Trading for Pf not so appealing this year.

by BullFan on Nov 16, 2009 1:08 AM CST

I wanted to have a decent chat with some of my fellow bulls fan and see how they felt about this team and our future as bulls fans. I know alot of us are throwing out every trade scenario that we can fathom, and will continue to until our team isn't dull offensively.

To jump into the thick of what I wanted to discuss was... I feel that our team shouldn't dump half of our role players for a PF unless it is Bosh and Bosh only. Outside of Bosh I feel Stat and Boozer just isn't worth breaking up this unit no matter how bad our offense tends to look. Mind you I wouldn't mind giving up a 2 for 1 like hinrich/Thomas for a boozer, but I feel that the teams that want some sort of Deng,Thomas, Hinrich, Salmons, James, Miller combo is just asking for too much.

I know we need some Post/Hi-Low PnR scoring DESPERATELY but I think if we can be in position for a lottery or better in the draft we would only have to worry about finding our #1 scorer in free agency rather than Hoping and Praying for this Wade/Lebron and Bosh/Boozer fantasy that WON'T Happen. Why? simple answer is No Player in the entire league likes, respect, or would willingly want to consistently have to deal with JR. Trust me there is no amount of downplaying this fact that can make it untrue, and the nba players know way better than us how bad he really is as a person. For the record the ONLY way Wade comes here next year is if he has some raging fantasy about playing for his home team, that means more to him than the roughly 8-14million per year he'd lose to come play for a horrible organization, and coach. The market means nothing to Wade he is a staple of the nba his popularity won't increase or decrease no matter where he plays minus a New York or LA setting.

I mentioned the draft and any of you college bball fans can agree that the 2010 draft will be as good if not better for PF's than this years draft was for PG's it's Possible that about 40% of the first round next year will be PF's. I mean there are all types of PF's coming out next year minus John Wall(pg) that should be a top 3 if not the no 1.

So what I was thinking about maybe trading just One player for a 6-12 range first round selection instead of trading 3,4, or 5 players for one of those almost aging PF's that may be up for trade this year. My thinking is well make the playoffs this year so lottery is out of the question. If we were to Lure in a Joe Johnson and trade Thomas and our first round for like a 6th pick we would still have a strong team that could contend as soon as our PF's can hold their own. Which should be the 2011 season which is realistically the goal we should be looking at for contending anyway. Face It Lakers, Celtics, Magic, and maybe Spurs and Denver are the ONLY teams that has a chance at winning until the 2011 season.

Rose, Joe Johnson, Deng, Noah, and any average or better Post PF, Taj, and even Kirk should step into the Next up for Contention role in the East with the down fall of the aging vet's either having diminishing skills or us catching up to thier skill set. Orlando is he only set year in and year out East contender, depending on when or if Boston fizzles out, and where Lebron/Bosh/Wade sign.

My Question to my fellow fans is .... Is the Bulls roster and Cap better suited for a Trade for a Established PF that may only have 3,4, or five yrs in the tank for their career, or Should we try to trade now for a nice draft position and find the best PF for our team, or Should we "Stay the course" and hope big free agent signings???

PS - Fans that are getting nervous about Rose's play dont worry too much, I know he isn't being aggressive enough yet but the Pg isn't supposed to be the focal scorer in this system and at some time some one has to hit off of a pass for him to get an assist after the circus trip Rose should start some progression and remind us of the guy we all loved last year. His Team Defense IS getting a little better i guess Kirk is rubbing off on him.

FanPosts are user-created posts from the BlogABull community, and are to be treated as the opinions and views of that particular user, not that of the blogger or blog community as a whole.

Tweet Comment 13 comments | 0 recs |

Do you like this story?

Comments

simple answer is No Player in the entire league likes, respect, or would willingly want to consistently have to deal with JR.

What evidence do you have for this? Of the 400+ players in the NBA, I am confident there is at least one or two that has no opinion of JR whatsoever….

Why isn't your friendly Bulls Blogger friendly?

by Dionysus2.0 on Nov 16, 2009 8:19 AM CST reply actions

If we confine ourselves to the meaningful limits on his point, rather than abstract flaws, we'll have a more useful discussion

I think the Bulls have a legitimate problem here. When we’re talking about signing a player to a eight figure a year contract, we start to have obvious effects on how the rest of the team is built.

Owners and players are both playing a game of credibility here. Players want to be paid, but they generally also want to win. So they angle for the most money, but they also angle to play on teams that have demonstrated they’ll pay a player a high salary and still go out and spend in other areas to get over the top.

In fact, if a player doesn’t exhibit this behavior, and he appears to not give a shit about anything but the size of his checks and his individual stat sheet, he tends to be maligned. Zach Randolph or Elton Brand, for example.

The unknown, when it comes to players, is how badly they want to win.

That’s the same unknown we have with teams and owners, but the dynamic is a little bit different. Owners want to win while, other things being equal, limiting payouts. Owners have lots of possible strategies they can employ to get this done. And they’ve got differing levels of credibility (as far desire to win) to start with. Hence, a team like the Atlanta Hawks might have to spend a lot on an unproven (at the time) player like Joe Johnson to demonstrate its desire to win. On the other hand, signing an expensive player and then following it up with an immediate salary dump (ahem… Ben Wallace, PJ Brown) or following through on an Emeka Okafor for Kenny Thomas dump demonstrates pretty clearly that you don’t value winning at that cost.

At the end of the day, that sort of track record is another bargaining chip when it comes to signing or re-signing a player, especially at the high end of the spectrum (ie max players). Because every team can offer about the same salary, the competition for the player falls along the lines of winning, and what else a team will do.

Suppose, for example, the Bulls, Clippers and Cavs all call up Lebron and make a pitch to him when he becomes a FA. What’s their pitch?

The Bulls will say they’ve got a good team to put around him. MJ’s winning tradition. And of course, they offer the max contract. Will they say they’ve got a blank check from ownership?
The Clips will say they’ve got a good team to put around him, the bright lights of LA, the chance to put a franchise on his back (hell, sell it as a positive). And of course, they offer the max and a blank check from ownership.
Now, if you’re the Cavs, of course you offer Lebron everything he wants. And you point out he’s had a good team the last couple years. But you also point to those other teams and say “Look, those guys are giving you a nice talk, but have they been walking the walk? You know we spent unlimited amounts of money over the last couple years to bring in players to put around you”. The last time the Bulls signed a player, they dumped him as soon as they hit a rough patch. Their bester player last year, they let go for nothing instead of paying him. And the Clippers’ owner is an inveterate slum lord who’s never spent much on his basketball team. The number of teams that should inspire confidence on the part of players that the owner will pay him and still spend to the hilt in order to win is really very small, Lebron. And we, the Cavs, have shown we’ll do that. Please keep it in mind when you make your decision.".

BullsTwo

by Sports2 on Nov 16, 2009 9:09 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs

Yes, but there is something more that Chicago brass can say in their pitch.

The right fit. Unlimited money is meaningless if you throw it at the wrong people. And look, every org. makes mistakes. The Bulls can say that Ben Wallace was theirs. But if I were Chicago, I would bring up the Cavs teams. Sure, they were willing to spend, but they did a terrible job of building a team around Lebron. Charles Barkley said it the other night on Inside The NBA – Lebron is the only super star whose team’s structure is not built around him. Chicago can say that their style of play would suit Lebron better than Cleveland.

by Unrealcity on Nov 19, 2009 3:53 PM CST up reply actions

Please explain to me how Wade loses 8-14 million per year (your words) if he comes to Chicago?

I don’t think anybody ever thought a Boozer trade would need anything other than a TT or Salmons type player with an expiring contract. The Bulls aren’t going to give up Hinrich, Miller, Salmons and Deng for Boozer, he’s an expiring player.

The draft points are interesting, but look at some of the guys the Bulls have drafted, particularly the bad ones.

Even when we draft a good player, if your theory holds true, the org will fuck it up and they won’t want to play here (or won’t be “worth it” ala Brand).

by RyPac13 on Nov 16, 2009 10:34 AM CST reply actions

Florida has no state income tax. It's not "coming to Chicago" but "leaving Florida."

Damned liberals.

People should remember that while they have the right to their opinion, they are not entitled to be taken seriously. --Bruce Bartlett

by tyger1147 on Nov 16, 2009 12:30 PM CST up reply actions

Yes we need another power forward.

Jerry Krause.

by SoulEater7 on Nov 16, 2009 10:41 AM CST reply actions

Where’s the Love for Taj?

by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Nov 16, 2009 10:58 AM CST reply actions

To say JR is a problem is BS

It’s purely made up crap. Fact is lots of players like him. Look at how many ex players are still in the organization. Krause was the hated one. Even pip wanted to come back to us to end his career. I would say most players have zero problem with reinsdorf.

by BoxingHideout on Nov 16, 2009 1:57 PM CST via mobile reply actions

Right now I would be glad to have Jamal Crawford back

anyone but Salmons… yuck

by JustAnotherFan on Nov 17, 2009 12:06 PM CST reply actions

If we get absolutely desperate

we can try Hinrich for Brand and hope…

by JustAnotherFan on Nov 17, 2009 12:19 PM CST reply actions

or Zach Randolph

(I’m just kidding – don’t beat me)

by JustAnotherFan on Nov 17, 2009 12:46 PM CST up reply actions

Not trying to make JR look like a bad guy, but he makes judgements on players off of his own beliefs of there individualisms not their playing abilities and the last thing a player wants is to have to worry if they’ll be resigned, trade, or misrepresented to the media not based on your play but off of your Owners image of you. I know of you know what I mean but not to what extent so Twitter the Tracy McGrady’s, Darius Miles"s, Ben Wallace’s, Grant Hills’s, Amar’e’s, Artest’s, Crawford’s, Gordon’s, Thomas’s why we won’t sign any Huge market players, By the way we have NEVER brung in a big name through free agency even with MJ and PIP. Bottom Line JR would rather have a team He Loved personally than a team he loves for winning and passion for the game. Through me in the fire but I know enough nba platers personally to know what I am talking about. I hate that it is true because I swear I bleed bulls, but no one will come here even for Rose and Noah, Its all about where Lebron and Bosh are going and they understand that it is up to them to decide the contenders of the next 5-7 yrs.

by BullFan on Nov 17, 2009 5:10 PM CST reply actions

Not trying to make JR look like a bad guy, but he makes judgements on players off of his own beliefs of there individualisms not their playing abilities and the last thing a player wants is to have to worry if they’ll be resigned, trade, or misrepresented to the media not based on your play but off of your Owners image of you. I know a lot of you know what I mean but not to what extent so Twitter the Tracy McGrady’s, Darius Miless, Ben Wallace’s, Grant Hills’s, Amar’e’s, Artest’s, Crawford’s, Gordon’s, Thomas’s why we won’t sign any Huge market players, By the way we have NEVER brung in a big name through free agency even with MJ and PIP. Bottom Line JR would rather have a team He Loved personally than a team he loves for winning and passion for the game. Throw me in the fire but I know enough nba players personally to know what I am talking about. I hate that it is true because I swear I bleed bulls, but no one will come here as the number 1 option even for Rose and Noah, Its all about where Lebron and Bosh are going and they understand that it is up to them to decide the contenders of the next 5-7 yrs

by BullFan on Nov 17, 2009 5:15 PM CST reply actions