"I've talked to Vinny about this. And our future is Derrick. There's no secret of that. There are times that I personally feel - and Vinny knows this - that I feel he should be on the floor at the end of games."
almost 3 years ago
NittanyCub
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Pax should just come down and coach the team already and get it over with
Vinny discovers frontcourt by accident. Someone re-smash Gooden’s groin!
- your friendly BullsBlogger
by fundamentallysound on Mar 2, 2009 6:19 PM CST reply actions
on comcast today
, “If you ever saw how emotional I get watching games … thats the reason I could never coach” – Pax
Fucking A Right - I've been waiting for this for 14 months now.
This is a start. Now if someone could actually coach the guys (as opposed to just playing them), we might have something.
Viva la nuance! Reading comprehension rules!!!
translation:
‘if YOU don’t play the kid at the end of the games, I’ll find someone who will…"
http://awsomepeoplesearch.com/
Maybe it's
“Hey, Vinny, your job is safe, man. Play the kid, win or lose – you’ll be here next season to reap the benefits of his learning curve.”
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
Saw this as well
Pretty awesome. Hopefully he’s realized how dumb this guy he hired really is.
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
He did find two not-dumb guys that Jerry scared off.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
Definitely, but there are also a lot more not-dumb guys out there he still could have hired
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
About F'ing time
It also has the probably unintentional but perhaps worthwhile side effect of explaining to potentially interested teams why Kirk Hinrich is sitting on his ass for 34 minutes a game.
? What do you mean?
If we aren't careful, the leanness we now feel will be the starvation of those we serve.
by Chi 'Till I Die on Mar 3, 2009 9:40 AM CST up reply actions
I bet this is status quo for the Bulls Mgmt, Owner, Coach, Players..
they communicate to one another “really” primarily via the media..
where and when did Paxson talk to him? in Paxson’s dreams? Heck, Paxson you’re the GM (get it!), you’re the boss of all of the coaches!
Did Vinny not listen to you? did Vinny say shut up and now you are taking his insubornation public? I’m missing something?
Is Paxson crying.. by saying I tried to tell him, but he did’nt listen to me?
Man up! you’re the Boss.. When Jerry Dorf came to town and said, they will play better.. and the team did for a while.
When PAxson speaks.. nothing changes…
man up!
How is Pax crying?
It was during an interview… my guess is Kashul asked him about Rose being on the bench in crunch-time.
I would rather have the AI of 2k9 coach this team than VDN
by trig on Feb 22, 2009 1:23 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
by chibullsfan03 on Mar 2, 2009 9:29 PM CST up reply actions
i heard this on the radio
i think paxson first set it publically during the rockets game at halftime with steve cashell (sp?). Lo and behold, the rockets game rose played the 4th quarter……so…yea..
On Behalf of Sue, Wjb, majoyenrac, Bullshooter and all the other Hinrich fans...Ill keep the Hinrich Hope coming...There will be light!
In other words.....
Don’t fuck up our cash cow or your ass will never see the light of day again. ANYWHERE!!!!!
Here's my take...
I understand that usually with rookies, coaches want to limit their minutes and have them learn by watching more experienced players show them the ropes. This has worked for some players, an example off the top of my head Deron Williams. But usually with number 1 picks playing on crappy teams, you have to play your superstar rookie. These rare talents usually have the uncanny ability to learn on the fly. So leave Rose in and let him play.
More from KC
For the second time in three days, general manager John Paxson disclosed that he discussed Derrick Rose’s fourth-quarter playing time with Del Negro. Speaking on Comcast SportsNet’s “Monsters in the Morning,” Paxson said: “He has to be in there to continually learn. And he will be.” … In the same interview, Paxson called his relationship with Del Negro “very good” and said he had talked with the first-year coach more than he did with Bill Cartwright or Scott Skiles. “We knew when we gave Vinny the job that he had never coached before so he was going to make mistakes,” Paxson said.
Might as well have said
“We knew when we gave him the job, he would fuck up . . . but hey, he was cheap”
by Option27 on Mar 2, 2009 11:45 PM CST up reply actions 4 recs
seriously
He has to talk to Vinny more cause Vinny is an idiot. Skiles was a good coach
by The90sBullsRevival on Mar 3, 2009 1:22 AM CST up reply actions
Pax should've said
we knew when we gave vinny the job that he had never coached before so he was going to be awesome, look at our record, 27-33, crazy isn’t it? rookie coach 27 wins. Well if we had d’antoni it couldve well been 40-20 but. vinny is cheap so, 27-33 is aight. He has already surpassed the total wins in a season by Floyd, and Cartwright so i have found a gold mine.
Derrick Rose got Freakin Skillz. When are we going to add a 7th championship?
by broseleay301 on Mar 3, 2009 3:49 AM CST up reply actions
Looks like
John got my message. It was obvious to most what VDnNwas doing wrong but a few if nto a lot of phone calls telling John what the fans are seeing might have been the clincher! Ill take credit for this…
You'd think this would satisfy Bulls fans, but in a way, it's actually more frustrating
because it reminds you of how asinine it was to bench Rose in the first place. In fact, it seems even more asinine now that management has had to come out with public statements in support of this very obvious proposition: play Rose in the 4th quarter!
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
by bullhockey on Mar 2, 2009 11:57 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
it's also frustrating
that he didn’t do such things last year when there was clearly nothing to lose by playing the young players.
USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Mar 3, 2009 12:06 AM CST up reply actions
Yeah. What a waste last season was...
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
It was all a part of the "process"
of fucking things up so much that it lead to us getting Rose… wait that was the unintended consequence of the previous years incompetence.
If we aren't careful, the leanness we now feel will be the starvation of those we serve.
by Chi 'Till I Die on Mar 3, 2009 9:42 AM CST up reply actions
Very True...
Seeing this article was totally bittersweet. It made me happy to know D-Rose will finally be playing during crunch time but at the same time it pisses me off that they didn’t just fire this idiot. Lets be serious, my 12 year old cousin even kept asking why isn’t Rose on the court. If a 12 year old knows that our franchise player should be playing in the 4th qtr and a Professional Coach doesn’t… something sounds wrong. I’m pretty sure I’m gonna be an unhappy bulls fan as long as VDN is the coach.
how could someone need to be told this?
i mean, come on, i thought it was obvious that tyrus needs to play at the end of games, but i could see how someone might not realize that. but rose? really? really?
/seth myers’d
Cashing checks and having sex.
So is this a sign that even Pax knows how stupid VDN is?
And, if so, how come he didn’t do this last year when the season was lost and there was nothing left to do but play Tyrus and Noah, hell even Thabo? Every time I think about Boylan, it just gets worse. His tenure truly was the worst Bulls basketball I’ve ever endured. At least in the Tim Floyd heydey you knew the team was garbage and expected nothing but the worst.
Confusion breeds success. If they don't know each other, opponents can't have strategy. GENIUS.
The only way this could make sense is if this is a move to reassure VDN that his job security
does not depend on winning or inflating the trade value of Hinrich; but rather, it depends on getting the star rookie some valuable experience. In other words, this is not a “win now” kind of a team, because it’s not a contender.
Vinny probably goes to the vet in order to play it conservative, with the hopes of making the playoffs and thus preserving his job security. Much like Boylan attempted to do.
It’s great that Pax takes him aside and says, “Vinny, don’t worry about playing it safe and going with the veteran guy who’s known for his defense, whom we’re trying to trade this summer. None of that matters, and don’t worry about having to do that to keep your job. We need to get Rose some experience.”
That’s the only way Vinny’s idiotic refusal to play Rose makes sense to me. And given that Vinny’s employing this classic rookie/interim coaching maneuver, it’s perfectly reasonable for Pax to correct it.
Of course, it coulda come a couple games earlier…
"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris
by bullhockey on Mar 3, 2009 12:29 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
How bad does this hire look now?
The fact that Paxson has to tell this to his coach and ensure the media/fans that he corrected Vinny’s mistake shows you how bad of a coach he is. Thing is, that makes Paxdorf look even worse for hiring him!
I don't really care how it looks
I just want him to play Rose in the fourth.
by NittanyCub on Mar 3, 2009 12:45 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
This article just pisses me off even more...
…WTF!?!?! Is VDN really still an NBA coach? It feels unrealistic this guy hasn’t been canned… every single Bulls fan has been angered ever since this idiot keeps pulling out our franchise player and probably would have continued to do so unless Paxson stepped in. VDN has to be the worst coach in the NBA; this team has way too much talent to be below .500. I honestly believe this team can end the season at .500 or a few games above but it will have nothing to do with VDN… it has to do with Paxson finally drawing the line and publicly calling VDN an idiot in other words.
Though, we could blame this on Paxson for hiring this idiot instead of Mike D’Antoni and also for not firing VDN already. WTF is he waiting for? It’s obvious VDN is a horrible coach that has no idea what he is doing. I say fire him already and start working on getting Jeff Van Gundy or Avery Johnson… Hell, I bet a monkey would do a better job
Huh?, Pax did not hire VDN instead of Mike D'Antoni
He settled for VDN after D’Antoni chose the Knicks intead of the Bulls (and after Collins renounced too).
The Game chose him !
VDN will now play Rose and move Kirk to SF??
in the 4th qtr. If so will Kirk run down the clock and still dominate the ball on some offensive possessions?
Was Paxson directive clear or just make sure Rose is playing the 4th qtr? , Doesn’t really matter if Rose swings over to a semi-shooting guard role during this period?
man up!
Ok, one of the problems is solved
But the thing about Rose playing the 4th quarter or not doesn’t end here. What’s the point of him playing if he can’t handle the ball, because BG or Hinrich are jealous and want to do dribble, dribble, dribble? I’m on the play Rose on the 4th quarter wagon, but just don’t play him. Give him the damm ball and let him create. Tell him to drive, to find open players and not to only carry the ball to the opponent half court and then give it immediately
Get of here with that BG is jeaous talk. If Rose is having a great year, and BG is having a great year and
Rose has taken the most last second shots on the team, how does that make BG jealous? Bg is playing the most minutes in his career and having his best year as a pro playing with Rose. So how does that make him Jealous??
If you payed attention to games, you would easily conclude that, sometimes, not always, BG looked for his shot and didn't let Rose create
Or, on the fast break, he opted to go to the rim and missed instead of passing the ball to Rose, who was in better position to score. This things only happen now an then, but you can see that. And I’m not talking about last second shots. Those decisions are made by the coaches, not the players. Do you think BG likes to see Rose taking that last second shot and be the man, when on previous seasons he was always the only choice?
I don't know, I haven't talked to BG lately. Have you?
And I’ve watched ans paid attention to every game and to me they seem to play well together. Rose’s assist numbers went up after BG was inserted in the starting lineup. It’s not like BG takes a bunch of shots per game anyway. I don’t think he takes enough to affect Rose’s ability to get guys involved. Now Hinrich? I agree. Because he dribbles a lot and when given the opportunity to hit open shots supplied to him by Rose, he doesn’t captilize. Gordon does. Rose scored 16 pts in the 4th quarter in the win over the Rockets. Gordon scored 11. That’s not jealousy, that’s a problem for opposing teams trying to stop 2 guys instead of 1.And that’s our 2 guards coming together to provide a come from behind victory. Again, how is that jealousy on BG’s part?
I don't need to talk to a player to know that
Put you in BG place. Would you like to see that? Especially knowing that Rose missed some shots and, after that, we lost on overtime?
Ok, maybe jealous was not the right word. But you have to admit that the selfish problem of BG is not eliminated yet. And those fast breaks – I just don’t remember in which game they were, but I know that we lost… hum… I think Miami – are a good example.
Ok ok. I agree BG did screw up on the fastbreak
But I guess i’m one of those fans whose protective of people lableing BG as a selfish ballhog. I just think people pick on BG because it’s just easy to do. Because he doesn’t take a lot of shots but he’s consistent at scoring and he’s been the most consistent player on the team this year. Even when he does get it done in the clutch like the Clippers game or the Heat game where he took over and hit 3 big free throws, no one gives him credit. They just knock his short comings. Literally. When he plays a part in a huge victory against the Rockets, we’re talking about what he didn’t do. BG has had to watch Luol Deng get 71 mil and Hinrich get 11mil a year while all the guy has been is professional, stayed healthy, and he comes into each season in the best shape of anyone on the team. Is he worth 71 million. No. But the money he was asking for doesn’t look so bad now. Rose needs to earn the right to be the closer, which he’s getting closer to doing with Saturday’s performance. Gordon’s been doing that since he first came in the league. He’s earned the right to be called better things then selfish.
I like BG too
He’s far way better than last year, there’s no question about that, and far, far better then Luol or Hinrich. He’s just one of those players that people love when he plays great, and hate when he make mistakes… And that, my friend, is not going to change
So the Bulls can't have
a guy like Gordon who can create his own shot? Most teams in the league do have a couple guys who can do that. And it is a good thing. I guess you think the Bull’s don’t need them, right? I remember people here constantly pointing out one of Deng’s biggest weaknesses has always been that he can’t create shots for himself. And that he’d be so much better if he could because he is so defendant on everyone else to get his shot going. So we have this guy Gordon who can create his own shot, he is super efficient, and can get us out of shooting funks because he isn’t dependent on everyone else to be successful. Yet that is bad? To me that sounds like a good front court situation to have in the 4th.
Rose has no trouble getting into his game and his offense with Gordon out there. In the last game they both did very well in the 4th taking turns and it seemed like Rose got any look he wanted and Gordon got some looks too. That is a good thing. We always talked about having more than one go-to option since we’ve been riding Gordon all these years with no one to split the defense and diversify our 4th quarter offense. Now we have Rose who can take over games attacking the basket and Gordon who can hit tough shots from outside. Seems like the ideal situation. But I guess the Bulls don’t need that, huh? Rose is good but if the defense is suffocating him because he is the only threat it will wear pretty fast on him.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
I clearly was misunderstood
Let me see if I can explain better. I don’t have a problem with BG creating his own shot. Not at all. It’s actually a good thing, like you said. The problem is when he exaggerates dribbling and don’t give the ball to other players that are in a better position to score. We haven’t seen this lately – at least I can’t remember, which is very good sign-, but he used to keep dribbling and kill the ball movement. He’s way better in this aspect.
The thing is: I prefer having Rose with the ball creating open shots to BG and the others. And sometimes, and in some games, we haven’t seen that. Rose just gets the ball on the opposite half court and passes immediately. The point was not about BG creating his shot. Again: I’m fine with that. Was about Vinny telling Rose to step up more often, handle the ball more, shooting when he has to and creating open looks.
I never thought it was a case of BG doing that too often
just that when he does that, it makes one so sick watching it that it feels like it’s too often.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Mar 3, 2009 3:42 PM CST up reply actions
So the fans, coaches and managment think it is OK for Kirk to pound the ball,
but not Ben?
but he used to keep dribbling and kill the ball movement
Maybe we can (but probably not)?
by Granny Waiters on Mar 3, 2009 9:42 PM CST up reply actions
I understand Kirk
and the others, Ben, Lu, they were the ones that brought Chicago back into the playoffs since MJ, and Kirk is probably thinking that he used to be that guy, (DERRICK ROSE), leading charge of the offensive, but what EVER happened to good ol captain kirk, he just suddenly SUCKED. He should never, EVER, be chosen over DERRICK ROSE, in the fourth quarter. Fuck VDN.
Derrick Rose got Freakin Skillz. When are we going to add a 7th championship?
by broseleay301 on Mar 3, 2009 8:36 AM CST reply actions
I'll say this about Vinnie
He is at least willing to listen.
1. stopped that stupid switch defense
2. is putting the kid back in at the end
3. is still giving Tyrus and Noah minutes despite the upgrade with Miller
4. is hopefully done with Timmmy and those minutes he was starting to give him.
(as an aside, did anyone notice how Pax seems to have rebuilt this team to compete against Orlando? timmy and miller is exactly the right pieces to defend against howard and rash)
Yeah Vinnie’s moves were dumb, even rookie-ish, but Boyl would still be doing them and Skiles would refuse to do anything not skiles like.
I just saw how Duhon’s PER is at 14 with D’Antoni right now. can you imagine what Rose’s PER would be at if he were coaching here?
Wow, I can't believe I'm just now seeing this.
I think the season will go much smoother now. Derrick will be on the floor. I love you Paxson,lol.
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