Wilbon talking Bulls and Taj. (Chicago best option for Bron Bron!?!?)
by BearingDown21 on Feb 22, 2010 6:58 PM CST
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PrintI was browsing around the internet found a video about ESPN analyst talking about the Chicago Bulls.
What I found interesting is the fact that they talked about LeBron James possibly landing in Chicago. Sounds like a pipedream but it does sound very logical. Well here's the link:
http://beta.espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4936216
and here's the video:
I believe this situation could happen. Im not saying its gonna happen 100% but its does sound very interesting and is fun to talk about. I also heard on the score for the Boers & Bernstein show that a source close to LeBron James said that the Chicago Bulls are the team, "no one talks about." You can take this anyway you want but it sounds pretty good to me. An All-star point-guard, a young highly-skilled, developing front court, and esspecially, a chance o follow the footsteps of the Greatest Basketball Player that ever lived. I think that Chicago is a bigger option to Lebron than people think. Tell me what you think!
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Ugh
I can’t believe I’m going to be forced to like this guy
The mania is still runnin' wild and the madness still flows through the veins.
by The Mega Powers on Feb 22, 2010 9:10 PM CST reply actions
Yeah
Would be a shame to have to root for the best player in the league, who has never been convicted of a crime, nor been in trouble for drugs or been considered a bad teammate. The horror. Jesus christ, so the guy celebrates and enjoys the game sometimes. So he doesn’t want to shake hands after a loss, but calls the guy later to apologize. Who the hell wants to shake hands after they just lost a playoff series?
I’d much rather root for a guy who takes a loss so hard he just wants to go in the locker room then someone who wants to shake a guys hand. Just like I want to root for a guy who enjoys winning. If you didn’t want him to dance around, you know what you do? You don’t let him destroy you during the game.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 8:25 AM CST up reply actions 6 recs
lol
just made it green for you
Practice beats talent when talent doesn't practice.
by iamsasquatch on Feb 23, 2010 12:38 PM CST up reply actions
Best way to not let him destroy you...
Sign his ass to a contract…
by kingj41 on Feb 23, 2010 12:49 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm just going to go ahead
and continue hating him. But, if he somehow joins the Bulls, I will LOVE him, and probably forever at that point.
However, if he stays in Cleveland, my level of sports-hatred will remain. If he goes to NYC or otherwise joins another superstar, I’m predicting LeBron will reach Brett Favre level sports-hatred, surpassing Kobe Bryant.
by kozzer on Feb 23, 2010 3:00 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
So I can only dislike players who get convicted of crimes and get in trouble with drugs?
Why don’t you just go back to defending Jerry Reinsdorf in the “Which team does he like better” topics.
The mania is still runnin' wild and the madness still flows through the veins.
by The Mega Powers on Feb 23, 2010 10:07 PM CST up reply actions
I'm with you Mega
The whole point of sports fandom is irrational love and hatred, and Lebron will forever be the target of my irrational hatred.
"Make good basketball plays!"
-VDN
The fun thing is
It doesn’t even have to irrational when it comes to LeBron because he’s a pompous ass cry baby.
The mania is still runnin' wild and the madness still flows through the veins.
by The Mega Powers on Feb 23, 2010 11:15 PM CST up reply actions
People can find reasons to hate anybody if they try hard enough
Take Santa claus for instance. That lazy fatass only delivers toys once a year?! Who else gets a 364-day vacation?
by Poloplaya14 on Feb 24, 2010 12:54 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Sometimes,
people don’t like someone. Don’t really need to find reasons that’s just the way it is. I don’t care for LBJ myself. He is a great player I just don’t like him he annoys the hell out of me. To say I or someone else is wrong for not liking/rooting for him does not make a lot of sense to me.
The Dude Abides
Wow these guys actually
bumped Gibson over Deng there. No one knows what these FA’s are going to do but I find it hard to believe Lebron, Wade, Bosh etc will leave money on the table that they could make with their current teams to come here. Unless it’s a sign and trade, I’m doubtful about them. I could see a Joe Johnson, David Lee, or Boozer more realistically signing outright because I can’t see their teams offering max contracts to them (hopefully we don’t offer max to them either). Money being equal, sure Chicago has a great shot, but the max guys can all get more by staying put so that worries me.
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
Something to consider...
is that the endorsement opportunities available by playing in Chicago or NY versus Cleveland and Toronto. While I’m sure they won’t make up the entire difference in salary what can you buy with $120M that you can’t buy with $100M?
New teams mean new jersey sales, new shoe sales, new business opportunities, etc. Not to mention the best advertising of them all…winning (presumably). Winning championships would allow them all to generate more money after their playing days then they would otherwise.
If Bosh stays in Toronto and has a nice Karl Malone type career he’d make a pretty good amount. But, if he goes to Chicago and wins a couple rings I’m sure he’d make up the difference in pay and then some.
You are just considering this now?
And you should redo your math if you are sure they won’t make up the difference, because that is wrong. Chicago, LA, New York (especially New York, where they take their basketball even more seriously then they do here), LeBron, Bosh, Wade, would make more then enough to cover the difference in salary from the increase in advertising money. The only one I’d be concerned about, is Wade due to the difference in tax laws in Florida.
If these guys didn’t play in basketball wastelands, Miami (b/c their fans don’t care, very nice place though), Toronto (no one watches Toronto), Cleveland (it’s fucking Cleveland.) they wouldn’t be leaving. The fact they would make up the salary difference and then some is one of the main reasons we’re even having these discussions.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 8:32 AM CST up reply actions
I've considered this...
for a while since I’ve mentioned it a couple times before this. What math is there to “redo” since all the numbers are speculative. Doing the math though, assuming a $53M cap the Maximum contract for the big three is 6 years, $120,442,500 or 5 years $92,220,000 which means leaving their teams means leaving $28,222,500 on the table.
Most of that could be made up in their shoe contracts but it would, as you pointed out, be harder for Wade because of the income tax laws. I can’t find any info on Bosh’s shoe deal so it’s also going to be presumably harder for him as well since he’s a big man and you’d have to really be Shaq or Howard to get a big shoe deal.
Local deals can again, make up some of that difference but LeBron and Wade are huge already. They’ve pretty much maxed out their earnings because they’re marketed through the NBA and it doesn’t matter that they play in crappy cities. What does a guy living in Beijing know or care about the mistake by the lake? For guys like Bosh and Joe Johnson who are just below the upper crust of superstars the potential to make up that difference is more relevant.
I think we’re on the same page but I didn’t come across in a very coherent manner.
As you stated
Lebron and Wade are already huge, it doesn’t matter what market they are playing in really. All of this stuff about making up the money in endorsements would apply to Bosh for sure. It’s possible for Wade and Bron but how much bigger can they get? They are already huge stars with all kinds of endorsements.
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
They are huge.
They can be bigger. To think that it doesn’t matter which market they play in is ridiculous.
20 million is not a lot of money over 5 years if you are looking at advertising revenue for LeBron James. He can easily make that up in Chicago, New York or LA. You are severely underestimating the difference that it makes to play for one of these markets if you think otherwise.
Think of it this way & just look at jersey sales.. an accused rapist, non-media friendly, not likeable, possibly second best player in the league has the most jersey sales. The clean cut, always smiling, likeable, media friendly, far and away best player in the league is second in jersey sales.
A young, second year point guard, clean cut, likeable, but very shy, not yet media saavy player is fourth in jersey sales. A superstar SG, with a championship ring, still in his prime, has multiple commercials, very media friendly, very likeable is 5th in jersey sales.
The market matters, even for LeBron James & Dwayne Wade.
Hell, Pau Gasol, the second best player on his own team is number 10 in jersey sales. David Lee, barely an all star, is 13th. Only two spots behind the top 4 player, Carmelo Anthony. Do you think the guys buying David Lee jerseys in Europe even know what he looks like? I really doubt it. They want the New York jersey, not the David Lee jersey. Carmelo Anthony is 11th in jersey sales. Even for the elite players in basketball, the market matters a great deal.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 1:06 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed, I've seen D.Rose
in more commercials than guys like Brandon Roy, Deron Williams, Amare
by QUINTEN DALEY on Feb 23, 2010 3:47 PM CST up reply actions
They aren't really leaving 28 million on the table.
It’s not like they are going to play that sixth year for free somewhere. Unless they get badly injured, they will still be making millions of dollars in year 6. Particularly Bosh and Lebron. Wade & Johnson I might be a bit concerned, but I’m sure they’d still be making a fair amount come year 6.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 1:08 PM CST up reply actions
To reply to your previous two posts...
I understand that they’ll get paid that year in some way but it’s not a guarantee. An injury ends that very quickly as Josh Howard is likely to find out. Not to mention that if Bosh and Wade re-sign with their current team (assuming a cap of $54M) they’ll make $24.7M in 2015-2016. If the go elsewhere they’ll be FA just before that season and any new deal they sign would require the salary cap to have jumped all the way up to $70.5M in order for them to make the same amount.
Jersey sales are just an indication of how popular a players jersey is. Players don’t get a direct cut from it because it’s all licensed by the NBA.
No.
It’s an indication of both how popular the player and team is. Do you really think David Lee is as popular as Carmelo Anthony or that Rose is more popular then Wade? No. The Bulls and Knicks are more popular then the Heat and Nuggets.
The jersey is just one sign of the many examples proving even the elite athletes get more attention if they go to a big market. I’m not suggesting they will make 20 million more in jersey sales alone or even 1 million. I’m using it as my point that your market does matter, even if you are two of the best players in the NBA (Wade and Lebron, who are selling less jerseys than Derrick Rose and Kobe respectively). It was suggested the market is irrelevant for such big name players, I was proving the point, that it clearly is not.
I’m also not arguing they would make less money (salary wise), I’m arguing your 28 million figure was way off. Like I said, an injury could be a factor, but in the end 28 million is still far off the actual difference. Even if they only make 10 million in year 6 from someone, that’s still much more then the zero you are using for your estimate of year 6 salary in the case they sign a 5 year deal.
You can’t compare a 5 year contract to a 6 year contract unless you add in the expected total they will make in year 6 from whatever new deal they sign at that time. It’s quite possible Lebron signs another 15 million dollar / year deal and that gap is now only ~10 million. To think Nike, Gatorade and whoever else he signs with, wouldn’t total over the expected 10 or 15 million difference if he played in an elite market is a ridiculous notion.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 3:02 PM CST up reply actions
I was going to leave this alone
but you keep throwing out words like “ridiculous” so I have to say one more thing here. First, the players aren’t getting money off of jersey sales so that has no bearing on them making up the salary difference. Second, my main point, especially so with Lebron, is that he is a huge megastar (making $40 million in salary+endorsements) so the limelight will follow him no matter where he goes. He came in the league with more hype than anyone maybe ever, so there was already enormous interest. Were the Cavs on national tv before they got Lebron? No. Do you seriously think his endorsements are suffering because he is in Cleveland? If he goes to Miami do you think his endorsements are going to take a hit?
I’m not saying he wouldn’t make more in endorsements here at all. There is no way to tell how much more he could make from endorsements in Chicago or NY so I don’t get your surety on this. He is the best player in the league AND the most marketable. Your argument applies to Bosh, Joe Johnson and maybe even Wade but not Lebron.
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
Horace Grant was who I thought of to compare too but a little smaller but wirey
LA Sports is what keep me off the streets and out of trouble, thanks to all the teams Rams, Dodgers, Lakers, USC sports and the Love of Tennis.
by so.cal.native1952 on Feb 24, 2010 2:33 PM CST up reply actions
Maybe they just can't see talent?
LA Sports is what keep me off the streets and out of trouble, thanks to all the teams Rams, Dodgers, Lakers, USC sports and the Love of Tennis.
by so.cal.native1952 on Feb 24, 2010 2:36 PM CST up reply actions
I prefer Johnson and Gay
The best teams are balanced and having the dancing diva and a bunch of d-leaguers in the bench would not be a good idea. Besides, we all hate Lebron, I think.
Bigger fan of winning myself.
I’ll take Lebron, and no.. a team with Lebron and Rose would not be surrounded by D Leaguers. Not that it would matter, plenty of god awful basketball players have filled out the benches of the greatest teams, but there would still be good talent playing with them.
The Best teams are not that well balanced anyways. Couple great players, couple really good players, then just a bunch of role players / specialists and aging veterans going for a ring. The Pistons are an exception to a rule. Karl Malone, Sam Cassell, PJ Brown, Gary Payton, Derek Fisher, any of these guys sound familiar? Those are the types of guys you add to your team once you’ve put together an elite core, not DLeaguers.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 23, 2010 10:43 AM CST up reply actions
Sobers sound like
the fans that called into Waddle & Silvy, saying “take Lee instead of Bosh”
by QUINTEN DALEY on Feb 23, 2010 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
If you have a shot
at LeBron you go get him, and learn to love him, just like we did Dennis Rodman.
by QUINTEN DALEY on Feb 23, 2010 11:10 AM CST up reply actions
HOW CAN TAJ GIBSON FLOURISH WHEN CHRIS BOSH IS TAKING AWAY HIS MINUTES???
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
But he's a Horace Grant-type player!!!
How can we trade away that!!!
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
by chapuforyou on Feb 23, 2010 10:04 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Noce is a D-Wade caliber player.
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
by chapuforyou on Feb 23, 2010 10:40 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Only in D-Wade's.
"Oh, y ahora ¿quién podrá defenderme?" "¡Yo!"
by chapuforyou on Feb 23, 2010 11:58 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
How dare you!?
"Make good basketball plays!"
-VDN
by penguin1 on Feb 24, 2010 12:51 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Lebron Is Coming
I Dont really care much for Prince James But Chicago is a option .
He’s changing #6 next year cuz he cant were it in chicago.(Conspiracy Theory) LOL!!!
by Flight2k on Feb 22, 2010 11:29 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
He said he could be an all-star at some point in is career
not that he was playing like one this year.
Wade 2010!!!!!
by illwill on Feb 23, 2010 2:38 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
i can definately see him as an all star if he starts getting more face time
or doing more commericals. Its a popularity contest anyway
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Feb 24, 2010 1:26 PM CST up reply actions
I'm not a big fan of LeBron
but if he were a Bulls… that would be incredible.
If us fans were able to accept Dennis Rodman, accepting James would be a no brainer
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Feb 23, 2010 1:09 PM CST reply actions
I think
If we get Lebron
We put him at the 4 spot….have him be a true point forward, we change the game like D’Antoni did a few years ago with Amar’e.
Roll out
Rose-Hinrich-Deng-Lebron-Noah with Gibson and Warrick ( :) ) leading our bench but still having Miller maybe and our pick this year….
Man I would love that. Lebron can defend the 4 spot fine esp with Noah cleaning up the team defense issues (Lebron’s a beast on the one on one).
If this didn’t work, trade Deng mid year and fit Lebron in his natural 3 spot. But I think given his size, speed, strength, he’s as good a 4 as he was a 3, and better in 3/4 than he is as a 2.
Ok Stacey I'm am so sick of hearing the "Hard Hat and Lunch Pail" nickname for Taj. Enough already, wasn't funny the first time, but you now say it 15-20 times per broadcast. It's enough to make me want to hate Taj, when I don't hate Taj.
And an improved
JAMES JOHNSON!!!!!!!!!, I haven’t given up on you yet!
by QUINTEN DALEY on Feb 23, 2010 3:50 PM CST up reply actions
This definitely could happen
Lets be real: The Cavs are NOT gonna win it all this season. There are too many good teams standing in their way: The Hawks, the Celtics, the Magic , hell….the Bobcats! I don’t even think they’re gonna get out of the freakin conference!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Feb 23, 2010 4:05 PM CST up reply actions
Sigh...Lebron is my least favorite of the upper-level of NBA players
only because his game lacks refinement, and his on-court behavior is irritating.
