Ric Bucher on LeBron
by YaoPau on May 19, 2010 6:19 PM CDT
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PrintHere's the insider link, here's the bootlegged link. (can't do that -ed.)
Notable quotes:
[Cleveland's] team power structure supposedly has looked like this: owner Dan Gilbert, GM Danny Ferry and head coach Mike Brown.
With James standing just below Gilbert and just above Ferry.
Two opposing GMs, without citing specific examples, said they know James has vetoed deals Ferry would have made over the past few years.
Meanwhile, the acquisitions of Larry Hughes, Mo Williams, Shaquille O'Neal and Antawn Jamison all have been made at James' behest, sources say.
That's why, while sources say it's true that mortgage-broker/friend-to-the-stars William Wesley is shopping James to teams in a package with Kentucky coach John Calipari, for a franchise to actually buy that two-fer would be a blatant attempt to acquire James' value-improving quotient without considering the consequences. One report had Los Angeles Clippers owner Donald Sterling willing to give James that authority, which fits with Sterling's modus operandi.
Anyone believing the Chicago Bulls would promise James he could hire his head coach doesn't know owner Jerry Reinsdorf or the franchise's history during Jordan's era. Jordan, after all, didn't want Jackson to replace Doug Collins as head coach, despised the deal that sent his good friend Charles Oakley to the Knicks for Bill Cartwright and had legendary contempt for GM Jerry Krause.
Six rings later …
"Jerry will never, ever turn the franchise over to a player," said one former Bull. "Ever."
Okay so I basically quoted the whole article. Not a whole lot of breaking news there, but I hadn't heard that LeBron was vetoing trades, or that Sterling would give LeBron full reign. And this was the first attempt I've seen at confirming Reinsdorf won't bend for LeBron, and it supports McGraw's story that Calipari isn't on Reinsdorf's wishlist.
As for the constant William Wesley references on ESPN lately, you can read more about him here, or find a colossal amount of info at TrueHoop. Scoop Jackson calls him the most powerful man in basketball, and MJ's agent David Falk calls him one of the three most powerful. Worth a read imo.
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This is why it's important for the Bulls to hire a name coach
If they’re gonna do it on their own, they need to hire someone that can garner some respect from Lebron. I just don’t see him coming here to play for Lawrence Frank or Mo Cheeks. I still don’t understand why Collins couldn’t get a shot. He has the respect of players from coaching Michael and his TNT and Olympic work, plus he would come at an org friendly price. That was the guy, if they’re not gonna get Phil, Doc or Van Gundy.
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
lol, thanks, love that show
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 19, 2010 7:36 PM CDT up reply actions
At this point, it looks like Collins is on his way to Philly
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Now Reinsdorf gets to watch his best friend in the whole wide world suffer from afar. Thanks pal!
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 19, 2010 7:58 PM CDT up reply actions
yea, bucher says that too in the article
“The consensus among front-office executives is that to transform James not merely into a money-making machine but a championship-producing one as well, the Cavs or any other franchise needs to hire a coach who can convince James to lose the pregame skits and develop the kind of footwork Kobe Bryant and Paul Pierce have, for starters. The problem is that the coaches with the obvious pedigrees are currently employed elsewhere:”
then he lists pat riley, phil, and poppovich, he mentions larry brown too but says that relationship is destroyed from the team usa days
im pretty sure the cavs didnt lose on the basis of skits and footwork.
"Oh don't look so smug. You try skating and blowing into a jug while your heart is breaking."
obviously...
i think hes trying to say front offices want to have a coach thats in control of the team. If the coach says buy a real camera next time you take pics of ur teammates then he’ll go buy an slr.
by regui8er on May 19, 2010 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
i totally agree that we shouldnt be giving lebron complete and total control
look at what it did to cleveland. every single trade or decision was made based on how they felt lebron would react to it. they didnt have the balls to do anything that was against lebron’s will. that doesnt add up to good basketball decisions being made.
i would rather have a gm and a coach that would actually stand up to lebron and take no shit from him. we need a coach to coach him and hold him accountable.
I wonder Lebron learned his lesson in team building...
I mean the trades he “authorized” did not exactly work out in bringing him that championship…though you can’t fault management for the Wallace for Shaq deal or acquiring Jamison for nothing…
Seriously, though…he wanted Larry Hughes???
Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and (there is no LLE thanks to the Pargo signing) will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.
Does it say anywhere that these where Lebron's handpicked choices?
It could be that these were all guys that they were gonna sign anyway, but just opted to ask Lebron first, which I don’t have a huge problem with. And other than Shaq, I don’t remember many of the moves getting criticized when they happened either
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 19, 2010 6:47 PM CDT up reply actions
i dont think its so much that they were handpicked
as they were decisions made solely based on how lebron would react to them
Maybe true, but my point is they were always drafting at positions of need
Like Larry Hughes, when everyone said he needed a Robin type shooting guard to pair with. Then Mo Williams when people said they needed a point guard. It’s not like any of the moves were a stretch. If anything the mistake they made was signing people period. When waiting for a better opportunity would have been a better choice
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 19, 2010 7:12 PM CDT up reply actions
but thats the thing
they made moves based on how lebron would react. if they waited to make moves (which wouldve been the smart thing to do in a lot of cases) they risked the chance that they would have lebron not be happy with nothing being done and risk losing him. with lebron not guaranteed to stay they had so much riding on him that sometimes they werent making good basketball decisions
You can fault trading for Jamison
When he could have had Stoudemire instead.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I have a hard time believing it was James who insisted the team keep Hickson over acquiring Amare
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
I don't know, every report I read had Phoenix more than willing to move Stoudemire
If LeBron signed off on a deal, it would have happened. I find it equally hard to believe that Ferry wouldn’t have pulled the trigger on that.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
The word after that deal fell apart was the Cavs backed away because Phoenix insisted
on the Cavs including Hickson.
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
George Washington
To be fair
The post trade deadline Amare is looked at a lot differently than the Pre-Trade deadline Amare.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 21, 2010 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions
I am not sure if this says anything.
Lebron says, get a point guard or get a power forward or someone who can guard Howard. Is that really news?
I saw T2 at Walgreens in Deerfield he’s tall. if you’re wondering what his grocery list included: magnums, french vanilla ice cream and a 20 oz sprite
by Super-Structure on May 19, 2010 7:20 PM CDT reply actions
Every star player has the cache to make demands in private.
Do we all forget when Kobe was publicly lobbying for Kupchack to ship Bynum out for Jason Kidd?
The Cavs had a ton of cap space after 2005, so now it’s James’ fault Danny Ferry didn’t do his homework on Larry Hughes’ contract year?
Frankly, the only move that completely bottomed out was the Hughes signing. They were in no position to refuse a Shaq trade because of the incredible pressure to win in James’ last season. Acquiring Mo Williams, Delonte West, and Antwan Jamison have done nothing but make the team better. You can’t predict that a 60 win team is just going to collapse in the playoffs, and now that they’re out it seems like Cavs management is out to get people to believe they had no power at all over the last 7 years.
"Boozer's dumb ass jumped. So I dunked on his ass."-Joakim Noah
by Ozzie Montana on May 19, 2010 7:24 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
The difference is that Kupchak didn't ship out Bynum for Jason Kiddm which turned out to be a good decision
The problem isn’t that the specific moves were bad. The problem is that it appears that Lebron has more say in personnel decisions than the GM does, at least at according to the article. Being good at basketball does not make you good at evaluating talent and making smart moves to build a team, which is why that, if this article is accurate, there was a problem in Cleveland.
Brad Miller is god.
also gotta wonder
what the moves he vetoed were. what if they were things that would have impacted the team in a better way?
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
I bet Lebron decided to draft Luke Jackson with the #10 pick
over Biedrins, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson and Jameer Nelson. If Lebron was a better scout, that never would have happened…
Without knowing the trades he supposedly vetoed, we don’t know how big his influence is. I doubt Lebron said not to trade for Al Horford or someone of that caliber, because he likes playing with Boobie Gibson. If Rose encourages Bulls management to sign David Lee and he flops, are 5 years from now the Bulls going to be blaming Rose for mismanaging the team?
This report seems awfully one-sided.
by Basketball Smurf on May 20, 2010 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions
Rose better not
encourage management to sign Lee.
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 20, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions
the thing is, cleveland has been super-conscious of the year 2010 for a while.
and they have been trying to woo lebron to stay in cleveland since he arrived in the nba. lebrons next team wont have that same pressure, so they can basically treat lebron like they treat every other star when they try to wax GM, “thanks for the suggestion, now let us do our job.”
"Oh don't look so smug. You try skating and blowing into a jug while your heart is breaking."
Good point
The potential to lose Lebron at 31 years old isn’t as bad as losing him at 25.
In other words: the Cavs knew they were in Cleveland
and Cleveland sucks
Back from the dead
by JustAnotherFan on May 20, 2010 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
They wooed him by having West bang his Mom.
by SoulEater7 on May 19, 2010 10:02 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
So you're saying the West situation was just a poorly thought out recruiting attempt? I like it!
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 19, 2010 10:14 PM CDT up reply actions
Awkward conversations....
(delonte west… to lebron…)
“Listen little buddy, When two adults love each other very very very much… uh… actually…. the thing is…. I’m not trying to be your new daddy…. uh…. It’s like I’m your friend, and now, I’m your moms best friend…. which is like, another way of me and you getting to know each other better….
2010... where relevant basketball in Chicago happens!
by kidronmusic on May 20, 2010 2:49 AM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
What will LeBron get
him for Father’s day
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 20, 2010 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Unless Lebron wants to sign a 3 year contract again, like he did when he extended his contract with Cleveland
He really seems to enjoy having his ass kissed, so it wouldn’t surprise me if he’s thought about it. The only problem is that the next collective bargaining agreement will probably reduce salaries, so he might want to lock in a big contract now.
I've been saying this for a little while now
Unless Lebron is really worried about the new CBA, I see him taking a shorter contract because he enjoys how much power that gives him within the team. I don’t think he’s worried about getting permanently injured within 3 years.
Vinny: "[Thrust] means pace, it means getting the ball out, it means getting your back to the sidelines, it means extending your outlets, it means getting the ball up the court into our early offense with plenty of time."
Come on Yao, everyone knows it's "Ric" Bucher. How dare you!
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
fixed :)
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"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 20, 2010 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions
lol
If you're reading this signature, there's a good chance you don't like Vinny Del Negro.
by Juiceboxjerry on May 21, 2010 4:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I will say
We bash JR a lot around here, but I’m glad we have an owner who wouldn’t give complete control to a player. I just wish he wasn’t giving control to guys like John Paxson.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2010 8:55 AM CDT reply actions 5 recs
heh
well said.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 20, 2010 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions
Brilliant
And if all that is true one thing we know now: LBJ would be a bad GM.
Back from the dead
by JustAnotherFan on May 20, 2010 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is that better or worse than Paxsonesque?
Does someone have a chart for this? Where does LeBronesque fall on the GM scale?
I feel like maybe I looked at this the wrong way. What if we can not only improve on the court, but also upgrade the front office by taking power away from Paxson? Maybe I’m not giving LBJ enough credit.
I bet LeBron doesn’t overpay Kirk Hinrich. It’s common knowledge that the only thing that disgusts LeBron James more than teammates sleeping with his mom, is thrust. And there’s no way in hell he drafts Adam Morrison.
"A common mistake made by baseball fans is to call a pitcher unhittable when that pitcher is not Matt Thornton." - Hardball Times
by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2010 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Here is level that can be
added to epic fail GMenship, Blayoresque, thats a step below McHalesque
by QUINTEN DALEY on May 20, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions
chuuch, preach, tabernacle!
"The Bulls Are Back" - D. Stern (2010)
by Belize on May 20, 2010 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Meh
I guess my take on it is very simple. Yes, I think it’s fair for the Bulls to be concerned about such things. However, there’s a very simple solution. Once you’ve signed Lebron, you’ve got him for 5-6 years. If he wants Calipari, give him Calipari to get him here. After he’s here, he really doesn’t have much leverage anymore, so you take his advice, give it your honest appraisal, and go out and make what you think is the best decision.
At the end of the day, that will be what’s successful in working with Lebron. Taking all that Bucher says is true (I don’t, but just for argument’s sake), the Cavs have gotten themselves in this predicament by cowtowing to him already. Victory has a hundred fathers and defeat is an orphan. The Bulls (or another team) would have several years and plenty of time to make their own decisions. If they make good ones, Lebron will stay. If they make shitty ones, whether on their own or on Lebron’s suggestion, they’ll neither get nor deserve any credit.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
Sign Lebron
sell the team. If the Chairman loves money more than his role as a basketball arts trustee it’s a good move.
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
by NBA Observer on May 21, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions
Sign Lebron
Profit year after year? Then Sell the team. Franchise values will always go up, sorta like home prices.
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
Is this even accurate?
had legendary contempt for GM Jerry Krause
The Chairman had “legendary contempt” for a guy that made many successful player moves?
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
jordan, not dorf.
"Why don't you do what my buddies and I used to do when we were hard up for dates?"
"Invade Korea?"
blah
You’re right.
12/31/08: Fire Vinny Del Negro.(upd: 1/7/10)
by NBA Observer on May 21, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
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