D ROSE'S LACK OF DEFENSE

by lincoln3 on Nov 25, 2008 7:36 AM CST

I first want to start out by saying congrats for a big win last night over a quality team on the road. The reason why I decided to join SB Nation is b/c of my disgust with the Bulls play againts the Blazers. I know night in and night out we may not be the most talented team on the floor. We are also a very young, SMALL Team but that is no excuse for lack of effort. We should use our youth, speed and quickness to be a good defensive team. T

That mentality should begin with our point guard and leader. I believe D Rose can be a top 5 PG in the league for the next 12 years. I believe he can have the same impact Tony Parker and Chris Paul have on their teams but it should start with his DEFENSE. Getting beat by Steve Blake of the Blazers were disturbing to me. I am challenging Rose to be a defender like Rondo. I think he should spend some time with Lindsey Hunter to learn how to be a PRO on and off the court and to learn how to play DEFENSE on every play.

Because of Rose's size and athletecism, he will be able to dominate any opposing PG and teams in the league with his scoring. DEFENSE is an ATTITUDE, I need him to have a Shane Battier/Bruce Bowen approach on Defense. Steals can be misleading, just because a guard is able to play the passing lanes and have some steals does not mean he is a good defender AKA Allen Iverson.

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It's his biggest challenge,

but I don’t think it’s a long term cause for worry. Last night he regressed in that department, but overall he’s shown steady improvement. His one on one defense can actually be pretty nasty. But he’s a rookie – it’s hard for me to remember, too! – and considering the burden he’s carrying…at least for this year, I really don’t care.

The poster formerly known as Freethefro.

by MPG on Nov 25, 2008 8:21 AM CST 0 recs

DEFENSE IS PORTABLE AND SHOULD BE EVERY NIGHT

I agreed with most of what you had to say until your last sentence “at least for this year, i really don’t care.” D Rose should and better care to play DEFENSE if you truly want to be compare as one of the elite PG, you have to dominate on both sides of the ball. The moves around the basket will get him on ESPN top 10. His Defense will get us deep into the playoffs and the Jewelry. ALL players have offensive off nights even the greatest, MJ. BUT Defense should NEVER take a night off or a YEAR off.

by lincoln3 on Nov 26, 2008 10:59 AM CST up 0 recs

Another biggest challenge for improvement.

a comment eariler by "drew gooden’s facial growth’ stated the following ..

“but I couldn’t help but notice that Hunter found TT early for two quick dunks.
I’ve seen plenty of drive-and-kick from Rose, but not enough drive-and-dump.
Rose pretty much walks on water for me, but there are areas of his game that will
improve. And TT’s game will improve along with it”.

I had to go back and watch that first qtr of the Bulls – Nuggett game. Yes “dgfg” was
absolutely correct. Neither Hinrich, or Rose yet has effectively and routinely
executed the drive-and-dump pass to a high flying Tyrus or Noah for easy dunks. Hunter
does it so naturally and effectively, I just hope Derrick and Kirk can learn
from Lindsey to help build the confidence of these young Bigs to get them going early.
(I always said Kirk needed a mentor before Rose arrived, and one good enough never arrived. Hunter is that man)

I believe Rose drives so effectively, draws double teams and can finish with all types of moves over or around most any defender(s). Therefore he doesn’t think unselfishly enough yet to drive and dump to get the other players going initially.

But he also must be known to make his other players better, that includes Tyrus and Noah, and his grade is not so outstanding in this area yet. I know he’s only a rookie.

When Rose achieves this level of comradery and leadership, he will (like Chris Paul) be able to tell (Tyrus & Noah) forcefully on the court, and be received,
to toughen up that soft interior defense. Put somebody on the ground! dude.

Ok! VDN get about your business, especially if you want a raise in a year or two.

man up!

by exult463 on Nov 25, 2008 9:45 AM CST 0 recs

Noticed that Hunter-Thomas connection too...

Obviously, Derrick isn’t at the point where he’s making everybody around him better. In fact, early on anyways it appears he’s made Luol worse. But it’s not cause for concern in the slightest. He just needs VDN and Hunter in his ear constantly.

I also don’t think Tyrus consistently rolls or cuts to the hoop. The difference is, as you touched on, when Rose goes to the hoop he manages to get the switch, with the big guy covering him, making it easy for Tyrus to float out. When Hunter is in, he doesn’t get that switch, so Tyrus’ jump shot—clearly his number 1 priority—is not available. Just a thought.

Asked what kind of player he expects to be in the next five years, he said: "Not a star, but like, a superstar. Something around, like, Chris Paul, Kobe Bryant, LeBron James, Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, something like that."

by BigBenign on Nov 25, 2008 10:37 AM CST up 0 recs

I'll keep an eye to watch the difference in the defense played

between the two, if Tyrus gets enough burn time with both?

It also may be Tyrus has adjusted his game to float outside because D.Rose strength now
is to drive and kick, whereas with Hunter, Tyrus instinctly followed Hunter to the hole on his two drives in the very short time both were in the game together. This same situation seems also be the case for Luol, as he already has expressed trying to learn to play with Rose.

Tyrus defense was somewhat matadorish, and his man beat him back for easy buckets, probably not in all cases his fault because of lack of team help defense, so maybe that’s why he didn’t get much burn with VDN later in that game?

man up!

by exult463 on Nov 25, 2008 12:38 PM CST up 0 recs

D ROSE IMPACT ON TYRUS AND OTHERS

Simply stated D Rose should elevate Tyrus and Luol games to the level that CP3 elevated Chandler’s game in NO. Chandler struggled in CHI b/c he never played with a true PG. Kirk is a converted PG and does not make players around him better. I am not trying to knock Kirk. that is just not his game. PGs are like franchise QBs some of them have the I T thing and some don’t. I feel Rose have the I T thing.

by lincoln3 on Nov 26, 2008 11:05 AM CST up 0 recs

Rose is 20

It’s a legitimate point for development, but not necessarily for worry. He’ll get there.

"You ain’t as hot as I is / all of these false prophets is not messiahs /
You don’t know how high the sky is / the square mileage of earth or what pi is." - Nas

by Jivas on Nov 25, 2008 9:52 AM CST 0 recs

agree

he’s a rookie…u gotta take it slow and have patience. Numerous times last night I would scream at him and the little things he dows wrong..until I realize: He is a rookie

"You’re caught up in basketball. Get caught up in life" - Starbury's Head Tattoo

by Belize on Nov 25, 2008 2:55 PM CST up 0 recs

does*

"You’re caught up in basketball. Get caught up in life" - Starbury's Head Tattoo

by Belize on Nov 25, 2008 2:55 PM CST up 0 recs

Other Top PGs

Deron Williams is known for his lack of Defense and it has hurt the Jazz in the playoffs the last 2 seasons.
Tony Parker is to small to play D but he is in the Spurs system so he looks fine guarding the 2nd best guard while Bowen guards the Pauls or Nashes or Derons.
Chris Paul is active and gets a lot of steals but Tony Parker went through him whenever he wanted in last years playoffs.
Derrick has the body and quickness to be a great defender and it might take another coach in the future to help him learn…… maybe Lindsay Hunter can teach him…. there isn’t a better older defensive PG in the NBA……….

by Jscho316 on Nov 25, 2008 10:20 AM CST 0 recs

Agree, but size is not always a factor..

I have much praise for Lindsey Hunter, his defense and overall game
has been greatly underrated in the NBA. Yet he does so many
little crafty things on both defense as well as offense. His pressure
on the ball, lateral movement has been one of the best in the NBA, let VDN turn
him loose.

Hunter is a direct example to Ben Gordon and others that smaller size doesn’t
dictate you not being a great defender.

Ben Gordon should also learn defense from this guy. School is in session.

man up!

by exult463 on Nov 25, 2008 10:39 AM CST up 0 recs

Maybe Pax will be smart

and bring back Hunter as either a player or assistant coach next year.

by Granny Waiters on Nov 25, 2008 7:35 PM CST up 0 recs

Exactly!

by hlac on Nov 25, 2008 10:00 PM CST up 0 recs

DEFENSE IS A WANT TO AND A PRIDE THING

D. Williams does not need another coach in the future to help him. Jerry Sloan is one of the top 5 coaches in the league. He is a tough, blue collar, defensive minded coach. D Williams has the size, strength, quickness in other words all the tools to be a VERY GOOD defender. He just chooses not to apply that same tenacity on Defense as he does on offense. The Kobe and Jordans they want to embarass you on offense and NOT be embarrassed by your offense. KG’s Defense and Leadership ignited Paul Pierce to become 1st team ALL DEFENSE. That is what i want to see from D ROSE. It is not in his personality to be as vocal as KG but if he plays that TENACIOUS defense the rest of the team should follow.

by lincoln3 on Nov 26, 2008 11:11 AM CST up 0 recs

Defenese? Is that a language, like Japanese?

I’m referring, of course, to the misspelling in the title of your post…

Look, the Bulls just did not show up for that Blazers game, number one. Number 2, Blake is simply not a scrub. I mean, you could make the case that he’s average, but I actually think he’s ok. And even if he was average, say like a Travis Deiner or a Luke Ridnour, even those guys have a good game once in a while. Plus, if Blake is getting to the cup, where the hell is the help defense? It’s in the tank with our clumsy bigs, that’s where.

Anyway, I agree with you that there’s so much to like about Rose. My initial worry was that the repetitive losing would take its toll on him as a young player, but by imposing his will on the game flow, he has single-handedly won enough games that repetitive losing is not yet a part of the season.

The one concern that I do have is that I still want him to be (or continue to develop into) a playmaker. And with the rest of the team sleep-walking around him, the assist opportunities are not there as much as they were there for Chris Paul for his first year in the league.

Defense (or defenese) is not a huge concern right now, at least in my view…

"It’d be ridiculous to hate someone for simply what they say in a sports blog. But I greatly dislike every syllable of your angst-filled, smarmy, nondescript, half-assed, elitist-garbage responses." –Rogerspark Kris

by bullhockey on Nov 25, 2008 11:24 AM CST 0 recs

I edited the title

too many caps.

USE THE SOFTWARE. Actions-> Rec/Flag. Reply to comments with the reply button. Rec good fanposts/fanshots so the crud gets pushed down.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Nov 25, 2008 2:14 PM CST up 0 recs

i guess he didn't like that

…it’s been changed back

by NormVanBeer on Nov 26, 2008 11:07 AM CST up 0 recs

I think DERRICK ROSE

should be in all caps.

by Granny Waiters on Nov 26, 2008 10:45 PM CST up 0 recs

INSTEAD OF BEING A PROOFREADER ADDRESS THE TOPIC

I misspelled DEFENSE. D Rose and the BULLS bigs are not playing it. You sound like you never played D in your life. DEFENSE is a huge concern right now. The phoenix OFFENSE has been cute for years, how many rings do they have. The 6 rings the BULLS won you think Phil, Scottie, and MJ said DEFENSE did not matter right now. Losers pick and choose when DEFENSE matter. Winners like the SPURS believe it matters all 82 games, Preseason and post season. Blake is a good player but should not dominate D Rose. You said look the Bulls just did not show up for the Blazers game as if that was OK.

by lincoln3 on Nov 26, 2008 11:17 AM CST up 0 recs

Easy, buddy. What's the fun in posting to a blog if we can't pick on each other's foibles? Or our own, for that matter.

You should have seen how proud I was that I caught someone on here calling the Bulls assistant coach Mike Myers instead of Pete Myers. Unfortunately, the guy I was correcting was me.

Anyway, I agree. It absolutely should matter to these guys, and they’re a disgrace. And that’s both offensively and defensively. But one game where you don’t show up, well, it happens.

I personally like how you spelled defense “DEFENESE”. If that’s the way you like it, then “DEFENESE” it is. If that is a language, the Bulls certainly don’t speak it.

by bullhockey on Nov 26, 2008 9:00 PM CST up 0 recs

?

While I haven’t seen Rose effectively “shut down” any of his opponents, I haven’t seen anyone light him up either. I would call him an average defender in NBA standards. If he is an average defender now, as a 20 yo rook, he will at least be an above average defender if not a great one in a few short years.

"I can accept failure, but I can't accept not trying." -- Michael Jordan

by bennythebull on Nov 25, 2008 12:27 PM CST 0 recs

Rose can do whatever he wants

Our frontcourt defense is far more important, since you know, it’s horrible, sucks, and is the worst thing to ever exist on this planet. And, no I’m not being dramatic.

"It never is, because I'm the Shogun. And before you get to the Shogun, you gotta go through a lot of ninjas."

by Ozzie Montana on Nov 25, 2008 7:02 PM CST 1 recs

I tried to ask Sam Smith about

but he hasn’t responded yet. With Rose’s ability to beat anybody of the dribble, it is baffling why he can’t see to guard anybody of the dribble. Hopefully it is just a learning process, and Rose will eventually become all NBA defense, just like Jordan.

by BigWay on Nov 25, 2008 9:33 PM CST 0 recs