Ben Gordon is a Piston. We're stuck being Bulls fans.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:32 PM CDT
492 comments
Don't worry. I'm not going to do what everyone thinks I'm going to do...and just flip out.
I'm kidding, of course. Lets rant:
First, this is not a Detroit Pistons or a Ben Gordon blog. I can't dedicate much (now...this may be Blog-A-Ben for a few weeks) as to how the Pistons are better off after giving the former Bulls guard a 5 year, ~$55m contract, or how Gordon can be more successful (for himself and team-wise) there.
He sure did quite well for himself financially, and doesn't look so 'stupid' for turning down previous offers.
This is about the Bulls, the team we're unforunately obligated (in however weird way we justify it) to root for. How they completely bungled how to handle a young and very good player, to an unprecendented level.
And I mean unprecedented: last summer Ben Gordon was the best player (under the current rookie salary rules) ever to take the Qualifying Offer. And he's now the best player to walk from the organization that drafted him, 5 years ago.
I'm writing this before the Bulls and others spin (or at least before I read it) the logistics of his departure, but I've been fearing for months that it'd be a situation like this where Gordon took an offer quickly and there'd be no matching 'process' for the Bulls to undergo. The Bulls earned no right for Gordon to let them do so.
Or maybe he did give the Bulls a chance to match and they chose not to. It's certainly a rich deal, but an offer the Bulls should've made themselves.
Even if this contract, in a vacuum, is overpaying Gordon, this is what the Bulls risked by not signing him the previous two seasons. They talk all the time about the benefits of signing early extensions to hedge against injury (hello, Luol Deng!) or poor play (Kurt!). Well it goes the other way too: if the team doesn't get the extensions done early, they risk getting outbid. And apparently Ben Gordon is worth $11m a season, as it only takes one team to make it truth. And this isn't a true market where the Bulls can just go out and pay for a replacement. The Bulls knew this was a risk, and still lowballed (if you look at his negotiations in relation to Deng, Hinrich, and Noc) Gordon last summer, and then pulled the offer after Gordon accepted it.
(Read that last sentence again in case you feel your anger subsiding, that should do the trick to get it back.)
The fact that their payroll was already careerning towards the luxury tax line is a result of mistakes from the past. The Ben Wallace signing still lingers on this team in the form of dead money. Luol Deng received a bit more than he deserved, and that was when healthy. Kirk Hinrich became an overpaid backup the second the Bulls won the lottery. But that doesn't mean they have to try and rectify those mistakes by letting Gordon go. They have over $25m in expiring contracts (Miller/Thomas/James) coming off the books at the end of the year. That's one season of paying the luxury tax, after a decade of record profits fueled by sellout crowds watching rookie contracts.
Gordon's contract is for his prime seasons. There is a fairly high floor as to how he'll perform during that time. Say he's really a $9m player in terms of production. He's then overpaid a bit. He'd be on a Bulls team with other guys who are likely overpaid a bit under that standard. But on the court it's a lot of talent. And that's how you win a title, by having the best team. Not by having the least overpaid players.
All indications were that the basketball people in the Organization wanted to keep Gordon. It was the guy signing the checks who wasn't so sure. So what Jerry Reinsdorf's team (I should say his investment. The White Sox are his team) gets for 'not overpaying' Ben Gordon is...being worse. Not having a player to trade in a future move for a frontcourt star. Not having a player remaining after they package multiple players for that star. Let him go with nothing to show for themselves. No matter how they compensate with the current group it won't be as good as if they kept everybody.
And I can't see them doing anything the rest of this offseason if it means going over the tax, as then why not just keep Ben Gordon? What this non-move means is that the Bulls do not care about winning. Not this year. Likely not for several years. They are far away from contention, and it's simply amazing that they think they're in any position to let talent walk, let alone their best player of the past 5 years. They're signalling that they're content to take one shot in Derrick Rose's prime, which means we can't really give a care about anyone else on the roster. Maybe Luol Deng? Joakim Noah? They're already starting to do with Tyrus Thomas what happened with Gordon years ago. Everyone else is going to be gone by the time this team is going for a title. Not winning one, or competing for one, but merely having a plan to try and go for one.
(And they certainly do not have the coach (lowest paid in the league, mind you) that will get them any closer to that level. They don't even have a coach who can properly run the team to the level where we even know if their young players are good enough to keep.)
Why shouldn't I just wait for 2010 if this team clearly is? The Bulls can feel free to laugh back at me, since clearly I'm not so smart either after putting down a deposit for next year's (partial, please.) season tickets.
And if 2010 is the plan, really go for it. Deal Hinrich now for expirings. Tell us that this is a 'transition' (nicer way to say 'rebuilding' or 'going cheap, you suckers!'), talk a big game and wait for the full-boat free agents to come. This is a team that just told the league they do not like spending money on their best players. That's always an attractive quality in a franchise that's courting free agents. Just give me a minute while I get Benny and the Luvabulls before we head to the airport and greet the lucky fellas.
Wait, not a minute, a whole goddamned year.
11 recs |
492 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
This is some real good stuff,
and brought to light how poorly run this franchise has been since the Jordan/Pippen era.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 10:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
They weren't really run that great during the Jordan/Pippen era now were they?
We should have at least 7 championships… if not 8!
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good riddance
This selfish, undersized shooting guard who badmouted his own players after a spectacular playoff series against the Celtics won’t be missed! Save your tears for a more deserving player. The Pistons will soon find out what they bought, a pig in bag!
by SlamDunk on Jul 1, 2009 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BG doesn't have character issues
As far as we know, he’s been a perfect professional. If there’s anyone you need to be pissed at, it’s the management of our Bulls. The article that tells us Charlie V and BG are signing with the Pistons. THAT SHOULD BE US!
We are the ones that should be flirting with real free agents. With a REAL coach.
Seriously, Jerry. You’re a bum!
by Alighieri on Jul 1, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Bulls will pay 4 this. It'll be the Lottery next year.
I heard an NBA expert say a good team needs 2-3 good offensive players and at least two good defensive players to be a realy good team. The Bulls only had one, BG, a young very good offensive player. They had no good defensive players to compliment him. Hinrick was overated. He can’t guard anyone under 6’4. This cheap & pathetic organization knows exactly what they are doing. Pippin, Jordon, Jackson, Brand, Artest, Miller, and now Gordon. Gordon conducted himself very professionally for some very ignorant and ungrateful fans. I said ignorant because his 4th qt. FG% was consistently amongst the highest in the league. Well lets see how well 10 mil/yr backup pg Hinrick fares against him next year. I wish Gordon the best.
by sadafan on Jul 2, 2009 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When did he badmouth his own players?
What are you talking about?
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BG implied that
if the Bulls wanted to win they’d have to get better players or something. Makes some moves. Kinda like everyone has been saying here.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like this..
They have over $25m in expiring contracts (Miller/Thomas/James) coming off the books at the end of the year. That’s one season of paying the luxury tax, after a decade of record profits fueled by sellout crowds watching rookie contracts.
So true and not to mention VDN is cheap. This organization reeks of cheapness. Wow JR you fucking asshole!
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:43 PM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Mr. Chairman did pay company men
like Luol Deng and Kirk Hinrich.
Steward of the basketball arts the Chairman is not. Steward of profit making sold as a trustee of the basketball arts he is.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hehe
the first two lines are gold!!!
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 1, 2009 10:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm going to Milwaukee!
Who’s with me? Huh? Come on. Who’s coming with me?
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
To watch games?
I was thinking about it. Closer to me actually.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Same here, actually an easier drive to Milwaukee
But I took NBA Observer to mean he would become a Bucks fan. With how much hate and frustration he seems to feel toward the Bulls organization, it’s probably best for him to switch.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Milwaukee is pretty awesome city-wise.
I dunno about their team. Jennings is pretty awesome!
I think I’ll just watch all the teams I like from afar, and not have a real favorite.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't even know what else to say
That just summed up everything that I hate about this situation. I agree, why not just go for it and deal hinrich for expiring contracts and Tyrus for a future pick since they won’t pay him either when the time comes.
by bigballa10 on Jul 1, 2009 10:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If they don't care, I don't care!
Which is a lie of course…or is it??? Well written yfbb
by Renobull on Jul 1, 2009 10:46 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm with you buddy.
This whole situation sucks. I refuse to take down the 3 BG posters, that I have collected over the years from Bulls Eyes. BG will remain to be one of my favorite players. And with Rasheed and maybe Rip gone from Detroit. I might be able to start rooting for them as well.
by Edicus2288i on Jul 1, 2009 10:46 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ben and Tyrus were/are my favorite.
I fear for my future fandom.
by Bill Cartwright's Elbow on Jul 2, 2009 12:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If they deal Hinrich for expirings
then we’d have about $34 million under the cap space to go with Noah – Deng – Rose?
Rose
Wade
Deng
Bosh
Noah
CHAMPIONSHIP!!!!!! BOOK IT!!!
by patagonia on Jul 1, 2009 10:47 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
What happens when Bosh and or Wade want to do a sign-and-trade to get an extra ~$30 million?
Oops!!!
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 2, 2009 3:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon didn't get signed because the goal is to have a starting lineup of 4-letter-word players only.
See it all makes sense now.
by KentuckyBullsFan on Jul 2, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
And that's why Luol Deng is worth the big bucks!
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wade and bosh
would be nice to fill sg and pf … yes sir
WADE 2010
by Orange Juice on Jul 2, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
nice post
i agree: ditch Hinrich now for expirings you cheap bastards. One season in the Luxury Tax is gonna hurt your wallet Jerry?
FU
Sometimes a player's greatest challenge is coming to grips with his role on the team.
-- Scottie Pippen
by Orlando Woolridge on Jul 1, 2009 10:47 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Excellent rant
I particularly liked the part about how it would be the luxury tax for 1 year.
I also agree that I would have more respect if the Bulls absolutely nuked this team outside of Rose and possibly Noah. If you want to clear cap space, do it big and get a high lottery pick to boot. They have the right coach in place for that plan.
And it would actually be a plan rather than just slogging around with mediocrity and a slow descent into a bunch of lottery years even with Rose and then Rose bolting (otherwise known as the Clippers doctrine as promulgated by Donald Sterling).
The Bulls simply have horrible management. Until a GM and coach are in place that are competent, there’s really not much hope for a truly competitive team. What a waste of a franchise.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 10:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I didn't even think of the high lottery pick from a tanking season
it’s an obvious reason to start selling off anything of use.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's already a 2010 mock draft fanshot/post
I admit, I went there before reading this. I kinda knew what you were gonna say. Pretty level-headed actually. So, still a fan?
by Bill Cartwright's Elbow on Jul 2, 2009 12:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the GM is fine based on what I've seen, it's the ownership that needs replacing, and I don't see that happening.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't agree, if we assume that Gar=Pax
A good GM would have:
1) Not fallen in love with Kirk
2) Really not signed Deng to that contract when he obviously is not that kind of talent
3) Not let Gordon walk
4) Not whiffed on Aldridge and/or Roy
5) Not given away JR Smith
6) Not failed for YEARS to acquire some sort of low post scorer
7) Not lost Gordon for nothing
8) Managed to get a better coach in place. I know JR obviously meddled here and money was an issue, but a very good GM manages to make D’Antoni or Flip Saunders happen by selling the owner on it as well.
The Bulls roster construction has sucked for years and the coaching hire betrayed how there is no plan in place, despite there being a lot of “process”. A good GM can create a good team even with ownership issues.
Maybe I’m being too hard on Paxson and Gar. Goodness knows I probably wouldn’t grade out best in show in my job. But, on the other hand, they do get paid way more than me so I’m not going to fell too guilty…
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
We don't assume Gar=Pax.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
[Well, I'm not.]
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He may not be, in which case I don't have much data to evaluate him
Except that I think this draft was poor. Johnson, on paper, is a defensible pick. Gibson is not. Especially if you know BG is gone, how can you not take Ellington to back up Salmons and provide some %#^$! shooting? I can only assume they think that’s covered with Kirk which is a bad sign.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why don't you think Hinrich can be an effective backup 2?
As far as backup guards go, he’s as good as it gets.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 2, 2009 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kirk is fine backing up the guards
But
1) You don’t pay a backup what Kirk get paid
2) If the bulls want to get better big time in 2010, clear room for 2 max offers plus a lottery pick…dealing Kirk helps do that.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 8:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But he's not just backing up one guard
he backs up two and plays 30-35 min/game
by hlac on Jul 2, 2009 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's still waaaaaaaay overpaid.
But if the Bulls do decide to keep him around, I have no problem seeing him get 30 minutes off the bench.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 2, 2009 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
True, Kurt is way overpaid now
but when he signed the contract, he was the starting PG and his contract is reasonable for a legit starter who has many tools in his toolbox (even if not one of the tools is “high-end”).
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 3:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's arguable.
He was definitely a little overpaid at the time, although the contract is frontloaded, so it’s not the worst contract ever.
by Poloplaya14 on Jul 2, 2009 4:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
JR signed Deng to that deal. The JR Smith thing was a Skiles thing as much as anything. Pax (and Gar, presumably)
made efforts to get a post scorer, but JR refused to pay the tax to facilitate deals (namely Pau Gasol and he’s making the same grumblings re: Amare).
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those White Sox rings were cheap also!
I’m sorry classy I think they called them.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I rec this, if that makes sense it's already up?
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:50 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
reply fail
i don't really consider a raspberry from sliding into home an injury
by U-God on May 31, 2009 4:22 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions 0 recs
by Where Triples Go to Die on Jul 11, 2009 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tsk Tsk Tsk
Such negativity.
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jul 1, 2009 10:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I will wait to be positive
when they do something positive. I am done with potential, mysterious plans, and versatile (aka mediocre) players being championed. Until something good comes from this I am assuming it won’t. They used up all of my benefit of the doubt last summer.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agree 100%
All this 2010 plan they that say they have could be all bullshit. I want to see some moves, and fast. Otherwise, I’ll ask for GarPaxDorf head…
by bull83 on Jul 2, 2009 5:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
as unhappy as us Bulls fans are...
in losing Gordon it looks like most Piston fans are just as unhappy in overspending for him… Rip hates coming off the bench, as does Ben,,, do they play Rip at the 3 and then Prince at the 4?
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Jul 1, 2009 10:52 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Wow. A lose-lose situation!!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jul 1, 2009 10:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben never complained about coming off the bench.
They can still trade Rip.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Apparently they informed Ben that he would be a super sub
Which is fine to him, I would bet, when the person in front of him is Rip Hamilton and not Thabo Sefolosha. Nothing against Thabo, but …
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or Chris Duhon
He was more professional than many players would have been if Chris Duhon was starting over them.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 11:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
Who else started over BG. … Hum. I can’t remember. Perhaps I’ve blocked it out.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stuckey to the bench
Put your best two guards in. Not the greatest handlers, but they’ll be passable.
by Bill Cartwright's Elbow on Jul 2, 2009 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really do want to see this though.
Gordon as PG is … just fun.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 2:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dumars can just beat up Rip
with his own stat sheet. Although Michael Curry is now gone, Rip was a better performer off the bench than he was as a starter.
I’d be surprised if Detroit keeps Rip, but if they do BG will start and Rip will come off the bench.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Last bit of hope
To begin with, I, too, am distraught over the likely loss of Ben Gordon. I do think there is a slim possibility that the Bulls still sign him, though. I believe that upon being given the 5 year 55M offer from the Pistons, Gordon had no choice but to say that he accepts it. By doing so, he kept the Pistons offer solid for the next week while signaling to the Bulls that they better call him and match the Pistons offer before July 8th (when he can officially sign). Therefore, in my opinion, the Bulls will only lose Gordon if they are committed to not paying the Luxury Tax this year and do not believe they can swing trades to get below it with Gordon on the hook for around 10 million this year. With that in mind, I am about 90% confident that the Bulls will let the Pistons offer be their justification for not pursuing Gordon fully under the guise that they weren’t going to overpay for his services. Hopefully JR surprises us all and tries to pay back us fans for our years of buying tickets to watch low payroll, bad, teams.
by smashbrickley on Jul 1, 2009 10:55 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
sorry man
it’s over :-/
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know, but I can hope for one more week.
Cant I?
by smashbrickley on Jul 1, 2009 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe the Pistons lose money and have to shutdown their franchise in the next week.
We can only dream!
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:31 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's a slim chance
Detroit as a city doesn’t make it to July 8th.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
No, your best hope is that somehow, someway the Bulls actually get a good 2010 FA to come here
That probability is not 0, though I believe it to be very low. There is a chance that I’m wrong and the Bulls really do relentlessly pursue making the team better in a big way. I don’t think that will happen, but there is 0 chance that BG is not a Piston.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm giving serious consideration to throwing in the towel on my Bulls fan-dom.
The only reason I’m a Bulls fan is out of some misguided feeling of loyalty to the team that gave a young, impressionable basketball fan the Jordan years when I was in an NBA vortex (Alabama). Upon moving back to the Northeast, instead of switching over to C’s fan-dom, I remained a loyal Bulls fan. And for what? Years of intermittent mediocrity and suckiness? To watch the owner line his wallet year after year and let his best player walk for nothing? I’ve yet to see any indication that this organization is as loyal to its fans as I have been as a fan, so fuck them.
I might come back to the fold, but right now, I’ve had it with the Bulls.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 10:55 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Put your blinders on and try to enjoy Rose and Noah.
That is what I am going to try to do.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sadly that's about all there is to do if I want to remain a Bulls fan. I just don't know that it makes sense to invest myself
so much in a team whose FO doesn’t give a shit about winning.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 11:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
I’m going to follow the players and root for them … I think the blinders might still be on, at least for a little bit, but on an intellectual level I can’t root for the Bulls anymore.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im feeling the same
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you guys like crazy ???? all this negativity.Ben god rest his sole he could shoot but he gave up alot of points i mean alot of points defensively. The only reason he had to score 30 to win was bc he couldnt guard at the 2 guard he short dosent play defense ball hog and a turnover nightmare.Plus we have derrick rose for the last minute shot he should be are game winning shot taker
by bears rock on Jul 1, 2009 10:56 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
"Ben god rest his sole"
angryandy?
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:56 PM CDT up reply actions 6 recs
hhahaha
we need angryandy here to cheer us up
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 1, 2009 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I swear that guy's a godsend, wait! interesting thought....
is angryandy actually Jerry Reinsdorf in disguise? The level of intellect would seem to suggest it…
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
angryreinsdork
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:25 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Stick a pole in your ass please
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 10:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"oh my" - Funk
that’s a bit much.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
how many points? did you count?
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with Bearsrock...
Everybody quit yer bitchin!!! Ben had his moments but hes a one dimensional player who is NOT WORTH $11 million!!!!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jul 1, 2009 10:58 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I guess you are worth 11 million?
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amen, and Ben lost money!
and Ben lost money over the course of his career so it wasn’t a good move. He could have been starting year 3 of the initial Bulls offer and look to resigned in two years. He delayed signing a big contract by two years for what? “The deal is slightly more than the five-year, $50 million and six-year, $54 million deals Gordon rejected from the Bulls the last two summers”
Who screwed up? 10M x 2 years = 20M. He waits and signs for 11M.
He was only making 3-4 M instead of 10M. A loss of 12 M for waiting!!
Awesome Ben.
The Bulls screwed up how?
by Noe_Valley on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They did the math in the other thread. You are off in your numbers.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he signed an extension two years ago
It wouldn’t have kicked in until his current deal was up. So he didn’t lose that money. Correct me if I’m wrong somebody.
by bigballa10 on Jul 1, 2009 11:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that still means he missed out on a year.
I.e., he wouldn’t have been on the QO this past year, but rather his extension. So really, it’s probably a wash.
by arjoseph on Jul 2, 2009 7:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, it's not a wash
I did the math including the QO and alternatives in the other thread. Ben came out $7M ahead.
And that was with me believing it was a 5/$55M contract. Apparently he got 5/$58M.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 8:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jerry Reinsdorf is cheap...
but this team really isn’t in the terrible shape you propose. There is really no reason to trade Hinrich for expiring contracts now, he is a useful player. There is no purpose in trading Tyrus before a real deal arises, which is self explanatory. I would have preferred Ben stay a Bull, but definitely not at 11 million. No matter how often you attempt to spin the twisted logic that the Bulls overspent on Hinrich and Deng so they should overspend again, it just doesn’t make sense.
I don’t understand denigrating the other players on the team because we liked Gordon. It seems people are hoping for Deng to get hurt again or for Hinrich to be unsuccessful just so Reinsdorf, Paxon and now Forman will be proved wrong. I just don’t think its worth it or reasonable.
There is no reason to like Reinsdorf and I think we all knew that during the collapse of the dynasty (or my dad describes it to me when I forget); furthermore there is no reason to like Paxon and Forman as they are simply an extension of Reinsdorf.
There are reasons to like Deng, Hinrich, Salmons, etc. We don’t need to persecute those we perceive as benefiting from the relative incompetence of our organization as none of that is there own doing.
The Bulls are the Bulls no matter what jackass runs them.
by McCabe on Jul 1, 2009 10:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
the Bulls arent interested in useful players
they’re interested in cheap (and I suppose young?) players. They’re waiting for 2010. This is what I keep hearing.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just like they were waiting for 2000 to sign Grant Hill and T-Mac
Why would any superstar want to sign with this pathetic organization?
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 11:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The funniest Tmac to the Bulls story
Was when the Bulls had Jerry Krause and Bennie the Bull waiting at the airport for T-Mac. Way to spend big, JR! But in hindsight, it’s probably a good thing we lost out on Tracy “First Round Exit” McGrady.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you are missing what I am saying.
I just don’t want to be consumed by an anti-organizational/anti-VDN rage that will prevent me from enjoying the thing I use as a diversion from real shit. The Bulls are a product and I know that I have no control over how that product is managed; I just moved to Portland so I could commit to that product, but it signifies absolutely nothing to me and never will. I just don’t believe hating the team you love has purpose.
by McCabe on Jul 1, 2009 11:15 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
how do you enjoy a product?
if there cheap and keep fucking up, its alright to complain
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if fans never complained
then owners would never spend money and seats would still be full
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 1, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's the point of blogs
To complain. If it upsets you to hear all this talk about the Bulls. Then don’t come on blogabull. Stay away from the negativity and you’ll be happier. I come on because I find it amusing what people think.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I come on here
because most of my friends aren’t AS into the Bulls as me (which, admittedly, it quite a bit) and I need someplace to vent when this organization consistently annoys and disappoints me.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey, that's why I started a blog!
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well then we are on the same page sir
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
wow, unintentional, horrible pun
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I thought it was pretty good
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Refreshing even.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
fair enough
i retract the horrible part of that statement
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is nothing wrong with complaining...
there is something wrong with being consumed by those complaints until you hate the thing so much that there isn’t any reason to complain anymore.
by McCabe on Jul 1, 2009 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
True, but no reason for you to get upset about it also
Think about it. You’re getting upset about people getting too upset.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am not upset...
I am saying I don’t understand the response. I haven’t made any threats or claims.
by McCabe on Jul 1, 2009 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Quit yelling at me!!!!!
yeah people get heated. No point trying to calm them down though.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see what you're getting at
but get in a few days of rage, it’ll be good :)
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was raging for a day or so after the draft
(as some of you may have noticed by me making some not-so-subtle “threats” at GarPaxDorf on here), but I think this is going to take me through the weekend to get over. I’m just going to miss some of the crazy, out-of-left field shots BG would make every single game. He was always good for at least one, no matter how bad he was shooting that night.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The reason for blogs is to vent
Share it with people. Now if you go down the street and punch someone in the face because they look like Reinsdorf. Then you got some problems.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well, that was kind of my point
not to literally threaten someone, but to vent about actual basketball issues that casual bball fans just don’t realize and/or care about
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I suggest we rage "Detroit style" and burn down JR's neighborhood.
I mean, that would be appropriate, right?
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
by bullhockey on Jul 2, 2009 12:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you love it?
Love and hate defy purpose.
But for me, I like watching good, interesting basketball. There are lots of alternative uses of my time. Movies, TV, exercise, my kids, working more, you name it.
The vast majority of those activities, I both have more control over and will get some actual reward from. So when these clowns make their product worse, they give me one less reason to pay to see it.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 8:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why?
I enjoy watching good interesting basketball and the Bulls without Gordon and with Deng will play good, interesting basketball. Secondly, I was born in Chicago, remember going to playoff games as a kid, remember mimicking Michael Jordan while posting up my grandma, remember my first pair of Jordans and the Elton Brand jersey I got for Christmas, I remember Derrick Rose getting picked, and I remember the feeling of being in the Boston Garden as silence fell over the stunned Celtics crowd. These things supersede the general operation of activity and point to why one chooses basketball to be truly passionate about.
by McCabe on Jul 3, 2009 11:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BEN was the heart and soul of this team, and he led this FUCKING TEAM back to relevance
3 STRAIGHT PLAYOFF APPEARANCES, while leading the team in scoring, and this is how it wounded up!!!!! AFTER 4 fucking years the 3rd OVERALL PICK in 2004 was let go.
Fuck the world
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:00 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Heart and soul of Ben Gordon
He cared only about himself! Good riddance to the selfish bastard!!!!!
by SlamDunk on Jul 1, 2009 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You forgot to say he was a midget.
And that he gave Rose the stank eye. Wait, I think there was something else. I forgot!
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon gave the Bulls a chance to match FWIW
Once presented with Dumars’ formal offer, Brothers contacted the Bulls.
But management chose not to enter luxury-tax territory to re-sign someone who averaged 18.5 points per game, shot 41.5 percent on three-pointers and became the first player in NBA history to win Sixth Man of the Year Award as a rookie in 2005.
Gordon stayed true to his word that he wanted to remain a Bull. The Bulls did not stay true to their word that they wanted to re-sign Gordon, or that was their highest priority, or whatever diatribe Forman has been spouting out the past few weeks.
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Link
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/chi-02-bulls-ben-gordonjul02,0,5953796.story
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yes, CHOSE NOT TO ENTER LUXURY TAX TERRITORY
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ouch
“I don’t have any regrets, and I don’t have any bitter feelings for the Bulls,” Gordon said after returning to Chicago late Wednesday. “Business is business. I’m going to a situation now where winning is the No. 1 priority. I’m happy with my decision.”
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 11:05 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Zang
Rumor has it Alex Brown keeps Chris Simms' right index finger in his back pocket for good luck.
by HanelucaTC on Jul 1, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hmmmm, I maybe a partial Pistons fan for next season
still love my bulls tho
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
League Pass might truly be League Pass next year, and not Bulls pass.
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
WOW. Hey LeBron! Hey Dwayne! Chris! Amare! Over here!
Can’t you see this bitter cold city with the greedy owner and a legend’s shadow hanging over your every loss is the best situation for you?! What do you mean fuck off?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
Sure, "Business is Business," Ben Gordon's business
He’d better learn to play some defense with that undersized body at the shooting guard position. His hiring will get Joe Dumars fired!
by SlamDunk on Jul 1, 2009 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I bet if the Bulls had tried to match
Gordon would have told Reinsdorf that his offer to let the Bulls match had expired.That’s what I would have done at least.
by potato0328 on Jul 2, 2009 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
I would have brought a music player
and put on some classic Ennio Morricone score to set the mood.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben doesn't get his $$$
and of course the Bulls don’t want to win! News flash BG you aren’t a superstar and you don’t deserve superstar money! Good luck in Detroit but we all knew you weren’t long for Chicago ever since your rookie season when you wanted to be a starter but came off the bench. Thanks for the memories!
by Playboy_Bull on Jul 2, 2009 6:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, the Bulls want to win
but chase it extremely incompetently?
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 7:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
11 mil isn't super money.
Just wait until the Bulls try to sign a superstar.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well first of all if you think 55 million dollars is superstar money
Then no one can help you.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
dude are you gonna change the image on your blog?
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was going to make a new one with both Gordon and Rose
If Gordon re-signed. But there is no need to change it now.
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought it was still the image of BG, my bad
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The bullshit about wanting to re-sign BG bugs me as much as anything
I suppose the awful management of talent should bother me more….
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Meh...
The middle of several to go as the Bulls try to build a championship team around Rose…does anyone think the players that were here when Rose was drafted would still be around??? Gooden, Hughes and Simmons were already traded, now Gordon is gone…next up, the Bulls will have to move Hinrich and perhaps even Deng and Thomas….the Bulls team that makes the finals will look nothing like the Bulls team from last summer…that is what happens when a team acquires a superstar….look at Cleveland, for example, the only player that remains from the team Lebron was drafted to is Big Z, look at Miami, the only player left on that roster is Haslem…the Lakers, Kobe has Fish, and no one else…
This team must be built around DRose….
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:05 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
This is the root of what is happening. The drafting of Derrick Rose set all of this in motion.
I expect this team to be totally different. They already said so. Hinrich is gone and so is Deng and Thomas. Noah will be the only one who stays from the old core. When Rose was drafted I knew that was the end for Ben, Kirk and Deng.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here's the problem
even when rebuilding around a newfound superstar, most teams don’t let their former 3rd overall pick in a draft walk away for nothing. Unless injuries, personality conflicts or the 1996 Orlando Magic are involved, it just doesn’t happen.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, compare this roster
to that Cavs one with LeBron. Does that make BG like Ricky Davis? give me a break.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It just shows how cheap and blatant this organization is
do they really think the fans are stupid enough not to notice that kind of stuff? I mean, can you name one other team that does that? Spends a top-3 pick on a guy who turns into the best player of the last decade for your franchise then let him go for nothing?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can poll my coworkers tomorrow
and they will all be happy to see BG go. They will think what they are told to think. It really is as simple as that. They are also Cubs fans though so I think being a Cubs is their punishment.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right, because
everyone who is happy to see BG go aren’t thinking for themselves. There’s no way one can reasonably not like having a 1-dimensional player get paid $11/yr. Also because the BG contract situation exists in a vacuum.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 8:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was actually shocked.
My main bball follower was all concerned that Rose would have to take up too much of the offensive load without BG. That Rose might have to play SG and Kirk PG. He thought Salmons was going to have to play SF. I had to remind him we had Deng on the team. Ha! He seemed worried.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hinrich was
resigned, Deng was resigned, BG didnt get resigned…they even resigned Chandler. I think the Bulls pick and choose who they want and don’t want to pay. Curry and Gordon fell into the latter.
by Playboy_Bull on Jul 2, 2009 6:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you are against overpaying guys
then you should hate Deng and Hinrich. They were over paid the day they signed the papers.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was thinking Hughes was more like Ricky Davis...
…BG is more like an experienced DeJuan Wagner, but I could see you would compare him to Ricky Davis (highest scorer and all)
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 2, 2009 8:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is true, but the Bulls fucked up last year when they pulled the deal off of the table. They
could have did a sign and trade last year…even if Gordon decided to wait a few days later. Gordon on the otherhand did a master stroke. He signed for one year qualifier with a no trade clause in his contract, thus ensuring when he leaves that the Bulls would not get shit in return.
Yes I agree…Bulls Management created this debacle today. They did not want to spend on Gordon which is all right, but to make it where they would receive no value in return should have gotten Paxson fired.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree totally!!
The BG era is OVAH!!! Its a whole new day!!!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
This should also be mentioned.
Tyrus Thomas is gone too. Tyrus will have a free agent amount of $12.1 million, which would preclude the Bulls from signing a max free agent.
I don’t have a crystal ball, but this is how I envision 2010 most likely playing out. Lebron stays in Cleveland and Wade stays in Miami. Amare signs with Miami, while Bosh goes to Cleveland. Yao Ming is injured now, and Steve Nash will sign elsewhere than the Bulls.
So the Bulls free agent targets would look like Carlos Boozer, Michael Redd, Richard Jefferson, and Joe Johnson.
When you put all things into perspective (production, efficiency, clutchness, and durability), I’m not so sure any of those players are better than Gordon, and if they are, it’s just a minor upgrade at most.
So we will essentially be giving up Ben Gordon, Tyrus Thomas, and the ability to leverage our $25 million in expiring contracts in trades, for a player, who might not even be better than Gordon is.
2010 a plan to rebuild? It’s not a viable plan for a team like the Bulls to build a contender. For Miami, yes. Cleveland to improve too. But not for the Bulls, who should be a lotto team next year, barring some miracle.
All this is, is Reinsdorf being cheap, which I think most people realize. Keeping Gordon, keeping Tyrus, and leveraging our expiring contracts for longterm commitments would have costed a lot more money. It would have made us a lot better team too, probably a contender, but profits may have not been at their maximum point. The 2010 plan, should get us around maximum profits.
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Bosh to bulls.
What does cleveland have to offer Toronto in a sign and trade? As I’m sure your aware Bosh gets more money and year in that scenario.
by robinhood on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cleveland has Lebron
Who Bosh has been rumored to be planning to go wherever he goes in 2010.
by Renobull on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cleveland will have cap space to retain Lebron and sign a max free agent.
Chicago Bulls Blog and Forums. NBA Power Rankings.
by Andrew7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The best thing for the Cavs to do
Would be to make it to the Finals next year and lose in Game 7. I feel like if the Cavs won the championship. Lebron would feel like his mission was accomplished. He brought a championship to Cleveland. Now time to go play with Bosh in NYC. or Chicago?
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe Johnson is better than Gordon...
In basically every measure of better…I would love the Bulls to acquire him in 2010.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't get your hopes up
There will be several teams able to sign the big name guys. If the Bulls were serious about 2010, they would’ve been clearing cap space for it ahead of time. They still could, I just wouldn’t hold my breath.
by bigballa10 on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
next year he's going to be 29
by the time this team becomes a contender, Johnson would be going downhill
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
Its a terrible way to win with Vets…nobody wins their first title after 30…rolls eyes
Not every player who the Bulls sign should be 25…that is not a good way to win a title…in fact, a team needs vets to win titles.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 2, 2009 8:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey Dionysus
after skimming the 340+ comments in this post Gordon thread… I agree wtih a lot of points you are making( even though most people arent).
1- I thought the idea that everyone on the roster when Derrick was drafted would be gone by the time the Bulls start competing for chance to go to finals was common knowledge. Now it looks like Noah played himself onto that team but everyone else is expendable.
2- Joe Johnson would be a fine " consolation prize" if free agency goes the way I think it may. I think he’d be a better fit than Wade because Wade and Derrick wouldnt work together. Johnson is more of a spot up 2 guard who doesnt need the ball in his hand 70% of the offense. Plus Johnson can post up a little and remember that the post presence the Bulls need so bad could be a 2 ( MJ, Kobe).
by Jscho316 on Jul 2, 2009 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait, really?
Johnson is more of a spot up 2 guard who doesnt need the ball in his hand 70% of the offense.
Joe Johnson creates his own shot off the dribble. Within this set he’s also creating for his teammates when the doubles and the help comes over.
He is certainly not a spot up SG.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he is old
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This 2010 thing better work
or Reinsdork is gonna look like a jackass. The managment must have gotten a promise from Wade and Bosh the way they are acting.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 1, 2009 11:10 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
it will not work
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've seen this movie before...it always ends the same way
There is no “2010” plan, other than to make a max offer to a FA (I guess Bosh). Lots of other teams with more resources, attractiveness, and the same desire will be competing for these guys. Which is why some good proactive team will get Bosh and sign him before 2010 happens. And Wade is no backup plan, as he is not leaving Miami. Other teams that lose out on the top guys will outbid the Bulls for second tier guys like Johnson (the Bulls aren’t going to the wall for anyone that isn’t a perfect fit).
That’s how you end up signing Ron Mercer.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And in any case, we could have kept Gordon and still had max money next year
You know, on the off chance that the superstar coming here would have actually wanted to play for the best possible team.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 8:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So...
You are saying that now we will have even more money and the superstars will be more inclined to sign here because we have a better, more balanced team…we just need a stud scorer…a role that these superstars are usually looking to fill…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 2, 2009 8:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Talent can coexist.
The Lakers happened after all.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 9:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately, as you well know, but pretend to ask
Superstars in the NBA can only be paid up to a certain point, the maximum allowable contract. Hence, we can’t offer them more money.
Thus, we can only offer them a better team to play with, in addition to the price ceiling amount of salary. And since generally speaking, players don’t actually like being the only guy who can score on a team, we’ve just made ourselves less attractive, and less potentially balanced.
Having two or three good scorers is more balanced than having one.
Having zero, I suppose, is balanced in the technical sense of the word, but pretty inferior.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose is a good scorer
so are Salmons and Deng (when healthy). Hinrich is an average scorer. Noah has shown he can take advantage of scoring opportunities down low (although he cannot create his own shot).
It’s not like it’s a team made up of Dennis Rodman, Ben Wallace and Tyson Chandler.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We just subtracted the player that drew the most double teams
I doubt Deng and Salmons combined will draw as many double teams as Ben Gordon has in a single season.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats right.
Reinsdorks ass is on the line now!!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Sell the team, cheap owner, sell the team
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Anybody agreeing that Gar Forman looks like that cartoon dog
that SAD cartoon dog, i couldn’t remember the name
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hate gar forman with all of my heart
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel a bit bad for Gar
this was likely way over his head, and he has to be the one who faces the public because the last guy hated it.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
its jerrys fault
I don’t even think he participated in the draft process either.
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Please don't take my shooting guard...he's the only one I have left."
