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Having character vs. being a character

Sam Smith had this anecdote in his Celtics championship epilogue, which his his eyes told about the effect the team leader, Kevin Garnett, had on the rest of the roster:

They did it with defense, obviously, but also commitment and tactics.

We all knew they’d be good after trading for Allen and Garnett, but they still were starting two non scorers in Rajon Rondo and Kendrick Perkins. It had to be more than scoring, and it was. And it had to be more effort than they knew, and it was.

One instance in preseason stands out.

The Celtics were running suicides, those halfcourt sprints after practice, and not surprisingly Garnett was beating everyone.

It’s why Garnett, though not the offensive finisher to carry a team and a player who does not dominate from the post despite his size, was the key because if your best player practices the hardest, it’s difficult for anyone else to coast.

Still, Pierce has often been known to ease through seasons and particularly practices, not always the most motivated team player. He fought openly with Rivers when Rivers came in with demands Pierce expand his game and be more unselfish. Little progressed because the team was so bad and lacking in talent Pierce had license to continue to shoot and score.

Now flip to 2007.

Pierce was jogging through the drill in his L.A. cool mood and Garnett turned angrily and demanded, “Are you going to run with me!”

No one ever had challenged Pierce like that in Boston, and certainly no great player.

Message received and understood.

It's a bit romantic, and for all I know completely made up. But I think it does contain an important message.

I've usually mocked Paxson for his 'character first' mantra, and even moreso when it was proven to be more than rhetoric. And then even more-moreso when it was shown that his 'character guys' didn't prove to have much of it.

Needless to say, I think it's mostly hooey. At least in the way it's usually (over) applied.

Talent wins. It won for the Celtics. But there's plenty of 'superstar' talent in the league that doesn't give the kind of effort that the Celtics did, and I don't think it's far fetched to realize there are great players who aren't the type to, like Garnett, not only practice hard but demand a teammate practices as hard as he does.

Which is why I think the character 'hooey' matters when discussing a #1 overall pick, because it's the opportunity to draft the caliber of player who will be the best player on the team. The pick will be a rookie, so it may be too much to expect them to take the reigns right away. But then again, this roster also seems like they're desperate for someone to set that tone, no matter his age. (plus, school-marms Wallace and Griffin are gone).

That's why this Beasley 'personality' issue is a huge red flag with me. The stories are usually downplayed, and it's rarely gone so far to say it'll keep him from being a great player himself. But there's enough to worry the heck out of me. Even if he has the motivation to commit to the work, will he be the type to drag others with him?

This isn't like debating whether to keep Nocioni or not for his hustle and heart.

With Beasley and Rose, this question should be a dealbreaking issue.

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here's the thing

only one of those links was about Beasley’s practice habits and I’m really not going to put much stock into his observations of a work out. I haven’t heard anything from experts saying that Beasley doesn’t practice hard. And if you’re going to reference Beasley being “Looney Tunes” then you shouldn’t be comparing him negatively against Garnett who I’m pretty sure coud be considerred legally insane.

by JSlakov on Jun 23, 2008 10:38 PM CDT   0 recs

yeah but it's not looney tunes

in Garnett’s case it’s ‘300’.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2008 10:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i also would have accepted 'taxi driver'

They're gonna give daddy the Rain Man suite, you dig that?

by MarketMaker on Jun 23, 2008 11:32 PM CDT to parent up   1 recs

The subject of this thread should be...

... Having talent (i.e Rose/OJ Mayo/DJ Augustin/Eric Gordon) Vs being the best talent in the ‘08 Draft (i.e Michael Beasley)

The No 1 Chi -Town sports fan in Europe!

by Vangelis on Jun 24, 2008 9:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that's if you wrote it

I’m not conceding that Beasley has more talent.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:48 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

But KG, Kobe, MJ are all legally insane in the right way (basketball-wise)

You want the leader of your team to be the guy who works harder than anyone because he knows that all the pressure is on him. The reason we all love Jordan is because he knew from Day 1 that the entire team was going to follow his lead, and he went out and worked harder on his game than any other player.

The problem is, Beasley can be a goofy guy but an absolute monster in practice, we just don’t know it. Dennis Rodman was as legally insane you can get in Chicago, but this was a guy who worked out in the Chicago summers after practicing at the Berto Center. It’s why the team put up with his attention-whoreism. We know Rose is in that mold. I would draft Beasley, but I just don’t know if he’s that guy. I would hate to see this once in a million chance to get a star that didn’t take the game too seriously. Yes, I understand he’s just a kid, but once he’s in the NBA that excuse is void. Chris Paul went to a shitty franchise with no fanbase, and in 3 years helped transform then into a sentimental favorite with legit championship aspirations. That’s understanding what kind of pressure is put on you as a rookie with superstar potential, and that’s what I wish I could definitely see in Beasley. Maybe we just have to see him in a Bulls uniform for it to matriculate.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 23, 2008 11:03 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

remind me

how do we know Rose is in that mold?

by JSlakov on Jun 23, 2008 11:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Sorry, I didn't mean to say Rose was in that kind of uber-competitive mode

What I meant to say is that Rose’s competitiveness just comes off as more apparent. Things like work ethic and drive are things that are built out of legend and hearsay, and Rose has apparently gotten enough cred since high school to be given this kind of “ultimate leader” tag. From all accounts he was the leader of one of the best college teams in the country.

I’m on neither side in this debate. Both players offer skill sets that are needed by the Bulls, and this damn intangible stuff is really the sticking point. From what I see and hear about both players, I tend to think Rose is mature as of now to take on the responsibility of bringing a NBA team back to prominence. I don’t see that manifesting in Beasley.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 23, 2008 11:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They said they had to lock Rose out of the gym....

now if dat isnt work ethic i dont know what is

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 24, 2008 8:06 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

we don't know

but I’m guessing the Bulls know. starting with how aggressively he peruses the dinner menu.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 23, 2008 11:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't know how much stock

you can put on Garnett’s motivation to his teammates. But there is something to be said about your best player always putting in his best effort. We have many documented years of watching Pierce and Ray Allen not committing to defense. That they should both decide to turn their habits around in the same year as they are teamed with KG seems a bit too coincidental. I think that Rodman is another example of someone being held in check for the most part with Jordon on court.

The young bulls do hustle. It showed from the start (even as I saw them lose the first 9 games 4 years ago) 3 years is not a fluke. Last year held a lot of issues for this young team. I think it foolish to believe that they no longer have the same (or better) skills coming into next year. Adding another motivated AND frankly higher skilled player to the mix who not only works to make his team better, but can actually deliver (yes Rose) only means that this team will get back deep into the playoffs again.

Having said that and having watched the Celtics championship run this year, I don’t feel that our young bigs are strong enough/skilled enough just yet to keep up with the top defensive teams in a 7 game series. But I think with an inspirational top pick in Rose, we get this team (in particular Tyrus and Noah) into a more cohesive and effective group then we have yet seen.

Beasley just doesn’t seem like a team player to me. I don’t need another Ben Wallace attitude in the group holding this organization hostage because of his superior skills.

Rose may not be that outspoken (and I think that bodes well with our core of deng gordan and hinrich) but he has not shown himself to be a distraction either.

Winning solves a lot of issues. With a top athlete joining our already very good squad, I can’t help but see a very successful year for the bulls.

by gman2849 on Jun 23, 2008 11:09 PM CDT   0 recs

I'm more offended when people spell 'gordan'

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:10 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

nothing personal, guy, but this is egregiously unacceptable.

They're gonna give daddy the Rain Man suite, you dig that?

by MarketMaker on Jun 23, 2008 11:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

nothing personal, but ...

... most people can’t spell egregiously.

Rose '08

by Orange Juice on Jun 24, 2008 12:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

but when tommy egregiously is the best player in the history of the sport of basketball, and spent almost the entirety of his career playing for the team this blog is dedicated to

then i’ll expect everyone to spell it right. in the meantime, i’ll enjoy being amongst those who can.

They're gonna give daddy the Rain Man suite, you dig that?

by MarketMaker on Jun 24, 2008 1:05 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't recall the last time I read "Ben Wallace" and "superior skills" in the same sentence,

unless the words “does not have” were in between.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 23, 2008 11:50 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I googled the query and though those exact words have never been typed in before...

Hoopshype did laud “Ben’s superior judgment and quickness” as one of the reason’s they believed He deserved the MVP award in 2005. (I know, this post is as off-topic as that statement is mind-blurring.)

by smash! on Jun 24, 2008 1:31 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

unclarified point to be sure

only meant to compare the corpse’ attitude.

by gman2849 on Jun 24, 2008 1:41 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't question Beasley's work ethic or commitment at all

I think the guy is a beast when it comes to working on his game. I don’t doubt that he wants to and intends to dominate. He wants to be great and because of that, he will be. I don’t doubt that he is a franchise player. He’s just one goofy bastard. You don’t quite know what to expect from him, and in some ways I guess he’s Noah-ish, and we’ve already had some run-ins with Joakim. But I think Beasley would be a capable leader on the court, I think he’ll be a team guy, and I fully expect him to be a 20 and 10 guy next year, depending on the situation, he could be a 23-24 PPG guy as a rookie. His game just looks so effortless. I expect this guy to be great, probably dominant. But.

Rose just screams “CHAMPIONSHIP!” Yes, he didn’t win last year, but damn did he get as close as you can get. He seems like the consummate pro, the guy you can see why Riley would love, hell, why DeNiro in Heat would love. He’s triple C, gives you every impression of greatness in the making by his demeanor, you notice his presence. He seems to have some of what we saw in Mike.

I’d love to have both these guys but you can only have one and it’s Rose because there are no question marks. He is close to as good as it gets for a #1. He’s a winner, he’s an outstanding athlete, he’s been a good kid, and he is physically dominating for his position. He’s not quite a LeBron #1 but I’d say he’s clearly a Dwight Howard #1.

by messwiththebull on Jun 23, 2008 11:19 PM CDT   0 recs

My biggest red flag with Beasley is that he sees himself as

a Carmelo Anthony. I know he wants to and dominate on offense. A burning desire to score rarely translates to winning, especially if it isn’t accompanied by a similar desire to dominate on defense. I’m looking for a player that has a desire to dominate on defense and is willing to sacrifice on offense, stepping up to score when needed. I believe the great championship winning stars have done this. I don’t know if that’s Rose. But, there have at least been signs that Rose could be a\that kind of player. He clearly sacrificed his own game for the team and was there for his team in the big games. He at least talks about defense and worked to improve defensively last season even though he isn’t a great defender by any means right now.

I haven’t seen any evidence that Beasley wants to dominate on defense or sacrifice on offense. He may want to dominate on defense, but he doesn’t talk about it. He may be willing to sacrifice on offense with better teammates, but it’s an unknown. It’s much easier for me to place faith in Rose’s desire to dominate on defense and sacrifice on offense.

formerly sbulls

by Scotter on Jun 23, 2008 11:35 PM CDT   0 recs

He said his game,

meaning skill set, is similar to Carmelo. Carmelo was never mistaken for a defender, even in college. Beasley plays passionate defense. He blocks shots, causes deflections, and gets steals. Unfortunately he can get in foul trouble due to his aggresiveness and therefore K-State tried to keep him out of situations where he’d draw more fouls.
So he doesn’t have the ‘statistics’ that say he’s a good defensive player, but he plays aggressive defense unless he’s in foul trouble. Watch the games. Understand situations. Then evaluate.

by kingj41 on Jun 24, 2008 9:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

nah, I'd rather not

but I listened to someone who did do that, and he said Beasley gets lost frequently on D.

I don’t think that physically he can be a great defender, either….maybe that’ll mean just more fouling. (hey, the Jazz should take him)

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:13 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Physically?

He’s got all the physical skills. Like most young players he relies too much on his athleticism on D because he’s confident he can block shots he contests and get the steals he goes for. He does need some coaching in that area.
However, he will get there sooner than later regarding that aspect of his game. He’s got the strength, athleticism and desire to improve in all aspects.
True, he’s not 6’-10” like he’s been listed. And no he won’t shut down KG, D. Howard, nor Tim Duncan. But, who can 1-on-1.

by kingj41 on Jun 24, 2008 9:26 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree on the coaching

Beasley isn’t showing me signs that he cannot learn and adapt. He’s been asked to get points most of this life and that’s exactly what he’s done.

I see plenty of room for improvement on defense. I’m just not seeing this passion right now. It will come with proper coaching and methods.

by NBA Observer on Jun 24, 2008 9:55 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

eek, passionate defense?

He plays defense, but there is little chance any of it is driven by passion.

Beasley plays proximity defense where as he plays it when the play is coming at him. He doesn’t force anything on defense the way Garnett, Pippen, and Gary Payton do/did.

by NBA Observer on Jun 24, 2008 9:54 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I've posted this elsewhere

But the single most disturbing thing about Beasley’s attitude/character, by far, is his continued insistence that he’s never done anything wrong. He remains completely unwilling to acknowledge prior mistakes, and I can’t explain in words how much this bothers me, and how much I believe it speaks to his personal character.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 23, 2008 11:44 PM CDT   0 recs

or the definition of a lawyer

what i really would like to hear is WHY he did those immature things…I could care less about the dead frog, but the property damage with cars is more serious. Did he plaster his name all over the car when tagging, or did he do it small, did he have to pay for a new paintjob, did a “friend” tag HIS name and he covered for it by taking the blame?

It’s smart not to say TOO much about past deeds in public, but I’m assuming he spilled his guts to Paxson with the details being confidential. It’s not like he WENT TO JAIL and/or STOLE LAPTOPS IN COLLEGE (like marcus williams).

On the other hand, we’ve all had one or two big A-hole teachers or principals in our lives…but most of us have the sense to just leave the fools alone.

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 24, 2008 1:13 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

He has publicly said he's made mistakes.

I don’t know where you get this thing that he insists he’s done nothing wrong. What he’s said is that he’s a kid and he screws up. If that’s not contrite enough for you, that’s one thing. But it’s not the same at all as claiming he’s never done anything wrong.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 23, 2008 11:54 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Please provide a specific link

And upon reading the quotes, if this is the case, I will recant.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 23, 2008 11:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Have a great vacation - I'm jealous.
“I just turned 19 years old in January,” Beasley said. “How mature do you want me to be? I’m still a kid. I’m not 20 yet. I’m not legal. I can vote, but that’s about it. On the basketball side of things, I’m 30 years old. Off the court, I don’t know how old y’all want me to be. Do you want me to act 25? 30? 40?. I’m 19. I’m a kid. I’m going to live my life. I’m going to mess up. I don’t know as much as you do or him. I’m learning day by day. I hear a lot about character issues. But I’ve yet to hear what those character issues are. Until I hear somebody tell me, I don’t feel the need to change.”

When a Chicago reporter asked what influence his mother has had on him, what advice she’s given him about maturity and growing up, Beasley quickly turned the question around and tossed it back.

“Life lessons,” he shot back, defensively. “The same kind of lessons your mother taught you. I got into trouble. But I don’t do those things anymore. You learn a lot as you grow.”

From the Miami Herald

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 24, 2008 12:26 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that's not exactly

repentance.

I wonder if Pax ever said: “yes. I want you to act 40.”

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:15 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I said it might not be contrite enough for some people

But it’s also not Jivas’ statement (bolded as well) of

his continued insistence that he’s never done anything wrong. He remains completely unwilling to acknowledge prior mistakes

I get that you’ve decided the “character issues” push him off your list, Matt. But if that’s going to be the deal breaker for people, they should at least base it on what has actually happened and what he has actually said rather than exaggerations.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 24, 2008 9:29 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

speaking of exaggerations...

I’ve also read accounts of the famous rat-in-desk incident that have been reported as a mouse-in-desk. Interesting how much less sinister the story is with a cute little mousey.

Seeing as the teacher him/herself has not appeared in any interviews, it’s pretty hard to say what the real story is.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 24, 2008 9:49 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If you put a dead mouse in your co-workers desk...

You’d probably be escorted from the building by law enforcement. I don’t care how cute it is.

Don't call me doughboy!

by Khalid El-Amin on Jun 25, 2008 12:26 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

agreed.

‘completely unwilling’ is a bit harsh.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:52 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Okay, I'm back

And that doesn’t do it for me, at all (I read those quotes when they were intially reported as well). Not even close – in fact, these comments only strengthen my belief that Beasley remains highly immature and that he just doesn’t “get it”. We can certainly agree to disagree on this – reasonable people do in fact see things differently at times.

I totally get that Beasley isn’t a felon, and hasn’t committed any really serious offenses in his time, but all this does is eliminate the risk that he’s Pac-Man Jones. But how many players really come into the draft with that kind of risk? Off the top of my head, Isaiah/J.R. Rider comes to mind, but this is a truly insignificant risk.

But the point that myself and others have tried to make in many of these threads is that Beasley’s immaturity/character issues do not lend itself to being a winning-type player. I’m not going to rehash any of those arguments – see my comments on other threads and Scotter’s points above – but I do believe that this risk remains as a significant aspect of the evaluation of Beasley.

But MAN he’s talented! I’m still leaning to Rose, probably 55-45 after starting 51-49 and being pushed to 70-30, but this is not an easy choice by any means and not one that I’d be completely satisfied with. What I am COMPLETELY satisfied and ecstatic about is that we’re far better off than we were with the 9th pick. That is something we can all agree above.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 24, 2008 9:02 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well, this would explain

the old-as-dirt fetish. “C’mon, act 40 out there…! Noah, Tyrus, out! Wallace, Griffin, go show them how it’s done…”

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 24, 2008 12:35 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

as we keep trying to guess what paxson is thinking...

i can’t help thinking that paxson will take rose for all of the reasons we expect.
1. great college team.
2. great college program.
3. highly regarded college coach.
4. led a team that went deep into the ncaa tourney.

i feel like it is very hard to choose between beasley and rose. they both have a ton of upside. they both are incredible talents. they both have question marks…so, when paxson looks at all the information and realizes that you probably can’t go wrong with either one, he’ll fall back on these points and feel more confident taking rose.

They're gonna give daddy the Rain Man suite, you dig that?

by MarketMaker on Jun 23, 2008 11:48 PM CDT   0 recs

Ford muddying the Rose waters
Think you’ve got the Rose-Beasley debate figured out? One respected NBA general manager who’s drafting in the second half of the first round said the Bulls and virtually everyone else is getting it wrong.
“Michael Beasley is far and away the best player in this draft,” the GM said. “He’s going to dominate in this league. How could you pass on him? I know everyone is talking about character this and character that, but come on, he’s not a bad kid.”

As for Rose, the GM says he thinks he’s overrated: “Derrick Rose is a good player, I get that. But he’s not a franchise player. I don’t think people are getting with Rose what they think they’re getting. He’s athletic and plays really hard. But he has just decent court vision and can’t take over a game offensively.”

When asked about the Heat possibly passing on Beasley at No. 2, the GM said, “It’s a joke. He’s so much better than anything the Heat are going to get offered. I don’t understand it.”

The rest of this article is currently under the ESPN Insider free preview by the by.

This is one of those moments when I don’t envy the decision Paxson et al. has to make this week. We’ll see in a couple days I guess…

by micah on Jun 23, 2008 11:51 PM CDT   0 recs

that wouldn't be 'respected' :)

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Riley could be trying to:

1. Psyche Paxdorf out
2. Riley wants to signal publicly “make me an offer” for either the #2 or for Marion to other teams
3. Disney(owns ESPN and Orlando Magic) wants Beasley in the state of florida as an additional tourist attraction and/or rivalry with Miami.

2 definitely, 1 possibly, 3 is a stretch

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 24, 2008 12:05 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Or, 4...

What the scout is sayin is true and mostly everybody on this site is blind to the truth.

by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 24, 2008 12:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What I meant by "1. Psyche Paxdorf out"

is that Riley may really want Beasley, but publicly says he wants Rose because he’s just playing with Paxdorf.

I never really understood why a DRose would pair so much better with Wade than Beasley.

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 24, 2008 1:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There is so much speculation about the Heat trading down in the draft.

More recent: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=Draftnotes-080624

It seems incredibly unlikely that Riley is jockeying for Beasley. With this much trade speculation, I have a hard time believing that Riley wanted Beasley all along.

by swede2287 on Jun 24, 2008 1:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

well, someone was convinced

bleh.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 9:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Stop with the "Riley is trying to psyche Pax out" talk.

The Bulls have the first pick in the draft. Period. How do you psyche someone out if you’re completely irrelevant to them? Ya can’t. It doesn’t matter what Riley thinks, says, does. Paxson isn’t thinking about Riley’s, or any other team’s, supposed fav prospect. He’s focused on the top 2, and who he wants out of those 2 because that’s what happens when you pick #1- you get to choose whoever you want, irrelevant of what anyone else thinks/wants/desires.

As for your #2- that’s not how that works. If a GM wants to talk trade, they use the phone. And after reading #3 above I’m really questioning why I’m even responding to #1 & #2 because that’s just crazy talk:)

by smash! on Jun 24, 2008 1:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

"If a GM want to talk trade, they use the phone"

And more GMs are willing to pick up that phone and call Riley with his public announcement of “make me an offer” for the #2 and/or Marion. Like the rumors involving Elton Brand which would make sense for both teams if Brand is healthy.

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 24, 2008 12:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

exactly

it’s likely Riley. That Snake!

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 24, 2008 8:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Disney owns the Magic?

I thought Pat Williams owned the Magic.

Wikipedia says this group owns the Magic.

Careful though, across the pond our good friends are blaming Wikipedia for students’ inaccuracies in studies.

Jimmy Wales you bastard.

by NBA Observer on Jun 24, 2008 10:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I recall Pat Williams selling the Magic

to a group of other owners, so wikipedia for the moment may be correct.

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 24, 2008 12:38 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

whoops..I guess Disney doesn’t on it then, and if its not Pat Williams, then I have no idea

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 24, 2008 2:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Looks like Pat

is just an Executive VP for the Magic, but not an owner or the GM. He may own a portion of the Magic parent company with DeVos.

by NBA Observer on Jun 24, 2008 3:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's Dumars

by way of the GM that speaks to Ford so frequently.

Could be someone trying to sully Kevin Pritchard’s options in Portland though.

by NBA Observer on Jun 24, 2008 9:58 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I believe that we should all recognize

That this opinion is a completely legitimate one. I’m not saying that it’s the only one or that it’s the right one – or even one that I agree with – but it’s completely legitimate to have this opinion of each player.

This is, in fact, what I fear and why my Rose preference is a light one. The scenario laid out by this GM is one of the many possibilities for the way the future will turn out with respect to these players.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 24, 2008 9:07 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Weird Question: WHAT ABOUT STEROIDS?

Like the rumors about Boozer going from a soft player to screaming All-Star level (Bill Simmons article). Do clubs factor this stuff in, but name it “character.” Or Looney Tunes?

I know the major sports test for Roids, but does the NBA test for Roids during the off-seasons? Or, say, before the Draft ??? We know that Beasley gained like 20 pounds of muscle from high school to college, but that’s probably not too unusual for a player his size…what is strange is a player of his caliber playing for K-State instead of a top 10 program. Top 10 probably passed on him considering what happened at Oak Hil.

/Bill Simmons is annoying at times, but he does watch a lot of college and pro hoops, so I’m curious as to what he’ll say about the draft this week

by KentuckyBullsFan on Jun 23, 2008 11:58 PM CDT   0 recs

K-State hired his AAU coach as an assistant

That was pretty much the only reason he went to Kansas State. Beasley was recruited by virtually every major program in the country, so his antics apparently weren’t enough to scare anyone off.

by Big D on Jun 24, 2008 12:20 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs