PLAYOFFS Game Seven Open Thread Overflow3: Bulls at Boston Celtics
by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 2, 2009 10:00 PM CDT
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Welp...
This is what happens when you play a 3 guard lineup with salmons at the 4 for most of the 4th quarter. Way to sit tyrus all game to…FIRE VDN!
Most of the 4th?
Don’t you mean all of the 4th and most of the 3rd? We would have won this series with a better coach.
by BoxingHideout on May 2, 2009 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions
True story...
I mean, I saw Perkins go out early with fouls and I thought the bulls would go big to control the glass while they had a lead…instead they went small…rediculous!
Damn
kinda knew it was coming though…funny how that doesn’t help the hurt
"Worker bees can leave.
Even drones can fly away.
The Queen is their slave."
+1
Very well put.
I think the pain comes from Game 5 – I knew we had to win that game to have any real chance to win the series. When I think about what could have been with this series, it’ll be Game 5 that sticks in my head rather than Game 7.
"You ain’t as hot as I is / all of these false prophets is not messiahs /
You don’t know how high the sky is / the square mileage of earth or what pi is." - Nas
Not what I wanted but
that was better than I expected.
Rose had a better year than I expected
Noah had a better year than I expected
BG had a better year than I expected because he stayed professional and was consistent
Miller and Salmons were a bonus
We could do better with a healthy Deng
As long as the Bulls can improve from here (not like they did last year) I am pleased
Still… Fire Del Negro!!!
by JustAnotherFan on May 2, 2009 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Well now it whole other story
Will the Bulls re-sign BG?
Will they get rid of Kirk?
Will they try Amare again?
Will they get anything useful in the draft?
Will they trade the pick?
Will they make more moves looking at 2010?
Will Deng go back to his 07 game?
Not here to rub it in.
I was here when you guys won, and I was here when we won. I might be a Celtic fan, but I’m first, and foremost, a basketball fan.
You guys gave us basketball. A shitload of it.
Thank you, Bulls, for being a worthy adversary. I’ll keep an eye on you guys next season. Good luck with VDN.
Thanks for making it a series.
- Dirk 'DaarisDirk' van Boxtel
Best of luck.
I think you guys can make it out of the east again. Everyone gives the Cavs way too much credit. You’ve got a lot more depth.
Good luck with VDN would be his resignation… Can’t see that happening.
by NerdVernacular on May 2, 2009 10:11 PM CDT up reply actions
Celtics have no chance making it out of the east
Orlando will probably win in 5 or 6, the Cavs would kill them. The Celtics aren’t that good, thus how we almost won the series.
by BoxingHideout on May 2, 2009 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Kind of agree
Dunno about Orlando. This series has tired us out a lot, and I’m really not certain about a lot of things Orlando brings vs our squad. We’ll see man, we’ll see.
- Dirk 'DaarisDirk' van Boxtel
the Magic had issues
with the 76ers.. I’m not sure they’ll run over the Celtics.. At least Doc is smart enough to make adjustments if they’re having issues in the paint. I think Boston can win that series.
by NerdVernacular on May 2, 2009 10:15 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree. The Celtics with Pierce hurt, Rondo hurt, their best player missing, their 6th man missing… etc… not a good team at all. Probably about even with Chicago. Frankly, you guys should have won. If they had KG in there it would have been an easy sweep and this series would have been a nonstory. Boston doesn’t stand a chance of getting past the Cavs.
Honestly, you're not giving your squad enough credit.
Your guys played “out of their minds”, as some say. They played so damn well, everyone stepped it up. Dunno why, or how, but you guys made it a series. It wasn’t us, by being shortmanned, it was you, by giving us hell.
- Dirk 'DaarisDirk' van Boxtel
i give Pierce, Rondo, Ray and Perk credit for refusing to lose and gutting it out. But the simply fact is that Boston was only successful last year due to their defense… and without KG in there they are a SIGNIFICANTLY worse team on the defensive end. The team is all bout rotating and disrupting shots. Bulls wouldn’t have been able to penetrate and kill us from mid range with KG in there. As you’d imagine… some fat 2nd year 2nd rounder (Glen Davis) can’t provide anything close to what the defensive player of the year, best player on the team hall of famer can. Series would have been a clear easy sweep with him… and without him I found it painful to even watch the Celtics struggle. It was like watching a once proud sick old dog with broken legs fend off a hungry house cat. I didn’t think the dog should be taken out back and put down, but I sure didn’t enjoy watching them get eaten by a kitten.
I’m sure the series will be memorable for Bulls fans. For me… I’ll remember it as an undermanned banged up Celtic team missing their best player struggle with an superior upstart squad. It’d be like watching the Spurs try playing without Tim Duncan.
thanks
Good luck with VDN
There is no hope for that. But thanks.
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:11 PM CDT up reply actions
hahahaha
when looked at from a horribly wrong point of view, it could be seen as a slap in the face
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:13 PM CDT up reply actions
no offense intended ofcourse
I meant “good luck” as in: perhaps some new assistants or something might help. I dunno man.
- Dirk 'DaarisDirk' van Boxtel
yea i know, we're just giving you a hard time.
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions
noticed, but still ;)
I’ve been lurking in these threads for a bit and honestly, you guys are pretty cool. my blood might be green, yours is as red as it gets. And I dig the fact that you stand with your team, even through years like last year. It wasn’t that long ago that the C’s had some hardship too.
So yeh, I feel for you guys. Who knows, a good pick, a good trade… Next season man, clean sheet!
- Dirk 'DaarisDirk' van Boxtel
Blood isn't green,
everybody’s blood is red in the end. >:)
"Ben Gordon is a bundle of muscle and clutch. That's all he's made of. Drink BG7 energy drink, you'll grow a pair of balls on your balls."
Hope this makes you stronger
I really would like Boston to kick LeBron’s ass
by JustAnotherFan on May 2, 2009 10:12 PM CDT up reply actions
great series
bulls played way over their heads…seemed to really believe they could win it.
should definitely be some consolation in the play of rose and noah.
oh yeah and mr. blog a bull gets the gasface for that foul shit he said about len bias, god rest the dead.
really showed your ass- no class.
What in God's name is the gasface?
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on May 2, 2009 10:47 PM CDT up reply actions
I would reciprocate on celticsblog
but I’m afraid I probably wouldn’t be able to be civil right now. Maybe in a day or two.
Brad Miller: best center ever in a running lineup with no PF
"Ben Gordon is a bundle of muscle and clutch. That's all he's made of. Drink BG7 energy drink, you'll grow a pair of balls on your balls."
I am sick and fucking tired
of watching this team live or die by the jumpshot. Get a real coach and a post scorer. That is all. Why the hell didn’t Tyrus get any minutes? We got annihilated in the paint tonight thanks to someone’s idiotic rotation.
great series
would like to say the bulls have a heck of a future….
by celticinorlando on May 2, 2009 10:10 PM CDT reply actions
bye bye ben gordon
and please dear lord, bye bye vinny. but for sure, if paxson has eyes, bye bye ben gordon.
I am not sure sometimes...
On the one hand, he can win a game for you…on the other, he can do what he did today…I would like to see what would happen with Ben Gordon and Rose with a real coach…that said, I would not be too sad to see him go…Noah’s continued development will help
Summary
I still think the Bulls should have won this game if not two others in the series. I still see no offensive gameplan from the VDN and there definitely is no defense. They can’t adjust on the pick and rolls and can’t cover opponents bigs in the paint.
This team needs to get rid of VDN, Deng, and get a low post scorer. As far as BG, I used to be a huge fan but tonight I finally saw the selfish play that costs this team opportunties to score. I would miss Ben, but as sad as it is to say they might be better without him. Kirk actually is not bad coming off the bench either.
Finally, to the Celtics fans posting on this site, go fuck yourself! Find your own fan site and post your comments there. Your team sucks and should have lost this series. You will not make it past game 5 next series…
Enjoy the offseason, GO Hawks!
Disheartening, but Im proud of the Bulls, no matter what
re-sign BG this summer and keep this team together. Fuck all ya’ll that wants gordon gone. Luol should be healthy next year and be able to contribute.
Derrick Rose: Point GOD
by Juan dela Cruz on May 2, 2009 10:18 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
VDN reciting a poem in the locker room?
What kind of a postgame speech is this?
Bork bork bork!
by Avinash Kunnath on May 2, 2009 10:19 PM CDT reply actions
Stop blaming VDN...
the Celtics simply outplayed the bulls…no excuses, bulls even go to the ft line more, so the refs had nothing to do with it. Game 7 determined the better team…’nuff said.
Were you watchine the game...
Yes, I get that it needs to be on the players… but when the coach can’t even put in a reasonable lineup, there is only so much they can do…
They did outplay the Bulls
but they also outcoached the Bulls by a mile. When you’re getting killed in the paint, why is your best interior defender on the bench the whole game? Why does the offense revolve around forced isolation jumpers? Vinny Del Negro doesn’t have a clue what he’s doing.
by NerdVernacular on May 2, 2009 10:22 PM CDT up reply actions
i hated to death how we kept switching guards onto their post players.
need a better defensive strategy than that…
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:23 PM CDT up reply actions
i think a 4 gaurd line up is great, but not if theyre missing all of those shots
we needed rebounding bad in that last stretch
4 guards and Miller does not work.
4 guard and Noah could. There is a big difference. Miller was like a dragging anchor the whole time. He’s a dead weight for 4 guards.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
that was the biggest flaw of all
of VDN’s coaching flaws in this series, IMHO.
Sitting Tyrus so much was #2.
The heart has its reasons of which reason knows nothing.
Blaise Pascal, Bulls Fan
We had our biggest runs in the first and the third
when we had our starters in there. And that included Tyrus. Every time we deviated from that (Minus Kirk making his first appearance in a 4th quarter ever) we were pathetic.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Outplayed the Bulls?
Are you kidding? Dude, the Bulls cannot close. They had big leads in the 4th quarter in two of the games that they lost and forgot how to run an offensive play. If you have watched a few Bulls games this year, the reason they are in the playoffs and made it to game 7 is not because of VDN. VDN cannot coach and cannot motivate his team. The Bulls should have won this series hands down…
This series came down to offensive execution
There was one point where Doug Collins said that either Ray Allen or Paul Pierce (in the 3rd qtr) should get the ball, and they’ll make a play for themselves. What happened? Ray Allen got the ball, got doubled in the corner, dished it to Big Baby and he had an easy layin. Bingo. The Bulls don’t do that at all with Rose.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Make a play for themselves or a teammate^
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
here are the press-conferences streaming
if you care to listen to them
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
I suppose so...
but Tyrus Thomas seemed to turn it over every time he got on the floor, and Noah committed some unnecessary fouls that got him out of the game, overall, good luck to a successful 09-10 season
every time on the floor
equals once …
a turnover, by the way, that he redeemed with a block
"Ben Gordon is a bundle of muscle and clutch. That's all he's made of. Drink BG7 energy drink, you'll grow a pair of balls on your balls."
please someone ask Pierce why he didn't shake hands to the bulls, as a "playoff MVP"..
DRose is gonna carry us into the playoffs and take it to another level from there...
the word starts with "do" and ends with "uchebag"
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions
At least the young guys got some really good playoff experience
I do think this series was really good for our young team. You can’t get much better experience out of a first round exit.
doc with the cheap shot at VDN.. i like!
DRose is gonna carry us into the playoffs and take it to another level from there...
Sigh...
time to soak in the feeling of defeat…all of BG’s big shots gone to waste…Noah needs some Prozac…
Fantastic Basketball
And a fantastic series…not sure how much further the Celtics can go, especially after this dogfight, but the best first round series I’ve ever seen.
The Bulls have nothing to hang their heads about, in fact, I think there’s so much to look forward to (more than the aging Celtics) with the Noah and Rose duo.
Not sure why Thomas didn’t get more minutes…Celtics owned the paint it seemed.
Best of luck next year and in the off season, with the proper moves it could be the Bulls who have homecourt next year and as we saw tonight, it’s pretty important.
Don't fake the funk on a nasty dunk
reading your posts the past day or so...
I was getting tired of some of your shots at the Bulls but thanks for the class in that post. I knew the Celtics would eventually win this series with Pierce and Allen, proven All-Stars, stepping up. Congrats and good luck against Orlando (which I think you win) but it will be tough against Cleveland.
Congrats again!
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:35 PM CDT up reply actions
It was always there.
We just looked over it because we were so sorry he was on a sucky team. Now that he has his ring he has taken it to a whole new level.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
I remember some of it from the 04 series between Sac & Minny
When he compared that series to going to war. That was probably the best glimpse. (I still think it’s funny he got taken out by Peeler’s elbow. Still makes me laugh every time I see it.)
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Completely agree with you...
You couldn’t be more right on with your comment. I saw a picture in the Trib this week of KG yelling at BG from the bench, talking smack. What a tool he is. I thought this was a championship team and those usually have class. This Boston team is dirty and has no class. Othe than Ray Allen, the whole Celts team is a bunch of whiney bitches…
Really?
He’s been a douchebag of the highest order for years.
by drew gooden's facial growth on May 2, 2009 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions
It's disheartening to see the season end but.......
1. We lost to a team that still has proven All-Stars in Paul Pierce and Ray Allen and they are the defending champs.
2. The team didn’t quit this year in games, they kept fighting, just like 2nite.
3. We dealt with a lot of injuries this year (Kirk and Deng)
4. Rose is going to be a force and Stud in this league!
5. Noah proved his worth this series.
6. Our young guys got tremendous playoff experience this series.
7. Many games this season we gave away late leads, just like this series.
8. We actually had a winning record versus the West this year.
9. We gained respect from the league and media in this series.
10. Paxson made trades that puts us in good position for the future!
I knew this season wasn’t going much pass the first round but to finish 41-41, a winning record at home and taking the defending champs (minus KG) to the 7 games and be right there at the end, I’m proud of the Bulls and would take this season over last’s season of uninspired, unselfish play and team giving up when they got down!
For the haters on Gordon, the man played hurt the past 3 games for this team. I want to see him back cause he can score with the best of the them. Let’s see the team get stronger and focus on improving our defense. Can’t wait for ‘09-’10!
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:32 PM CDT reply actions 5 recs
agree'd. rec from me
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:34 PM CDT up reply actions
There's plenty to be happy about, but...
Tonight, I mourn and sulk. I can start looking forward to the future tomorrow.
Hey, hopefully.....
You recorded some of these games so you can relive the victories again. I’ve already watched Noah stealing it from Pierce and then throwing it down on his head 10 times I think!
I recorded every game that was on TV where I live, so I will enjoy some of them again. Like the comeback against the Rockets but I’m so glad I have this whole series on DVD!
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:39 PM CDT up reply actions
Good points
I know everyone’s hating on BG, but management needs to have a serious exit interview with VDN. I can’t imagine Pax is comfortable that we have an identity, even after this great experience. We’re not a defensive oriented team and don’t have a recognizable style on offense. What we are (and I know yfbb has said it a ton of times) is a team full of talented players. Before they enter into any contract talks, trade-talks, or draft scouting, I pray they really take a hard look at what kind of team they envision.
"Some people want it to happen, some wish it would happen, others make it happen." - Michael Jordan
Agreed....
The defense potential is there, it’s needs serious focus because when your shot isn’t dropping, you can always rely on stopping the other team. That is what the old Championship Bulls knew they could do!
Until that improves, we don’t get past the 2nd round!
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:46 PM CDT up reply actions
let's see what Vinny has to say now...
his press conf time
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
"We have a lot of young guys that have gone through it (playoffs) the first time"
Noah (1) and Rose (2) = alot apparently.
Also “Kirt” played a good game
yea! i loved how he announced it so clearly.
“Kur-TAH”
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:36 PM CDT up reply actions
Maybe he'll learn his players' names by next season
Why resort to name calling?
-Dionysus2.0
because I wish to insult you personally
-your friendly BullsBlogger
err. pronounced*
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 10:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Salmons
only really played a few meaningless minutes for the Sixers a few years back. This was his first real playoff experience.
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:37 PM CDT up reply actions
He is not young but....
This was his first real playoff experience, being in important situations, close games, hitting big FTs and shots. He will learn from this and he is 29 or 30 I think, still has 2 or 3 good years left. So that is a plus.
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions
Great series
See ya in the finals in about 3 years
by southern oregon on May 2, 2009 10:35 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
that would be freaking epic.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
If Artest can say it, so can I. Broy>Kobe.
I dream
of being on the other side of the 92 finals.
"B-Roy is the best shooting guard I have played against"
-Ron Artest
If Artest can say it, so can I. Broy>Kobe.
MJ retired...
You aren’t getting on the other side friend-o
If we aren't careful, the leanness we now feel will be the starvation of those we serve.
by Chi 'Till I Die on May 2, 2009 11:59 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok it may have been entertaining
but it was bad basketball which is pretty much all you see in the NBA now.
I hope this turns into a Mike Brown-type situation
I mean, that guy was just a big dumbass his first years. Remember his playbook.
Iso to Lebron
^that was it.
He’s gotten better
Do you like fishsticks?
At least he knew defense and had them play it.
That’s the problem with our coach. He doesn’t do anything particularly well. Mike Brown had one end of the court down, so its much easier to bring in assistants to take care of the other end.
"Some people want it to happen, some wish it would happen, others make it happen." - Michael Jordan
But VDN would have just do Iso for Larry Hughes in that situation
For those playing the home version
The conversion goes as follows
LeBron:Rose::Hughes:Gordon. A+ for my analogy skills
That conversion doesn't work at all
I mean … at all
wow
"Ben Gordon is a bundle of muscle and clutch. That's all he's made of. Drink BG7 energy drink, you'll grow a pair of balls on your balls."
felt like i just broke up with my gf again
or she broke up with me..anyways very crushed right now
Ben wants to remain a Bull
TNT just played a short clip of David Aldridge interviewing Ben after the game. He says that he wants to stay but he’ll have to see what the Bulls want to do.
http://awsomepeoplesearch.com/
Who will be our SG?
Did he say who?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Second quarter Kurt or 4th quarter Kurt?
Just because he left off with a high note doesn’t mean he suddenly materialized into a SG. I bet it ends up being Salmons at SG and Deng at SF, if Deng gets healthy.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Would dumping Hinrich be something you would think of?
Portland fans are already sweating over that one cran.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Depends on what we'd get back for him.
He should be starting PG on another team, but the Bulls have already indicated they won’t give him away for nothing. We had an offer for him earlier we turned down because it wasn’t good enough.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Please specify what that offer was if you can
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am going to have to have a Kirk fan step in.
It is all a blur for me. It was something not equivalent to a starting PG price though. I’ll have to run off to do some hunting for that unless someone steps in…
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
It was the Minnesota one.
I’ve blanked out on pretty much every detail of anything before this series right now, but it was mainly expiring contracts. Pax said he had another chance for a deal to put the Bulls in great shape for 2010 financially, but it wouldn’t have been a good basketball move for this year. We all assume he was talking about the Kirk to Minnesota thing.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
I can understand that
But, here’s what I don’t understand. If you’re Chicago, does Kirk Hinrich provide more value than Ben Gordon long term? Particularly since shooting is one issue that the Bulls will always need addressed.
Yes, maybe it didn’t make sense for the Bulls to dump Kirk Hinrich at the deadline, but maybe dumping him during the draft to Portland makes sense in a 2nd thought scenario. I’m not noodling here, or trying to pin motives, but I’m saying that if Chicago is serious about not paying luxury tax and keeping Gordon, something has to give. It’s either Salmons or Hinrich. Hinrich seems like the more logical target.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
You went wrong when you used the word logic.
The Bulls have been less than logical every off season I’ve been watching in recent years. Anything is possible.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
True
My mistake.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Please trade us Rudy and Batum
:D
"Ben Gordon is a bundle of muscle and clutch. That's all he's made of. Drink BG7 energy drink, you'll grow a pair of balls on your balls."
The non-basketball savvy Chicago media and Bulls
Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf personally like “Kurt” Hinrich and personally dislike Ben Gordon.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on May 3, 2009 3:21 AM CDT up reply actions
Bunch of expiring bench warmers from the Timberwolves, IIRC.
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on May 3, 2009 3:19 AM CDT up reply actions
blake or rodriguez and batum
plus a first rounder for kirk seems fair. Kirk can play both pg and sg (to an extent) and you want b-roy on the floor as much as possible, so if kirk is playing sg then roy can play sf easy. Then you have Rudy who can play sg when kirk plays point moving b-roy to sf. The bulls need a backup sf not named tim thomas and taller than 6’4. Thats batum, who is young, and athletic, plus we need a backup pg which is blake or rodriguez (it doesnt even matter since we want rose in as much as you want b-roy in) The first rounder is to make things fair-er since you guys arent giving us anything too special.
Thats the realistic offer, i would hope the bulls would try to get fernandez and rodriguez from from you cuz and not the draft pick and batum, in either case, everytime i run the scenerio, Hinrich, B-roy, aldridge and your solid centers (pryz and oden) make you quite a power house on both sides of the court (hinrich roy and center on defense, while aldridge, roy, and hinrich on offense)
THe bulls shed cap space, shorten rotation while adding needed backups, and we look even better salary wise going into 2010, while remaining competetive (and possibly resigning gordon).
As a bulls fan im happy, and as a hinrich fan i get to hope hinrich wins a ring with you guys…
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
I got a better question
Why couldn’t the Bulls trade Salmons?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Wouldn't that be possible to address through the draft?
Wouldn’t you rather get a cheap SG/SF through the draft and retain Gordon than keep Salmons and lose Gordon?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Does that draft look good this time around?
I am not sure who we’d get with our pick that would be able to preform his first day out. Or even his second year out for that matter.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Not many notables have come forward
it could be viewed as a good draft to get some good low-pick steals though. In these kind of “bland drafts” there is always the potential of finding diamonds in the rough
And you have to remember
we SUCK at developing young guys. Whatever good that happens is by their own effort. Noah had to hire his own guys and I seem to remember hearing other players have too because the team is lacking in that department.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Developing young talent is key
An organization has to be good at that to make the draft work for them. The Bulls are lucky (or maybe not) they’ve had so many high picks.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Very good point.
We drafted Tyrus because we thought we could develop him in the background while our team was on the right track (we viewed the 2nd pick as a luxory). Today, Tyrus is still an athletic freak that takes off on plays, has no real offense, and goes for too many blocks.
Exactly
That’s how I’d look at it. Besides. don’t you want to get your core production from your main players anyway?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
We can still keep Salmons (he'll opt out for 2010)
and still draft cheap SG/SF and not have to worry about Gordon and the contract he wants (which will hinder free agent chances)
That's wishful thinking
But okay. And I don’t mean that to be a prick.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
What's the wishful part?
In my situation we have more constants. Salmons play is constant, and his contract is a constant (as in, it is known). We know what pick positions we have (constant).
Gordon’s play (not constant/consistent can be hot or cold too often) and contract (who knows how much he’ll want or what other teams are willing to pony up) are variables. Plus, any money we give him is less we can offer a free agent.
The Bulls wont have any cap room anyway
So how it is possible the Bulls would be able to make a Free Agent offer?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
If you dump Kirk Hinrich
You’re basically switching Hinrich for Gordon. That makes more sense to me anyway.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Guys like playing with BG.
You hear that over and over again. Having him would make us more attractive to free agents, not less. Get rid of Kirk for expiring, Miller gets off the books…if BG signs for what they offered him last year and pulled off the table we should be fine. Plus BG’s role on the team changes with a star player on the team. Allen certainly has benefited from it for example.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Plus I doubt we keep Tyrus
his check is coming up and I don’t think it will be signed by us.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
I think we'll try to get rid of him (probably as a chip in a trade)
mainly for the fact that his contract is up. I don’t think the Bulls want to re-sign a guy that is still a work-in-progress. He seems like he’ll be one of those guys that will give flashes of brilliance too infrequently (like when Mikki Moore would kill us when he was with the Nets).
With a good coach
he could probably do great things more consistently than what he’s flashed at here. If he needs structure the Bulls ain’t the place. Benching him in this game after him not really playing worse than Miller is the signal. That is pretty humiliating for a guy you plan on keeping. Not for a guy who knows he is leaving.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
which part Scotter?
Well, it’s wishful thinking Salmons will opt out yes, and it’s wishful thinking that Salmons could replace Gordon’s shooting, and it’s wishful thinking that Gordon’s liabilities make the Free Agent market less for him. The Bulls have tried unsuccessfully for 2 years to sign him.
I think this is a very difficult play for the Bulls to pull off however they decide to do it (probably poorly).
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
He actually tried signing
before the league deadline but the Bulls pulled the offer since they had set up an artificial deadline that he did miss. That does indicate he might sign that same contract if they offer it again. We will see I guess. Part of me wishes he won’t just so I don’t have to hear all the Ben haters day in and day out. What will they do without Ben to gripe about?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Gripe about something else
That’s what haters do.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
He'd be dumb not to opt out
he’s playing very well and is getting paid just under what most people would feel his value is. Plus he’s getting older so he’ll want to cash out quick. I’d say a healthy Salmons’ (remember he was putting up around 25 a night before the groin) defense + offense > a healthy Gordon’s (I’m not forgetting that his leg was injured here) defense + offense.
While I do like to rag on Gordon, I do acknowledge that his defense is actually not as bad as most argue. In fact he’s good at being around loose balls – so in that respect his defensive awareness is good (but helping out on defense or rotating over isn’t that good… plus his height is a bit of a problem.. but his strength helps out a little… see, I’m one of those logical Ben-knockers). I think Salmons is a better fit for us. He attacks the rim more consistently, and he can make his own shot opportunities (I always said Gordon is a better spot up shooter, than taking it off the dribble).
So there’s my reply to that…
I've watched Salmons for some time now
When he came to the Kings, I expected a combo G. He ended up playing SF. He’s really a SG with ball handling ability. Which made him a duplication of Francisco Garcia. (Next year is a huge deal for Cisco.) The point I’m making is that now the Kings have the opportunity to go fill their holes with players who will make the team better in the short & long term.
I don’t understand how Salmons is a guaranteed opt out when A) he has had a career season, and B) how much in demand will he be when 2010 comes around and so many premier guys are on the market? He may take the safe route.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
The teams that don't get their star player
will have money squirreled away and might spend a portion of it on Salmons as a consolation prize.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Do you honestly believe that?
Or has the dysfunctionality of the Bulls scrambled your brain to where you only think that way?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I really mean that as a joke
I’d be crazy if I was a Bulls fan. This franchise has done truly outlandish things. Especially to the fanbase.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Hey, history shows us that is the case
How did Rashard Lewis, Jerome James, Stephon Marbury, Jamal Crawford, Samuel Dalembert, Quentin Richardson, Jason Richardson. Bobby Simmons, and more get their oversized contracts?
Because they went to teams that had money left to burn after they swung on a whiffed on the guys they really wanted.
Rashard Lewis?
The Magic targeted him the whole summer.
Beyond that though, you’re probably looking at a new NBA. If anything this past year is an indication, cutting costs will be a major agenda on teams that are looking to cut back because now they can. I’ll bet Salmons is in the first bin of players who is badly hurt by that potential trend.
You could be right, and I could be right. We’ll see.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Why did they target him?
Because they had cap room and had to use it. The same reason we targeted Ben Wallace.
Rashard Lewis was their target because there were no good major free agents available. The same thing will happen in 2010 when most of the big stars re-sign with their teams (and a few go elsewhere).
I think you're reading the tarot cards wrong for several reasons
One is because the salary cap is likely to go significantly down meaning there won’t be as many teams needing to spend money to get over the minimum salary cap.
Two is that how many players can do what John Salmons does? How many players can do what Ben Gordon does? There’s a real market for Gordon, and what kind of market exists for Salmons is anyone’s guess. It’s just that Gordon is going into Free Agency at the wrong time, and Salmons could be walking into the perfect storm perse.
This is where I jump off the boat. It’s time for me to take my happy ass to bed. To you syxx, cran, Scotter, and every other Bulls fan, great series and hopefully the future works out as well as this series did.
Good night.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Huh?
Salmons played really great ball his time here as a Bull minus his injury hampered playoff series. I don’t think he is that good, but if he keeps it up for a reasonable amount of time there will be teams with money out there who might want him. I am not talking anywhere near a max deal, but with everyone clearing out space for only a few stars that will be available they will have to sign someone to make a roster. Once again, I don’t think he is that good. He wouldn’t be the first not that good guy to luck out.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
History doesn't say he will
He was playing well above his career mean in Sacramento, and he continued in Chicago. Next year will I think determine whether he opts out. (How the market looks I imagine will have something to do with it too.)
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
It's his last chance to get a multi-year deal.
In almost every case NBA players opt out in favor of securing that next long term deal. And a lot of it has to do with the agents. They only get paid when a new contract is signed so there’ significant incentive for the agent to talk his client into opting out.
I don’t think Salmons is a lock to opt out, but if he gets 35 min/g and averages close to 20 points per game again, I think the odds are better than 50/50 he opts out.
What happens if Deng comes back healthy?
What then? I’m not saying anything is absolutely 100% because if I could predict the future, I would not be chatting up with yall here.(No matter how much I do enjoy it.) I would be making fat ass moolah predicting the future. What I’m saying this is a very tenous situation that is far from perfect prediction.
You mention the past, and I think it’s a fair point. But, if this economy has done anything to NBA teams, wouldn’t’ Salmons be the first kind of player hurt by a new NBA team’s important in not to overspend on the type of player Salmons is?
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
fat ass moolah predicting the future... :-)
The thing is he’s making at or under what he could be making. He may try to get signed somewhere else just so he can keep at or around his current pay for 4 or 5 more years.
As opposed to sticking with us here (which I wouldn’t really mind) and then wonder if teams will want to sign for a longer contract…
And what I'm saying is
There might not be a single NBA team willing to offer that contract anymore. I think this summer will be very telling.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Salmons was highly sought after
even when we were dealing for him. I’d be surprised if he didn’t get some tempting offers. He seems to like being on a winning team though. If his offers come from teams with less expectations than the Bulls he might not be swayed away. Of course dealing with Bulls management…he might run for the hills at first sight at the three headed Garpaxdorf monster. Or does it have four heads?
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
that's all true
Salmons did have a few serious suitors. I’m still shocked he ended up in Chicago, but that was the price for deadling Brad Miller. And that definitely had to be done. The money issue was also a big deal there as the Kings were looking to gain flexibility by moving that money in miller & salmons to basically Noc. I still like the deal (love it actually) from Sac’s end. I think it’s worked out for the Bulls.
All that said, I don’t believe Salmons is a guaranteed lock to do anything. 5 million dollars guaranteed money may be better than going out on the market without a whole lot of a guarantee to get another long term contract. Salmons isn’t a star in the NBA. He’s a very solid player who can work well within the right kind of system, but one reason he’s flown under the radar I believe is that he hasn’t always played well with different opportunities. He needs minutes and starting minutes. That’s not going to increase his market but really decrease it. Of course, that’s assuming NBA teams don’t still suffer from the spending spree’s they’ve traditionally gone on. I’m not convinced that this “economy” talk won’t change how the teams spend money. I’m very convinced that this is all up in the air, and everything said here today is just hot air on each side. There is a ton of variables from here on out that none of us know.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Very good points
The Kings are my team in the West (have been since the Mitch Richmond days), and I liked the trade for both sides.
You’re right, it’s hard to know what Salmons will do, but the original point (about 30 posts ago, heh) was that his future is more certain than Gordons, which I still think is true. Either Salmons stays and gets paid what he’s contracted for or he opts out and the Bulls get more cap room. While Gordon depends on him wanting to stay or leave, the Bulls wanting to keep or ignore Gordon, other teams willing to make a play for Gordon, and how much Gordon will be paid in those scenarios.
That’s all. No one is saying Salmons is a star, but he is a VERY good role player being paid average role player money.
He doesn't like being interviewed either LOL
I’m still shocked Sam Amick did an in depth profile of him.
Evil Cowtown Inc: Screwin' Suckaz over since Nineteen Eighty-Five.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
FUCK CHUCK!
Seriously, he is a flaming asshole.
If we aren't careful, the leanness we now feel will be the starvation of those we serve.
by Chi 'Till I Die on May 3, 2009 12:00 AM CDT up reply actions
Barkley or Swirsky?
"Whoever was responsible for pulling that offer [to Ben Gordon] off the table...bring him before me and I'll punch him right in the face " - Frederick Pfeiffer
by Granny Waiters on May 3, 2009 4:34 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm on the side that says.....
Pay him fairly, he has played hurt for this team. He is willing to take the big shot and can hit it sometimes. Let’s see what happens but I want him back.
by BullsAttitude on May 2, 2009 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions
damn. wanted to see some of our players' press conf
but nba.com just shows the coaches. ghey
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
In my fanpost earlier today,"Can the Bulls knock off another NBA champion", I said no. My 4th reason makes me feel almost like a prophet after viewing another Vinny the Ninny performance. Can't we just vote this clown off the island and start next year
4) Vinny is our coach for the biggest game of his career (granted there have only been 88 of them, many being real stinkeroos) and asking him to get us over the hump in a season where he suffered numerous brain cramps intermixed with mind-boggling mistakes is like expecting Paris Hilton to lead a campaign to promote teen abstinence or even less likely, him allowing Tyrus Thomas to remain on the court
during crunch time even if our interior defense is leaking like a Katrina dyke.
That prediction is still valid but I must amend it to read ….remain on the court for at least 18 minutes. But than its always reassuring to see Derrick Rose matched up in the post with either Davis or Perkins. As they say in tennis, advantage Celtics.
And how about Ben? After sinking 4 of 6, he finished the game hitting only 3 of 17 while grinding our so called offense to almost a complete standstill. In the final 3 games Gordon shot a sparkling 17 of 58 (.293) and his defense tonight was woeful, yet I don’t blame him since our anti-coach. outside of an occasional pick and roll or pick and pop, only has Iso’s by Salmons, Rose and especially Ben in his playbook.
When the jump shots don’t fall, the Bulls do. Tonight once again demonstrates almost complete cluesness regardless of what chicken scratchings he has scribbled on his clipboard. At some point, prior to slitting my wrists, I will try to think of some favorable comments about this season and the future direction of this team. Unfortunately, as long as Captain Kangeroo is at the helm, it is going to be extremely difficult to guide this ship in the right direction so I will wind this up with just 2 words from the depths of my heart………………………..FIRE VINNY!
If you can't answer a man's arguments, all is not lost. You can still call him vile names.
Elbert Hubbard
It feels so good!!!
Thank you Bulls fans… your colorful message board is now filled with misery!!!!
This feels so GREAT!!!
Hope you enjoy it tonight...come Monday...the end of your one-hit wonder begins.
"Some people want it to happen, some wish it would happen, others make it happen." - Michael Jordan
I'm not terribly upset.
We were not going to win anything anyway. Just like the Celtics.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Ben Gordon: Where Cojones Happen. - Gene Wojciechowski
by chibullsfan03 on May 2, 2009 11:03 PM CDT up reply actions
But is smells like old people in there. :(
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
*it
damn, there goes the joke. :(
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Yeah
But then I remember that the Bulls have a future beyond these playoffs
by drew gooden's facial growth on May 2, 2009 11:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Winning a first round series against
a seven seed in seven games feels great? The only reason this series was anywhere competitive is because the Celtics are injured and mediocre.
Well, to channel the coach who ran Red out of town…“Kevin Garnett isn’t walking through that door! Leon Powe isn’t walking through that door! And if they did they’d be limping!”
"Your eyes can decieve you. Don't trust them." Obi-Wan Kenobi, the first sabermetrician...
by Curtain Jerker on May 2, 2009 11:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm glad you feel good
about being taken to a game 7 by a team with 20 less wins than your team. By a team “coached” by VDN. By a team that played Lindsey Hunter. By a team without “the Man from Sudan.” By a team lead by a ROOKIE POINT GUARD. By a team with NO BIGS. By a team that you should have swept.
Enjoy your moment now, because in a year or two when KG, Allen, and Pierce are looking slow and old like Brad Miller (also on our team), our young Bulls will be lead by a dominant Rose right past your old and broken team.
I'll also add, By a team that got routed at home by you in Game 3 (a game on our home court)
By a team that got routed in the last game of the season at home (where a win would have let us play the Magic instead of your somehow-non-flagrant-foul-getting team).
I hope the Red Sox, Bruins, Celtics, and Patriots all get hindered by a freak fannypack-related accident..
I know how the ash tastes in your mouth
But the Magic thank you for taking them to the wall and I thank you for some fine BB
by southern oregon on May 2, 2009 11:32 PM CDT reply actions
Welp, I'm calling it a night. And a post season.
Time to start looking into the draft, watching the trade rumors, and waiting for summer league to start.
GREAT SEASON BULLS. THANKS FOR PROVIDING US WITH ONE OF THE GREATEST PLAYOFF SERIES AND GAMES (3OTs of pure awesomeness – also resulting in a Celtics loss, Noah postering Pierce, and Rose rejecting that d-bag Rondo).
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