Sixers 103, Bulls 95: Not the worst game I've seen, but that's only because I'm a Bulls fan so I see a lot of garbage
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 2, 2008 11:13 PM CST
227 comments
blech.
The only reason the Bulls weren't blown out early was because the Sixers were trying to match their terribleness. Then while remaining close, it took the Bulls more Sixers awfulness to allow them to tie the game. And overtime was a whole separate steamy pile.
So much for whatever could've been built on from Sunday: the Bulls offense was completely discombobulated when the Sixers aggressively attacked them on the perimeter. Basically back to their 'my turn' offense, and with Derrick Rose joining in on the miscues (he was great when he shot the ball, but was not much else tonight) the team had no chance.
Drew Gooden really really thinks Drew Gooden is good. Heck, just ask him. Not only did he think he was good on Tuesday night, but he thought he was Amare Stoudamire. Just completely on his own trying to create plays from 22-feet inwards. Ben Gordon was not letting open looks come to him, and when not forcing shots in the lane (rarely did he take an open jumper) he was part of several missed handoffs on the perimeter.
So with those two not having good nights, and Rose having an uncharacteristically sloppy game, and Luol Deng going MIA in the second half, and the Philadelphia 76ers offense in general...just all sorts of bad. There's no excuse for this team to play like that. I do not accept this as some karmic retribution for 'stealing' one in Philly. That Philly team sucked, and the Bulls decided to match them.
The one bright spot was Tyrus Thomas, who had one of his best games of the year. Was instrumental in the final comeback, was not (well...a couple times) forcing things on offense. This was the Tyrus who once earned a spot in the rotation: the type of game where if you just leave him out there, good things will happen. And perhaps most importantly, it's now been several games since he produced a complete zero (through minutes yanking and bad play alike).
Vinny did some good and bad: I liked how he had Thomas as the first big off the bench and resisted going small. Not too much Hughes at the 3, Hunter at the 2, Noc at the 4, etc. I was trying to be clever and call out Vinny's sub pattern but missed repeatedly, which I consider a good sign. I thought he was a bit too aggressive in benching Rose late due to foul trouble, but it turned out to be necessary.
But man did he stink up overtime. (it even started out bad, why have Gooden take the tip and not Tyrus?) I realize this is the typical coachy' thing to do, but it was completely daft to ride the same lineup through the entire overtime just because they're the ones who got you there. Especially since it involved Andres Nocioni on Andre Iguodala. What's the sense in that? Even with the opportunity to switch out before the final Sixer possession in regulation, Noc remained in the game. Since Rose had been replaced by Hughes in that possession, Vinny wasn't averse to the concept completely, so he must think Nocioni is still even a passable defender. He actually hit a couple shots tonight, but on defense (and defensive rebounding, my god...) Noc is near toast. And just the way he's moving in general...if he isn't hurt he's at least worn out.
And I'll say the following with several caveats first (Deng's not having a good start to the season, I mentioned his disappearance in this game's 2nd half, he's not being paid like a franchise player but definitely like a very important player): isn't it significant that Vinny sat Luol Deng for the last 4.5 minutes of regulation and the entire overtime? I know with a mismatched roster that some rotation decisions are always going to be head-scratchers (Noah starting but always on the fast-track to the doghouse, for one). But benching Luol for the worst defender on the roster (and one who's gassed) shouldn't be one. I'll be curious to see if this is made out to be a big deal.
That last rant on Vinny wasn't meant to read that significant. It's his first overtime, he stunk it up, his team made him look worse by running no real offense. The more important time of this game was the 48 minutes of crap beforehand.
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Man...TT must have had a great 1st half
cuz I olnly caught the end of the 3rd and beg. of the 4th. What i saw was the same player that cant finish plays, (layups!), does dumb travels and chargings…anyways, enuff bashing (I own a TT shirt jersey, so I have a great degree of hope)…my question is: Is his hands small? (pause) Seriously…they are times when he tries to dunk and the ball falls out of his hands. I think he has small hands. Anybody wanna get a measuring tape?
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 2, 2008 11:23 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Ah....
That’s the Tyson Chandler syndrome…
The only cure is learning how to play with a great point guard.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:29 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Quick! Trade Tyrus for P.J. Brown!
Thabo Sefolosha: His last name sounds like a disease, and his ballgame IS one.
by chibullsfan03 on Dec 2, 2008 11:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Don't forget...
If your going to get PJ Brown, then you should also get a tall, sweet shooting young two guard that we can send to Denver for nothing….
(not that JR Smith is great, just that he’s better than nothing)
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
two second rounders
you needed those to trade up for Thabo. And, er…Omer Asik (I forget the other transaction).
J.R. is pretty much nothing still. He just told the press him and Karl need to talk more.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 2, 2008 11:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah...
But then again, Thabo isn’t on my list of great players right now… and obviously the verdict hasn’t come in on Omer…
In fact, not that it’s Thabo’s fault, but I remember reports that John Paxon liked Thabo so much, that he decided against drafting Brandon Roy at #2 and decided to take Tyrus instead, thinking that Thabo, paired with Gordon, would be a perfect solution at the 2.
I would rather have Brandon Roy than Tyrus, Thabo, and Gordon right now.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If we got Brandon Roy, no Derrick Rose.
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 2, 2008 11:48 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
yeah...
that makes sense… and I would rather have Rose…
But, I really wanted Paxon to take Roy in that draft, and was very against him taking anybody else…
So, Roy is definitely the one that got away for me…
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
No one was even thinking of drafting Roy at #2
It was Aldridge or Thomas.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 2, 2008 11:53 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There were plenty of people....
That thought a tall shooting guard who played both sides of the ball well and had the most solid game in the draft was worth the #2 pick.
It would have been a blow to Ben Gordon’s ego, but he ended up coming off the bench anyhow.
And we did need a PF, but to me, Roy was the best player available, and he did fit a need.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:57 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We didn't really need a PF.
We had Chandler…who was a natural PF before being converted to Center…
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 3, 2008 12:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno, maybe I'm lost
But didn’t the Bulls have this “inside scoring” need since 2006? No Curry, Sweets wasn’t panning out, and Chandler was showing that his true potential was a rebounding/defensive guy who could get 8-10 points off of putbacks. Aldridge and Thomas both had the potential to solve the inside scoring need, while Roy was a great college player I don’t think anyone was too pissed with the Hinrich/Gordon/Duhon trio at that point.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 12:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe we should invest in a good
offensive coach…ala Pat Ewing. He did wonders for Yao (until he left) and Howard..imagine what he could do for gray (?)
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 3, 2008 12:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
oooooOOOooo
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 3, 2008 1:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
great!
wait, he’s not a coach?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:34 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I've been saying
that on this site for months now . Ewing in the Berto center would do wonders for our big men. How could Tyrus/Noah NOT listen to the man?
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Dec 3, 2008 9:55 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought though
too that ROy had ankle injury concerns and injury concerns in general all over him draft night and that’s why he slipped a bit.
I also know remember from the online reports that Roy was at least in a later discussion as the Bulls pick—and I don’t have a link, but remember seeing him on the draft pick boards and the verbage around them at least a few weeks before the draft….
At the time I thought that was crazy with LMA and Tyrus Thomas….especially after Tyrus was awesome in that tournament.
Who knows though, I still have a glimmer of T2 hope.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 8:07 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The call for Roy was tiny...
Just as many people thought we should draft Adam Morrison. Where are those people at?
In the draft, some work out and some don’t. The only real decision was Tyrus or LMA.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I for one
Bought into that Morrison hype….I don’t tend to watch too much college ball at all, and I just bought into the talk that he would be an elite scorer, though poor defender…
I thought perhaps having another scorer with what at the time was nice D in Wallace, Chandler, etc would have been nice instead of getting another offensive liability.
