebron, Bosh, Lee, etc…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 10:06 PM CDT up reply actions
wait a minute
D2.0 will figure it out when he’s done letting go.
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2010 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
Rec to that...
The context was there since this is a Clippers thread…
NBAO should have been more specific, since this board spent two years debating the merits of keeping Ben Gordon vs. Max cap space this summer…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions
I'd rather keep him if we don't get LeBron
but if the org is willing to gamble once in a lifetime I’ll support
by JustAnotherFan on Jun 23, 2010 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions
plus we could still go for Gay if things go wrong
by JustAnotherFan on Jun 23, 2010 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You can always go for Gay
It’s just hard recovering if you realize it was a mistake.
by runningman on Jun 24, 2010 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Just saw that too
If this really is the case, I would love for this deal to go down. We open up crazy cap room, and we’re in position to pick our SG for the future. Henry and George should be available at that pick. And it takes one more team out the running for LBJ. Please let the Clips be this desperate.
There's just no possible way this will actually happen, even though it does seem pretty fair for both sides.
This is the best possible trade to open up cap space that I can even fathom.
Broussard is either going to be universally loved or universally hated by Bulls fans after this summer, with no in between.
Let's sign LeBron and dance our way to the NBA championship. It'll be so crazy!
The thing that keeps me from getting too jacked is that he said he didn't hear it from team sources
Also, he goes on to kinda downplay it almost immediately after he brings it up. I really doubt it will happen, but it’s worth dreaming about
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Clearly the Bulls are active though, as Gar has said it multiple times
And by active, I mean trying to dump Deng’s contract with that #17 pick. Stranger things have happened, so I’m cautiously optimistic.
Let's sign LeBron and dance our way to the NBA championship. It'll be so crazy!
by Illini15 on Jun 23, 2010 8:41 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It actually does make sense for the Clips if they truly think they can't sign Lebron
It gives them a huge team and a better power forward than anyone they’ll get on the open market (unless you really love Rudy Gay)
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 8:43 PM CDT up reply actions
Rudy Gay sucks.
It’d give them a really good starting lineup, Deng is probably better than anyone they can get at #8, and the #17 is a nice add-on for them. Great deal for both teams in my opinion.
Let's sign LeBron and dance our way to the NBA championship. It'll be so crazy!
They would have to pay Gay at least as much as Deng
for Memphis not to match it, and Deng is a better player. Besides Lebron, there isn’t a better SF available either in the draft, in free agency, or for trade.
It’s been a long time since i’ve seen a trade that matches the needs of two teams so perfectly. Adding Deng and Griffin to last year’s Clippers will make them a force to be reckoned with.
How is this fair for the Bulls?
Give up a talented player for nothing…
I know we are drunk with enthusiasm for the greatest free agent class in history, but the deal sucks for the Bulls unless they have Lebron signed…otherwise, another hole to fill is created.
But, if they get Lebron and Bosh/Lee, then all is forgiven and the risk was worth it…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 10:09 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
This is only the first half of the trade.
We have to wait until after 7/1 for the second half.
It's not for nothing
Aside from the no.8 pick, $11 mil in cap space is very valuable, even if we don’t get a 2nd max FA. Let’s say we get Lebron but can’t get a 2nd max FA. We could still sign a few lesser free agents, like say Mike Miller + Jermaine O’Neal + Matt Barnes, which would, at the very least, be comparable to Deng in terms of overall value.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:35 PM CDT up reply actions
well, if it's 'lets say we get LeBron'
then fine. Don’t you only do this if you have LeBron?
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2010 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Well let's say we only get Bosh
Then we target different lesser FAs with our extra $16 million in cap room, like say Mike Miller + Brendan Haywood + Josh Howard. Of course, if we don’t get Bosh or Lebron, then the offseason will turn out to be pretty meh, but that’d be the case regardless of this trade going through.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions
And you know what?
Even Boozer + Joe Johnson (made possible by moving Deng) wouldn’t really be a bad result at all.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Um...
Yes it would…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions
Right because having 3 all-stars + Noah in the same lineup would be disastrous
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
All-Stars? It's pretty well-covered ground why JJ at the max is a disaster.
Boozer at max money is a laughably stupid use of resources. How would signing David Lee and Ray Allen be any worse of an allocation of cap space?
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 23, 2010 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Answer this question
Do you or do you not think that a lineup of Rose, Joe Johnson, Paul George/Xavier Henry, Carlos Boozer, and Joakim Noah could compete for a championship? I think the answer is yes, which is why ending up with Boozer, JJ, and the no. 8 pick would be a fairly good result.
Now, I’m not saying we should TARGET Boozer + JJ. We should obviously go target Lebron and Bosh, and if we get them, hallelujah, dynasty, etc. But as far as plan Cs go, Boozer + JJ ain’t too bad.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions
I talked myself into Ron Mercer, I probably could accept JJ and Boozer.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 24, 2010 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions
But, that team "contends" for titles in the same way Dallas or San Antonio does.
Winning 50+ but I don’t see how they push past the real elite teams in the league unless Rose turns into a top 10 player.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 24, 2010 12:23 AM CDT up reply actions
yeah, I can't accurately value #8 in this draft
but I’d think you’re lucky to get someone as good as Deng, and it’d take a few years.
btw I don’t think that team is in the top tier.
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions
That's what I've been saying
Hell supposed the worst case scenario (Boozer+JJ) this offseason would have been a dream just a year ago.
Boozer was not an all-star last season....
and I do not project him to be an all star in the future…David Lee on the other hand, all star last season, perhaps an all star for several years to come….
Joe Johnson…have you read YaoPau’s post on this topic…lets just say, the future does not project well for this type of player….
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 24, 2010 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah yeah yeah
JJ + Boozer will likely fall off a cliff 3 years from now, yada yada yada. If we win a championship before that happens, it’ll all be worth it. And like I’ve stated a million times now, this is plan C. The idea is that we make this trade,and then we end up with:
Plan A: Lebron + Bosh. Championships. Lots of them
Plan B: Lebron/Bosh + one lesser max FA (Boozer, Lee, Amare, JJ) or a bunch of role players. Still a dynasty, IMO
Plan C: 2 lesser max FAs. Still a title contender in the immediate future. Eventually the wheels fall off on JJ/Boozer/Amare but hopefully not until after we win at least one title.
Plan D: we crap out and get nobody. This is the “sky is falling” doomsday scenario.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 12:20 AM CDT up reply actions
we would not win a title with jj and boozer.
2010 Offseason Motto: Get Greedy, Bulls. 1 top FA down (Thibs), 1 (or 2) to go.
by fundamentallysound on Jun 24, 2010 12:38 AM CDT up reply actions
If you believe that, then you can't say we'd win a title with Deng + JJ/Boozer either.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 12:48 AM CDT up reply actions
Why?
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Because dent isn't significantly beter than JJ/Boozer to the point where'd he push us from non-contender to contender.
Brad Miller is god.
We are talking about Deng plus...
JJ/Boozer…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Why would you plan for 1-2 rings
when you can plan for 4+?
by Stacey_Is_King on Jun 24, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
The plan is for 4+ by getting lebron + bosh
The point is that if we strike out on both boozer + JJ is better than nada.
Brad Miller is god.
well if you keep deng
cuz of his age he will basically have decent trade value throughout his career (barring major injury) but if you sign boozer and joe johnson…your locked into 32 million dollars, for at least 5 years each, with no chance of trading them…and with their skills diminishing, so as rose gets better, those two gets worse, and the bulls ultimately would then not get any better, they would become essentially the pistons of the last 4 years, maybe one long run in the playoffs, but eventually ousted most likely before getting to the conference finals (or in it)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with that
Moving Deng with the intention of getting Joe Johnson + Boozer would be moronic. Moving Deng with the intention of getting Lebron + Bosh with the fallback of getting Joe Johnson + Boozer would be a good idea.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
uh but....
its not good..it means you failed….failing is bad…
its like saying, going for a d on a test is bad, but going for the A and getting a d is good? Actually no its not…in both cases you pretty much bombed….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions
You're not getting the point.
Let’s say you have an asset worth $1000 (Deng). You have the option of selling that asset and buying $1000 worth of stock in a company (cap room). You estimate that after 1 year, that stock has a 20% chance of being worth $1500 (chance of getting Lebron) and a 80% chance of being worth only $900 (chance of settling for JJ). Basic math would tell you to take the risk because the expected value of that trade is going positive. Even though 80% of the time you will be worse off, the 20% of the time you strike gold makes the decision a good one.
Obviously, these numbers are very arbitrary, and this scenario is simplified compared to what actually takes place but this is the best way I could think of to get the point across.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions
i dont agree with it because
the chance for lebron doesnt go up by trading deng, what happens is that you get room to get two sfs. If you dont trade deng, you get to try to get lebron (instant contention). Say you dont get lebron but land bosh, well a team of deng + bosh >joe johnson +bosh. You could argue talent wise for maybe the first two years, but ultimately for the monetary value (you could add some solid free agents or have flexible capspace for trades) and in terms of age and potential its greater (both bosh and deng fairly young) with it being easier to move deng in the future….
NOW say you strike out on lebron, bosh, amare but keep deng. Well now you can add one of boozer or joe johnson and ultimately;
deng + boozer or Joe Johnson > Joe johnson Boozer for pretty much the flexibility reasons. You arent committed to 32 million in two players, but 25+million, its still a crappy situation but not as worse
To trade deng and then end up with joe johnson and boozer with the intent of signing lebron to me is akin to firing scott skiles and hiring vdn with the intent of hiring d’antoni. FAILURE!!!
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 24, 2010 12:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Well fine if that's your sticking point...
Same argument as before except replace Lebron with Lebron/Bosh. Because the only way to get both is to move Deng.
Bottom line, I think the chance to get Lebron + Bosh is too good to pass up. And in order to have that chance, moving Deng is a necessity and getting the no.8 pick in the process is icing on the cake.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions
i think my stance got lost within the rebuttles
i wasnt arguing that the bulls shouldnt trade deng for a chance to get bosh and lebron, i wholeheartedly agree that they should pursue that route…what i disagree with is your stance that somehow if we miss out on both bosh and lebron, the worst case scenerio of boozer and Joe Johnson is somehow okay….What i am saying is that having joe johnson and boozer as the end result of trading luol deng is a failure, its bad, it sucks.
I also admit i think i got a little out of line, i blame it on the fact that its kinda late and im still up (excited for draft day) i guess ultimately i wouldnt mind luol deng being traded so long as we got one of bosh or lebron, and then picked up a JJ or boozer as the other free agent with that superstar…i just didnt agree with walking away with joe johnson and boozer is somehow still “okay”….it definetly is not….not for trading luol deng away…
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Would you rather get nobody?
Anything involving Lebron or Bosh is obviously far superior to Boozer + JJ. But I’d rather end up with Boozer and JJ than nobody.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 2:15 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
would i rather we get nobody
as opposed to jj and boozer…um…yea
i rather there be a 2011 plan as opposed to committing 32+ million dollars and 5 years to two players who are/will be rapidly declining in health and ability.
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Well that's where we disagree then
There is no realistic possibility of 2011 happening. Joakim Noah will be up for extension, and we’re not gonna be able to fill our roster solely on 1-year contracts unless we plan on being a 20-win team next year. Oh and Melo might sign an extension soon and the rest of the 2011 FA class sucks. I mean if you prefer Caron Butler and Zach Randolph to JJ and Boozer… But even if you find yourself salivating at the prospects being a player in the summer of ZBo, keep in mind that you’d have to suffer through another water-treading season completely wasting another year of Rose’s and Noah’s primes.
With Boozer and JJ, we’d be at least a 50-win team. With significant improvement from Rose, we could be more than that. That sounds much more appealing to me than another year of battling for the 8 seed.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 24, 2010 3:25 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
There is no 2011 plan
Combine Noah’s extension, with contracts the Bulls sign this year, with there being only one notable FA who might not even become a FA, with the new CBA, and there’s virtually no chance that a 2011 plan can produce anything superior to or even equal with JJ and Boozer.
If we strike out on LBJ and or Bosh and anyone else
We will suck for another 5 years. IMO Better to get somebody good rather than get nobody at all if our 1st plan fails
Its not like those are the only two other players available...
I would rather move forward with this Bulls team as constituted rather than overpaying two marginal stars…
BTW, its retarded to think a team that won 41 games two consecutive seasons would suddenly win 20…especially with a core of Rose and Noah…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
We would I'd we made the the moves necessaryto be players in 2011
We’d have to move Hinrich, Deng or both. We wouldn’t be able to sign any free agent to a multiple-year deal leaving us rail-thin.
Brad Miller is god.
it'd have to be more than intent
they’d have to be pretty sure, IMO.
If it’s a dump of Kirk, then fine. I think if we gave Luol away for cap space, we’d blow that cap space trying to find someone (and likely multiple people) to replace him.
(unless they think Deng really is an injury risk)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions
Agreed. Johnson+Boozer while losing Deng is not enough to put us over the top.
LeBron has to be the target if you’re moving Deng. However, if you wanted to work out something like Kirk for Johnson and then sign Boozer, that might work.
PG Rose
SG Johnson
SF Deng
PF Boozer
C Noah
With Taj coming off the bench is a very good foundation. Obviously, though, you don’t settle for that when LeBron could feasibly land here.
Lebron
I will get murdered for this, but… I’m not sure I want to watch one on one basketball the next 6 years. What has Lebron done so far? Lebron does not equal Championship. A team of well balanced studs does. I would rather have Johnson + bosh, amare or boozer.
by un-Bull-leavea-Bull on Jun 24, 2010 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Um, Joe Johnson is far more guilty of just going 1 on 1 than LeBron is. Hawks fans dubbed him
“Iso-Joe” for a very good reason. Johnson’s AST% last year was 21.2 while LeBron’s was 41.8. LeBron’s an All Defensive team defender while Johnson only has a good defensive rep around here because he’s taller than BG. James is the better player and better all around player.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
Agreed.
Add one of the top shooters in the league and finally a guy that can score on the block with Noah and Rose?? Love it.
by un-Bull-leavea-Bull on Jun 24, 2010 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
What?
Miller + O’Neal + Barnes is not comparable to Deng…the NBA does not work that way…with only five positions on the floor, the starting five and seven man rotation are the keys to winning titles…depth beyond eight players is pretty useless when it comes to actually winning a title…
As it currently stands, Luol is arguably the second or third best player on the team, and the cap space gained by this deal does not give the Bulls enough to ensure two max free agent contracts…without the second max contract available, the risk is too great without having Lebron signed to secure the 3 spot in Luol’s place…if Lebron is signed, then I am all for this deal.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions
According to my calculations...
This deal leaves us with $32,951,746.00 in cap space, using the estimated 56 million dollar salary cap.
If the first max deal is Lebron James at $16.5 then that leaves $16,451,746 left for Chris Bosh…
That’s pretty close, and it gives Bosh enough leverage to say, work out a S&T with Chicago or I’ll sign with them outright and you’ll lose me for nothing. Which increases the chances of signing Bosh if the rumors of him wanting the extra year are accurate.
Ask me about Tom Thibodeau!!!
www.kidronmusic.com/podcast.html
Close
Does not equal sufficient. Especially when it comes to offering max contracts.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
I thought you were all for giving up good players for nothing to take a chance this summer.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
To an extent I am...
But, I am not ready to gut the team in order to have the opportunity to sign max free agents…it doesnt make sense to me….the Bulls will already be challenged in filling out their roster next season with only six players under contract.
While I don’t think depth matters much to winning a title vs. the quality of the top 7, I think its too great of a risk to mortgage the future for the unknown…if the Bulls were to make this move then strike out in free agency, they would have JJ as their starting small forward…ugh.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Moving 1 of 6...
Who is arguably your second best player for nothing but space…feels like gutting.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
This trade makes sense
the clippers and bulls should do this trade asp because it helps both teams. The bulls could then go after lebron and bosh and start a new bulls dynasty
I still don't understand what's taking the bulls so long to make a trade
a lot of teams are making trades and even miami made one, by trading their 18 pick to move down for more cap space
But the trades that have been made
have been fairly small contracts or salary going both ways. Neither of those scenarios satisfies the Bulls’ needs.
OK, I've calmed down and come to my senses. The initial shock of reading this has worn off
There is no way in hell this is happening.
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
I was so anti-trading-Deng for the 2 Magic players in the other thread
but assuming George or Henry are there, hot damn that looks good. I’d like to do it like I said with the magic: “wait for Lebron”, but the draft is obviously before that.
if it happens at the draft: here’s to hoping the Bulls semi-tampered and know that Lebron is coming here.
if it doesn’t: here’s to hoping the Bulls told the Clippers who to pick, the Clippers told the Bulls who to pick, and the Bull sign Lebron and the trade happens expostfacto.
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
Both George and Henry will be there at 8
The Bulls would actually get to choose which one they want.
You’re right that the sticking point is Lebron. If he still decided not to come, the Bulls would be kind of screwed. I guess they could take Paul George, and then sign Joe Johnson and hopefully Bosh. George is certainly tall enough to play SF, and if you have two all-stars at SG and PF, you can make do with James Johnson and Paul George battling it out at SF. One of them has to turn into at least a role-player type of starter in the NBA.
Let's say we miss out on Lebron but "settle" for Bosh
Even if we don’t get that 2nd free agent, we still have $16 million to spend on role players.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions
they are gonna have to be some great role players
subtract deng and add bosh only makes us a little better, perennial playoff good, maybe perennial second round good…but thats about it…
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think so
Let’s say we end up with Mike Miller, Matt Barnes, and Channing Frye to go with Bosh. Not one of those guys will get over $5 million annually, so getting all 3 with $16 million in cap space should be quite doable. That gives us this lineup:
PG Rose/Hinrich
SG Miller/Henry/Hinrich
SF Barnes/Henry
PF Bosh/Taj
C Noah/Frye
Not too shabby, and a very well-rounded team.
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on Jun 23, 2010 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Mike Miller is
a bench player not a starter
by QUINTEN DALEY on Jun 24, 2010 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions
honestly, rose, kirk, deng, bosh, noah is better. now and for the next 5 years.
"If I was to answer that question honestly, I would have to lie to you."
- Isiah Thomas, when asked if any teams were interested in trading for Shandon Anderson
Yeah, but only marginally
I’m willing to risk a marginal dropoff in talent for a potential massive upgrade in talent (as would be the case with Lebron + Bosh).
Plus if Xavier Henry (or Paul George if you prefer) takes off, then you we’re much better off.
Brad Miller is god.
hinrich and deng and taj are pretty important in this FA pitch i think. basically, noah and rose
are the main reason why this might work, but with hinrich and deng and taj there as well, there is the sense that this franchise has two young studs and a young TEAM around them. that last part is important, because without it the bulls look inferior to miami and maybe even NJ.
"If I was to answer that question honestly, I would have to lie to you."
- Isiah Thomas, when asked if any teams were interested in trading for Shandon Anderson
This thread is about trading Deng
We’d still have Hinrich/Taj. If you think not having Deng would decrease our chances of getting a FA, that’s your opinion. I disagree because Lebron (or whoever) would be smart enough to realize that enough cap space to grab another max FA is more valuable than Deng is.
Brad Miller is god.
I like Barnes but he is 10x better as a reserve.
by C Smoove on Jun 24, 2010 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Bulls can get either George or Henry at 17!
by un-Bull-leavea-Bull on Jun 24, 2010 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
You clearly have not been following the draft process
Both of those players will be gone by 17.
I don't trust Broussard
i think the guy hates the bulls and just like to tease bulls fans by getting our hopes up, so we can feel bad when it doesn’t happen………..the trade does make sense for both teams but i think he is playing games again with bulls fans, just to write a story, so he can continue to get paid and keep his job
"i think the guy hates the bulls and just like to tease bulls fans by getting our hopes up"
I thought we liked him because of the positive rumors!
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2010 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
JBJ plays by his own rules ;)
Let's sign LeBron and dance our way to the NBA championship. It'll be so crazy!
In retrospect I should have
but in a moment of pure elation, I thought this was just too big to put in the rumor thread. I can assure you I wasn’t trying to rock the boat :)
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions
and yfbb said...
That Bulls related rumors should probably get their own threads….as they are more important than what the stupid TWolves are doing.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 10:18 PM CDT up reply actions
argh
So lets try to keep all the non-Bulls stuff (if there’s a hard Bulls rumor, it should probably be in it’s own thread) in one spot
JBJ is the true hero of tonight.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2010 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Thank you, Thank you (takes bow)
Unlike Joakim Noah I promise to show up for all my autograph appearances
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh and if that pick don't get you cap space, don't sell it
Cleveland is trying hard to buy a draft pick and if the above scenario doesn’t happen, they may buy the 17th pick from Chicago. One of the players the Cavs are targeting is Kentucky guard Eric Bledsoe, whom some believe could turn into a Rajon Rondo-type player.
Bucher
just said the Bulls are selling Deng hard. didn’t mention anything specifically, but you gotta think something like this Clips rumor has been discussed.
What about that?
2008 draft-day acquisition Omer Asik, who has recovered from breaking his collarbone in EuroLeague play last December, worked out at Berto. “I feel great,” Asik said. … The same can’t be said for free agent Jannero Pargo, who walked around Berto with a full leg brace after hurting his right knee.
From KC
by JustAnotherFan on Jun 23, 2010 10:24 PM CDT reply actions 7 recs
haha
for the Pargo news?
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2010 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
question
what the hell is he doing at the berto center? Hes an expired contract…you dont see warrick or joe alexander walking around the berto center….someone kick pargo the fudge out!
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
How do you know who is at the Berto...
They have some random European dude who has never been under contract walking around and feeling good…why not have a player under contract for another six days there nursing a sore leg? Heck, they could have Mario Austin and Mike Sweetney in for workouts too, since I think they hold rights to both of those players…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions
kick them all out!!!
that place should be reserved for Bulls and future bulls and hall of famer bulls…not sucky we dont want you on our team anymore bulls
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Organizational guy
he’ll be the next Bulls developmental coach, soon as he looses all his money.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions
development?
how to keep up your confidence after missing 40 shots in a row?
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 24, 2010 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
heh
how to become known as ‘a shooter’ without having to make shots.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2010 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
maybe were looking at this the wrong way
maybe he will be the Poker Development coach….10 years from now he will still be sitting in the bulls locker room playing the locker room guys in poker. He could be like the World Wide Wes of the bulls! Just hanging around, long forgotten that he was once a player (mainly cuz people will block out the image) reporters will swear he exists, instead of a players power broker, he will be a Power Poker player thats broke….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 24, 2010 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions
not likely to happen
but i hope wade signs elsewhere so we talk about loyalty more
by jsptvo on Jun 24, 2010 12:57 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
He will say it was a bad streak
(a 10 year long bad one)
by JustAnotherFan on Jun 24, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions
How did he get hurt
because i thought you have to play in games to get hurt, unless he had his sneakers untied and trip
by Jermal on Jun 23, 2010 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
he lost a poker game to john paxson
couldnt pay up the money…legs had to go….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 24, 2010 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Since posting the Bulls/Clippers trade rumor, I’ve spoken with officials from both clubs. Some thought it made a lot of sense, but the one with the most juice said it’s not going to happen. He said the Bulls have talked with several clubs, including the Clippers, but that in the end they will end up keeping their 17th pick. Posturing? We’ll see.
A vision without a plan is just a dream. A plan without a vision is drudgery. But a vision with a plan can change the world.
by Sayre Bedinger on Jun 23, 2010 10:45 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
from Broussard
A vision without a plan is just a dream. A plan without a vision is drudgery. But a vision with a plan can change the world.
by Sayre Bedinger on Jun 23, 2010 10:45 PM CDT up reply actions
Link
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 23, 2010 10:49 PM CDT up reply actions
If there's one thing I'll take from this
it’s to never trust a reporter that uses the word “juice” in a story, unless he’s referring to something you drink
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 23, 2010 10:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I said it earlier that Broussard just makes up stuff
the only thing i believe he said was correct was wait and see and that the bulls might keep their pick at 17
Or a box named Jerry
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 24, 2010 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions
It's not going to happen because
the rules prohibit it from happening.
The Clips are over the cap until the 2010/11 contract season begins on July 8. Until then, they cannot take in contracts that are worth more than 125% of the contracts they are shipping out.
I’m not sure what the rules are regarding agreements to trades in advance to place on future dates, but there are very few teams, if any, that have cap space that the Bulls can trade Deng and #17 for. So it’s highly unlikely the Bulls can make a trade for cap space before July 8.
by Bullsfan7210 on Jun 24, 2010 5:56 AM CDT up reply actions
They can agree in principal to the trade beforehand, happens quite frequently
IIRC, Deng was technically drafted by the Suns and wasn’t officially a Bull until their trade was completed on July 1 of that year.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
Is it just me?
or will everyone else breathe a collective sigh of releif when the Bulls ACTUALLY make a move? I guess it depends on the move, but even though we’ve been waiting for the class of 10 for long enough, it seems like the last few days are the worst.
A vision without a plan is just a dream. A plan without a vision is drudgery. But a vision with a plan can change the world.
by Sayre Bedinger on Jun 23, 2010 10:52 PM CDT reply actions
or unanimously roll their eyes
when they dont make any moves and pick gordon haywood with the 17th pick
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Jun 23, 2010 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions
Is Hinrich really that valueless...
or do the Bulls really think that moving Deng is that important.
Anyway, if we lucked into Greg Monroe and had a ton of space, I think we would be in an ideal situation if this went down.
I saw T2 at Walgreens in Deerfield he’s tall. if you’re wondering what his grocery list included: magnums, french vanilla ice cream and a 20 oz sprite
by Super-Structure on Jun 24, 2010 4:24 AM CDT reply actions
Broussard updates his story
Some thought it made a lot of sense, but the one with the most juice said it’s not going to happen.
http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/17058/bulls-clippers-trade-update
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
This is where my dislike for Henry and George (wtf?) in the mid-lottery makes me twice unenthusiastic about this idea.
Unless Cousins or Favors fell to No. 8 (or, of course, Turner), this thing is dumb times 2.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Can you expand on that?
I’m pro-trade because I think the space to sign two increases the chance to sign ne. We’d become the best destination, and right now, we may have fallen behind Miami in that regard.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
It does give the Bulls space, but what are the chances?
I guess… even though I’m unenthusiastic about Henry being rated that high, who cares if you get the guy you want. But if they don’t get anyone in free agency, rolling with Derrick Rose, Hinrich, Johnson, Gibson and Noah is a huge step back.
Of course, if they signed James and Lee, then Rose – Henry – James – Lee – Noah is a future potential dynasty.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
We're talking about one of the most reticent franchises in the league
I highly doubt they’d let Lu go without knowing full well that they had a replacement waiting. They probably already know that Joe Johnson will come, so they figure he can replace Luol’s production. I’d bet my life that they won’t ditch Lu and be stuck with the team you just mentioned.
He may not be married, but he's got plenty of Thibo-hoes.
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 24, 2010 8:45 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
good point
this FO has been scared to death to take a risk so many times, that you figure if they’re going all in, they must really know something.
I'm with you in a way
Deng is paid pretty fairly, and it’s hard to replace a fair contract of that scale. I’d rather trade Hinrich for a 2nd than do this deal.
But just working some numbers, let’s say Deng is worth exactly his contract, or $12.5 mil per year. And since Pax rocks at drafting, let’s put an expected #17 pick value at $3 mil. $15.5ish million of value going out. I don’t think it’s hard to make that up with $10.5 mil in cap space and Xavier Henry. There’s a chance we fall short, but it won’t be by much, and the upside of landing two studs I think outweighs it.
So you think
there’s a chance they make the deal with the Clips and then use none of their 30 mil plus in cap space? Of course it would be a step back BEFORE they signed anyone. The point of the trade is so they CAN sign guys. It’s not just so they can free up playing time for James Johnson.
DEJESUS!!!
That they would use it, but not get anyone worthy of it.
Minus Deng plus Joe Johnson and David Lee is a step back after everything is said and done.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
But...
This deal would not give the Bulls space to sign two max guys.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
maybe the bulls realize that joe johnson
is not a max guy
LeBitch and KG's constant showboating, chest pounding, dunking with one hand behind the ear, dancing, and pure and simple rubbing it in is so fucking annoying.
by hongydraw on Jun 24, 2010 9:20 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Fortunately, Joe Johnson has to realize that, too.
He won’t.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
OMG OMG OMG
Now if we could move Deng for #8 and get Xavier Henry or Paul George (the best guys in the gradft with two first names) AND move JJ or the trade exception to Portland for Rudy we’d be in business…
The biggest
thing about this deal wouldn’t be clearing Deng’s salary, it’s that it would be the clearest indication thus far of where Lebron is going.
DEJESUS!!!
everyone is getting all nervous...
I think its almost impossible for the bulls to competely strike out this off season….. we have to man things going for us
Rose
Noah
Thibs
Cap Space
Big Market
History
by Da Bears2333333 on Jun 24, 2010 2:00 PM CDT reply actions
I'm under the impression that less than half of what you say makes any sense
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 24, 2010 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions
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