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Full Derrick Rose Q&A

Is up at Bulls.com.

It certainly all sounds good, but not much to take in. One thing you can say is that he certainly isn't shying away from his desire to play in his hometown. If you listen to this interview with WSCR  (and read this from ESPN.com, which also has quotes from Pax and Vinny) he's downright wishing for it.

UPDATE(6/20): More (with some overlapped information) from the Daily Herald.

Found this interesting as well:

Some of the guys like Ben Gordon and Joakim Noah were in the gym watching my workout and I loved that. I hope I worked hard enough so they think I can play with them and that I deserve to be in this position.

I'm convinced Gordon is sleeping at the facility. All summer if you needed a quote, here's Ben !

 

1 recs | Comment 294 comments

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Comments

Display:

(saved this for the commenters)

meanwhile, Kirk’s out having a kid or some other bullshit…

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:26 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

:-D

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:26 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

To your friendly BullsBlogger..

Not to go off the subject but i have a quick question: I’m somewhat new to this blogging thing (this site has been fun though) could you tell me what the HELL is trolling?! Can you do it by accident? Is it something sexual? Please tell me! Thank you.

by JohnnyKilroy on Jun 19, 2008 7:34 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There's no way this guy isn't an alter.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:43 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

it's more or less 'being a random jerk just to bait people'

kindof what I just did with that Hinrich post. Don’t do that.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:46 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and as always

if you have a general question for me, please email me.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:47 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

YFBB loves that OT talk!

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:48 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thank you Father....

I’m going to say my ‘Hail Marys’ now…..

by JohnnyKilroy on Jun 19, 2008 7:52 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

An actual summary of the sarcasm on BAB

could actually be useful. I was thrown by it when I first started posting.

Consider this a potential manual so you can link noobies to it and punish them with an array of RTFM replies.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:23 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great pic!!

Hopefully we’ll be seeing a lot more of this!

by JohnnyKilroy on Jun 19, 2008 7:35 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Man, Rose is built like a mack truck.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:36 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No.

To put it bluntly.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:38 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's good for me

I saw the photo and it instantly reminded me of Jay, although maybe he was just bigger in terms of height, not in muscle.

And I agree, Rose looks jacked.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 7:42 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Name Height (In Shoes) Weight
Jay Williams 6’ 0.25” 6’ 1.75” 197
Derrick Rose 6’ 1.5” 6’ 2.5” 196

Jay weighed more despite being shorter so I’d say he compared favorably.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 7:42 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Link?

I thought Jay was 6’3 in shoes, but the builds do compare favorably, which does make sense considering how high most people were on him before his accident.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 7:43 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Based on pure "numbers" maybe, but Jay wasn't nearly as jacked.

Rose is one of the most physically imposing PGs to come around in sometime, outside of Deron Williams obviously.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:45 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

right, I remember Williams being more doughy

Then again so was Deron Williams initially.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:49 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Amazing what an NBA weight-training program can do...

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:50 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You keep missing the point...

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:54 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

what

is the point exactly? seems to me you’re trying to say Rose is better than Jay Williams when Jay had an amazing college career and everyone agreed back then had a pro body while playing at Duke.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 7:57 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

'everyone' also agreed

that he may be too shooty for a point guard, and too short as a SG.

Also, everyone always has duke-colored glasses.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:59 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ah

I forgot how much you value “pureness” in your point guards

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 8:01 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

just saying

Jay’s ‘pro body’ was in question.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 8:04 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well

Jay could bench the same, had a better agility time and very similar sprint time to Derrick. Couldn’t jump as high though.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 8:06 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He was very Eric Gordon-ish in a way.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 8:02 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I see at least multiple chins.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:57 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Stop hatin...

It’s just more of him to love!!

by JohnnyKilroy on Jun 19, 2008 7:59 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He looks 35 years old in this picture

You know why he has that expression on his face? He’s thinking if he gets his AARP card through the email or at the nearest retirement center.

"Glen Davis??? wow!! We had Glen Davis, his name is Michael Sweetney" - tyrus4prez

by NittanyBull on Jun 20, 2008 11:12 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Amazing

what effect having a life threatening motorcycle accident will have on you.

by JockstrapNoah on Jun 20, 2008 11:52 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

also

he had a better freshman year than Rose

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 7:48 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Obviously. Stats are all that matters.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:49 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

a lot of players did

Michael Beasley did!

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 8:01 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

indeed

at least we’re in agreement there

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 8:10 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What is your agenda I am confused?

You couldn’t possibly be anti-Rose, I mean it’s not like 99% of your comments have the theme of “Golly Derrick Rose sucks.”

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 8:40 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

hmm funny

none of my comments have been anything like Derrick Rose sucks. I think he’ll be good with a high chance of being great and its possible he could be better than Beasley. But it makes little sense to me to pass up someone who not only fits our biggest need but is also widely regarded as the most talented player in the draft and had the arguably the best freshman season ever.

It also makes little sense to me to regard Rose as highly as many of you do based on his tournament run alone. I would guess I watched more college basketball than anyone else on here this year because it was my job to do so and in my informed opinion Beasley was much better than Rose.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 8:52 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Your job to do so? Are you a scout?

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 9:01 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

no

I did stats for ESPN. I did many Memphis and KSU games and in my downtime watched a lot more because I was interested in those two teams (I could have won $400,000 if Memphis had won it all and the score had been right).

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 9:07 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yea, i'm with you

I like Rose as well, but I sure as hell don’t understand wht most people think he is the obvious choice. Beasley is gonna be sick

by Juiceboxjerry on Jun 19, 2008 9:35 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm always missing my bets

because I get the team wrong!

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:03 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

considerring

it was a 10 dollar bet that I made before the tournament started. The game went to overtime and I was within 5 points of the correct score.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:22 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not to pull an Alec, but...

that’s pretty sweet. Internship or a full-time gig?

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 9:46 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well

it was full-time but not nearly as sweet as you might think. I’m not working there anymore, it had its perks but working 5 PM-2 AM every night sucked, plus you had to work weekends and they’re really not nearly as well run a company as you’d expect. I wouldn’t be surprised if that whole division went under before long.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 9:51 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

couldve won $400k if the score was right.......

yeah i couldve won the lottery if the numbers were right…. so!! what dumbass information to include.. doesn’t justify your points any so leave that sheety information out sucka

by yetti on Jun 21, 2008 1:22 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

um

the only point I mentioned it is that I was explaining one of the reasons I was particularly interested in Memphis games. Let me know the next time you have a chance to win 400,000 where the odds are better than 1 in 50 million.

by JSlakov on Jun 21, 2008 10:55 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

what's the Bulls biggest need?

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:43 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

IMO

the Bulls biggest need is a go to scorer who can draw a double team. Preferably this would be someone who can get easy buckets in the paint on his own. Beasley looks like he fits this bill. The fact that he could be a dominant rebounder as well certainly helps.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 10:50 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

didn't mean to sound jerky and rhetorical

the Bulls have several needs. I’d say:

1) Someone to generate easy shot attempts when the offense breaks down.
2) Someone to collapse a defense and free up teammates.
3) Someone to be an on-court leader.

Those aren’t in order, I really don’t think there is a good way to prioritize them, actually.

I think Rose, even though he’s a perimeter player, can do the second thing. He certainly could the 3rd. Beasley has an edge for the 1st if it’s limited to ‘dump the ball into someone’. I don’t think that’s enough in his favor, especially considering that drafting him could create another need: masking their power forward on defense.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:52 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Beasley bad on defense?

does anyone have evidence for this? Just scrolling through the stats of opposing players on the season, he held Taj Gibson to 10 points, Joseph Jones to 5 points and 12 points, Malik Hairston to 7 points, Darrell Arthur to 7 points and 10 points Damian James to 9 points, Leo Lyons to 9 points. Now I don’t remember specifically if he was the primary defender on these guys but I don’t remember seeing him getting eaten up by anyone and we know he was the best rebounder in the country so it seems like people are really exaggerating his defensive deficiencies

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:04 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't know who those guys are

but no, I have no evidence, and I sincerely doubt box scores would provide it anyway.

I thought it was a commonly held perception. Yes that’s lazy, but is there any evidence he’s a good defender?

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:06 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't have a link right now,

but the best analysis I’ve seen, which agrees with my opinion from watching him, is that he hasn’t been well trained in defensive skills and has relied largely on his athleticism to this point. Without question his offensive game is more developed.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:08 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

but what about motivation to defend?

that’s what I heard was a problem.

Plus I think any size deficiency hurts more on Defense. (but that’s a testament to his offensive skill too)

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:12 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've never read or heard that he's unmotivated,

just that he hasn’t been asked to do it – the typical “save it for the offensive end” stuff. He could be unmotivated for all I know.

I hereby invoke the whole “BG scores so much his defensive defficiencies don’t matter as much” argument. ;)

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:15 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I said this in another response

but I think it’s important: That argument is less valid in the frontcourt.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:16 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I actually think it's a crappy argument

anyway, but I’m all about using whatever argument works in a given situation, then ignoring it when it suits me. I think I learned that in law school.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:19 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well I believe it's just nuance

but a Rose/Beasley argument rarely can stand such things.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:20 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and again

the average starting PF in the league is listed at 6’9” and we know that they are generous with those, so I’d say he’ll give up an inch maybe on average. And his standing reach is better than his height.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:17 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But even if he only gives up 1 inch on average

that’s a huge drawback, for this moment, right now, when we’re all just projecting like crazy as to how he’s going to be in the league.

Plus, there’s gotta be (speculation alert!) a huge correlation between shorter PF’s and poor defensive PF’s.

Throw in the fact that PF’s often end up guarding the other team’s C, and if that C can do anything down low, you pretty much are out of luck with Beasley on the other team’s center. Which gets back to what was mentioned above, about hiding your PF on defense.

For Beasley to be an above average defender, you’re asking him to overcome his height disadvantage and be exceptional right out of the gate, doing something he hasn’t clearly proven himself doing (even if he held the PF’s you listed above to the relatively low scores you mentioned). For a team predicated on “defense first” philosophy, this is not a great start.

You might argue that Rose’s defense isn’t great either, but he has the quickness to be a great defender.

Great perimeter defenders need quickness. Great frontline defenders need height. Unless they’re named Rodman, Ben Wallace (pre-2006 only) or maybe Elton Brand or a few others…

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 20, 2008 11:33 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Carl Landry is 6' 7"

and rocked the power forward position for the Rockets this year. Defensively, reboundsively, and offensively. You can be 6’ 7” and be too small or you can be 6’ 7” and succeed at PF. With Beasley you’ve got to discuss the 3 though as well.

by JockstrapNoah on Jun 20, 2008 12:20 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that's your example?

There are plenty of examples of 6’7” rebound machines. But that doesn’t mean they’re good defenders. (I can’t say either way on Landry in particular)

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 12:24 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The Bulls don't need a 3,

(and although this is a “take the best player” league and not a “draft for position” league, I also happen to think that Beasley is not the best player.)

Second, I agree that there are plenty of pretty good rebounders who are 6’7, in fact, it seems that 6’7 or 6’8 is the optimal height for being a dominant rebounder.

But nevertheless it seems in my subjective view that defensive abilities and height are both much more important at the 4 than they are at the 1, especially if the candidate at the 1 has the quickness to become a great defensive player.

I also question whether Beasley will “dominate” at the pro level. He’ll be good, but to ask him to be like Barkley on the low block is asking a bit much, don’t you think?

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 20, 2008 1:08 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Being a 7 footer

is the ‘optimal height’ for being a dominant rebounder. Ask Dwight Howard.

by kingj41 on Jun 20, 2008 1:12 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Proximity to the rim

is more important. Spending 100% of the time in the paint should mean more rebounds.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 2:57 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I know being a 7 footer doesn't equal dominant rebounder

But he threw out there, “in fact, it seems that 6’7 or 6’8 is the optimal height for being a dominant rebounder.”

In terms of today’s game, specifically, this year, I just took a jab at that statement.
Most of rebounding is having a knack for the ball. I can’t list all the skills that make rebounders great, but I know the desire to ‘go get it’ has to be there. But out of the top 20 on that list (@RP48), how many are 6’7(ish)? Jamison, McDyess, Evans, Landry? 20% doesn’t qualify the ‘optimal’ tag.

by kingj41 on Jun 20, 2008 3:59 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah, that was an admittedly

un-scientific statement, based upon my very anecdotal and small sample size. Best rebounding Bulls in my own subjective memory: Charles Oakley, Dennis Rodman, Ben Wallace. All of whom are around 6’8.

There was also that story in S.I. talking about how Rodman was the best rebounder in the history of the game (from back when Rodman was on the Spurs, I believe). So that’s where I’m getting that.

Granted, the top 3 rebounders this year were all closer to 7 feet than 6’8. Oh well. shrug

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 20, 2008 5:03 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well

I’d consider leading the league in rebounding some sort of evidence, as well as the stats I posted above and just the fact that he seemed to be holding his own in my time watching him.

