Why Amare?

by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 25, 2009 12:53 PM CDT

I know most the posters on here are drooling for Amare and that this has probably been covered in previous posts (particularly around the time of the trade rumors last year), but can someone please make the case for me? Why is Amare so much better in your eyes (yfBB) than Tyrus? Bad knees, bad eyes, uninterested defense. If we could get him straight up for Tyrus I could see your point, but other than that I don't. Weren't Tyrus' combined blocks & steals in the top five or close? isn't he younger, healthier and tougher? I would love to see a case for the value in trading for Amare when you consider what else we are going to have to give up, that he has ONE YEAR left on his contract, and has health issues?

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Tyrus got smoked by Big Baby Davis

Amare’s an all-star. I agree with you that Amare’s probably overrated, especially with the eye thing now, but he’s a big upgrade over Tyrus.

by YaoPau on Jun 25, 2009 12:56 PM CDT reply actions

Seriously. Where are you getting this from?

I’ve only seen that they’re in on the bidding, not that the deal is close.

by arjoseph on Jun 25, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions

Okay not done. But close. Here is the report from a Suns beat writer. Check the blogs of the involved teams.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaulCoro/56227

Amare and Barbosa for T-Mac, Landry, Brooks seems to be on the table.

by Norsktroll on Jun 25, 2009 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions

And shortly after

Steve Kerr resigns….
He’d have to.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions

Here is another report linking Amare to Golden State for Biedrins

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=A2KIRy3MwkNKq3cBdRq8vLYF?slug=aw-draftbuzz062409&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

No rumors about Chicago. Sorry.

by Norsktroll on Jun 25, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions

this is bordering on trolling. Oh wait, troll is in your handle. I should have expected it.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions

I'm not questioning your sources...

Okay, I am. It just doesn’t make sense. If you’re going to trade a guy like Amare, you want some value in return. The GS deal makes much more sense than the HOU deal. But I think CHI could trump both those offers. Maybe they’re trying to drive up the cost for Amare.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions

we can't trump the GS offer. Biedrins is one of the best young C's in the league and they

have much better draft picks than we do (#7). If the Suns could come away from the Amare situation with Biedrins (the running C they need, a rich man’s Joakim Noah) and Jordan Hill (projected to be there at #7 and who should be a similar, but worse player to Amare), then I think they definitely do it.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions

"A rich man's Joakim Noah."

Eh. I haven’t looked up the stats, but Noah seems like the much better defender of the two, and they’re pretty close in rebounding. Neither is polished on offense. While Biedrins is younger (I think) and more athletic, it’s pretty close, and personally I’d rather have Noah.

by arjoseph on Jun 25, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions

That's not to disagree with your evaluation of the trade offer, just a quibble on the description.

by arjoseph on Jun 25, 2009 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions

I described him that way because they are very similar players only Biedrins is

younger and slightly more efficient. But yes, I’d rather have Noah.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions

I know most are sour on Deng

But I don’t think his injuries have been career altering. Frustrating yes, but something an off-season and improved strength and conditioning program could take care of. You don’t think an offer of Deng, Tyrus, 16, 26 trumps that? Like I said, they could trump it. But I’m not trading for Amare unless it costs less than that.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 2:05 PM CDT up reply actions

I actually don't think it trumps it. 16 and 26 in this draft are not so hot, Tyrus is a big

question mark and Biedrins is better than Deng.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions

I guess it's your opinion

that Biedrins is better than Deng that makes you feel that way. I don’t have the same opinion.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions

Also Biedrins has no health issues.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions

Deng has health issues?

He’s gotten injured. Non recurring injuries. Unrelated events.
If they were related recurring injuries I’d be concerned. But if has a clean bill of health after taking some time off, I think he’ll be fine. Plus he’s young enough to overcome such things.

Biedrins will not improve as a player. Not saying I don’t like him, but I think what you see is what you’ll continue to get.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions

Deng hasn't improved in 2 years.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions

Um

yes, he hasn’t consistently been on the floor for 2 years. He’s still only 24 years old.

I don’t understand you guys that think a guy is washed up after 23. I understand you get closer to fully understanding his limit, but not all players are created equal.

by kingj41 on Jun 25, 2009 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions

Still only 24? He's pretty much who he is at this point.

He might get a little better, but he’s pretty much who he’s going to be. That’s a guy that can give you 18-19 ppg and 8 rpg with good defense. It should be noted that I like Deng, a lot. He’s just not as good or as valuable as Biedrins, that’s all.

That’s certainly valuable, but not more valuable than a young, talented C with no injury history on a much better deal.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions

And Biedrins is locked in at 9 million per season

for the next four seasons.

by Scotter on Jun 25, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions

Biedrins is also in the

Nelson mastery offense which can like D’Antoni up the stats because of the system….

It’s a risk as he’s not the strongest out there and has been injured quite a bit himself.

I do think that’s a better offer than we have unless it’s Deng + Tyrus….I’d take the chance on Tyrus if the Bulls are trading him…..I do have faith in him, just tired of waiting esp if a guy like Amare comes up and we don’t do the trade because in 2-3 years Tyrus might be at that level…

THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.

by majoyenrac on Jun 25, 2009 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions

Amare's been linked to several teams, the Bulls being the first.

What are you doing here?

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett

by tyger1147 on Jun 25, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions

yfBB hold back the tears

Don’t know if this is more draft day B.S. but I found one link to “reports” of T-mac for Amare…..how does that work?

by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 25, 2009 12:58 PM CDT reply actions

Amare

I think it has something to do with Amare being one of the most productive offensive players and the bulls lacking a productive offensive frontcourt player.

by Jud Buechler on Jun 25, 2009 12:59 PM CDT reply actions

For one year....

and what are you giving up. I know he’s better offensively, and better all-around than tyrus. That’s not what I was asking about

by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 25, 2009 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions

Take the risk

Not doing so is riskier, as we still don’t know what we have in Tyrus besides a freakish athlete with raw skills.

Team’s can’t really win with 3 guardy types playing and 2 bigs who have no real post offense….

THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.

by majoyenrac on Jun 25, 2009 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions

Amare to the rockets is nearly a done deal!!

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/206430-amare-to-rockets-for-t-mac
sorry bulls fans

Oden...Aldridge...Roy.....THE REAL BIG THREE

by CroRupt on Jun 25, 2009 1:17 PM CDT reply actions

yea

what about the question mark in the headline of that article don’t you understand?

by JSlakov on Jun 25, 2009 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions

yeah, honestly what a dumbass.

1. Cut a hole in a box
2. Put your Kirk in that box
3. Make some team open that box

by fundamentallysound on Jun 25, 2009 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions

Fail

by BNeL21 on Jun 25, 2009 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions

This dude is an ass.

Homecoming

by illwill on Jun 25, 2009 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions

CroWrong.

by arjoseph on Jun 25, 2009 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions

article also says portland is close to landing hinrich..

"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"

by Jaina on Jun 25, 2009 1:38 PM CDT up reply actions

it's bleacher report

there’s really no difference between bleacher report and a fanpost

by Calogero on Jun 25, 2009 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions

agreed

Bleacher Report sucks!

USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 25, 2009 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions

Amar'e's a great

Offensive player int he post, a few time I believe 50 pt scorer against not just any defense, but the San Antonio Spurs defense.

He’s young, he’s quick, he’s athletic and well he’s an all NBA talent, already at that level.

Tyrus may become a wash at some point as he continues to grow, but even though we’ve seen improvement, he’s a few years away from that kind of a leap.

Amar’e quit on the team this year in Porter’s and became a scapegoat early for Porter and Kerr until Porter was canned. Once Porter was canned, Amar’e seemed happy and blew up, only to have the eye incident.

Amar’e’s an injury risk, but he’s a very talented player who’s blog rep took a hit last year, but give him a new change of scenery, especially on a team with a defender next to him (Noah) a quick, strong athletic PG (Rose) and some other scoring options (Rose, perhaps Gordon)….and voila, Bulls are set.

Amar’e’s the real deal, a more talented big than Bosh, just more testy too, and that makes him riskier. The no D rag’s a rag, Amare’s a better defender than given credit for, but it’s hard to play great D and try to play even better O when you’re playing next to the same thing in Shaq, and are playing a slower sytle that further shows their weaknesses.

Amar’e CAN defend, he just needs to have the impetus to defend (Shaq is too slow these days unless it’s a slowed down half court game—which is getting closer to the exceoption)….

Amare could thrive with us. Noah to be the specialist who doesn’t need to score, Amare to be th eflashy post guy we’ve lacked forever, who’s also a better offensive player than Bosh.

Bosh might be the better defender, but Amar’e’s the stronger talent.

If you could get either for what it seems we’d give, you pull that plug. Have it be the not that risky but perhaps somewhat risky first wave of the young Rose years…..and go from there, if it fails Rose likely gets a new player at 25….if it works, Rose might start in championship level 1 or dynasty 1.

Bulls have too many good solid options around (Pax did draft really well, no busts, only 1 questionable pick in Tyrus over BRANDON ROY, but Tyrus holds gobs of value still in a trade chip), that getting a guy who’s there, to play next to a guy well on his way and 20 is a great thing…

THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.

by majoyenrac on Jun 25, 2009 3:43 PM CDT reply actions

Amare loses interest in defense, but

Tyrus loses interest in basketball. While he’s out on the floor. Of playoff games.

Not saying he’s a bust. Just saying it does happen.

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 25, 2009 4:09 PM CDT reply actions

After some thought.....my real point is this

You don’t build a contender, ala the Lakers, by gutting your team to get a star with questionable health. For example, the Kobe trade was more real than most people realized at the time (as many writers have acknowledged in recent weeks). The only reason it didn’t it go through? Because Kobe didn’t want to play with the scrubs that would’ve been left after we gutted our team to get him. If we gut our roster to get Amare, and I think you can call giving up both this years picks, ty thomas and deng gutting, then we aren’t building a contender. The only way this team contends year in and year out is if all the deng haters are proved wrong and he returns to form and we get a FA who sees Chicago as a place they may win a championship. It takes a little luck I know, but gutting this team for a guy with microfracture surgery who may only be here a year or two does not create a contender. We won’t win a championship next year with Rose/Amare/Noah and……..who. So let’s stay the course and cross our fingers that deng’s injuries are a fluke and that the bulls can sign a star in the next year without gutting the current roster.

by BigforkBullsFan on Jun 25, 2009 5:03 PM CDT reply actions