One of the bigger names remaining, Chicago Bulls free agent guard Ben Gordon, didn't get an offer in the early hours Wednesday, but will go to Detroit Wednesday morning to visit with the Pistons, who are expected to offer the fifth-year shooting guard a multi-year contract between $10 and $11 million annually.
Hopefully on his visit Ben sees dozens of cars on fire and realizes Detroit is no place to be.
4 months ago
your friendly BullsBlogger
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Hopefully on the way out of town he doesn't turn on Chicago sports radio and think that all the fans don't want him back
We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan
by snley on Jul 1, 2009 10:09 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
damn you guys
I checked into AM1000 cause I read below Dumars would be on. Instead I get Tom Waddle saying that Rose can’t grow as a player with Ben Gordon around. Go catch some footballs with you face, jackass.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
stunt his growth..
yes having players that can open the lanes for Rose will stunt his growth. This is the best bulls talk for now. later we get to hear B&B say short term loss long term gain…(cry)
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
B&B should be smarter than that
though to be fair they are completely bearish on the Bulls doing anything for years to come, so Gordon is irrelevant I suppose.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yeah the Bulls are in NBA hell according to B&B.
But I believe to be in NBA hell you can’t have players like Derrick Rose. Example the Bulls with just Hinrich and BG, Deng..thats NBA hell.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and while in nba hell
they still managed to make the playoffs most years, while once getting to the second round….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 1, 2009 4:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well that's their definition
it’s not a new concept: no championships, no lottery picks
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think actual nba hell
is what the grizzlies have, or the timberwolves, being a team that year in and year out goes to the lottery, doesnt get a good enough player, and then continues to suck it up year after not making the playoffs and having bad reps around thier team. The buls give us way too many moments of hapiness and hope, and so that cant be hell (or maybe im sort of religious so i see hell as the worst thing possible in all of existence as opposed to a real crummy situation)
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 1, 2009 5:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's not so much basketball hell
as it is basketball idiocy. They have the chance with lottery picks to get that big piece yet haven’t cashed in on their (many) opportunities. The Bulls would still be (deep) in basketball hell had a) Isiah not been in charge of the Knicks and 2) Derrick Rose not have fallen into their laps.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the term everyone is looking for is
basketball purgatory. That’s where the Bulls have been for awhile — when you just barely make the playoffs, but don’t make good enough offseason moves or get good enough draft picks to every get any better than a 7th or 8th seed.
But the Bulls should NOT be there, seeing as how we lucked into the No. 1 overall pick last year…
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe that this is true. Rose is the one now. That is why I don't believe Ben will be back.
Honestly I think the same goes for Kirk, Deng and Tyrus. Everyone thinks I am crazy to suggest that Johnson and Gibson will become a part of a new core, but I think that drafting Derrick Rose set all of it in motion. Rose has made everyone else expendable and the reason/excuse will be because they do not “fit” with Derrick.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
so basically
Rose is Reinsdorf’s new “profit monkey”
by M 80 on Jul 1, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly... Rose is the cash cow...but I said this last year. Unfortunately this is a business.
and Reinsdorf is about making money. The 2007-2008 debacle led to Rose falling into our laps. A writer analysing last years draft said that If the Bulls take Beasley then they were satisfied with the team as it is, but if they took Rose that other changes would be on the way because drafting Rose changes the team totally.
Rose success has now quickened the pace of those changes. Riensdorf has hit the jackpot.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose is a cash cow based on success
If the Bulls stink it up this year, then he’s just another good player that “can’t even lift his team to the playoffs”.
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose is the only reason why we made the playoffs this year.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, he wasn't
Watching games helps in analysis once in a while.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Without Rose you are saying we still would have made the playoffs.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Without Gordon they don't make the playoffs
Without Salmons or Miller they don’t make the playoffs, without Noah they don’t make the playoffs. See how easy this game is?
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The year before Rose dropped into our laps?
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did you honestly think they were good?
They won 41 games, and made the playoffs by beating up lottery teams after the trades.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I did not say they were good. I said without Rose the Bulls
would not have made the playoffs.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes..........we know that. That argument would also work with 5 other players
You make it seem like Rose carried the team. He did that for about a month.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And the Bulls made the playoffs by only 2 games
I agree with both of you. Without any one of several players, the Bulls would have missed the playoffs, but I also think that Rose had the biggest impact of any player on the roster, including BG.
by kozzer on Jul 1, 2009 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
No. It does not work. Teams had to change how they
play the Bulls to account for Rose. Rose became a factor in EVERY game, because of what he may do.
Rose was not always successful and yes he did have teammates who stepped up also, but Rose changed the Bulls. Players are coming and are looking forward to playing with Rose.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's times like these when it's important to remember the old adage
. . . never argue with fools, they will drag you down to their level and beat with you experience.
Bart71’s attempting to drag you down, don’t let him.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Down to my level?
Get your head out of the sky and look at what is on the ground.
I said the Rose was JR’s new cash cow. That is not a statement of ignorance that is a fact.
I said that the drafting of Derrick Rose set in motion other changes to come and it has started. Ignorance?
Sports2 said that if the Bulls stink it up this year that Derrick Rose would be known as a good player, but he could not lift his team to the playoffs, to which I responded that if it was not for Derrick Rose we would have not made the Playoffs.
Ozzie then responded basically saying that my statement could be applied to other teammates to which I disagreed with and went into why I made the statement in the first place.
Intellegent discussion, me and Ozzie have had other discussions in the past and whether we agree or agree to disagree then that is fine.
So please Fundamental weight in on where you think I am “foolish” or obviously not up to “your level”, whatever that means, since you are so enlightened and so wise and leave the little cheap shots alone.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're trying to change what you said.
You actually said this,
Rose is the only reason why we made the playoffs this year.
Now, you’re trying to claim what you said is this,
if it was not for Derrick Rose we would have not made the Playoffs.
Which is not intellectually honest. The first statement is entirely foolish. Derrick Rose is clearly not the ONLY reason we made it to the playoffs this year. He wasn’t even the best player on the team.
The second statement is more defensible, but you could say that about any of the 5 starters on the team and be correct. Does this team make the playoffs without Brad Miller or John Salmons? No, it doesn’t. So it’s a stupid thing to say as some sort of claim about Rose’s value.
So you’ve said all sorts of foolish things, so I called you a fool. There you go.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 4:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Remove Rose from the Bulls and we don't
make the playoffs. We could have still made it if any of the others were removed.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 4:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that is not a new core
those are just two guys picked in the middle of a cruddy draft.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gotta agree w/ yfBB here
not sure that they’re the new core. Johnson has boom or bust potential, but hardly anyone you can count on as a sure-fire prospect.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
JJ and Taj should strengthen the bench. Anything beyond that is a bonus.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 1, 2009 6:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course Rose is the one,
but that doesn’t mean that you then let all your good players go so that you can get new, crappier players.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What does that even mean?
If you’re just saying that’s a good excuse for the Bulls to get cheap bad talent to replace our expensive decent talent, fine, but I wouldn’t judge how greedy or not people were in this mess of an offense we had this year.
Also, we brought in Salmons. He actually ballhogs more than Gordon.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
All successful teams know the pecking order. Rose was placed on top for a reason.
Rose plays a different game from Hinich. If the team is the same as it was without Rose then keeping Ben Gordon is a no brainer. Gordon and Hinrich “fit” together well, but neither of them fit with Rose. You know that Gordon likes the ball in his hands and create with the ball in his hands….now with Hinich this is fine because we know Hinrich is not going to do anything with the ball anyway…not with Rose.
Rip Hamilton or someone who plays like Hamilton is a better fit for Rose. I know Salmons is no Rip Hamilton. I know Salmons is not the answer because as you say he is a ballhog himself. It is not about getting bad talent because the “good” talent would not defer to Derrick Rose. It is about getting NEW talent to go with the new style of play Rose brings to the table since he is the one that the team NOW revolves around.
That is why they drafted the way they did. They drafted Johnson and Gibson with Rose in mind. Not with Ben, Kirk, Luol or Tyrus in mind. That is what I mean.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know ...
I see an attempt to get the PF/SF positions under control with this draft – which makes sense, because TT is foul-prone and hasn’t played up to expectations, and because Luol Deng keeps breaking things.
If we were really trying to build around Rose I’d think we would’ve picked better shooters for those positions.
I do, however, think Rose and Gordon work well together – offensively. Gordon does the ‘hog ball/jack up shot’ thing too often, it’s true, but there isn’t anyone in the league better to kick out to than BG on the arc.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Waddle is much more style than substance.
I like him as a personality, but he just throws a bunch of vague statements around and when one sticks, he references it daily for the next year.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he just said the Bulls should pursue Turk.
They don’t have money!
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, Waddle doesn't know jack outside of football
I’m not sure he even watches Chicago sports outside of the Bears and maybe an occasional Cubs game..
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I went balistic when I read this.
I have zero respect for twad. Seriously when was the last time he watched a fucking bulls game, let alone NBA game. I stopped listening to them a long time ago.
If we aren't careful, the leanness we now feel will be the starvation of those we serve.
by Chi 'Till I Die on Jul 1, 2009 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I remember during the playoffs
you had your choice of Silvy & Waddle or Dan Hampton and the annoying Lawrence Holmes. What a platter of garbage.
by M 80 on Jul 1, 2009 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hamp and Holmes,
now that was a disaster. How Hampton ever got on the air is beyond me. He’s a meatball with no verbal skills.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm
Auburn Hills — Chicago Bulls guard Ben Gordon and Milwaukee Bucks forward Charlie Villanueva will be at the Pistons’ practice facility Wednesday, meeting with president Joe Dumars and maybe take a tour of the area and do a little home shopping.
That’s how serious the courtship is between the two free agents and the Pistons.
There is a chance a verbal commitment could be reached soon.
-Charlie-Villanueva-visit-Pistons-today" >detnews.com
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
There's a lot of houses available in Detroit.
Who wants to live in Detroit right now (Ghost town).
by PricanStar on Jul 1, 2009 11:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they all live in the rich suburbs outside of Detroit and believe it or not
there are some rich suburbs up there.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't look good
Chicago Bulls guard Ben Gordon(notes) and Milwaukee Bucks forward Charlie Villanueva(notes) flew to Detroit on Wednesday morning for a mid-day meeting with team president Joe Dumars and indications are both are moving rapidly toward deals with the Detroit Pistons, league and sources close to the two players told Yahoo! Sports.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 10:17 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Isn't there ANYWHERE else that Ben can go?
please, not the Pistons..
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 10:19 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Well Rodman ended up coming here. Call it Karma.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rodman played himself out of Detroit and San Antonio
Ben’s biggest mistake is not being Kirk Hinrich.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
or signing the contracts he was offered.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right, can't offend Reinsdorf and his fake deadlines
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well apparently it was a very real deadline
yet arbitrary. :)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Quiet, I'm clutching my BG autographed napkin and crying my morning away
No one can replace his chiseled arms, no oneeeeeeeeeeee.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Detroit is offering him more money than the Bulls did
So obviously they value him more than the Bulls do. Considering how bush-league the Bulls acted last summer in pulling their offer after he decided to accept it, I don’t know why he should even bother giving the Bulls a chance to match.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ozzie do you really believe that Kirk is going to remain a Bull? I think Kirk is next....
they are clearing the deck for Rose. They are making a new core.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I find it necessary actually
at least dealing Hinrich is SOME kind of plan (suck and get cheap and lie to us about 2010) as opposed to just hoping guys ‘pick up the slack’ back to 41 wins.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stop telling us they wanna become a better defensive unit.
You would fire VDN if that was true.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the season when they flopped sealed their fate. The drafting of Derrick Rose has
changed everything. Just like it was with Jordan. Once the championships started rolling in the team had totally changed from when he was a rookie. It would be foolish to think that this “process” would not be repeated with Derrick Rose.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm
so Pete Myers is the next Phil Jackson?
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except the Bulls had good players before they drafted Rose.
Lots of them! Like, 73 lottery picks worth.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Bulls should of tried to get Gordon"
—angryandy
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 10:19 AM CDT reply actions 5 recs
Gordan*
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lets see..
Stop Rose and Salmons and you stop the Bulls. Thats how simple it will be. To me at least. Going to be a long season. Doubt they make the playoffs… it’s looking like 20010 or bust.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Johnson will kick in. It is not going to be that easy. Why all the negativity. The sky has not fallen.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Johnson like the rookie?
yeahhhhhh
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The boy got skills though. I think he is going to do well. He is an offensive player.
He can’t be left open. No he is not Lebron, but he will contribute and WHO is going to stop Rose.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Um, good defenses
This isn’t Rucker Park. Teams are allowed to have strategies to stop the opponent’s most dangerous player, despite what Vinny thinks.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That will open the door for the other players who will play off of Rose. That is how it
should be done.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
key word is Vinny.
it doesn’t help your argument. lol
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LIAR
Teams aren’t allowed to collapse into the lane to stop Derrick Rose!
DRIVE ROSE! SCORE! RUN THE OFFENSE OF SCORING POINTS
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That 33% from 3 is RIGHTEOUS!!!
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Johnson will kick in? Is that one of his kickboxing moves or something?
That might be the way he can contribute the most next season.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kick wit his Martial Skills?
I wonder which fighting style he knows? Tae Kwon Do? Kung Fu? Mui Thai? Kickboxing? Ju Jitsu? I hope Ju Jitsu because Ju Jitsu kicks all those other fighting styles asses.
by 420man! on Jul 1, 2009 6:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
how will anyone stop John Salmons?!?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
from preventing "BG the Pistons" torching the Bulls for 50 pts every time they play one another!
man up!
by exult463 on Jul 1, 2009 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hinrich
will get in foul trouble lock him down
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course, since his chances of remaining a Bull are higher
Portland is trying to make a sign and trade for Andre Miller with Philly
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
While the Chicago fans give him a standing ovation! And I aint talking about Hinrich!
man up!
by exult463 on Jul 1, 2009 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I bet anything that Gordon is booed
he’ll be painted as someone who left for $$. People at Bulls games are stupid. They just stopped booing Noah.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess that depends on how much he signs for...
I would boo if he signs for less than what the Bulls offered…
But if he signs for more than either of the Bulls offers, then its clear to me that Ben made the right decision for Ben…and he got paid.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't matter
They will boo just to boo
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 1, 2009 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is there to boo over.
I thought this was all just business?
The Bulls are family when they want something from you but business when you want something from them.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'll be honest. If he returns to the UC in a Pistons uniform, I'll boo him.
I think I am congenitally programmed to boo any Piston. They are the Bulls’ arch-enemy, after all.
"We're gonna hire a motherf*cking coach with NO experience? Not as an NBA head coach, not as an NBA assistant, not as an assistant’s assistant, not as a college coach, not as a high school coach, not as f*cking grade school coach, not as a coach of the Lovabulls, not as a coach of the towel boys, not even as a coach of a dynasty on Playstation. Nothing. Really? Really, Pax?" - 1958ChiTown's Initial Reaction to the Hiring of Vinny Del Negro, posted on June 7, 2008 at 2:41 PM.
by 1958ChiTown on Jul 1, 2009 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
My thoughts also
Piston players just get booed no matter what.
I won’t boo Ben…. but most people in Chicago just hate the Pistons. -
"Remember, I'm Italian".
by BCs71 on Jul 1, 2009 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed.
nothing angers me more at a Bulls game when uninformed bball fans boo Joakim. Just because he doesn’t score 20 ppg people think he sucks.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jul 1, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BG scores that much and people think he sucks.
I think they just don’t like Noah’s hair. This is the kind of IQ we are dealing with in the mainstream fandom.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
*stares you down, fires up contested jumper*
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is only 18,001 seasons to build a championship team. ;)
Even Gar Paxdorf should be able to manage.
it’s looking like 20010 or bust.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 1, 2009 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess this means the Bulls will need plays....
I guess this mean VDN is going to be fired after the season…. look at the bright side.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If there is a positive to Gordon leaving....
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
..Vinny is in bed now wetting in his pants ...
man up!
by exult463 on Jul 1, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe Dumars is going to be on ESPN 1000 in a little while, for anyone who's interested
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 10:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Is he going to announce a Ben Gordon agreement? That would be bold as hell.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Pay Back! or the Big Ben Back!
man up!
by exult463 on Jul 1, 2009 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL!!!!!!.......Hell Naw.....the big payback...That will be the theme song. Bens first game back in
Chicago is going to be brutal.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
God, that'd hurt
And would be a bit unlike Dumars
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
damn why am I listening to the score?
dumb me.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This organization is really pathetic
No other team makes so dumb decisions as this one. No one let’s his second best player walk away for nothing… If they don’t get a real star in 2010, they should all be fired
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 10:41 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Just a rumor, but apparently the Rockets are also interested in Bosh
Once the Toronto Raptors figure out that Chris Bosh will be departing via free agency a year from now, they may be inclined to trade him this summer.
Their choice is to trade him to the Rockets now and get something in return, or wait until he signs with the Rockets a year from now and get nothing.
If they decide to deal him, Rockets general manager Daryl Morey almost certainly would like to be at the front of the line.
Houston Chronicle
I have a feeling the Bulls wont get nothing in 2010. We are so fucked up
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do the Rockets have that is worth Bosh?
Yao and McGrady are done physically, and Ron Ron is a free agent.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jul 1, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ben probably have been waiting for this day for a long...long time.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:45 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
now, I'm sure Reinsdorf has been waiting for it too
or commissioning a Paul Konerko statue and buying a fucking NHL team, whatever.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
not yet.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
watch out for Detroit next season..
Come on Doug Collins..
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 10:56 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Two UConn alums together again.....LOL!!!
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Add Rip...
And you got three…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's true
Doug could always screw things up.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What if the Blazers signed Turkoglu and traded for Hinrich?
Sure, that will “stunt the growth” of Batum and Bayless, but who gives a flying fuck? THey’ll be a 58-60 win team next year. Wing players are a dime a dozen and they’ll find a competent PG somewhere.
If I were pritch-slapping someone, I’d sign Turkoglu then give up Blake + Fernandez or Blake + Batum/draft prick or Blake + Outlaw + draft picks for Hinrich.
Overpay/lose a deal*, win 60 games, punch a bunch of people in the nuts.
*I’m sure even getting Blake and Fernandez for Hinrich, the Bulls would feel that they lost out on the deal, too.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 10:57 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
They are interested in Andre Miller, according to the New York Daily News
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Miller's a fall-back.
I’m guessing Turkoglu is #1, and they won’t be able to get MIller after that. (or… MLE?)
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They're thinking to include Blake and others in a deal for Miller
So, they could have both, couldn’t they (just asking)? Miller and Turkoglu, of course…
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
teams dont need a pg with Tukoglu
he runs the offense most of the game. The times hes out or in fall trouble give Roy the ball and let him create.
I think a player like Bayless could work well in a system where Heido creates and Bayless hangs around the perimeter and shoots.
Could also use a defensive PG. Point is Portland wouldnt need a PG to run the offense so you dont need a Miller or Blake….
by Jscho316 on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if teams don't need a pg with Turk
than why was Jameer Nelson in the all-star game?
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 1, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Handling the ball in late game situations doesn't make him a PG.
He was Orlando’s best scoring threat late in games and therefore handled the ball in some situations. On a team that likes to run he wouldn’t be a very good PG, as he’s not all that fleet-a-foot.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Turk handled the ball a lot for the Magic because he could score or set up the offense
Plus, the Magic were one of the faster paced teams in the NBA while the Blazers were one of the slowest, so, going by your logic, he’d be an even better fit as a point forward for the Blazers.
We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan
by snley on Jul 1, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im hoping that deal goes down
Id be happy all around…
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 1, 2009 4:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When BG leaves that frees up how much money for the Bulls?
Nothing? Can the Bulls pursue anything?
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It gives Reinsdorf more money to pursue buying the Pheonix Coyotes!
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kelly Dwyer's at it again
Gordon? The Bulls prepared to do this for years. Team owner Jerry Reinsdorf is easily the cheapest in the NBA, taking in quite a bit of profit while refusing to pay the luxury tax, or retain players that he’s not entirely comfortable with.
You’ve been able to see the writing on the wall for years with this move. It’s why the team makes all sorts of moves to approach the tax (like spending guaranteed money on two draft picks who aren’t even likely to be in next year’s rotation) just to leave itself the excuse to not pay Gordon, a huge scoring threat for a team that sometimes struggles to top 80 points in a game.
Chicago will toss out John Salmons’(notes) name, of course, because most of their fans won’t remember that Salmons will turn 30 later this year, and will be about to enter the down side of his career. The Bulls always leave you a carrot, always refusing to smartly spend money in the proper areas while distracting you with the luck of the Derrick Rose(notes) lottery selection, or a seven game series loss to a team missing its best player.
Although most of the article is criticizing Detroit.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it's a great move for Detroit
but not a terrible one. And most importantly it doesn’t matter how Detroit does with Gordon, I’m not a Pistons fan.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gee, that's why I only put the quote about Chicago here ;)
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have a doubt
Could the Pistons sign Gordon and then make some sort of trade for Boozer, sending Hamilton in the package to the Jazz, and then extend Boozers contract?
That would be awsome for them (not so good for us, of course)
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they certainly could.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I mean, I think the Jazz want Millsap instead of Boozer
So, they could trade him…
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They should want Millsap more than Boozer
Especially given the projected cost of each player next season in relation to their production on the floor…
Rip for Boozer and Brewer would save the Jazz some money next season….
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
and in the future
remember, boozer is now a 2010 expiring K
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not enough to get them under the LT
I actually don’t know the Jazz’ stance on the LT, but in the past they’ve seemed pretty concerned about it. And basically they’re in no position to sign Milsap and not pay it, as far as I can tell.
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they are going to be about 3 million over the LT. The Bulls could conceivably take back Ronnie Price and Ronnie Brewer
using the Nocioni and Sefolosha trade exceptions which would put the Bulls over the LT, but if they could dump Kirk to the Mavericks for Jerry Stackhouse’s partially unguaranteed deal. They could then get rid of Stackhouse and save the money from that (around 4 million in savings) and be under the tax and have replaced Ben Gordon with Ronnie Brewer (not ideal from a floor spacing perspective, but he is the big guard who can defend alongside Rose).
The roster would then look like this:
1- Rose, Price
2 – Brewer, Salmons
3- Deng, Salmons, Johnson
4 – Thomas, Johnson, Gibson
5 – Noah , Miller
Is that team better then this year’s team? Maybe, if Deng stays healthy.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This simply reduces to trading Kirk and Ben for Ronnie Brewer... and expecting to be better?
I was a big Ronnie Brewer guy before the draft, but jeez. And if Deng is healthy this year, he’ll be healthy with Kirk and Ben on the team as well.
I’m not quite following this from the Jazz perspective. Do they keep Milsap too?
Do we get him?
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dono, I guess it was mostly premised on the idea that they are really scared of the luxury tax (like the Bulls).
Also, I think Ben’s gone regardless of whether or not we get Ronnie Brewer, so maybe getting him isn’t such a bad idea.
I’ll fully admit it wasn’t terribly well thought out and that there’s probably no way the Jazz would do it.
1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box
by fundamentallysound on Jul 1, 2009 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
how would Rip help the Jazz
Jerry Sloan runs pick and roll offense more than anyone. I probably should know the answer to this but how does an NBA offense work where Milsap or Okur are running pick and roll with Deron Williams but Rip would be coming off screens?
The Jazz would rather have a corner 3 shooter like Korver than a midrange guy like Rip.
by Jscho316 on Jul 1, 2009 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was not the point
I was just wondering if the Pistons could get Boozer in a trade and then extend his contract… But if the Piston sign Gordon, they don’t need Hamilton anymore. So they could trade him. Maybe to Oklahoma, who needs a nice SG and is/was interested in BG… Who know’s
where
by bull83 on Jul 1, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
a team that sometimes struggles to top 80 points in a game.
WTF? Did he watch the Bulls games last season…I don’t think scoring was the issue with the Bulls last year…but, I guess he can overlook facts if that conveniently backs his case.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
how about this:
“a team that sometimes (read:always) struggles to be in the top half of the league in offensive efficiency.” is that better for you?
by TheMoon on Jul 1, 2009 7:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't remember the Bulls...
having trouble scoring this past season. Defense was where they were lacking not offense.
by ronmexibull on Jul 1, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Our back court had no trouble scoring.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
After watching a bunch of BG highlights,
I’ve come to the realization that he is one of the 10-15 most skilled players in the league. Not the most productive overall, but few players can score like he can. I’m probably a little late picking up on that, but I didn’t appreciate how tough a job he’s had on this team, being the only real scoring threat since being drafted by this franchise. I’m gonna miss him if he leaves.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 11:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Can someone put together a highlight reel of his phantom D for perspective sake?
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He doesn't play great defense.
I get it, but you’re gonna have awfully few options if you’re looking for skilled scorers who also play very good defense. I think the Bulls of 08-09 could have been a very good defensive unit provided a good coach and solid scheme. Look at the Cavaliers. Outside of Lebron they don’t have any standout defenders, yet they played great defense all year. The Celtics only premier defender the last couple of seasons has been KG. A good scheme can make up for physical limitations.
by dakoose on Jul 1, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
Wait for the highlight reel of BG stepping out of the way of his man and tell me how you make a scheme out of that. You can’t teach someone to be tough. I know he has more cajones than most when it comes to offense. The fact is he has NONE on defense. Getting out of the way and hoping TyT or Noah blocks your guys shot is just too frustrating. Here’s hoping that the Bulls start playing defense next year and don’t just talk about it.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 4:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he actually does fight on defense
he’s just physically limited.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he pressures to keep the ball out of his guys hands.
But as soon as his guy gets the ball he watches him drive past so he doesn’t pick up fouls or get hurt taking charges. I can’t believe after all these years playing with Kirk, he hasn’t learned how to take a charge.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'll agree with that.
though I hate the idea of taking charges as defense, it’s certainly a skill that refs reward. Though wouldn’t we have wished on many of an occasion that Kirk wasn’t so aggressive and didn’t have to be benched with foul trouble (pre-point-god)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 4:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes.
That’s why he’ll be a great (although highly overpaid) sixth man until we trade him at the deadline (IMO, of course). He won’t have to worry about fouls. He can come in and steady the second team, play high pressure defense on the other teams best guard.
I can’t believe so many people think Kirk can’t help this team next year. I think he had as much to do with the playoff push as Salmons/Miller. Remember when he came back and when the Bulls started to push from 9/10 to 7?
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why is he a sixth man
because his defense isn’t great? We are more than willing to start guys who don’t have an offensive game. Have our front court close down the lanes and those penetrating guards who now and then get past Gordon or Rose will come up against a wall. A good defensive scheme fixes a lot of our problems even with the roster as it stands. Just not having Gooden on the team helps tremendously.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BTW - I was talking about Hinrich
I won’t get into why I think Gordon is a sixth-man on man-crush for Gordon day
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 5:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's what I get
for stealth commenting during work and scrolling around a 300 post monster with a lot of unidentified pronouns.
As a Gordon fan I will be a tiny bit relieved all the crazy people will have to find someone else to trash on the team. Hopefully someone I don’t feel like defending. I need a holiday.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 5:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I actually don’t want to see BG go cause he’s too fun to watch. I just don’t get why people keep acting like the bulls would be a lottery team without him.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 5:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am worried about our three point shooting
and outside shooting in general. Salmons, for me at least, is still a big question mark. If he reverts to former years and doesn’t do well we are doomed. If he does well he’ll probably want more money so he might not stick around with us anyway. And then that means Rose will have lost two SG in his short career and have no stability.
I don’t trust Kirk’s offense. Deng may or may not be healthy. It worries me. Gordon helped stabilize the offense because his shot seemed to have nothing to do with how the team was doing. We could be playing well together or we could be struggling and Gordon wasn’t phased. He played the same way whichever and could get our team going. I guess it will be up to Rose to get us out of a funk. He shouldn’t have to, but that is how our offense has been.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am still not sure he'll get off the bench.
Cedric Simmons was drafted at 15 and he did nothing here. I expect nothing out of Taj because I don’t think he’ll be playing much anyway. It is hard to have whipping boy out of someone not touching the floor.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 5:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Then who will be the village idiot?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 6:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hinrich is more physical than ben gordon
is that what you are saying?
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jul 1, 2009 5:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
on defense.....um, Yes
Hinrich stays in front of his man, contests shots, takes charges, you know….plays defense. I actually don’t want to see BG go cause he’s too fun to watch. I just don’t get why people keep acting like the bulls would be a lottery team without him. They can change the team and play defense more, get Deng back, etc. Losing BG means we can have schemes on offense and defense. Things which don’t work with someone who plays like BG. He is a turnstyle on defense and over dribbles on offense. Although to his credit, this was probably because he knew as much as anyone that he was the best option in the end.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 5:13 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently, many posters in this thread are assuming that Gordon
will immediately accept the offer.
I doubt that he will. In fact, everything I have heard indicates that he wishes to remain a Bull.
"We're gonna hire a motherf*cking coach with NO experience? Not as an NBA head coach, not as an NBA assistant, not as an assistant’s assistant, not as a college coach, not as a high school coach, not as f*cking grade school coach, not as a coach of the Lovabulls, not as a coach of the towel boys, not even as a coach of a dynasty on Playstation. Nothing. Really? Really, Pax?" - 1958ChiTown's Initial Reaction to the Hiring of Vinny Del Negro, posted on June 7, 2008 at 2:41 PM.
by 1958ChiTown on Jul 1, 2009 11:18 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
the Bulls may not want him
actually, the basketball people want him. Reinsdorf doesn’t want to pay him.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If it's more money, why does he stay in Chicago?
The Bulls aren’t any closer to winning a title than Detroit. He’s 25 years old, this is his best shot for nailing a big payday.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
First of all, I'll apologize in advance for the fact that I have been
somewhat out of the loop since the Bulls exited the playoffs. My information could be obsolete. That being said, it was my understanding that Reinsdorf was going to let competing teams set the market with opening offers, then make a matching offer to keep Ben in Chicago. Reinsdorf didn’t want to make an initial offer at the outset of the free agency period because of his crippling phobia of paying more than fair market value for any asset.
"We're gonna hire a motherf*cking coach with NO experience? Not as an NBA head coach, not as an NBA assistant, not as an assistant’s assistant, not as a college coach, not as a high school coach, not as f*cking grade school coach, not as a coach of the Lovabulls, not as a coach of the towel boys, not even as a coach of a dynasty on Playstation. Nothing. Really? Really, Pax?" - 1958ChiTown's Initial Reaction to the Hiring of Vinny Del Negro, posted on June 7, 2008 at 2:41 PM.
by 1958ChiTown on Jul 1, 2009 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the matching thing doesn't work with a UFA.
detroit could offer him something and he could just take it without letting the bulls even attempt to make an offer if he wants.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jul 1, 2009 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's certainly true. However, if reports about Gordon's desire to stay in Chicago have
any basis, you would imagine that Gordon would at least consider a competing offer from the Bulls.
He would have to be rather impulsive to immediately accept the first offer he received on the very first day of the free agency period. Historically, Ben has been deliberate and circumspect in his business dealings.
I interpret this entire saga as a continuation of the Bulls pathological insistence on letting the “market” determine the salary of its players.
"We're gonna hire a motherf*cking coach with NO experience? Not as an NBA head coach, not as an NBA assistant, not as an assistant’s assistant, not as a college coach, not as a high school coach, not as f*cking grade school coach, not as a coach of the Lovabulls, not as a coach of the towel boys, not even as a coach of a dynasty on Playstation. Nothing. Really? Really, Pax?" - 1958ChiTown's Initial Reaction to the Hiring of Vinny Del Negro, posted on June 7, 2008 at 2:41 PM.
by 1958ChiTown on Jul 1, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
i don't think he would not think about it or necessarily take the first offer on the table
but i was just commenting about JR “waiting to for someone else to set the market” because he could very well be gone before that happens.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jul 1, 2009 11:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But no contract can be *signed* until July 8th
so even if Detroit put an offer out to Gordon today, the Bulls still have a week to put a counter offer out there. If it’s a similar offer, we’ll see how much Gordon wants to stay with the Bulls. If it’s significantly less (or if no offer is made), then we have even more evidence of Reinsdorf’s cheapiosity.
by kozzer on Jul 1, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
but ben could agree in principle before that.
he doesn’t have to wait till july 8th to tell the pistons he will sign with them.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jul 1, 2009 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
His agent (if he knows what he is doing)
will go to the Bulls with Detriots offer just to see if they can get more.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
by J Theory on Jul 1, 2009 12:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only Ben's already had one offer pulled from the table after he decided to accept it
So I wonder if he’s going to be less willing to wait around this time. That also probably didn’t do much for his regard for Jerry Reinsdorf’s business ethics.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i wholeheartedly disagree with that
he had no problem throwing gobs of money at hinrich or deng, and Deng was an RFA when he did that and as far as I can remember, no other team set his market. Gordon is not a Reinsdorf guy, it’s as simple as that, and he in all likelihood isn’t going to be willing to shell out much more than MLE money for BG
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon should go
I trust DET management over the Bulls anyday. Moreover, the Bulls jerked him around and stll.aren’t.sure he’s a starter. Why deal with crap? Go play for Dumars and get paid.
The Bulls don’t want Gordon and I think Gordon is smart enough not to want the Bulls. I wouldn’t expect this signing to take long at all.
by hitlesswonder on Jul 1, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think Gordon really likes Chicago.
Bah.
I agree with you though.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think he'll immediately accept
I imagine it’ll go down like this:
1) Detroit offers contract in the 5 years, 50 mill range
2) BG says he’ll consider, asks Bulls to make offer
3) Reinsdorf hems and haws and eventually either doesnt make an offer or lowballs BG
4) BG signs with Detroit, Reinsdorf bemoans how unfair it all is.
Fuck you Reinsdorf, go buy a hockey team.
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's exactly what I was thinking.
Reinsdorf, is a cheap Bastard that is not going to let management make any moves this summer and we’ll go into the season with what we have. When 2010 rolls around he still not going to do anything.
I can’t stand him.
by PricanStar on Jul 1, 2009 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just like with Mike D'Antoni last summer
This organization is so fucking arrogant, they think the world revolves around them. Hey, guess what Jerry, people don’t want to come here so badly that they’re going to sit around and twiddle their thumbs whie you decide whether to make them an offer.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Everything except for his actions the past two offseasons...
You know, when he turned down the Bulls’ offers.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But...he...tried...to...accept?
"We're gonna hire a motherf*cking coach with NO experience? Not as an NBA head coach, not as an NBA assistant, not as an assistant’s assistant, not as a college coach, not as a high school coach, not as f*cking grade school coach, not as a coach of the Lovabulls, not as a coach of the towel boys, not even as a coach of a dynasty on Playstation. Nothing. Really? Really, Pax?" - 1958ChiTown's Initial Reaction to the Hiring of Vinny Del Negro, posted on June 7, 2008 at 2:41 PM.
by 1958ChiTown on Jul 1, 2009 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
After the fact.
You cannot accept an offer that is no longer on the table.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't look like he messed up. I've been telling anyone who would listen that...
…Ben Gordon would warrant $10/yr when he hit free agency. It tripped me out to see people saying Gordon should get no more than the MLE. This guy has been nothing but the most consistent and best player the Bulls have had since Michael Jordan left in 1998. I know it’s only been 11 yrs, but there have been a lot of players in and out and Gordon hands down has been tops among them. Now Rose will be, but to this point it’s unquestionably been Gordon. More consistent and durable than Deng and flat out more valuable player than Hinrich yet he stood by and watched them both get paid in the $10-$12M range while the Bulls make record profits and lowball him. Now here the Bulls sit in what appears to be a standoff with their most bitter division rival…meaning Gordon gets a chance to come back and bite the Bulls with some of those clutch 4th quarter shots.
If Gordon goes then I wish him well.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 1, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Bulls didn't lowball Ben
they overpaid Kirk and Luol.
If the Pistons want to overpay for him, and Ben wants to live in Detroit/play with Charlie Villanueva, then everyone is screwed. We’ll be headed back to the lottery, and Detroit will get swept out of the first round of the playoffs.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm inclined to agree with that.
But in any event, NEVER have I seen a guy who has clearly been either the best or second best player for an organization for the last 5 yrs be treated in such a shitty manner. In fact, I think that’s what really made Detroit attractive to Gordon. The fact that they showed Ben the love the Bulls NEVER showed him.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jul 2, 2009 12:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
right because
jerry so clearly articulated that to him that it was no longer on the table. from what i recall, he only told him that when BG said he wanted to sign. furthermore, what good reason did the Bulls have for pulling the offer? what good did that do? if you offered him that in august, why wouldn’t you offer him that in october?
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the process is like poker. They pulled their card off of the table when no one else
offered anything to Ben last year.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
ah yes, "process"
meaning “we’ll be cheap and petty with guys reinsdorf doesnt like.” and what good does pulling that card off the table do? now they’ll either have to pony up that same deal to retain him, or they’ll lose a good player for nothing. it’s stupid; this isn’t poker it’s running a professional sports team
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Riensdorf is cheap. He figures to get a greater return for his investment off of Rose than Gordon.
Why pay $10mil to Gordon when you have Rose for cheaper? Jerry lucked up on a cash cow with Rose and Jerry knows he can make more money with Rose as the franchise player. I think a lightbulb went off in Jerrys head and that is why he pulled the deal. The only reason why Hinrich is still here is because they thought they needed to “ease” Rose in, but Rose came in and literally took the Bull by the horns (pun intended).
Rose capped it off with his performance in the playoffs. I knew Ben was gone as soon as I saw Rose playing well. We all know that Ben is at his best when he has the ball in his hands.
I don’t think they are through. Hinrich is out of here. That whole crew with the exception of Noah is gone.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
really
what bull did he literally take by the horns? :-p
by JSlakov on Jul 1, 2009 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha
so by literally, you meant figuratively…
I’m just kidding with you, no big deal :-p
by JSlakov on Jul 1, 2009 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anyone read John Hodgman's More [book 2 of his almanac of fake facts]?
*Not literally.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey!!! Good for you. You pulled a Tyger!!!!
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because it's an affront to Jerry's sensibilities?
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ignore D2.0
he’s insistent and deranged.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
who cares about improving the team when you can make a point?
will you get a new tune d2.0. you’re boring.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 1, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
much nicer way to put it.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Clearly the Bulls care about improving their team...
…sometimes you its addition by subtraction…
I don’t understand who is making the point? Is it BG if he gets overpaid by another team?
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So Pax/Gar/Reinsdorf are smarter than Joe Dumars?
Because the levels of success the two franchises have had over the last decade would suggest otherwise.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jul 1, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The body of work Dumars has amassed...
in the past ten seasons is greater than the combined efforts of Pax/Gar/Reinsdorf…
I am not saying that BG is not a good basketball player, I am saying that he is not a good fit for this franchise moving forward with Derrick Rose as its point guard…Dumars’ vision for the Pistons is irrelevant to Gar’s vision for the Bulls…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Bulls obviously thought BG was worth
6 years / $ 54 million, or else they wouldn’t have offered him the contract. You usually don’t give $54 mil to someone out of the kindness of your heart. The fact that the Bulls pulled the contract because BG wasn’t excited enough about the offer, is silly and poor business. They got their feelings hurt because BG wouldn’t sign the contract on their terms. That is just stupid. If they didn’t think BG was important to the team, they would have done what the Bucks did to Charlie V and not even extended the qualifying offer. The fact that the Bulls are going to negotiate with BG for 3 summers in a row proves that they don’t view it as addition by subtraction.
by Basketball Smurf on Jul 1, 2009 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has said he likes the city and his teammates.
I think what he hasn’t said is all you need to know that he is GONE. He can’t stand JR, obviously. Reminds me of Briggs before the Bears ponied up, except that the Bulls aren’t going to.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jul 1, 2009 5:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Hinrich is on this team I'm not watching next season.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:34 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
And here's the thing I just can't wait for
Nothing like a little Kirk rage to really make my time on BaB enjoyable
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even better when that rage is outdated and inaccurate :)
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
nothing against you wjb 1492
but isn’t he a bit pricey for a bench player who has an inconsistent jumper and big ears?
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if there's one thing you can't do
it’s have a basketball player on your team with big ears
by Calogero on Jul 1, 2009 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey, I've spent the past several weeks talking trade at Blazer's Edge
I’m all for resigning Ben. I’d love Kirk to be traded someplace he can start.
And I’m decidedly not looking forward to the excess of Kirk hate around here if, in fact, Ben signs elsewhere and Kirk is still on the team. Because, even though the vast majority of people here understand that it’s a management decision, and may even be contrary to what Kirk himself would want, it’s going to come out in a large quantity of venomous posts directed at Kirk, and most of those are not going to rationale, semi-objective posts regarding his ability or role on the team, there going to be stuff like your proactive decision you won’t watch or resorting to inaccurate nicknames or making fun of his appearance.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ok I don't mean to make fun of him. Im just frustrated with this team.
Kirk seems like a decent dude but I just don’t want him on the Bulls at that price knowing his best basketball is behind him.
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know about his best basketball being behind him
his fg% and 3-point fg% were both pretty high last year. No one wants him on the bulls at this price, but it takes two teams to trade.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 12:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's kind of my point
I think most people feel that way. I like him a lot more than most, and I think the team is much better with him than without, but I still understand that he is the most logical guy to be moved considering JR’s luxury tax issues and the makeup of the rest of the team. I disagree his best basketball is behind him, but he’s not really going to get to show that with the available role on the Bulls.
So sure people are frustrated. And I expect a lot of that is going to come out in posts like yours. At this point I don’t think anything Kirk can do is going to be good enough for most people around here – if he’s still on the team, I can foresee him going 7/9 for 20 points in some game and people will still be pissed just because he’s still on the team.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not a Hinrich hater
I’m a hater of him being shoved down my throat when there’s other options out there that better serve the team’s future. When he plays poorly, it’s just going to be an indictment of our front office. He’s just making the most of a messed up situation.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whether BG is a "better option" than Kirk
is very debatable. I want BG to return, too, but everyone talks about him like he’s Kobe or something. At some point, the price for someone with only 1 definable NBA skill (scoring) – and BG is a very very good scorer – just gets too much.
by kozzer on Jul 1, 2009 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, I suppose anything is debateable
But the team has saw fit to play BG more than Kirk when they had the option of playing one or the other.
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see
so you (general BaB ‘you’, not saying you in particular) trash all the decision making of the team, then cite it to substantiate your point? I really would have prefered BG as the 6th man last year.
by kozzer on Jul 1, 2009 12:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes.
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, and a stopped clock is right twice a day
doesn’t make your point any more valid
by kozzer on Jul 1, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, considering you addressed your point to a generic set of talking points
I’m not too concerned about that :P
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But most around here say Vinny is an idiot...
Or something to that effect…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jul 1, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"When he plays poorly...."
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bad games at 9.5 million will not be easy to swallow
Especially when he’s not even the starter.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jul 1, 2009 12:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Everyone has bad games throughout the season
It hasn’t started yet, we have no idea what the team will actually look like, yet you’ve already assumed he’s going to have so many bad games or play poorly enough that you’ll take it as an indictment of the org.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you just like him because you think he's cute and he's from
Kansas?
by SoulEater7 on Jul 1, 2009 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I started as a fan while he played for KU
Are you suggesting I know so little about basketball that I judge players on their physical appearance?
My favorite players have always been PGs, and I tend to prefer the ones who are more hard-working, defensive oriented types. As a kid, my favorite player was Terry Porter. I’m not a huge individual fan of any of the superstars, but it doesn’t mean I don’t recognize who has superior basketball skills or what flaws a guy has.
The whole original point was that I expect many people will take their anger at Ben not being resigned (if that is what happens) out on Kirk, and as a Kirk fan I am definitely not looking forward to it.
But thanks for reinforcing my point by immediately calling him Sir Bricks-a-Lot and making fun of his ears. ;)
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
to be honest
I think Kirk’s appearance has a lot to do with the dislike of him on this board.
by JSlakov on Jul 1, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't like
the way he carries himself on the court and when he gets upset and frustrated which seems like much of the time for him with the way he’s been ref’d. If I met him on the street he’d look normal.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think he's ugly
I also don’t think Joakim’s ugly. I really don’t care for Derrick or Luol. Ben’s pretty cute when he smiles.
Thabo was the real cutie, though.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Deng and his contract
will split the difference on the hate post-BG.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Kirk
I don’t like the excessive love for Kirk
by Sports2 on Jul 1, 2009 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I like BG
I don’t like the excessive love for BG
by ronmexibull on Jul 1, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
They should just keep 'em both.
Fuckers. (Gar Paxdorf, not Gordon and Hinrich)
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jul 1, 2009 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
yessir
See what Bulls management has done? It’s made us choose between children!
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 3:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Kirk will get that opportunity again real soon.
by Bart71 on Jul 1, 2009 12:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually I beginning to visualize him as a career backup..
man up!
by exult463 on Jul 1, 2009 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's not very good at passing or scoring.
It’s a problem.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has a killer dribble though.
I have come to terms with his meh shooting. The only times I really get pissed at him is when he tries and fails to make a layup. I’ve never seen the layup messed up in so many different ways. It drives me bonkers.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jul 1, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's a much better basketball player than you'd think
if you were judging by reading through the posts on BaB. People don’t want him here, so the negative gets overemphasized and the positives downplayed.
It’s kind of funny, because it’s the same thing the Chicago media keeps doing with Ben.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jul 1, 2009 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I mean - he's a combo in the truest sense of the word.
It irritates me to no end watching Kirk miss layups and brick threes, and it irritates me to no end watching him pound the ball for 10,15 seconds.
I know he’s good. I do watch the games. His defense is effective against the right players, and he knows what he can and can’t do.
But I don’t think he’s good enough at either of the positions to start at a high level. I mean, he could start for Portland and LA, but eh.
He is a hell of a backup.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we exaggerate the weaknesses of our players...
Kirk’s shooting isn’t bad….as a matter of fact, I’d say its slightly above average for an NBA point guard. (I should probably look that up somewhere) Yes, he misses sometimes. I’ll let you know when I find someone who doesn’t.
The layup thing is definitely irritating. I’m not really sure why he can’t make one all of the sudden, but I can’t defend that at all.
And as for his defense, I think he’s one of the top 5 defenders at the point guard position in the NBA. Again, he can’t lock down everyone, but who can?
I’d take Kirk over a good deal of NBA starting point guards. Similarly, I’d take BG over most NBA shooting guards. Problem is, both of these guys have played with one of the worst frontcourts (offensively) in the NBA year in and year out. I kinda want to see them both gone just so they can play somewhere where they don’t have to carry the team by themselves.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
summation of long-winded post:
I agree with BG: we were one good player away from competing at a high level a few years ago.
and yes, I understand how stupid/pointless it is to even think about that.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problem with Kirk's defense
is that quicker small PG’s give him fits, and the league is getting more and more of them.
My problem with his bricking threes is that they’re usually wide open. His percentages are good though, and he was hitting that stupid crossover/long 2 in the playoffs.
I would take over Hinrich right now:
-Andre Miller
-Rose
-Rondo
-Harris
-Chris Paul
-Deron Williams
-Aaron Brooks [then again I irrationally love the tiny PG’s]
-D.J. Augustine
-Tony Parker
-Gilbert Arenas [balky knee? This might be a no.]
-Steve Nash
-Chauncey Billups
-Jameer Nelson
-Jose Calderon
That’s 14 people. I keep forgetting teams, too – I’m fairly sure there’s more. Hinrich would be an upgrade for detroit, Mavs probably [dunno about Kidd],
Hinrich is a wash for Sessions and Chalmers [but without the upside], and we have like 50 million rookie PG’s here now.
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
by Prevenge on Jul 1, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
everybody has trouble with smaller pgs
I can’t name one pg in the nba that can stop the smaller, quicker pg, so why pin that on Hinrich?
wouldn’t take Miller: no 3 pt range, turnover-prone, shoddy defense
wouldn’t take Aaron Brooks: come on now, anybody looks awesome when Steve Blake is guarding them
wouldn’t take D.J. Augustine: at least not yet. honestly, right now, I’d be more prone to take Felton over Hinrich. obviously he has the potential to get much better, but wouldn’t take over hinrich at the moment.
gilbert and harris are both great offensive players, but it comes at the cost of their teammates. you know those 2 games a year where the Bulls have injuries and so Hinrich decides to take a bunch of shots and score 25-30 points? Gilbert and Harris are what I’m reminded of when I see that. that’s not the right way to run a team, and that’s why the Mavericks didn’t mind losing Harris’ offense. (I’ve got the fire extinguisher ready: flame away) On a team with actual plays, I’d rather have Hinrich…….but Vinny doesn’t have actual plays…..so I guess I’d rather have them. nevermind that last paragraph.
Calderon took over the starting role for the raptors and they went from being a potentially elite team in the East to being a lottery team. Wouldn’t take him over Hinrich.
As someone who lives in Milwaukee, can we please stop overhyping Ramon Sessions? He’s definitely got the potential to be an above average basketball player, but he’s just not there yet. First, he needs to learn to take over his team (read: just say NO to Michael Redd), shoot better than 18% from beyond the arc, and focus on getting the ball to Bogut more often. Someday (I hope), he’ll be better than Hinrich, but not right now.
and chalmers? that dude is not a starter on any team in the NBA.
I’m at 10, and you’re at 14. Either way, he’s better than half of the starting PGs in the NBA. Overpaid: absolutely. But I don’t think that implies he should be treated like the plague. Besides, it could be worse. Mike Bibby makes $14 million a year.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
"I can’t name one pg in the nba that can stop the smaller, quicker pg, so why pin that on Hinrich?"
That’s a selling point to Hinrich’s value, that’s why.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jul 1, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
then it needs to stop being sold so much
the guy is an above average defender for his position. if he could shut down smaller, quicker pgs, he be a candidate for DPOY.
by darksmokepuncher on Jul 1, 2009 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs