TechN9ne: Bulls talking Mayo, Stephen Jackson
He's back! Some have lost faith in him but he speaks and you might wanna read it.
over 1 year ago
SoulEater7
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Ugh, give me a break
Hasn’t this guy proven that he knows jack shit by now?
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
Yes please
Jackson has been the shooting guard I’ve wanted through all of these suggestions/speculations. Bobcats want to get rid of money and he would be a good fit as long as he can play without a headband.
Sam Smith did drop S Jax's name alot in his last mailbag.
Rose 2010!!!!!
by illwill on Dec 27, 2010 4:50 AM CST via mobile up reply actions
Sam Jackson would be the worst possible player to trade Taj Gibson for.
And I don’t even love Taj Gibson that much.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Er, Stephen?
Or was that intentional? :)
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 27, 2010 9:18 PM CST up reply actions
not intential. Freudian?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
lol, maybe.
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 27, 2010 10:20 PM CST up reply actions
I wouldn't trade Taj for Stephen Jackson or Sam Jackson.
Now Action Jackson….. That’s another story.
http://sportige.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/action_jackson1.jpg
Rose 2010!!!!!
by illwill on Dec 27, 2010 11:20 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Forget Action Jackson.
I’m fine with just Vanity.
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 27, 2010 11:23 PM CST up reply actions
Nevertheless
I stand by my statement. ;)
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 28, 2010 10:22 AM CST up reply actions
ehhh
not really (well depends on ur taste). But she still was my GOAT as a kid too lol
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
If they leave Asik out of it I would do it
The Bulls and Grizzlies had discussed a Mayo to Chicago deal, but the Grizzlies are asking for Taj Gibson, Omer Asik, James Johnson, and the Charlotte draft pick. The Bulls will not do that trade, but have considered doing a Gibson, Johnson, Bogans for Mayo deal, which Memphis wouldn’t do at this point.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 6:42 AM CST reply actions 3 recs
Considering that Taj and that Charlotte pick are our two most valuable assets
it would take more than OJ Mayo to convince me to part with both in the same deal. Especially if they’re asking for Omer too.
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 27, 2010 8:53 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
OTOH, if Mayo starts to play better, New Orleans probably wouldn't make the trade.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
What does New Orleans have to do with a Mayo trade?
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 27, 2010 10:41 PM CST up reply actions
I have no idea.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
thats a crap load they're asking for mayo
watch they’re gonna trade him for someone worthless, like the gasol deal
I'm cuckoo for Kukoc!!!
by Yibs on Dec 27, 2010 11:12 AM CST up reply actions 4 recs
I hate these kind of posts.
They got a decent return in for Pau. Really.
Marc Gasol + draft picks was better than the Luol Deng + draft picks we could’ve offered, imo, especially from a team who was starting over’s viewpoint.
I view these kind of posts as either uninformed or purposely misleading.
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
by dantheman3k on Dec 27, 2010 11:52 AM CST up reply actions
They still didn't get nearly enough for Pau
Especially given that when traded Marc Gasol was like 50lbs heavier than he is right now (And at that point it wasn’t expected him to lose that weight). Plus Marc Gasol is decent, but Pau is a top 1-3 PF…..who can fill in and be a top 1-3 C.
They didn’t get near the value, and lucked into at least getting his younger brother after his younger bro got in shape.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
by majoyenrac on Dec 27, 2010 11:55 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
plus Marc was just a bet
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:59 AM CST up reply actions
That's kind of what I was saying
At the time Pau was $2B better than Marc Gasol. Now he’s still $900M better than Marc Gasol, and Marc will never bridge that gap.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
no. I wasn't objecting that the Lakers "won" the trade
I was objecting that they’ll trade for something worthless “like the Gasol deal”
for a re-starting franchise, a young international big man with a lot of potential, 2 first round picks (that became Donte Green & Greivis Vasquez), money, and Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittenton, and Aaron McKie isn’t “nothing.”
While no “superstars”, no, and thus the Lakers did make out pretty well…
I just hate the
oh, They gave up Pau Gasol for players I don’t care to pay attention to and draft picks I didn’t follow? THEY GOT NOTHING!!!
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
Retrospectively it is what you say
I think most of us (myself included) hold on to the feelings that we had when initially hearing about the trade. Because at the time the deal was ridiculous.
But if you look at the deal retrospectively you have to look at it going forward from that time, Javaris Crittenton was another potential player who turned out to be a bust, and let’s not get started on Kwame Brown.
I would also assume that most of us are on the side that aren’t too fond of Kobe, tho now I have become indifferent.
But look at those players... They DID get nothing.
It was ridiculous at the time and it’s even more ridiculous in hindsight.
my point was it wasn't ridiculous at the time.
At the time, it seemed you got 2 below-average veterans – but expirings – in kwame & mckie , 2 first round drafts, a youngster with potential in Javaris, and a bigman with a lot of potential in Marc Gasol. Maybe you didn’t view Marc Gasol as potentially being as good as he is now or whatever, but I still don’t think he’s reached his full potential and I remember believing he had a lot of potential at that time.
So, at the time, no, it wasn’t ridiculous.
And, in hindsight, it’s really only ridiculous because of poor drafting and bad free agencies with caproom by memphis.
That seems to me that, in hindsight, Memphis’ GM and coaching sucks more than that trade sucks. (“But the GM made the trade?” Shut up.)
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
by dantheman3k on Dec 27, 2010 11:01 PM CST up reply actions
It was ridiculous at the time
when you get two first round picks from the Lakers after gifting them Gasol, you know that those picks are essentially second round picks and don’t expect them to amount to anything. If you though Crittenton had potential, you were the only one.
The trade was always a swap for cap space and Marc Gasol, and at the time Marc was overweight and not even guaranteed to come to the States any time soon. Go read any article about the trade at that time, 98 percent were talking about how Memphis got robbed because they got nothing of value except the Marc question mark.
by runningman on Dec 28, 2010 4:58 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Again we learn this time and time again, you never trade an established NBA player
for potential, especially not one of Pau for Marc.
If I'm the Grizz, I ask for this too
they got Paxson to outbid himself for Noc a few years back…why not dupe him again?
cuz Gar is there to save the day!
after all, it’s a process
-Jeeves Life in the Cell
Turns out not to have been worthless as Marc is awesome...
…but at the time, yeah.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Rec'd
I agree completely. The only thing that makes me semi-comfortable about moving Taj is the confidence (hope?) that Asik will develop into a Marcin Gortat-level backup big man over the next 2 years.
(And they obviously wouldn’t do the deal without Taj).
"You can't be afraid to play somebody because they've got 3 really good players. How are you going to win if you're afraid to play? We're not going to be afraid to play - we're going to fight, we're going to attack, we're going to throw it out there and see what happens." - Carlos Boozer
We’re going to have to ‘overpay’ if we want Mayo.
Memphis has no real need to move him at this point. He doesn’t make that much money, he won’t be a FA at the end of the season, and opening up for playing time for Henry is not critical for them.
Cap’n Jack on the other hand, we should be able to get at a discount. They will be motivated to move him because they’re ready to go into rebuilding mode.
My opinion is that while Mayo has more upside, and is the better 3pt shooter, Jackson is the better overall player right now. I would not offer more for Mayo than the Bulls have already considered, nor would I include the Charlotte pick. If for some unforseen reason they feel compelled to lower their asking price, fine, but I don’t see why that would happen. It seems far more likely that we will get Jackson, and I don’t have a problem with this at all. Why beg for Memphis to please trade us Mayo, when we can have Charlotte beg us to take Jackson’s contract off their hands? It’s so much more enjoyable to deal from strength rather than weakness.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
by kingles on Dec 27, 2010 9:26 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
i really wanna keep taj man
or atleast JJ..esp with boozer’s injury risk. If we lose him for a long period, who’s gonna back him up?
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
I like Taj
but I would trade for Mayo in a heartbeat.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:52 AM CST up reply actions
but would u give up JJ and Taj?
that means either Asik will play the 4 or alot of minutes for Scal
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
If it was just JJ and Taj for OJ then I'd probably do it
but they’re also asking for Asik and at least one first round draft pick. That’s too much to give up for one player who’s not even starting right now.
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 27, 2010 12:49 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
It's not like Taj is starting
beside Mayo would be a starter… for us… unless bogans keeps the spot…
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 2:24 PM CST up reply actions
I would not hold any trades because of JJ
and we would have to work on another deal to fill the reserve PF but that would not worry me as much. I’m not downplaying Taj but we need OJ more than him IMO
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 2:19 PM CST up reply actions
Wait…WTF is Charlotte going to do with Taj?!?!?
I guess they’d try to deal Diaw next. Then Taj, and Tyrus would be splitting minutes once again just like old times. Ahhh…memories… I should think we could get this deal done without having to include Taj, though they’d certainly insist on getting Asik in that case.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
Do the Bobcats have any plan at all?
Seriously. That playoff run last year appears to be a last gasp effort to sell tickets.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 27, 2010 10:04 AM CST up reply actions
I think that was basically it.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 10:17 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Which is why that pick is looking better and better every day
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
not really, if they're intent on still just trying for the playoffs
that means the pick will never be really low.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 10:35 AM CST up reply actions
anyone wanna wait 5 years?
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
isnt there some sort of cycle
like teams wallow in mediocrity for 5 years, and then they break towards either elite status or crap status for 3 years before returning back to the mediocrity….or something like that….To me, id rather have charlotte have their time now with aging semi-stars, as opposed to be given time to find a nice young talented nucleus which in 5 years will make the playoffs annually due to being in the east….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Dec 27, 2010 11:08 AM CST up reply actions
I don't.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 11:14 AM CST up reply actions
No way
Feb deadline is my limit
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:43 AM CST up reply actions
I think that WAS their plan.
They thought they could lose Felton and Chandler and still compete. They were wrong. I think they realize that now which means… fire sale!
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
They (meaning Larry Brown)
Totally undervalued Felton and the Chandler trade was all about the dollars saved…
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
I remember tha xmas day telecast of the Bulls game
They mentioned a story about Larry Brown “crying” when they traded away Felton.
I don’t think he undervalued him at all
by Option27 on Dec 27, 2010 6:14 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
did you read the yahoo article on his firing?
apparently he made m take dj over brook lopez because he despised felton that much
Derrick Rose is a motherfucking ninja.
They traded away Felton?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Brown didn't undervalue Felton
There were numerous news stories about how Brown really wanted to keep him. The Bobcats blog put forth a theory that the reason shy Brown was sitting Tyrus is that he felt that Ty’s contract is the reason that Felton couldn’t come back. That’s probably bunk, but it shows how much Bobcats observers think Brown liked Felton.
not quite...he liked Felton
Larry Brown – the team’s head coach – was less optimistic. As ESPN.com reported: "A day before training camp opened, Brown said, ‘I died’ when Felton left, then questioned his team’s front line."
he's a bit weepy
future Bulls coach?
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2010 9:36 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Wouldn't that qualify him more for our front office?
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 12:37 PM CST up reply actions
I had thought Brown was the mastermind behind the Augustin pick over Lopez...
…and didn’t like Felton as a player…I would have thought if he (Felton) were that important to the org, they would have wrapped him up with an extension before the Knicks offered him that deal.
I don’t know what to believe now.
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 27, 2010 10:45 PM CST up reply actions
Both stories could be true
He might not have liked Felton coming out of college, but loved him by free agency this summer.
the problem I see with a Jackson trade is that
Charlotte is intent on making the playoffs and I don’t know if the Bulls have the pieces to make that happen. It looks like Charlotte is thinking short term – perhaps if they come to a more rational view and realize they have to tear it down before they can build it back up than they would trade us Jackson. But as it is, I don’t see a trade that makes much sense for both teams.
Perhaps once Charlotte comes to the grip with their suck – Jackson for Bogans, JJ and Brewer with the Bulls offering Charlotte their 1st round pick in the year Chicago gets Charlotte’s pick. With Jackson’s contract, I have to think the Bulls would want to shed salary (Brewer, maybe Korver) and wouldn’t be willing to give up any picks. Really with that contract, Charlotte should be paying someone to get Jackson off their hands.
by Basketball Smurf on Dec 27, 2010 11:05 AM CST up reply actions
there is no chance the bulls trade korver
they are trying to get more shooting. trading a guy that had league’s best single season 3-point % in history isn’t going to help us.
by JEdward4 on Dec 27, 2010 3:38 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Diaw to Orlando rumors
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:42 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
By the time they’re done
they’ll have a payroll of $30mil next year.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
Interesting that they would trade J-RIch
which would probably put Jackson on the block
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:54 AM CST up reply actions
So Diaw and J-Rich are going to be traded for each other twice?
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 27, 2010 12:53 PM CST up reply actions
I really hope
ORL moves JRich. That ORL team with JRich can be quite scary. Diaw does nothing for me. This trade would make ORL weaker IMO. Good luck with Turk and Diaw!!
I vote for Thomas to play, play more and play regularly.-Sam Smith
Seriously, isn't Diaw just a fat Rashard Lewis?
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 2:17 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
Not at all
Lewis at this point is solely a 3 pt shooter. Diaw is a good passer out of the post and can even be a decent defender when motivated. Still, this would be a ridiculously stupid trade by the Magic.
Well, isn't what LeBron did last night the living embodiment of The Secret, leaving millions on the table and turning himself into a hometown villain, all for the sake of winning?
Neil Paine, basketball-reference.com
I would love
for the Bulls to somehow get into the JRich trade. JRich is the SG the Bulls need. I would prefer him over SJAX.
I vote for Thomas to play, play more and play regularly.-Sam Smith
I would love JRich too, but his contract is too large to work out a reasonable trade
Getting traded to Charlotte, though, would increase the chances that he’s available as a FA and maybe the Bulls could snag him with the MLE (assuming there still is one)
Well, isn't what LeBron did last night the living embodiment of The Secret, leaving millions on the table and turning himself into a hometown villain, all for the sake of winning?
Neil Paine, basketball-reference.com
I agree
I was on JRich team before the JJ Red offer. But snley is right now it is impossible.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 5:54 AM CST up reply actions
Maybe i'm just in a bad mood
but i’d pay good money to see the look on Tyrus’s face when they trade Taj to the Bobcats and then announce he’s going to start ahead of him.
They either have, or soon will come around to the fact that they suck.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
jackson is kind of like an older, less athletic jr smith, though one who has truly proven
he can defend well. all things considered though, id rather try JR for a year.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
yeah, JR's contract makes him much more attractive to me
in 3 years someone is going to owe Jackson $10 million dollars – uggh, don’t want it to be the Bulls.
by Basketball Smurf on Dec 27, 2010 11:21 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
it fits perfectly with the other contracts
Korver, Brewer etc were signed to 3 year deals.
Those expiring, along with Jackson means 20mil comes off the books at the same time, and by then the Bulls know if the team is the real deal, give them the option of adding a max player if the team needs to.
But thats all dependent on the CBA
I remember once former Bull Dave Corzine staring at a stat sheet after a loss when he had one rebound and Michael Jordan offering, "One more rebound than a dead man."
by Rex Grossman on Dec 27, 2010 1:33 PM CST up reply actions
so JRs only signed for a year?
i’d rather do that then… also what happened to all the redick talk?
I'm cuckoo for Kukoc!!!
Bulls can't acquire Redick until a year after they gave him an offer sheet (July)
Well, isn't what LeBron did last night the living embodiment of The Secret, leaving millions on the table and turning himself into a hometown villain, all for the sake of winning?
Neil Paine, basketball-reference.com
by snley on Dec 27, 2010 12:59 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
The problem with Smith is he doesn’t know WTF he’s doing.
Do we really need Smith jacking up random 30ft jumpers while Rose and Boozer shake their heads sadly? Do we need him playing good D for 3min a game and not trying the rest of the time? He doesn’t get it. We don’t need GarPaxDorf pinching pennies right now. Screw that.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
he is perfect for the second team
I remember once former Bull Dave Corzine staring at a stat sheet after a loss when he had one rebound and Michael Jordan offering, "One more rebound than a dead man."
by Rex Grossman on Dec 27, 2010 1:34 PM CST up reply actions
If they could keep Brewer and start him, and acquire Smith...
It’d be like a different, but actually legitimate, vesion of starting Thabo and bringing in Gordon. God, Vinny was stupid.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
jax and smiths shot selection seem similar to me.
"JJ has never made that floater. He’s probably never even practiced it, he just decided to take a floater, which is why he’s James Johnson."
-JocktrapNoah
by TheMoon on Dec 27, 2010 5:30 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Rather get Cap'n Jack
Jr is younger and may be here only a year but I dont want to watch him shoot random ass jumpshots and I don’t want to see him do some dumbass stuff on the court.
(Sing song)...Everybody Hates Rondo...
Man, I can't think of two players I'd want much less than JR Smith and Stephen Jackson
What concerns me the most is that the Bulls seem to feel some urgency to get a deal done. Why?
I would much rather sit tight and wait for the asking price of a better player/fit to come down (Iggy, Mayo, even holding out for Melo seems more reasonable) than to spend our few trade assets on an extremely short-term possible solution (JR or Rudy) or an over the hill player on a bad contract (Jackson, Rip Hamilton, etc)
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
by Sports2 on Dec 27, 2010 11:18 AM CST reply actions 1 recs
Well
I consider Melo out of the question. He seems pretty content with going to the Knicks and even if he were to be traded, the Nets trade package is by far better than anything we could offer (4 first rounds, Derrick Favors, and possibly Troy Murphy).
The Sixers seem content to keep Iggy till the trade deadline since they want to see how much they can get out of them since the playoffs are not out of the question yet for them and Evan Turner not being what they expected him to be. Though I would love to see Iggy here, I don’t think its likely.
As far as Mayo, he’s not out of the question, but the Grizzlies are being unruly with there demands for Mayo since they don’t seem content with putting him back into the starting lineup any time soon, Like they are making him suffer and just being stingy with us because of a past history problem with a trade gone bad.
I’m not the happiest with looking at an aging Stephen Jackson either, but if Bogans leaves, I’m almost content with anything at this point.
OK, then wait for the trade deadline.
There’s no urgency to making a move right this second. If we want an immediate upgrade, how about something silly like starting one of the several wing/guard players we have now that are obviously much better than Keith Bogans?
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
i think its more due to the ease of scheduling
this next month and a half is far easier than what comes february and beyond….if you get new players, to implement them to a system like thibs (which is still being reported by guys like kc and friedell to take longer than most thought) is probably going to take a little more time than most players are used to. If the bulls have a legit reason to be wanting a deal done now, i think that would be the reason.
To go into the second half of the season with a completely healthy and in synch roster would be spectacular, especially if we did any deal that actually made us better on paper….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
It seems like the Bobcats and Denver feel some urgency
If you feel that the guys you want are never going to get traded, or their price is way more than you’re willing to pay, why wait for them when your second tier guys are about to get traded now? There’s your urgency… the other teams are ready to trade.