And why do people assume Rose is better? Again, just running through some box scores and not knowing for sure if he was the one guarding them:

Rob McKiver-21 points
OJ Mayo-16 points
AJ Price-23 points
Deonta Vaugh- 20 points
DJ Augustin- 16 points
Mario Chalmers- 18 points (I’m sure you remember 3 of them)

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:14 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

DJ Augustine was destroyed by Rose

Box scores mean nothing. Trust me, I picked Texas to beat Memphis before that game thinking that Augustine would be able to match up with Rose… he was thoroughly owned. in just about every facet of the game.

by E-Grizzle on Jun 20, 2008 1:20 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

one take

Jay Bilas here says that Beasley is a good defender but not a great one. I’d say with what he brings in scoring and rebounding, good defense is probably enough for now.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:32 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Defense is difficult to measure

Period, but it’s particularly difficult to measure along those lines. If Beasley is standing and wandering around with little clue as to what he’s supposed to be doing, it may be someone other than “his” man who’s scoring buckets.

Seriously, find any scouting report of him, people who watched him on a large number of defensive possessions during the year, and his weaknesses on that side of the court are evident.

Here’s one example (mp3):

http://www.bullsbeat.com/bullsbeat_42x.mp3

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 11:10 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The funny thing about it is that Rose has been

criticized for his defense, too. They both have the ability to improve. Let’s just agree to disagree up front about whether they’ll improve, because I don’t want to have the same argument all over again.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:12 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

fair enough on the improvement question

but I’d say that it’s far more important at Beasley’s position to be good defensively.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:15 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Definitely, because

the bigs are the last line of defense. If a perimeter guy gets by his man and drives to the hoop, the bigs have got to be there to contest the shot and/or recover back to their man if the ball is dished.

But if the other team’s bigs overpower, or more importantly, “jump over” our bigs, the perimeter guys are not called upon to help out.

Which is all another way of saying that height and defensive ability for a highly touted draft pick are much more important for bigs.

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Jun 20, 2008 11:38 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Tony Parker was a terrible defender

in his first few seasons. He couldn’t shoot a jumpshot either.

Now TP wasn’t a lottery pick, but he was on people’s radar if you go by what the draft commentators were saying on draft day. They said, “Who? Oh, Parker. The young French point guard. That’s an interesting pick. We know about him, but we thought he was two years away from being drafted. I guess the Spurs know something we don’t.”

There is something to be said about drafting a guard that is an average defender. There’s also something to be said when that average defender has Joakim Noah and Tyrus Thomas behind him.

You can mask defensive weakness with a rotation of elite defenders behind your guards. TP has Duncan and Bowen. He’s really improved in his own right, but it takes time, coaching, and a person willing to learn.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 9:17 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A couple of things...

...that the Bulls and Rose supposedly have, no?

by tyger1147 on Jun 20, 2008 10:06 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You forgot...

4) Someone to prevent the opposing PG from penetrating into the interior of the Bulls defense, thereby completely breaking down and exposing the Bulls on D.

by BullsFanInSeattle on Jun 20, 2008 8:03 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The biggest need

is to obtain the best player. Period.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 10:55 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

sure

and I believe firmly that Beasley is the best player.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 10:55 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

in 4 years?

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:04 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

considerring

Beasley is slightly younger than Rose so I’d say that yes, I don’t expect him to fall behind Rose in 4 years.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:07 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

see, I do.

by staying still.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:09 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

why

is Rose more likely to improve than Beasley? Considering we don’t know what either of them can do in the NBA right now its hard to imagine what they will be able to do in 4 years. But I think both of them have room to improve and both of them have the natural gifts to be able to improve them. Beasley though I see as more talented and that should stay consistent throughout their careers.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:28 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There are a lot of reasons.

Rose is more athletic and has better size (for his position). Beasley already seems quite “polished” on the offensive end, and only somewhat motivated on D, which doesn’t usually change.

And that’s staying away from the supposed character issues.

by potato0328 on Jun 19, 2008 11:56 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Because..

Bigs generally transition better their first year in the league where a point guard takes 2-3 years in a system to hit their potential. You are right Beasley should come in and play better right away. Not many with basketball knowledge are going to contest that. However, many us do believe that Rose has the ability to be the better player and have a bigger impact on this team in the long run.

I personally feel that Rose a bigger upgrade over Hinrich than Beasley is over Gooden. I feel in two years a team with Rose, Gooden, Gordon, Thomas, Deng and Noah would win more games than a team of Hinrich, Gordon, Beasley, Deng, Thomas and Noah.

"If you're not going to compete, then I'll dominate you." MJ

by Rankdog on Jun 21, 2008 1:33 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The Bulls have many needs

Otherwise, why would they be in the Lottery.

You’re assuming that you’ve accurately gauged the Bulls biggest need; and that Beasley could actually fill it. Both points may be entirely untrue.

Beasley’s rebounding will translate to the NBA. But why do you assume that his scoring will translate? Why do you assume that he’ll be a back-to-the-basket post player in the paint in the NBA, against taller, stronger, longer defenders in the NBA?

It makes little sense to me why people assume that the Beasley can fill the Bulls need of a dominant low-post scorer, while there are other great needs of the Bulls that need to be filled and that Rose easily fills.

by BullsFanInSeattle on Jun 20, 2008 8:01 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

speed?

does anyone know how they compare speedwise?
also how do they compare basketball IQwise? or in pure point guard skills?
I was not that impressed with Jay Williams either before or after he became a Bull.
However, I was prejudiced I wanted them to pick another high school kid (they already had Chandler and Curry) but everyone was saying we had enough with the High School experiment and should never draft another High School kid. So, Amare went to Phoenix.

"To a man with a hammer, every solution looks like a nail." SLC

by WayOldGuy on Jun 20, 2008 7:37 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good post

That mentality is a disease. You cannot just avoid taking a risk in an area just because you took a similar risk in the same area and weren’t happy with the results the year before. The conditions have changed. There’s a different climate. There’s a different makeup of teams. There’s new rules. There’s older players.

It’s incredibly stupid to walk up to a roulette table, watch a spin land on red, and then place a bet on black. You lose and then bet on red. You lose again. It’s a poor strategy.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 9:21 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

3/4 court sprint times

I think Jay’s was 3.07 and Rose’s was 3.05 or something. Very similar.

by JSlakov on Jun 20, 2008 11:04 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Rose's vertical is prolly alot better...

and he is a great finisher around the basket

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 11:09 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

word

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 7:46 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Jay Will

Was little. And by that I mean short.

John Paxson has been like family to me. I can no more disown him than I can disown my white grandmother, who also was unable to pull off any deals for superstar free agents or hire a top-notch coach.

by preverbal on Jun 19, 2008 10:05 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

between him and Gordon

the Bulls could be handing out plenty of tickets to the guard gun-show. Or, uh, something like that…

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:50 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Vinny's already got so much clout

he’s making prospects fetch him water!