I was more for Tyrus at the time, but if Tyrus was gone I thought perhaps Morrison wouldn’t be a bad option.
I did think LMA took too many nights off in college (he’s a guy I watched a few times and I thought that was a concern when he wasn’t being paid)…..and I bought into the Kirk-Ben guard lineup a bit too much like the rest of Chicago.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 12:08 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
“I was more for Tyrus at the time, but if Tyrus was gone I thought perhaps Morrison wouldn’t be a bad option.”
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The honesty is appreciated
While we’re at it….
I thought the Bulls were dumb for passing on Beasley.
Not that I was unhappy with Rose, just thought a scoring big was very important to this team.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
A scoring big is still imortant to the team...
We just couldn’t pass on a rare talent like Rose.
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 2:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I know but it's not like Beasley wasn't a talent too.
I said if I was an expansion team and had nothing I would take Rose. But this team could potentially make a big leap with an elite scoring big. Hindsight at 20/20, I didn’t see a Hinrich injury, Deng/others regression etc. that showed this team needed a lot more work than anticipated.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 4:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I was all for Rose
But I was nervous after the less than impressive summer league.
I’m totally fine with Rose making me look like a dipshit though :)
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 2:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
JR is still a scorer.
He basically puts up Ben Gordon like numbers per minute…of course he is a head case who doesn’t talk to his coach, so he is not a Pax type guy.
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 2, 2008 11:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
But JR did that on a team that featured 2 other real big time scorers and at least some inside presence….
You can’t compare those stats, but JR on a team without any offensive strengths (Bulls last year) and I would bet his numbers would be far worse than Gordons…
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 8:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Those are career numbers, not just last season.
Because last season JR Smith was a better shooter and scorer…
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 3, 2008 8:51 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Again
JR Smith has played much of his time with 2 all league scorers…
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If JR Smith was so great
why did not one offer him a contract? He was a restricted free agent and the Nuggets were desperate to unload salaries. Any reasonable offer would have caused them to pull back. Instead they got him pretty cheap (3/16.5mm).
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
well that's not entirely fair
because of restricted free agency. I mean Ben Gordon didn’t…(recognizes who he’s replying to)…nevermind.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 12:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
plus
i think that deal is pretty fair for JR.. maybe a little more… but ben is worth more than JR also, and i’m not a huge ben fan.
by Jaina on Dec 3, 2008 12:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Based on JR's numbers and age
He deserved way more. Something around Noc’s contract.
It’s only a fair deal because it’s a compromise of his talent vs. behavior. It’s only 3 years for a reason.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 1:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Big difference
Gordon signed the 1 yr tender. Bulls offered him 6/55 or whatever. No one offered Smith a contract. He settled for 3 years and 38.5 million less than Gordon’s turned down contract.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 1:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think your right
Besides. Does any GM want to be the guy that has to say “I got outbid for JR Smith”?
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
I’m happy we traded JR Smith and that he’s not on our team (he just constantly has issues with coaches, and while I could see that a bit with George Karl, I haven’t heard as much with Byron Scott—other than Jason Kidd didn’t like Scott—not anything new there with Kidd either)….
But JR Smith had a lot more value than the garbage we got for him, and then the release of that garbage to lock in and dramatically overpay for the absolute shite that was Adrian Griffin….
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 8:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but so what
really, that’s down my list of Pax mistakes. If he could’ve gotten more for Smith, he would’ve. Apparently that was pretty close to his value.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think Pax tried very hard to get value for Smith
he dumped him almost as soon as he got him. He didn’t want him… at all.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 3, 2008 10:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
that's true
and the urgency was because they had to get under the cap to sign A-Drain.
Yeah, it was bad. I would’ve preferred waiting until training camp at least, but I get why he wanted no part of Smith.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
if he wanted no part of Smith, then why trade for him?
I just never understood that series of deals and still don’t. Tyson Chandler for a year rental of P.J. Brown… just doesn’t make any sense. Especially because he failed to use P.J.‘s expiring contract to make any trade to make the team better (which would have made the trade justifiable because then it would have been essentially Tyson’s roster spot and cash for someone good coming back in the deal for P.J’s expiring). Pax needs to go, period.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 3, 2008 10:39 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
they were dumping Chandler to stay under the tax
there, solved it :-)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:40 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agreed at the time that paying both Tyson and Wallace so much made little sense
given their similarities, but that was under the assumption that Wallace wouldn’t be toast a year into his tenure. That fact mucked up a lot of future planning, not just how Chandler was handled.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:42 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
There were
Other guys to dump than a 25 year old who proved he could do some things right.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe at that immediate second
But Pax could have forced the hand to play him a bit, drove his value way up and gotten something for him….it only would have taken till the deadline.
We were pretty excited about JR’s upside as a big man to offset with Gordon when Gordon needed some air. Thabo you could tell by preseason wasn’t quite ready for a major role just yet. The org could have been honest with Thabo and told him it was temporary to get his footing….
That move is very high on my list of Pax mistakes (that and the PJ Brown move of getting a nice expiring contract and then not trading that contract when PJ bitched about his role early and played like crap for us….he had value too as an expring contract and we had need with him going away, Sweets not working out, Wallace slowing (even though it was a bit, we knew he was slowing) and Tyrus looking a ways away from being consistent…..
That was a shame….
That double move is my #1 Pax mistake, since the Wallace signing both wasn’t seen to go so bad so quickly at the time and was virtually saved by the Gooden/Hughes trade that Pax pulled out of his ass.
I know we missed on Brandon Roy and LMA, and that’s frustrating, but Tyrus still has some upside potential, so who knows….
I also know that the inability to make a trade is there (That’s probably #1 but that stems with the PJ Brown trade too)…
I don’t fault the Hinrich signing, since at the time that was a steal, and Kirk would have been a nice starting PG especially in the next few years when it declines, had we not lucked out with Derrick Rose.
The Nocioni signing…it’s too high for a bench player, but Noc is better than he’s played the past 5-6 games and while it’s ridiculous for a team with needs at the 4-5 spot that were apparent back then to pay for a luxury….we were on the up when we signed him, and it didn’t look bad.
If Luol doesn’t get back to his form and if Ben goes, that will quickly be the #1 blunder….and I’ve always said my point that Ben was more valuable to us. Luol has a lot of the tools, and stats in the past, but Ben has been our threat in the past when in tough situations and has been the closest to a leader pre Rose….had we had inside presence BG would look even better….and that’s not new to my view based on these 18 games or so this year….I’ve said that in the past. Of course it sounds easier to gloat when Luol’s having his worst career stretch, and that’s not my intention, I just think we should have made a case to keep Ben as his scoring punch is a bit more of a need on an offensive starved group than an at beast 9th-11th SF in the league who wouldn’t ever get past that spot with newer guys quickly getting better than him (Deng’s not there yet, but he’ll be back to form at some point).
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:46 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i actually think his problem
is he needs one more dribble before jumping. he jumps from pretty far then loses it…
by Jaina on Dec 3, 2008 7:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
good news guys
I sacrificed BigWay after scanning the game thread. So…I don’t know, good fortunes for all and all that.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 2, 2008 11:26 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
The Gods tell me you have to sacrifice something good to be rewarded.
De gustibus non est disputandum
by Sports2 on Dec 3, 2008 8:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well, I'm pretty screwed if that's true.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure he's perfecting his anti BG rhetoric in front of a mirror now
Getting a tattoo of Jerry Sloan on his chest.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 1:51 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
hmm....
Are you happy with the season?
We are 8-10….nobody predicted we would have 8 wins after the road trip.
