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Around SBN: Where Do The Lakers Go From Here?

The Pau Gasol extension strikes fear into the league

Good small-market angst from Canis Hoopus on the fact that Pau Gasol will be averaging $19m a season for the next four years.

Jerry Buss told the media that this [Pau Gasol] signing sends a message.  I think he has.  The Lakers are open for business, and will use their cash to add or retain expensive players that other teams can't hope to keep.

Luckily we're a big market team. Wait, huh?

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Shouldn't this be a FanShot?

In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).

Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.

by tyger1147 on Dec 28, 2009 10:10 AM CST reply actions  

nope!

commentary, albeit little.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2009 10:19 AM CST up reply actions  

(plus I think there is too high of a fanshot/fanpost ratio)

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2009 10:38 AM CST up reply actions  

The Bulls

Should be using this opportunity to get a star player from one of these struggling teams instead of this fake 2010 pipe dream. This just pisses me off how they are not showing any clear plan. Either go for the really big cap space by dumping some salary like Kirk, Salmons or Deng, or fleece one of these cash strapped teams for their good players but for goodness sakes, don’t just sit there and do nothing.

Fan of the Chicago Cash Cows formerly known as the Bulls

by bigballa10 on Dec 28, 2009 10:47 AM CST reply actions  

Who's taking Kirk Salmons and Deng?

Which star player is now available that can be had at a reasonable price?

It may be frustrating, but this is not 2k10 and you have to make the other team better too.

Nobody’s looking to get rid of expiring contracts, and nobody’s looking to get rid of a star for peanuts.

by runningman on Dec 28, 2009 7:25 PM CST up reply actions  

Nobody is looking to get rid of of players yet

But I’m sure there will be teams looking to cut costs before they get hit with a luxury tax. My real point is that the Bulls need to have a real plan if they want to take advantage of that if it presents itself. Right now, based on the statements they made about the roster coming into the season and how much money the team is making, I think they are content to just leave things as is.

Fan of the Chicago Cash Cows formerly known as the Bulls

by bigballa10 on Dec 29, 2009 4:18 PM CST up reply actions  

Yankees of the NBA?

When theres no more room in hell...go to the mall

by SoulEater7 on Dec 28, 2009 12:15 PM CST reply actions  

Kobe's got a player option this Summer

Great teams usually will do all that is necessary to retain top talent.

12/31: Fire Vinny Del Negro.

by NBA Observer on Dec 28, 2009 12:24 PM CST up reply actions  

Gasol is an awesome player

Maybe he’s a little overpaid, but not by much (at least by NBA standards). It’s only a 3-year deal, which limits the risk on the Lakers’ end. Barring catastrophic injury, he should remain this good by the end of the contract.

by Big D on Dec 28, 2009 12:54 PM CST reply actions  

There's nothing that can be done about this, right?

If you’re Lebron, you’re thinking, “unless I join up with another star or two I got no shot!” Unlike baseball, basketball is a sport where the best team damn near always wins, so unless another team builds up a super contender in the very near future(this might be the Celtics last chance at another title) the Lakers will be feasting for the next 5-6 years or so. Think about it. Gasol is in his prime and will be there for the next few years, their point guard crew is set, Kobe is still elite and even when he starts going downhill Andrew Bynum will likely be good enough to pick up some of the slack.

Lebron, Wade and a bunch of other stars should think long and hard about joining up.

Yes, I’m aware that the Cavs just whooped up on the Lakers, but get real, this Lakers team is better than last years’ and barring a huge upset by the Nuggets no team will stop them from getting to the championship, where they’ll likely win their second consecutive title.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 1:33 PM CST reply actions  

If the Lakers are so willing to spend money to improve the team

send them Hinrich! Dear God, I’ve been wanting the Bulls to trade Hinrich to the Lakers all season, ever since it became apparent Fisher and Farmar were a sub par point guard combo.

Bulls trade Hinrich to Lakers for Farmar, Mbenga and Vujacic or Morrison. (I’d prefer Morrison because he expires, but just to have the $4 million extra in savings is worth it.)

The Bulls should than follow up that trade by sending Salmons to the Spurs for Finley/Mason Jr. The Bulls would than have enough cash to get a max free agent and possibly retain Tyrus.

Rose/Farmar
Mason Jr. / Vujacic
Deng/JJ
Tyrus/Taj
Noah/Mbenga/Miller

The Bulls would lose a bit on the court but the extra flexibility and the chance to retain Tyrus make it worth it. If the Lakers are willing to spend, the Bulls should take advantage and try to send them something they need.

by Basketball Smurf on Dec 28, 2009 1:48 PM CST reply actions  

You think the Lakers would trade for Hinrich?

They may not have a stellar point guard, but they don’t need one. All three are solid defenders and Phil seems to be more than happy with the way Shannon Brown has been coming along. The Lakers don’t need/want another player that needs the ball in his hands.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 2:16 PM CST up reply actions  

Neither Fisher (anymore) or Farmar is solid defensively.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2009 3:05 PM CST up reply actions  

I've seen Fisher, and to a lesser extent, Farmar,

struggle against the upper echelon of point guards in the league, but they seem all right against the regular guys. I may have overstepped it calling them solid, but it’s not as if Kirk is all that good at guarding point guards either. Say you line up Kirk and Kobe, both can guard the two/three, neither can really guard the one.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 3:21 PM CST up reply actions  

He can play defense against the latter two,

as they rarely look to score. Fisher would be just fine against Miller or Kidd. Both are older, slower guys who don’t drive the lane much these days. More than half of Kidd’s shot attempts are three’s, most of which come off of double teams. You don’t have to be much of a defender to stop Kidd these days.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 3:47 PM CST up reply actions  

but, they or Fisher can hit the outside shot .. something that is disappearing from Hinrich's skills

"I tried being reasonable, I didn't like it."
"Go ahead, make my day"
"We boil at different degrees"
"A good man always knows his limitations"
"You've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?"

by exult463 on Dec 30, 2009 6:15 PM CST up reply actions  

true, plus Kirk's famous (if less true by the year) un-clutch-ness

just put Fisher in the 4th

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 31, 2009 2:23 PM CST up reply actions  

Hinrich needs the ball in his hands? That is probably news to Hinrich

Hinrich is a definite upgrade over who the Lakers currently have. Brown is much more of a 2 guard than point and even he is only a so-so defender. I rag on Hinrich all the time, but as a 25 minute combo guard off the bench where he would have no pressure to score, I think he would excel. He would certainly be better than Fisher and Farmar and would definitely do a better job of defending Rondo, Nelson, Billups, Miller and the other guards the Lakers are likely to face.

by Basketball Smurf on Dec 28, 2009 3:19 PM CST up reply actions  

When Hinrich isn't dribbling, he's lost.

And if they’re gonna play a point guard who’s out there for defense and not looked upon to score they have one in Brown, who’s far cheaper, has room to grown and is ten times the athlete Kirk is.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 3:23 PM CST up reply actions  

ten times the athlete but not 10 times the defender

Rose is 10 times the athlete that Hinrich is, but he obviously isn’t a better defender. Brown can’t touch Hinrich on the defensive end. Plus, its not like Hinrich is a bad athlete. He is 6’3, reasonably strong, with pretty quick hands and feet. And I don’t know why having Brown would preclude them from getting Hinrich. I mean, the great Shannon Brown averages 18 minutes a game. Obviously he is too important to sit behind someone on the bench…. I think the Lakers can find time for him if they remove 2 guards from their rotation.

This idea that Hinrich can’t play without the ball is pure BS. Hinrich shared a backcourt with Duhon where he was the shooting guard and with Gordon where he was the secondary option. He also is now playing in a backcourt with Rose and had his most success in college playing off the ball with Aaron Miles. If Hinrich can’t play off the ball, than why has he repeatedly done it throughout his career. If Hinrich has to dominate the ball to put up his numbers than he is worse than anyone could imagine.

by Basketball Smurf on Dec 28, 2009 3:34 PM CST up reply actions  

I don't know who you've been watching.

Hinrich doesn’t move well without the ball, often drifting towards the ball handler on offense, screwing the spacing. He doesn’t catch and shoot very well and isn’t a great decision maker either. Have you ever seen him make a successful back cut, or dive through the lane for a pass and an easy layup? He’s a player, that without the ball, is lost.

With regards to Brown, in terms of defending point guards, I think Brown is better suited for the job. He is quicker laterally, can actually contest layups and is quick enough to stay with point guards, something that Hinrich doesn’t do as well as you seem to think he does. Brown also offers explosiveness on offense and runs the fast break very well. He’s also the best leaping point guard in the league, and that counts for something.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 3:53 PM CST up reply actions  

I lean towards that

Hinrich is better with the ball. But unlike the Org., I’ve long stopped trying to bend the team toward’s Hinrich’s strengths.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2009 4:16 PM CST up reply actions  

Hinrich is a poor offensive player

but no one is running their offense through him. All the things you describe is why he is a poor offensive player. Its not like you put the ball in his hands and his game comes alive. He will never again be the primary offensive guard on an NBA team. The fact that he isn’t a great decision maker suggests that you wouldn’t want him to be your lead guard.

In regards to Brown, I don’t see any evidence for what you are talking about . He spends most of his time backing up the 2 where he has taken Vujacic’s minutes. He plays the exact same amount of minutes as Farmar except Farmar can’t pass for a 2 at all. He has a very low assist rate and steal rate, lower than Farmar or Fisher. He also has the worst DRtg on the lakers of anyone getting minutes. He has shown no ability to play high level defense, despite his athletic gifts and gets frequently pulled for Fisher in clutch situations. The primary reason Brown gets minutes is because unlike Fisher and Farmar, he hasn’t been a trainwreck on offense.

The Lakers really only have 6 good players. There bench is non-existent. I think adding Hinrich improves the team especially when you consider Fisher is done and Farmar hasn’t lived up to expectations. After Fisher retires they can plug Brown/Hinrich into the starting line up and use the other guy as the primary guard off the bench.

by Basketball Smurf on Dec 28, 2009 4:21 PM CST up reply actions  

Is Hinrich better than Brown?

Yes, but I think Brown fits what they like to do better. He doesn’t do all that many things better than Hinrich, but what he can do, IMO, fits the Lakers better than what Hinrich brings.

Metal sharpens metal.

And this guy right here understands and knows what leadership is all about: The coach, the hall of famer......... Dick Butka! George Ryan

The Bulls shrink like a dick in cold water.

by dakoose on Dec 28, 2009 4:39 PM CST up reply actions  

the better coaching he'll have

on the lakers will fix that. I’ve never seen any reports classifying hinrich as uncoachable. He is more than serviceable for the lakers and I think he can stay serviceable for the 3 years left on his contract, if the bulls can get Vujacic and or Morrison its a solid deal.

don't let the bed bugs bite

by Rex Grossman on Jan 2, 2010 2:44 PM CST up reply actions  

err

fix the errors mentioned above…

don't let the bed bugs bite

by Rex Grossman on Jan 2, 2010 2:45 PM CST up reply actions  

"You can't win a championship with Gasol as your best player!"

that’s what the Bulls would do.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 28, 2009 3:06 PM CST up reply actions  

And Bynum is near max...

With his four year, $58M extension.

Thomas, Miller, Salmons, James, Pargo, Gray, MLE, and LLE will not be here with a Max Free Agent...don't get too attached.

by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 29, 2009 4:48 PM CST up reply actions  

At this point, Kirk would have trouble against the small PGs that give the Lakers problems…guys like Aaron Brooks. Brown altho probably not a better overall defender is more suited to that purpose than Hinrich.

by C Smoove on Dec 28, 2009 4:04 PM CST reply actions  

I still don't like the whole mindset:

“It costs twice as much to sign this guy.” Sure, they signed Pau Gasol once they were over the tax, but if they didn’t have Adam Morrison, Sasha Vujacic, Luke Walton or Jordan Farmar on the team, they might have been able to pay a whole LOT less. Why not say they’re paying THOSE guys $10 million to sit on the bench?

It was the same thing with Gordon: "We can’t pay him because it would cost $20 million. Well, true, but it’s not paying HIM that much. If they would have traded Hinrich, they could have kept Gordon. If they wouldn’t have signed Wallace or Nocioni, they could have had Gordon. Re-sign Gordon and then tell yourself that you’re keeping Hinrich around for $18 million a year to be a backup. Changes the dynamic a bit.

Instead, why not we just figure the luxury tax payments and divide that by all the players? Seems like that would make sense to me. And it’s not like it’s that hard to get a general idea.

In the past 10 years, just four team owners have not paid a luxury tax and are not on pace to pay one this year: Donald Sterling, Jerry Reinsdorf, Chris Cohen (Golden State), Bob Johnson (Charlotte).

Two owners’ teams averaged an operating income of over +$10 million per year while their teams have lost over 60% of their games: Donald Sterling and Jerry Reinsdorf.

by tyger1147 on Dec 29, 2009 8:15 AM CST reply actions  

it is for some, unfortunately

if the Bulls just said ’we’re paying they luxury tax for Rose’, maybe they can justify it. Heck, the reason they’re in this luxury tax bind was because they got the 1st pick instead of the 9th, that screwed up Paxson’s careful craftsmanship of a 35 win team.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 29, 2009 9:38 AM CST up reply actions  

This is going to be interesting

Teams are looking to cut costs and are already making small moves. The Jazz dumped Eric Maynor, their 1st round pick who played well when Deron Williams went down, on OKC for the rights to some foreign guy overseas in order to save money. The Hornets tried to dump Devin Brown on the T-wolves but instead the Suns gave the Wolves their former 1st round pick Alando Tucker for Jason Hart, then waived Hart. Yet another cost cutting move. I just question whether GarPax will even by players in any of this stuff. As the trade deadline approaches, things will start to heat up. Salmons and TT for Boozer would work and it saves the Jazz $1 mil in salary from the payroll and gets them a little closer to being under the tax line. The Jazz are barely an 8th seed right now so they may be more open to anything that will save some money.

Fan of the Chicago Cash Cows formerly known as the Bulls

by bigballa10 on Dec 30, 2009 12:47 PM CST reply actions  

Laker fan, in reference to the Hinrich discussion above

I think most of my feelings were pretty well fleshed out in the trade discussion we had here a few weeks ago before the Lakers came to Chicago. In any case, I would love Hinrich; he’s a huge upgrade on any of the Lakers’ existing point guards, mainly because he can actually shoot threes and plays far better defense. I’m going to assume his numbers for this month are more indicative of his actual play, and he actually be playing in a defensive scheme in L.A., unlike the “stick Kirk on an island against the other team’s best perimeter threat” that seems to be employed here.

As far as our current point guards, Fisher’s shooting has appeared to have deserted him save in clutch situations, and his defense against nearly all of the league’s point guards is awful. He routinely gets eviscerated by faster point guards, he doesn’t move through screens well, and about the only thing he does well is sell charges. Farmar has been a fairly poor fit for the triangle from the outset, and while he’s a significant improvement on Fisher defensively, he still makes mind-numbing decisions on both ends. As for Brown, he really isn’t a point guard for starters, and has trouble keeping up with the same kind of faster point guards that give Fisher trouble, although he’s been halfway-serviceable against two guards. He and Farmar seem to alternate having good offensive games, and the lack of consistency, along with Walton (and recently, Artest) being gone has killed the Lakers’ bench play. Having Hinrich come off the bench (or sending Fisher to the bench) would significantly improve it.

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.

by Ben R on Dec 31, 2009 12:18 AM CST reply actions  

thanks

i think Hinrich has some value around the league, especially for contenders. I listened to Bill Simmons NBA podcast and he was talking about how Hinrich would be perfect for the Celtics. If he continues to improve his play, perhaps the Bulls can move him at the trading deadline (if they have any sense at all and realize he is a luxury they can’t afford).

by Basketball Smurf on Dec 31, 2009 3:34 AM CST up reply actions  

Rondo and Hinrich on the same team. I would take on Scalabrine and Big Baby for that to happen.

Vinny Del Negro interviewed for the job today. I mean come on! Nobody else thinks this is nuts?
by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 6, 2008 5:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

by Ozzie Montana on Dec 31, 2009 12:26 PM CST up reply actions  

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