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 7:48 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Are those Nikes?

Looks like Derrick found a shoe partner.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:25 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think Rose has signed with Jumpman

I seem to have read this somewhere unofficial, so I could be completely wrong.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2008 9:44 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Will his pining for Chicago get him in trouble?

Or does he figure what the rest of us assume, that Pax is picking him? Imagine us getting Beasley, and a shot of Rose crying as he goes to Miami a la Steve Francis.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 7:45 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I can't imagine that

Steve Francis was and still is one of the most cocky players in the league. Can I still say he’s in the league? He has a contract.

Rose is completely the opposite. He’s much more reserved. Watching Memphis games I was looking for signs that he was a vocal presence for his team.

We really need guys like Joakim that use all the tools available to them to make the team better. Talking is a huge one, but the right words at the right time is more important.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:28 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But seriously folks...

I think we’ll all agree that Rose will be better off with VDN as his coach than That Holy Terror Scott Skiles.

by JohnnyKilroy on Jun 19, 2008 8:09 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

that espn article makes me worried

But maybe that is paxson’s point? why? can someone please explain the logic behind not letting people in on who you intend on drafting. I mean, d rose has to be the guy. We already used a number 2 pick on tyrus just TWO years ago, and if you read what paxson said about ty when they drafted him(he basically said they knew he would take a few years to come into his own in the NBA), i would be shocked if there were ready to give up on him after only two years.

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 8:57 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Maybe he just hasn't made his mind up yet.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 9:00 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

sorry, messed that up

do you believe pax when he says he hasn’t made up his mind?

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 9:07 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't disbelieve him.

It’s easier for us to make a pick when we don’t literally have to make the pick and live with the consequences. He may be leaning one way, but I’d actually be surprised if he was 100% set and not having any thoughts on the other guy. They just finished having them in today.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 9:30 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I see your point

I, personally, think pax is totally full of shit when he says he hasn’t made up his mind. I don’t buy it. I honestly think the choice is obvious, especially after hearing what these guys had to say in their interviews with the media.

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 10:18 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The reason Pax or any GM will keep quiet...

is leverage maybe for a trade which i dont believe is going to happen

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 8:29 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Reluctant Bride Syndrome?

She might bail at the alter.

Paxson the player did know when to pass and when to shoot it.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:30 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow!

I read the transcript at Bulls.com and listened to the clips that were played on WSCR, and all I can say is WOW. This kid is bright, mature, polite, humble (when’s the last time you heard of a top draft pick admit to a specific skill deficiency?) yet confident, and very, very driven. I just can’t express what a pleasure it is to see that the kid has a great head on his shoulders.

More importantly, it’s how the difference in “brain” between Rose and Beasley effects the decision on the top pick – the different in inherent risk between Rose and Beasley’s failure to reach their potential due to attitude/desire problems is astronomical. I had visualized the possibilities of each player’s ultimate career value in a graphical format, with Rose having the higher maximum upside but Beasley being much more of a sure bet to be an All-Star caliber player (thereby leaving the downside risk with Rose). Well, the last couple of days has made me shift the entire Beasley curve substantially over to the left, pushing my personal opinion from 55/45 in favor of Rose to 80/20 in favor of Rose.

I’m still nervous about the downside with Rose – the performance risk that his performance level doesn’t improve dramatically – but I’m much now I’m happier to take that risk, which I see as being just a little smaller than I did a short while ago.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 9:16 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I should point out

That it’s possible that Rose is really a complete jagoff, but that he understands how to play the game and that he understands what needs to be said; note that I don’t think that this as the case, as he came across as especially sincere in his desire to become a Bull. But getting back to the point – even if this is the case, that he’s not the person he projects in his interviews – it’s still a great sign for his maturity and overall professionalism, and the difference between him and Beasley in this regard is stark.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 9:18 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're certainly welcome to your opinion on their personalities,

but I still don’t see where people get the impression that Rose has a greater desire or better attitude about the game of basketball. They’re both driven and both want to excel.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 9:40 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Really?

I hadn’t realized they changed the name here… I thought this was still blog-a-tyrusthomas.com

But yeah, I think your right, it’s changed a bit. I never thought that the Tyrus love fest would switch to a player that has actually proved less than Tyrus Thomas in the NBA.

by kidronmusic on Jun 24, 2008 11:07 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

enough other people say otherwise

I admit I don’t know, and you’re correct that these vanilla Q&As aren’t much to go on.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:53 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I understand what you mean, this is all pretty much hearsay.

I don’t doubt that Beasley wants to win. I just wonder where that is on the list… above or below “score a lot” and “have a good time.”

by potato0328 on Jun 19, 2008 11:59 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's the Larry Hughes priority rating scale!

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 20, 2008 12:22 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can we keep that brain warm

And ditch this stupid headband nonsense?

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:32 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Okay

For one, even if they have equal desire, Rose’s desire includes playing defense and doing what he needs for his team to win. Beasley’s desire is to be the best player he can be. There is a big difference there – Carmelo Anthony gets better every year and it almost certainly underlies a great deal of hard work in the offseason, but with all of that desire he’s a horrendous defense and his on-court play does not maximize his team’s chances of winning.

Second – and more importantly – Beasley has the emotional maturity of a fetus.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 9:52 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sorry

That was supposed to be a reply to wjb’s post above. Fuck.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 9:53 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Your sig plays in nicely here...

:-p

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 19, 2008 10:16 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We're obviously not going to agree on this

But I think you’re making a pretty big assumption based on a single Q&A. When has Beasley ever said he doesn’t want to play defense or want to win? People keep asking Rose about his defense because his coach said it’s not the first thing on his mind in a radio interview. And do you think Rose doesn’t want to be the best player he can be?

You find Beasley immature – I find him funny. You find Rose all things wonderful – I thought his interview was incredibly boring. To each his own, I guess.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 10:18 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It was a cookie cutter interview

To me, that just shows he knows how to stick to the script, and won’t say anything inflammatory. That obviously is a positive for Paxson. I like Beasley, spontaneity, it’s good to have someone with a pulse on the team.

But hell, if Rose is going to be a great player he can be more boring than Duncan for all I care. Same goes for Beasley.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 10:25 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We already have Noah for the affable big man

We need someone who can rally the troops, not crack them up

by E-Grizzle on Jun 19, 2008 10:41 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It doesn't have to be one or the other.

These are not mutually exclusive characteristics.

What happened to all the talk about what a great team leader Noah is, by the way?

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 10:45 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, I mean everyone was talking about how he would be the vocal leader the team

needed, and now he’s been relegated to the team clown role.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:21 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think Noah can be a leader

Just not the #1 leader of the team. He IS a rally-the-troops kind of guy though, who is also goofy.

by E-Grizzle on Jun 19, 2008 11:19 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

Pick the best player. I want the guy who will perform on the team. I happen to be in the minority here who think there’s a strong possibility that guy will be Beasley. I do like Beasley’s personality, but if it turns out Rose is the better player then I hope Pax does that.

I just really object to people equating Beasley’s personality with a lack of drive or focus on the basketball court. I happen to think that’s a load of crap.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 10:43 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't see how it's possible to 'like' Beasley's personality

to ‘like’ is to not think it’s an impact either way. But there’s a potential red flag to being Mikey Prankster, and at the very least (and that may be all it is) it’s something Rose has in his favor.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:46 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Disagree

When I say I like it, I think it’s a positive. Again, I realize I’m in the minority here, but that’s my opinion.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 10:49 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

bro

she’s not a dude

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:56 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

dude-tte

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 11:00 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

heh

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:00 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Haven't been called that in a while.

I changed my sig – you can take credit.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 11:10 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

there you go

hah, pissing off riley is another perk

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 11:14 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's interesting.

Who do you think the best player is in the NBA with a “crack the guys up” attitude? Any past players?

(I’m not trying to come at you, I’m actually wondering. I’m having a hard time doing better than Arenas or B. Davis right now, but I’m sure there’s better….)

by potato0328 on Jun 20, 2008 12:01 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OK, I swear your post wasn't here when I hit post

Then I walked away and came back to see you’d already posted it.

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 20, 2008 12:27 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

And that’s the guy I should have thought of.

by potato0328 on Jun 20, 2008 10:23 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I suppose Shaq?

If nothing else, taking Rose will at least piss off Pat Riley.

by wjb1492 on Jun 20, 2008 12:25 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And he had the physical tools to dominate "just like that."

And we saw his “motivation” and how he had to play himself into shape every year during the regular season. He didn’t have to (nor did he) put in the extra hours over the summer. Other than the most imposing physical specimen to ever play in the NBA, is there anyone else?

by tyger1147 on Jun 20, 2008 12:49 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

it would be one thing if beasley

was hysterical, but i dont know, his jokes are lame, he is trying too hard to be the goof ball…thats the major red-flag. you are either naturally funny or you aren’t, you can’t force it. sorry to nit-pick, it just bugs me

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 10:49 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

why's that impossible?

is there something wrong with wanting a charismatic player on your team? This guy could be the face of our franchise for the next decade or more and it seems perfectly reasonable to prefer a guy who you find to have a more interesting personality, even if it shouldn’t be the #1 reason.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 10:53 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

so far my impression isn't charismatic or interesting

merely goofball. Which is fine, but not a positive.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:55 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

and this may be a crappy reason

but if the Bulls think Beasley’s immature even in the least, they can’t take a chance and draft him.

I know how I blast the organization about caring too much about ‘intangibles’, but I think in this case it’s worth it playing it ‘safe’.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:02 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

immature

he’s 19. how mature were you at age 19? how mature was Kobe? the fact that he makes jokes and seems to be enjoying his life as a soon to be millionaire does not count as a red flag to me.

by JSlakov on Jun 19, 2008 11:05 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wouldn't want the Bulls to draft me either

questions about his maturity aren’t only due to his time with the media.

Wasn’t Kobe already practicing his Jordan speech patterns at 19?

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:08 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think Kobe

was practicing his Jordan speech patterns at about 15, because he had it down cold by the time he was 20.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 11:11 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

not the point

the point is that he ISN”T funny, he is acting like the class clown, on purpose. thats lame. He should be aware enough of the magnitude of the situation he is in that he has to put on his game face and try to not prove the critics correct.

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 11:11 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think his Bart Simpson personality is allowable if he has a good work ethic

I don’t want to see Beasley be the next Derrick Coleman because he never took the game too seriously. He is just a kid, but once he starts his NBA career, all those excuses are moot. His priority has to be basketball. I’m not expecting an MJ/Kobe type of devotion to the game, but I would like to see him set an example as the player who knows how much is expected of him, and is going to put forth that amount of effort.

Dwight Howard was often considered too affable to be a superstar. Well, he’s become a force in the league, but has still maintained that light-hearted nature.

Kobe’s immaturity was a different sorts. He was an asshole who wanted to play for a solid franchise, and was criticized by Shaq for taking things too seriously in the early years.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 19, 2008 11:11 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Howard was said to be too 'nice'

not exactly the same thing. Though it’s not that far off of a comparison.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 11:13 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

B-Easy is an idiot

You may be able to live with his immaturity (which frankly frightens the hell out of me in a city with a nightlife like Chicago), but if you can tolerate his stupidity, then you have no case. When asked what he thought about playing in Miami, B-Easy praised South Beach. The boy is a moron. Maybe even a complete moron. I’m not saying he’s not a nice guy, an entertaining guy, a stud player, because he seems to be all three, unquestionably, but your are taking on more risk for an undersized 4 who potentially won’t be the answer to the post scoring void for arguably an equally high ceiling as Rose. Why even take that risk?

by messwiththebull on Jun 20, 2008 7:06 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What does the nightlife have to do with anything

Is he gonna go to Ruby and write graffiti on the go-go dancers? Or put dead rats in the bathrooms at Soundbar?

You just called someone a complete moron, yet you know nothing of his intelligence. Derrick Rose could be a complete dumbass, yet if he plays basketball well you could care less.

If we knew something about his work ethic, then his quirky character would apply. I don’t mind goofball if there’s dedication behind it. Unfortunately, I think we will only find out how he truly is once he gets to a pro team.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2008 9:47 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Are you soft on drafting Rose?

or just skeptical about the number of posts pointing to Beasley’s “character” issues?

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 9:59 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The latter

I was initially sky high on Rose. I tend to believe his potential is greater than that of Beasley. This is a perimeter oriented game now. You don’t necessarily need a dominating big man to score, just one who can anchor a solid defense. Scoring big men in this league go nowhere unless they are paired with either an exceptional playmaker, or some kind of solid slashing perimeter player. I doubt the Bulls roster as is can provide Beasley with that kind of support. I waver so much because I wonder if Rose will improve his scoring ability, which is going to be paramount to him becoming a successful pro. He doesn’t shoot particularly well, and his mechanics are weak.

So, I get both sides of the argument, but I can’t stand that people are calling Beasley a moron, idiot, whatever because he was a prankster 2 years ago.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2008 1:35 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

On shooting

Do the Chris Paul and Tony Parker examples increase confidence in the Rose pick? Neither of them were very good shooters entering the league, but they both could handle the rock, slash, and blow up opponents with their speed in transition.

Those two are what’s carrying me heavily over to the Rose camp. I think Rose has these skills right now. Nobody will be able to double Gordon and leave Rose. If you pass to Rose he’s so quick with the ball to cheat off him would be near suicide. Opponents are going to have to leave other guys.

Noah? Can’t leave him near the rim. He flushes easily. He puts back most shots. He’s already one of the best tap dancers in the league.
Thomas? Don’t even let this guy have a free lane to the rim without the ball.
Deng? Among the best cutting SFs in the NBA.
Gordon? Please leave this guy open. seriously.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 3:02 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think I posted this somehwere I else

But I argued that while Beasley may in fact be a better talent, Rose is a better fit for the team because of all the little things he can open up for the rest of the roster. My biggest fear with Rose is that he’ll take a long time to learn how to be a distributing PG that knows when to take over the game and incessantly drive into the lane. My fear with Beasley is that he’ll just be a solid 20/10 guy who will be a great player, but won’t improve the team.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2008 3:10 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Beasley's *ACTIONS* - his play - make it clear that he doesn't want to play defense

You’re right in that we’re probably not going to agree on this, but I’d like to think that it’s an obvious point based upon his play last year that Beasley has absolutely zero defensive intensity at all (defensive rebounding aside) – and while this may be built/taught in a minority of circumstances, I see this as being a part of a player’s DNA and not something that is likely to change over time.

And it’s his actions, along with his interview reponses, that make it clear that he hasn’t grown up one bit. He still refuses to acknowledge any wrongdoing from his high school days! If that isn’t a red flag, that he remains completely unwilling to acknowledge that his high school behavior was unacceptable, then I don’t know what is.

And it’s not just one Q&A – it’s a series of data points from their play on the court and observations of coaches and scouts, all of which were highlighted by the interview responses of each player this week.

Parental Advisory - Explicit Content

by Jivas on Jun 19, 2008 10:54 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

agreed on that

it’d be something if he said something besides “hey I’m young, what can I say?”

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 19, 2008 10:56 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Why perception matters

Perception of a person will lead to certain questions asked in a certain way. When the perception of you is good the line of questioning will leap to next level. The character questions won’t even be asked.

I’d rather not have to read questions and answers about character in our draft picks. I want them asked about basketball, teamwork, effort, and growing.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 8:40 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well that is character

or should be.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 9:28 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

boring?!?

can i assume by that statement and your sig that you are a “glass is half empty” kind a guy.

I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE

by CONOR6 on Jun 19, 2008 10:22 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm actually an optimist.

I should change my signature – I put that one on when Doug Collins backed out of the coaching search. Not that I wanted him necessarily, but it was just one more negative in the national media.

And yeah, boring. There’s nothing innately wrong with boring, but what was interesting about it? I could have written those answers in my sleep.

Here's to what was suppose to be the most exciting offseason in years, but has instead spiraled downward into pitiful morass of indecision. Cheers!

by wjb1492 on Jun 19, 2008 10:47 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Chad Ford's "tier" theory on drafting is very insightful...

apparently a lot of teams use it.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2008/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=Tiers-080619

If we used this theory, I think we would still take Rose. Our two big team needs seem to be: better point guard and better interior scoring. And I assumed that most teams have Rose as the best player in the draft, and Beasley goes second.

I think by this theory we would take Rose.

by swede2287 on Jun 19, 2008 10:36 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This article makes me laugh every year

especially when he goes through the examples. He’s very professorial.

Speaking of the examples, those Atlanta Hawks just don’t get it do they.

by potato0328 on Jun 20, 2008 12:04 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Much better than JSlakov....

....because at least you acknowledge that such a bad team has at least two big needs!

If we need better PG play and better interior scoring – Beasley can only really help with one of these, but Rose can help with both. Rose will be a better PG than the Bulls have currently, and his penetration, athleticism, court vision, and basketball IQ will allow him to enable all of his teammates to be better as well.

When we consider the Bulls as having only ONE need – maybe Beasley is the best pick. But when we start considering multiple different needs, Rose seems to fill more of those big needs than Beasley.

by BullsFanInSeattle on Jun 20, 2008 8:06 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

of course

they have multiple needs, but I’d rather take the guy who has the best chance of filling the most important one than someone who may fill more than one. And while I admit they definitely have other needs than a go to scorer, I’m not sure they really need better PG play. I know Hinrich regressed last year but I’m not ready to give up on him, especially considering some of the big shooting point guards who have come into their alone later in their careers like Billups and Nash. If he plays at the level of the three years before last I think he’s definitely capable of being the starting point guard on a contender, especially if we added someone who could draw a double team and get him more open looks. I think the same could go for Deng and maybe even Gordon. Rose potentially could get them less open looks because he hasn’t proven he can shoot.

by JSlakov on Jun 21, 2008 11:10 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Short and sweet
When we consider the Bulls as having only ONE need – maybe Beasley is the best pick. But when we start considering multiple different needs, Rose seems to fill more of those big needs than Beasley.

This might be the best short answer advocating that we draft Derrick Rose.

Thanks.

by NBA Observer on Jun 21, 2008 11:18 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Reading into Pax and VDN's quotes

They say stuff like “you can plug him into that position for 10 yrs” and “he allows you to play a certain style of basketball, opens the floor” about Rose and simply say “he’s a fantastic scorer” about Beasley. Seems like the things they say about Rose have a higher value imo.

by E-Grizzle on Jun 19, 2008 11:17 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Best quote:
I’d love to play here. I know the whole city would be behind me and it’s such a great sports city. The Bulls have a lot of talent and they’re young, too. I think if I’m lucky enough to come to this team, we’ll do some damage."

Draft. This. Man.

When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer

by Illini15 on Jun 20, 2008 12:03 AM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My 2 cents

I keep going back and forth between the two because I am thinking how many people here if D Rose was not an option would be going insane for Beasley because he is everything we had needed in terms of a player. Tyrus had a shot at it, but he is not ready yet… I think honestly our PG spot is ok if our PG is not the primary playmaker. With Beasley he wouldnt be and if we can get a better shooting guard somehow, Maybe like a Redd we can do some damage with room to grow. We have good back court depth already if we add one more primary guard instead of say gordon and gooden and or noccioni. Now I look to see if we had only D Rose to choose from… I dont see how we would be any more excited than now. Some people would still have the same questions as now such as if he can shoot the ball well enough and if he is as good defensively as thought which I think the opposing guards points per game scored against him. With everything said though, after watching their interviews and listening to them I would still say F it and Draft Rose just based on the fact that he will do his best he can to be the best he can be and lead the team. I just dont think Beasley is willing to do that…

by NamingRightsOnSale on Jun 20, 2008 12:55 AM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree with most of this post...

but don’t quite understand the logic at the end.
No, Beasley didn’t say “I’m going to play my butt off”, but show me a game where he hasn’t. When he steps on the floor, hes all business, and each of his games is a testament to that.

We keep saying that we want a team leader, but the best way to lead is by example, and NOBODY in college basketball did that better than Beasley.

It would be nice to have a hometown guy and all, but you draft the best player available.

by darksmokepuncher on Jun 20, 2008 7:38 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What did Joe Dumars know about Melo

That made him select Darko instead?

I first heard about Beasley three years ago. When I looked at his production it was awesome. He could do so many things. The consensus was this guy is going to be an awesome player.

The questions that always came up were about character and maturity. Why was he jumping from school to school? Is that just the new way of basketball talent development after Lebron? It’s not unusual to attend multiple high schools before hitting the NCAA and then to the NBA. Lots of guys play 3 years at a home high school, get noticed, and then play their final year at Oak Hill or Notre Dame prep. However, Beasley was attending ALL of these schools. That was strange.

Maybe he was just too good. Maybe he couldn’t fit into a team. Whatever doubts were there his one year at KSU sure as heck showed HE can produce. What about his team? He had some big games. Not just big games, the best freshman production ever. WOW. How the heck are there still character questions about him?

It’s his attitude. Fun fun here. Fun fun there. Fun fu fun fun everywhere. When does a prospect take a step back, look at the trees, and start seeing he’s about to enter a forest and not a patch of saplings.

You could have said some of these same things about Noah last year. But last year the team needed a center. We needed a big. We needed a guy that showed he works. Noah works.

This year the demands are different. We need a big time talent. We need a blooming young man with incredible talent and demonstrative path towards maturity and leadership. Rose is that man. Beasley is not.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 9:09 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree 100%...

... Beasley has been the consensus No 1 all year, it will be a historic mistake to let Beasley go somewhere else.

I also can’t believe how “conservative” some of the posts are. There is nothing wrong with having fun and being aggressive on the basketball court, in fact that is exactly what has been missing from this organisation since the Jordan era. I am sick of reading lame arguments portraying Beasley as (almost) a criminal just because he pulled a few pranks at high school. The guy showed his character at K-State and yet people are still worried about him moving high-schools (!).

The fact that Rose comes from Chicago should have no influence on our decision at all. Beasley is the more talented out of the two with stronger leadership attributes. This should be a no-brainer…

PS How can anyone forget the collapse of Memphis against the Jayhawks?

The No 1 Chi -Town sports fan in Europe!

by Vangelis on Jun 20, 2008 9:55 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ugh

My opinion is that we should avoid drafting Michael Beasley. I think we should draft Rose.

What I was offering was a nuanced view of Beasley. The market for developing top talent may just be what we see in Beasley. When a kid is identified at a very early age to be a special player in the future you will see them move from school to school, but play for the same AAU team.

For example, If I recall correctly, Derrick Rose didn’t attend Simeon High School in Chicago for four years. I think he attended another school first and later transferred to Simeon. Simeon is a private academy. It’s not a public high school. You have to pass an entrance exam. You pay your own way, but most students attend on scholarship. You must demonstrate not only that you belong there, but that you can remain excepted there.

Beasley was hop scotching from school to school. He has yet to explain the reasons for that. He’s trying to put the best spin on these facts.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 10:14 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

hehe.

Frustrated w/ others for not getting your nuanced view? Don’t be so nuanced.

by tyger1147 on Jun 20, 2008 10:18 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Frustration

cannot be expressed through turn based text communication. In this turn based communication model frustration is expressed best through silence or the absence of a reply.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 10:20 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

or just a

“huh?”

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 10:31 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Beasley "hop scotching from school to school"

All this says to me is that he was a basketball prodigy.

No matter where he went he was so far beyond what anyone else there was doing that he saw no reason to stay. We all know a prodigy or two, right? How many of them had smooth youth experiences?

Rose has said again and again—Beasley is the better player. I think we all know Beasley is the better player.

The case for Rose is based almost entirely on the postion of point guard having become a more valued position than small/power forward. How much more talent is that worth in the equation? Beasley has twice the talent, but point guard is three times as important?

Is that the argument?

Wjb said it, and I agree—Beasley is now and will be a better team leader than Rose. Beasley is magnetic, super charismatic. Rose, I’m sure, keeps his nose to the grind stone, and will have a steady arc of solid play throughout his career. Beasley a basketball genious.

Give me Beasley.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:47 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeesh, I don't know where to begin

I remember my neighbors had prodigy and it was the coolest thing I had ever seen.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 10:53 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ha-ha

But I’m serious. There’s a huge gulf between “very good” and “genious.”

I think Beasley is so so far beyond very good. Matt, you like numbers. beasly’s numbers are not just “very good”—the are historic, one time only numbers.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:56 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

they're college numbers

some translate, some don’t.

There’s no indication (and Rose saying so is irrelevant) that Beasley is more talented, let alone TWICE as talented.

Though maybe he is, with his talents in areas I don’t value.

The part about his ‘magnetic’ personality is just you being a weirdo.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 10:59 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let's just say ESPN video is not following around Derrick Rose.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:01 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

let's just say you're a weirdo.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:02 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Probably because Reggie has the good

sense to keep ESPN away. It’s the sports entertainment network not the sports leadership network.

formerly sbulls

by Scotter on Jun 20, 2008 11:07 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My guess is that it's probably a mutual decision

between Reggie and ESPN.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:21 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

True

But ESPN wants to have an entertaining video, and Derrick Rose is a quiet, humble guy(or at least appears to be). They want to follow around the seemingly attention starved prospect whose attitude seems to be questioned by just about everyone in the hopes that he does something crazy so that they get higher ratings/more hits on the website. I would rather watch the #1 pick entertain on the basketball court, not in a videoblog leading up the draft where he contemplates what his next joke will be.

And no, I haven’t bothered watching the video.

"Me like to shoot much" - Andres Nocioni

by BNeL21 on Jun 20, 2008 12:58 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Honestly who cares if Beasley is the 2nd coming of Richard Pryor

If Rose is more pathetically milk and cookie boring than Tim Duncan, yet turns out to be an All-Star PG who can lead this team deep into the playoffs in several seasons, then give me his lameness.

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 20, 2008 1:38 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

let me ask this??

if u were able to look into a crystal ball where would u see Rose and Beasely numbers wise and who would u compare their games too? My guess is Rose is a 20pt 9-10 assist 4-5 rb guy…beasely will be a 22pt 11-13 rb guy

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 11:27 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

stronger leadership qualities????

what evidence do u have of Beasely being a better leader???

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 10:46 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Stronger leadership attributes?

Set down the blow torch and step away from the pipe. Beasley is a beast on the court, and may ‘lead by example’, but he has in NO way, shape, or form exhibited any type of ‘leadership attributes’ nor ‘leadership mentality’ that will carry over into the NBA. I’m not going to try to argue that Rose has, but to blindly state that Beasley has stronger leadership assets than Rose is simply not true. If it’s not false outright, it’s moot – so hypothetical as to be meaningless. Rose led his teams to city championships, state championships, and the NCAA Final. Memphis hadn’t made a Final Four since 1985 – until they got D Rose.

PS How can anyone forget that Beasley couldn’t get his team out of the second round? If he’s THAT great – sheesh – even Danning Manning won the title, right???? ;-)

by BullsFanInSeattle on Jun 20, 2008 8:19 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

considerring

Memphis made the Elite Eight the year before and Kansas State hadnt made the tournament since 1996, I’d consider Beasley’s feat more impressive.

by JSlakov on Jun 21, 2008 11:15 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

What did Joe Dumars THINK HE KNEW about Melo

that made him select Darko instead.

I don’t think there’s any way to support Dumors’ skipping over Melo. To use Dumars’ selection of Darko over Melo doesn’t build a case for the Bulls to select Rose over Beasley.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:13 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There isn't

The Dumars info is misdirection. It means nothing. It’s an attention grabber.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 10:18 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

no such thing

that’s all taken care of with the signature :-p

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 10:19 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If the Dumars ref is a misdirection,

then don’t complain about people not getting your “nuances.”

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:49 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not complaining

not anymore. Definitely was before.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 10:55 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sorry, I'm probably late to the party today.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:57 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It wasn't about their characters.

For someone tuned in who can remember quotes from years past, you should know this rather obvious info. It was about their positions. The Pistons had drafted Tayshaun Prince the year before (the only good pick in the whole draft after 10th-Caron Butler-other than Carlos Boozer). They wanted a scoring big man to complement Ben Wallace and could afford to take the development route. Of course, they went out and picked up Rasheed Wallace the following February.

by tyger1147 on Jun 20, 2008 10:16 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree.

My question is…are you saying the Pistons made a mistake by rating position/need over player?

That’s how I’d see it…and to me, the Bulls taking Rose would be a similar miscalculation.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:52 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The question is ....

Would u rather have a potential Chris Paul( Derrick Rose) or a potential Rasheed Wallace/Derrick Coleman(Micheal Beasely)...i take Derrick Rose

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 10:56 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't believe that's the question.

If you had to start a university physics department, would you rather have Einstein or your high school physics teacher?

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 10:59 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Did Einstein spray-paint that physics teacher's car?

you’re really going to run with this ‘basketball genius’ thing, aren’t you? Can we just hold off a couple minutes till the next massive logical leap? I don’t like this one.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:01 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Fine, I'll hold off.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:02 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But I don't see how

you can so blithely back out of the numbers.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:04 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Glenn Robinson and Carmelo Anthony had insane numbers too

Rose has very good numbers. As much as we’d all like it to be, drafting isn’t a science.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:05 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Glenn Robinson, I'll give you...

but a few weeks ago people here were climbing all over themselves to give up half our team to get Melo.

And I think Beasley will be a lot lot better than Melo. For one thing, Beasley will board as well as score.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:18 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Melo-lust was in a different context

There’s an argument to take Beasley with a draft pick. But it’s a different conversation to say you want to pass on Derrick Rose to take Michael Beasley.

for instance, I wouldn’t trade the #1 pick for Melo.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:29 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But, that wasn't me willing to give

up half the team for Melo. I’d be hesitant to trade Deng for Melo, and at least David Thorpe would back me up on that. Statistics have to be put in context.

I’ll throw another name that had great statistics as a freshman in a loaded ACC with Rasheed Wallace, Tim Duncan, etc. How did Joe Smith turn out? I think Beasley will be an All-Star, and better than Carmelo, but his statistical performance will be altered in the NBA.

For one example, his offensive rebounding is going to take a huge hit. His offensive rebound rate was already nearly halved against those 11 teams with bigger interior defenders. Plus, he’s going to have to play outside more on offense against NBA defenders. That part of his stats won’t translate to the NBA. That’s just one example.

formerly sbulls

by Scotter on Jun 20, 2008 11:30 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

blithely huh?

i see somebody has been on the online dictionary today….Rose gets it done he will be a star in this league i guarantee…Beasely will be good too but i dnt think he will fit well on this team and he is a tweener dont we have too many of those already??

CHICAGO MANE!!!!

by YEP on Jun 20, 2008 11:06 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If "blithely" throws you for a loop,

I’m sure you don’t want to draw swords over a vocabulary challenge.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:11 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well if that's what you believe, go for it

I will continue to make fun of it, is all I’m saying.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:04 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Looking for ways to go here

with you. I see what you’re saying. There’s strong evidence to support it.

What I’m pondering is different people in history that were geniuses, but required very specific surroundings/habitat/people/etc around them in order to achieve. There are plenty of geniuses that end up in mental aslyum’s because nobody can find a method to recess their uncontrolable side and elevate their genius.

First two that come to mind are Bill Clinton and Ted Kazynksi. Bill with his legendary memory, but can’t remember shit about the women he’s fondled. And Ted with his mathematical talent and social critique, but poor strategy of sweeping away his tracks.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 11:10 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OK. Ha...

I’ll throw out my Einstein if you throw out your Ted Kazynski.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:13 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

get a room, you two.

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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 20, 2008 11:15 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, but I keep bumping into other people who've read it.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on Jun 20, 2008 11:19 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Gladwell blogs too

Not very often, but he has posted about win shares.

by NBA Observer on Jun 20, 2008 11:43 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

WoW doesn't use Win Shares

Win Shares were a Bill James invention, and Kubatko mashed it up with BoP stats at basketball-reference.com.

by hscs on Jun 20, 2008 11:47 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Kind of weak argument

Bill remembers every contour, what do you expect him to say?
Ted wasn’t that talented- its just makes better press, since the average news reader doesn’t have a clue about advanced math. People of his skill level are a dime a dozen in most university math departments, and many of them have something resembling his personality as well…

by iBurkey on Jun 20, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

Bill and Ted’s Excellent Adventure was far superior to Bill and Ted’s Bogus Journey.

by hscs on Jun 20, 2008 11:28 AM CDT