Bulls won't pay Amare, would pay for Bosh
[Is this making any Amare deal a non-starter? That seems a bit of a risk considering it's no guarantee that Bosh is traded, let alone to the Bulls -ed.]
That raises another question: If the Suns have discussed moving Stoudemire to Golden State or Houston, why aren’t the Bulls getting involved? They probably would if Stoudemire agreed to a contract extension worth $14-15 million per season. The Bulls don’t want to make the trade and then pony up $20 million per when Stoudemire becomes a free agent next year. They’d feel better paying Bosh that kind of money.
-Mike McGraw
over 2 years ago
Edicus2288i
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crimeny.
they feel best paying nobody that money. Are they really that confident they’d get Bosh? Or are they confident they can pretend to try and placate the fans?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 28, 2009 6:58 PM CDT reply actions
I'm guessing the latter a lot more than the former
Shit, back when people thought we could get Kobe I heard the disembodied voices on the radio saying it wasn’t worth doing because he’d cost too much to re-sign.
How about those that didn't want him
because he took too many shots and he wasn’t a winner!
I don't know why, but I have a good feeling about us getting Bosh...
And I would much rather have him that Amare, so I’m just hoping this is the master plan and they can pull it off.
Smart vs. Cheap
The Bulls are obviously going to spend the money in 2010, if the players want to come. If they weren’t they wouldn’t be bothering collecting expiring deals that give them cash for next summer. Remember the last time the Bulls tried to do this they were willing to spend the money, Grant Hill and Tracy just didnt want to dance with Krause at Ohare. If they decided to stay away from Amare and put all their eggs in Chris Bosh’s basket, that’s ok.
Of the two, Amare is way more of a risk because of his knee. When your paying a max guarenteed contract there is no problem with staying away cause of injury.
Looking back to draft night I changed my opinion that the Bulls should stay away from Blair because of his knee(s) problems. If the 26th pick goes rotten cause of injury its not the end of the world contract wise or talent invested wise….. if Amare can only play 50 games a season because of injury and he is making max money thats a franchise crippling move.
If they weren’t they wouldn’t be bothering collecting expiring deals that give them cash for next summer.
Not really. Never underestimate the side effect of saving money. JR wouldn’t be crying in his cheerios if this ends up in thinning out of the payroll and nothing more.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
bosh hasn't exactly been the picture of durability in his career
i get the argument that people would rather have bosh than amare, but i don’t really get the injury thing as a good reason. amare’s knee hasn’t been a problem in 3 years and that eye injury was a one in a million fluke injury. and while bosh’s knee hasn’t been operated on (to my knowledge) like amare’s has, i do recall bosh missing some games throughout his career with knee problems
For an example of max contract plus injury crippling franchise.
See Magic, Orlando and Hill, Grant.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
still went better than the Bulls rebuilding plan.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Teams should definitely stay with superstar potential players without a history of injuries.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
Until cap space becomes actual players, I'm going to assume the Bulls view saving money as an end unto itself
I think the pickiness about whom to pursue demonstrates little actual desire to improve. They refuse to take risk and will only make a significant roster change if the perfect deal presents itself. Given that, I don’t think we’ll see Amare, Wade, Bosh, whomever on the Bulls. I would guess they miss on all that, and sign some sort of middling shooting guard in 2010 — it will be like Ron Mercer II.
by hitlesswonder on Jun 29, 2009 9:39 AM CDT reply actions 3 recs
History of spending
The Bulls wanted to sign McGrady Hill Duncan in the Rebuild Plan 1 – but the players didnt come cause Krause pissed them off. They would have paid max contracts to those players… did it work out for Orlando, no! but thats hindsight.
The Bullls did pay Lux tax back in 1997 and 1998, MJs contract was over the salary cap…. 33mil and the cap was 27mil.
Instead of getting mad at the Bulls for not paying huge sums of money to players all the time …. get mad at them for signing players to overvalued contracts that hurt how they move under the cap.
Having Deng’s and Kirks contracts restricting resigning Ben or “X” player is more of a reason to get mad at Pax, than getting mad at Jerry for not going into the Lux tax.
Message to Tyrus
This was not a message to Tyrus Thomas.
Drafting two PFs and possibly maneuvering to bring in an All-Star PF is not a message to the only real PF on the roster, the one who couldn’t get on the floor at the end of the games against the Celtics?
