List of 10 Biggest Draft Busts Missing a Bunch of Bulls Players
by bullhockey on Aug 26, 2009 9:43 PM CDT
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How is it that Ball Don't Lie puts up a list of the 10 biggest draft busts of all time and only one Bull gets mentioned by name?
Of course, the Bull happens to be Marcus Fizer, whose "bust" value started really high and just kept getting higher. Here's a guy who came to the Bulls at #4, at the same position as their rookie-of-the-year #1 overall in an ill-fated plan to trade him, before the other team (allegedly the Pacers--in a deal for J. O'Neal) backed out. Although a big man, he didn't rebound. Although a scorer, he didn't seem to shoot that well, and he played on the all-bust teams of the Tim Floyd era.
But what about Curry, Crawford, Chandler and Trent Hassel? What about Dalibor Bagarich and Dragan Tarlac? For goodness sake, what about Brad Sellers? Even our low draft picks seemed to be high profile, and bad. AJ Guyton? Khalid El-Amin and Jake Voskuhl, anyone? Jay Williams almost wasn't a bust, but he kind of rode his motorcycle into bust status as well. Artest wasn't quite a bust, but he was so batsh*t crazy that the Bulls had to dump him.
Hopes were so unrealistically high for us as Bulls fans that it wasn't clear whether we were getting the sales job before these guys were drafted or after they were on the team. But hopes aren't unrealistically high anymore. I think we are right to demand that our drafts show some results. Here we are, 10 plus years post-Jordan, on our second rookie-of-the-year and our, what, 6th or 8th rebuilding plan? All of those high draft picks and not one Amare Stoudamire or Gilbert Arenas or Tony Parker or Manu Ginobili, not one diamond in the rough who was better than our hopes.
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Chandler and Crawford
are not busts…
by In Walks Rudy on Aug 26, 2009 10:21 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
It has got to be Curry
as In Walks Rudy states, Chandler and Crawford (especially Chandler) are not bust. They may not be as good as their draft position, but both guys have been productive on multiple teams for a while now.
I find it hard to call Jay Williams a bust too, because he got unexpectedly injured. Although, by far, the Bulls got the least out of Jay Williams and he had the most hype.
by Basketball Smurf on Aug 26, 2009 10:44 PM CDT reply actions
Considering Eddy Curry went to my school
It sure hurts to know how terrible he was.
And let me tell you, he was a dumbass. Lol.
by Stacey_Is_King on Aug 26, 2009 10:59 PM CDT reply actions
im goin with jay williams
technically he aint a bust..but he busted his ass and busted our rebuilding process..so that´s a bust imo
The only way you can avoid making a mistake is not to make a decision . Our Owner´s philosophy-
Tyrus Thomas!!!
…too soon?
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Aug 27, 2009 4:38 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I'm pretty sure Tyrus qualifies as a bust more than any of those guys mentioned above
Wasn’t Eddie Curry averaging close to 20 ppg at one time with the Knicks? Or maybe his last year with the Bulls? I don’t know, Jay Williams would qualify if his lack of contribution was actually basketball-related. But the rest of the guys do not qualify as busts. Underachievers, yes. But not busts.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 27, 2009 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions
if only we could look such things up somewhere!
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Aug 27, 2009 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
2006-2007
Curry averaged 19.5 ppg for the Knicks:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/curryed01.html
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 27, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions
I guess if you count basketball as being all about scoring.
Tyrus Thomas is better than Curry, looking at advanced statistics.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/thomaty01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/curryed01.html
I support the Tornado Release [See: Joakim Noah]
Hmm... I don't know which stats your're going by but
Curry had higher points per 36 numbers as well as a higher offense rating. Which numbers were you looking at?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 27, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh, I was going by win shares.
Curry’s better at offense, sure, but he’s like a pole on defense. NBA players have the ability to “turn” and “run fast”, which is detrimental for him.