I would assume that the Bulls have already talked to Denver and Philly and know the chances of getting those players in a deal they can live with. What’s the point of waiting for a miracle at the trade deadline and then ending up with nothing?
by runningman on Dec 27, 2010 6:37 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree that the sense of urgency seems misplaced
If what we’re doing is moving our last valuable trade assets for the one missing piece that will legitimately allow us to compete for a championship, I think waiting for the right deal is a lot more important than getting a deal done a few weeks earlier.
"You can't be afraid to play somebody because they've got 3 really good players. How are you going to win if you're afraid to play? We're not going to be afraid to play - we're going to fight, we're going to attack, we're going to throw it out there and see what happens." - Carlos Boozer
by Jivas on Dec 27, 2010 12:15 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd be concerned if I thought it was true
I don’t believe the Bulls are actually active, for the reasons you stated.
Unless they are looking to move Luol Deng’s contract (ha!) (sigh)
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
Don't play with me.
I’d be soooo happy to see Deng somewhere else, given a decent return, of course.
doubt it
Bulls aren’t getting anything more than he is worth. He is still treading that line of being a salary dump type trade if they tried to move him
I remember once former Bull Dave Corzine staring at a stat sheet after a loss when he had one rebound and Michael Jordan offering, "One more rebound than a dead man."
by Rex Grossman on Dec 27, 2010 1:36 PM CST up reply actions
I didn't ask for more than he's worth.
It’s just that if he’s traded, it’s not a pure salary dump; they need to get rotation players in return.
I know Deng can play, I just think he’s not that good and has too many weaknesses.
well my point is
that he is more valuable to the Bulls, than to be traded for more rotation players.
And at this point I think his value to other teams isn’t very high, meaning the Bulls might get a decent rotation guy and for sure garbage players or bad contracts if he was moved. Which would look more like a salary dump than a trade to get better.
I remember once former Bull Dave Corzine staring at a stat sheet after a loss when he had one rebound and Michael Jordan offering, "One more rebound than a dead man."
by Rex Grossman on Dec 27, 2010 3:04 PM CST up reply actions
Yep.
If he’s playing up to the level where someone would take him, the Bulls would be playing awesome and shouldn’t trade him. If he continues to play below that level, I don’t see how the Bulls could possibly get a better player in return, in any form.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
OK, Deng+JJ (Bulls Version) for JJ (Hawks Version)
I’m not a real JJ fan, and I think his contract is preposterous, but I can see some real logic to this from both sides.
For the Bulls, they were reportedly very hot for JJ, and we aren’t getting under the cap anyway. JJ is slightly better, and really a 2, while I think Brewer and Korver might be a bit better suited at 3s.
For the Hawks… well, they can go nowhere cheaper.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
the only player i ship deng out for is melo
Otherwuse deng is more valuable
Derrick Rose is a motherfucking ninja.
sin defending Deng?
wtf
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 2:21 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
my thoughts exactly
It’s the shock of the hour!
"You can't be afraid to play somebody because they've got 3 really good players. How are you going to win if you're afraid to play? We're not going to be afraid to play - we're going to fight, we're going to attack, we're going to throw it out there and see what happens." - Carlos Boozer
now you guys know one person higher than deng on my hate list
Derrick Rose is a motherfucking ninja.
Wow
I agree with not rushing into things, but seriously this is a terrible idea. Why trade Deng for a guy with a worse contract who is playing FAR worse than Deng. Joe Johnson is below 50% TS this year. It could be just a slump, but it is one hell of a slump. This is just a terrible idea.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
Oh, c'mon, He got hurt and tried to play though it. He had surgery and seems fixed now. His last couple games kicked ass.
His contract is just as much of a non-issue as Deng’s is. The bulls will be over the cap either way.
JJ’s recent play is a negative blip obviously explained by a minor and now corrected injury. And now that it’s corrected, JJ is back to being what he’s been for most of his career. Both a better player than Deng and an actual 2 guard.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
Let's see how a few more games go
Do we also have any real evidence to say that Brewer or Korver would actually be better at the 3? If we improve our 2 spot but then severely downgrade our 3 spot, aren’t we really in the same spot we were before.
Also, Jerry will never sign off on this and that’s a huge point to consider. Unless there is a solid 3 coming along with him, JR is not going to pay a crap ton for a team that is not ready for a championship.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
Well, their game and the balance of their careers suggest to me that they're both better suited there
Jerry will have a meet up with his buddy Arn Tellem and demand this deal :)
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
I don't know what the luxury tax/scap situation will be in the future.
If its’ the same, one means keeping Noah and/or Rose, the other doesn’t.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
c'mon, Jerry will pay for a winner :)
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
by Sports2 on Dec 27, 2010 9:06 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Then Noah will be traded away.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
It still doesn't help that JJ
Has a terrible contract…..
I think he’s a clear upgrade over Luol, but in 3-4 years I am not convinced that’s still the case when he’s 33/34 and Deng is 29…..and his contract will be much more than Luol’s when Luol’s expires…..and unmovable.
Move beyond JJ…..
I would however go for Josh Smith :) in a heartbeat.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
Well....
At least Joe Johnson is close to a proximity of being worth that deal…..Arenas perhaps was worth it 2 years before he got it (and then got hurt for 2 years and the gun thing)….Lewis was never worth his deal….
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
I think Arenas was closest to good value.
You can’t really blame injuries; they happen, and unless you’re talking a guy like Oden or Camby or Roy, you roll the dice with a player of that caliber. And right now, yes, Joe Johnson is the best player of the three. If we would only have to pay him that money for two or three years, it might be worth thinking about. But Joe might be just as useless as Lewis is now in those final two years.
Arenas
Had 2 years of season ending injuries BEFORE he got that extension…..
That wasn’t his value then. They dramatically overpaid. he had been worth it before he got hurt, but he Wizards outbid themselves to keep him.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
Its not often...
But I totally agree with your thinking on this one…Rec’d.
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
I concur with everything.
The only thing that makes it urgent for me is that, if they don’t then end up getting a trade done, Keith Bogans will be the Bulls SG for the playoffs while Thibs still (apparently) tries to send the other starters the message. Or something.
But I do not want Stephen Jackson for anyone or J.R. Smith for anyone other than Bogans, Scalabrine, Thomas or JJ.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Can Jack play the 2?
i thought of him more as a 3 or like a way better version of Deng….love jack’s game tho
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
That is what he does for the cats
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 11:45 AM CST up reply actions
*remembers that Gerald Wallace is a 3*
ohhh yeeeaaa lol
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
I'd like some type of deal
where we unload Deng in a deal for Ming and Battier, but I can’t get the contracts to match up without including a rotation player.
Lol.
I’d love Melo, but I’m not as in love with Melo as I once was. His recent play/behavior/conditioning lately have turned me off a bit.
I actually wanted to use that cap space and grab a combo from the following guys: Thaddeus Young/Greg Oden/JR Smith/Tyson Chandler/Tayshaun Prince/Wilson Chandler.
A lineup of Rose/Smith/Chandler/Boozer/Noah with Korver, Brewer, Asik and Oden or Tyson Chandler off the bench would be pretty sick.
I really don't know how much those players will be demanding in free agency.
If somehow we could get Battier and Ming for Deng+(~6-7 million in spare parts), we’d have a lot of money coming off of the books. I don’t think we’d lose a ton by going from Deng to Battier for the remainder of the season. We’d obviously be getting a bit worse, but we’d be getting out from under Deng’s deal and allowing for major improvements in the offseason.
Then again, we might be better off keeping Deng and landing Smith this season, and then resigning him in the offseason with his Bird Rights.
Rose/Brewer/Deng/Booz/Noah, with Korver/Smith/Watson/Asik on the bench would be really good too.
Dude's sister just died
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
by Sports2 on Dec 27, 2010 7:11 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not talking about this past week.
Just this whole season in general. He’s missed a bunch of games(not counting those due to the recent death), as he does every season. He’s never in good shape and has been talking about switching teams publicly(I’d love to play with Derrick Rose).
Yes, I agree that Carlos Boozer did all of those things... oh wait, you're talking about Carmelo Anthony?
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
by Sports2 on Dec 27, 2010 8:52 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
You're being difficult on purpose.
He’s dedicated to the game, stays in great shape, clearly works at his craft and though he misses games, they seem to be due to major problems, not minor issues like Melo, which can either be played through or avoided by actually being in shape.
I still like Melo a lot and would love to have him on the Bulls, he’s just not on the pedestal I had him on before.
Well
Boozer’s always in good shape….
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
You do know Yao's done right?
The only reason he has trade value is that insurance is set to cover half his salary that year. But that wouldn’t create any salary cap flexibility; it would only save Jerry Reinsdorf a bucketload of money.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 27, 2010 5:13 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, I know he's done,
but he’d be coming off of the books after this season, as would Battier, so we’d have enough cash to get several really solid players.
No we wouldn't
"Here"s":http://hoopshype.com/salaries/chicago.htm a link to the Bulls salary commitments next year. Noah’s contract extension kicks in, meaning that, even if you get rid of Deng’s $12 million, we’d still have $50 million committed. The cap will probably be around $59 million, so that’s $9 million in cap room. If we had no cap space, we’d have a little over $6 million to spend via the MLE. So, in effect, by getting rid of Deng, you get another $3 million to throw around. Is that really worth it?
Pat Riley is the devil.
I don't think that'a accurate.
The salaries in a trade don’t need to match up perfectly, they just have to be kinda close.
For instance, per the ESPN trade machine, we could trade Bogans, Deng, Watson, Scal, JJ, and Kurt(20.9) for Battier and Ming(25.4). I’m not saying that trade would work, we’d probably need to sub Taj in there instead of Scal or Kurt, both of which are only signed through the end of this year,
The Bulls would then have 42 million committed to Rose, Noah, Booz, Korver, Brewer and Asik. (Those six)+(~20 million in cap space)=WOW.
A core of Rose/Noah/Booz/Taj/Korver/Brewer/Asik
Have you looked at the 2011 Free Agent class?
It sucks. We have a really good team right now and you want to blow it all to hell for a shot at Thaddeus Young and Wilson Chandler? Thanks but no thanks.
Pat Riley is the devil.
We do have a really nice team,
and I added(above) that we might be better off with some simple tweaking this season and staying put. All this is me justing thinking “aloud,” none of this is something I firmly believe in. I’m just throwing shit at the wall. Also, Landry Fields(and Melo) plays the same position as Chandler, so they may not pay him; he might be available.
However, I think that for the future, the Bulls would be better off with
this team:
Guards: Derrick Rose, Ronnie Brewer, JR Smith, Insert backup PG.
SF: Wilson Chandler, Kyle Korver
PF/C: Boozer, Noah, Asik, Chandler/Oden.
I’m very down on Deng(always have been, not just this year), and would gladly give up Deng and Taj for JR Smith, Tyson Chandler(or Oden) and Wilson Chandler.
I don’t know how much each of those guys will demand, so this may all be way off. I think Tyson, Wilson and JR are all gonna get something in the 6-8 range. We can get them if this deal goes down.
- Of course, this deal would also allow us to sign Melo, but he probably is gonna sign with whichever team trades for him, so I’m him altogether.
Yeah I guess it just comes down to your opinion of Deng then
I don’t see that team as better than ours because I think Deng is a lot better than Chandler.
Pat Riley is the devil.
These are the guys you mentioned
“Thaddeus Young/Greg Oden/JR Smith/Tyson Chandler/Tayshaun Prince/Wilson Chandler”
First off, none of them are as good as Luol Deng except Oden when he’s healthy, which is never. Also, Wilson Chandler, Young and Oden are restricted, which means our chances of getting them are slim. Prince is like Deng only much older and nowhere near as good at this point in his career. Tyson Chandler wouldn’t add much to this team given that we have Boozer and Noah locked in, and JR Smith’s value is low enough where we could get him for the MLE anyways.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 27, 2010 7:53 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
ah, yes...
“…except Oden when he’s healthy, which is never.”
excellent.
by badnewsintennisshoes on Dec 27, 2010 8:43 PM CST up reply actions
I don't know if he's on the block, or if he can really play significant minutes at the two
but Dorrell Wright caught my eye the other night during the GS-POR game.
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 27, 2010 1:12 PM CST reply actions
I don't mean as the permanent solution at SG, more in the stop-gap for a season or so if no appealing trades present themselves.
I got the skills to pay the bills and that's about it
by Rose Colored Goggles on Dec 27, 2010 1:12 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
doesn't he play 3?
anyway he is overhyped right now and would probably cost too much
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
I doubt the Warriors trade Wright
but his contract is good at 3 years/11 mil.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 27, 2010 2:31 PM CST up reply actions
You take enough shots
At least one is bound to go in
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
by DRose01 on Dec 27, 2010 2:29 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
You tell that to Bogans...
j/k
but to be fair, Monta is shooting it as well as Rose.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 27, 2010 2:31 PM CST up reply actions
Monta is doing quite well
That would be an amazing 1-2 punch.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
theyd be the face
(the recipients of punches)
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
Rose's D has improved dramatically of late
He’s challenging shots, he’s making his rotations.
The Post D is the cleanup for the guard D anyway….if you don’t have post defenders, you’ll get creamed because of hte hand check rules make guarding the perimeter rough…..
Why do you think Rondo’s a “good defender”—he’s decent but not as good as his rep, it’s because he has KG int he post demanding the D attention int he post, whcih gives Rondo the ability to play passing lanes and make steals
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
that is part of it...
but he also tends to display outstanding anticipation, and makes plenty of steals directly from ball-handlers. Rose certainly has room for improvement, but he is nowhere near the defender that Rondo is at the moment.
by badnewsintennisshoes on Dec 28, 2010 11:34 AM CST up reply actions
I know Rondo is a better defender than Rose right now
Rose is improving dramatically this year though,
But Rose is a much better shooter and scorer than Rondo….
Rose also is the better player and talent. but Rose on the Celtics and wow they’d be a 75 win team, but Rondo here and we’d have sunk pre Boozer, and we’d be still pretty far behind .500 (though Rondo would be as good a player as Boozer….whcih means he’s pretty darn good, but he’s able to do more on the C’s because the other teams cannot double or triple team him since he has sometimes 3 or 4 other hall of famers on the court with him.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
while...
it is clearly true that Rose is a far more potent scorer than Rondo, you are overstating the case. Rondo is a vastly superior passer, has far better court vision, and is a smarter player. All of those qualities contribute to offensive production and efficiency.
Yes, Rose’s particular skills are more important to the Bulls than those of Rondo would be, but that is irrelevant to any comparison.
by badnewsintennisshoes on Dec 28, 2010 1:10 PM CST up reply actions
That's not irrelevant to any comparison
Rondo’s game is tailor made for the C’s because he is a fantastic distributor who isn’t counted on to be the main man scorer on the team really well ever.
Rose’s game isn’t a “system” game, he can create his scoring ops witha litany of moves and inside outside O game.
Sure he might not get 14 assists a night in Boston, but he’d score much more and at a higher percentage and would open up things even mroe for them.
Rose would work on any team in the league. Rondo needs to have major scoring options around him to make him look like an MVP candidate. He’s an alls tar, and highly skilled—especially because he’s found out how to play his game and he has the team to mask his pretty hefty weaknesses.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
See how awesome not using numbers is in arguments?
People can argue hyperbole and talk around each other ALL day.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Oh so
Rondo is the best f-ing shooter in the game.
My bad Tyger, you are a fing God. I love you.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
by majoyenrac on Dec 29, 2010 7:50 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
That's true of Monta Ellis of years past.
This Monta Ellis is balling.
As a reply to all
I was talking about Sam Smith taking enough metaphorical shots at players Bulls should acquire. Sam also liked Joe Johnson and he is having a crappy season.
I was not talking about Monta! Dude is awesome
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
Monta has a 55.7% TS%
This year, a 20.3 PER, averaging 26-6 mostly from the SG spot, shooting almost 38% from 3 land….
And all that for a measly $11M per year.
Monta Ellis would be abotu as good a piece as we could hope for.
A Rose-Ellis combo would be a super BG-Rose combo…..
We could only dream…
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
i feel like monta ellis and rose would be lebron and wade only worse
only less passing ability and skill overall
Derrick Rose is a motherfucking ninja.
by sin on Dec 27, 2010 2:49 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I wonder how long Ellis would last with Thibs
Ellis hasn’t been asked to play defense ever. Maybe he’ll pull the Amare trick and say nobody ever taught him how to play defense.
I can predict the future using Norm Van Lier's crystal balls.
"Sam has a tendency to denigrate reports coming from any reporter who didn’t also cover the day Naismith first put up the peach baskets." - snley
by NBA Observer on Dec 27, 2010 3:41 PM CST up reply actions
But
Add in that Lebron and Wade are 2 of the top 5 players in the league.
Add int hat we have Boozer-Noah as wildcards that the Heat do not (Boozer’s got more inside game than Bosh, and Noah is definitely something the Heat don’t have).
But alas, we’re probably not getting Ellis anyway, as they’d want at least a Noah-Deng and some picks type of deal for Ellis and a bad contract……and we can’t loose Noah for a non defender like Ellis (or Melo)
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
not too mention a massive downgrade defensively
Doesn’t seem very moral to me. Might as well take Satan’s autograph while you’re at it. - N.C.
Misleading title.
We haven’t “moved on” to Jackson, quite the opposite. We’re waiting to see if we can get Mayo or Smith, and the article says we can pull the trigger on the Jackson deal if we want.
eat. sleep. hoop. repeat. become legendary.
you're right, I'll change it
(i did it in the first place)
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 4:47 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
actually, the longer version of the rumorpress post is gone
so who knows.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 4:50 PM CST up reply actions
The Waiting Game
The bulls will wait until feb. to make a trade………some team will then realize that they aren’t making the playoffs and start dumping players
So much ambivalence.
Part of me thinks we’re ready to compete for a championship this year, and an upgrade at the 2 is better done sooner than later. Another part of me agrees with the Bucher-esque line of waiting a year or two when the older teams are completely faded and financially strapped teams are dumping talent because of the new CBA. My only question: who are these great SGs that will be available a year or two from now? Anybody awesome is probably going to be untouchable (Eric Gordon, Kevin Martin et al.). All of which means: I do not envy GarPax right now.
by arjoseph on Dec 27, 2010 5:00 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Of all the SGs rumored to be available, Jackson's the least attractive to me (besides Rip Hamilton, I guess)
But he’s still an upgrade, and depending on the specific players involved, I might just bite the bullet and say yes. I’m confused as to who the parts involved would be though. The post says this would be an 8-player trade.
Maybe something like this? I’d say yes to that.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 27, 2010 5:21 PM CST reply actions 4 recs
Not that I'm in favor of Rip, but he seems like a guy who keeps himself in very good shape.
And I could see him playing pretty well for the next few years. I can see Jackson falling apart completely.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
i agree
i became a fan of Rip after seeing his workout vid during an NBA game (which i cant find on youtube=( ). Dude was working his ass off and stated that he works so hard because he beilves when he rests someone else is crafting their game. That shyt made me respect the shyt out of his game – pisston or not
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
Rip contract is absurd. If Dumars wasn't on crack or something when he decided on that extension
he would be worth gold this year with his expiring.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:01 AM CST up reply actions
I don't think I'd make that deal. Especially now.
Remember, if you deal taj without getting a big in return you’re looking at more minutes for Asik and 38 year old Kurt Thomas over the next 2 months (not to mention the Ginger who shall not be named), unless you make a corresponding move. And that would become even more difficult after taking on SJax.
I don’t think he represents enough of an upgrade in the short or long term to justify the move. Hold out until the asking or ice drops or you find someone better.
How could we trade for SJax?
He makes like $9MM this year, so that would mean we’d have to send out A LOT more than JJ and Taj. Also, Jax will make over $10 million in 2012-2013. With Boozer, Deng and Joakim already on the books with 8 figure salaries that year, how could we re-sign Rose? Am I missing something? It seems like the only way we can get SJax is if we unload Deng…
Team would need to move one of Korver or Brewer in any SJax deal, which makes it not worth it to me
As to issues with bringing in another 8 figure contract, that’s not a problem until we know there’s a hard cap in the next CBA.
Well, isn't what LeBron did last night the living embodiment of The Secret, leaving millions on the table and turning himself into a hometown villain, all for the sake of winning?
Neil Paine, basketball-reference.com
WHOTF gave him that contract?
10 mil in 2012-13? WTF?
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3xj7ps5
Bulls get Wallace, Jackson, Brown
Bobcats get Deng, JJ, Scalabrine, Bogans
Jordan cuts Scals right away and saves over 5 million total and gets a younger exciting (shhhhh!) player to keep his fans happy in Deng and a prospect in JJ and a solid defensive(sshhhhh!) player in Bogans that he can cut next year and save even more money.
Bulls get themselves into ECF with chance to go to Finals and win it all.
The SF that the Bulls get back
Gerald Wallace.
If the Bobcats were desperate enough to do that trade, i’d do it and even give them their pick back.
I don't think they would trade GWall for Deng
GWall just made all star last year
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:03 AM CST up reply actions
Obviously Jordan would be blowing it up to rebuild if he did
that trade but throw in ours and their #1s and its not so bad for Jordan because of the money he save and Deng is young etc…
That whole "one year rental" argument for J.R. Smith makes no sense to me whatsoever
If our cap space is pretty much gonna be locked up from here on out, wouldn’t you wanna trade for someone who you think is gonna stick around?
I wouldn’t use any trade assets for a one year rental. Then after the year, they go somewhere else and we have a shorter amount of assests.
Why would you even?
by Option27 on Dec 27, 2010 6:27 PM CST via mobile reply actions
I agree, never made sense
Like what New York did for T-Mac
...New York trading for T-Mac made sense
they did it to have another expiring contract to try to grab another superstar.
A true friend stabs you in the front - Oscar Wilde
Yea, just looked at it,
Not a bad trade in retrospect: Lose Jared Jeffries, and then the swap the Rockets have for New York’s pick this next year is useless now
The idea is that you can re-sign him if he works out because you have his bird rights
And if the rumors are true and he’s excited about coming to Chicago, then maybe there is a good chance he’ll want to stick around
But if he leaves, you have Kyle Korver and no Ronnie Brewer... or vice versa.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
I know they're both good players, but honestly I haven't seen enough out of either of them to be terrified of replacing them
I know I’ve said it before, and I know it’s not exactly a debatable argument, but I think you can get a pretty good facsimile of either every off season for around the MLE.
I don’t see us getting an upgrade at SG without taking a risk, and if that risk is simply losing Brewer or Korver I’m pretty comfortable with that.
Assuming there is an MLE.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
It isn't about replacing Brewer or Korver.
It’s about replacing our only attractive assets and THAT is not worth a gamble of hoping JR Smith likes it here enough to perform well.
I want someone like Mayo because he’s cheap at the moment and could wind up being the long term answer at SG on a championship team.
Use the MLE for players on the bench to give us depth. Not our future SG
by Option27 on Dec 27, 2010 11:20 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Damn
I just started thinking about a starting five of Rose-Mayo-Deng-Boozer-Noah and got extremely excited. That’s the move to make. Mayo is young, plays defense, is a team guy and I even think him and Rose are friends. He’ll be jacked to play for a winning team in a big city.
Fuck depth. We have a young team that will be competing for several years, Taj won’t be the difference maker in a championship team. We can get by just fine with Kurt Thomas this year, then get someone for the MLE next year. Get Taj the fuck out of here, and they can have the Charlotte pick too for all I care, the world is ending in 2012 anyway.
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 6:31 PM CST reply actions 8 recs
not sure
how good “friends” they are, but yep they DID work out together over the summer…so we got that going for us…whatever that means
I wouldn't do that trade more because of...
…the Grizzlies history of bad deals, seriously tho, we’re gonna give all that to a team that just paid Mike Conley $45/5?
Well, yeah, if you can steal him somehow, then do it
But if it’s February and the deadline is an hour away, I’d do what it took to get the deal done (within reason obviously)
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 6:40 PM CST up reply actions
Agreed.
Mayo has more talent and much more upside. His skill set fits an area of greater need than Taj’s going forward.
He's the type of guy that I could see coming in
and playing much better right off the bat. Then everyone would be talking about what a steal he was. People shouldn’t get too caught up in how he’s played this year. I wouldn’t mind Jackson or Smith either, but I just don’t think they’re as much of a home run. This trade would set us up for years (Barring injuries, of course)
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 8:24 PM CST up reply actions
Not to mention
We wouldn’t have the bad taste in our mouth of paying Stephen Jackson 10 million in 2013.
Well Smith Deal ends after this year
and you probably don’t have to give up much to get him. Jax on the other hand……
Rose 2010!!!!!
or maybe we play cheap and some other team gets Mayo
and we are left whining about how cheap Gar Paxdorf are… have u seen this movie?
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:07 AM CST up reply actions
I agree and I was trying to make this point about Taj in another thread.
Mayo would mean more for our team that what Taj currently brings. If we could get Arthur back it lessens the blow even more. Arthur is averaging 8 and 5 while playing about 20 mins a game.
Rose 2010!!!!!
by illwill on Dec 27, 2010 7:27 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
that's how i feel
to those who say “this is stupid, Taj is better”, you don’t always have to get the clear-cut better player to win a trade, you just have to make your team better (besides i’d argue they’re close enough). Taj is a valuable asset right now, but his value isn’t being maximized as a bench player (who seems to have dropped off a little since the move). if someone wants to trade for him thinking he’s a starting caliber PF, good, let’s do it. unless Boozer gets hurt again, Taj’s value (around the league) can only go down from here. his main value to the Bulls is as Boozer insurance. i’d rather have a good SG at this point than Boozer insurance. and Arthur would be a decent replacement, he can score and maybe Thibs can coach him up on the defensive side.
But Mayo is a marginal upgrade on Brewer.
And Taj has two more years at 1.3 million, he’s not valuable as a trade asset because he doesn’t have a big salary, and he’s super valuable as a cheap component to a strong front court and stifling defense in a salary cap environment.
You need a strong front court just like you need a strong backcourt. Why can’t you get Mayo for the Brewer or Korver and the Charlotte pick ? You’d have a more complete team if you can gain Mayo and keep Taj.
by JockstrapNoah on Dec 27, 2010 9:06 PM CST up reply actions
Um
No way in hell would I get rid of Korver. He may not be starting caliber or whatever, but he our best pure shooter, most consistent 3 point threat, and one of our best pure scorers especially coming off the bench that includes Watson, Brewer, Gibson, Thomas, and Asik.
well yeah, i'd rather get Mayo while keeping Taj
i’m just not sure Memphis cares to do that.
i’m just not convinced that losing Taj would be some sort of disaster. even while Noah’s been out it’s not like Taj has been the knight in shining armor. what if the Thibs magic dust is real? Taj has gone from a 103 drtg to 98 under Thibs. Korver’s at a career best 104. Brewer’s at a (by a wide margin) career best of 98. Boozer’s at a career best (by a decent margin) at 99. Asik is at a 98 as a fucking rookie out of Turkey! Kurt Thomas replacing Noah hasn’t been a picnic, but hasn’t been a trainwreck either. so why can’t you bring in Mayo and Arthur and see the same type of shit? why can’t the defense stay awesome with them and no Taj? i think it can, while the offense gets the lift it needs.
by M 80 on Dec 27, 2010 9:55 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Drtg is a flawed stat
And it’s based primarily on the success of the team as a whole, so saying that every Bulls player has an impressive DRtg is essentially saying that the Bulls are a good defensive team. But we already knew that to begin with.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 27, 2010 10:33 PM CST up reply actions
even if it's flawed, i don't think it's worthless
when it’s noticeable almost across the board, it’s pretty obvious that Thibs has had an impact. the point is that the Bulls are a good defensive team with some guys that weren’t always considered (or aren’t) good defensive players. in any case, i’m pretty sure that Taj Gibson isn’t the main reason behind it all (though he surely has had some part in it). i think it’s conceivable that you could lose Taj and bring in Mayo and Arthur and not only not become a shitty defense, but maybe remain about the same.
for me it comes down to this: Taj is a luxury, not a necessity. while some say Mayo is a “marginal” upgrade over Brewer, i believe he’s more of a necessity to this team. even if Brewer is given the starting job, i’ll bet that in a few months people will be admitting we still need “more” at SG. Mayo might be the longterm answer, and i just don’t think the price of Taj is too steep to find out. he’s the guy we probably have to trade, and we’re not elite with him, so why not find out if we can become elite by using him to add a different piece? there just aren’t a lot of other options out there that make much sense.
if there’s any shred of truth to these rumors, i’m just happy the Bulls are actually considering something like this.
Why would Memphis trade Mayo to only get Bogans and JJ in return?
I agree with you about Taj and Asik. They are not worthy to kill a deal.
Rose 2010!!!!!
Individually they're not worth it
But I don’t like any team taking all of the Bulls big man depth, especially in a “win now” trade.
Asik
is the deal breaker IMO.
I remember once former Bull Dave Corzine staring at a stat sheet after a loss when he had one rebound and Michael Jordan offering, "One more rebound than a dead man."
by Rex Grossman on Dec 28, 2010 3:11 PM CST up reply actions
Mayo is a 39% 3 pt shooter
To Brewer’s can’t shoot 23% career.
Mayo shoots a lot of 3’s in relation to his other shots, whcih lowers his FG%.
His D is solid, he’s younger, he’s on a rookie deal.
Having ’em both, would be most prefered, but Mayo would be solid.
Brewer’s good, but he really can’t shoot (though because he’s good at playing and driving towards the rim, his FG%‘s generally mask this—he knows what he’s good at and typically doesn’t force what he’s not good at—whcih is a skill often times forgotten on the court).
But Mayo is a clear upgrade if used correctly on our team.
2010-2011: I put the Scottie-Barkley Rockets feud curse on the Wade-James-Bosh trio.....
The "Rose and Mayo are buddies" angle is important
We need to do everything possible to make sure he doesn’t bolt for LA, right?
Pat Riley is the devil.
He might call Jerry Buss and ask to play for him.
Only this time he’ll be getting paid legally.
This is also the deal I want the Bulls to make...
If the Bulls can get Darrell Arthur included in the deal it would be great
Only if Jerry wants to extend him
by Option27 on Dec 27, 2010 11:22 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Meh
If they keep Taj they will have to extend him as well. Besides, Jerry can extend him and see how far the team goes. If he is not impressed he would have 4 very tradeable starters and a Deng with 1 less year on his contract. Also, remember that Noah and Boozer contracts are light unitl 2014 when they get really heavy. Time enough to see how far this team can go.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:11 AM CST up reply actions
You posted a pic to go along with that post?
Very SoulEater-ish
by Stacey_Is_King on Dec 27, 2010 9:52 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
hahaha, it really is
I don’t know, I liked this photo :P
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 12:41 PM CST up reply actions
Actually, now that I think of it, Souleater probably would've posted a picture of mayonaisse,
made it a fanshot, and just put a sentence like: “This is what we need.” under it
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 12:44 PM CST up reply actions
That's what I'm talking about JBJ
Mayo is more important for us than Taj. We sign freaking Joe Smith if we need, lol
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:05 AM CST up reply actions
i dont know
but us or MJ should hire him…dude is sick
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
Since the Knicks game
I’ve been thinking about Wilson Chandler… he’s starting to hit his outside shot pretty consistently, he’s super athletic, has great size and is only 22…could really grow into a great compliment to DRose and be a great defender under Thib’s tutelage. I know he’s more of a three than a two, but I’m sure he could handle moving over.
Maybe send over our Bobcats pick for him? The Knicks need draft picks badly if they want to get into the Melo derby – that could entice them. Of course, throw in a Bogans and a Lucas or whatever.
he would probably be overpriced because the Knicks are hot
and i’m not sure they would trade him for a long term pick because the fans are finally enjoying the team. It would be risky for them. Anyway, Mayo would be a better option because he can carry the ball as well.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:13 AM CST up reply actions
KC has returned to shit on everyone's dreams (although he doesn't mention Mayo). Took him a little longer this time, probably because the holidays:
Is help coming? Rumors persist that general manager Gar Forman is actively looking for an upgrade at shooting guard, but sources said reports of talks with the Nuggets regarding J.R. Smith weren’t accurate. Players such as Richard Hamilton and Stephen Jackson would appear to have prohibitive long-term deals.
The Bulls have scouted Rockets guard Courtney Lee, who is well-regarded for his defense and toughness. But even if talks became serious, he’s a 37.9 percent career 3-point shooter and might represent only a minor upgrade.
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
Oops, my bad
Here ya go: LINK
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 8:54 PM CST up reply actions
Thanks man
Of COURSE he would shoot all of these down just to tell us that Courtney Lee is the guy they’re looking at. THANKS KC! YOU’RE THE MAN!
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
What I don't understand is why he mentions Jackson's contract as "prohibitive"?
Rip’s would fit that description, but Jackson’s is definitely doable, as several people on here have pointed out. Unless, of course, Jerry is worried about the luxury tax
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 8:52 PM CST up reply actions
I wouldn't exactly call them "long-term" deals either
Players such as Richard Hamilton and Stephen Jackson would appear to have prohibitive long-term deals.
Could this just be K.C. editorializing? He cites a source relating to the J.R. Smith thing, but then writes this part in the form of an opinion
Rose before hoes
by Bullsfan7210 on Dec 27, 2010 9:07 PM CST up reply actions
He does that shit all the time
It’s like he’s reporting things, but also trying to shape the facts slightly. He’s a pretty bullshit writer if you ask me. It’s pretty shameful how much he sides with the Bulls. I know it’s not easy to be a beat writer and politic all the time, but it appears like he’s just said “Fuck it”, and become their PR man.
Every story he puts out is some mailed in piece of garbage about how SUPER! Rose has become, or how great the chemistry is. Then, every once in a while, when he actually has to report stuff, it’s bullshit like this, where he’s just trying to explain why the org isn’t doing something. And the tone of the stories is always like “Well, they’re doing the best they can do…”. Give me a fucking break.
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 9:23 PM CST up reply actions
I agree...his mailbags are worthwhile, but that's about it. He's basically JR's puppet.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
Which is telling in this case...
In that the Bulls would consider these shitty long term deals to be prohibitive to a trade and JR Smith was already a Bull, and the team is not looking to revisit that tenure…
So, if KC is the organizational mouthpiece, I can glean from this…tech9 is full of shit, and the Bulls may be looking at OJ Mayo if he is actually available.
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 27, 2010 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
...He’s a 37.9 percent career 3-point shooter and might represent only a minor upgrade.
Apparently “minor upgrade” means trading a couple of really shitty three point shooters for a really good three point shooter.
BullsTwo > Back up and running!
Hey man, he's just tempering our expectations!
::rolls eyes::
KC is the worst
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
correction
KC LIVES to shit on everyone’s dreams.
His tombstone will lead ’don’t read too much into this…’.
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 27, 2010 10:09 PM CST up reply actions 6 recs
hahaha
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 10:27 PM CST up reply actions
ahhhaaaa
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
I really don't like: Rip Hamilton, Stephen Jackson, JR Smith
I would have to have great deals to get those guys.
My number one guy is still Iggy.I know the chances to make something for the Bulls doable is small, it’s still the one that makes them the best. He’s the best 2-guard available out there by a long shot, and, therefore, he’s their best option regardless of fit. Next is Mayo. He doesn’t have quite the proven production as someone like Jackson or Smith, but I think he’s had the glimpses and he is very young, he’s being sat so his price has got to be low, and for some reason, I just feel like he would thrive as a third or fourth fiddle guy. He probably doesn’t have the name recognition to come in and start right away over Korver or Brewer (or Bogans) like a Stephen Jackson or Iggy would, but by next year, I’d feel like they have their starting 5 locked up
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
The thing that's so great about Mayo is that it allows us to keep the starting lineup intact
I don’t see an Iggy deal getting done without Deng, Plus Mayo’s a better fit, even though he’s not quite as good. So when adding all that together, Mayo seems like the best, and most realistic choice imo
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 9:25 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, it'd be nice to add Mayo and have some continuity for the next 5-8 years.
Teams like the C’s and Lakers are great mostly because of their superior talent, but their familiarity and chemistry with each other is also a huge part of their success. Look how many SGs Rose has had to primarily play with in a span of only 2+ years: BG, Salmons, Thabo, Kirk, Bogans. It would be nice to finally cement 4 main guys around our star and see what happens.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
hahahahaha
I’d slap Paxson for giving me Bogans to start next to. That guy passed up SO many 3’s in the New York game
I'm a bit late here
but yeah, familiarity is real important. It took the Celtics five years after blowing up their team in one offseason to win a title, and it took the Lakers ten with Kobe and Gasol playing with each other before they could finally compete.
Familiarity over multiple seasons means almost nothing. You had it right with superior talent, “familiarity and chemistry” is not a huge part of anybody’s success, unless by chemistry you mean good players passing the ball to other good players.
by Gentleman Jim on Jan 1, 2011 1:43 PM CST up reply actions
I don't see an Iggy deal getting done WITH Deng.
Why would Philly do that?
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
by tyger1147 on Dec 28, 2010 9:35 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Well, that's true also
But still, that’s probably about the only way the deal could happen, isn’t it?
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 12:46 PM CST up reply actions
no
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
For me, Mayo and Smith are on approximately the same level
Smith has risks we’re all aware of: maturity, shot selection, defensive effort, expiring contract. But Thorpe has mentioned a couple of times that he’s heard Smith has shown a lot more maturity this season, and I think that offensively he’s a better player and fit than Mayo. He also seems like he might be the perfect example of a guy who would really benefit from a change of scene.
Mayo has risks too: he hasn’t yet proven to be an impact player, he’ll soon be looking for his first big money deal given his potential and pedigree, and he’ll probably cost more to get. However, Mayo is the better defender, is younger, and probably gets along well with Rose.
For me the question comes down to who would I rather give up: Brewer/Korver or Taj? I’m still going back and forth on that one.
One more thing to add in Smith's defense.
I think a lot of the perceived problems with him are a bit overblown. He’s been an important piece for a team that has won 50+ games 3 seasons in a row, and was a top 10 defense for two of those years.
Overblown?
He pled guilty to vehicular manslaughter and choked a D-Leaguer during a pickup game. He definitely has issues.
Now if you’re saying that the effect of those issues on his value to a team is overblown, I guess I can agree with that.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 27, 2010 10:39 PM CST up reply actions
There'd be nobody left for BaBers to hate on if they did this trade:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3xj7ps5
Well….I guess we’d have John Lucas the turd plus Kwame perhaps.
OT - Meanwhile, John Wall comes off the injured list today
and goes to the free throw line 13 times in 25 minutes. Unreal. Rose is getting jobbed.
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 9:54 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
Rose really does get jobbed. It's sickening.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
by Illini15 on Dec 27, 2010 9:55 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
I mean, I can't even imagine what Rose's stats would look like if he got to the line like these other guys do
He’d probably be at 27-28 points a game with a TS% in the upper 50s and a PER of 25+. PLEASE HAPPEN SOMEDAY SOON!!!!
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
by Illini15 on Dec 27, 2010 9:56 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
Yup, that's exactly what it would look like
Apparently the league doesn’t think he’s whining enough, because no one can tell me he doesn’t get hit as much as Wall, or any of these other guys. Such a shitty part of the league
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 10:30 PM CST up reply actions
I agree
I used to sort of buy into the “he avoids contact too much because he’s so athletic”. It’s not true. I’ve watched more games this year (benefit of having a new kid…lots of TV time) and Rose drives and gets hammered all the time. It’s just not called and I don’t know why. I think the people that say he doesn’t sell the contact to the refs enough mus be right. He needs to learn to yell when hit I guess. It’s ridiculous.
by hitlesswonder on Dec 27, 2010 11:23 PM CST up reply actions
Yup, that's all it is
He doesn’t exaggerate it enough apparently. Which is probably the hardest thing for him to do, considering his temperment on the court. Oh well, fuck the NBA
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 27, 2010 11:58 PM CST up reply actions
He still does a few things wrong in that area
I remember one time he could have just jumped back into Amare and gotten to the line, but instead took a tough layup and missed. However, I for the most part agree. To a certain extent, he needs to take the advice I give my high school players: don’t do anything fancy, just go up strong and keep the ball high so the refs can see it when you get hacked. Flailing wouldn’t hurt either. Honestly, he should spend some time with Boozer working on this. He does a great job of emphasizing contact.
"Mental toughness is to physical as four is to one." - Bob Knight
It's almost like he has to learn what a foul is and what isn't
Maybe once he knows what gets called, he’ll go to it more. But at this point, he has no clue how to earn a whistle
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 1:06 AM CST up reply actions
Seriously ask yourselves this question.
If Rose had blown by everyone and got to the low block, does he:
A) jump straight up and around and try to make a ridiculous reverse lay up… and might
or
B) jump backwards into the player trailing him, drawing the foul but possibly missing the layup.
Rose does A. He avoids contact. He’s EXPLICITLY said that. There is no conspiracy to keep Rose down.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Do you hate Rose?
Just because he avoids contact doesn’t mean he doesn’t get it. He also doesn’t exaggerate contact
Will he just do the diggie already?
Do a little dance pre-game and refs will love you forever!
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 27, 2010 10:18 PM CST up reply actions
Ok, refs sucks but Rose is to blame to
that’s the price you pay for being a ninja.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:23 AM CST up reply actions
Why can you guys not accept it's Rose's own doing. He's admitted as such.
Do you really, honestly, think the league is intentionally not calling fouls on Rose? If you believe that conspiracy, there’s nothing for you.
Rose could get more fouls if he wanted, but according to most people on here, it wouldn’t be as pretty and wouldn’t be real basketball. So be glad he’s sticking to his guns even if it hurts his team. Sheesh.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Do you watch the games?
Sure, there’s plenty of times where Rose’s acrobatic-ness costs him a foul call, but there’s always a couple of times where he’s hit (often by more than one player at the same time) and nothing is called because he doesn’t ever flop or flail around. It’s definitely both…this is not just a black and white issue here.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
For the most part I agree.
But there have been several examples all year with a pretty expansive sample size of times where he is fouled and does not get the call.
There are several theories for why, but the one that I like the most is that he’s too fast and refs don’t know what the fuck is going on.
It doesn’t hold water, but I always thought that was funny. I have no idea why he doesn’t get calls sometimes. He’s clearly getting fouled, and there are a shit load of times where he’s running into contact.
I dunno, Kurt Thomas has some shit to teach young boy.
"What do you think, I just dunked my whole career?" Jordan asked Henderson after making a 3.
"You’ve got to miss eventually," Henderson told him.
"That’s what Cleveland said," replied Jordan
Regardless of what Rose says, he still gets hit a lot every game.
So if he doesn’t get the foul calls he already should get, what incentive is there for him to try and draw more contact and in the process take less makeable baskets? Do we know he will get those calls when he doesn’t even get the obvious ones?
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 28, 2010 10:31 AM CST up reply actions 3 recs
My problem is
Rose needs to make more of his freethrows when he gets to the freethrow line………i’m sick and tired of him making one and missing the other
by Jermal on Dec 28, 2010 12:02 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
See, I disagree in the sense that, he's still getting fouled like those other guys
He’s just not exaggerating the contact enough. So, in essence, the refs are the evil ones here. But you can definitely still fault Rose for not being a better actor-flopper-whatever. It all depends on how you look at it. Sure I get a little upset with Rose, but I get more pissed at the stupid system in the NBA
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 12:51 PM CST up reply actions
It's only Rose's own doing by default.
Once you concede that the refs suck, then you can pin it on Rose, but I still chose to blame the refs for sucking and only assign a tiny bit of the blame onto Rose. The refs are there to detect fouls, not detect flailing arms and then deduce that there was a foul. He shouldn’t have to sell the fouls, the “world’s best refs” should be able to do so on their own. I guess that’s the theory, anyway.
Officials don't hone their craft enough at the professional level.
This is true in both NBA and MLB, and is largely a result of the paucity of incentives to be really great at officiating instead of merely meeting the adequate level of proficiency to remain in the highest professional league.
I guess.
They don’t call travels, they don’t call loads of shit.
In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).
Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.
Learn to flop
Tell Rose to start taking some classes
While the Bulls have been winning I really haven't watched the past two games.
What I mean is I haven’t really enjoyed watching them. I don’t enjoy this team right now. Maybe it’s just the Holidays or whatever when the NBA just seems so dirty and greedy. I think it’s because I’ve come to realize that the Bulls have pretty much maxed out on resources and this is the team we’ll be watching for the near future. While it is a good team I’m not sure it’s good enough to win a title. What I’m really saying is I miss Ben Gordon and Tyrus Thomas. ha!
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
by SoulEater7 on Dec 27, 2010 10:41 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
Souleater is a monthly manga series.
So I’m guessing our Souleater is going through withdrawls until the next issue.
Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. says:
"4 our of 5 of us recommend Devin Hester. The 5th dentist has gone missing. He was last seen wearing green and yellow."
by Dr. Handsome, D.D.S. on Dec 27, 2010 10:53 PM CST up reply actions 3 recs
i might be the only one who got that joke...
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
fillers will do that to u
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
I think what I'm saying is I want a 2 guard.
ha! Sorry I had a moment. I’ll be watching the game tomorrow.
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
by SoulEater7 on Dec 27, 2010 10:56 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'd prefer the couple weird comments about you not watching games
to the hundreds of weird comments you make during games you watch
BaB on Twitter | BaB on Facebook
"Don't nag, flag!"
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2010 12:02 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm going to comment much less.
Maybe Sin can be the mascot now. I’l pass the torch.
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
oh so that was you
i was wondering what that cow with the fake ass horns on it was all about….
I dont care what the D.N.A. Says, the Guy wearing number 12 Cannot be Kirk Hinrich, he is definetly Kurt. Kirk can actually play basketball!
by piccolomair on Dec 28, 2010 4:43 AM CST up reply actions 4 recs
I have no idea if this was posted but McGraw checks in...
The Bulls are definitely looking for someone to fill that role. But with limited resources at the moment, failure will be an option.
Read more: http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20101227/sports/712289834/#ixzz19O2k3uqJ
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
Well, that's pretty depressing
Sounds like a lot more crying poor in that one too. “Fiscal responsibility” my asshole. What does that even mean? We’re not saving for Lebron anymore. This is the window
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 1:24 AM CST up reply actions
true, Lebron mania is over
but it still doesn’t mean they have to be stupid either. You REALLY want Jackson or Rip??
MAYBE you take a chance on Jackson…but I’m not even sure you do that for the price.
Nah not for those two.
I’m not even sure about Mayo. Fuckin blows. Need a damn 2. I think I’d shit my pants if they traded Deng though..
ALL I want for Christmas is a starting NBA shooting guard and throw in a decent backup point guard!!! Come on Paxson.. seriously John Lucas 3?
No, I don't want Rip
Jackson would be aight, but Mayo would be sweet as hell.
My point is, I don’t want to hear about financial constraints. Just say you don’t want Rip because he’s old and shitty, or you don’t want S Jax because he’s not what you’re looking for. But DO NOT tell me it’s because of money
Until Keith Bogans is taken out of the starting lineup, it's: Tommy Del Thibo
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 28, 2010 3:24 AM CST up reply actions
Especially when JR
is spending like a sailor for the White Sox.
That part was not depressing
The one scenario that might justify the Bulls trading the pick now is for Memphis guard O.J. Mayo. It’s probably safe to say the Bulls would jump at the chance. The question is whether the Grizzlies would give up on Mayo while he’s still on his rookie contract.
No hot sauce?
by JustAnotherFan on Dec 28, 2010 6:27 AM CST up reply actions
At least McGraw admits that the Bulls would trade for Mayo and are interested in Smith
Whereas KC “The Human Wet Blanket” Johnson shit all over everything besides Courtney Lee.
Deng/Boozer/Noah: All your rebound are belong to us.
failure will be an option.
lmfao!
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
by Belize on Dec 28, 2010 11:30 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
new bab tag line
yfbb make it happen!!!!
chicago where failure will be an option!!
Sam Smith talking....
Courtney Lee for JJ and Bulls #1 around Feb on ESPN radio pre-game.
I’d take that deal over no deal at all and move Brewer into the starting lineup.
The #1 is unlikely to bear a starter, anyways
It should be around #20 or so, which is no sure thing for more than a rotation player in 2 years.
NBA sources tell us the Bulls are one of the most aggressive teams in the NBA trade market as they try to find a scoring guard who is a good fit with All-Star point Derrick Rose. USC coach Kevin O’Neill, a longtime college head coach and NBA assistant has experience with Stephen Jackson and O.J. Mayo, both of whom reportedly on the Bulls radar. “Jackson is a better shooter and probably is a better fit alongside Rose,” O’Neill said. “Mayo is more of a slasher and wants the ball in his hands to take it to the basket, which takes the ball out of Rose’s hands. (That’s why) Jackson is probably a better complement to Rose.” Chicago Tribune
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
I like S Jax, but who would we give up to make up that salary?
Watson or Brewer would have to be included in any scenario involving Jackson. People tend to focus on Jackson’s age and contract when it comes to any trade involving him. But what you have to keep in mind is the role we are going to ask him to play, which would be our 4th / 3rd option (depending if Deng wants to play that night or not).
He is a lockdown defender and a good shooter. Plus he is 6-8 and can play both wing positions. If we trade for him we will basically be paying for this year and the next. His last year he will be an expiring deal, which is still very valuable in this league. I don’t expect a huge drop off of his stat next year since he will not be asked to do as much for us as he has to do in Charlotte.
With all that being said I still would rather get Mayo, but I would be fine with Jackson as well. And trust me any financial implications from a Jackson trade would not make Jerry let Rose walk lets be real with ourselves (K.C).
Rose 2010!!!!!
I think it all comes down to this
Jackson’s contract is so bad that Charlotte really should have to throw in something else of value into the deal. If they’re willing to throw in DJ Augustin or a 2016 1st round pick (only half-joking), then it’d be worth giving up a package of Taj + Brewer + Watson or something like that. If it’s just Jackson coming, then it’s just a bad trade.
Pat Riley is the devil.
If the Bulls include Taj in a trade for Jackson then that's dumb.
I doubt Pax is desperate to make a move that bad. However I would be will to part with Brewer, JJ, Scal (cap-filler) and their original pick (Maybe) to make a deal work.
Rose 2010!!!!!
And he's not that good of a defender, is he?
My impression of him was always that he was athletic enough to be a great defender but because of lack of effort or some other reason, he never really put everything together on that end.
Pat Riley is the devil.
Who Jackson?
He has a career 107 DRtg, which means he’s good, I guess not a stat guy. Plus he has a career average of 2 spg. No big drop off this year either he has a 108 DRtg and is averaging 2 spg.
Rose 2010!!!!!
For some reason people don’t realize Jackson is a good player.
News flash: Luol Deng is good...We now return you to your regularly scheduled hating...
I know he's good
But is he a lockdown defender? Is he an all-star level player? The answer to both questions is no, I think. He’s almost certainly on the downside of his career, he has questionable shot selection, and he’s got a bad contract.
Pat Riley is the devil.
There are no lockdown defenders in the league…that idea of a true lockdown defender is pretty much a myth to me. There are some guys that make it harder to score yeah but as far as locking down their opponent game after game….no
Everything is relative
By “lockdown defender” I mean a guy who’s one of the top 10 or so wing defenders in the league. I don’t think Jackson’s even close to that level.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 29, 2010 10:56 AM CST up reply actions
Bogans isn't a lockdown defender but he somehow starts
I still think Brewer is a better defender than Jackson and washup Bogans
We don't need an all-star player at the 2.
We have 2 All-Stars on our roster already and another who probably would have made the team except for injury. We need a scoring threat a the 2 guard position and someone who could defend.
Rose 2010!!!!!
Well the better the player is at scoring and defending, the better, right?
And I just don’t think jacksons that good at either of those things at this point. He’s a very talented scorer but his shot selection is questionable which is evidenced by his low scoring efficiency. He’s doing more harm than good if he ends up chucking bad jumpers and taking possessions away from rose and boozer. And regarding his defense, he’s never been that great and he’s probably lost a step.
Pat Riley is the devil.
its just the indiana brawl that has haunted him
people think he’s less of what he is
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
And the subsequent gun shots
…outside the club and being sited for a felony…
He was a good player at one time, but he is on the downside of his career…not sure if he would be willing to accept the fifth banana role on a team.
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 29, 2010 12:53 PM CST up reply actions
if he doesnt mind playing in charlotte
im sure he’ll love it. Plus he played that role with the Spurs really good. He def lost a step or two, but the man is a warrior and Im sure he’ll fit in perfectly with Noah Rose and Booz
"I’m stupid, but I won’t get my drama on/what I’m dealing with is too real for me to comment on" - Yeezy
From the Stephen Jackson
Mainstream media outlets generally portray Jackson in a negative way, highlighting the fact that, in the past five years, he has been charged with felony criminal recklessness and a number of misdemeanors, including assault, disorderly conduct, and two counts of battery.33
Some sources identify Jackson in a more positive manner. Former teammate Tim Duncan once labeled Jackson as the “ultimate teammate” during his days in San Antonio. ESPN analyst and sportswriter Michael Smith finds Jackson to be “articulate, charming, and thoughtful.”34 Lang Whitaker, executive editor of Slam Magazine, states Jackson is “one of my favorite players, after all.”35
Marcus Thompson of the Contra Costa Times conveys his opinion as such: “He takes the younger players under his wing, taking them shopping, dispensing advice, lending an ear. What’s more, he does the little things that are unbecoming of a millionaire thug. He looks people in the eye when they talk to him, as if he cares about what they’re saying. He frequently doles out handshakes, half-hugs and, to women, pecks on the cheek. He returns phone calls. He mends fences, lifts spirits, makes others feel special.”36 Gwen Knapp, of the San Francisco Chronicle states “He couldn’t have been more charming or more engaged, the perfect face of the franchise.”37
Former coaches Rick Carlisle and Don Nelson have constantly referred to Jackson’s high character. On the Jim Rome show, Nelson stated Jackson is not simply a good person in the limited world of the NBA, but one of the finest people he has ever known.38 Former Pacers executive Donnie Walsh, who was principally responsible for the Golden State trade, stated “I love Jack to death. He’s emotional and he’s going to get technicals. But that’s just part of the package. He’s a great team guy.”39
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 29, 2010 3:52 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
That didn't look right...
You get the idea…Wikipedia and all…
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
that was awesome man
"Half the time I’m in the cut/dont want you to notice me/roll with me and you’ll see that I’m only awkward socially" - Joe Budden
Stephen Jackson is a great dude
he is the kind of guy that has your back in a fist fight, or a knife fight, or a gun fight, or a fight with fans, or a fight with your girlfriend, or if you want take on those two guys maddoggin you at the club, or that one guy who rolled his eyes at the White Hen that one time you came in all stoned and tried to steal something- he’s your man. He is always eager to have a friend’s back.
Both the negative and positive can be true.
by Basketball Smurf on Dec 29, 2010 5:00 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That's all very nice
But unnecessary… Nobody here was questioning his character. The issues with jackson are his bad shot selection, age and contract.
Pat Riley is the devil.
by Poloplaya14 on Dec 29, 2010 6:15 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m sure Jackson is a nice stand up guy besides the bad press but at this point is his career he appears to be a chucker. I’m sure of that is bc he has to the 1st option of a shitty offensive Charlotte team…maybe on a better team he would show more discretion. His age and contract are my main issues with S Jax.
While I am not much of a Mayo fan...
I figured out this trade in another thread….thoughts?
Is this even a basketball game anymore, or am I watching a referee themed television show? -Juiceboxjerry
Good God No
Boozer for Z-Bo really? Boozer’s looked amazing next to Rose.
No, No, No. I know Mayo’s a big upgrade over Bogans, but we have no reason to get Z-Bo and trade our PF, especially when he’s fitting in very nice and looking like a superstar (not just an all star).
No thanks.
It's almost 2011 Bulls. Let's Get Grimy!!!
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