I guess we’re not that bad. I can see us string a couple of wins together
But yeah, this team mentally, aside from Rose, is extremely fragile and weak. Gordon and Nocionis going back to their chucking. It drove me insane.
If I was Rose I’d literally lose my mind already
by Half-Life on Dec 2, 2008 11:27 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I am.
I’m actually really happy with this season. The only thing that really mattered was that Rose developed, and clearly, he is ahead of schedule.
Plus, this is the most fun I’ve had watching the Bulls in a decade. Again, just because of Rose.
And yeah, our record is better than I thought, and I can only assume that Deng and Thomas, in particular, will get better at playing with Rose, so I see us as a team on the rise. Plus, we get Kirk back, who, at the very least, is somebody better than Hughes to come off the bench.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Totally agree,
this season has gone better than expected and Rose has been incredible, but now that we know he’s good it would be nice to see some sort of nucleus begin to form around him. Maybe BG, but he’s probably gone. Other than that it’s kinda scary how our roster is beginning to shape up.
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 2, 2008 11:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not happy with the season
I’m even less happy with people saying they’re happy.
I’m happy they’ve won enough to stay around .500. I’m not content with it though, this team looks too bad too often. And I get that they’re young and Vinny got the coaching job due to an essay contest, but that doesn’t mean I can’t point out when it stinks.
I’m not unhappy either, just don’t get the feelings out there that this is ok. There’s some real problems with the team.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 2, 2008 11:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's the weird part.
Their record is actually pretty good. Not that 8-10 is good, but they’ve played the leagues toughest schedule and they’ve had no “bad losses” (I pretend like Portland never happened). But watching them, there isn’t much to be excited about other than Rose. None of the players are developing and you get the sense they’re just running in place. No one seems to even be improving.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
im with you (kinda)
I have a nightmare that Rose is gonna get so accustomed to “shooting first” that his passing skills wont grow with him…..
btw…(left field) I just realized that the only PG that has some skills like Rose is (GASP!) —> Marbury
***shudders***
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 2, 2008 11:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good eye Belize!
I was just going to point that out. This kid isnt developing into a pass first pg like CP3 or DWILL he’s going right down the same road as Marbury. I totally blame Paxson for not at least trying to put the right people around him.
Ill wait and see the final results (hoping he doesnt) but it doesnt look good right now. This kid leads our team in scoring for the season and dam near every night. Not to mention i notice he’s more prone to pull up now instead of attack the basket. Bad sign if he falls in love with that questionable J. Maybe though it was all due to circumstances. well see
BTW does anyone here think VDN knows about back pick lobs? My gosh..
Deng sucks! We got reemed on that deal!
VDN Rode Noc and the final 5 way to long (mostly Noc).
I was actually hoping he would bring the artist formally known as deng back in during overtime.
by Bulls4Ever on Dec 3, 2008 9:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i don't like marbury
so i don’t mean to really defend him, but the guy is a near 20 ppg and 8 apg for his career (16 and 8 as a rookie). you can’t really say he doesn’t pass. all his numbers really declined the past several years anyway. rose is about at 19 and 6 right now. i don’t think rose won’t improve on his passing game, considering how hard he likes to work.
i certainly don’t want to see rose turning out like steph in terms of attitude, but that’s nothing to sneeze at. there’s a certain style that marbury plays with that’s offputting, and i don’t think rose will do that, but we’ll see i guess. i get the impression the guy knows when he needs to score and when he needs to dish. in the second championship at simeon didn’t he score only 2 pts or something?
by Jaina on Dec 3, 2008 9:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
Marbury’s issues typically don’t stem from his play, they are from his leadership abilities….and his wanting to always be the man. Derrick already has the respect and leadership qualities his veteran players love.
End of story, plus Derrick doesn’t seem as unreasonably nuts as Marbury or have as much ego (not gloating on that sick crossover on Miller for one when prodded to do just that by the media, that’s a great sign).
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Marbury was an arrogant jerk
at his press conference announcing he was going to play at Georgia Tech (yeah, the generic hat over the GT hat stunt annoyed me greatly).
by Granny Waiters on Dec 5, 2008 2:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Steve Levy of ESPN snuck in a little commentary on Marbury the other night
He was doing the “Marbury from draft to now” rundown and slipped in this gem.
“Marbury was traded on draft night by the Bucks to the Timberwolves for the rights to Ray Allen. What did the Bucks know?”
Marbury was well known to be a terrific individual player, but never really did much with a team. He’s like the Skiles of players. He gets traded. The team he leaves gets better. The team receiving him gets better early, but then trails off into mediocrity. Skiles is a coach that can get fired for cheap. Marbury has the golden parachute that’s impossible to take away.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 10:57 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Disagree
I disagree, Rose can pass and score. But he’s scoring right now because he CAN score, whenever he wants pretty much. If you have THAT type of talent, why would you not use it when the game is on the line??
The players around him are not adjusting, they’re still stuck in the mentality of the past. They’re not used to playing with a superstar and doing their roles, that’s why everything is not falling in place right now.
Rose wants to help the team win more than anyone, so don’t say he’s another Marbury, he’s on another level. Rose is a team player, more than Gordon or Hughes or Hinrich ever will be, you can bet on that.
He just have that next level confidence when it comes to scoring.
by Half-Life on Dec 3, 2008 1:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Marbury is an amazing basketball player with an infuriating attitude
His off the court issues are what keeps him in basketball limbo. He’s selfish and only cares about his stats…..does that sound like Derrick Rose to you?
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 1:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay... you can point out when it stinks....
And you always do…
And often, your not wrong.
If I expected everybody to stink, and instead, I get to watch a Rookie play brilliantly, and the team win a few games…
What’s the problem with me being pleasantly surprised?
I’m even less happy with people saying they’re happy.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the problem is that everyone besides Rose and Gordon
are having bad seasons. Maybe Drew Gooden and Larry Hughes too (relative to expectations), but they’re not long-term answers anyway. It’s very frustrating.
Also I feel betrayed by Vinny after his ‘campaign’ after getting the job….which makes the rookie-coach mistakes less acceptable.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh....
I don’t deny that everybody else is having a bad season…. I’m just not terribly surprised.
Deng is the most frustrating… but I really think he just needs to learn to play with Rose, which means he will get better.
Tyrus is disappointing, but I tempered my TT expectations a long time ago.
Noah is frustrating, because he is worse that last year, and a large part of it is him not being in shape… but I wasn’t exactly expecting Noah to carry us to the playoffs.
Basically, I think our win-loss record is good considering how poorly everybody is playing. So, then, my assumption is when Deng learns to play with Rose, and Noah gets in shape, and somebody convinces Tyrus to stay close to the basket…. We will be better than we are now.
And better than we are now, might get us into the playoffs, which will be good experience for Rose, and good for the teams reputation with two big years of free agency coming up.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 1:41 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That's the point, kid.
Some of us had higher expectations for Deng, Thomas and Noah than others w/ (probably) lower expectations for Rose. In the end, it probably evens out to about a .500 record.
You probably similarly didn’t think Rose would be this good. However, you also didn’t think Thomas nor Noah would be that good (relative to what others thought). Thus, your overall total performance of the team is probably being outplayed.
For me, I’d rather have Rose outperforming my expectations while having Thomas and Noah and Deng performing to our expectations. What makes this situation disappointing is that, while the team, overall, is about as good as expected, w/ Rose’s surprises, if everyone else were doing as well as I thought, this team would be, right now, built for a championship… just needing a few years to get there.
Viva la nuance! Reading comprehension rules!!!
by tyger1147 on Dec 3, 2008 2:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I totally agree
VDN lied right to our faces. That bs about TT JONO THABO getting good burn and developing our guys was BS. He’s got rookie coach fever and wants to try and win every single game and lost sight of what was important… Developing our guys.. So now we’re stuck with guys like Gooden and Hughes and ACk Vets playing major min so we can try and WIN NOW. Id rather we loose every dam game this season if i meant TT JONO ROSE and THABO would become better ballers…
by Bulls4Ever on Dec 3, 2008 4:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I think it's just an attitude thing.
A way to keep hope alive and stay positive while still acknowledging the problems. To the extent anyone thinks we’re completely on the right track, they’re wrong, obviously. “Sky is falling” types, though, who are always doom and gloom, are off base too, though.
Honest criticism isn’t doom-and-gloom, but neither is positivity naivete. They’re just different lenses through which different people experience our current mix of good and bad.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:13 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
thrilled with rose...
…disappointed with the rest, but overall, I think there is a sliver of hope. i think we will make the playoffs, but we are far from contending, obviously.
by bullsfaninbigapple on Dec 3, 2008 9:19 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I predicted between 41-45 wins.
I think just about everyone thought this might be a .500 team but then “took off” a couple of wins because they got burned by the Bulls the year before.
This team should definitely be a .500 team.
Viva la nuance! Reading comprehension rules!!!
by tyger1147 on Dec 3, 2008 10:05 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
why was rose so lazy in OT?
Baller since 1984
by Capo on Dec 2, 2008 11:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
lazy?
maybe passive.
It seemed to me that he was not getting the ball enough, and after the first couple bad possessions they just decided they collectively had to force up anything.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 2, 2008 11:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What you mean
Drew Gooden shouldn’t be shooting corner 3s in overtime?
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He was wide open!
And Rose was crashing the boards.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
We should have a running post for worst play of the year.
And people can nominate their favorites.
My favorite this year was Tyrus’ attempt at an alley oop to Ben Gordon. And the subsequent footage of Del Harris and Bernie Bickerstaff’s faces from the bench.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 2:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
the was also Rose's alley-oop to Gray
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 2:10 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
also gotta nominate
tyrus’s bullet pass over the head of noah, and then tyrus acting like noah should have caught it.
by Jaina on Dec 3, 2008 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He look like he got banged up a bit
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 2, 2008 11:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
5 fouls
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:02 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Good point.
He was a different player when he picked up his fifth.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 6:32 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
and man did we need him to stay in the game. I was impressed at Rose being able to cognizantly avoid that 6th foul even if it led to Andre Miller going off in OT. We need better help D, though I saw Ty come over a few times to help out. The best game I’ve seen from Ty in a while, not the best box score, but it looked like he knowingly tried to avoid forcing anything.
by messwiththebull on Dec 3, 2008 7:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Foul trouble
maybe?
"The Zen philosopher Basho once wrote: 'A flute with no holes is not a flute, And a doughnut with no hole is a Danish.' He was a funny guy."
by Ugh It Live! on Dec 3, 2008 10:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have to say
that the title of this recap is very true.
Thabo Sefolosha: His last name sounds like a disease, and his ballgame IS one.
by chibullsfan03 on Dec 2, 2008 11:33 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
BTW....
Right after the draft, I started a long and arduous argument with Your Friendly BullsBlogger about the pro’s and con’s of starting Derrick Rose from the beginning of the season…
I was Con.
I was wrong.
Kudos to Matt.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:37 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Outside of Oden (who was hurt)
When was the last time a team sat the #1 pick on the bench?
Starting Rose on this team of jokers was/is a no-brainer.
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:05 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Sure... it looks that way now.
I wasn’t alone in that thinking, so clearly, it wasn’t a crazy sounding then as it is now…
But the idea was that Rose only had a year of college, was playing the hardest position to adjust to the NBA, and was playing with Kirk Hinrich, who we were hoping to trade at the deadline…
Basically, Kirk starts, but he and Rose play about equal minutes… and Kirk’s value stays high, and Rose gets to adjust to the NBA by playing heavy minutes against the other teams reserve point guards.
And, this was just to start the season, as soon as Rose looked like our best point, he would start.
This is pretty much what the coaching staff said the would do with Rose too, it’s just that he is way better than anybody expected him to be this early in the season.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 12:19 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The worst part about Kirk getting hurt...
Is that now we don’t have a decent backup for Rose. As much as I think Pax has screwed the pooch with our roster I have to think he knew Rose was going to be our best player immediately.
Maybe that’s giving Pax too much credit, but Rose is on another level from every player on our roster, that had to be obvious even in his workouts before the draft. I thought so just watching him play at Memphis, but maybe that was foolish.
If they said they were going to start Kirk (which I honestly don’t remember) that could have also been a play to trade him. Who really knows? I’m just glad we finally have a franchise player worth holding onto.
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
I love watching Rose play… and every time he is on the bench, I find myself cursing Gordon (dribble off the foot) Hughes ( terrible shot selection) or Thabo (terrible this season)…. and I can’t wait till he’s back in.
But, he is playing a lot, and he played hard in the final four, and he worked hard this summer with draft workouts and then the Olympic Reserve team… and he already had the tendinitis problem, and his style lends to some abuse in the paint (like Wade)
Basically, I’m terrified of him getting injured, or wearing out. Kirk is not as good as Rose, but I would love to have him healthy right now, cause he is a better point guard than anybody else on the roster.
Oh, and management didn’t come out and say they wouldn’t start Rose, but they were definitely tempering expectations, and they said, they would work him in slowly, or something like that… and I took that to mean they were planning to start Hinrich…
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 12:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm much less concerned about Rose getting hurt ala Wade
he’s more compact than Wade and looks much sturdier. He’s also not nearly as reckless as Wade. They both drive hard to the hoop and Derrick absorbs a lot of contact, but his body control is so great that he doesn’t absorb contact with the floor very often. Wade has a knack for hitting the floor (like Iverson) after he gets hit and that’s where I think a lot of his injury problems come from. Derrick, on the other hand, usually lands on his feet.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 3, 2008 10:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Wade's biggest
Injury was a freak collision near the FT line with Battier….that slowed him significantly the past 1.5 years….
Anyone else could have had that happen.
Wade’s built like a tank, so I’m not sure I follow the sturdier D. Rose comment….
But Wade does take risks and fly into the lane to get as much contact as he can so he can get to the line….
It’s what makes him great, but also why he might not have more than 5-6 years…
I hope not though as I love D. Wade.
I don’t think thought the 2 are comparable, as Rose is a better ball handler and passer (though Wade’s always been an underrated passer) but Wade is the better defender when he’s focusing on D (and likely always will be, though who knows, not a knock on Derrick, Wade’s just awesome)….but overall in a few years the two can be in a similar stratosphere as Derrick’s less TO prone and more apt to run an offense and that can negate Wade’s flashy strengths.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:54 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, Wade is built like a tank
I guess I got a little caught up in the Rose hype in terms of him being sturdier. I guess he just seems stronger because of his (in my view) superior body control, which requires tremendous strength. The freak injury thing with Wade is true, but he has been knicked and banged up a lot on smaller things because of his recklessness. Also, Wade’s defense is really good this year, but it probably looks a little better than it actually is based on his stat lines. He blocks shots incredibly well for a guard and he’s good at playing the passing lanes, but his man to man D has never been elite. On the whole, he’s a pretty good defender, but not great (the arguments for him as DPOY on ESPN.com are ridiculous).
Also,in the interest of full disclosure, Wade has been my favorite player since he entered the league and I was heartbroken when the Heat snatched him up on draft day and we got stuck with Kirk.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 3, 2008 11:04 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Rose is a cat. Wade is Squirrel.
Rose lands on his feet. Wade is all sorts of out of control. If he takes the hits and lands on his feet the impact is lessened.
Maybe Rose has studied Aikido.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I actually think Kirk looks expendable now
I want Rose playing 35+ MPG right now. I want his backup to play no more than a dozen or so minutes to spell him. I think the guard rotation in terms of MPG allocation is fine right now though I’m not thrilled that it leaves Thabo out in the cold, which is what I feared would happen and one reason I advocated having him start for the first half of the first quarter because otherwise he’d see little to no floor time.
I think the guard rotation is fine with three guards logging heavy minutes, and the fourth to spell Rose or competently fill in if he’s in foul trouble. I don’t want another guard in the rotation who needs 25-30 MPG right now.
by messwiththebull on Dec 3, 2008 7:31 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
my new signature
sums up the overtime pretty well, i think
"Gooden for three..." *spit-take* WAIT...Did tha- did he really...
by chibullsfan03 on Dec 2, 2008 11:40 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
I almost threw my laptop into the ground...
I mean… Really?
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:05 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not just a three from the corner,
a three from the corner in overtime.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 6:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
While I agree that Drew Gooden did not have one of his better nights,
I didn’t see how he was “completely out on his own”. Other than that horrific shot in overtime, he looked the same as he has all year only this time his shot wasn’t falling. Plus, he only took five shots, it’s not like he was jackin’ em up out there.
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 2, 2008 11:45 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
I agree.
I didn’t think he played well, but, again, other than the terrible shot in overtime…
If I were Drew Gooden, I would be trying to do some things too.
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
his free-throws were a bonus to help get that lead down
so we could get to OT
he was attacking the last few minutes of regulation
"Gooden for three..." *spit-take* WAIT...Did tha- did he really...
by chibullsfan03 on Dec 2, 2008 11:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He was ok
Didn’t do much offensively, Brand kind of had his way but that was expected, only this time Drew didn’t match the output. I liked how he drew some fouls in the 2nd half, but that shot in OT just rankles me.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 2, 2008 11:47 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
I actually thought he did play pretty well, despite not making a shot. He wasn’t chucking, and he was attacking the rim and helping the flow (passing it out when he didn’t have anything). His rebound totals weren’t gaudy, but he always seemed to be around the ball, tipping and fighting (and often having no help by other white jerseys). We knew Brand was going to destroy him in any one-on-one (Tyrus was actually our best on-ball defender of Brand, go figure).
Until that last shot.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:18 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well, somewhat agree
I rarely think Gooden plays under control. But he did so in the last game. I don’t mind the jumpers if they’re assisted….he was trying to dribble his way into shots.
He also had 6 TOs
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:40 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not happy about this team's play...but satisfied with their record if that makes sense
Yes, record wise the Bulls are right there, and if they play at this rate they could sneak into the playoffs. Rose has been just spectacular, everything I ever hoped for in a #1 pick.
Rose looked bad passing-wise, though how many times do we have to be subjected to Tyrus having a clear path to the basket and taking a jumper that he won’t make 70% of the time? When he rolls to the basket, he gets fouled or gets a close shot. If he misses it, whatever it’s still a good possession.
And I really hope someone on the coaching staff gets together with Rose and teaches him how to not be caught so blind with that stupid pump-fake that Andre Miller and Sam Cassell love to pull. It’s such a crappy way to draw a foul, and Miller got 5 easy points in the 4th by executing that move on Rose.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 2, 2008 11:46 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
yes, that's how I feel too
their record is around what I could’ve hoped for.
But now that we know Derrick Rose is incredible, the stakes have been raised, no?
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:41 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't understand why Nocioni continues to get playing time.
He has been playing bad…on both sides of the ball…Thabo should be getting all of Noc’s minutes at this point.
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 2, 2008 11:47 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
No comment.
Except, in this case, that was a comment.
I do wish Noce would get thrown into VDN’s doghouse. Might wake him up too. At the very least, we can play Thabo. (wink, wink)
by PatBull on Dec 2, 2008 11:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The sad thing is....
It doesn’t look like Noc is sleeping out there…
It looks like he lost a step or two… you don’t wake up from that. He used to drive and finish, and hustle on D, and get to loose balls….
Now he drives and gets blocked, doesn’t help in time on D, and falls on the floor as the other team scoops up loose balls….
by kidronmusic on Dec 2, 2008 11:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Damn it.
You know what, I never really thought of it that way but you just made a lot of sense. He’s maybe…29? Coupled with the plantar fascitis, the odd bumps and bruises, the way he plays.
DAMN! Maybe he has lost a step or two or three.
Now I’m really sad. Now we really have to trade him away.
by PatBull on Dec 3, 2008 12:09 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It is sad.
Nocioni isn’t really a fundamentals player, he is a hustle player. And he wasn’t that athletic to begin with, so him losing a step really effects his game.
I think he still has some value in the league… and we should cash him in for the best offer.
I don’t think he will be any good at all in 2011, so if his contract at all inhibits our ability to sign quality free agents, he will become incredibly unpopular.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 12:24 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
The contract can't be much worse than Jason Kapono
maybe we can do a “who gets traded first” gambit.
I hope we don’t have to “Kenny Thomas” Noc.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:02 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
THIS IS WHY HIS CONTRACT HIS SO BAD!!!
And despite all the mongoloids clamoring it was great (not you, just others in general), yourfriendlyBullsBlogger said it was idiotic for its length.
It was just a bad, bad signing. And why he must be traded first.
Viva la nuance! Reading comprehension rules!!!
by tyger1147 on Dec 3, 2008 10:12 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
remember that the flopping rules changed
and have affected his defensive presence since
by gman2849 on Dec 3, 2008 1:12 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah. Still gets a few from time to time...
but not like his first two years.
by PatBull on Dec 3, 2008 1:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's not like he isn't flopping anymore....
He didn’t change his game to adhere to that rule, and he isn’t getting called for flopping too much, so, I don’t think this is the problem…
I wish it was.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 2:05 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Or just play Deng more minutes, hell even Hughes
Noc has really fallen off after starting the season on fire from the arc. I don’t see any reason to play him unless they are in control of a game or serious foul trouble.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 2, 2008 11:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I find myself saying this
but Noce does spread the floor and it does give Rose more room to operate. Thabo doesn’t provide that spacing. I know, it’s the standard line we keep hearing and I hate to use it but the bottom line is that Noce is a bigger threat on the court with Rose than Thabo has even remotely shown he can be.
Deng was getting lit up by AI2 last night and he didn’t have it on the offensive end. I can see why VDN would have sat him with the game on the line.
by messwiththebull on Dec 3, 2008 7:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Iguodala was certainly rolling against Deng
but I thought he was still sticking with him pretty well. With Noc, it’s a blow-by. The Bulls were fortunate to draw a couple charges under the basket with the help defender.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:43 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I might be the only one,
but I liked Noc defense yesterday. At first, I couldn’t believe what VDN was doing because he seems to have adopted Noc as his defensive stopper (I don’t know if anyone else has noticed this). But anyways, he did a good job on Iguodala. Noc was very aggressive and seemed to be funneling AI2 in various directions based on where the help D was. I don’t know if that was coincidence but it worked fairly well including the last shot of regulation, where he and Hughes for AI2 to pass out to Miller.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:16 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did we really want to funnel
Iguodala to the middle of the paint?
This has never been good defense.
Wait, we did have that mysterious wet spot by the dotted circle. Maybe that was the plan.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:29 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
ha!
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 1:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
aren’t you supposed to be funneling to the help?
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 2:06 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Well yeah
But not in the middle of the paint. It’s 5 access points out of the trap.
1) Shoot
2) Drop off to your 5
3) Drop off to our 4
4) kick to your 3
5) kick to your 2
technically there is 6 points out if you count getting hacked.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 2:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that Noc is able to create more
space for Rose since he is a viable 3 point threat, but all his positive attributes are being severely weighed down by his concrete feet on defense and those horrible dribble drives that either end up with an elbow-chop for an offensive foul, or a wild, flailing attempt at a layup. He needs his numbers severely cut until he proves that he can improve on those aspects.
"Derrick Rose is like a $500,000 Maybach parked in the driveway of a $200,000 house in the middle of nowhere" - Bill Simmons
by RogersPark Kris on Dec 3, 2008 9:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's true...
Nocioni is starting to remind me of Philip Seymour Hoffman in the basketball scenes of “Along Came Polly”
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 2:15 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I liked how BG was playing with DR last game
And I had a hope that he understood how to play off of Rose.
But tonight he showed again,that he doesn’t get it.
Forsing very difficult shots in traffic instead of hitting open threes is stupid.
I think he wants to NY badly to play next to LeBron in 2010 .But if he is so stupid not to understand how to play next ot Rose,then no one won’t want him and pay him monet he is asking.
If he only cut his ego and play smart,it will be very powerful backcourt,especially with BGs’ already improved D and assuming DR’s D will get better.
General manager needs the ability to foretell what is going to happen tomorrow,next week, next month, and next year. And to have the ability afterwards to explain why it didn't happen.
Sir Paxdorf.
by Azabullsfan on Dec 2, 2008 11:58 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
After the end of the game..
I felt like this guy at the 11 second mark..
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 3, 2008 12:03 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
You felt like wearing a Noc(or Pax) jersey while drinking a Coke?
Make sense
by NittanyCub on Dec 3, 2008 12:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, i'm lost on that one. Did I miss something?
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 3, 2008 1:03 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I just meant the sad..depressing face
btw…why the hell is paxson letting Noc rock his jersey? Like..I thought he was evil
"That’s the reason why you are on the court—to take someone’s heart." - Air Force One
by Belize on Dec 3, 2008 1:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And not to criticize Rose unduly,
(wonder if that subject heading got any attention), but he’s got to learn not to dribble into the corner. It’s a terrible habit, and nothing good ever comes out of it. Unless the ball is getting kicked out to you, that’s turnover central, as we saw last night. Teams are funneling him there.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 6:42 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Yeah.
I’ve been saying this for at least a week. Derrick has never had to adhere to this basic rule because his athleticism could always get him out of any trap. Not so in the NBA. He needs to stay away from corners (all four of them, including the one that materializes when you cross half-court; bring the ball up the middle!).
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
he was picking up his dribble a lot in general. Also when he was in the corner he was looking cross-court instead of the easier pass behind him.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:44 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did we need Big Paws McGray out there?
He just need a white shirt in the paint with his hands held high for the save.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
It's Funny
Because while I agree with most of your points (especially the continued use of Noc on the this game aggressive Iguoldala (why put a slowish 3/4 on a quick 2/3 and especially when unlike last game the quick 2/3 was being aggressive much of the game)?
But I think it’s funny because while Deng wasn’t as aggressive in the 2nd half, I thought he played much much much much better. His D improved and the few shots he took weren’t the bad shots of the first quarter.
And yes he’s not paid like a franchise guy, he’s not far off the mark. He’s paid in the all star threshold and should at least look like an all star caliber player and maybe the 1-2 time all star folks thought he would be….
Yeah yesterday’s game featured another bad Luol outing…..a jack em up everywhere because I’ve been on a roll of late and so now I’m a top 3 PF styled game of Drew Gooden (hopefully watching the tape will remind him that he’s not awful, but not THAT good…
And Derrick Rose was a bit sloppy last night.
I thought Ben played a lot more one on one too, but I think some of that was necessary after running the offense early wasn’t getting anything at all done.
I did think we had more chances to win this game and coughed it up in the 4th only to get it to overtime because the 76ers just aren’t all that great…..but yeah the OT was disappointing….so be it.
Tyrus Thomas won my player of the game award. He’s had 2-3 very solid, if unspectacular games in a row…..maybe we’ll start seeing the preseason Tyrus again…..which would be AWESOME.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 8:01 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
TT is coming back
I think his confidence was shaken by the Boston game, which would explain the slump he had…. Seems to me he’s come out of whatever funk he was in.
by 72-10 on Dec 3, 2008 9:55 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I see that too
But that Boston game and the 10 game stretch of awfullness are a bit much to say he’s going to stay at the usefull to very very good player he’s been the past 3-4 games.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:56 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
i'll tkae noch's D over BG's anytime
It aint easy bein' Piatkowski
by Yibs on Dec 3, 2008 8:38 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Why?
BG is keeping his man in front of him this season and Noc can’t keep anyone in front of him. This forces the other 4 guys to play out of mind defense to pick up the slack.
Really, Deng was having a great game defensively so I have no clue why he wasn’t finishing the game and playing the entire OT. Noc gave us one 3 and four awful defensive possessions and a crucial missed rebound.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 9:00 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
at a crucial point in OT
Noc ran over to Ben’s man, pretending to be the help defender, and needlessly doing this by the way…only to completely remove Ben from the play and allow the man to go right to the basket, untouched.
That was beyond horrible defense. Noc is not a smart defender at all. He was getting absolutely roasted out there, but for whatever dumb ass reason Vinny kept him in.
by NormVanBeer on Dec 3, 2008 9:07 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
That was a stupid play
The only time that is even a remote option is if the ball handler picks up their dribble so you can trap them. But the primary defender has to know that a trap is even possible since Ben was sagging off his man trying to get him to shoot.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 9:12 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Even if a trap were possible there,
Noc had to know that his man would have been open for a pass. The only place his man could have gone was toward the basket (unless he wanted to chill out of bounds with the cameramen). That’s a point-blank and obvious pass, too, and there’s no help defense there. Absolutely NO REASON to leave your man. If a dude wants to dribble down into an occupied corner, crowding it with 4 guys, that’s as good as a trap anyway.
Completely nonsensical and misplaced aggression.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, this is totally wrong.
BG has been showing good defensive fundamentals, not getting stuck in too many screens, moving laterally to cut off dribble drives, etc. His weakness is that almost everyone can shoot over him, but I’d rather have guys elevating for long jumpshots than blowing by Noc to the rim.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
it's not even much of a comparison
maybe against Iguodala since he’s a 2/3. But Noc is a frontcourt player, he has different and more important responsibilities than Gordon.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Especially since Iggy (and relatively few SGs these days) are great long range shooters
De gustibus non est disputandum
by Sports2 on Dec 3, 2008 10:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And this is relevant because?
Viva la nuance! Reading comprehension rules!!!
by tyger1147 on Dec 3, 2008 10:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
Why?
BG’s playing D….Noc (who I’ve always liked) right now is just fouling.
Noc can guard most 4’s well, and many 3’s well, but the 2/3 combo SF/SG’s are way too quick for him…
BG has that quickness and strength (hell he might be stronger than Noc, who knows).
Nocioni is on the worst “healthy” stretch of his Bulls career….I don’t know what his deal is.
Noc does play generally solid defense in or near the post though…..
But I think he needs time in the doghouse wtih Deng for a bit…..both have really beed playing poor of late
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 10:58 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
shouldnt we want him taking on the 4's and 3's?
why should we expect him to gaurd the faster guys, if we dont expect BG to gaurd the bigger guys?
It aint easy bein' Piatkowski
by Yibs on Dec 3, 2008 12:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
I was just responding to the talk that Noc’s D was terrible on Iggy.
Noc has been terrible though of late….just a hacker, not a chucker.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 1:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Most 3's are faster than Noc, too.
A wing is a wing is a wing, for the most part. So basically we should only have Noc guarding 4s. He gives up size, but it’s much more in his wheelhouse. He should not be a perimiter defender, no matter who he’s guarding.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 1:43 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I have no explanation for why Deng did not play the final 12 minutes
I have yet to read the daily wrap ups, but watching the game it was pretty damn obvious how badly Deng was needed to guard Iguodala to force the Sixers to put the ball in Miller’s hands to make plays.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 8:57 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
He played 37 minutes, so it wasn't a case of being in Vinny's doghouse
Really no excuse, even if Luol was tired, a tired Deng still defends better then a refreshed Nocioni
"Derrick Rose is like a $500,000 Maybach parked in the driveway of a $200,000 house in the middle of nowhere" - Bill Simmons
by RogersPark Kris on Dec 3, 2008 9:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
and by OT Noc was tired too
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Not to mention they had a perfectly rested
Thabo Sefolosha sitting on the bench with enough length to really bother Iggy…
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Dec 3, 2008 11:20 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
not sure I would've like him going in completely cold
but not sure why he’s getting DNPs either.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 11:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Hunter only played 3:05
Thus providing the fatigue excuse for a loss. And Gordon’s line shows it. 0-3 from the field in the 4th. 0-5 from the field in the OT. He was attacking the rim as well which is good, but maybe too much without any gas in the tank.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:50 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I predict that the media romance and honeymoon with D Rose will end
in a couple weeks. Then you’ll begin to hear people coming out of the woodwork to pick apart his game. Saying he’s more of a scorer, doesn’t make his team and other such bullshit. It’s inevitable. Unless of course, the team rattles off a bunch of wins and he starts dishing out more assists.
by Juiceboxjerry on Dec 3, 2008 9:06 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
The more Tyrus rebounds
The more minutes he will receive with Rose. If Tyrus learns how to cut behind Rose’s penetration he will be wide open for lob passes.
If Tyrus grabs 13 boards in 32 minutes on a consistent basis I’m cool with that. The dunks would be icing.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 9:14 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes.
I’m still flabbergasted at that one play when Tyrus and Rose ran the pick and roll, Tyrus rolled to the basket WIDE OPEN but didn’t even think to look back at Rose, who almost passed to Tyrus anyway when Tyrus turned away from Rose to set a screen for Gooden (or someone), and Rose ended up airmailing a ball past Larry into the backcourt for a violation.
That should have been a highlight-reel dunk. We need to show Tyrus some tape of Amare.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 9:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
yep
that was a pretty bad play. Tyrus kinda just floated down the lane with no real intentions of doing anything. Had his head been turned, the pass could’ve been thrown, easy 2 points.
I won’t get on him too hard because he had a pretty nice game…but he just needs more time to work with Rose and those kinds of things should come pretty easy
by NormVanBeer on Dec 3, 2008 9:38 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
so he basically has to be the best rebounder in basketball :)
he’s always been a good rebounder.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:48 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Consistentcy has been absent in his game.
What else is new.
Last night he went and took the basketball for boards. He was using his athleticism to his advantage. He doesn’t always do this. In fact he stands flat footed and watches a lot of boards he could grab go to opponents.
I’ll be happy when he’s active every night.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 10:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
nah
if he played a bunch, he’d always rebound. Consistently. I swear.
Again, ‘consistency’ is used instead of saying you want him ‘on’ all the time. Even at his rebound rate they can’t all be ‘active’ games. Just play him and take the overall result, good and bad.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
He’ll always rebound and always get a block….the consistency comes from him focusing on D and not forcing 15 20 ft jumpers in 1 game when he’s missed the first 13.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 11:01 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Tyrus is always at his best when he gets his points in transition and on clean-up duty
For instance, last night he had that putback dunk of Rose’s blocked layup in the closing minutes of regulation. That’s when he is at his best. Then, in overtime, the Sixers baited him into taking a 17 foot jumper and he obliged. He, of course, missed. He needs to forget the jumper for a while. Being a creator is not where he is going to bring value.
by fundamentallysound on Dec 3, 2008 11:08 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Consistency is used
in place of “hustle”, “run”, “move” and “jump”.
That’s really what I want. That’s really what I think keeps him on the floor. Allow my Skiles corrections.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:06 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
well he has to play to do all those things
and it may not happen every stint, or even every game. So what, wishing won’t make it so, and yanking minutes certainly won’t. Just play him and coach him.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 11:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Tyrus basically saved the game more than has been noted. His rebounding and protection of the hoop kept the Bulls around late when they needed stops.
The problem is we might not see it again til January. If he ever could focus his game he could be very useful.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What I loved
was his rebounding in traffic. He was getting position and just getting higher than other guys. Shows again…as if we didn’t needed to see it again…that Tyrus doesn’t need to do a lot to be effect. Really he’s just got to play, and play with energy. The more I watch him, the more I think I’d like him to be a sixth man off the bench.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 12:28 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Tyrus played well yesterday...
But NOBODY protected the hoop when it mattered.
That’s not TT’s fault at all, but it was just an observation.
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:46 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Did you miss the block TT had
with 30 seconds left in regulation. He can’t block EVERY shot, but he disrupted defensively.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 1:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
just read up in the thread
some are pointing it out already. Gary Payton (part of the abominable team on NBATV) was saying Rose is a 2-guard. He’s not. If he scores, that’s good, not bad. Scoring point guards are a fantastic weapon.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 9:49 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Rose really only looks to score
When his team is struggling or senses that it’s an important moment in the game. He’d much rather find the cutter or wide open player for the J then force a wild lay up.
"Derrick Rose is like a $500,000 Maybach parked in the driveway of a $200,000 house in the middle of nowhere" - Bill Simmons
by RogersPark Kris on Dec 3, 2008 9:52 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
When Rose is taking his shots he looks more like he’s setting up his future moves. By taking the shot behind the screen from 18’ he’s telling his defender you better come over the top to guard me. That’s a setup. Rose doesn’t want to put up that 18’ shot. He wants that defender over the top so the dribble penetration puts him on Rose’s back. That creates the wide open lane for the screener to cut.
Rose is a PG. Anyone speculating that he’s a SG is just wrong.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 10:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
GP is a TV phenomenon.
I’m both wildly engrossed in what he’ll say next, and horrified at the prospect of what he’ll say next. I couldn’t decide whether I wanted to watch or not. Completely torn.
by arjoseph on Dec 3, 2008 10:14 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I watch
with the sound off.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's honestly the worst announcer
I’ve ever heard. Sometimes it’s literally incomprehensible. My wife walked into the living room while he was talking and just kind of squinted at the TV. She asked, utterly sincere, whether it was an English broadcast.
It’s not as if he’s speaking a unique dialect either. Delonte West, for instance, is from a part of Baltimore where they just speak in the most wild way imaginable. Totally sensical and legit and totally impossible to follow if you’re from Chicago.
Gary Payton is different. It is hypothetical english. It could makes sense, but it lacks subjects. Lacks verbs. No predicates in there, either. If you diagrammed a Gary Payton sentence it would look like a seismograph. It’s like a word-salad.
The only thing I’ve ever gotten from Gary Payton is “I played the game, I know what you don’t know, I’m awesome.” The rest is gobbledygook.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 12:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I find it pretty fascinating.
I ended up scrolling between timeouts to NBATV to hear what he and CWebb would say next.
by CJ Bulls on Dec 3, 2008 12:22 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I credit your patience.
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 12:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
He's so stupid it's funny
The way he tries to be the next Barkley is funny. Go back to Oakland GP, no one cares about you except pissed off Sonics fans. The only competent analyst on NBA TV is C-Webb, he’ll say something smart every 10 minutes or so, that’s integrity you can’t find anywhere else!
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 2:01 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
And Rose
Has awesome passing skills and proved on Sunday he knows how to run the pt and run it quite well.
He might be more of a scoring PG than Jason Kidd, and not quite Nash like as a passer, but still he can pass, just has little options with Noah especially not able to complete layups because he’s not strong enough to take the contact after an awesome pass.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 11:02 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
What's more likely?
(dovetailing the finishing at the rim disease we have)
Noah unable to finish at the rim or BG getting his shots blocked?
We’d be unstoppable if both of these problems went away.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately
It’s Noah unable to finish at the rim.
I’d put that up there with Ben dribbling the ball off his leg….seriously he has to lead the league in that department….it’s strange too because he can make nice passes and make some nice ball handling plays, but it’s 1-3 times a game anymore where he dribbles the ball off his leg (thankfully many of these our guys recover…but still).
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 12:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
BG dribbling off his leg was nothing...
Compared to Hughes getting ripped while dribbling like a lazy idiot at the top of the key. End of the third, no focus whatsoever, and clearly mattered in a game that went to overtime.
Don't call me doughboy!
by Khalid El-Amin on Dec 3, 2008 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
That was 1 stupid bad play
Hughes wasn’t paying attention at all….awful.
But BG constantly dribbles off his legs…I don’t get it.
Hughes from my eyes—didnt’ check the stats though, played a decent game again, a surprising 4th or so in a row…
BG wasn’t as bad as his shot selection would indicate, the offense was out of sequence all game.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Why our opponents don't trap BG everytime he touches it is rather remarkable
I’d be trapping him anytime he has the ball between the free throw lines. It’s a carnival of turnovers and fastbreaks after that.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, puke.
Gary Payton’s such an idiot. Somebody fire this guy. Let him eat and drink himself into even deeper stupidity, buy a pontoon boat, and just float away. Then Charles Rosen watches one game, which happen to be one of Rose’s worst, and concludes the same. The kid just had a ten assist game, for Christ’s sake.
His assists have been rising. His turnovers have been dropping. He had one bad game.
Now all of the sudden he’s an undersized two? Ben Gordon is an undersized shooting guard. Does anyone with a modicum of sense think they’re remotely similar players?
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 12:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think anyone realizes
That if your teammates can’t hit shots, what the hell is the PG supposed to do? I guess Chris Paul averaged 21 points and Deron Williams 19 because they were so unselfish and the gods decided to just tack on field goals to the final score? I guess Devin Harris is a bad PG because he can’t average 10 assists? How’s that trade working out for Dallas vaunted NBA analysts?
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 2:00 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think so...
I mean, sure, the media attacks every other sports star in the city… But the Bulls have been so desperate for so long, and Rose is the homegrown hero.
I think he will at least have this season as his Award Tour, and everyone will shower him with love… like Portland does with their young players.
Now, if we flame out in the playoffs, then, they might start picking him apart.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
The media might pick him apart
Because he’s pretty boring, and after the feel-good stories are done, there isn’t much to talk about him.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 2:32 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
You mean boring personality right?
Cause I could see that, not that I dislike Rose’s personality, but other than “he’s so humble” he doesn’t give the media much to write about.
But his game is anything from boring. He is easily the most enjoyable and exciting player to watch since the dynasty days…
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 2:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
If he
continues to shine and do the little things he’s done (he has all the highlight reel athleticism the media loved of the rookie Tyrus Thomas, while he’s also been a much better all around player than Tyrus already and is homegrown and per the media a good but quiet kid)…they won’t bother him much if he plays like he is now or even better.
by majoyenrac on Dec 3, 2008 3:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
adoreable anecdote
But what I was most impressed with was when Rose drew his fourth foul early in the fourth quarter, again with Miller suckering him in with a head fake and jumping into Rose, which always is called on the defender in the NBA…Rose seemed to grow frustrated and began to argue. It was Thomas, who usually is lost in some moody far away place in games, who began to comfort Rose, walking him away from trouble and giving him a soothing palm of the head.
awwww :)
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 10:31 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
When the kids raise the kids
all sorts of Samuel Huntington theories come to life.
Or something like that.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 11:09 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs
rec'd for title of the post alone
don’t get CSN down at school, so haven’t seen as much of rose as i’d like. from what i’ve seen, it appears that when he penetrates and doesn’t take a fga, its always a kick out? why hasn’t he been able to find someone rolling to the basket/near it for a much easier conversion? teammates don’t know how to play with him, hasn’t developed that part of his game yet? if i’m totally off base, please let me know as i said, i havent seen enough of rose as i’d like.
"KenWO
no point in arguing with people who are blinded from reality..."
by Where Triples Go to Die on Nov 29, 2008 6:49 PM
by Illini0509 on Dec 3, 2008 11:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs
Because there isn't anyone
rolling to the basket/near it for a much easier conversion?
--Torch
by torch on Dec 3, 2008 12:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I've heard...
that the coaching staff made an early focus on keeping the lane clear for Rose to penetrate…
But now, I’d really like it if they teach the other players to slash through the lane when Derrick is looking to pass, and then crash the boards when he does drive….
Hopefully, this terrible team trait gets much better as the season goes on… I’m banking on the experience of our assistant coaches for this one.
by kidronmusic on Dec 3, 2008 2:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
Like Torch says
and the fact that Luol Deng is apparently moored to the three point line – not behind it, actually on it – by his 71 million dollar deal.
Roll hard to the basket, Tyrus! Cut to the rim, Luol!
This is what you get when you consistently draft basketball players who didn’t play basketball as kids. (However I do think Luol was cutting better, and more aggressive, last night.)
The poster formerly known as Freethefro.
by MPG on Dec 3, 2008 12:45 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
new draft rule
You must have played YMCA basketball at some point before college.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
thats what i thought
i’d imagine this is any easy fix, but that may be assuming too much with this organization…
"KenWO
no point in arguing with people who are blinded from reality..."
by Where Triples Go to Die on Nov 29, 2008 6:49 PM
by Illini0509 on Dec 3, 2008 2:31 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
meh, this team usually gets off to a slow start
but its not that bad considering even if you have a below .500 record, you could still make the playoffs in this league
"Charles Tillman is one of the best strippers in the NFL" - John Madden 11/30/08 Chicago Bears vs. Minnesota Vikings game
by Chanman25 on Dec 3, 2008 12:43 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
Dan Bernstein:
the Bulls are finally starting to see that an NBA team can’t really afford to play Aaron Gray unless a similarly slow, unathletic opponent is there for him. The Sixers got off fast last night by exploiting Gray
Indeed, Gray came in and was -8 in 6 minutes.
As I mentioned in my recap, I was predicting that Vinny would again bring Gray first off the bench in the 2nd half out of superstition, but I was happily incorrect. Gray’s a matchup player, Gooden/Thomas/Noah are not (or at the least shouldn’t be and need to prove otherwise). I’m not sure how Noc fits in at the 4…his ‘matchup’ is if he’s hitting threes, I guess.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 1:36 PM CST reply actions 0 recs
whoops, forgot to link the popcornmachine
http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20081202&game=PHICHI
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 1:37 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
(and that stint wasn't completely Gray's fault)
he should not be playing with Drew Gooden.
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by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 3, 2008 1:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
I forgot that Gray had played
When they showed him on the bench in the 2nd half the hair was flopless and sweatless. It was in pristine condition. maybe he made half time adjustments.
50 year old Ratliff was a +8 in the same sequence.
In a trust with Vinny Del Negro.
by NBA Observer on Dec 3, 2008 1:39 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
But you're unfair to him you big bad blog meanie!
I want to karate kick Vinny when Gray comes in the game, but there’s absolutely no advantage to it. Use him tonight against the Charlie Hustle Bucks so he can take advantage of a Bogut-less frontcourt, not a team that loves to get out and run.
"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."
by Ozzie Montana on Dec 3, 2008 2:03 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs
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