I support the Tornado Release [See: Joakim Noah]
win shares is an absolute garbage statistic
Curry was a better scorer in every way and Tyrus is better at every other facet of the game in every way. Neither is too good though
by Basketball Smurf on Aug 28, 2009 2:09 AM CDT up reply actions
Oh I definitely agree that Tyrus is better at defense and rebounding
I suppose my main point was that no player that averages 20 ppg in a season (and abover 16 in a couple others) should be considered one of the 10 biggest draft busts ever.
I guess my expectations for Tyrus were so high because I really wanted Aldridge leading up to that draft and was shocked when we took him. And then extremely disappointed when we immediately traded him.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 28, 2009 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think Win Shares is too good,
but it was the advanced statistic on the page that supported me. I didn’t want to, you know, do “work” or something.
I support the Tornado Release [See: Joakim Noah]
He was pretty good that season
He even hit a 3 point buzzer beater to beat Milwaukee in one of the last games of that season that buzzer beater plus the David Lee buzzer beater is the reason why we didnt have Portlands or Seattle/OKC pick. I live in the area and watch the Knicks in one hour on gamenights its the only NBA on at 1 am and they condense the whole game into one hour. Hes no bust, if he was healthy and on a contender like Orlando, Boston or Cleveland hed be a nice piece.
Too bad he's more often than not on the Jerome James meal plan.
Part of what makes him a bust is the choice that he’s made to not be in condition to play. He’s supposedly losing weight this off-season, but we’ve heard that before.
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
If you read the story, the "busts" are people who have contributed ZERO to their teams and are out of the league asap.
All the big-name guys you mentioned above contributed or started, and averaged respectable #‘s at one time in their careers. Some still do. So I wouldn’t call them busts. Underachievers? Sure. But compared to the guys in the article, Fizer is the only bust, and Williams is clearly the unfortunate soul (or IMHO, absolute idiot).
by smash! on Aug 27, 2009 6:14 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I was thinking the same thing
All of those guys (exclude jwill) had at one point be reasonable…curry lead the league in fg%, chandler right before we traded him was looking like the player the bulls had envisioned, and crawford…well he was a number 7 pick who was puttin up around 17ppg by his 4th season..not bad..but nothing to boast about… i cant say one was a bust… they just sucked compaired to what we had all expected..at least we didnt draft desagana diop or adam morrison
and ps- i liked Khaled El-amin, fat little guy could play, but he was fat and little, what were we expecting when Chicago drafted him?
eh
joe smith is considered a bust, being a former number 1 pick, hes a solid player still and started for the bulls and plays minutes for the cavs….kwame brown is still in the league and playing for some poor team (oh yea the pistons….i dont feel so bad anymore) and he is probably one of the biggest busts ever…so i dont know about this dissapearing from the league asap qualifier or never starting qualifier…i rather consider a bust to be a lottery pick who contributes like a late first rounder or worse…
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
It's not what I consider a bust, it's what the general qualifications were in this article we're talking about.
And Brown was on the list. He might not be out of the league but that’s only bc he still has the “#1 draft pick” allure so someone is willing to give him something small and see if he’s worth a bench slot. Same with Darko. Their certainly not contributing anything though and they’ll be out soon enough.
I wouldn’t call Smith a bust… he’s a solid player who’s been in the league 14 years, has a career scoring avg in double digits, and even had a year (96) when he averaged 19ppg. I’d call him a disappointment at #1 I guess, but that wasn’t a particularly strong draft (Garnett, Wallace & Finley were the only notables taken after him and Garnett was a risk back then as taking kids out of hs wasn’t the norm).
Agreed.
I’ve always kind of liked Joe’s game. Not as a #1 overall pick obviously, but I think he could have been a great starting PF on a contending team in his prime. I could have seen him fitting in very well on those Spurs teams in the early 2000s.. Oh well.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 28, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions
None of those Bulls belong in top 10 busts
Curry performed well enough as a bull to be a valuable trade chip, and then netted even more in the trade.
A bust is someone who doesn’t provide value to his team and Curry paid off in spades.
Jay williams is the only one who didn’t provide value, but I don’t know if a career ending injury belongs in the same discussion as being without skill like Fizer.
completely agreed
…nothing else to add
left shark - "Kirk needs to go and join Ben Gordon and L Deng somewhere else trade Deng and Hinrich they no good"
by NormVanBeer on Aug 27, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
man...
thats a way better definition than i thought up…i agree with it…
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
Adam Morrison :-(
Such a bad 2006 draft pick. Really bad!
Morrison and Tyrus should have fell definitely out of the lottery to positions later in the draft.
After seeing adam morrison quit, fall to his knees and cry like a baby because he couldn’t sink any shots with xx seconds remaining on the clock and his team still in a winnable NCAA tourn. game?
Proved he was major loser, and he’ll probably be a Bull soon or later
"I tried being reasonable, I didn't like it."
"Go ahead, make my day"
"We boil at different degrees"
"A good man always knows his limitations"
"You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?"
by exult463 on Aug 27, 2009 6:10 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Morrison…now that is a bust. How did he get picked so high…
Smith is not a bust, he’s never became a star but not all #1 picks do. He contributed for every team he ever played on.
Brown and Milicic are both still in the league b/c they can both provide defensive value. Both suck offensively but Kwame has become an above average post defender and Milicic can block shots. If you are tall and can play D, you will always have a job in the NBA
Had to pick Jay
He crushed us his pick set us back pretty far. The Tyrus Thomas draft night fiasco was pretty bad I knew LaMarcus would of fit in better instantly with the corpse but the fact that Tyrus and Noah were actually had for a #3 pick I cant say that hurt the team the most because Noah is best out of the 3 but having Noah and LaMarcus alongside of Derrick Rose would of been sweet.
We probably wouldn't have gotten Rose if we'd picked LaMarcus though... :)
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 28, 2009 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions
pretty sure you guys won that one...
Steven Hill's "PER" last year was 88.54… His beard alone had a PER of 42.15...
by In Walks Rudy on Aug 28, 2009 9:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Still in retrospect I'd settle for brandon roy and gordon in backcourt (kirk as bkup)
even as much as I like Rose. Even better, if I could dream then Roy & Rose (RR connection)
Then Rudy would probably be starting, instead of presently hid behind Roy.
"I tried being reasonable, I didn't like it."
"Go ahead, make my day"
"We boil at different degrees"
"A good man always knows his limitations"
"You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?"
The part talking point is that
LaMarcus Aldridge is the next Joe Smith. You’re not agreeing?
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that
I don’t think the book is closed on LaMarcus, and he’s got a shot to be better than Joe (or at least be on some better teams). But as of right now, that’s a pretty accurate comparison.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Aug 31, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Actually, it is funny how that view is accepted as gospel on here.
I think LMA is already more dynamic and more fun to watch than Joe S. ever was. I know that the view on here is that their shot distributions are very similar, but I always note it when LMA is using a back-to-the-basket move. I don’t really remember Joe doing that very much.
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
I think LMA is a better Joe Smith at the moment, with gobs of potential.
I also think that the one thing he currently brings consistently is fairly inefficient volume shooting, and that he doesn’t have the drive or impetus to get better.
That’s never a good thing …
I support the Tornado Release [See: Joakim Noah]
ronnie lester was pretty much a wasted draft pick
the bulls had some other great ones. Sidney green was drafted with two other players in the first round and they ball were busts. I think enis whatley was one of the other ones and i forget who the third pick of that draft class. making one bad draft pick in the first round is bad, but when you make three in one year ..ouch
If you dont like me please ignore me and my posts
The Pirates,Reds,Royals, and Padres are not major league teams
Dalibor Bagaric 2000 was the worst recent 1st rounder
Redd was a second round pick that year. Bulls had 6 picks in one of the worst drafts of recent memory.
Old schooler’s will appreciate the following names from the championship years: (all first rounders!)
Corey Benjamin 1998
Keith Booth 1997
Travis Knight 1996
Mark Randall 1991
I know that none of these guys were high picks… but they were all busts, and each year there were other quality guys we could have drafted.
Biggest bust (after Fizer) from a high round pick is Stacy King in 1989. We wasted a #6 pick on him and he was a career backup. He was OK, but we got BJ later in the draft and he had a longer career. Others drafted after King and before Armstrong were: Nick Anderson, Mookie Blaylock, Tim Hardaway, Dana Barros, Shawn Kemp…. Divac was drafted at the end of the first round and we drafted Jeff Sanders instead! Oops.
Pre-Jordan, Sidney Green was a #5 draft choice in ‘83… and major bust! Quinton Dailey was drafted #7 the year before… There were other REALLY bad picks in the late 70’s-early 80’s. But I don’t really remember watching any of them, so I can’t really comment on them…
Our beloved Bullies have a lot of bad picks in there! But then again, so do most other teams.
by 72-10 on Aug 31, 2009 1:19 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Armstrong?
Wasn’t Tate Armstrong a #1 pick? There’s also a Chicago connection for the biggest bust of all time — Larue Martin since he played at Loyola.
by El Toro de Goro on Aug 31, 2009 5:37 PM CDT up reply actions
And I almost forgot John Laskowski. God, I’ve been around a long time.
by El Toro de Goro on Aug 31, 2009 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions
I just looked up Larue Martin's stats
Wow…. worse than Kwame Brown! Impressive memory… though I guess it’s tough to forget a guy that bad! He really stands out.
Yeah, Tate Armstrong was a first round pick… #13 in ’77. It is amazing how bad the Bulls were at drafting back in the day!
Chandler
Doesn’t really deserve a mention in an all time list. Heck he’s been a billion times better than Kwame #1 Brown….would have been nice if he was Pau Gasol, but Chandler when healthy is a VERY GOOD role playing big time elite defender….just ain’t healthy enough.
He’s every bit as solid as Okafor, but doesn’t have the UCONN name behind him….and while Okafor scores more, he also forces a lot of shots that would be better suited going to more gifted offensive talents. Chandler’s more athletic and the better defender of the 2….
Thurston Moore is a rock god
BTW
Jay Williams was a huge bust. He was on all the sports cover mags as the guy to bring Chicago back, and while he got hurt so we’ll never know for sure, he didn’t seem to have it quite to the expectations as a rookie, and well….HE GOT FREAKING HURT outside of bball setting the org back quite a bit.
Curry was all hype but he at least played well enough for some of that hype when he was in shape
Thurston Moore is a rock god
I remember a tripple double game Williams had...
where he looked incredible. He definitely showed flashes of greatness…. obviously we’ll never know how good he could have been. His game was based on quickness, so there was no way he was coming back after that accident…. I don’t remember him as a good shooter, but that is something a player can develop.
Been so long I barely remember...
He just seemed so bust like coming with such high expectations and then the next year when we had Kirk, I thought Kirk was better as a rookie than Williams was as a rookie….and so I pegged Williams as bust like even though like you said we wouldn’t know had he not been injured.
Also, Duhon had a triple double I think in year 2…..sometimes it happens….
Thurston Moore is a rock god
guys, despite the fact that
this is cited as biggest busts of all time, it’s just biggest busts of the decade.
and it’s also LOTTERY PICKS ONLY.
that’s why a guy like trenton hassell (whose career isn’t bad for a second rounder) isn’t going to be on there.
none of the guys named are busts really, just disappointments pretty much. but they provided at least some value.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
I was limiting it to first round picks
But if you want to say lottery picks, I’m fine with that. I mentioned a few in my comment earlier. Stacy King was the biggest bust I can remember but there were worse before Jordan. The ’89 draft was a great draft (one of the best in the last 30 years) We could have chosen about a dozen players better than King with the number 6 pick.
If you’re limiting to the last 10 years, then Jay Williams is the biggest bust because we only got 1 year out of him. But do you define a career ending injury as a bust? If you do, then he’s at least as big a bust as Fizer.
i'm just saying that's what the article is
top 10 lottery busts of the last decade. it’s not the top 10 biggest busts of all time…
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
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