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More D'Antoni

Blogabull_s_tiny by your friendly BullsBlogger on

There's a pointless and fun tool that was posted amongst the SBNation brethren that allowed us to count comments by user on a post. Here's what's been produced in the weeks worth of D'Antoni talk:

Total Users: 74
Total Comments: 913
Total Threads: 3

Top 10 Commenters:
your friendly BullsBlogger 119
NBA Observer 105
alec 64
tyger1147 52
snley 52
Ozzie Montana 49
NormVanBeer 47
bullshooter 41
exult463 24
hscs 21

And after all that...still no real news. But more speculation!

Star-divide

 Here's the latest from K.C. Johnson, with one interesting tidbit being that it looks like Pax is cooling on Avery Johnson. But on to the D'Antoni part:

D'Antoni, by all accounts, intrigues Paxson on many levels and presents reservations on others. Those reservations go beyond money.

While Paxson is said to like D'Antoni personally and value his offensive coaching skills, D'Antoni's reputation as a lesser defensive coach is giving Paxson pause.

D'Antoni also routinely limited practice time with a veteran—and superstar-laden—Suns team. That's not to say D'Antoni couldn't change if he took over the league's youngest team in the Bulls, which his camp has stressed is his desire.

But Paxson is giving indications he might want to wait to interview candidates such as Celtics assistant Tom Thibodeau. How that fits with the Suns' plans is uncertain. D'Antoni is under contract to the Suns for $8.5 million over the next two seasons, but they clearly are at an impasse philosophically with him.

On to the that money...

The Bulls on the hook next season for $4 million of the $5 million guaranteed that Scott Skiles negotiated upon his firing—even though Skiles landed the Bucks' job...D'Antoni's best-case scenario—to engage the Bulls and Knicks, with whom he also interviewed, in a bidding war—won't happen, sources said. Beyond the fact the Knicks still consider Mark Jackson a strong candidate, the Bulls, if they get past other reservations, would pay D'Antoni only on their terms. They won't get into a protracted price war.

The Bulls ranked among the league's top spenders with Skiles' salary, so nobody can call them cheap. That said, candidates beyond D'Antoni likely could be hired for half his price.

I agree that none of this means the Bulls are cheap. KC says it's beyond money, which is plausible. Or just a smokescreen and I'm the typical naive United Center patron...but I'll play that part for now. D'Antoni isn't an infallible candidate, and there are certainly real reasons to be hesitant to lock him in at a huge figure. There's no salary cap or luxury tax for hiring coaches and the Bulls have the cash, but that doesn't mean they should overpay for a guy who they think they could then also fire a couple years before the contract's up.

But while we don't know what D'Antoni is asking for, it does bother me that the money owed Skiles (guess we did get an answer) is being referenced so often, implicitly indicating it as a stumbling block regardless of D'Antoni's pricetag.

That should be considered a sunk cost, and most of it can be allocated (unofficially) in last season's budget, when they were paying Boylan with spoonfuls of PCP-laced gruel (or the monetary equivalent).

The article says that the Bulls are negotiating on their own terms. Which is fine. But it should be in terms of them and D'Antoni. Not them, D'Antoni, and Skiles.

0 recs | Comment 219 comments

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hmmm...

I hope that first bit doesn’t mean that people will start making inane pithy comments just to get their count up…

by micah on May 8, 2008 12:51 AM CDT   0 recs

HAHA

Thats exactly what i was thinking…

im trying hard to become the next kirk hinrich, therefore im doing nothing more than being the next chris duhon.

by piccolomair on May 8, 2008 2:23 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

trust me

I look upon my ‘top ranking’ only with shame.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 8:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Why would you be ashamed

when you are in the same category as NBAobserver and Alec !

Speaking of people contributing too much or too few, what happened to one of the best contributors on blogabull, sbulls. Haven’t seen him/her? write anything in a long time. Did not even finish his evaluations of players if I’m not mistaken.

The Game chose him !

by Diabolo on May 8, 2008 8:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he changed his username

to scotter, and posts once in a while. I don’t know if he’s planning on doing evaluations for this past season. I may start begging if necessary.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 8:28 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Because

that would pith you off?

by Cannoli on May 8, 2008 9:16 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey matt...

very stupid question but, can you do that about other things as well…ie….other players…i guess it only works with the new blog system right, the key word feature?

im trying hard to become the next kirk hinrich, therefore im doing nothing more than being the next chris duhon.

by piccolomair on May 8, 2008 2:24 AM CDT   0 recs

It's just to count up comments

put in a thread URL and it spits out the ‘stats’.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 9:33 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

re micha's hope that people don't start making "inane pithy" comments just to get their count up.

Many will consider this post to be inane but micah’s comment indicates he is opposed to those that have substance and point: that are tersely cogent. (def of pithy). Inane is the opposite: lacking significance, unsubstantial, empty, He must be a politician, by taking both sides on the same issue.

Ok, I have nothing pithy to add except it gets my count up one more, but trying not to be inane or redundant, I second Matt’s hope that the Bulls don’t use their contract negotiation blunder with Skiles to keep the Bulls from getting the best coach available.

If you can't answer a man's arguments, all is not lost. You can still call him vile names.
Elbert Hubbard

by Tyrusmancrush on May 8, 2008 2:48 AM CDT   0 recs

You'd be pithier

if you used the reply button…

My Bulls may suck, but my Jayhawks are National Champs!

by wjb1492 on May 8, 2008 10:18 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I can't help but wonder

about Peter Vecsey’s assertion that Skiles really quit and wasn’t fired from the Bulls. It’s stuff like that that makes it harder to stomach reports of the money owed to Skiles.

That and the fact that the man has another job.

by ToroToroToro on May 8, 2008 4:24 AM CDT   0 recs

I agree

on the part about Skiles’ money should actually count towards this past season’s “budget” if there ever was such a thing. And if it really is of concern to the Bulls for next season and D’Antoni is the guy they really want then work his contract like they’ve done with players. backload it to offset the cost. A 4 year/$18mil deal would pay him as much as he’s making in PHX and you could have it pay out in a 2/6/5/5 manner and make next year’s total “coaching” output a combined $6mil.

by CubFan81 on May 8, 2008 7:09 AM CDT   0 recs

The Bulls have front-loaded contracts, not back-loaded them.

The Cubs, in saving TribCo and Zell money, have been the back-loaders.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 8:25 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yeah...

I knew that, I just didn’t convey it properly. What I meant it was that there’s no rule that says the contract has to be paid out in equal yearly amounts. They could get creative if the Skiles’ payout is that much of an obstacle to getting the guy they seem to want above all others.

by CubFan81 on May 8, 2008 12:49 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If D'Antoni plays hardball

Let him go to the Knicks. They’re reportedly showing lots of interest and $. D’Antoni must know that the Bulls have more promising personnel, contract situations, and a GM and owner that, while maybe accused of being cheap or having no balls by some, tries hard to make good decisions and does open up the checkbook once in a while. Sure the team was dysfunctional last year, but the Knicks are an absolute mess. If they’ll give him 5mil/year and that makes his decision for him, more power to him.

by T Maple on May 8, 2008 7:18 AM CDT   0 recs

Marc Stein's

Latest report:

NBA coaching sources told ESPN.com on Wednesday that the Knicks continue to regard D’Antoni as their No. 1 target to replace Isiah Thomas and are preparing a “staggering” financial offer they hope will prove too steep for Chicago to compete with, thus convincing D’Antoni to spurn the Bulls.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 8:27 AM CDT   0 recs

I wonder

if they would also give D’Antoni a GM title.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 8:44 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

A Tip to Make Deep Threads Load a Whole Lot Faster.

1. Click on your UserID at the top of the screen to access settings.
2. Click on “Edit Settings” towards the top right.
3. Go to the Default Comment Format that probably says “expanded”
4. Change it to “closed”
5. Click “Update” at the bottom of the menu to save your changes.

This way, when you open up a thread that has new comments, only the Subject and the “by-line” show up. To get the rest of the comment, you simply click on the bolded subject. (Note: you may click on the subject and sometimes nothing happens-this is because the user only typed something in the subject and not in the text box.)

This has significantly reduced loading time. For me, the 400+ comments in the last thread took about 1min30 sec the old way, but only around 15 secs. this way. Hope it helps.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 8:33 AM CDT   0 recs

I'll also try to not let the threads get that big

thanks for the tip, I did not adjust that setting myself. I also recommend turning off the avatars/pictures in comments.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 8:37 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

just turning off the avatars

made things load quickly for me. jpegs are page killers.

by KT on May 8, 2008 8:43 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I didn't find the avatars helpful at all.

I still show mine and I still load superfast. Try switching up, just for fun.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 8:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Could also just leave the giant thread open

and then open another instance of BaB to play around on the smaller threads?

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 8:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Just for fun, I let FasterFox time the load for me.

For the 447 comment, D’Antoni Signals thread, time to load:

Expanded comments, Avatar shown: 153.3 seconds
Expanded comments, No avatars shown: 109.7 seconds
Closed comments, Avatar shown: 15.8 seconds
Closed comments, No avatars shown: 15.2 seconds

Just FYI.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 8:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

lol

nice…though top-10 on this subject is not something i’m proud of. I won’t have too much more to say until this thing is over with

by NormVanBeer on May 8, 2008 8:42 AM CDT   0 recs

Ha! I plan on living and dying with each new rumor.

Though I gotta say I’m glad the Observer topped me. Matt, you get a free pass.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 8:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I would rather have

AVery Johnson. Forget D’antoni. Paxson seems to be going to slow. He’s not going to even try and interview Avery. D’antoni is ok but Avery Johnson is a better coach.

Bulls fan till death

by saalikjazz on May 8, 2008 9:16 AM CDT   0 recs

Stephen A Smith

will be next up on First Take to talk about the latest in the coach searches.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 10:11 AM CDT   0 recs

I've been waiting for someone who's the opposite of plugged into the Knicks and Bulls

to appear on a fifth rate sports talk show and discuss what he read on ESPN.com 5 minutes before the cameras rolled. Thanks!!!

by hscs on May 8, 2008 10:39 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Just trying to feed my addiction.

If it’s not yours, more power to you.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 10:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

it's a waste of time

Phoenix doesn’t want him, the Bulls can give D’Antoni a raise, the Knicks are wacky enough to pay Phil Jackson money, and everything else is crap from agents or totally fabricated. The only ‘update’ left is D’Antoni unofficially agreeing to terms with a team.

by hscs on May 8, 2008 10:58 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I know you'r right.

This whole thing is starting make me feel burned out and exhausted.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 11:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Maybe you need to spend some more time drinking with your daughter

We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan

by snley on May 8, 2008 11:02 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Y'know, some comments are funny.

Some are just nasty and mean-spirited.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 11:13 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I apologize, there was no intention of mean spiritedness

It was more the intended irony from combining others accusing you of drunk posting yesterday added with your occasional references to your daughter. Again, there was no intent of harm on my part. It was simply a bad attempt at a joke.

We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan

by snley on May 8, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Let your conscience be your guide.

I usually know when I’ve gone over the line, and I’ve gone over the line more than once here…and when I have, I’ve apologized to the people I offended.

I appreciate snley’s apology; I understand he didn’t mean his comments to be actually hurtful. Every blog has its own rules of etiquette. With a few notable exceptions (the big isms) your rules are very lax…more so, no doubt, than most of us assume in our personal lives. I recognize this is my issue and not yours. End.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 11:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you went over the line

when providing unprovoked information about your personal life.

Not quite ‘fair game’, but it wouldn’t even be possible if you didn’t leave the door open.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 12:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

this is worse

than when wallace was traded. there was so much anticipation, but it was only for a few hours. this has gone on for days now, with no signs of resolution.

by Jaina on May 8, 2008 11:05 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Screamin' A.

if anyone has not done so yet, watch these YouTubes.

some crazy Knicks ? fans heckle him remorselessly at the draft at MSG every year and video tape it. They actually catch him eating Cheese Doodles during commercial breaks and then licking his fingers. Screamin’ A.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvJGghOuFlQ

by Orlando Woolridge on May 8, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm really disappointed

in hscs’ performance, he used to be a prolific poster, not to mention an acerbic wit. And where is chgobr? Not on the list? That’s unacceptable, he needs to step up, too. ;-)

If there is one thing this offseason demands, it’s more batshit craziness! Let’s freak out, people!!!

2008 or bust.

by bullshooter on May 8, 2008 11:16 AM CDT   0 recs

the Bulls should have all the leverage here

1. better team
2. brighter future
3. D’Antoni’s first choice

there is no reason we should lose this “war” with the putrid Knicks.

the only thing that scares me is if Walsh starts telling him, “You know you wanna be here buddy. This is the place where LBJ will be playing” after next season (even though we all know he will be in Brooklyn with his mentor HOVA). If he chooses the Knicks because of the money, then, well, maybe we don’t want him in the first place.

by Orlando Woolridge on May 8, 2008 11:19 AM CDT   0 recs

i pretty much agree with this

i don’t expect the bulls to offer as much as the knicks may potentially offer. but it should be close enough that it should be no contest. if he just takes the money then well, nothing we can do about that. then he’s stuck with the knicks.

by Jaina on May 8, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Here’s where I disagree.

The Bulls should never lose out to another team based on money…especially in this case, where the money only counts against team revenue and not the salary cap.

Paying D’Antoni, if he indeed is your guy, an extra million a year will not hamper the Bulls team operations in the least. The Bulls had net revenue of over $160 million last year. Their operating income was the highest in the league. You mean to tell me they’re going to get outbid by the Knicks by a miniscule million dollars, and call it quits on D’Antoni?

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 11:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

then...

that’d be bat crap insane…

Step 1 - Hire a coach. Step 2 - ... Step 3 - Win.

by Lt.Dan on May 8, 2008 11:41 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

no...

that’d be the ten mil PLUS an ass grab and cat call…

Step 1 - Hire a coach. Step 2 - ... Step 3 - Win.

by Lt.Dan on May 8, 2008 11:43 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Don't forget about the backseat of an Escalade

We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan

by snley on May 8, 2008 11:44 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

would that be

part of the Benefits package?

Step 1 - Hire a coach. Step 2 - ... Step 3 - Win.

by Lt.Dan on May 8, 2008 11:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Anyone who says

“there’s nothing the Bulls can do about the money.” Because there is something the Bulls can do about the money: pay it.

If it’s 10 million?—100% outside the norm? Maybe you begin to question it at that point.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 11:44 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If somehow the Knicks put that price on the board

And Mike D was interested, I would let him walk, as Paxson no doubt would. He could maybe hire Avery for less (?), or just go cheap and hire Thibodeau and get a guy who meshes with his philosophy.

Rusty Longley v 2.0

by Ozzie Montana on May 8, 2008 11:49 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

"Avery for less"

As stated in KC’s article, Avery’s getting $12m from the Mavs, but he has an offset clause. So I don’t think he’s coming cheaply at all, and I wouldn’t blame him for sitting out a year. Coaches seem to get magically smarter when that happens.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 11:59 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

there's a fine line...

Paxson & Co. have to walk the line between being “stupid” (aka overpaying) and being cheap (aka losing him for a couple million). At what point does it become stupid to keep chasing this guy or to out-bid the knicks?

I’m not sure who, but one of these teams (Knicks or Bulls) will end up with a whole lotta egg on their face next season. Someone is gonna look like a genius for getting D’Antoni and someone is going to look like a fool for letting him walk (well, besides the Suns).

by NormVanBeer on May 8, 2008 11:59 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Skiles is getting 4.5 million per year from Milwaukee

How much more is D’Antoni worth? Not much, if anything at all.

by hscs on May 8, 2008 12:17 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What do you want to compare?

D’Antoni: 3 division championships, .608 winning percentage, .510 play-off winning percentage.

Skiles: 0 division championships (despite 5 seasons coaching in the east), .528 winning percentage, .429 play-off winning percentage.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 1:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

clearly the Suns were a better team

It’s tough to say they had a better coach. Skiles’ success isn’t directly tied to 3 very good players. He’s a little more proven, and a much safer investment than spending 4.5 million on a maybe post-15 minutes D’Antoni. I’d say they’re even.

by hscs on May 8, 2008 1:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

In their prime?

Amare is hardly in his prime and missed an entire season to boot. It’s arguable whether Nash was “in his prime.” Best production years, of course, but that’s an anomaly (in general) from 30-33. Unless you’re talking about Raja Bell.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 1:50 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

relative primes

Nash only had 3 good seasons under his belt, Amare went from merely very good to great, and Marion followed a more traditional rise in production. My point was they were already good, experienced players when D’Antoni took over. Skiles didn’t have that benefit when he started coaching in Chicago. There’s just more reasons to doubt D’Antoni’s coaching ability.

by hscs on May 8, 2008 2:01 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

and no, I really don't remember when a prime is

I don’t have access to Hollinger’s archives, but your MLB-esque estimation is probably too old for the average NBA player.

by hscs on May 8, 2008 2:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Then that puts Nash further out of the picture.

In which D’Antoni should be credited with “rejuvenating” his career or whatever.

Even then, 21-25, has never been thought of as a player’s prime age.

You have guys ranging in age from 21-30/25-33, and you claim D’Antoni had them all “in their prime” to raise the question of his coaching ability. As if to say, those three guys would have been that good, or having their career years, regardless of D’Antoni’s coaching. His three best players were aged nearly a decade apart. It’s hardly a good argument.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 2:17 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jim Hendry put the peak performance age at 29

for baseball players.

Dum spiro spero! (While there is life, there’s hope!)--Leon Trotsky

by alec on May 8, 2008 2:17 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jim Hendry's a fat moron.

who’s fat. And it’s a game with sticks and pants.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on May 8, 2008 2:22 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Jim Hendry's an idiot.

And it depends on what you’re talking about? Baseball, with its varying aspects has different peaks. Speed (or players who mostly rely on it) comes around age 24. Power and defense in the late 20’s. OBP in the early 30’s.

I wasn’t even speaking about MLB, but I’m glad Ryan was to pigeon hole my vague comment into that.

Most people’s athletic ability peaks in the early to mid 20’s and stays somewhat stable through the mid-20’s. However, it’s the “learning” that typically delays productivity.

by tyger1147 on May 8, 2008 2:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs