The stories from the press conference, whether we can believe them or not
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 12:00 AM CDT
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PrintMy initial reaction to today's interesting and a bit weird Bulls presser (words that describe much of what the Bulls do, it seems) focused on the big-picture significance of a franchise still not clear in it's hierarchy. At least not made clear to outside observers, which matters less relative to how far outside such observers are (we're pretty far out there, here), but still disappointing to watch unfurl.
Basically, Paxson's words make most of what Gar said now seem suspicious in retrospect, since we still don't know who's in charge. Especially Pax's words about not being able to override Gar. Do we really believe that the Executive VP of Basketball Operations can't overrule someone under him? It was a bad decision to have the 'sorry for the push' press conference take place right after the 'coach firing' press conference.
But that's been covered in the earlier post, and it's a dynamic that will be interpreted (fruitlessly, perhaps) many times over when discussing the moves made in this very important offseason. There were a lot of other juicy morsels of information from today's press conference, possibility of outright lies notwithstanding:
- Vinny was a good coach, really he was great, but we needed a different coach. I get the need for everyone to play nice, but I think Gar did overplay selling of VDN the coach, as it laid out conflicting goals and actions. For instance, Gar would simultaneously say that the Bulls needed a coaching change to improve, yet also say they also improved under VDN (and Pax with the worse 'he didn't fail, and we didn't fail'). I actually do understand what he means by that, but there was little reason to pump up VDN instead of emphasizing that no matter Vinny's results, you're holding this job to a higher standard. Giving VDN a platform to express his thanks for the paid internship was unnecessary as well.
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Time to move on
so, who’s the new cheap, inexperience and punching bag coach going to be for the bulls this time?
Rusty LaRue?
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
by chapuforyou on May 5, 2010 7:41 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Dusty Baker?
Oz on Swish HR celeb: "That's the way he is. Good for him, enjoy it. I wish he could do it for me, he was a very horseshit player for me.''
by OznCoop on May 5, 2010 8:08 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Lindsey Hunter?
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on May 5, 2010 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
The Rock
can you smell what he’s cooking?
by Jermal on May 5, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Ashy Larry?
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 5, 2010 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Hans Gruber?
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on May 5, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Dexter Morgan?
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 5, 2010 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Tony Clifton?
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
by chapuforyou on May 5, 2010 4:00 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
YfBB?
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 5, 2010 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Vinny Del Negro?
Brad Miller is god.
by Poloplaya14 on May 5, 2010 4:33 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
Macaulay Culkin?
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 5, 2010 6:37 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
You all should be grateful
I’m responsible for single-handedly making this a green zone.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 5, 2010 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
So the answer is stacey king?
green this man!
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 6, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
At least Pax wouldn't shove him
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
love seeing the inner workings of this clusterfuck of a front office
on display for the world to see, especially since they’re so anti-media and all their damned rumor mongering..
i wonder if it takes 3 memos and a meeting to put a pot of coffee on in the office. after all, everything’s a process.
http://ExtendtheGame.blogspot.com
by Calogero on May 5, 2010 12:30 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
kinda reminds me of Spaceballs
“whats the matter with you? you’re always preparing! don’t prepare! just go!”
the thigh bone is not connected to the free throw bone.- Shaquille O'Neal
by BULLieving in Miami on May 5, 2010 7:18 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Even if it takes 5 memos and 5 meetings to make a pot of coffee...
If Melissa Issacson says the coffee was made on its own, then the coffee was made on its own.
LeBron is an Asshole
by leeac on May 5, 2010 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I liked KC asking Van Gundy "questions"
KC is to the Bulls what David Axelrod was to Mayor Daley. He’s a public relations mouthpiece that posed as a reporter and then gave it up to be the actual public relations mouthpiece.
Gar arrived with Floyd and the savvy chairman still hasn’t figured out the problem on the court. Damn Schanwald is so damn awesome on the operations side and as lottery boy that it’s the best distraction.
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
Well, you see,
it’s a process. We have a big process to go through this summer, a big, overarching process. And within this process is a bunch of smaller processes. And we’re going through processes to find which process to process first. And once we’ve processed our processes, we’ll go about the process of prioritizing those processes. Finally, once the processes are prioritized, then we’ll start the process (the big one, you follow?) with the first process.
dunno bout you guys but i think i was traumatized after watching gar on tv for so long
i really got absolutely nothing out of this little news conference
front office still looks retarded
pax still looks like hes pulling the strings
gar spewing process shit
blah blah blah
i think we’re screwed unless another miracle comes along
As long as you just resign yourself to the fact that 99% of front offices in sports are
completely full of shit, you have nothing to be upset about. The only thing to really take away from this is that the Bulls talked a big game about this summer and getting better NOW (the next three months). So rather than judging them on their words (mostly bullshit) we’ll all wait a little bit and judge them on their actions. If they can’t get anything done this summer, then they have failed based on everything they said. The only shitty thing is, if/when they do fail, nothing will be done anyway, and THAT is what sucks.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 5, 2010 5:29 AM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
And the Rockets
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
well, Phil already said he won't be coming here
…so thats one name we can scratch off the list.
the thigh bone is not connected to the free throw bone.- Shaquille O'Neal
by BULLieving in Miami on May 5, 2010 7:21 AM CDT via mobile reply actions
"nobody puts Gar in a corner"
lol
by drew gooden's facial growth on May 5, 2010 8:01 AM CDT reply actions
somewhere...
Patrick Swayze is laughing in his grave.
the thigh bone is not connected to the free throw bone.- Shaquille O'Neal
by BULLieving in Miami on May 5, 2010 8:39 AM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Sam smith on Bulls power structure
I see it as sort of a bicameral legislature, theories that went back to ancient Greece and like the U.S. government. To my thinking, Forman, the guy who worked up the scouting ranks, is the House and John Paxson, the former Finals hero, is the Senate and they try to come together in conference. Reinsdorf is the president and has veto power. I see each with sort of a line to the president, but having to come together before presenting something.
by JustAnotherFan on May 5, 2010 8:34 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
This is how I see the Bulls short list looking and I'll throw in JVG besides his comments.
1. Casey
2. Thibodeau
3. JVG
4. McHale
5. Frank
by SoulEater7 on May 5, 2010 10:46 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
What would make you think Thibadeau is that high up when
A) The Bulls had a chance at him last time and didn’t even interview him
and…
B) Basically every report says they want someone with head coaching experience
And I really hate the Casey idea, not cause I think he’s a bad coach (he would’ve been great two years ago), but because a splashy hire is a necessity imo. Hiring a guy like Van Gundy or Rivers immediately washes away a lot of the bad pub this franchise has accrued during the Vinny era.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 5, 2010 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions
His defensive reputation.
Rivers is under contract. JVG would seem the best choice but you know Pax.
If they hire Kevin McHale
I’ll never go to another game.
I think Mchale would
be a better fit as a NBA coach than a NBA GM.
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 5, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
McHale's actually a good coach.
Horrible GM.
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
by Prevenge on May 5, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
His NBA record begs to differ...
Not about him being a horrible GM…but I don’t know what makes him good as a coach…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Well, he seems to know what he's talking about,
and his teams have performed fairly well relative to expectations.
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
yeah, i wish someone would explain why mchale is good without mentioning his
teams record or the fact that he was a great low post player. im sure that wont happen because no one has ever seen the T-wolves.
there is something awesome about Pargo, though.
Seriously. It’s kind of awe inspiring: he WILL shoot. He has no conscience. No remorse. He will shoot – the situation, the opponent, the country. He could be in zero gravity floating in orbit. The dude would be jacking up shots. And missing.
-MPG
I'll give it a shot
He did a decent job over a short period of time in 04-05. He went 19-12 with that team, which was not that good. Cassell was hurt that year, and Sprewell sucked. They had to start Trenton Hassell for 50 games that year. Then last year, he did a pretty bad job, but that was a pretty shitty team. The backcourt was Mike Miller, Randy Foye, and Sebastian Telfair, 3 guys who put up PERs of 13.8, 13.7 and 10.8, respectively. Jefferson also missed 30 games that year, but to McHale’s credit, 08-09 was Jefferson’s BEST year in terms of PER, which supports the theory that McHale’s a good big man coach. Kevin Love also outperformed most expectations.
Basically, he hasn’t shown to be a great NBA coach, but then again, he hasn’t gotten much of an opportunity (he’s had ample opportunity to show that he’s a shitty GM). He has demonstrated the ability to coach a team with a superstar and a collection of mediocre players and win at a .600 clip, albeit only over a 30 game sample size.
Brad Miller is god.
that looks pretty inconclusive; i dont see any reason why the bulls should take
a risk with him after this vinny crap. as a side note though, looking at garnett back then. holy crap. i hope we dont forget how insanely good that guy was.
there is something awesome about Pargo, though.
Seriously. It’s kind of awe inspiring: he WILL shoot. He has no conscience. No remorse. He will shoot – the situation, the opponent, the country. He could be in zero gravity floating in orbit. The dude would be jacking up shots. And missing.
-MPG
Something I've missed in all the coverage
Was it just Vinny that got canned? Is the next coach going to be expected to keep Bickerstaff/Myers/Hunter around?
good question, this was not addressed
Bickerstaff is likely gone, the other ‘Vinny guys’ were Ociepka and Severns.
The Org. spies are Myers, Brown, and now Hunter. Not sure about the big man coach they hired last year.
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Whoever they hired as the big man coach should probably be retained
Considering Noah’s improvement and Gibson’s production.
by pooriejay on May 5, 2010 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sidney Green
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
if the coach ends up being mchale
i could see them choosing not to. otherwise, yeah.
i always thought it was such a shame that there wasn’t a big man coach on the staff for so long.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
that was all Vinny, didn't ya hear? :)
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I believe those guys had team options for next season...
I would expect Pete Myers to be around, as he seems like Org’s eyes and ears on the bench…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
I'm telling you KC Johnson is going to be our next coach
He’s a company guy and will listen to whatever Paxson says. 500,000 per year sounds right.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
The only meaningful criteria for hiring a new coach is whether
he can help us secure the services of one of the marquee free agents. If a particular coach makes Chicago a more attractive destination for LeBron/Wade/Bosh, hire him. If he doesn’t, ignore him. Everything else – tactical acumen, player development, temperment, pedigree – is irrelevant.
Because of the personnel decisions that have been made, the entire future of the franchise rises and falls on the Bulls’ ability to woo LeBron/Wade/Bosh. This coaching search is generally a futile sideshow.
It's not irrelevant since it's impossible to know with certainty...
…to what degree a coach can influence other players to come. I mean, can you tell me who has a better rep among players between Casey and Mo Cheeks?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I certainly can't.
But I would hope that Bulls management would be able to answer that question after interviewing the two men and gathering league intelligence.
If they knew it with such certainty, then there'd be no reason to even go after the guys.
Maybe none of them have more sway than Mike Brown or Pat Riley. I don’t think it’s as easy to know and definite as you seem to think.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
By the same token, it isn't easy to asses which coach
is the best tactician, or which coach would best develop our existing talent. All of these characteristics are fairly nebulous. And amongst the nebulous constellation of attributes, the most critical is the ability to woo a free agent.
Frankly, with the existing talent, we could hire a genetic hybrid of Riley, Brown, Jackson, and ‘Red’ Auerbach and still not survive the first round of the playoffs.
Really?
I think it’s much easier to assess x’s and o’s than trying to figure out who is going to have the inside on a guy who hasn’t even made up his own mind.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Apparently Hollinger is skepical of the FO as well:
Ryan (Los Angeles)
John, what do you see the Bulls doing this summer? Do you agree they should focus on adding Joe Johnson in a sign and trade for Kirk Hinrich, then focusing on adding a guy like David Lee? Let the other teams jockey for the stars!
John Hollinger
(1:26 PM)
I think they’ll hold a lot of meetings, dither, nearly sign a guy, dither some more, watch everybody else make their moves, and then in September explain how this was the plan all along.
Can’t blame him for thinking that way. After all the trade talk this team has been involved in it’s officially “show me” time.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 5, 2010 12:54 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
Does anyone here really think Joe Johnson would put the Bulls in position to
contend for a title?
I am genuinely curious.
meh
he won’t, but having nothing also won’t.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
if they sign-and-trade Hinrich and "pieces" to get Johnson?
They’ll have room to sign at least Lee and maybe someone like Boozer. And yeah, I think those two help this team contend for a title over the next 3 years? As good as the Lakers or Cavs? Probably not. But big jumps by Rose and Noah and a good coach will get them on the Jazz/Magic level, in my opinion.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I won't to win
Championships not bow out in the ECF
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 5, 2010 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions
and...
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I don't know about Magic level
but Jazz/Suns/Hawks level? Sure
by Stacey_Is_King on May 5, 2010 7:56 PM CDT up reply actions
He won't
even get us to Game 7 in the 1st round, Joe Johnson would be nice if you add an Amare, I hope Stacey King jumped off the Joe Johnson as TOP BULLS FA bandwagon.
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 5, 2010 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions
Ouch!
I’m trying hard not to think that way.
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
I'm afraid that Hollinger's right
and we’re going to end up with Ray Allen at $10 mil per.
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on May 5, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Joerger, Amare, Allen, Gortat
and sign and trade whomever to make it happen, except of course, Rose/Noah.
Well I'd be cool with that line-up
but how on earth are we getting Gortat from the Magic? who would they want in return that would be worth it to us?
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on May 5, 2010 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Okay. I would be hoping that they would let Gortat go for salary cap reasons
However, Pryz might be a posibility, although I know he’s hurt…
Don't want Pryz, he
might blow out his ACL again when he shakes Benny the Bull’s hand at the airport
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 5, 2010 3:53 PM CDT up reply actions
What do you mean let him go?
Just release him? He’s not a free agent if that’s what you’re thinking (Gortat that is).
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
Of course I would take Hollinger more seriously
if he were more than just a number’s guy. As it is, he’s certainly no insider when it comes to these things.
The Bulls have not always made the right moves, but they certainly had taken action in the Pax era. And I think that, since the Gar/Pax era started, they’ve made some quality trades and put the team in the positive financial position they are in now despite the contracts of Deng and Hinrich. It could be a lot worse; they could have paid Ben Gordon, kept Salmons and suffered the delusion that such a team could compete at a high level.
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on May 5, 2010 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
he is a numbers guy first, but no doubt is more insider since joining ESPN
he like goes to games and stuff too. Granted, they’re Atlanta Hawks games, so it’s barely in the NBA. Hey, now there’s a team that deluded themselves into competing. Idiots!
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I am dismayed that the media is perpetuating the view that
Bulls management is an inept circus. It certainly won’t aid us in our pursuit of LeBron/Wade/Bosh.
Now, the Bulls front office has made errors, and they have brought scorn upon themselves with risible antics like the Paxson/VDN fight, and they are certainly masters of the bizarre and mildly uncomfortable, but I don’t think they are more dysfunctional than most professional teams. I actually believe they have some unique strengths. Unfortunately, it is becoming an article of faith amongst NBA commentators that Reinsdorf, Paxson, and Gar are Felini-esque jesters. At this point, its a hyperbolic cliche.
eh, nobody cares what we think
and I’ve heard nobody cares what the media thinks either. So I say we rip on the FO for being boobs, and ALSO get an FA, and everyone’s happy.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 3:43 PM CDT up reply actions
If players are making decisions based on media and fan hyperbole, then there was no chance to begin with.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on May 5, 2010 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions
The Bulls Blew it big time.
Although Vinnie may not have been a top tier coach in NBA, what was the Bulls management expecting in return for such a modest investment at the head coaching position? In all actuality they got a great return on investment, and are cheating themselves out a huge payday, curtsey of Vinnie.
Under Vinnie’s coaching regime the Bulls may have underachieved a tad bit, but that was due, mostly, to injuries to key players at various points throughout his 2 year stint. But injuries are a part of NBA basketball, and good teams make it through tough times.
Vinnie’s Bulls were involved in trades each year at the trade deadline. Considering those circumstances alone, I think Vinnie did an excellent job of infusing veteran talents (Miller, Hinrich, Deng) with quality youth via the draft (Rose, Noah, Gibson), and various role players/toss ins(Noccioni, Salmons, Warrick etc). Through all of this constant roster maneuvering, Vinnie still managed to develop Rose into an All-Star, Noah into a potential All-Star, and a core of players that play very hard for him.
Vinnie’s Bulls managed to make back-to-back playoff appearances through all of this. Other than cold hard cash, making the playoffs and having a legitimate shot at a title run is what are most important potential free agents. With Rose, Noah, a decent core, a 2 year playoff run, and plenty of cash to spend, the Bulls were a cinch to secure a major free agent, if not more at years end. The bonus would be that next year was the last of Vinnie’s contract. He would be able to coach a much improved team to an assumed, much improved record, for a mere $2 million dollars. If Vinnie proved he could handle the task at hand, Management could re-up with Vinnie again for a very modest increase, even though we would have impeccable credentials for a then 4th year coach. (>50% win pct., 3 consecutive playoff appearances). If Vinnie were not able to handle the task at hand, Management would have a quality team to with enough talent to lure a big name coach to the Bulls.
Management made a move too soon. Now we go into free agency without a coach. No free agent will even consider coming to Chicago without knowing who the coach is. And if Chicago goes the cheap route, looking for the hottest assistant with no coaching experience, no free agent will come as well. If Pax and Gar had put their egos to the side Chicago could have
A top free agent this year and Vinnie extended next year for a modest increase
A top free agent this year and a big name coach next year
Instead we get
No free agents and another coach with no coaching experience.
The Bulls Blew it big time
Nick@Nite3
by Nickatnite3 on May 5, 2010 2:24 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
So you are saying that keeping Vinnie would have HELPED lure a top FA?
Instead of an experienced head coach or more qualified assistant? Vinnie was liked by some of his players; nothing more. I don’t think he did a horrible job, but you cannot possibly think that he is qualified to lead a potential championship contender.
Rose is entering his 3rd year. While he will continue to get better into his 4th and 5th years, now is the time to improve your team and start trying to compete for a title. Retaining VDN is not the way to start.
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on May 5, 2010 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Use Vinnie
You gotta take advantage of what Vinnie has done. Todays players are more focused on here and now. Players look at Vinnie as a coach that gets his team to the playoffs. Players want to go where they think they can win, with a coach that wins. Use that to your advantage and keep Vinnie, if just to show some stabilty to lure a free agent. Don’t cut the team off at the head and expect others to want to jump onboard. This was the first time in a long time that a quasi-rebuilding project was working to perfection. Why ruin it by getting a new coach? Believe it or not, keeping Vinnie and showing some solidarity towards the future would go along way with a pending free agent.
Secondly, the team as it stands is not good enough to lure a big name coach right now. Yeah coaching Rose would be every coaches dream, but the Bulls have some serious concerns at the 2,3,and 4 position. Too many gaps for big name coach to be bothered with.
Use What Vinne has done to get that free agent now.
Decide who will coach that team, next year. You will have a much more intising product to offer a big name coach.
Nick@Nite3
derrick rose and noah got the team to the playoffs not vinny
todays players arent stupid. they know how much vinny had to do with the success of the bulls.
i guarantee you without derrick rose and noah vinny wins about 10 games.
by sin on May 5, 2010 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
yesterdays players were morons.
there is something awesome about Pargo, though.
Seriously. It’s kind of awe inspiring: he WILL shoot. He has no conscience. No remorse. He will shoot – the situation, the opponent, the country. He could be in zero gravity floating in orbit. The dude would be jacking up shots. And missing.
-MPG
In this very long piece
Did he really suggest we should have kept Vinny Del Negro?
Also, we’re not going into FA without a coach, at least not right now. We could still easily have a coach in place well before FA starts. It’s only the second round of the playoffs right now.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 5, 2010 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions
What's so bad about Vinnie?
This is my question to you. What is so bad about Vinnie. I’m not saying in any way that Vinnie is a top tier coach. I am saying that Vinnie is giving Chicago waaaaay more than it is paying for, and the future can only get better. I think it’s fair to say that with the talent on Chicago’s roster, the Bulls pretty much played to even potential. Were it not for the 10 game slide due to injuries, I could see the Bulls having finished with 46-48 victories for the season. What is wrong with that? How is that not an acceptable record, for a second year coach, with an average NBA roster? 46-48 victories would have placed the Bulls as a 5th seed, behind Clevland,Orlando, Boston, and Atlanta. Chicago is NOT better than those 4 teams. The only way this will work for the Bulls is if they get a coach with winning, current, NBA experience. Not a coach who sits and analysesthe game for a living and hasn’t coached in 5-10 years. I don’t want Mo Cheeks, with his 50% wins 31% playoff wins. I don’t want Doug Collins with his career 53% wins, and 39% playoff wins. What’s wrong with keeping the coach you have for the last year on his contract, add some talent to the roster, and see what he can do? He has all the incentive in the world to coach his tail off to get a contract extention. If he doesn’t show the ability to handle that upgraded roster, then you make your move. Up until now, Vinnie has showed that he is more than capable of getting the job done. And he’s doing at a very modest salary, in a big time city. Vinnie has dealt with players not being to handle trade rumors (Deng, Gordon, Hinrich). Players being traded mid season. Key players not returning (Gordon, though I totally agreed with thtat move) Player acting out (Thomas). Injuries (the entire roster). Vinnie took all of this in stride to the tune of a 50% record, and 2 playoff appearances. What would the crime have been to keep him? Now we are seriously endangering of chances of landing a free agent.
Nick@Nite3
I think many of the posters on this board disagree with your
underlying assumption that retaining Del Negro would have improved our chances of signing a major free agent.
What is the basis of your opinion that VDN would have been an asset in courting a FA?
Keeping Vinnie
The basis is that the Chicago Bulls are a team whose arrow is pointing up. This is occurring uner the direction of Vinnie. Free agents want to go to a team that is better than their current team, and getting better for the future. Vinnie lead that mediocre team to 2 playoff appearances. Don’t knock it because it’s in the East. Do you know how many teams didn’t make the playoffs in the East? Players are looking for teams that hae their act together. Getting rid of the coach shows the ship isn’t stable. Players will look at this and say " Gee, my team hasn’t been to the playoffs in years, and this team is firing their coach, who has for 2 years straight. What’s going on here?" I really think this will impact free agents decisions. If they had kept everything in tact, in would look like a more stable setting worth being in. So what because GM and coach had words, probably happens more than we know. But don’t go fire the guy when he has done his job exceptionally well considering all circumstances.
Nick@Nite3
"Don’t knock it because it’s in the East."
no thanks.
I like the implication that firing Vinny means they made the playoffs two years and it was deemed not good enough.
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 5, 2010 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Up as in 41-41?
Are people going to look at VDN and see it going up because of him or because of Rose adn Noah?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on May 5, 2010 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
To answer your question
Minimal basketball knowledge and failure to implement even a mediocre offensive system. No team with a healthy Derrick rose should be a bottom 5 offense. Show me one other team ever that has been bottom 5 in Ortg with a player of Rose’s caliber.
Brad Miller is god.
This.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 6, 2010 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions
Chris Paul's 2006-2007 Hornets beg to differ.
In his second year, had a 22.0 PER and a 116 ORtg (both vastly better than Rose) and his team was 23rd of 30.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on May 6, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Byron Scott
uh oh.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 6, 2010 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions
23rd of 30 is not equal to bottom 5
But yeah, I see your point, so I’m rephrasing the question to name a team that had a player of Rose’s caliber, finished bottom 5 in Ortg, and didn’t have a bad coach at the helm?
Brad Miller is god.
This is all a bad joke:
QUESTION: What is the leading quality that John Paxson is looking for in his search for the next Bulls coach?
…
ANSWER: a push-over !
(I’m gonna go punch myself in the face now)
by KentuckyBullsFan on May 5, 2010 3:15 PM CDT reply actions 3 recs
A million recs
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
Sam Mitchell for coach
he was coach of the year in 2007 for toronto and may help to lure bosh to come to the bulls.
by Jermal on May 5, 2010 3:37 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
My second choice would be Thibodeau
he would be a good defensive minded coach, look what he did for the celtics
Why a coach ......
with no coaching experience? Do you think because Thibodeau is a great defensinve mind that a free agent will be more attracted to Chicago? i don’t think so.
Nick@Nite3
Vinny didn't have any experience
and you and some others still would perfer to have him as the bulls coach……..not me by the way
by Jermal on May 5, 2010 4:30 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
he's got loads of coaching experience
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on May 5, 2010 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hmmmmmm
The though of him possibly being able to lure Bosh sounds good, but he has a career 148-180 record. Bosh might know know more about his coaching ability than we do, which might be a reason to stay away. I say no way to Mitchell.
Nick@Nite3
For that matter......
What former NBA coach has such a following that potential free agents might consider? The only coach I think any player really want to play for is D’Antoni, and some don’t want to play him. I really think having a new coach in general is just bad for the Bulls right now. Too many questions about where the teamis headed. If they had stuck with Vinnie, there really wouldn’t be any questions.
Nick@Nite3
Can't be too picky
D’antoni?? Vinny??? There isn’t a great coach available for the bulls to choose from, unless phil jackson decides to leave the lakers or pat riley decides to coach again. So, you have to take the best available one and pray and cross your fingers the coach can help improve the team and can get along with players as well.
by Jermal on May 5, 2010 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I missed the conference
Did Gar say whether his top priority is still to resign Ben Gordon?
by El Toro de Goro on May 5, 2010 5:45 PM CDT reply actions 4 recs
No
but in adhering to his “woe is me” persona, he mentioned that while he embraces existential nihilism as a whole, he is still unable to reconcile the fact he does indeed value a championship. As such, he is considering tossing his hat into the epistemological nihilism ring.
Thank God no!
Maybe at some point everyone will realize Benedict Gordon took the money and ran…there was nothing the Bulls could have done to retain to him…they did not have the option to match the contract that was offered. So now the Pistons have a severely overpaid one dimensional player who struggled all season to even deliver that dimension.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Completely off topic
but u gotta love another MRI on Lebron after they were destroyed by the celtics at home (the first MRI said there was nothing)
Aww, I'm watching game 3 against the Cavs
VDN and Derrick just shared a chuckle moment when he told Derrick, “Now you gotta make a tough shot to make up for the easy one you missed”
It almost made me feel sad.
He kept his players loose..
I’ll give him credit for that, and they usually showed up to play. It’s a shame he couldn’t coach in-game worth a damn.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 6, 2010 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions
True. I think the Bulls should get a players friendly coach
I could definetly see Noah freaking out with a General type
by JustAnotherFan on May 6, 2010 8:33 AM CDT up reply actions
curious what everyone thinks
would you rather we hire a coach first well before july 1st so that he can be there with pax/gar to recruit the FAs?
orrrrrrrrrrrrr
would you rather the bulls left the coaching spot open so that they could offer the FAs a coach of their choosing?
the second would be my preference because hey anything we can add to our pitch helps.
of course if we played this route there is a chance many of the good coaches would be taken beforehand
I imagine it's common knowledge among those in the game
Which coaches and players get along, so if you know which FA’s you want, you know which coaches to go after. It’s safe to say if a player disliked a coach, the GM’s would or should know. I guess that’s a lot of faith to put in to Paxson, but I’d hope the FO can at least do that much background research.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 6, 2010 3:42 PM CDT up reply actions
Depends on who they hire.
And they probably already know what they want. If they’re trying to hire John Doe, then it won’t matter.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 7, 2010 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions
i'd rather hire the coach first.
i think it would send a better message for the bulls FO to avoid the bullshit because of the crap that surrounded the last search, and that it would look a lot better to a FA to have some sort of stability to come to.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
All we need for success next season are:
BYRON SCOTT & AMARE STOUDIMERE.
I believe Derrick would flourish and further develop into the best PG in the Game under B. Scott, and it doesn’t hurt that he’s coached the best in the Game (J.Kidd/C.Paul). Amare and Joakim would just DESTROY any frontcourt in the Eastern Conference! If we keep Deng, our team can run the fastbreak like a PHX/OKC. Derrick’s assist-to-turnover ratio will decrease, because he’ll have FINISHERS he can pass the ball to on the break. We also need a 3pt. shooter, and a solid defender/post player on the roster as well. But those Spaceballs comments made earlier about the Bulls FO were HILARIOUS! I think i’m gonna go watch that now. LOL.
J.I.
by Jeye15 The Legend on May 7, 2010 12:26 PM CDT reply actions
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