Monday Coaching and Free Agency Roundup: Bosh sign/trades, Joe Johnson, Thibodeau frontrunner for coach?
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 24, 2010 2:03 PM CDT
Email
Print[UPDATE by your friendly BullsBlogger, 05/24/10 6:40 PM CDT: Woj is reporting that the Hornets are moving fast on Thibodeau in response to interest elsewhere in the league. And Reinsdorf is cited as a fan of Thibs, notsomuch the supposed man in charge, Gar Forman.]
Lots of stuff floating around the past couple days, not as much new as it is...more. As always, you should be heading to the fanposts and fanshots constantly for updated information. Though I think I need to remind everyone that 1) Fanposts are preferred, especially if there are quotes and your own commentary, and 2) try and keep the different threads about the same topic to a minimum. I realize this isn't an exact science, and I always lean towards more rather than less, no matter if it gets less organized that way.
So enough of the dungeonmaster tasks...
- Mike McGraw confirms KC's weekend report that Thibodeau is emerging as a frontrunner for the head coaching position. If the other options are Frank and Cheeks, I could see Thibodeau, despite being new to the job, actually having more resonance in free agent recruitment. Every Celtics victory makes him seem like a coaching star, whether he is or not.
- RaptorsHQ and Sam Smith dive into some Bosh sign/trade possibilities, in the wake of the weekend report of Bosh's list. This is obviously going to be a fluid situation: Bosh may have a list, but it'll depend on how other FAs land, and the degree of preference may make the whole idea of a list meaningless: if he chooses to go to one single place, the Raptors have less leverage in a sign/trade, and could just have to accept the trade exception and a pick. If Bosh has a few destinations in mind, that changes things. Thankfully Taj Gibson played himself into being somewhat desirable as return, I would've not expected that a year ago.
- Sam also had his obligatory mention of Joe Johnson, a result that only he seems to think is desirable, whereas most Bulls fans either range in it being a last resort, to an outright awful idea. Doug Thonus at ChicagoNow is dead-set against signing Johnson, though I think that's only if it were a 6-year max contract that I don't think will happen anymore. Last week Hoopinion had a great piece on Johnson's lack of progress, and implied regression in his next contract. I was actually a bit encouraged in his career aging trajectory considering he's not that athletic now, so losing that shouldn't be as big of a deal. However, as the post suggests, his defense could really suffer. And thus even as being so so so so much taller than Ben Gordon, we wouldn't see that much of a bump on that end of the floor as implied by his vaunted tallness. Overall I'm still not in the apoplectic camp of a Joe Johnson signing, only if it is followed by the Bulls continuing to refuse to go into the tax afterwards to bolster that overpaid contract. He's still an upgrade that makes the team better.
140 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I would be
thrilled to hire Thibs… and you said exactly what I have been saying for a couple weeks to friends… Thibs gives us more cache with Free Agents than anybody not named Phil Jackson. He’s got all the potential in the world with zero fails. That’s an easy, sexy sell.
I’m really hoping for a Lakers/Boston final with the Lakers edging it out. Hopefully, that will keep them from offering Bynum to Toronto. Why mess with a championship team.
Without that option, and with Dallas and Houston not on Bosh’s list. I think a S&T where we send out Deng, Taj, and Kirk, and take back Bosh and Hedo is Toronto’s best option.
2010... where relevant basketball in Chicago happens!
I agree that adding Joe Johnson would make us a better team
but even as a last-resort, I’m not sure I like the signing. If that were our only move this off-season, I don’t see us being much better than a 4-seed (assuming Lebron/Wade/Bosh stay in the East, the Celtics don’t fall apart completely and Amare/Boozer don’t come to the East)
by darksmokepuncher on May 24, 2010 2:19 PM CDT reply actions
I'd rather be a 4-seed than an 8 seed
I’m fine with Joe Johnson as a last resort. No one wants to hear it, but there is a possibility the Bulls could miss out on all the top free agents. Lebron and Wade resign with their teams, Bosh signs in Miami, Amare stays in Phoenix – what do the Bulls do then? I agree that Joe Johnson isn’t worth a max contract, but I’d rather overay him than whiff entirely this summer. The problem is that Noah is going to be eligible for an extension after next season, and with the lockout looming, it’s not like they can count on having all the cap room again in the summer of 2011. To a certain extent, the Bulls need to shit or get off the pot this summer.
by Big D on May 24, 2010 2:35 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
To be clear, my objection with Johnson is that I see a near 0% chance of the Bulls going into the luxury tax as a team that can’t get out of the second round, and I see almost no chance of the team doing that with the present core + Johnson. Johnson probably gets them to the second round, and that’d be more fun than what we have now, but I think he caps the team’s ceiling at that spot.
by dougthonus on May 24, 2010 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
the fact that we have to say "probably" when it comes to getting to the second round is exactly why I'd take my chances
I’d much rather wait and hope to get Carmelo than take ourselves completely out of contention for a guy who can “probably” get us past the first round.
by darksmokepuncher on May 24, 2010 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions
I would rather target...
David Lee, Carlos Boozer or even a trade for Al Jeff or Paul Millsap…
The only scenario where I want Joe Johnson, is the front loaded 3 year, $45M type of deal…and I can’t imagine he would sign that contract when someone else will offer to overpay him well into his declining Rip Hamilton years…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on May 24, 2010 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
me too, except for Jefferson.
“Joe Johnson as a last resort” falls below David Lee, Carlos Boozer and (somehow) Paul Millsap.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I only included Millsap...
Because there were rumblings in Utah that he could get traded if Boozer resigns…I don’t know how we could make it work (Taj for Millsap?), but he has been productive when given minutes and has a reasonable 3 years, $24M remaining…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on May 24, 2010 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
i agree
i was just throwing that out as an aside… or something
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Either way none
of those guys = CHAMPIONSHIP
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 25, 2010 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks...
Captain obvious…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
agreed. hell, i cant stand al jeff but id rather have him for the next six years on the off chance
that he gets better than joe johnson.
"Why don't you do what my buddies and I used to do when we were hard up for dates?"
"Invade Korea?"
The good news...
The Al Jeff contract is only 3 years, $42M remaining…while he is a slow down, one dimensional player…that dimension actually fills a need for the Bulls…he is pretty far down on my wish list, but Joe Johnson at the max is not on my list…first YaoPau then Doug have convinced me that is a terrible idea.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on May 24, 2010 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Only way he would be a good signing is if he's the second FA we get this summer
and for a contract around 17 mil.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
I listened to Sam Smith on Waddle and Silvy recently...
And he made a (rare) good point about the 2000 free agency, where the Bulls were apparently close to brining in T-Mac, but became greedy (Sam’s words) and tried to bring in Duncan and Hill as well.
This got me thinking about this summer and who the Bulls’ top priority should/might be. I get the sense that Bosh wants to be wanted, really wanted, by a number of teams. So, should the Bulls put the all their eggs in one basket, so to speak, and heavily court a Bosh S&T within the first few days of the free agency period? That way, if successful, it provides an even more attractive team for LeBron (since he will apparently not rush into a decision), while also avoiding going after a number of free agents and striking out completely. And, if the Bulls don’t land James, a core of Rose-Deng-Bosh-Noah (or without Deng) is still pretty fantastic.
By no means am I saying that James isn’t the best player or that the Bulls shouldn’t make every attempt to sign him. However, my gut feeling is that Bosh would be more turned off by teams courting another player over him than James would.
This may not make any sense, but I figured I would throw it out there.
by bryield on May 24, 2010 2:41 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I guess my main point is that there is a first mover advantage
and it may be more strategically advantageous to target Bosh first and James second.
by bryield on May 24, 2010 2:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with this, but I think its where Bosh's list of teams hurt us
Ideally, I’d like for us to go after Bosh with a sign-and-trade first and still have cap space left over. At that point, I think we’d take a definitive lead in the running for Lebron.
Unfortunately, with Bosh giving Toronto a list of teams, they really don’t have to jump at the first opportunity.
by darksmokepuncher on May 24, 2010 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I think that's the way to go...
Try to S&T for Bosh at midnight on July 1st. Whatever Toronto wants as long as it leaves cap room for another max free agent. Then sit back and decide who to add. At the point, we would be a no brainer for somebody.
If we do Deng, Taj, and Kirk for Bosh and Hedo…. we are talking
Rose
Xavier Henry, Paul George, or James Anderson
Hedo
Bosh
Noah
If Lebron or Wade seriously wants to win, they would have to think long and hard about jumping at that. And at worst, we get Joe Johnson, or Ray Allen, or Morrow.
I would figure that Brad Miller would come back to that team for the minimum… and maybe Acie Law, and few other veteran ring chasers.
2010... where relevant basketball in Chicago happens!
I guess it will ultimately come down to which team(s) swoon the best.
But, clearly the advantage is going to go to the team who lands the first big free agent. The problem is, it is becoming increasingly clear that July 1 will begin a ridiculously frustrating collective action problem.
It makes sense to me
I would be happy if Bosh was all they got. It’s way better than settling for JJ.
I do not condone mediocrity in no shape or form
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 24, 2010 3:02 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
right, they'll condone below mediocrity?
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 24, 2010 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Hinrich, Gibson, Nocioni...oh and adrian griffin to have a skiles favorite in there
What should have been the bulls REAL core!!!!
by Sambossanova on May 24, 2010 10:51 PM CDT up reply actions
If he comes with Bosh or LeBron
I’m all for it. If he’s the only catch of the summer, that’d be disappointing.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 24, 2010 3:31 PM CDT reply actions
Here's my thing.
We get the s+t for Bosh done on draft night. Any Bosh trade is going to involve draft picks, wouldn’t Toronto want to control who they draft? I don’t want to draft someone at 17 for Toronto and they get stuck with him. And I don’t want to draft someone for us and then we lose out cuz Tor wanted someone else.
I know it won’t be official til July 8th. But the trade could be done in principle by draft night and I fully expect it to happen like what happened with KG and Ray.
Get Bosh draft night and then on July 1st. Gar Paxdorf Rose, Bosh, and Nah show up on the doorstep of Lebron and tell him “let’s go get those rings.”
by Edicus2288i on May 24, 2010 3:43 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
can't do it on draft night
so there’s your thing gone.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on May 24, 2010 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
yep...
That was funny.
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
kg and ray
were under contract, which is why they could do it that way.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
and the KG deal wasn't until end of July
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2954127
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
But don't the Raptors have until June 30th to get Bosh to sign an extension?
Couldn’t they sign him and then trade him to us on July 8th? Or is that rule in place where you couldn’t trade newly signed players til December whatever?
by Edicus2288i on May 25, 2010 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions
that i'm not sure about
an extension isn’t a new contract. i don’t know what the rules are regarding that.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
I dont even understand Joe Johnson as a last resort
If we end up with Joe Johnson as our best get of the offseason, that would mean that
A) we missed out on all of the better FA’s
B) failed to S + T anyone else better
C) left the potential for our team over the next 4-5 years or whatever the length of the contract would be to top out as a 3-4 seed.. this is the high end of the potential…
Personally, saying to me watching “better basketball” for a few years is really just a slap in the face, you have to consider alternative possibilities (by signing joe johnson we give up on what could be a better player next year, we won’t go anywhere with him in 1 year so it is pointless not to wait,, also to say a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush only makes sense if all the birds are created equally, as to which joe johnson is decidedly not) when making decisions, it isn’t “Oh well, LeBron and Bosh didn’t sign with us, lets just take J Johnson” that type of thinking is so short sighted it is mind blowing, and not only is that more akin to giving up on a title, it would also mean that as a team in Chicago, with a good core, we could not lure any of the 7-8 better players/values/combination of players on the market… Joe Johnson isn’t a last resort, it is a failure of 2010 and would only confirm to me that our management has no concept of players relative values in the league and that they do not particularly care to win a championship in derrick rose’s prime
Gasol was traded at the draft deadline was he not? And to a team well into LT let alone without capspace
So we have until Feb ’11. Relax.
Question: Which do you choose
A) Lose Noah (and only him) in a sign-and-trade for Bosh
or
B) sign Joe Johnson outright to a deal for at least 5 years and $15 million per year
I’m not saying either is necessary or the only choices, just wondering. I don’t know what I’d do.
Probably A for me. With youth and salary flexibility, I think I might like Rose, Deng, Bosh going forward better than Rose, Johnson, Deng, Noah.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Lose Noah
Joe Johnson is a terrific player, but he has too much that good opponents take away from his game. Bosh is future hall of famer on a squad with Rose. We can acquire another center to complement Bosh.
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
by NBA Observer on May 24, 2010 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions
permaban!
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
by NBA Observer on May 24, 2010 7:20 PM CDT up reply actions
Don't think there's any way
the org does scenario A.
Noah is just too much talent/cost. (i.e we can get somebody hella good for the differences of their contract values..)
by BAB-Bass on May 24, 2010 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yea, perhaps he's cheap now, but if any team can see that shiny new contract coming. it's the Bulls
Noah won’t be cheap for long. That’s the same reason I’d have to say “A” for Tyger’s question. If you can get the superior talent/player you kinda have to do it, although it would never come to that. As much as I love Noah, and he is oh so awesome, so much of his game is dependent on hustle and being a high energy player. If he gets paid big bucks, his value could take a big hit unless his game keeps improving, which is very possible.
Btw, I was watching Celtics/Magic the other day, trying to figure out how good Rondo is because of all the ESPN drool that’s being thrown his way. Magic Johnson said he was the best point guard in the league, which made me sad. I think I figured out what Rondo is, he’s the Joakim Noah of point guards. The thing that separates him from other guys is his hustle, he’s basically an energy guy like Noah only at pg. He’s obviously a very basketball smart too. I’d still take Rose over him in a heartbeat. Rondo’s playoff PER is around 19.5 last time I checked, which is the exact same as Rose’s from this year. If Rose had guys on his team that could shoot like the Celtics, Rose would be silly good.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions
You're selling Rondo short.
He’s pretty damn smart, too. The thing is, Chris Paul does virtually everything (rebounding?) as good as he does, but then offensively he’s amazing.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 5:30 PM CDT up reply actions
I said that he was very smart:
He’s obviously a very basketball smart too.
The thing about Rondo is, he probably has the best collection of talent for a point guard to work with out of anyone in the NBA as far as the skill set of his supporting cast. Every one of his teammates can shoot jumpshots incredibly well. Which leads to them converting his assists at a higher rate. When he gives the ball up, that person, whoever they are, can take and make big shots.
I’d like to see him on a team without that kind of support. Plus, all of his scoring is just him being opportunistic, nobody is trying to shut him down like they do with Rose. That team just plays great team ball, and he’s had the same squad basically since he came into the league. I think he’s entering overrated territory, and I’m not just being a hater. I guess time will tell.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 5:50 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I think Rondo is entering "destroyer of gods" territory.
He could be one of those guys who plays All-Star ball during the regular season because he hangs back while the other stars get the credit, and in the playoffs he just turns into an animal. The way he’s slaying Jameer Nelson when Orlando really made life hard for him last year is damn impressive.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on May 24, 2010 5:55 PM CDT up reply actions
"Destroyer of Gods" territory?
I think ESPN has an opening. He was 4-14 with 11 points 12 assists and 3 rebounds on Saturday. He’s been damn good, but to me the star of the show has been the Celtics defense, particularly a guy like Perkins that is D’ing up Dwight Howard to the tune of 7 points on 3-10 shooting, and only 7 rebounds. Rondo is good, but he’s not that good.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're right
it does help to look at ALL of his performances (not just his amazing ones + highlights) when reaching a verdict.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 6:46 PM CDT up reply actions
well, he didnt look good tonight, but he was better than his stats suggested on saturday.
"Why don't you do what my buddies and I used to do when we were hard up for dates?"
"Invade Korea?"
I didn't finish reading everything you said before I responded (so I take back the 'smart' comment)
but the way Rondo penetrates then makes the perfect move, whether it be a pass or a shot, it pretty amazing. It’s Steve Nashian. It’s like he has the defense’s every move planned out in his head, then reacts in a way that you can’t counter.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 5:32 PM CDT up reply actions
lol, I didn't read this comment before I responded, so I take back my correction above
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 5:51 PM CDT up reply actions
I can't chose between those, personally.
But the org wouldn’t do B anyway, so I wouldn’t have to worry about it.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions
But I guess if I was hard-pressed, I'd just choose B
and hope for the best.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 5:33 PM CDT up reply actions
A. Neither
Look I like Bosh and think he’s a hell of a talent. But one thing that seems for sure in their careers… Noah seems to have more of an impact on his team’s winning or losing right now then Bosh does. I’m sure I’ll catch hell for that but that’s just my opinion.
Also I know Joe Johnson is looked at like a bad signing if we got him as a last resort but in terms of how he would match up with Rose, I just don’t think it’s that bad of a move if we ended up with JJ and Boozer if the whole Lebron/Bosh thing doesn’t pan out.
You see,
the whole issue I have with joe johnson isn’t about whether this team will get better, that would be admitting to hinrich > JJ.
However, our team would get better with almost any free agent we sign and to different magnitudes and for longer periods of time, when you add all of those things up, you are essentially looking at JJ as the bottom of the barrel.
True but here's the thing...
If we get Bosh we’re still going to need a SG that can fill it up from the arc. I don’t think that’s as easy to aquire as people think. Unless we get a steal in the draft, JJ is our best option there. Unless we can get Nowitski or Lebron which is a different conversation at that point. If we end up with JJ and Boozer I can live with that even though a lot of fans would be pissed. I think that roster can get to the Eastern Conf Finals.
But the question is, how
much better will each FA make us?
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 25, 2010 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Option A)
as much as i like noah, bosh is better and we also don’t get the johnson baggage, albeit it may mean we keep the hinrich baggage…
Realize, also, that A) if done with noah and Bosh straight-up, which is possible...
…means the Bulls “only” take on about $14 million of Bosh’s contract in new money. How much space will they have? Could they dump Hinrich on someone (fuck Hinrich, grrrr….) because getting someone like David Lee plus Bosh PLUS whatever the M2GwcD&S would be drafted, would be pretty snazzy for the Bulls. 3 guys in Lee, Bosh and Deng in the prime of their careers for the next four years to go with Rose and a the SG. Not a ten-year dynasty, but if the SG turns into anything, definitely a legitimate title contender for 3-4 years… before contracts even need to be thought of.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I didn't know that.
Entirely changes thing….I think you have to, in that case.
by Stacey_Is_King on May 24, 2010 6:48 PM CDT up reply actions
This could be very very bad
Thibodeau could be offered Hornets job really soon
Chicago Bulls owner Jerry Reinsdorf has been effusive in praise of Thibodeau to league friends,
Thibodeau has interviewed for several jobs over recent years, including Philadelphia, Detroit and Sacramento, but has yet to land one. It’s unclear whether Thibodeau would immediately accept an offer or wait for the chance to meet with the Bulls once the Celtics eliminate the Orlando Magic in the Eastern Conference finals.
OK, enough with the waiting around. Get him here now
by Option27 on May 24, 2010 6:05 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
this is a little different
thibs is in the middle of the playoffs. the hornets had an opportunity to interview him before the bulls’ season was over.
this isn’t the same story as d’antoni.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
Not talking about Dantoni
That was a CLEAR fuck up…this is more casual bulls front office with thier sense of “lets not rush into anything” …a sense of lets take our sweet time and then nothing happen
yeah but what i'm saying
is that there was no taking their sweet time. thibs has had no time to interview between when vinny was let go and now since the celts have been playing.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
But they took their sweet time to fire Vinny...Ugh whatever...
General manager needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.
Sir Paxdorf.
Sinse Vinny has been fired
Tom has had 2 interviews with the Hornets….Only One with the Bulls …I just hope the Bulls Front Office dont screw this up by taking their time.
the celtics
eliminated the heat the same day the cavs eliminated the bulls.
the celts started their next series only 4 days later (april 27 was game 5, – may 1 was game 1). so 3 full days of rest.
granted, it took a full week (till may 4) for them to fire vinny, but they would have had to fire him, get permission from the celts, and do the interview in 3 days.
but since the hornets weren’t in the playoffs, they were able to ask for permission during the first round or whenever which makes it a whole lot easier.
yeah it sucks that the hornets did get a chance to squeeze in the interview, but you guys are making way too big of a deal about the bulls dragging their feet on this one.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
Yer
Its crap how its turned out so far …What i was saying is that i hope the bulls front office dont sit back and go by our so called GM’s moto " Lets not rush things" and really try and get this down ASAP before the hornets snap him up.
yeah
the biggest problem might be if the hornets actually give him an offer, and then it’s obv up to him whether he wants to wait for the bulls. if the hornets threaten to move on, he might wanna take the sure thing, but if they come up with an offer very soon (before the bulls can even schedule an interview), it’s tough for the bulls cause obviously they’re not gonna put an offer out to someone they haven’t even gotten a chance to formally interview yet.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
If another team snags this dude before we can, I'll be super pissed
by Option27 on May 24, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
it's tough though
if the hornets have a good offer and aren’t willing to wait, he might wanna take the guaranteed money over potential money from the bulls.
let’s hope the bulls get to at least get a chance to talk to the guy so that they could feel comfortable having to make a sudden offer if they really want him. they’re not gonna offer him money without talking to him.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
i think this whole coaching debate is a bit funny....if
we were able to get lebron and bosh…. i could care less who are coach was lol
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 7:00 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
none of the coaches we are looking at are that....
enticing….. Lebron or Bosh wont want to come because we signed Thibodeau.
they will come because they have a chance to win with a lineup of
rose
lebron
deng or hinrich
bosh
noah
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 7:10 PM CDT up reply actions
phil jackson or Doc are the only coaches that can entice players here
none whom of which i believe are going to be in chicago next yr
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 7:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I cant wait to see hinrich play sf
if they cancel tomorrow's game too, it'll be the second-best lossless streak of the season
How shitty are we!!
-billyok
by blackoutsox on May 24, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
How is it the process-oriented Bulls have a favorite of their coaching search when they haven't even interviewed him?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
...because it appears that JR is actually awake and likes Thibs.
Probably because of that whole “defense” mantra, which ruined the D’Antoni thing. Hopefully this means JR will immediately pony up and offer this guy the job, because even if he doesn’t pan out, I don’t see how he’d be worse than Vinny, Mo freaking Cheeks, or Lawrence “My team started last year 0-16” Frank.
Thrusting out of the playoff race, one injury at a time.
In a way, if it's true. doesn't that kind of strengthen their argument that they're heavily researching guys before interviews?
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions
Not really. Should have been researched already, imo.
I just think it’s funny that, as KG goes, so go the Celtics, so go Tom Thibadeau’s coaching prospects.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on May 24, 2010 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Just by firing VDN and Collins getting hired
the chances of a coaching search narrowed to “guys that could be in my foursome” was eliminated.
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
by NBA Observer on May 24, 2010 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
With the cle firing mike brown it puts an intresting twist on things...
I think the bulls need to go after Bosh with 100% effort in a sign and trade 1st. Then lebron second.
The coaching change for cle makes you wonder…. if Cle wasn’t out coached as bad as they were against bos could they still be in the playoffs.
Cle did hold the best record. What could have Phil jackson done with the same team??
hopefully lebron isn’t wondering those same things!!
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:13 PM CDT reply actions
What if Bosh's first priority is to play with Lebron? (which has been mentioned as a possibility)
How does your plan look then?
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
well.....
i think Bosh is smart enough to know chicago team in place right now could be a top three in the east without Lebron.
with that being said… I just can’t see lebron signing back on with the cle with the ageing supporting cast around him…
But I agree I think bosh and lebron will be in the same uniform next year
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions
If that's the case
and there is some kind of handshake deal between the two, I would be very scared of the Knicks right now. Having a shitty supporting cast is the one thing the Bulls have over them right now, that changes if Bosh goes to NY,
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:27 PM CDT up reply actions
i think that actually plays to our favor...
bosh added to the knicks still dosn’t make ny supporting cast better then the bulls.
who would be their PG or C?
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions
but i think this FA is one big collusion with the players....
this off-season could swith the balance of powers for years to come….
I just hope in plays in the bulls favor
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:34 PM CDT up reply actions
if Lebron number one concern is to play with Bosh this would have to be his priroity list to Bosh....
This is their plan…..
plan
A) Lebron knows chicago offers them ( bosh and Lebron) the best supporting cast.
So i can see them saying to each other…. Bosh try and work a sign and trade to Chicago….. if that happens i’ll follow u there
B) they settle and play in NY
i don’t see mia in play for either
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:38 PM CDT up reply actions
unless wade goes somewhere else that is
…
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:45 PM CDT up reply actions
read my article if u want to know how i think the fa will play out for bosh....
…
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions
Man
You replied yourself 5 times!
by JustAnotherFan on May 25, 2010 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I have a question for all of you that think the world will end if we don't get Thibodeau
Have any of you ever even heard him speak? I haven’t, and I know it’s not hugely important, but shouldn’t we have at least heard a guy talk before we start saying that it will be a complete disaster if he doesn’t get the job?
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
what????
his coaching speaks for its self
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Yea, the three hall of famers and current All Star point guard have nothing to do with it...
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Look at our other
candidates though …
by rick_ross on May 24, 2010 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
celtics
have a team rule about assistants addressing the media.
before that, i don’t know what the rules on his teams were like.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
Yea, I've heard that too
My point is just that, how can everyone be so certain about a guy that no one really knows that much about? Except that he’s been passed over for other jobs a ton of times. Like I was saying, it’s not a bad hire, but people make it sound like a home run, and it’s far from it imo
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions
watching him the playoffs...
it seems like the playes really respect and listen to what he as to says
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions
yeah, i get it
i get not being sure at all. however, he sounds a lot more appealing than frank or cheeks to me, if those are our other candidates…
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
I agree, but it's a shame it has come to that
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 6:25 PM CDT up reply actions
Have you ever read about Doug Collins' coaching history? Or seen his record?
Thrusting out of the playoff race, one injury at a time.
...at least Thibs has a chance to be good, whereas we all know Collins sucks
Thrusting out of the playoff race, one injury at a time.
How does he "suck"?
He has an overall winning record. He’s proven that he can be a good coach, and he’s respected throughout the league. We know nothing about Thibaodeu, how is that a better situation? I’d like to know why you think Collins is so awful…
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions
I wouldn't say Collins sucks but I would say he's maybe a little above average and he slows down the offense
Just wouldn’t work with this team.
But Thibs does have the chance to be really good.
And I’m very much looking forward to hear his humor I keep hearing about
The last time Collins did a good coaching job, Grant Hill was on his way to a HOF career.
His tenure in Washington was a disaster, and I’d like to think die-hard Bulls fans are pretty clear on what led to his downfall in Chicago.
I’m not going to say Collins has no chance of succeeding, but honestly it’s been a really long time since he’s had to think about this stuff.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on May 24, 2010 8:43 PM CDT up reply actions
He still doesn't suck
And even given some of the things you mentioned, I still like him when you stack him up against some of the other names we’re hearing. That Washington job was doomed from the start, any expectations were not realistic anyways. And like I’ ve been saying, I didn’t want him because of his coaching ability, even though I think he could do the job, I liked him because he’s one of the few candidates that would be a pretty big name, someone to give some of theTh free agents something to think about.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions
You are the same guy who doesn't like Avery...
Who has the best winning percentage of any coach in NBA history…
I am saying, suck is relative…
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
by Dionysus2.0 on May 24, 2010 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Just cause I don't want him for the Bulls doesn't mean I think he sucks
Avery is a pretty good coach, I wouldn’t hire him, but he’s not terrible or anything
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 25, 2010 12:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Forget about the coach, we need to find players
For PF, I have an off the radar guy the team should pursue: Ryan Bowen. Sure, he just took a job as a video coordinator for Iowa, but c’mon, the guy had a better PER than LeBron. And at SG the team needs to sign Alonzo Gee. After all, he was second in 3P% this season.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
You're right.
I concur.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Fun stat of the day:
Brandon Jennings’ three-point percentage is higher than his field goal percentage.
Go Rockets/Nets[CDR]/Bucks[Jennings]!
They're jsut doing this
so that if he gets/takes another job they have yet another reason to rip the Bulls org, like they do over D’Antoni (who lied to Reinsdorf and doesn’t coach defesne at all).
Basically, they just want to bitch and complain.
If D'Antoni could somehow consistently get a league average D out of a team with Shawn Marion
and cameos by Kurt Thomas and Raja Bell without even coaching D, then I think the importance of coaching has been greatly overstated. No, they didn’t spend a lot of time on D, but yes, what they did was effective enough.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
by snley on May 25, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I guess
They did win a bunch of regular season games when he was coach of the Suns. But it’s telling that when a reporter asks Knick players if they work on defense in practice and they respond “are you kidding?” and laugh. Defense wins championships, and in general I’d much rather have a great defensive team with a mediocre offense than the other way around.
It's not just in New York, D'Antoni gave light treatment to D in Phoenix too
Still, those teams could have won more in the playoffs if not for some bad luck with injuries and suspensions. I find it funny, though, that people love to hold up those Suns teams as prime example number 1 that “defense wins championships” yet never seem to make mention of the mid 90s Knicks. It’s not defense or offense, it’s the combination of the two sides that leads to a team scoring more points than their opponents.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
True about those Suns teams getting bad breaks
especially that year with all the suspensions.
And of course, having a great defense + an effective offense is better than a great defense + an average offense. But not very many teams that have their primary strength as offense win championships. In the NBA, you pretty much have to go back to the 80’s Lakers. And even they played good, rather than average, defense.
It goes both ways though, the 04 are a rare exception of a team that won with below average
performance on either side. Still, their numbers were skewed from that season as they started playing much better offensively after getting Sheed. Otherwise, championship teams have had top 10 units on both sides.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
I'm sure the Bulls have been in contact with Thibs' agent.
I would think things are reasonably under control. Reasonably=as much as NBA transactions can be under control.
Fact:
were gonna end up with Hubie Brown
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 24, 2010 6:52 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Fact: bulls are going to get lebron and bosh!
we sign and trade hinrich or deng…. taj and draft for Bosh
and lebron signs on
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 6:54 PM CDT up reply actions
So what do u guys make of Chris Broussard??
he was one of the first to say he thinks Bosh and lebron are coming to chicago??
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5211940 ( Broussard latest interview on lebron and Bosh)
what do u guys think??
by Da Bears2333333 on May 24, 2010 7:05 PM CDT reply actions
I like him a lot for the past 10 days or so.
But if LeBron is not here in August I’m gonna hate that guy for pumping up my hopes for whole summer.
General manager needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.
Sir Paxdorf.
I don't really care about that, they'll get their chance to talk to him
but I am thinking about how great JJ Redick would look in a Bulls jersey. How could we pry that guy away from the Magic? He’s exactly what we need imo. I want him so much more than Joe Johnson
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 24, 2010 9:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Gotta give Redick a lot of credit for how far he's brought his game the last couple years
He would be the perfect 2 with Bosh, James, Rose, and Noah. Solid D, great shooter, ok passer and ball handler. Even if Bulls end up w/ a lesser FA, I’d still like to see them take a run at JJ to replace Kirk. After all the money Orlando spent last off season, I’m hoping they may be willing to pass on matching offers to Redick.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
Go Celtics for Lebron, OK
Go Celtics for Thib, too much
by JustAnotherFan on May 25, 2010 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions
Redick has definitely improved. He’s proved he can get his shot off in the NBA and nail 3s. He’s never gonna get to the rim but he can shoot. Also he’s not a liability on D…not a good defender but he’s gotten up to passable/mediocre status which is good enough. Not a bad option at SG….shouldnt be a starter tho unless we had Bosh and James as well….would be good off the bench either way
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
