Trade idea: Kirk for Rudy
by Unrealcity on Jul 3, 2009 6:14 PM CDT
41 comments
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=m24a5j
Portland is said to now have a verbal agreement with Hedo and Rudy is pissed. I know that some other people have also mentioned this in some of the threads, but I think it deserves its own FanPost. I think we can agree that we all are pissed and that something needs to happen before the beginning of the year to make this team more competitive. And I am sick and tired of hearing about everyone else improving while we regress. I don't want to just do something so we can say we did something, but we can't stay pat when everyone else around us is getting better and we were already only mediocre. So, let's finally make a deal happen with Kirk and the Trailblazers. Everyone knows they need a defensive PG and that they love Kirk. We are now in desperate need of a SG. So...
Portland Trailblazers get Kirk Hinrich
Chicago Bulls get Rudy Fernandez, Steve Blake, and Travis Outlaw
Blazers
Hinrich / Bayless
Roy / Webster
Turkoglu / Batum
Aldridge / Frye
Pryzbilla / Oden
That's a nice looking team. A pretty good mix of vets and young guys across the board. No one is too old though. This is a 60 win team next year.
Bulls
Rose / Blake
Salmons / Fernandez
Deng / Outlaw
Thomas / James Johnson
Noah / Miller
Let me say that Hinrich is one of my favorite players on the Bulls. But I care way more about the Bulls than any one player. And I think we have a much better team with this trade. And if Deng does have lingering problems with his leg, Rudy moves to the starting 2 and Salmons to the starting 3. If only we had DeJuan Blair as our back up 4 I'd be happy. That one's on you GAR!
A word to the Blazers fans that will inevitably be on this thread. We need more for our Captain than two back up scrubs. I know you'll say that they aren't scrubs, but they are just serviceable. You are not getting anywhere in the playoffs with Blake as your starting PG and we're not giving up one of our best players for two mediocre backups. Yes, Kirk is a backup now as well, but only because he is behind one of the most exciting young players in the NBA. He was behind Chris Paul on Team USA, but he still played and played well. You're not going to ever see Blake or Outlaw on that team. No, I am not saying Kirk is just behind Paul, just that he is ahead of Blake and Outlaw, by a good deal, IMO. And the point is, you get better.
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Have been hoping we could pull off a trade for Rudy
for a long time now. This makes it a bit more likely. Now we just have to convince Pritchard
by reprisal on Jul 3, 2009 6:36 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agree
Blake and Outlaw together don’t have the same value of Hinrich. But I kind of understand the love the Blazers fans have for Rudy. The guy is to likeable for not wanting him on our team or to see him in a trade. But if we are going to trade Hinrich to the Blazers now, Rudy has to be included. It doesn’t make sense just try to get cap space when you can also add a good player and, more importantly, a nice substitute for Gordon
by bull83 on Jul 3, 2009 6:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The ideal trade for the Bulls, of course, would be this one
Bulls get: Bosh and Rudy
Portland: Hinrich
Toronto: Blake, Outlaw, Tim Thomas and Tyrus Thomas
But only in my dreams, of course
by bull83 on Jul 3, 2009 6:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So Toronto essentially gets
a whole lot of nothing for Bosh, the only player worth anything that they’d receive is Tyrus. We would probably have to include Deng to Toronto as well for that to work. So we get Bosh and Rudy for Kirk, Deng, and TT (and TiT but he doesn’t really count). I could live with that.
"One time I went to a social gathering, I brought a bottle of Tanqueray and a shotgun and showed those motherf&#@ers the best time they ever had!"- Kenny Powers (Eastbound and Down)
"Why give 100% when 35 can still get you paid and laid."- Kenny Powers
by gridiron_assassin on Jul 4, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Portland wont trade Rudy for Hinrich straight up
Forget about it!
by We-B-Dunkin on Jul 4, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not saying they would for sure
but how do you know they wouldn’t? It’s not like we’re talking about trading one of our scrubs for an all star. Kirk is a starter on over half the teams in the league and would undoubtedly be an upgrade for Portland at PG. Fernandez is at best maybe the 3rd, and potentially 4th or 5th, most important player on that team. Kirk plays better D, can bring the ball up and run the offense, and is just as good of a shooter, if not even better.
I think the reason everyone assumes Fernandez can’t be had in a trade is because he’s quite popular among the fans, but he’s not necessarily that great of a player.
"One time I went to a social gathering, I brought a bottle of Tanqueray and a shotgun and showed those motherf&#@ers the best time they ever had!"- Kenny Powers (Eastbound and Down)
"Why give 100% when 35 can still get you paid and laid."- Kenny Powers
by gridiron_assassin on Jul 4, 2009 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How about the next time you post about a trade YOU made up,
don’t be so misleading with the title. Jeez,
by dakoose on Jul 3, 2009 6:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed
I fixed it.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 3, 2009 7:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would the Blazers do this?
Those are three solid contributers for a point guard who may not be much better than what they already have. Not to mention, they obviously got Hedo because they think he can handle the ball.
My guess is that their eventual point guard will be someone who can shoot the three and score with out the ball.
by McCabe on Jul 3, 2009 8:13 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And Kirk can shoot the 3 and score without the ball.
He is a combo guard who is a good defender. That sounds about perfect to me.
by Unrealcity on Jul 4, 2009 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd love this one
Every since the reports saying Rudy’s not happy, I’ve been hoping that the unpossible will now be more possible.
This would be a net for both clubs…
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jul 3, 2009 8:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
ESPN has been reporting Rudy' unhappiness.
Local reporters and interviews with Rudy in Spain have given a different picture. Nonetheless, with Turkoglu on his way to Canada, it doesn’t really matter anymore.
Portland fans would still love to get Hinrich, but I don’t know how it works if Chicago wants more than 2010 cap relief.
However, we might be able to take Deng off of your hands with the money Turkoglu didn’t take. That could leave you with about 11-14 million in guaranteed salary in the summer of 2010, if you renounce everyone who can be and don’t sign anyone to anything that goes that far. I think. ?
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They're both terrible contracts, take your pick.
We’ll need more cap space than that anyway
by Ariel112 on Jul 3, 2009 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How about both?
I might be way off base, but this is how I am looking at things.
(Contract info via Storyteller’s Contract Site) Contracts on Chicago’s books the summer of 2010:
Kirk Hinrick 9,000,000
Luol Deng 11,345,000
John Salmons (ETO) 5,808,000
Derrick Rose 5,546,160
Tyrus Thomas (QO) 6,236,806
Joakim Noah 3,128,536
James Johnson 1,428,000
Taj Gibson 931,400
2010 1st round pick: ?
Total: 43,423,902 (+ cost of first round pick)
That alone is enough to add a near max player, but it’s close. However, if Chicago is a destination for free agents, you might be interested in making more room.
Blake + Outlaw (both expire next summer) for Hinrich drops you total salary to 34,423,902 (+1 first rounder) in 2010.
Not extending the Qualifying Offer to Thomas drops your salary to 28,187,096 in 2010. Not sure if you want to do that, but it is a possibility.
John Salmons may figure that he’s worth more than $5.8 million and opt out, dropping your salary to 22,379,096 (+1 rd.). That’s just enough to sign two max free agents to pair with Rose, Noah and Deng.
Find a way out from under Deng in 2010 and you have a mere 11 million (+1 rd.) in salary committed for the biggest free agent market in years. That makes Chicago more attractive than New York or New Jersey, that’s for sure. This is where Portland’s cap space comes in. Deng’s Salary this year is 10,365,000. That’s going to be pretty close to how much we could be under the cap and about how much we were going to offer Turkoglu.
That would leave you with Rose, Salmons, Thomas, Noah, Miller, Blake, Outlaw, Johnson and Gibson. A pretty big hole at SG unless Salmons goes over there full time. One might might be available with the mid-level exception (do you guys still have that this year?), if they were willing to take a one year deal. Pry Von Wafer from Houston for a year maybe? Not a great team, but certainly not a bottom dweller either. Enough to make Chicago an attractive place for free agents next summer, I would think.
This is just my pet idea. It probably has no basis in reality. But it’s fun to talk about anyway.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well written, I actually read this on Blazers Edge too.
This is a great idea, probably one of the more realistic trades to get rid of our big contracts for 2010 but sounds way to good for our terrible management to pull off.
by Ariel112 on Jul 3, 2009 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I spent so much time writing it up that I'm getting my money's worth.
Have no idea if Portland would be interested or not.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I haven't heard anything about KP being interested in Deng,
and the Hinrich talk has been going on forever, maybe it will happen in Feb.
by Ariel112 on Jul 3, 2009 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Portland ends up with more cap space if we wait until the beginning of the season.
Cap holds for our euro stash drop off on opening day until July 1st 2010 . February is definitely a possibility.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope so,
you guys could use some help with your defense ; )
by Ariel112 on Jul 3, 2009 11:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No doubt.
Although it picked up at the end of the season. We went from 20th all the way up to 13th in the course of a month. Still, if we have aspirations, we’ve got to get it higher than that, even with the most efficient offense in the playoffs last season. It doesn’t mean anything if we can’t stop anyone.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
True, you guys really picked up your game toward the end of the season.
Would’ve liked to see you all play better in the playoffs but your real task is keeping Oden healthy if you ever expect him to be effective.
by Ariel112 on Jul 3, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And out of foul trouble.
But recovering from microfracture takes time. And Corey Maggette’s knee didn’t help things. Fortunately, this summer has been spent regaining his lateral quickness, which he still didn’t have back last season, which is per usual for microfracture. So you are absolutely right, keeping Oden healthy is key for us. At least none of his injuries have been recurring or related.
μὴ φοβοῦ, μόνον πίστευε.
by T Darkstar on Jul 3, 2009 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hedo to TO
I think we end this discussion now.
by Stay Chisel on Jul 4, 2009 12:42 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Trade Rose for Brandon Roy
If trade Kirk for Rudy, why don’t we trade Rose for Roy, so that Rose and Roy can play together, and the bulls still get Roy (a top 10 player). I think this is the best for Rose also. LOL
by Calvin X on Jul 4, 2009 12:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
2012 Olympic team.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 4, 2009 2:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wipe the slate clean
Kirk + Lou to the Blazers (under the cap) for Blake, Rudy and the rights to Jeff Pendergraph.
Super cheap, with room for two max guys next year. Probably gonna suck, but at least they’ll suck cheaply and maybe get better.
1- Rose, Blake
2- Rudy, Salmons
3- Salmons, Johnson, Tyrus
4- Tyrus,TiT, Pendergraph, Gibson
5- Noah, Miller, Gray
by Sports2 on Jul 4, 2009 6:28 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
as ridiculous as this looks..
I wouldn’t be against it…a theme among the big-time FA’s is that they want to play with other great players. 2010 we could add Bosh/Amare (hopefully) and Joe Johnson…leaving our core Rose, JJ, Amare/Bosh, and Noah…I could get on board with that core..fill in a decent bench and we are instant contenders with ANYONE
by BooRad16 on Jul 4, 2009 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"a theme among the big-time FA’s is that they want to play with other great players."
and apparently a theme with Derrick Rose is that he can’t play with other great players.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 4, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah pass first 21 year old PG franchise players are totally unappealing
The pessimism of Blog a Bull is at an all time high which is saying something.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
by pookeyguru on Jul 5, 2009 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We have an owner who treats the Bulls as a cash cow (pun intended)
to fund his baseball team.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 5, 2009 4:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.......not really
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 5, 2009 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
YFBB's jst saying
that Rose is apparently “such a horrible fit” with Gordon.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 6, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We're really going to have to push big time to get James Johnson to play the 4
He says he’s a 3. He says he told the Bulls he is a 3. The only skills he maintains to be a 4 is a good shooting stroke, the weight, the strength, but he lacks any low post game and whenever asked he insists he’s not a power forward.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 4, 2009 9:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
we could just forget the development
and trade for his future, Travis Outlaw, now :-p
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 4, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm all for it.
Our organization couldn’t develop a head cold properly.
They certainly can’t develop NBA talent.
Lord... please let the Bears pick a good WR at #49....
by kidronmusic on Jul 4, 2009 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
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