As long as...
the Bulls management “feels better” about what’s being done.
That’s what’s most important, right?
Sounds like a process to me
Book it.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 29, 2009 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions
If this is true, I kinf of agree with the Bulls
I just don’t understand why they don’t try to get Bosh now. We have interesting players to offer to Toronto (especially Deng), so why not try to make something now? If it doesn’t work, try again by the trade deadline… They should be trying to do something, not just waiting and seeing. I just hate to think that we might lose Bosh in 2010 to another team, just because we wanted to wait until then…
I have a question, since I don't really know much other than basketball on the court...
Could the Bulls use BG in part of the package for Bosh? Like BG, Tyrus and Gibson? I’d actually rather see Deng than Tyrus because I think Tyrus is better at the 3 anyways. I guess I’d take Tyrus’s airhead plays and shot blocking over Deng’s outside jumpers and inconsistent 4th quarters/injuries. So I’d just rather see Deng gone but I’m not sure if that’s plausible to package BG with him.
I’d rather see Hinrich and Deng as the pack for Bosh but I think that might be too much for Toronto? I really don’t know how the numbers work but what would be the package for Bosh?
BG would have to agree to a sign and trade.
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
Why do people keep suggesting we trade Deng...
WHO in their right mind would trade for a guy making that kind of cash without seeing him at least play until the deadline to see if his injury is going to keep holding him back. The deadline is the earliest any trade involving Deng would go down and I don’t think it’ll happen even then. If he starts putting up all-star numbers to justify his salary, why would the Bulls get rid of him? If he doesn’t, who would want to pay him. We’re stuck with Deng. Start rooting for him.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 29, 2009 6:11 PM CDT up reply actions
You know, it's always a smart business decision
To pigeon hole a mediocre product into only one possible solution that works out in the end. I mean, it’s not like Bryan Colangelo could make some kind of miracle trade, or grab better offers from younger, more talented teams (if Golden State can’t get Amare, the same package for Bosh works just as well).
They may be terrified of Amare not signing an extension, but I’d be just as afraid of Bosh never actually coming to Chicago.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
I think a Heat package could win out too
If they like Beasley over Tyrus.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions
Heat better be careful though.
Last thing they need to do is unload Beasley BEFORE the status of D-Wade and an extension is determined…because there is no guarantee that even with Bosh that Wade will stay.
But if indeed Beasley is part of the package to get Bosh then I agree with you completely as I believe Bosh to be an easier guy to play with than Beasley.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jun 29, 2009 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions
Miami would still have "create a team" cap space
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 29, 2009 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions
If someone prefers Tyrus over Beasley
I would like to meet them.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 29, 2009 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
I do!
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 12:27 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
Did you also want Tyrus over Aldridge?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions
still do!
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
me too.
Tyrus was raw when he came out, very raw. He’s made strides but still has his issues. I still like Tyrus and over both those guys.
Really?!
You want Tyrus Thomas straight up over LaMarcus Aldridge?! A starting PF on a 54 win team? Who has posted better rebounding and scoring numbers than Tyrus each year in the league?
Look, I’m a Tyrus guy compared to most of my friends. I think he’s still improving and can eventually be an all star. But LMA is consistently ranked as one of the top 50 players in the NBA, a list Tyrus hasn’t even come CLOSE to yet. Tyrus is probably top 100, but not top 50.
In what world is Tyrus the better player than Aldridge right now? What’s the likelihood that he’s EVER better than Aldridge? 25 percent?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions
Aldridge is a better offensive player, that's it
His per-game stats mean nothing, he can’t rebound for shit.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 29, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok, what stat shows Tyrus
as a better rebounder last year? Aldridge’s numbers are comparable (albeit a little lower). Tyrus’ TRB% has gone down every year he’s been in the league, from 15.9 his rookie year down to 13.4 this year. His rebounds per 36 min have gone down from 10.0 his rookie year to 8.4 this year. Granted, Aldridge was at 13.2 on TRB% this year and was averaging 8.1 rebounds per 36 minutes.
However, this is due to the fact that Aldridge isn’t asked to rebound. That job is left up to Oden and Pryzbilla, who comprise the most efficient rebounding duo in the NBA. Aldridge is asked to play more perimeter-oriented defense and face-up/shoot jumpers on offense (which he’s very good at).
We don’t ask Tyrus to play outside, he just won’t stop doing it.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Right, no one tells him to stand there, he just does it cause he's retarded
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 29, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
What Aldridge has done in the NBA is exactly what his college rebounding
suggest. He’d be a solid offensive rebounder, and a crap defensive rebounder. It’s not Oden and Pryzbilla. He was crap on the defensive glass before Oden, and Pryz has never 2000 in a season, and he only played 700 in Aldridge’s rookie season.
I like
how you act like offense is such a small part of the story. That’s it? Seems like thats half the equation, and its quite possible there’s a bigger difference between Aldridge’s offense and Tyrus’ offense than there is between their defenses.
Word.
Last time I checked Kobe’s a better offensive player than Bruce Bowen. That’s all.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions
What part of my statement is wrong?
He’s an efficient offensive player, his PER and numbers reflect that. He’s still not a good rebounder, nor has ever been one.
I didn’t act like anything, Tyrus is a better defender, Aldridge is the far superior offensive player.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 29, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions
you said
“he’s a better offensive player, that’s it”
when we say “that’s it” in this language, it usually is to trivialize the importance of that thing relative to other things.
Or if one is trying to slag on Ben Gordon :)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
not really
but somewhat really. I never once think of it as some huge mistake. Save that indignation for not taking Brandon Roy.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions
it hurts to think about
the possibilities if we’d taken Roy. Maybe I’m just making this up to torture myself, but I feel like we would have been much more likely to trade Deng if we’d taken Roy.
yeah, but we sooo
wouldn’t have rose if we had roy.
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
I'd say yes, really
and I’m not saying that because of homerism, I’m a huge Trailblazer fan as well. Aside from rebounding, Tyrus is a way better defender, and he is more atheletic and has more potential. From what I see from LMA, he has pretty much peaked, I don’t see him getting much better than what he is right now, but Tyrus on the other hand is still improving.
IMO, LMA is the better player right now,but the likelihood of Tyrus will be better than Aldridge is about 50%.
"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so."
As far as cap room
Cleveland will have some in 2010 as well. Would you rather play with James or Rose?
"I guess I can’t do anything if you’re just irrational, but to point it out and move on."
- fundamentallysound
LBJ will dominate the ball on offense.
For a PF who wants to be “The Man” on offense, Rose is the better teammate.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 29, 2009 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions
I would rather dump Deng then Tyrus
For one reason. We get rid of Deng’s contract and then next off-season say Lebron/Wade are interested in coming here and we have no cap room. We could just let Tyrus walk, getting some cap space.
??
WHO in their right mind would trade for a guy making that kind of cash without seeing him at least play until the deadline to see if his injury is going to keep holding him back. The deadline is the earliest any trade involving Deng would go down and I don’t think it’ll happen even then. If he starts putting up all-star numbers to justify his salary, why would the Bulls get rid of him? If he doesn’t, who would want to pay him. We’re stuck with Deng. Start rooting for him.
by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 29, 2009 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Are the Bulls just blowing smoke?
Hoping to drive Amare’s price down? If they are I don’t think it’s going to work (too many other teams going for him). If we really believe we can get Bosh and that’s our predetermined strategy, then I have no problem with it. I do think Stat’s a better fit here basketball-wise, but I can’t argue that Bosh seems to have the better attitude and locker-room presence. I don’t know that for a fact, but from an outsider’s perspective it seems as if Bosh would be a better fit personality-wise.
I just want us to do something rather than just stand pat. We must have some sort of strategy, right?
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 12:08 PM CDT reply actions
HUH?
Wait a minute don’t they have Taj Gibson now? Who needs Bosh or Amare!
;)
by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Jun 29, 2009 12:39 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Gibson will give us extra muscle coming off the bench, nothing more. I like the pick.
Between Amare and Bosh i would much rather have Bosh. I think Bosh is a good enough player that he can easily adapt to the Bulls system. Plus, hes not a prima donna. If we hope to see Lebron or Wade in a Bulls uniform next season we should trade for Bosh now!!
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jun 29, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions
Gibson needs to add muscle
before he gives us any off the bench. That’s like saying Tyrus Thomas provides extra leadership in the starting line-up.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions
muscle, hehe, Gibson, hehe
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
LOL
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
by Juan dela Cruz on Jun 29, 2009 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions
Amare’s knees are not the only problem. Do not underestimate the risks secondary to having a detached retina.
Discomfort, watering, redness, swelling, and itching of the affected eye are all common and may persist for some time after the operation. These symptoms are usually treated with eye drops. Blurred vision may last for many months, and new glasses may need to be prescribed, especially because the scleral buckle may have changed the shape of the eye. The scleral buckle also can cause double vision (diplopia) by affecting one of the muscles that controls the movements of the eye. Other complications can include elevated pressure in the eye (glaucoma), bleeding into the vitreous, within the retina or behind the retina, clouding of the lens of the eye (cataract), or drooping of the eyelid (ptosis). Additionally, infection can occur around the scleral buckle or even more widely in the eye (endophthalmitis). Occasionally, the buckle may need to be removed.
What are the results of surgery for a retinal detachment?
The surgical repair of retinal detachments is successful in about 80% of patients with a single procedure. With additional surgery, over 90% of retinas are reattached successfully. Several months may pass, however, before vision returns to its final level. The final outcome for vision depends on several factors. For example, if the macula was detached, central vision rarely will return to normal. Even if the macula was not detached, some vision may still be lost, although most will be regained. New holes, tears, or pulling may develop, leading to new retinal detachments. If a gas or air bubble was inserted in the eye during surgery, maintaining proper positioning of the head is also important in determining the final outcome. Close follow-up by an ophthalmologist, therefore, is required. Long-term studies have shown that even after preventive treatment of a retinal hole or tear, 5% to 9% of patients may develop new breaks in the retina, which could lead to a retinal detachment. Overall, however, repair of retinal detachments has made great strides in the past 20 years with the restoration of useful vision to many thousands of patients.
Just reading that made my retinas hurt.
"You never got me down, Ray. Ya hear me? Never got me down."
-Jake Lamotta
by The Red Menace on Jun 29, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Bosh is great and everything, but why do we need him? Noah already fills the tall/lanky player role.
Because the Chicago Bulls are not a modeling agency?
by Sports2 on Jun 29, 2009 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Aaron Gray begs to differ.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
He will be begging. I think the Bulls are going to fill his roster spot with Carney Wilson this year.
I thought that Taj Gibson
was going to take the “White Panther’s” roster spot.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 29, 2009 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions
You mean Big Sexy?
The White Flag? The Victory Cigar? Why on earth would we ever let him go???
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
Do you mean...
because the Bulls are a modeling agency?
done.
(not the trade, I mean I’m done with this blog)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 3:17 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
How about Ricky Rubio/Al Jefferson
For Kirk plus a combination of others (Deng, Tyrus, etc). Then we put Rose and Rubio in the back court to play together.. both are capable of playing either position and they learn together, but Rubio would initially need to be the backup SG, with some minutes in PG role.
or
just Rubio/Brewer for Kirk…
man up!
Why do people keep proposing Rose trades?!
NEVER. GOING. TO. HAPPEN.
Unless LBJ is on the market, forget about it.
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 29, 2009 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions
He didn't say anything about trading Rose.
He suggested playing Rubio as a SG who could take backup PG minutes.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
We need more SG's who can't shoot!
Vinny Del Negro Offensive Gameplan, Part 1
-When there's less than 30 seconds left in the game, that's me with my hands cupped around my mouth yelling.
"BEN! SHOOT! SHOOOOTTTT!!! WHY AREN'T YOU LISTENING TO ME?!?"
-This segues nicely into my Timeout Management classes - order now!
Well, the user name implies a Noc fan.
(not the trade, I mean I’m done with this blog)
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 29, 2009 6:16 PM CDT up reply actions
I don't think I've seen so many
people say “I know he’s the future and he’s a great player but we should trade him.” in one off-season.
I mean seriously how many people have said we need to trade Derrick?
Derrick will never go anywhere.
Amare even if both knees were 100% isn’t worth 20 million a year. He’s a good player but not a franchise player. Not a #1 option on a championship team. At most I’d pay 13-15. Injuries are a factor, how can’t they be. Two knee surgeries and now the eyes which often never fully recover.
I don’t see how Amare gets us to a title by himself which seems to what a lot of you believe. Bosh by himself isn’t enough either.
We need a true top-tier player like a Wade. Not some 2nd level All-NBA players.
top tier
doesn’t being first team All-NBA before the age of 27 usually put you in the top tier
Last season Amaré did NOT play like a first team All-NBA player.
Not a good sign for someone who will demand a max contract in order to be extended this summer.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 29, 2009 6:19 PM CDT up reply actions
Stats numbers look...
very similar to Bosh’s last season. And I have a feeling they would have looked much better had he been able to play out the season under Gentry’s style of basketball.
Fact is Stat is the most efficient scorer in basketball and has been for a few years now. Or at least in the top 2 or 3.
Stat isn’t the best defender but if he’s averaging 22-25 pts per game while shooting 55+%. Who cares. It’s not like Bosh is a world beater on defense. Bulls need an efficient post scorer who can knock down 15 ft jumpers, finish at the rim, and play well with Rose in a two man game. While creating double teams to free up outside shooters.
Just a couple years ago Stat averaged 25 ppg, 9 rbs, 2 blks, and shot 59%! Pay the man if we can get him.
Bulls are going to be lucky to land either guy. I sure as hell wouldn’t not go after Stat to take a chance you might be able to land Bosh.
Bosh isn't...
a #1 option on a championship contender either. He’s a great #2 guy on a championship contender.
I personally like Amare better because I believe he’d be a better fit with Rose. It appears that the Bulls are molding themselves into a running offensive team that rebounds well and plays enough defense. Amare and Noah seem to be a great fit down low IMO.
Why is it risky?
Stats has shown no ill effects of his microfracture surgery years ago. And the eye thing was a freak accident. This org needs to take a risk on a big time talent to get to the next level. I wouldn’t be so sure the Bulls can land Bosh. What happens if we pass on Stat and miss out on Bosh? I think we’re being a bit too picky on which All Star talent we can aquire.
It seems the Bulls Org may be positioning to stay cheap to match this economical mood of many
Therefore BG walks! Their reasoning and the choice to keep Kirk over Ben, might be product marketing versus wins. Together with VDN bad coaching, this can be risky decision that could backfire with some head rolling changes required because of fan rejection to a losing product.
Doesn’t look like Bulls are really interested in doing anything during this free agency period. Although I believe they will unload either or both Deng and Tyrus for the right situation.
man up!
"fan rejection to a losing product."
wait, didn’t you just say they were staying cheap to match an economical mood?
(holy crap, what if people really would applaud ‘fiscal responsibility’ as to not offend those hurtin’ by giving these darned players so many millions)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 29, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions
Never in sports! ‘fiscal responsibility’ coupled with a winning product is the only true 'fiscal responsibility'
everybody wants their cake and the opportunity to eat it too.
Bulls are staying cheap because it their way of doing business, using the economy as an excuse just gives Dorf more gasoline to run his organization his way. Therefore I’ll borrow you words
"they feel best paying nobody that money" .. and the fans continue to buy tickets. Only in a major market like Chicago can one get away with this strategy…
Reinsdorf really is smarter than most!
man up!
So fun bickering over two guys when we'll likely get neither.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Reminds me of
sort of like the pre-draft Dejuan Blair and Tyler Hansbrough discussions
"What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so."
I don't think RuPaul is that special
I would rather have D-Wade who is an elite, prime time player, and a game changer. Rose and Wade my goodness, thats all you need to say. Face it folks, Chicago is the DONUT way, hole in the middle, its been going on for like 30+ years now.
Chicago: Where Derrick Rose happens
i was listening to a draft express podcast,
and jonathan givony said james johnson was one of only three players— and, two days before the draft, the most coveted among those three— that toronto was deeply interested in. i wonder if forman was thinking ahead to a possible bosh trade?
Why didn't Toronto draft him then ?
The Game chose him !
Yeah, good question
I still hope it’s true though
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 30, 2009 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Because Derozan is a better prospect
And Johnson was never rumored to be a top 10 pick.
The Chicago Bulls.....the more profitable Los Angeles Clippers.
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 30, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
The highest I saw Johnson
was at 12 to the Bobcats. Apparently Jordan really liked him (which is probably a bad thing).
by Rose Colored Goggles on Jun 30, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions









