Sam Smith: Pistons Promise BG $11 Million Annually
by R6Vox on Jun 17, 2009 6:55 AM CDT
240 comments
[Note by your friendly BullsBlogger, 06/17/09 8:52 AM CDT: I'm comandeering this existing fanpost, since there's already some comments.
I can understand why the Bulls now would begin to look away from Gordon.
I haven't heard they are, and General Manager Gar Forman has not come off his stance that he wants to bring Gordon back. But I also heard that Gordon's agent allegedly has been saying he has an $11 million promise from the Pistons.
Sam's likely full of it (can't call BG's agent yourself?), or it's the Bulls feeding him preeemptive 'BG will be too much!' talk.
Or the Bulls boned themselves not signing Gordon earlier. By the way, a $11m annual 5-year contract can start at ~$9m. If this is true, I can't think of an incentive for Gordon to informally let the Bulls 'match' the offer. -ed.]
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let him walk...
48 minutes of intensity...RIP NVL.
by Lt.Dan on Jun 17, 2009 7:09 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Offer him 6 years instead of their 5
At $10M a year….
Injury risks abound…..and the fact that the Pistons are farther away from being there than the Bulls, does Ben really want another rebuilding project?—even if they rebuild rather quickly before….it’s still a few years. The Bulls have the flexibility Gods in their favor.
If that doesn’t work, we can try to be suitors in the Rip trade with them….
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 7:42 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I've never
Personally liked Rip, but he is talented….I just think he thinks he’s much better than he is and was helped a bit by those around him….but he’s talented and while not as explosive consistently as BG, he’s a better defender….
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 7:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
even 6 years at 11 million for Ben would start us out paying a lower first year price
but $11 million is the very high point of Ben’s value, so I think it’s a tough decision for Bulls management. Guess what JR? you lost this negotiation – ya idiot. Could have had the guy for $2 million less per year last year. I really hate this org.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 7:58 AM CDT up reply actions 11 recs
Rec to that
I really hate this org comment….sigh.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 9:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Man, you guys sound like disgruntled Blackhawk fans trying to watch a home game on tv a couple of years ago.
Depressing.
by Black Sox Baseball on Jun 17, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you saying we have to wait until Reinsdorf dies?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only if he has a son that is going to take over
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 17, 2009 10:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
decisions, decisions
I was watching the 1995 Playoffs VS the Magic's and remembered how much I hated Horace Grant. Horace Grant - i hope you burn in bball hell
by Belize on Jun 17, 2009 7:52 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, I don't really believe such things till I see them
but I do believe $55M over 5years is a perfectly reasonable price for Gordon.
$9.5
$10.26
$11.02
$11.78
$12.54
At that price, the Bulls could pretty much certainly have maximum cap space in 2010 if they manage to trade Kurt before then.
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 8:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I won't believe it until I see it either.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 8:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And just imagine the space if they also trade Kirk!
What do I need to show fire for? I'm not a dragon. - Lou Pinella
by smash! on Jun 17, 2009 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can they do that kind of promises?
I mean, does the Free Agency season already began? I thought it was only after July 1st…
by bull83 on Jun 17, 2009 8:25 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's against the rules...
Gordon isn’t a free agent until July 1. Teams aren’t allowed to negotiate with free agents until then. So it seems like that would be tampering.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is Gordon's agent stupid?
Why do this now? It’s illegal (or against the rules, whatever) for the Pistons to talk to Gordon, isn’t it? So doesn’t this only put a cloud on the whole thing? And if he’s trying to put pressure on the Bulls… I guess the only way it makes sense is if Gordon really wants to stay (so he doesn’t care if the Pistons are in trouble for tampering) and they really feel the Bulls want to keep him, this could force the Bulls to trade Hinrich at the draft??? I don’t know?
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 8:30 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree...
this either sounds like stupidity from Gordon’s agent (which I can’t imagine is the case), an attempt to pressure the Bulls into giving a better offer (certainly possible), or just a phony report altogether.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can't imagine stupidity from Ben's agent?
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jun 17, 2009 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
I have trouble imagining a professional agent would be THAT dumb...
To publicly say a team is tampering with your client if/when you’re interested in signing with that team.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
On the other hand
It’d be very smart for someone to repeatedly plant such rumors.
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right - if he's just trying to stir the pot...
that’s different. The stupidity thing was merely if Gordon was actually interested in signing with the Pistons.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He hasn't "publicly" said anything.
That’s why it sounds like crap. Not to mention that BG and his “agent” have been trying this misinformation for three years now, so it seems to be status quo for them. It’s only tampering if there is proof or if you say in an interview or something that “we have talked” or “we have a guarantee”. These are just rumors from someone, from someone, from someone.
by Unrealcity on Jun 17, 2009 11:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What years of misinformation?
The only thing I remember is some ridiculous thing last year in a foreign language that got traced back to a sports blog that anyone could have started to get attention. In a universe where Poopsworld exists how can you blame someone’s agent when there are plenty of fans out there stirring the pot themselves?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 11:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because of the motive.
You are totally right that there are tons of ridiculous “rumors” out there from blogs. But they usually are easy to spot because they look like a major “steal” for the team that the blog writer is a fan of. But what motive does a blogger have to try to manufacture a higher value for BG. Sure, there is the chaos/anarchy angle, but the one who would “benefit” from rumors that BG is promised 11 mil is BG.
by Unrealcity on Jun 18, 2009 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't really see what good it would do if it were planted by BGs party.
Come July it is either real or it isn’t, right? And if it were a lie then what? Why would the Bulls offer him any more than they did last year? They’d really lose face if they bid high for him, especially without a Pistons offer like that. And even if it turns out to be true…once again why would they bid over what they did last year to match the Pistons offer? He was as good as theirs last year at a lesser price and they passed on him. They already showed what their interest in him was. Real or not it doesn’t change that.
They don’t seem to be the organization that would make exceptions for a guy who is probably sixth or seventh on their like list (Rose, Noah, Kirk, Deng, Miller, Salmons (who is tall) …. BG (who is short)…). This news stirs people like us up, but for most of the regular fans they seem happy to see him go. With that kind of reaction it seems more of a Bulls move. Getting ready to pull the BG band aid off.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 18, 2009 11:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it's just as likely completely bogus.
As far as I can tell, it’s just as likely to be “battlefield preparation” from the Bulls. “See! see! BG’s agent is a jerk! We can’t deal with him, don’t blame us when he signs somewhere else!”
Probability this is BS out of the Bulls camp 50%
Probability this is BS out of Gordon’s camp 25%
Probability this is BS out of someone else’s ass 24%
Probability this is true 1%
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure I agree with those percentages...
The first response the average fan will have is not going to be that Gordon’s agent is a jerk. They’re just going to think “Gordon got an $11 million per year offer.”
I guess it’s possible that the Bulls camp started the rumor, but I’m more inclined to believe it’s the third option on your list (or the second).
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good point, but...
The average fan, I think, is the guy that, like Jerry Reinsdorf, expects a significant loyalty discount (see 2.0,Dionysus). The average fan gets mad when they hear about a guy making $11M/yr, and it builds willingness to let the player walk.
Even if, without fanfare, the same fan would have been just fine with the Bulls signing said player for $11M/yr.
Hard to say.
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 9:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have no problem with guys making $11 Million a year.
And I don’t expect a loyalty discount. I just think Ben Gordon is not worth that much money in a league with a salary cap. His contributions on the court are not worth roughly 1/5 of the available cap.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 1:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
must....resist....addressing...D2.0...
it’s not a hard cap!
::quickly covers mouth::
damnit.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, there's not much chance the Bulls started this rumor...
What do I need to show fire for? I'm not a dragon. - Lou Pinella
by smash! on Jun 17, 2009 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gordon's agent has proven to be that stupid.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 8:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stupidity vs. bad advice.
eh.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 8:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, BG's agent has proven to do stupid things and give his players stupid advice.
Ergo I think he’s most likely stupid.
Or, even more likely, his negotiating style was built for the economic boom years. I mean … look at Zack Randolph. LOOK AT HIM.
-I was wrong about Pau Gasol. I have been shamed. :(
by Prevenge on Jun 17, 2009 9:33 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think that it's one of those 'happens all the time even though it's illegal' type things
technically the Bulls and him couldn’t talk either, but Ben seemed to expect it.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why can't the Bulls talk with him?
He’s under contract with the Bulls.
I was under the impression that tampering is only an issue with other teams’ players.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he's not under contract with the Bulls anymore. that ended as soon as the season did.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's correct
he’s not a free agent until 7/1 but he’s also not still a Bull? KC said in last week’s story about Ben and his camp that he’s still a Bull though.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's in basketball limbooooo.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But wasn't it D2.0 that told us he was still a Bulls employee?
Therefore, we couldn’t give him any credit for doing the camp.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I stopped reading D2.0
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It is my understanding that he is under contract until it expires 6/30/09.
But, admittedly, I have not reviewed the standard NBA player contract. I deal with contracts all day, and usually the expiration of the contract is the point and time the new one can be entered. In this case, the beginning of the free agency period.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't see how the mail order bride business pertains to this discussion.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We prefer to call the International Companions.
And I wish you kept your word.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
so do I ::sobs::
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Playing the Franchise Mode on NBA2k9
doesn’t count as “dealing with contracts” all day.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Jun 17, 2009 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
DUDE!!!
…….uhh never mind…….
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jun 18, 2009 3:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought he was under contract until July 1st...
I could be wrong. But that would make more sense to me, given that that’s when the new fiscal year starts and free agency begins.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You had to ask?
Raymond Brothers doesn’t exactly have a growing client list for good reasons.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome...
Let’s sign and trade Gordon for Rip.
This allow BG to get an extra year guaranteed while the Bulls would get an all-star replacement for BG. I doubt that is what the Pistons had in mind…
I have to doubt the validity of this report, as the Pistons really need help inside, with their only big men under contract being Kwame and Maxiel…I would think Varrajeo, Millsap, Boozer, etc would be a more appealing usage of that cap space.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 8:37 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
We could trade them Salmons too...
Then roll with a backcourt of Kirk, Rip and Rose next season…oh, err, Salmons will be 30 in December…
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 8:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's the future!
Rip = Luol? (kind of)
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rip >>>>>> Deng....even at 30 or 31.
Do you realize how much more mentally tough Hamilton is than Deng? Maybe he could teach Deng a thing or two about that.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jun 17, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
does his DOG wear a mask too?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hamilton has been exposed since Billups left.
He’s a whiner and a cry-baby now. He’ll have zero toughness if he’s going to be the oldest and forced to be a leader on a team. He’s weak.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Totally agree.
I wasn’t a fan of Rip when things were going well for them. Sure, he kept working all game and ran his man into the ground, but I didn’t see him as a true All-Star. I think BG could have been an All-Star on that team with Billups. But at this point, I certainly don’t want Rip in Chicago. I’d rather overpay for BG than that.
by Unrealcity on Jun 17, 2009 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wait what?
He was not a cry baby before Billups left???
by TruEChiFaN... on Jun 18, 2009 1:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh...
And you should link the original article, written by Sam Smith.
" I've looked at these numbers and decided the #1 problem
is that Ben Gordon is selfish..." -your friendly bulls blogger
by Dionysus2.0 on Jun 17, 2009 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed.
I changed it. Stop using the wiretap as a primary source, peeps!
(As far as your other stuff, D2.0, I’m off you when it comes to Gordon)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can that happen?
BG can just walk can’t he? Can we do a sign and trade? I though that was possible with restricted FAs not unrestricted.
by Ashman23 on Jun 18, 2009 2:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe it is only necessary
if the team you’re dealing with is over the cap.
by 72-10 on Jun 18, 2009 7:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Considering the age difference of two years...
…Stuckey compares favorably to Kirk Hinrich. And that worked well for the Bulls.
3 pt shooting is where Stuckey pales big time. AST and STL he also lags. but he’s a better rebounder, better foul-drawer, better control of the ball. It’d be an interesting combo, imo.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 9:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Stuckey, Ben, Prince is a nice 1-3. I don’t see much to like in their 4-5 situation, however, and I don’t know that their free agent money is enough to turn the tide. If they can afford Boozer, he’s obviously something, but he’s so high risk.
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, but he's the best out there this year.
If they could somehow acquire Boozer (which isn’t impossible), the 1-4 is pretty good for the east for the next couple of years. Where do they get a C? McDyess?
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess their other option is to try a lop-sided under the cap trade
They could offer Rip, the #15 pick and Amir Johnson for Bosh and some of the Raptor’s salary sludge? If I’m the Raptors I’d rather deal with the Bulls though
I have no clue where they get a center.
Maybe they try to swing a trade for one with Rip? How’d Rip look in Phoenix? How’d Shaq and Boozer look together? That’d be a weird team
1- Stuckey
2- BG
3- Prince
4- Boozer
5- Shaq
Meh
by Sports2 on Jun 17, 2009 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, meh.
It’s not great, but it’s competitive and could be Top-4 in the East. I don’t see how they get “great” in any way, though.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 9:54 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I were the Pistons...
I’d keep Hamilton (if he’ll come off the bench), go for Gordon, Odom* and Pachulia (then Nesterovic :-P) Gordon at $11 per and Odom at $10 per combines for a next year salaries of $17.2. W/o considerations for cap holds, the Pistons currently have $30 million committed to 8 (or 9?) players next year. I tried to find something, but I have no clue what Pachulia’s value you might be.
Stuckey/Gordon
Gordon/Hamilton
Prince/Hamilton/Odom
Odom/Maxiell???
Pachulia/Brown (blech)/Johnson
That’s a good team.
*an NBA exec said Odom’s worth “at least” the MLE, so he might come in around $10 million.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd still trade Hamilton for bench parts
his value is only going to go down. And as the Iverson thing taught us, he’s not one to come off the bench and like it. Actually he didn’t really like listening to Flip Saunders either. Actually, Rip Hamilton can shove it (If I’m JoeD).
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
they could also do the rumored dumping of Amir Johnson
to get more cap space.
I wouldn’t be surprised that the Pistons wouldn’t choose BG in a different free agent class. But they have the cap room now, so even if Gordon isn’t the best fit it’s easier (and better) to sign him and trade Hamilton than try and sign a better fit of a worse player.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no way Odom goes to Detroit. He needs to be "on the beach." Auburn Hills / Detroit is decidedly NOT the beach.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:35 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think that will happen, but that's what I'd certainly try to do.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 12:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you still have Shaq as a full-time player?
He might play 60 games next year if he’s in the best shape of his life and playing controlled minutes.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We may have him as a Bull.
sweet tanky tankson.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe a Rip-for-Boozer swap?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's not a bad option for both teams. The Jazz could probably replace Boozer with Millsap and replace Millsap on the bench
with Hansbrough or Blair (if he drops like Chad Ford seems to think). The Pistons could then let Sheed walk, pursue someone like Gortat and also sign Gordon. Stuckey, Gordon, Tayshaun, Boozer, and Gortat is a pretty solid starting 5. I don’t know what their bench would look like though.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2 year APM from BV says that Stuckey stinks (-5.0)
and I agree, he’s never looked special to me. Though, the one game I saw him in person was the game in Boston where he torched the Celtics, seemingly hitting every shot and helped to give the C’s their only (I think) loss at home during those entire playoffs. Anyway, I think Kirk is a lot better than Stuckey.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stuckey really fell apart after he was anointed after the Billups trade
I don’t think a Stuckey-BG backcourt really works, but I’d be interested in seeing it. Two stout strong guys who create shots, one driving and one launching. League Pass, ahoy!
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When I consider the rookie and sophomore seasons of APM to be a reliable indicator...
…I’ll let you know. And when there’s the same two seasons of APM for Kurt’s seasons, too. I don’t hate that, but there’s no way you can compare the two. In the only ways that are comparable, it’s not too bad.
And like I said, he’s 2 years younger than Hinrich was, too.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
fair points, there. I just don't buy the Stuckey hype much.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm also inclined to call the '08-'09 Pistons
unfit for analysis.
Too much upheaval, crappy coach, etc.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is Stuckey good at?
26.1 AST% last year, doesn’t shoot 3s, 41.8 eFG% on jumpshots, 49.7 FG% on close shots. Just 8.0 AST/48 as a point guard last year compared to 9.4 for Hinrich in 2005, -0.42 defensive APM in 07-08 (1.42 noise).
I guess the answer is “drawing fouls”, but that’s really it, and 4.1fta/36 isn’t that great. There’s a reason why the 2009 Pistons were so bad with Stuckey-for-Billups the only change in their starting lineup. He’s 23, well below average offensively for a guard and probably average defensively.
Stuckey – Ben – Prince is a bad 1-3 (what competitive Eastern conference team has a worse 1-3 over the next 3-4 years?). Amir Johnson could be good, who really knows, and maybe they can keep Maxiell around as a nice bench piece for a couple more years, but there’s not much there.
by YaoPau on Jun 17, 2009 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What was Kurt's offensive and defensive APM's his first two seasons?
9.4 and 8.0 assists/48 is that big of a difference? That’s one assist per 36 minutes.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I noted Kirk's assists because
I’ve never thought of Kirk as a good passer, and Stuckey’s been worse.
As far as I know, there isn’t organized play-by-play data for the ’04 and ’05 seasons. Something I might be working on soon.
by YaoPau on Jun 17, 2009 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Joe D
Joe Dumars might really like BG that much. Like I said before, he might be trying to build the championship team centered around a very good 3 guard rotation
or maybe
He is driving up the value of Ben, so Bull’s are screwed against the cap – like the Bulls were when we WAY over paid for that other guy name Ben.
Either way, it seems like he has the upperhand verse the Bull’s management team.
by Jesse07 on Jun 17, 2009 9:27 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I was thinking along the same lines
Maybe Dumars is being crafty by trying to screw his division rival by offering big contract rumors.
"Remember, I'm Italian".
by BCs71 on Jun 17, 2009 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I'm going to hurl
Let’s let our biggest rival steal away our biggest player during his prime…great job Paxdorf!
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Jun 17, 2009 9:34 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It worked for Pistons and Ben Wallace.
This will be the same!!!
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 17, 2009 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I mean Gordon's skills will totally decline
Shooting goes away, just look at Ray Allen!!!
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 17, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And BG's body
is a rusted out old box.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm...to be fair
we are also declaring Rip dead at 31 :)
(but he doesn’t shoot 3s and gets his shots by running around screens, so…)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ray Allen also runs around screens all day, but like you said, his shots are worth 3 points.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
he does shoot some 3 pointers and at a decent clip. just not ray allen level
by JSlakov on Jun 17, 2009 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he was in an offense that didn't involve isos and jack up threes[!!!], maybe he'd get there.
-I was wrong about Pau Gasol. I have been shamed. :(
by Prevenge on Jun 17, 2009 9:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
too bad
there’s nobody on our team that comes close to setting a decent screen :(
http://awsomepeoplesearch.com/
by NormVanBeer on Jun 17, 2009 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Noah sets a decent screen
Just can’t respect it cause he can’t hit an outside shot
by Option27 on Jun 17, 2009 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really hope this isn't true
If Ben Gordon leaves for Detroit, the only people who will be angry are his supporters. Think anyone in the media will criticize Jerry for losing the negotiations? No, they will applaud his hard-line stance against a me-first guy who was out for the money. BG to Detroit also means Hinrich is going nowhere.
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 17, 2009 9:49 AM CDT reply actions 2 recs
The media is clueless
I’d like to just put contracts on them and pro players. That way we can create an actual market on their true value.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the best idea you've ever had
“Sam Smith, who will be shopped.”
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you're the Pistons who would you rather go after?
Turk or BG?
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:01 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Why would Turk leave his team for the Pistons?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I don't think the Pistons have much hope of attracting anyone but a player who is simply after top-dollar.
Turk has an owner who’s already said he’d go into lux tax. I’m pretty sure he’ll stay put in Disneyworld.
What do I need to show fire for? I'm not a dragon. - Lou Pinella
by smash! on Jun 17, 2009 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, that really is BG's only choice
(going for the money I mean) since the Bulls, unlike the Magic, are not in it for the winning. Turk has options.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the Bulls are more talented & promising than the Pistons...
As for Lux tax, I don’t think the Pistons would either.
What do I need to show fire for? I'm not a dragon. - Lou Pinella
by smash! on Jun 17, 2009 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure they are.
Although the Bulls have wasted four years of talent and promise already and went no where. Neither team are going to be making moves to win BUT the Pistons might be able to pay him more. So go with the team that will pay him more. That is the difference between BG and Turk. Turk might take a discount to win. BG would be taking a discount to stay with the Bulls and wallow in mediocrity.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would anyone leave for the Pistons?
Money aside.. They are on the decline and the city is pretty dumpy. Of course they don’t live or play in the city but still.
BG said he wants to go to the team that can pay him and have a good shot at winning. (If you believe that) I kinda do which is why I could see him back with the Bulls. He knows his role in Chicago and it’s the 3rd Market so I’m pretty sure if he plays well and the team is winning he’ll make money.
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
"He knows his role in Chicago "
he does??? Can he let us know?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don't know?
It’s to grab his nuts after he launches a 3 from Mars.
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'd be willing to do that for 10-11 million a year.
"Remember, I'm Italian".
by BCs71 on Jun 17, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I am BG
and looking at the Bulls I know vs the Pistons I don’t know, the Bulls look a lot better. I just got to get paid for the proven production I put up.
The Chairman really is a bit lost on the Gordon and Hinrich situations.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
he knows what he's doing
Hinrich fits in better with the ’70s Knicks
(ht: Kelly Dwyer)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
which also explains his love for Luol Deng's pretty (but horribly inefficient) baseline long two point jumpers.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you mean when he shoots a two right ON
the 3 pt arch? Yeah I don’t hate that!
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's the worst shot in all of basketball.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
technically the worst shot is one that misses, but yeah, I got cha.
What do I need to show fire for? I'm not a dragon. - Lou Pinella
by smash! on Jun 17, 2009 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
right, I just mean it's the one that has the highest odds of missing while at the same time not compensating
for that greater risk of missing with the reward of an extra point if the shot does go in.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Could the Pistons afford
Okur and BG? Would they want Okur and Sheed in the same lineup (who would rebound?)? Just took a look at some of the Pistons fanboards and nobody seems too thrilled about the possibility of them adding BG. Most cite his inconsistency, turnovers and lack of defense, some even say he’s a 2nd coming of AI.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Jun 17, 2009 10:19 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I read some here and they seem cool with it
http://blog.mlive.com/fullcourtpress/2009/06/report_detroit_pistons_promise.html
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
(though last time they had a BG thread at DetroitBadBoys it was considerably negative
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Positivity about the Bulls is not allowed there
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 17, 2009 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
From Need4Sheed comments
I’m against the BG pickup unless we use him like Chicago has the past few years. First guard off the bench, bringing energy and scoring. I wouldn’t be against him getting crunch time minutes but it’s hard to justify $11Mill/year for a glorified 6th man.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Jun 17, 2009 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's a new one.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
had to come up with something...
I know Kirk doesn’t avg. $11 mil per, but that’s the same argument that’s been made against Hinrich. He’s a good player. He just makes to much now because he’d become the glorified 6th man.
by kingj41 on Jun 17, 2009 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just meant the spelling
I was wondering if that was in the need4sheed comments :)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
2nd coming of AI
similar production at 1/2 the cost… (From the Pistons perspective)
AI doesn’t/didn’t play D either. He only used his quickness in the passing lanes…Otherwise, he didn’t care.
by kingj41 on Jun 17, 2009 12:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, but he isn't a team guy or a winner.
So they don’t want someone like AI no matter the cost.
by Unrealcity on Jun 17, 2009 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If BG leaves I think it's back to the lottery.
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:29 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think we'd still make the playoffs without BG
But we won’t go very far.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 17, 2009 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
we didn't go very far this season.
You take away your best scorer and still have the dumbest coach in the league? Lottery!
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Might not though be the worst thing in the world
To not spend the BG money, see what we got (I think we’ll be .500 presuming Noah-Rose-Tyrus improvement, full year health of Kirk and Deng and Salmons)….
Because we have that money to spend next year and will have more….
I like BG though…
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Somehow .. this statement seems past tense or questonable.. "-Tyrus improvement" ?
man up!
by exult463 on Jun 17, 2009 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problem is if BG goes...
Tyrus and Noah are two starters who don’t really score. Yes Tyrus can shoot but nobody wants him to do that because they need him for other things like REBOUNDING.
Then you have Rose who can get his own shot but doesn’t have much of a three point threat in his game. So you defend his drive and let him shoot.
Salmons is now the guy you try to limit because he can do so many things offensively.
Now the scoring load becomes very heavy for Rose and Salmons and you combined that with the fact that they are a poor defensive team with a thin front court that doesn’t score.
Kirk and Deng are too inconsistent but will have to take more shots next season if BG leaves.
However maybe the ball movement increases due to BG leaving. But again it’s about the ball going into the bucket and nobody does that better on this team better than BG so good luck trying to find all that scoring.
Maybe as a unit they can come together and pay better defense but thats asking a lot.
Some maybe more of this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fWqBgZtwjw&NR=1
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh I know the problem
What I’m saying is we don’t spend the BG money this year and pool that with Miller, Tim Thomas and Jerome James money to make ourselves better in free agency.
We’ll still have a young nucleous and we don’t really know yet how much better Derrick Rose might be to offset the BG scoring.
Plus you have to hope Luol won’t have another stress fracture next year….Salmons and him might be nice…
I’m for BG resigning with us, I’ve always been a BG supporter….but I am starting to think if BG’s too expensive, we can let him walk (sadly)…take the 1 just ok year and get another pick and have the cap room to really be something.
I mean Derrick-Tyrus-Noah seems like a nice nucleas….and Luol and Salmons ain’t bad themselves for the present.
I would rather we keep Ben, but I don’t want us paying him some $12M/year to keep him so he doesn’t go to Detroit (if we have to counter and inc rather than just match)…
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 12:21 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand everyone wants to save money and sign the big free agent.
but to me the free agent that is going to put the Bulls in the top tier of NBA teams is only Lebron. I don’t see Lebron coming to Chicago.
Why not pay BG and deal Hinrich for cap relief? I say just bring the team back because I really don’t wanna see another wasted free agent bonanza idea.
I mean if the big idea is to sign Chris Bosh then I’ll pass.
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
If we got any of the big 4’s: Stoudemire, Bosh, Nowitzki, we’d be golden…
Oh and there’s a certain top 1-3 player in the league right now with Chicago ties (Dwyane Wade)….that’ll put us up there.
I don’t want to give up the sun the moon and the stars for Bosh, but I might for Dirk—not that old—and would for Wade.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm afraid
That BG goes and the Bulls wind up with crazy amounts of money for signing a big free agent…. but who would want to come here to play? The Bulls would have to perform above their heads (at least make the second round ) next year without BG to entice a big name to come play here.
Lots of teams are clearing cap, and all it takes is an injury to one of the other Bullies to put them below mediocrity and get below .500 next year (if BG is gone especially). I know money talks and all, but why wouldn’t Bosh or whoever rather play for a team that will pay and succeed immediately?
"Remember, I'm Italian".
by BCs71 on Jun 17, 2009 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know if they would
If Rose improves and he will and if Tyrus stays and improves (he seems like he could) and Noah seems to be the great puzzle piece guy, with a lot of character, I think that’ll help, as will the packed crowds and the MJ mystique adds.
It’s not like those we have left are the Crawfords, etc we had….we have some good, emerging talent and a hungry fan base to boot.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see your point.
But if the Bulls fall below .500 and miss the playoffs then even with the talent I’m not sure a big FA would choose the Bulls over a team that did make the playoffs the year before (assuming they pay up and have similar talent like the Bulls).
God I hope Vinny get possessed by Chuck Daley’s ghost and coaches his ass off next season, or makes a deal with the Devil at the crossroads – soul for coaching ability. Or maybe he can trade hair tips instead since that may his best asset.
"Remember, I'm Italian".
by BCs71 on Jun 17, 2009 4:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
But then there's always that
He brought the Bulls back to glory…..
Guys in the NBA can see the talent on this club, they might think the coaching sucks or that them missing [insert Joe superstar] could be that difference-maker….
After maybe 11 yrs of futility, that would be nice for them….if they turned the Bulls around again, the marketing impact could be huge, and seeing as a max contract is a max contract, that says it all.
All this “I want to play for only a contender” is just media derived nonsense to keep their values up. I think ultimately guys was to get paid first and play in a defined role 2nd. Winning a title is third unless you’re nipping on your last contract (not gonna happen to these mid to early 20 year olds)…
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 5:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Noah is a plus for any 4 who wants a lot of touches on offense.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 19, 2009 5:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A lot of what-if assumptions if Gordon leaves.
Who’s performance can we count on if Gordon leaves? Have we had any players who has been consistent in the last 3 years other than Gordon? Rose only played one year and he’s considered our best player. Do we gamble on another player past his prime or close to the end of his prime? If the Bulls had some decent talent, Gordon’s loss wouldn’t hurt much. The Bulls don’t have much talent. Paxson had better put a decent product on that floor next season. Lottery next year would be disasterous. Those tickets ain’t cheap.
by sadafan on Jun 17, 2009 11:36 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Noah has talent
just not offensive talent. We have Salmons, but I doubt we resign him so he’ll be gone soon (and he still has to continue on with his elevated play at that). Deng is good when he is healthy (and when the team is healthy) but it will take a couple seasons of strong basketball from him to get him back to the dependable category with me. If getting rid of Gordon was part of some larger plan (a trade for example) I’d be fine with it, but it looks like we are lined up to let him go for nothing. Which is a big waste. Especially with such a question mark in the offense side of things. Our defense is already questionable and you can’t blame BG for all of that. Arg.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 11:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Gordon
I really truly do and would and always said I would have chosen Gordon over Deng. But neither Gordon nor Deng really seem to be good enough to warrant spending in the 33% of the total pre-luxury tax dollar range, and that’s the issue. I mean maybe if Rose blossoms by next year into that superstar….but I still see us lacking a serious PF—Tyrus is always a tweening 3/4
We’re stuck with Deng unless we can unload him…..
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 18, 2009 7:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Help me convince my buddy that BG is worth re-signing
his case:
Meh. Ben Gordon is a flawed, flawed player. Our team will be better off without him. The stats back me up; he has awful handling skills and has TROUBLE creating shots at the end of games (I mean good shots). His AST% is deplorable. And just because Del Negro doesn’t preach defense doesn’t mean that it’s not integral to championship basketball
His turnover rate is off the charts, too. As good as he is offensively, he mitigates that with his defense and turnovers. Compare his Off. Rating vs Defensive Rating and you’ll see he hurts the bulls more than he helps. We’ll be closer to a championship with him gone.
Mine:
We’ll be back in the lottery with him gone…I’m not denying that he doesn’t handle theball well and doesn’t pass well but as a shooting guard his #1 job is to put the ball in the basket, which he does better than anyone else on the team.
His Ortg of 112 is just 3 shy of DWade, and Wade’s DRtg of 105 is only 7 less than BG’s. Would you call Wade… Read More a horrible defender? Championship-caliber teams don’t require that all 5 guys be All-NBA defenders. Look at the Lakers – would you say Derek Fisher – his career DRtg of 107 is exactly the same as BG’s DRtg for his career – is an “awful defender”?.
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Jun 17, 2009 11:12 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
7 is a pretty big difference in terms of DRtg (so he's sort of got you there, but DRtg is a pretty crappy way to measure individual defense anyway).
His AST% is not deplorable and neither is his TOV%, especially given his very high USG-rate. A simple search on basketball-reference.com will show that.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's a better ball handler too than given credit for
He was terrible, but for his amount of touches, his TO rate compares very favorably to the Kobe’s, Wade’s, etc…..and BG while he doesn’t shoot as much as them, is as involved in our offense, esp late in games.
Add in that he gets hacked quite a bit or doesn’t get the calls that Wade, Pierce, etc get, and when he doesn’t get those calls, it counts more often than not as a turnover to BG—when he’s hit.
His ball handling improved significantly in the past year plus. That’s no longer a major knock. His To’s often do come from him getting too fancy with the ball, but I’d argue BG’s a good ball handler….he’s just not a PG.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
His TO rate in the last playoff series
vs his usage is really good. He was not a TO problem for us in that series and not this last season either. People need to update their rhetoric.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He also wasn't passing at all in the playoffs, which really helps the turnover rate.
by Scotter on Jun 17, 2009 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
His TOs usually
came from dribbling off his foot (or so people say). He didn’t do that kind of stuff nearly as much all year or in the playoffs. And that was with Rondo and Pierce doing reach in fouls (that didn’t get called) every chance they got.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
In reality the bulk of his TOs never came from dribbling off of his foot.
They came from getting trapped in the pick and roll, and Boston didn’t trap him very often.
by Scotter on Jun 17, 2009 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
they didn't?
I thought they trapped a lot, though oftentimes too early.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Getting trapped and trying to dribble out of it,
falling down, dribbling off his foot in response…I think when dribbling off his foot comes up it usually is in that context of having some defensive pressure turned on him. He’s had less trouble with that this season and in that series. Maybe Rose has taken some of that pressure off him.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I always see Ben
trying to get too flashy with the ball handling and passing and that leads to probably really 40% of his TO’s, but seems like 80% of them. THe rest were either good D like you mentioned, or just general to’s everyone has.
I think his TO’s were good, and I saw some really nifty plays, and think he meant it when he said he feels he could be a PG in this league…I don’t think he’d be a pass first :) heh, but I do think he showed a remarkable improvement from year 1 BG to last year BG in the passing, ball handling and decision making…..
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Without BG
we’ll be up one, with the ball, with less than 24 seconds to go. (With appologies to Scotter or YaoPau-can’t remember which one).
by hlac on Jun 17, 2009 11:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder if I should add
“and a TO with VDN drawing up a play.”
That still has to be the No. 1 problem.
by hlac on Jun 17, 2009 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
this is why
I don’t have friends.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Who needs friends when you have us? ;)
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 19, 2009 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Still less than what that underachieving SF bum (to this point) will be making.
In retrospect, if I had to live with either Deng or Gordon making 11-12M per year I’d much rather have that guy be Gordon.
Now Deng may prove me wrong, and for the sake of the Bulls I hope he does, but the more time passes the worse that deal gets.
And why in the hell is Reinsdorf doing all the negotiating? Isn’t that what GMs do? Why would Paxson or Foreman want to be the GM when it seems any decision they make is usurped by Reinsdorf anyway? I know he’s the owner and it’s his money at stake, but come on. This guy goes too far.
by lexdiamonds0730 on Jun 17, 2009 11:48 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed on that part 100%
Sadly we may be “stuck” with Luol….so we may have to move on. I don’t know if I’d rather both be making $12M a year either though…..even last year, but I always saw BG as the better player.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
LD = Lacks Dog
BG = Basketball God
"As a basketball player gordon is a useless as tits on a a whore" - BigWay (Dec 2, 2008). BigWank, I'll miss you more than all the others. This song is for you, my brother!
by marionette on Jun 17, 2009 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
intrestingly enough
lex diamonds = L. D.=Lacks Dog
BUM BUM BUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jun 18, 2009 3:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
lex diamonds = LD = luol deng :)
"They should. They better. I'm Vinny Del Negro!"
by Jaina on Jun 18, 2009 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It all makes sense now!!!
Luol Deng is considered to be his biggest critic……
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jun 18, 2009 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yah
i’d thought of that too, but been waitin’ for it….. finally!
lol! @his own worst critic!
"As a basketball player gordon is a useless as tits on a a whore" - BigWay (Dec 2, 2008). BigWank, I'll miss you more than all the others. This song is for you, my brother!
by marionette on Jun 19, 2009 1:10 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If true - and I tend not to believe anything at this point in the free agency game -
this is like a nightmare game of liar’s dice. $11 per is the tops I would feel good about the org paying for Ben – but given the history of negotiations I don’t think he stays for equal money.
And I don’t agree with anyone who thinks Ben is going to look at Detroit and Chicago objectively and conclude he’s better of win-wise with the Bulls. He’s competitive, and he’s certainly confident in his own abilities – I think he’d look at Detroit and think he could be a big piece in getting back to the glory days. Market-wise it’s not great, but not the worst either. A team that’s a perennial loser makes him an equivalent offer, then sure the whole money vs. winning thing looks different.
But for all that, this just doesn’t make sense to me. Were I Detroit and wanting to get in there early, wouldn’t it make more sense to offer what Chicago did last year (with the info out that Ben would have signed that), or maybe a tiny bit more for the whole “respect” thing, and also let them know you’d like a shot at matching higher offers? Given the economy and the uncertainty with the whole free agent market this offseason, why jump out there early with what is likely an above-market offer for this year’s market?
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jun 17, 2009 12:14 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
.... why jump out there early.....?
His first name is Ben.
by kingj41 on Jun 17, 2009 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
If it's true, he's definitely gone
Let’s see, Ben can choose between a team that supposedly wants him so bad that they’re making him offers before they’re even allowed to, or a team that thought so little of him that they pulled a contract offer after he decided to accept it. Even if the money is the same (because we all know the Bulls aren’t beating that offer), that’s a pretty easy choice. And the Pistons will still have money left over to sign somebody like Millsap, so they should be as good or better than the Bulls next year anyways. Let’s not even bother comparing the management of the two teams, and who is more likely to build a contender over the next few years.
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
by Big D on Jun 17, 2009 12:33 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
If they lose BG I say F it!
Totally rebuild around Rose and gut the team. Keep Noah.
Really what’s more fun? Winning the title or winning the lottery. Everyone knows it’s winning the lottery. Find the next Kobe.
Im really just kidding.
by SoulEater7 on Jun 17, 2009 2:48 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I am not sure...
How reliable the source is, but he seem skeptical about the Gordon rumors. He also suggests that Amare wouldn’t fit the Bull system; I tend to agree.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Chat.asp?CHAT_TOPICS_ID=333
by McCabe on Jun 17, 2009 4:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The system would change
Around Amare. If that’s a coaching change, it’s a coaching change (yfbb cheers)….
But Amar’e’s too good a player to not get if you can get….he really truly is that good.
I love it when guys are two time all NBA first team players before they turn 25. Then get hurt and suddenly can only play in this system or that system.
There’s a reason Amar’e’s good, and no it wasn’t D’Antoni. D’Antoni might have done a good job to hide the flaws in STAT, but Stoudemire’s a fantastic player.
i don’t think if we’re set in any style whatsoever, since even our style altered dramatically every few games….
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if we HAVE a system
it’s a phoenix-esque one. Amare fits fine.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
hey, hope it's true
I have spoken to Bulls sources and they say keeping Gordon is a priority and remind that the luxury tax is not as big a factor as everyone is making it out to be.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 17, 2009 4:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
huh?
“not as big a factor as everyone is making it out to be.”
Hmmm…and where would everyone get that thought….uhhh I don’t know, maybe your OWN chairman and organization!
Wow…way to blame everyone else for making it a big deal when the Bulls were the ones who started the whole lux tax story in the first place…smh
http://awsomepeoplesearch.com/
by NormVanBeer on Jun 17, 2009 9:30 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hope that is the case...
They wouldn’t necessarily live in ‘Tax Land’ like the Knicks. They have enough contract(s) expiring to be flexible and likely not even end up exceeding the tax.
Could be posturing so they don’t look as bad when BG bolts…
Hopefully it’s not the latter.
by kingj41 on Jun 17, 2009 4:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is it with people...
going off on paper tigers, screaming at ghosts of conversation past. I simply mean that the Bulls run a lot of perimeter isolation plays and if Amare doesn’t get touches, he has a tendency to whine, he is also not a particularly good passer; which is useful when running the same pick and roll play over and over again. I know that Amare is really good, stop being a complete twat all of the time.
by McCabe on Jun 17, 2009 4:27 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't going off
Seriously, just commenting on what that guy had in his post and your iteration of it.
I was merely saying not to you but to that guys “the Bulls system” might not work….nonsense.
We don’t have a consistent system and were still developing what we had as of last year.
What I see are athlete’s a lot of them, and inserting a superstar to that mix has to be promising.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 17, 2009 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amare can shoot very well from midrange. Imagine all the shots Tyrus took and then imagine about 10% more of them going in.
Remember all those times Tyrus didn’t set a good screen or roll to the hoop after setting a screen? Yeah, Amare would set good screens and finish on the roll A LOT better than Tyrus.
"Tact is the art of making a point without making an enemy." --Newton
by fundamentallysound on Jun 17, 2009 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT
I totally didn’t know they was showing the combine on NBA TV
This shit is awesome.
And there is Jay Williams
by Option27 on Jun 17, 2009 7:17 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
The NBA Draft combine is being televised right now on NBA TV
It’s pretty rad. Jay Williams is one of the announcers
by Option27 on Jun 17, 2009 7:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jay Williams (sigh)...
I’m very happy that we now have Rose. But I can’t help but think what might have been with Williams (and the Bulls) had he not had the career-ending injury.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 7:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
A much different course
But prolly not as bright as the Rose era
by Option27 on Jun 17, 2009 8:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Williams would have thrived with the rules changes and a different coach...
he was stuck in the triangle, but was suited to play in the system we’re playing now.
I think he would have been a star. But, oh well.
by SouthernCub on Jun 17, 2009 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
maybe not
but Williams was absolutely a better prospect than Rose, and I don’t understand the revisionist history by some on this.
by JSlakov on Jun 17, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i disagree wholeheartedly
Williams was considered a good prospect, but Rose was considered the man after his 1st year in college. If I’m correct, Williams needed 3 years at Duke to build up his rep to become 2nd pick in the draft. Rose needed 1 year to be considered #1 pick. He is bigger and stronger than Williams and a more proven “winner” – whatever that means. Jay Williams was a nice guy, a great college player, a bit of full himself, but not the can’t miss prospect Rose was considered to be.
by Basketball Smurf on Jun 17, 2009 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rose wouldn't have been #1 over Yao.
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 18, 2009 8:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just because of size
I hope in talent, he should have been….
Yao is dominant because of his size, but I am still surprised he’s not more dominant.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 18, 2009 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
WTF?
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 18, 2009 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
In bball skill and hope as a player Rose would be the better player than Yao has been.
But in the draft size 99% of the time trumps talent.
I think Yao is the 2nd best C in this league, but I also think he hasn’t really ever been a true take over the game kind of C. He’s been solid, he’s been more than steady—which is great, he’s avg’s a 21-10 for his career…but I’ve never really seen him completely take over a game, that’s all.
He’s a matchup nightmare, but how many 30+ games has he had? Not many….that’s all.
Yao’s biggest strength is his size and his consistency. He’s consistently an all star, and because he’s an all star in every game, that consistency makes him a superstar.
He’s not a guy like a Wade, or a Lebron or a hopefully down the road Derrick Rose who can and do completely take over games.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 18, 2009 9:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Furthermore Jay Williams was a Dukie (like Deng)
If that doesn’t asked most questions, one more year having Deng will.
man up!
by exult463 on Jun 18, 2009 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
WTF?
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 18, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You are a dumbass Tyger
And I’m leaving it at that. Not getting into your b.s. crap that you don’t support.
Take some reading comprehension lessions dumbass.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 18, 2009 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The fact that you think you need to explain that Yao's size helps him...
::sigh::
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 18, 2009 10:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Somewhere out there Aaron Gray felt a faint flicker of hope.
Unfortunately he misinterpreted it as nagging hunger and went off to the nearest White Castle. Next time, Gray. Next time!
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 18, 2009 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dude you are a fucking dick
Stop responding to my posts.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 19, 2009 7:26 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Tyger
You are a brilliant man…
….sigh…
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 19, 2009 7:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, Yao has never put up 30+ points and 15+ boards in a season, like Lew Alcindor did.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on Jun 19, 2009 6:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't bother with Tyger
He’s just trying to be a dick to be a dick, that’s all he does…..
Waste of time….
I’ve tried to get him to post and not be a dick and nothing…..
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 19, 2009 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've tried to get you to post and not be dumb and nothing...
People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett
by tyger1147 on Jun 20, 2009 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah cuz
You’re right everything I write is stupid genius.
I guess I just can’t compete with your intellict….
Fuck you
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 20, 2009 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now I do feel stupid
Typing too fast, intellect.
Still why I bother responding to you Tyger….
Not like you to pick yet another fight with me after a thread dies……
Why don’t you complete any of your thoughts….oh that’s write you are too lazy to do so and would rather try to act like you are an all knowing being.
All bow to Tyger1147, douche bag of the year.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 20, 2009 7:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow this is fun
If you two are going to have an interwebs pissing contest, at least be funny like Dionysus 2.0/yfbb
That Steve Nash is exactly the same as Kirk Hinrich, but worse.
by NBA Observer on Apr 8, 2009 12:23 PM CDT
by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2009 10:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the question here is obvious:
Whose stream is larger?
[continues making bad jokes at the periphery of everything]
-I was wrong about Pau Gasol. I have been shamed. :(
by Prevenge on Jun 21, 2009 4:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey
I really don’t give much of a rats ass about Tyger, but oddly he picks these damn fights all the friggin time.
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 22, 2009 7:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
stupidgenius as in me?
Things could be worse. We could have kept Boylan.
by stupidgenius on Jun 21, 2009 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Plus
Rose was FAR better as a rookie, far more consistent.
I get that the system might not have been a perfect fit and the rule changes blah blah blah….
Rose just had it from the start of the year, I mean the first week we were in awe a bit, after ESPN and the other analysts suddenly dropped Rose to 6th in the ROY (Thinking that he and Beasley would be the best of the class, but that it would take Rose 3 yrs or so to get there).
Derrick was a sensational rookie. He did all that to start the year without ANY system….
THE BULLS ARE GOING TO WIN IN 2010....maybe by stating this the positive vibes can make it happen.
by majoyenrac on Jun 18, 2009 7:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
completely disagree
but you thought Beasley was a better prospect too, so it’s really all one’s perspective :-D
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 18, 2009 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
wow man
you done grinned so big your face done split! :-D
yea, jslakov was about the biggest beasley booster a year ago. i think he called me “a george bush supporter” over it. well, somebody got angry and did, lol! good times…
"As a basketball player gordon is a useless as tits on a a whore" - BigWay (Dec 2, 2008). BigWank, I'll miss you more than all the others. This song is for you, my brother!
by marionette on Jun 19, 2009 1:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am glad to see...
that he is getting a look for commentating, he was always an articulate guy.
by McCabe on Jun 17, 2009 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool
I was watching last night. Pretty interesting stuff if they could just show the workouts and quit all the commentary.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 18, 2009 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I was getting really frustrated
I could have tuned out the babbling had at least kept the camera focused on the workouts, but their were way too many times they cut to the closeups of the commenters. You’d think they might realize that most people willing to watch coverage of the combine would like to see how many of the guys there did, not just focus on a couple of the top guys. Of course, it was ESPN programming.
I was entertained by how many ways they found to call Hansbrough a stiff, I have to confess.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Jun 18, 2009 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
if he can get it good for him
we took a ben from them for a crap load of money and that worked out well right?
hopefully its time to return the favor, and BG craps out there
I remember Michael dribbling at the top of the key. Everybody knew to just get the hell out of his way. - Steve Kerr
by Yibs on Jun 17, 2009 8:41 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It is hard to get the last laugh when you have Deng holding down the fort.
Wallace got old and crotchety. Gordon is still young, extremely consistent with what he brings and isn’t injury prone. It is hard to see how he’d ever be as bad for them as Wallace was for us.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 9:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yea i kno
but one could dream
I remember Michael dribbling at the top of the key. Everybody knew to just get the hell out of his way. - Steve Kerr
by Yibs on Jun 17, 2009 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
We did give NY Larry Hughes.
And Duhon. And they even pretended they liked it for a while before they reached the poo part of the Hughes sandwich. Cling to that.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
yahhh!
i forgot about the great deng!
I was watching the 1995 Playoffs VS the Magic's and remembered how much I hated Horace Grant. Horace Grant - i hope you burn in bball hell
by Belize on Jun 17, 2009 10:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right now he is still in the phantom limb stage.
I keep running across him when I look over our salary problems. Otherwise I forget he is there. Still, he also isn’t as bad as Wallace. There is still hope he will drink milk and his bones will stop cracking. I guess England didn’t do those “Milk – it does the body good!” commercials.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXF5VcEmXG8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApVq2yG0po
blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up4XM48cStA
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 17, 2009 11:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Phantom Limb
Venture Bros Reference?
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
by piccolomair on Jun 18, 2009 3:20 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I just finished watching Band of Brothers.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 18, 2009 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope so :)
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 18, 2009 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im to drunk to read
the 190 posts that are here by the time I got to see this, so I dont know if the thoughts im about to spill have already Ben(haha but not funny at all) covered. There is no reason for the pistons to want Ben, and I think only an idiot wouldnt understand why. I like ben , but when you really get honest with youself(in the general terms) you understand that a Rose/Gordon backcourt would never win a title no matter what else is in place. Even if our golden boys D gets better. Unless it was first team all D which wont happen in the next 4 years if ever.
But now ill get called a Gordon troller, because I said somthing that was not dick sucking of Gordon(crane im looking at you)
by TruEChiFaN... on Jun 18, 2009 2:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
lol gordon troller
its funny because hes only tall has a troll
I remember Michael dribbling at the top of the key. Everybody knew to just get the hell out of his way. - Steve Kerr
by Yibs on Jun 18, 2009 6:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh, trolls are big.
I think you meant gnome.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Jun 18, 2009 8:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some say
the media is full of shit.
So Sam hears a rumor that Raymond Brothers is saying he’s got a $11 mil per guarantee from the Pistons. Gordon tells KC that isn’t true.
I guess it’s a good thing I am moving July 1 so won’t I can postpone the inevitable suffering.
12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Jun 18, 2009 2:36 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
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