Said in droopy dog voice….
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
signing ben gordon is a priority allright
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jul 1, 2009 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gar is off to a rough start here...
First a lame duck draft and now this. Ouch.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
outside of Rubio, Griffin and Curry
The whole draft class was a lame duck
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Then trade them away to make some more cap room for BG
by Edicus2288i on Jul 1, 2009 11:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They tried to trade the picks
Or at least said they tried. But no one wants these crappy rookies on their team.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Get off the ledge people
Fish is much cheaper. I know he’s not as good as BG but you got Luol coming back.
Laugh now, cry later.
by Option27 on Jul 1, 2009 11:37 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
"Fish is much cheaper"
oh thank god!
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, let's all forget about the fact
that Salmons is about half as productive at the SG position as compared to SF. Look how his numbers skyrocketed after Luol got hurt. So, by losing BG and getting Deng back we’re also going to be losing production from Salmons. Fantastic.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are we really contending next year with BG?
Really now?
C’mon
by Option27 on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or the year after that...or the year after that.
He was not a good fit with Rose. I don’t know why people are in denial about this…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 2, 2009 8:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose was ROY right?
So why wasn’t BG a good fit for him? Seriously I want to know.
by Dils on Jul 2, 2009 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because there is only one basketball and two guards cannot dominate one basketball.
If Gordon was a shooter only, in the mode of Rip Hamilton or Reggie Miller then keeping him is a no brainer, but Gordon loves to have the ball in his hands and create shots.
If Hinrich was the PG no problem, but not with Rose, who is a real PG, through whom you run an offense thru.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Salmons will be the same way.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah Salmons is the same...
Bg had the ball in his hands because nobody else had the literal Balls to take and make shots. Should they had ran BG off more screens? Sure. That’s not BG’s fault. Watch what Detroit does with this guy. BG is going to replace Rip Hamilton because he’s going to be used the same way. Just like Ray Allen is in Boston. Everybod has such a little man complex when it comes to BG and it’s just tiring. If the guy wasn’t used right it’s not his fault. Nobody worries about Hamilton or Ray Allen’s defense, they worry about offensive production. We just lost one of the league’s best at that for nothing. SMH
by Dils on Jul 2, 2009 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Then with Salmons it will be the exact. same. thing.
Or is everyone forgetting John Salmons passed the ball even less then Gordon
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd like folks to go back and look at last year's Kings
1- Udrih
2- KMart
3- Salmons
4- Thompson
5- Miller
KMart ~ Deng
Noah > Thompson
Rose > Udrih
For sure, we’re a better team. But it’s not like we’re outlandishly different either. Basically there but for the grace of Derrick Rose go we.
And we were damn lucky to get Derrick Rose.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
because he was starting and there was one less player to share the ball with
Salmons will be the same now that BG is gone. He would’ve been worse coming off the bench. Not that it makes it OK to let BG go. But I don’t think this makes Salmons worse. For that logic to make sense, the Bulls would have to run an actual offense where people have set positions. Instead of everyone just running around hoping that someone gets open.
by paxdorf on Jul 1, 2009 11:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
For a year.
Then Rose will have to get used to a third SG in his short career.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow. Great post.
I think this changed my mind. I was against signing BG before, but this completely makes sense. Why do I feel so depressed?
This line from a movie, television show or other piece of popular culture pretty much sums up my entire personality.
by ScottieG33 on Jul 1, 2009 11:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Excellent post.
"Vinny continues to act like a crazed arsonist pouring gasoline on our season while running around carrying a torch yelling 'I’m in charge. Don’t any of you foolish knaves try to second guess me. I know gasoline is a liquid but I’m pretty sure it isn’t flammable and the odor gives me a natural high.'" - Tyrusmancrush
by Illini15 on Jul 1, 2009 11:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
managerial fiasco, but hardly a basketball tragedy
you are correct in your condemnation of Reinsdorf for his mistreatment of fans, and your indictment of management for mishandling Ben’s situation over and over again. it’s a travesty, and a reason for pessimism in the foreseeable future.
that said, Bulls may not be worse off without Ben next year. they will be a much different team without him – bigger, with Rose playing a bigger role and learning to become a closer. oh, and vinny still fucking up everything in sight. may be they will win 5 fewer games, may be not. overall, i am not certain that losing a nice talent that is Ben is going to hurt them on the floor THAT much…
by bob horse on Jul 1, 2009 11:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Anyone who thinks this sets the wheels in motion for some grand change is delusional
I don’t even care about losing Ben, it was pretty much a formality he was going to go.
This just highlights why the Bulls cannot become a title contender unless almost everything goes perfectly. They don’t care about taking risks, they don’t pay for players who aren’t “good guys”, they value a false sense of team loyalty over legit on-court production. The owner is constantly meddling in affairs of player personnel and coaching matters when he should be trusting what the front office staffers believe, since you know HE FUCKING HIRED THEM.
Fuck Jerry Reinsdorf.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 11:44 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
the only way the Bulls win a title is have the GOAT fall into their laps..
and then it takes them seven years to figure out how to get players around him.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha
The only Bulls gear I have is the green Ben Gordon adidas shirt. My GF sleeps in it too. Ehhhh great.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
People are going to read into that.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This Gordon love is weird
A year ago, the big offseason Gordon post was Scotter’s “Gordon is better than Hinrich”. As in, we needed a post to convince ourselves that Gordon was better than Kirk “career 41.5 FG%” Hinrich.
Now Gordon leaves and everyone’s throwing in their Bulls towel. What?
We didn’t lose Ben Gordon, Bulls Savior, we lost a zero-time all-star who doesn’t play defense or rebound or pass, and might actually not be as good as Kirk Hinrich (whose salary looks pretty good right now). We’re fine without Gordon, maybe better going forward.
by YaoPau on Jul 1, 2009 11:55 PM CDT reply actions 6 recs
yeah, you can take that over to bulls.com
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 2, 2009 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ha
they don’t even have the fact that Gordon left on the official website
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sam Smith wrote a blog about it
it’s linked on bulls.com
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 2, 2009 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh gotcha
but its not on the main headlines, it’s just a sidenote
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least someone will sleep well tonight.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I will rec this post when Kirk Hinrich gets traded for Blake and Outlaw
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 12:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want Rudy if we trade with the Blazers
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So would I, but I'm being realistic
Especially if Portland signs Hedo.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rudy wants to leave if Portland signs Hedo
Maybe we will have a chance to get him
by bull83 on Jul 2, 2009 6:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The thing i will miss about ben gordon
will be his ability to score the ball in the most pressured situations, that is truly hard to replace. That “game closing” ability. In terms of the rest of his scoring, it will be hard to get to get his 20+ points per game from somewhere else, but its not impossible at all. I really think the bulls are gonna be just as good as they were this year, next year….but its all a gut feeling more than anything….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
how are we going to replace his scoring and clutchness?
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Players who don't shoot as well
will take those shots. Less will go in but eventually, if they shoot enough, something might go in. You just have to remember Kirk misses wide open threes and can’t make a layup. Deng can’t shoot the three and might still be slowed down by injury. Salmons has all of the traits of BG people say they don’t like and will be slower as a SG…yet he is going to be awesome or something. Rose will be good but will have to fight through more double teams. Hopefully he won’t be so much like Wade that he gets hurt because he’ll have to put the team on his back by himself all the time. Tyrus, well, will he be on the team? Noah is good near the basket but has no outside shot. There are a couple rookies that might be ok or might be like Cedric Simmons. But it will work I am told.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
huh
i already said his clutchness would be hard to be replace….his scoring lets see, deng i am sure will step up his game because i have a few games from this season early in the year and i have the miami series downloaded when we killed them, and deng reminded me of what i liked about his game and that maybe it really was the injury that kept him out of games. Salmons i think can score, and i especially think his ability to finish at the rim is greater than gordons, so i can see him getting a few and 1 plays. I think rose is smart enough to get it, “my teams best scorer is gone, i gotta step my game up or else we are screwed” so im expecting rose to do things that leave my jaw on the floor. I dont know if kirk will stay, but if he does, i expect him to do nothing but work on shooting. This season i felt that kirk worked on being a pg and i noticed the change in his game in that regard, but i think this year he will understand that he is going to be needed more for his defense and ability to shoot the 3 than anything. Hopefully the bulls trade to the blazers, if we get rudy thats awesome and thats a hellava lot of points, if not we still have blake who is a decent 3 pt shooter, plus probably outlaw….
Noah and tyrus should also produce a bit more….also consider that (although im not a whiz with stats here) gordon had an essentially negative effect on the team scoring, meaning his drtg and his ortg canceled each other out, he gave up the points he scored. We should have more players scoring wihtout giving up the same ammount of points this year, so theres that
Again the only thing we wont have is probably the clutchness gordon gave this team….as for the double team that gordon forced on himself, i dont thin those double teams really did much but keep the bulls main offensive weopen (gordon) out of track. teams really will have to figure out how defend the bulls who will now be relying more on balanced scoring to win games….
I think yfbb is looking more at the future of what the bulls could be with gordon (win now, and win later not just win later) but that now isnt this year at any rate, and i see the bulls having the same production this year as they were going to with or without ben….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's not just gordon love - it's management hate
i mostly agree with you on Gordon (although I do think he is better than Kirk).
Many folks are mostly upset with ineptitude of Paxon and cheapskate JR. Ben leaving is the closure of years of mishandling of his situation, worst of which was inability to trade him in a package for a real star after the sweep of Miami.
It is frustration with JR and Paxon and Gar and Vinny not going anywhere.
by bob horse on Jul 2, 2009 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree & I was wrong........I think I finally have a super reason to hate the bulls org. Bunch of yes men to JR. OK pulled the offer off the table after BG agreed. Have a chance to match Detroits offer. Nothing....thats what we got nothing dang
(deng) why not match and then do a trade. The raymond brothers got lots of interest a few mid level offers from contenders. IDIOTS
by Ibleedbullsred on Jul 2, 2009 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I admit I don’t know enough about the rules for trading recently signed players, the cap, and other technicalities, etc.
The bottom line is that the Bulls missed opportunities to trade Deng and Gordon when their value was high, hugely overpaid for one, and let the other walk for nothing after facilitating an embarrassing 2-year-long melodrama. Other major missteps (signing Wallace, trading Aldridge for TT, firing Skiles and hiring Vinny) complete a depressing picture
by bob horse on Jul 2, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for some sanity YaoPau
This Gordon love is a joke. I’ll have a big laugh when he is run out of Detroit with one-dimensional play, not to mention he’s undersized at the two-guard position.
by SlamDunk on Jul 2, 2009 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You did finally remember he is short!
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Run out of Detroit
Not for 3-4 more years!!
by hlac on Jul 2, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hinrich is a point guard.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wooo 2 BG Jerseys to put with all my other former Bulls player jerseys!
I’m now down to a Rose and Kirk jersey for current bulls.
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on Jul 2, 2009 12:00 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
what kind of kirk jersey is it
Man ive been looking forever for the kirk jersey with the oldschool alternate bulls away jersey (black with the red pinstripes) or a St. Pattys Day kirk jersey (green’s my favorite color)
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the bigger question is
who would buy a kirk jersey?
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait till he is is in Portland
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've seen a lot of 8 year old suburb boys wear them to games.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
huh
i would of course…i didnt know that was a big question of some sort…i should be on jeopardy or something in which case….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well as a season ticket holder, the Bulls sent us all white Kirk jersey's 2-yrs ago...
last year they sent us a championship replica banner, and this year a Rose jersey. So yeah, I guess I could have predicted who the Bulls would hold on to this summer…
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
just a home red one
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on Jul 2, 2009 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
...home red one
i meant “plain ole” red one
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on Jul 2, 2009 12:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh....
…..(yea thats all i got…)
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So I enjoyed a lovely day at the lake
And I somehow had a sense I was going to come home to this – I almost just went to bed to enjoy that relaxed feeling just a bit longer.
JR sucks. Congrats to Ben for winning his big gamble. It will be odd to see him in a different jersey, but I wish him the best until the season actually starts. I hope it works out better with a Ben going the opposite direction for his sake, but I’m not all that enamored of the Pistons team even with Ben on it.
I don’t think the Bulls will be as hideous next season as some others do, but I suppose we shall all see.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 2, 2009 12:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Oh, and I guess I need to start looking for a new sig. Damn it.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 2, 2009 12:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too...
I have been thinking about another quote from your friendly bulls blogger…
So yeah, fuck you D2.0.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 2, 2009 8:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't play up your 'rebel' status
you’re not interesting enough to do so.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sorry about that whole thing
just unleashing my anger
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm just afraid what this does to us in 2010
How many people are going to see this trade badly? A team that treats its best player as badly as this?
No one’s gonna sign with us.
Depending on how well 2010 turns out, I might just stop buying tickets altogether.
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:10 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ok, that point's arguable
That prior to Rose. But he’s still the highest scorer for this team the last 4 years. That counts for something
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who's been better and more consistent?
Hinrich was hurt half this year and sucked worse than Gordon last year.
Deng’s been hurt.
Who else has been on the team the past 5 years?
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 2, 2009 3:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben Gordon has missed 12 games in 5 years.
Another reason to overpay. He has a track record of durability. 398 games in 5 years. That’s pretty good. Another reason? He doesn’t play international ball. Totally devoted to his contract.
by JockstrapNoah on Jul 2, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't he thinking of playing for the British team?
I thought I heard that somewhere. But you make good points in any case.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i bet he will now since he's got a long term contract
he was going to last season but not if he hadn’t worked out a contract or had to play on the QO (since risk of injury)
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jul 2, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
in the end
sadly i think money talks….but then again are the bulls even doing the right things to have enough money to talk or not….? I think matt said this and i agree, the front office should come out and announce some sort of plan…i mean give potential free agents and us fans (especially us fans but ESPECIALLY the free agents) some sort rope to hold on to so that this freakin team doesnt look so damn cluless….if you are losing ben gordon show some poise, unlike when d’antoni signed with new york and reinsdork came out and said “aww he cheated us, didnt even give us a chance”….act like you have a plan even if you dont….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So how is everyone doing on this lovely evening?
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:17 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Who flagged this?
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT: How can you tell when you've been flagged?
Just for personal reference. >:[]
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Got a message that said "don't troll"
I just figured someone flagged me
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I did!
double-shot!
clearly what you were doing there was trolling, no?
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you can't tell
only I can see it. There are not a lot of flags here, believe it or not. Most just insult instead.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's why I was curious.
I figured someone would have something to say instead of hiding behind a SB Nation warning system.
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, not tough blog commenters like you
huh?
flagging works, I can’t read everything. and not everyone has a right to be here.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah you know me
Big tough guy
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So, seriously,
how much money would each of us have to pitch in to buy this team?
I’m willing to let those college loans go for a while to get this done.
by potato0328 on Jul 2, 2009 12:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Some of us go picket a Cubs game
Maybe Jerry would give a damn about us then
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
uhhh...
Am I the only one that really, really thinks Ben Gordon isn’t an 11 million dollar a year player?
I mean, I’ve watched him play in a Bulls uni for quite a while now, and yeah, he scores 20 a game, but he adds very little to the rest of the teams play. And 20 points on a ho-hum shooting percentage does not equal a wise investment at 11 mill a season. Hell, I’m not sure how much I’d invest in him at 8-9 mill a season. Contracts that big should be reserved to players who can actually be top 2-3 players for a serious playoff contender, and Gordon isn’t that.
Not saying hte ownership isn’t cheap, but I think this is misguided rage at the moment. If we try to low ball Rose, then I’ll get pissed.
by Novacain on Jul 2, 2009 12:23 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I'm gonna wait and see
If nothing is done to this team after losing BG, then we have the right to burn a cubs jersey in front of Reinsdorf
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
umm
wouldnt he enjoy that? (reinsdorf owns the sox so if you burn the cubs jersey he will think you hate the cubs that much, doing it in front of him might make him think you are doing it FOR him…..)
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have to excuse the robots.
They’re only programmed to see “20 PPG.”
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you see anyone else who can give us that 20PPG?
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
John Salmons had 18 ppg
with 3 fewer shots per game…
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can anyone help on Salmons when Ben Gordon and Derrick Rose were in the game?
Nope. It create one on ones every time Salmons had the ball. Subtract Gordon, move Salmons to the 2, and pray/hope/wish Luol Deng ever sees an NBA double team in his life and I’ll place more confidence in Salmons as the 2 coming anywhere close to 20ppg.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose/ Salmons / Deng (forgot about him?)
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose will average more.
Salmons started along side BG so his points were already counted in a sense. Can’t add him like he is and extra 18 pts out of nowhere. Deng will have to show up and take the brunt of it. At least be as good as Salmons was for us in the stretch last year. Noah might put a couple more in a game playing without Gooden in the way. Eh.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We played a 4th player in Deng way more than that.
I wonder what our top 1-3 will expect? Probably to be paid more than Deng.
Gordon has a good shooting percentage. I am not sure what leads you to say otherwise. Not the stats.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A healthy and confident Deng is a good 3rd option.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and can be pretty efficient
a guy that young for an entire season produced extremely efficient stats, it could not have been a fluke….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has little control over his health
and he doesn’t strike me as Mr. Confidence. Deng will actually have to show up again to prove a good season and one playoff series wasn’t a fluke. I’d only feel comfortable penciling him in. Dependability requires a little bit of time elapsing without injuries.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is gonna sound really stupid
i mean totally moronic, a saying of an imbecile…but so are my other posts…..
I think the reason deng never returned last season, was because they wanted deng back at true 100%, he is still young enough that his body could heal, and even when he was put on the injured list, doctors were saying he could play if he tried. So what if all this time was to put luol at a level of healthiness that he couldnt (without a serious hit) be out with the same injury? Maybe the organization had a plan after all, at least in that regard…
then again ive been a hinrich fan for all these years, so ive gotten used to holding on to simple thoughts of hope without having any real evidence….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When they got Salmons they got more comfortable
with Deng being out. Maybe they did just say screw it, let him sit it out. Then again the news coming from the Bulls remained really mixed. A few times they took a negative tone about Deng. Why would they do that if this was part of the plan? Why would they speculate him coming back for the playoffs? It just makes us more pissed when he never even suited up. Their PR screwed it up if it was any kind of plan.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because they are the bulls organization
Mums the word and all of that…another example is when news broke pax was stepping down, they downplayed it and when he had his trade press conference he basically bashed the media and told them he wasnt going anywhere….but he still left. this organization seems to have a pattern of blowing smoke and acting “clever” and diverting attention. Because J.R. is a businessman of such “high regard” i can see him being the kind of guy that preaches this business philosophy (see book of 5 rings) so thats why i think they were always against talking to the media and never giving the media the right attention, and thusly the media hired morons like kc johnson to blow even more smoke to force the bulls’ hands. Thats my thought on how that organization works….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh come on
Deng, when we signed him, looked to be a lot better then a 4th player. One year before that, he was putting up almost 18 a game (with a great shooting percentage, I might add), playing solid defense, getting rebounds, etc. That was a move that I bet a lot of Bulls fans fully supported, and just go back now and talk about how sucky it was.
And I’ll be fair, Gordons % at 45% isn’t bad. Still, if you look at the numbers, the difference between Salmons and Gordon seems to be Salmons is more efficent while taking less shots. I’ll take a chance giving him starting minutes.
by Novacain on Jul 2, 2009 12:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He had no three point shot and isn't athletic.
Should have been at least a red flag right there. For his position he has flashes of good things, but there are plenty of guys better than him at the things you’d traditionally want a SF to be good at. The season prior to his summer signing the team imploded and as co-captain he had little leadership showing through all of that. Another red flag. I am not saying they shouldn’t have signed him, but why in the world did his value balloon so much? Who was driving up his price?
Salmons got those numbers as a SF for us. He still has to prove he can do that as a SG. I wouldn’t mind him being our starting SF, but Deng must start with his contract leading the way.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is he, a $9 million player?
Is it worth being worse so as not to overpay $2 million?
I don’t believe so.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 2, 2009 3:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My thoughts
We really put the nail in the coffin a year ago when we resigned Deng and not Gordon. As I was advocating then, if we had signed both to the qualifying offer, I think things would have turned out much much differently (and better). We would have been in a situation to see how things played out last season and acted accordingly. Look at how things might have played out.
Both players play well: Easy choice, we sign them both long term. If one of them is refusing to sign we can look at the production and decide whether to sign him or not in a way that doesn’t affect our future strategies.
One player plays well, one doesnt: Sign the good one and possibly try to resign the worse one for a discount. Again if the good one doesn’t want to resign, weigh the situation from there.
Both players play poorly: Easy choice, let them both go or try to sign them for big discounts. Go all in towards 2010.
As things really turned out, the second happened. Gordon played well, Deng did not (albeit for injury reasons). Unfortunately, because we didn’t wait and see, we lost out on the good one and are stuck with the worse one.
Now its easy to see this in retrospect, but some might remember that I was saying these same things a year ago and I feel pretty vindicated (not that it gets rid of this sick feeling in my stomach) in saying that the wait and see approach could only help us (see what we have) and not really hurt us (worse case, we’re building for the future with a 20 year old potential superstar.
Sigh.
by JSlakov on Jul 2, 2009 12:31 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Hollinger states that the Bulls still have a ton of depth on the perimeter
and should be fine for the upcoming season
by LoveForTheGame on Jul 2, 2009 12:33 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
All pesimisim will disapear when Rose strips Gordon
then dunk on Charlie V. Do not doubt the power of Rose even when it comes to 2010.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:40 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Gets me thinking
What exactly is Derrick Rose thinking at this point? I’m fairly curious
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ummmmmm
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:42 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
prolly just eating an apple
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on Jul 2, 2009 12:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ah dammit.
so much for this signature
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on Jul 2, 2009 12:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"You mean I get to dribble now?"
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose is laughing......"no one will challenge me now". This is my team.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So Rose is so weak
that he can’t shine over a 1 dimensional midget? Talk about a backhanded compliment, Bart.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 9:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what is Joe Dumars thinking?
First off, it is good Drose is not playing with BG anymore. Drose played his rookie year with alot of respect for the NBA. I fully expect him to realize he is much better than 99% of the league and start dunking on everyone. 2nd, REALLY Dumars? Does he really expect to do anything with BG being the best player? HAH I say good riddance and enjoy watching Rose this year
by jyang16 on Jul 2, 2009 12:42 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
wait, Rose couldn't realize this
because of Gordon?
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
only person holding Rose back
is Vinny. I hate that I have to use an MJ reference to get this point across but the Vinny preventing Rose from getting any better is sorta like Dean Smith was the only person who could keep Jordan under 20.
Vinny is the only person who could keep Derrick from improving at defense, end game situatons, …. ect.
by Jscho316 on Jul 2, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why are you guys so hung up on this BG as the best player stuff?
How can you all be so blind and not see the deal here? Ben Gordon is an offensive talent. When you are trying to build a team, step one is to assemble as much PRODUCTIVE talent as possible. Gordon is that. He’s not potential like Luol Deng. Gordon has produced to the tune of 19 or 20ppg for his career. And now he makes $11M/yr which is LESS than Deng’s average salary of $12M/yr which many people here have said is what a THIRD OPTION on a good team makes. So the Pistons aren’t paying Gordon to be the best player. They paid for a productive rotation player capable of lighting the scoreboard up with the best in the league a lot of nights.
This is why I cannot understand why so many of you undervalue Gordon. At $11M/yr, Gordon is paid right about what he should be paid. I’ve said this for the last 2 years and have had to listen to some dummies on this site talk about how he’s only worth the MLE because he should be the sixth man. Yeah, the same way Manu Ginobili should have only been worth the MLE before he was hurt because he was the 6th man (Ginobili will make $10,725,000 next season). And before you start talking about how Ginobili has 3 rings, I venture to say that if Gordon played with Tim Duncan and Tony Parker he may very well have 3 rings too. It would have been nice to get a chance to play with Pau Gasol and Derrick Rose (if only the Bulls could have pulled off the deal the Lakers pulled off to steal Gasol). Chances are the Bulls would be looking at 55 wins this coming season with those two anchoring the lineup and Gordon on the wing firing away…while making $10-$11M/yr as the THIRD OPTION!!!
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 2, 2009 8:01 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
to a degree...
Ben was the vet and Drose is a very humble guy…seems like this led to DRose defering to BG throughout the year
by jyang16 on Jul 2, 2009 12:45 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Salmons and Hinrich are vets too
But true, the sooner Rose starts figuring out he’s the best player in this team and possibly the best point guard in the Eastern Conference, the better for us.
by Alighieri on Jul 2, 2009 12:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is how I feel
This is D. Rose team unless Wade comes.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep...Rose is no doubt working hard
He looks more cut and the ease of getting to the rim is unbelievable in his most recent workout clip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q19VErS2iH4
by jyang16 on Jul 2, 2009 12:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we keep stripping away more good players
mathematically Rose will learn this all the faster. Noah will be the next to go. Anything for Rose.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 12:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree. Noah play in the playoffs saved him. I think he is in. He looked good playing off of Rose.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is too good to play near Rose.
Rose can’t handle playing with good players.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 9:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
WHAT
I understand being upset about BG leaving, but what makes you think Rose can’t play with “good players”?
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Read the thread.
It is one of the top reasons people wanted BG to leave. Because Rose is too timid to take control of a team that has good players on it. They threaten his ability to lead. Charismatic Noah fits the bill too.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No. It is because Ben Gordons style of play does not fit with Rose. In case everyone has forgotton
it is all about Rose. The issue is not his shooting. The issue is his need to dominate the ball. That was good with Hinrich because all Hinrich would do is dribble around with the ball anyway. Rose is not Hinrich.
It is really irrelevant. Ben is gone. I am glad he is gone. This is now Roses Team and I am behind Derrick Rose……Fuck Ben Gordon.
If everyone loves Ben then buy a Ben Gordon Detriot Jersey and wear it to a Bulls game when Detroit comes to town. Ben is now the enemy. When he goes to the hole and flail as he alway do then put him on his ass.
Bulls Management did bungle the whole situation and I think Ben made a masterstroke of a move to place a no trade clause in his qualifying contract to make sure the Bulls would not recieve shit when he leaves.
Considering how Ben was handled it was a good move on his part, but he is gone. He is a Piston now….a damn Piston. He is in direct competition with us in our same fucking division. So HELL NO I will NOT be crying any crocodile tears for Ben Gordon…. I will hate him just like I hated Isaih Thomas and Joe Dumars.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's a difference between
“Gordon holding Rose’s leadership back” and “Rose can’t play with good players”.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I seem to remember
Rose playing worse with Kirk. Kirk dribbling, Rose standing at the 3pt line doing nothing…I don’t remember that with BG.
Rose was as good as he was this year along side BG. Were we not happy with Rose this season? What was so bad about Rose that signaled that BG was a bad guy for him. I thought Rose did great. Oh well. Guess he sucked.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, I thought Rose and Gordon played well together
for the most part. Sure, BG jacked up some shots, and dribbled a little too much at times, but it was much more frequent when Rose drew the defense and kicked it to BG for an easy jumper.
I can sorta see the “BG held Rose back” thing, definitely don’t agree with it, but I can understand it. What I couldn’t understand, though, is the “Rose can’t play with good players” thing, which is what I was questioning.
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because he should have deferred to him at certain points in the game.
Rose is not yet the best clutch player on the Bulls team (well I guess he is now with Gordon gone). As long as Gordon was there, Gordon was a better option down the stretch AT LEAST until Rose develops. This will come. It may not happen this season, but I have no doubt that Derrick Rose will be a fantastic player down the stretch of games. Next season, you can count on a lot of John Salmons to close out games. Mark my words!!
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 2, 2009 8:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm starting to come down a bit... and be ok with this.
Maybe it’s because I had a nacho bell grande and a gatorade… then I think about Deng and Hinrich still being on this god damn team and I feel sad. I really don’t see a reason to watch Bulls basketball next season. But ok BG is a Piston and it makes me shake my head. But ok…He’s gone..He’s gone. I guess the best part of next season will be VDN being fired and the lottery.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 2, 2009 12:53 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
"I really don’t see a reason to watch Bulls basketball next season."
Come on man. You don’t really mean that.
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 12:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
no
well…ok but not with the same optimism or hope.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 2, 2009 12:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's going to be like rooting for the Cubs again.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 2, 2009 12:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it is still worse being a Cubs fan.
My coworkers are like walking corpses these days with the way baseball has been going so far.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's a good thing for you.
Nothing worse than listening to a Cubs fan.
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Bears and Culter
but I think the Bulls will surprise starting with Rose.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 1:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we're the only ones looking forward to next season
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
count me in the mix
im hoping theres a crap load of season ticket holders who were ben gordon fans, cuz man when they put those tickets on craigs list or ebay….im getting them…..great seats to great games at great prices….last year i went to a couple games with that philosophy, the bulls would lose a bunch of games in a row, a bunch of peeved ticket holders put tickets on ebay for cheap cuz they couldnt care less about them and no one wants them anyway….i would buy them and get to enjoy a few good games…..good times…
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 1:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
what's the price range on those tickets?
"Gordon is a pretty good defender when he wants to be." - Andrew7
by gobulls1124 on Jul 2, 2009 1:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they'll be ok I just over react because I liked BG.
I think the Bulls are doing whats right in the long run but losing a good player stings. The Bears scare me because the expectations have been set pretty high. I hope they can meet them. I like the White Sox now. Cubs killed me off in 2003.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 2, 2009 1:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do to but he is gone
I think Rose is gonna have a great year and I think Deng has a lot to prove.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 1:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I never liked Deng not even when they drafted him.
When i watched him at Duke I didn’t unsterstand the hype. I’m afraid that I will have to just suck it up. Tyrus gets dogged ten times worse than Deng and I don’t understand that. Or why he makes the amount of money he does. But it looks like we’re stuck watching him in a Bulls uni for a few years.
He has a fifteen footer and his game hasn’t really progressed past a fifteen foot jumper and a slash to the basket. But lets all get on Tyrus because his Bball IQ blows. Well look who the coach is.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 2, 2009 1:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Ty
but we can’t get a ring with ty as the 3rd option we can with Deng. Ty need to play next to a dominant center and Noah is not the option. Scoring PF’s are easier to come by than centers, even though we don’t have one.
Homecoming
by illwill on Jul 2, 2009 1:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know, that's absolutely my assessment of Deng's game as well
He seems like a nice guy, but he doesn’t seem like he’s a good NBA player
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I cancelled my cable television
Maybe that decision was worth it now.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon's rookie year is what brought me back into Bulls fandom after the break up of
the dynasty. And now he is walking for nothing. I initially felt bad when Jerry and Pax got booed during Red’s ceremony. Now, I’m just pissed I wasn’t there to join in the chorus.
Help us Tyrus Thomas, your our only hope.
by silentpete on Jul 2, 2009 1:53 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I just realized this
I can’t wait until all the idiots at the United Center start booing Gordon because he’s in Detroit now. Because he’s a total backstabber and didn’t give accept an offer last year, or inform the Bulls that they can match Detroit’s offer this year.
I hope he lights them up and grabs his balls, with both hands, whenever he makes a 3. God this organization is stupid.
by NittanyCub on Jul 2, 2009 2:06 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
A whole new Dimension has been added to this Bulls/Pistons Rivalry
I am quite excited as a basketball fan to see upcoming Bulls/Pistons matchups. Suddenly this on and off Bulls/Pistons rivalry has some added spice… added flavor… like tabasco sauce.
Gordon… the former teammate… the former hero… is now the villian. The enemy. Like a World War 2 defection. But Gordon did what he believed in… what he felt that best for himself and his career. He was never obligated to come back to the Bulls. He was never obligated to come back to our cheers.
I can’t wait to see him in a Pistons uniform… its going to be weird. But at the same time its exciting. I want to see how the Bulls respond to facing Gordon and his new team. I want to see them play harder against the Piston because Gordon is on it. Prove to Gordon that they don’t need him.
At the same time I want to see Gordon play harder for the Pistons and show the Bulls that he doesn’t need them. Bulls/Pistons games should make for a bloody entertaining time!
by 420man! on Jul 2, 2009 3:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd boo his ass.
He is lucky to have received his payday but I’m glad the Bulls didn’t cripple themselves.
by Playboy_Bull on Jul 2, 2009 6:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They signed a cripple, does that count?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yes boo his ass....He is now the enemy. In league with our historic rival Detroit.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Bulls have no rivals
You have to be good to actually draw emotions from other teams.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben is playing in our division as a competiter...so yes I will boo him.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can boo whomever you want
Just pointing out the Bulls have no rivals.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL.....My friend and Bulls Brother Ozzie..... I concede the point, but the Ben Gordon Candlelight Vigil is beginning to get old.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Never! I will start a collection for an eternal flame to be put outside the UC
And cutting off MJ’s head on the statue and replacing it with Gordon’s bicep.
I’m over Gordon leaving. As I’ve said before, I never believed the organization wanted him back after last summer’s fiasco. My beef will be ever present if they don’t trade Hinrich, fully committing themselves to 2010 riches.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is the point. I think Hinrich is gone also....certainly by February.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No way
They’re retiring Hinrich’s number at the trade deadline and then extending his contract.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You could always go away.
Post on a different thread or something. You are not being held here against your will, right? Wink twice if you don’t feel safe to say it out loud.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it hasn't even been a day.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm pretty sure
I can find all five stages of grief in this comments section.
If there are problems in this world that jumping can solve, Tyrus Thomas will solve them. (Truehoop)
by Chalkwhite on Jul 2, 2009 2:46 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I liked Ben
but it is what it is, Period.
by TruEChiFaN... on Jul 2, 2009 3:32 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Bulls cheap?
Seriously the Bulls are not idiots. If the Bulls signed Gordon and went over the Salary Cap, would it be worth it? Would they win a championship with Ben Gordon, hell no.
"Basketball is like religion: many attend, few understand."
by morobb on Jul 2, 2009 6:13 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
Exactly what I've been saying...
everyone else is thinking with hearts.
by Playboy_Bull on Jul 2, 2009 6:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Luxury Tax for one year:
Ability to sign and trade a max player in 2010:
Better team next year
One of these things is worth the two others.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just stop using logic
We are using “our hearts.”
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hell no?
I don’t think anyone was arguing that singing BG to the extension he deserves was the key move in a championship strategy. However, 20ppg at the SG position and the option for two guards that can produce game winning shots on their own is pretty fucking important.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It sucks, it really sucks to see BG leave, but life goes on
I’m just wondering what would the Bulls do when the time to offer a new contract to Rose arrives. They better not be cheap…
by bull83 on Jul 2, 2009 6:24 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You have to Love Ben even if sometimes you hate him
With that said B-O-O H-O-O(thank you breakfest club)
The worst thing that could happen is him going to the pistons, now every time he puts up numbers I have to read about it at annoying levels by BaBers…….great!
by TruEChiFaN... on Jul 2, 2009 7:47 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
YOU GOT THAT RIGHT!
now every time he puts up numbers I have to read about it at annoying levels by BaBers
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 2, 2009 5:41 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
tremendous post yfBB
unfortunately my computer at home is on the fritz so i couldnt come here to bitch and moan last night. you hit the nail on the head on just about everything i was thinking. there is no plan other than “make JR as much money as possible.” he’s turned into donald sterling. it’s a disgrace.
if there were an actual plan at this point, the move would be dumping fish and hinrich for expirings and just tanking this season. even if we keep them and somehow miraculously sign bosh or some star next year (which im very doubtful of), what does that make us? essentially the hornets, and that’s only if rose somehow becomes at or near chris paul’s level, which is just too much to ask of anyone. might as well strip this team down and start over again, cause we’re now not one star away, but more like 2.
by Calogero on Jul 2, 2009 8:02 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Why the HELL
are there never any bulls rumors, its like their not doin anything
i see knicks pursuing kidd, raptors pursuing turkoglu
portland pursuing lee
nuggets actively trying to resign birdman
But i havent sen ANY bulls rumors, except like, bulls dont want to pay 11 mil for a 6th man or sumshit…..
by Faizamaze on Jul 2, 2009 8:07 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Simple: according to KC Johnson, they are not going to be proactive
Translation: they don’t know wtf they are doing and, worst, what to do now or if the 2010 plan – if there’s one – fails.
by bull83 on Jul 2, 2009 8:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The 2010 plan is just freeing up cap space and hoping somebody good signs with them
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I predict that if Hinrich is still a Bull when the season starts...
…Hinrich will end up starting some games at the 2 due to perceived problems with Salmons.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 2, 2009 8:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Salmons fits the Bulls "Company Man" mold
I think the club will need a new reason to bench Salmons to start Kirk.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Company man?
what is that supposed to mean?
by kozzer on Jul 2, 2009 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Salmons isn't "gritty" enough and hogs the ball too much
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't really see how Salmons is any different personality-wise than Gordon
He has complained just as much as Gordon in years past about not starting for Sacramento.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you blame Gordon for complaining about not starting over Chris Duhon???
I sure as hell can’t.
Plus you act like he’s been a chronic complainer and a cancer. Farthest thing from the truth. Gordon is one of the more professional guys in the league.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 3, 2009 2:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you keep reading into posts as people trying to bash Gordon?
Read what I wrote again. Gordon has complained before, it’s a fact. In the same way, Salmons also voiced displeasure in Sacramento about coming off the bench.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 3, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You would complain too Ozzie!
Who did Salmons play behind? Kevin Martin and Ron Artest? What the hell is he complaining about? And he complained A WHOLE LOT MORE!!! Here is a little blip from 82games.com team preview before last season:
“4) Salmons = Artest, and not in a good way. Upset about being benched after playing well as a starter, Salmons let his coach know about it, resulting in a minor beef between he and Theus. Unfortunately, he didn’t do himself any favors by scoring just 7.4 points on 43% FG shooting in 40 games off the bench. Not only does Salmons like to complain a la Artest, but he also tends to be a 1-on-1 ball-stopper, two negative qualities that the Kings would like to reduce in ’08-09.”
Gordon had LEGITIMATE gripes and is nowhere near the complainer that Salmons can be when he’s not happy. In fact, there may not be a more professional person in the NBA in that regard than Ben Gordon.
Gordon played behind CHRIS DUHON and KIRK HINRICH!!! Gordon clearly outplayed them both whereas Artest and Martin were clearly better than Salmons (Martin does a bit of ball-hogging himself though…but if you played for the Kings you might do that too).
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 6, 2009 11:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Real Mistakes.
I think letting BG go does not even rank amongst the many mistakes this organziation.
Paying Lu, Kirk, and Noc the kind of money we did is outrageous.
Giving Ben Wallace top dollar without realizing the guy had no legs.
Hiring a three point shooter with no coaching history. (What is it with non-athletic white guy shooters getting in positions of power all over the NBA and then sucking at their jobs? VDN, Kerr, Paxon.
BG was a one dimensional player who is very selfish. He didn’t start taking it to the rack again until this year. His rookie year and his contract year will remain his best, he will start settling for horrible jumpers quickly in Motown. He gave up on so many pick and rolls while guarding Ray Allen in the playoffs. He will single handedly win against us at least 4 times.
by LawsonHimself on Jul 2, 2009 9:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
So Gordon was playing for a contract
the last three seasons then, right?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jerry West has been decent
I heard he couldn’t shoot though.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was on Allen the first couple games, until the hamstring tear, from what I saw.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Biggest Bulls mistake was driving off Phil Jackson for Tim Floyd.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 2, 2009 5:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mr. Chairman has no money for BG
and nearly 200 million for the Phoenix Coyotes.
Retire already you old bastard. Quit this business and drown in your cashspa.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:32 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Can we petition the other 29 owners to register complaints with the NBA
that our cheapass owner and his 20-30 million operating profit and refusal to breach the luxury tax is a hidden systemic risk to the NBA cartel?
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 9:45 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I couldn't disagree more
Ben Gordon was a GREAT scorer for the Bulls. One of the best the franchise has seen. However, paying $55 million for just a pure scorer and having a $11 million a year locked up was not going to win us any championships.
When was the last championship team that had a shooting guard that was 6 feet tall.
He couldn’t play defense. Yes, he would score 20 points but he’d also give up 20 pts.
I hope that the Bulls don’t panic and sign someone this year, or if they do it is a one year contract.
Why is everyone so concerned about next year. We were not going to compete for a championship next year no matter what. Lets look at the big picture… In 2010, we will now have the flexibility to get maybe 2 elite players…
For years the Bulls have been going with the formula of having a deep team that consisted of 10 above average players, but no all-around stars. This is not the formula to win championships. Only 5 players can play on the court at once. Championship teams need 2-3 stars, 2-3 above average players and a bunch of role players.
We have one future star in Rose. Gordon was not a star, he was a scorer. We should trade whoever and I mean whoever (outside of Rose) to get Bosh and sign him to an extension and then go hard after Wade. A team of Rose and Bosh (and possibly Wade) would be very attractive for older quality players to come in and want to be role players on a team with this type of star power.
Gordon was great and I appreciate what he did for this team, but with him we would be nothing more than a mediocre team… We expect GREATNESS!
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 9:46 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The point is you don't let 20ppg players, who are good guys, and in the prime of their career go for NOTHING.
That’s just BAD, all the way around, for a million reasons.
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are the reasons?
You do when they’re asking for $11 million a year and don’t play defense… I agree he was a good guy and a great scorer, but that would only take us so far… If you want a team that will actually compete for a championship, we had to let him go.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You think the Bulls have a plan for building a championship team?
I’d like to know what it is.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stars... Not above average players
The plan is to bring in Bosh or Amar’e. From what I hear we really want Bosh more. Lets say that we need to trade to get Bosh in here at the deadline. I would give up Tyrus, Brad Miller, James Johnson and Kirk if it took that.
If you have Rose at the 1, Salmons at the 2, Deng at the 3, Bosh at the 4, and Noah at the 5. That is a team based around 2 stars in Rose and Bosh. Deng and Salmons are above average players. Noah can be a rebound and defensive specialist. Then you fill in the rest of the team with role players.
I believe we will still have money to go after Wade as well… I know we don’t know if these guys will come to us, but I’d rather be patient and take a chance at greatness rather than settling for slightly above average
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That trade would not get Bosh...
The chances of Wade and Bosh being Bulls is essentially 0. In the meantime, the Bulls lost a 20ppg scorer for nothing. If you keep trying addition by subtraction eventually you get nothing.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I admit chances of getting both are slim...
But at least there is a chance… and I think there is a pretty good chance we get one. If not, we spend money on other quality free agents then. But at least we will have a chance at getting elite talent back in Chicago.
If we sign Ben Gordon we take that chance a way, and lets be honest we were not going to win a championship with Gordon being our leading scorer… You name for me the last time a 6 foot shooting guard led his team to the championship. The closest anyone has come has been Iverson, who at the time was in another league than Gordon and was actually more of a point guard…
I’m sorry I’m not satisfied with going a round or two into the playoffs and not having a real chance of competing for a championship because we don’t want to give up a good guy that can score 20 points. It’s time the Bulls make some bold moves.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even after signing Gordon, I believe we would've had enough to get a max player in the 2010 FA bonanza.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Esepcially if they traded Hinrich for expiring contracts................
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, that would actually make sense
Not gonna happen.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Other possibilities...
Even beyond LeBron, Wade, Bosh, and Amare, there are a lot of other good free agents available. Just to name a few:
Joe Johnson, Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, Dirk Nowitzki, Josh Howard, Kenyon Martin, Tracy McGrady, Micael Redd, Steve Nash, Brandon Roy (restricted), Manu Ginobili, Carlos Boozer, Mehmet Okur
Although some don’t fit with the Bulls, some teams with cap space will be spending money on them freeing up the other players for us. Anyone of these guys can replace the scoring of Gordon
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
good point
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 2, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wow.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sarcastic.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 2, 2009 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, Kenyon Martin's gonna light it up for us!
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Read the whole post...
If you read the whole post I said some of these guys aren’t a fit for the Bulls, but other teams with cap room will give them money freeing up the other guys for us.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Another weed smoker? ;)
Yeah, Kenyon Martin’s gonna light it up for us!
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 2, 2009 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't count:
Ray Allen, Kenyon Martin, Tracy McGrady, Brandon Roy (restricted), Carlos Boozer, Mehmet Okur
Simply put, MeMo isn’t that great: neither is Boozer, and he’s old. Neither is K-Mart. Ray Allen has two surgically repaired ankles and won’t get too much, McGrady is COMPLETELY done, and Brandon Roy is going to be resigned by the Blazers [obviously. Seriously? Unless the Blazers totally shit the bed]. Ginobli … a lot depends on how e does this season. I’ve heard varying things about his surgery.
So … that’s ten guys. There is a lot of cap space out there, though, and after FA’s see the way we [mis]handled the Gordon negotiations, I doubt they’ll be flocking to us and our either first-round-and-out or playoff-missing team of greatness.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why FA's will come...
I don’t think any player is going to care that we “mishandled” the Gordon negotiations if we are flashing a max deal at them, a chance to play in Chicago (one of the biggest markets in the league), and a chance to play with an up-and-coming stud point guard that will feed them the ball.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seriously? What are the reasons?
Why don’t you start off by re-reading YFBB’s post at the top of the page. It’s pretty detailed.
And then you can tell me what the plan is to rebuild a championship team? How are we going to add the many pieces we need to compete in the EAST, let alone for a championship? We’re going to lure Chris Bosh and D. Wade here bc our GM and Owner are so charming? We’re going to show them the 6 trophies from the 90’s and hope they remember how great MJ was (but forget how we broke that dynasty up too soon)? Do we just hope they’re White Sox fans and offer them the opportunity to sit in the chairman’s luxury box? Or maybe we’re smart enough to try to be proactive and create our own luck and we actually pursue a Bosh at the trade deadline. Who are we going to trade for Bosh in a sign and trade at that time? Linton Johnson and the bronze Michael Jordan statue?
I can’t wait to hear the answers….
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hear you go...
How are we going to have a chance to afford these players with a 6 foot shooting guard taking up up $11 mil a year??
I admit fully that Gordon was a good player and we will struggle for scoring at times, but if you think our team is going to fall apart and be the most unattractive team to free agents you are way off. We had a deep team… we couldn’t get all of our quality guys enough playing time as it was to make them happy. The scoring will be picked up by the other players and we will still compete for the playoffs with our team now. Rose’s scoring will improve. Hinrich will get more PT and get points. Salmons has proven he can be a great scorer and now will get more touches. Deng was hurt at the end of the season, and he will be more involved in the offense. Tyrus was showing improvements on the O end, and I’m hoping Noah is working on some offensive game.
Gordon was great, but at times he even hurt our offense because the team would just defer to him and he’d dribble around and just try to get his own shot. We should actually play a better team offense without him
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
VDN is the coach, Salmons dominates the ball as much or more than Gordon
Team offense will not magically appear.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Points
I agree that VDN has a LOT to learn, and Salmons took some shots in the playoffs that if they didn’t go in, I would have been calling for his head. However, Salmons has good size and can play defense, and is talented on the offensive end. Hopefully, VDN can push the team offense on this team and Salmons will buy in
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Salmons can't play team D at all and will [IMHO] not buy into the team O
he’s a selfish player.
We’ll see … he’s reinvented himself before, though.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He'll do fine on offense
Despite the departure of Gordon, the team will still take a shitload of bad jump shots, and in the process will have to rely on Salmons and Hinrich to replicate their career-best performances beyond the arc.
His overrated defense won’t really matter. I don’t buy the Bulls getting better on defense because they still don’t understand the basic tenets of a team defense, and Vinny is definitely not the guy to coach it. With Hinrich, Deng, Thomas, and Noah they have enough skill and athleticism to be average, nothing better.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
I agree, and with Ben Gordon they would have been slightly above average. In order to be great we need to trad away the four you named off for legit elite stars to pair with Rose, and then fill in the rest of the team when you have a core of three star players set
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Salmons Can play D.He did a great job on Pierce as I remember
who is heck of a offensive player.
General manager needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.
Sir Paxdorf.
by Azabullsfan on Jul 2, 2009 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh I just read that you said Team defense...Not sure about that also.
He is a smart vet,but we need a coach who can “buy him in”.
General manager needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.
Sir Paxdorf.
by Azabullsfan on Jul 2, 2009 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, that's not a plan, that's a wish...
Tyrus was showing improvements on the O end, and I’m hoping Noah is working on some offensive game.
Super-duper! Finger’s crossed?
But seriously, now tell me how we’re going to S&T for Bosh?
For my true fans, I feel bad for them. The longtime fans of the Chicago Bulls – I just felt like they’re being cheated. Not with me, but just things that happened in the past. I feel like the fans deserve a lot better. - BG7
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait, I see your "plan" above...
and I laugh at it. HA!
(I’m really not trying to be an arse, I’m just pissed at the Bulls Org. and I think you’re slightly delusional today).
For my true fans, I feel bad for them. The longtime fans of the Chicago Bulls – I just felt like they’re being cheated. Not with me, but just things that happened in the past. I feel like the fans deserve a lot better. - BG7
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are your issues?
I realize that Noah and Tyrus are not going to be offensive solutions. I don’t really even care if they’re on the team in the long-term. You just pulled out one line from my explanation on how we’re going to make up some of out offense.
Please explain to me what issues you have with my plan of getting stars for this team? I’m sorry that you think competing for the 4th-8th playoff spot is acceptable as long as we’re in it every year, but I’d rather take a step back one year, to have a CHANCE at taking a huge step forward the next.
As I stated above:
Even beyond LeBron, Wade, Bosh, and Amare, there are a lot of other good free agents available. Just to name a few:
Joe Johnson, Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, Dirk Nowitzki, Josh Howard, Kenyon Martin, Tracy McGrady, Micael Redd, Steve Nash, Brandon Roy (restricted), Manu Ginobili, Carlos Boozer, Mehmet Okur
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 10:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that competing for a low playoff spot is acceptable? Heeeeelll no.
Gordon has value, YFBB, myself, and everyone who is super-pissed today understands that and THAT is why we’re pissed. Bc we gave away VALUE for nothing. No one, and I believe this, thought we HAD to keep BG to compete for championships, but rather that we couldn’t let someone- who clearly holds value around the league- go for nothing if we want to make moves. In the NBA, you can sit and hope the lottery balls fall your way- and we’ve been more than lucky that they have on more than one occasion- or you can go out, make moves and make your team. You can’t make moves with no assets, and I hate to break it to you, but that trade you proposed (Tyrus, Miller, Johnson & Kirk) above for Bosh is an absolute joke… and actually, why am I even bothering with this rant bc if you’re of the mind that a trade like that would be feasible I’m pretty sure I’m wasting my time…
For my true fans, I feel bad for them. The longtime fans of the Chicago Bulls – I just felt like they’re being cheated. Not with me, but just things that happened in the past. I feel like the fans deserve a lot better. - BG7
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right...
First off, if it would take Deng, Noah, Tyrus, Johnson and Kirk for Bosh I’d do the deal. Anything that would not involve Rose is acceptable with me.
I don’t know what you think would need to be done to get Bosh…
Biedrins, Bellinelli Brandon Wright and Curry are being proposed for Stoudamire… Stoudamire and Bosh should pull in the same type of deal.
Tyrus, Johnson Kirk and Miller is not that far off. Instead of getting one more young player, the team would be getting a big expiring contract (Miller), which is also very attractive, but whatever… Like I said, I’d do whatever it took to get Bosh outside of trading Rose.
This team is slightly above average and that is it. I like a lot of the players, they are good guys, but we need to compete for a championship.
I understand your feelings that you don’t want to see Ben Gordon go for nothing. I suppose we could have tried to deal him at the trade deadline, but for what? We don’t need any more young talent. We don’t need anymoe draft picks. We need a star. If we could have traded him in a package for Bosh or Amare at the deadline I would’ve done it, but those teams were not looking for him. There was no possible matches that made sense for us. If you could tell me a good possible solution other than “We should have just signed BG” then let me know, but I think I’m wasting my time…
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose/Bosh/three D-League players isn't going to get you a championship.
It will, however, get you an award as the new big-market Grizzlies. [KG and Sam Cassell?]
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 11:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tyrus is next.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree. I think the draft of the two forwards sealed the deal for Tyrus.
by Bart71 on Jul 2, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought benching him during the playoffs sealed the deal myself.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wanting to get paid sealed it.
Tyrus has a high opinion of himself. That’s no good.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone who eats a PB&J is cursed
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 12:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tyrus should be good trade bait
We should push Tyrus hard to Toronto in a package to get Bosh. Phoenix also really liked him… if we can’t get Bosh Amar’e would be a good backup plan. As long as we can give these guys an extension and they don’t ditch us in free agency, do what it takes to get one of them without giving up Rose.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thik Gibson was a bad pick
He is 24… We are overloaded at forward as it is. We clearly knew Gordon wasn’t in our plans. Why not take Ellington. Or better yet, why not deal the pick because we don’t need to develop another average player to take up PT.
Did anyone notice how much better we played when the rotation was cut down to a 7-8 man rotation. When you play 10-11 guys, chemistry does not form and players don’t get comfortable with their roles.
by Got2BtheB on Jul 2, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good as gone!
For my true fans, I feel bad for them. The longtime fans of the Chicago Bulls – I just felt like they’re being cheated. Not with me, but just things that happened in the past. I feel like the fans deserve a lot better. - BG7
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
From what I've read, it's easy to pick up 20ppg scorers
Gordon did that and he wasn’t even any good. The Bulls can just sign AI or Pargo to replace those points. Points are easy to replace. That’s what I’ve read…
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't always agree with you (understatement), but I think your post summed up exactly how I'm feeling today...
The most poignant part IMO, and the one I’m most afraid of is:
This is a team that just told the league they do not like spending money on their best players. That’s always an attractive quality in a franchise that’s courting free agents. Just give me a minute while I get Benny and the Luvabulls before we head to the airport and greet the lucky fellas.
by smash! on Jul 2, 2009 9:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Look, you can argue that Gordon isn't worth money and paying him trashing signing a FA in 2010
I would disagree with that, but never mind.
The larger point is that the Bulls lost a significant amount of talent for nothing. Good teams don’t let a situation like that develop. Of the Nocioni, Kirk, Deng, BG group the Bulls signed everyone but the most talented. Moreover of Deng, Kirk, and BG they paid the mony in inverse ratio to talent. Letting Gordon go for nothing is the sign of a completely incompetent organization.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 2, 2009 10:02 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Wow, Ben quote from McGraw article:
To the fans, I generally had a great time being here,’ Gordon said in a phone interview. ‘For my true fans, I feel bad for them. The longtime fans of the Chicago Bulls – I just felt like they’re being cheated. Not with me, but just things that happened in the past. I feel like the fans deserve a lot better.’
BG tells us all what we already know, Reinsdorf is cheating you out of your money and time. Stop following this team. Boycott, until he sells.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 2, 2009 10:05 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Smash made me look at your sig, and it's amazing. Kudos.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
[Also I agree with the article bla bla bla. ... Sigh.]
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 2, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am thrilled...
BG was an over-priced, one-dimensional, me-first player who couldn’t pass, defend or rebound. Why would you want to go over the luxury tax for him? He thinks he is a star, he is not. Let’s see if Detroit wins more game with him.
Did he seem like a nice guy who really cared about winning? Yes. Was that reflected in his style of play in the form of passing, playing to a scheme or recognizing his limitations? No. I don’t know about you guys, but I am thrilled that we will no longer have end of quarters with BG hogging the ball, going solo, getting trapped and jacking up a desperate shot.
by bullsfaninbigapple on Jul 2, 2009 10:16 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
if it makes you feel better
we’d be going into the luxury tax for Tim Thomas.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Btw, I don't disagree that...
…Gar Paxdorf have not done a good job of managing the franchise and have over-paid Deng etc. The points you have made questioning the direction of the franchise are all valid ones. Where we disagree is whether signing Gordon improves the situation or makes it worse. IMO, over-paying for Gordon would not improve the situation, it would have just locked us into mediocrity for the next 4-5 years. We may still remain mediocre due to managerial incompetence, but now at least we have a chance to get out – with a $55mm contract, we were doomed to be average.
by bullsfaninbigapple on Jul 2, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
only if you had to stop spending
$25m in expiring contracts this year. You can get something for that.
I like Bosh as a Bull, but having him and Ben Gordon is even better.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Detriot
basically traded Billups and Wallace for Ben and Villanueva. Now come on, let’s get back to reality. If it took 11 mil for the Bulls to keep him then Good Luck to Detriot.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 2, 2009 10:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
lesson learned for our future FA fun
you have to ‘overpay’ to get talent from other teams. That’s why it’s usually better to draft or trade for them.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also take a shot at those players that can be had for a reasonable price
like the Spurs have done.
Right now the Bulls should be looking at players who are unresricted, such as Wafer, Nesterovic (shouldn’t we have gone after him instead of trying to keep Gray?), Carney, Frye, and Diogu.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 2, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Spurs are smarter and luckier than us
we can spend our way out of some mistakes, but chose not to. It’s going to take a decade to replicate what the Spurs did.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 2, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Instead Gar is going to replicate what Paxson did for the next decade.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 2, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sweet
Notre Dame boosters rejoice!
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A VIEW AFTER CALMING DOWN
Last night I was terribly disappointed. Here is my view this morning.
Short term:
1- Most likely we are not as good this year w/o BG. He is an effective weapon we just lost. This is the most likely short-term outcome.
2- Less likely but possible. BG played over his head last year. It was a contract year. VDN’s system was offensive-minded and uptempo. He started, was a key player in a system which played to his offensive strengths and minimized his defensive weaknesses. Hamilton and BG do not mix. BG does not have a good 2009-10 season. The Bulls are vindicated.
4- Though less likely and admittedly a stretch, there is a possibility that w/o BG others players thrive. Deng, Hinrich and Salmons thrive with extra minutes and mesh with new rookies. We play better defense and are better without BG.
Long-term
1- We clearly have strengthened our position to recruit a star either February or in the 2010 summer sweepstakes. If we somehow get D Wade this turns into a big win for the Bulls. Getting Wade is an unlikely option if we signed BG long-term.
2- We do not make the playoffs because of not having BG which negatively impacts recruiting. The Bulls remain in the mediocrity abyss the next five years.
I want to see the glass half-full.
by chgobr on Jul 2, 2009 11:10 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I strongly disagree with long-term 1.
First, we have one less good player here. Wade openly said the Bulls should re-sign Gordon. So in his mind, he’s got more evidence now that the Bulls don’t agree with his thought process. Good players like to play with other good players. Wade’s even said he’d like to play with BG.
Second, we have one less piece to conduct a sign and trade for a star player.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't Miami after BG for a while there last year?
D’oh.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 2, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They were definetly after kirk
i dont remember pat riley being a huge gordon fan though….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just a thought but
wade gordon and d-wade cant all possibly co-exist together….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 2, 2009 11:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wade, gordon, and d-wade?
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jul 2, 2009 11:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hah
there goes the validity of my question…..
:)
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 3, 2009 1:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Add long-term #3:
The Bulls stink so badly that Rose takes the qualifying offer so he can leave for a championship contender.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 2, 2009 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben Gordon was good but
let’s not forget that he was injured for most of the year and as a slasher, is someone who cannot create his own shot. While he gets along great with JR, it’s nice to see that JR is able to put aside his own personal feelings for the good of the team. It is clear that the Bulls still have the top two players out of the trifecta of Deng, Gordon, and Hinrich.
by MrBungle on Jul 2, 2009 11:48 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
This is my new favorite snark post
Winz!!1
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jul 2, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was going to write a massive angry post against you
Then I realized you were talking about the Sudanese Samaritan.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Overrated
I’m new to the site, but BG is not a difference maker and isn’t worth close to $55 mil. I’d rather the Bulls have a shot at LB or CB or DW next year than sign a guy with a very limited game. The Bulls weren’t going anywhere with him, well maybe another .500 season and first round exit from the playoffs. Furthermore, he doesn’t fit well with D. Rose, not in the least bit. His defense is absolutely deplorable, and is reminiscent of AI as an older veteran. What does that mean? As he ages, he’ll become even worse (if that’s possible). As Bulls fans, everyone should rejoice that the Pistons are more mediocre than ever after shelling out close to $100 million for middle-of-the-road players. Also, another player in the 2010 FA off the boards.
"Yeah, Moe, that team sure did suck last night. They just plain sucked! I’ve seen teams suck before, but they were the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever sucked!" - Homer
by propheteer on Jul 2, 2009 12:15 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I am late to this post but
He sure did quite well for himself financially, and doesn’t look so ‘stupid’ for turning down previous offers.
What? Didn’t he turn down 50 million over 5 yrs in 2007? So he lost out on ~10 million and has 2 more years until his next deal.
Does he still have the same agents? I hope not.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming"
by ridindirty on Jul 2, 2009 7:06 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You obviously didn't bother to click on the link
Because you’re very off on your numbers.
by Sports2 on Jul 2, 2009 7:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A little Haiku for the occasion ...
Ive been here a while
This is my first time posting
Fuck you Gar Paxdorf
by JoNo's Swag on Jul 3, 2009 4:36 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
How can some of you call yourselves Bulls fans?
As far as I know we have no one in the organization named Kurt or Paxon. We do have a Kirk and a Paxson though. Also losing Ben is the best thing that happened to this organization since they rid themselves of Wallace and Hughes. Things are continuing to look up. I just wish you guys could see the light.
by numba7 on Jul 3, 2009 3:38 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If you were a Bulls fan, you should realize that VDN calls Kirk "Kurt".
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 3, 2009 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I know. So since he is an idiot it gives you guys permission to be idiots?
by numba7 on Jul 3, 2009 7:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Use the "reply" button - some of us "idiots" have figured that out at least.
Furthermore, calling Hinrich “Kurt” is a running BaB joke, not idiocy.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 3, 2009 7:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it always
seems more idiocy than joke, though.
and that’s why i laugh!
by marionette on Jul 4, 2009 1:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mean more idiocy than joke,
when VDN says “Kurt”?
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 4, 2009 2:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