Of course, I’d forget all of this with banner #7 (possibly)
I will say one thing about
Lebron’s game that I don’t like that no one talks about…. He takes a lot of bad shots. I think if he played with a PG like Rose, and didn’t have to worry so mush about facilitating as well as scoring and rebounding, he’d be closer to that championship.
that has a lot to do with
The Cavs having a bad habit of devolving into ‘give it to lebron and get out of his way’ mode. I don’t think he would take as many bad shots if the offensive schemes were better.
don't let the bed bugs bite
by Rex Grossman on Feb 27, 2010 3:11 PM CST up reply actions
I think you all are crazy
for saying “I guess I’ll take Lebron.” Are you f(_)Cking crazy?!? You people are out of your mind. He is the best player since MJ, and as mentioned above he has never been accused of anything. Hes been a good teammate, he’s stayed sober, hes kept weapons out of the locker room, he hasnt cheated. He is CLEAN. And you guys are just gonna say “eww, he’s too good for us”? It’s basically what your saying. you say his on court behavior is erratic? It’s like Carlos Zambrano or AJ Pierzinski. If he’s on your team, you love him. Otherwise you hate him. Well, you have a reason to hate him. Im kind of going out on a tangent I feel, but one thing Im sure about is if you don’t want Lebron…. Well, I dont even exactly know what to say to you.
by Lweb23 on Feb 24, 2010 10:29 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Wouldn't it be so satisfying to beat Lebron?
And watch him speed walk off the court, near tears?
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
not as satisfying as watching him hold up a championship trophey wwhile rocking a bulls jersey
and seeing Kobe speed walk off the court
not as satisfying as seeing him dunk on dwight howard
not as satisfying as being the best team in the league and acting like the cockiest fans you’ve ever met – cause man when the bulls are on top again i caaaant wait to have the biggest smirk on my face – this is for the past 10 years of pain
"Where is my poster machine??"
Yes people on this blog are ucking insane
People on this blog don’t like Wade, Boozer, STAT, Joe Johnson, Taj Gibson, David Lee or Lebron. The only players people on this blog like are BG and TT. Hell they only recently started ti like Rose they wanted to trade him for Jennings beginning of the year lol.
Wade 2010!!!!!
by illwill on Feb 24, 2010 2:32 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
maybe they just can't see talent-----go Taj
LA Sports is what keep me off the streets and out of trouble, thanks to all the teams Rams, Dodgers, Lakers, USC sports and the Love of Tennis.
by so.cal.native1952 on Feb 24, 2010 2:38 PM CST up reply actions
Wade, boozer, STAT, Joe Johnson, Taj, David Lee, LeBron...
Which one of these is not like the others?
by Poloplaya14 on Feb 24, 2010 3:20 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Wrong!!! These people speak only for themselves.
A significant portion of commenters on this blog appear mature, knowlegeable, and appreciate talent regardless of the NBA team they play on. All are not as partisan as some of the more overzealous and/or hateful idiots who comment. I enjoy watching Lebron, Bosh, Wade, Rose and many others.
Jesus, people
Of course we hate Lebron. Cuz he kicks everyones ass! Its sports, you always hate the top dogs if he’s not on your team.
We hated Rodman, and then when he was on our team, we defended his antics, lol.
Man Those Bulls teams were so fun.
"Michael Redd's owed 18.3 million next year. He can either opt out like an idiot or opt in like a douche bag." - NittanyCub
by Trey23 on Feb 24, 2010 11:31 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Great point
If the fan base in general can accept and adore DENNIS FREAKING RODMAN then I think we can get over it for LeBron.
If not
Those fans who can’t cheer for the fun loving, never in trouble, best player of his era, are welcome to root for a different team, while I enjoy the championships Lebron and D Rose win together.
by Grinder in Training on Feb 24, 2010 4:26 PM CST up reply actions
I just watched this and i havent been so excited in years
of course they were saying everything i already knew..but to get some recognition from other people besides bulls fans reaaaaaaaalllly gets me pumped
"Where is my poster machine??"
wilbon is a chitown guy
but still. he’s a credible espn analyst
by Lweb23 on Feb 24, 2010 12:55 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
He will say when the teams suck
I’ve heard him trash the Cubs quite a few times (he’s a Cubs fan too) as well as the Bears. Not so much the Bulls, but they’ve been out of the national spotlight pretty much until Rose came along.
But overall he’s not a ‘homer’ in an irrational way.
Wilbon is a Bulls fan
but yeah it’s still nice to get some national buzz.
Joakim on whether he ever tried tennis: "I played a little bit. If anybody on the Bulls wanted to play me, I would kick their ass."
by bigballa10 on Feb 24, 2010 12:57 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
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