Bulls/Wolves preseason reaction: Larry Hughes is hurt
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 22, 2008 10:44 PM CDT
129 comments
(!)
I admit, I may have snuck in a pump of the fist when I saw Larry Hughes crumple to the ground. It looked like a separated shoulder, and KC reports that's indeed the diagnosis.
I'm not happy that he got himself hurt, but I'm happy he is currently out...if that makes sense. I'm not the only one, apparently.
I wonder if Ben Gordon's toe, which held him out (or VDN held him out, who knows) again, now will feel better...
The irony is that this was a game where Larry's aggravating shot selection of never-consistently-released-leaner jumpshots were actually falling. So maybe it's good for Larry's ego he went out this way, as the superstar he dreams he is.
Rest of the group, in the lazy rating system I thought of before Larry Hughes got hurt:
The Rose:
- Derrick Rose
- After seeing Kevin Love and remembering that as a best-case draft outcome...thank you again lottery balls.
The Good:
- Deng (first half)
-Thought he played well off of Derrick Rose - Nocioni
- Noah
The Bad:
- Deng (second half)
- When Rose was out and he was trying to be a #1 option...didn't look good. - Gray
- Though he was asked to guard Al Jefferson, which wasn't really fair. But he's been especially bad the past two games. - Hinrich
- Thabo
-Just abysmal. He looks like he belongs in the scrub scrum with Nichols and Powell. Maybe I had it wrong by saying Nocioni should be traded and Thabo can be the backup 3. Thabo can't even be in the rotation if he's this bad, and maybe he'd help a trade get done. - Gooden
- Can we stop calling him a low-post presence? Most of his offense is from jumpshots with his heels on the 3-point line.
The Hughes
- Larry Hughes
- At least he was the subject of the comment of the night, a mini-thread with Yibs, Jaina, and ibleedbullsred, making fun of Dwayne Wade's separated shoulder wheelchair ride.
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I usually hate
when people celebrate injuries… but I do admit I did just that tonight. I was happy for the rotation’s sake when I saw it, not necessarily because he got injured. If that makes any sense…
B.J. for three.... KABOOM!
by chibullsfan03 on Oct 22, 2008 11:03 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
KC says he's out at least six weeks
That should pretty much end the guard problem for the time being. Hell, with Gordon hurt and Thabo looking awful, they might actually be a bit thin in the backcourt now.
by Big D on Oct 22, 2008 11:04 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
It must have been changed
It did say “out at least six weeks” just a few minutes ago, I swear. I don’t think I’m losing my mind (at least not yet).
by Big D on Oct 22, 2008 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
KC...that trickster!
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 22, 2008 11:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It did and I quoted it in the game post.
The internets are tricky like that. 1984!
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 22, 2008 11:26 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Six weeks...
I just did my victory dance, which I save for the occasions that make me happiest( i.e. the Bulls making the playoffs for the first time in 7 years).
Today is a happy day for the Bulls and their fans.
by stupidgenius on Oct 26, 2008 12:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone have Mike Miller's address?
I want to send him a thank you card
"I knew I'd always remember it as the night me and Michael combined for 70 points" - Stacey King after Jordan scored 69
by Goostafer on Oct 22, 2008 11:08 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Whoa
That Nancy Kerrigan talk was really just puerile foolery.
Oh well. He’s not playing.
Get well Larry. Winning isn’t everything. You don’t have to play to earn your paycheck.
by NBA Observer on Oct 22, 2008 11:12 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I didn't get to watch the game
but how the heck did Noc have 6 fouls in just under 23 minutes?
Who was he guarding?
by NBA Observer on Oct 22, 2008 11:13 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
You know Noc...it was hard to tell at times :D
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 22, 2008 11:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Everyone. Noc is a man after all. With grit and stuff.
Only a sissy would guard one or two players at a time. And Noc ain’t not sissy.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 22, 2008 11:28 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thabo is becoming more and more of a disappointment
by hlac on Oct 22, 2008 11:43 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
It almost seems as if he’s actually regressed from last year, which is hard to imagine.
by messwiththebull on Oct 23, 2008 6:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
He might just start slow, especially in learning how to play with the new guys. He looked awful last year too until mid season.
Not that I like that excuse, but it’s the 2nd yr we’ve seen it so far….he does indeed look bad.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He had a good excuse last year though.
He ran into JoeJoe during a team autograph session downtown.
The Game chose him !
by Diabolo on Oct 23, 2008 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What does Gordon's toe...
…have to do with Hughes’ injury?
Why would you even say this…
I wonder if Ben Gordon’s toe, which held him out (or VDN held him out, who knows) again, now will feel better…
Unless of course you thought there was something else beyond a serious toe injury going on for Gordon…if you believe his toe is hurt, then Hughes situation will have effect on its status…
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Oct 22, 2008 11:49 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Because the one game BG played Hughes was "injured?"
Every other game sandwiched around that one, BG sat out…and Hughes played in all of them. It’s a bit odd to say the least, especially when BG keeps saying he’s OK to play.
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 22, 2008 11:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think there's anything to it.
Vinny said how Ben’s toe hurt following the game he played, so he’s not 100% ready to go, and they’re going to make sure he is before putting him back out there nightly again. It’s the pre-season, no sense in it.
"Sharapova's Thigh": Sports, Entertainment, Booze, The Ladies... And Their Thighs.
http://sharapovasthigh.blogspot.com
by CubsClapp on Oct 23, 2008 12:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not really buying the conspiracy, but it's still odd nonetheless.
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 23, 2008 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's one of those things that you know isn't really the case, but can't help pointing out the odd coincidence, no?
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Oct 23, 2008 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh yeah, I guess.
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 23, 2008 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
BG was in on VDN's Master Plan
Kinda like a cabal.
by messwiththebull on Oct 23, 2008 6:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thabo Still Very Important
I know Thabo’s shooting poorly but Vinny Del Harris used the Rose Thabo Noc Noah/Tyrus Grey line up in the 4th against Dallas and a lot in the Minn game and it seems he likes it.
Thabo is really important to Rose’s devolopment because he already defers to Rose unlike Deng, Gooden, and Gordan( when he gets back).
Like SI said in todays NBA Preivew, Kirk is good as a 3rd guard.
by Jscho316 on Oct 23, 2008 12:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Thabo is important because he defers to Rose.....LOL
Rose is not Michael Jordan…. He is a Point Guard, a position where he is to be good and make others better. Thabo should be feeding off of the additional attention Rose attracts, not consistently deferring… Gordon, Deng, Gooden, and yes Thabo should see increased opportunities to put the ball in the basket with minimal defensive pressure. Thabo is what he is, an end of the bench emergency rotation player. He is no more than a lesser paid Larry Hughes (sometimey jumpshot and all)
"Who did we think we were"
by Thirdrock on Oct 23, 2008 7:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
baaahahahahahahahaa
I was at work..and when I saw the recap of Larry Hughes’s shoulder I almost smacked my boss in delight…luckily i didnt and I stay have a job
bahahahahahaahhaha
by Belize on Oct 23, 2008 12:31 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Ouch
You know it sucks that he is injured, but oh well, I guess this is the way he will be yanked out of the rotation
by NamingRightsOnSale on Oct 23, 2008 4:16 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I am not happy with this
With Rose playing like he is playing I am confident that Hinrich or Hughes should be traded for a center. But the second will be impossible to trade so it should be the Kirk. We still need back up and Hughes injury makes the trade harder. There is no doubt for me that the starting 5 should be Rose/Gordon/Deng/Tyrus/Gooden
by JustAnotherFan on Oct 23, 2008 5:36 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Okay except.. We’ve seen that lineup maybe once.. So small SG, and a short center?
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 7:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why trade Hinrich?
Rose is going to be a great player. Right now he dominates the 4th quarter. I would like to see him do that when the opponent’s starters are still in the game. He is still raw. It is going to take time for him to really get comfortable in the system and playing on this level. Hinrich is valuable in that the offense seems to flow better with him on the floor as pg…A backup he will be…How many backup pgs out there that are better? Not many. So, really, do you want to trade a starter worthy PG for some teams backup, wouldnt start for the Bulls, center? As far as Hughes, I am still ELATED that he is not Ben Wallace.
"Who did we think we were"
by Thirdrock on Oct 23, 2008 8:09 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do we want to pay a backup PG that much?
Does Hinrich want to be a backup PG? If Rose keeps playing as he has (and there is no reason to not — he has been our best and most consistent and improving player all preseason) then Hinrich will only be coming off the bench as a PG for about ten minutes a game. How would he ever be happy in that role and how could we be happy having a guy get paid that much to play ten minutes? Rose will have an off night here or there, but not worse than the next players. Do we need expensive backups for everyone who might have an off night?
As for BW. I didn’t like him, but at least he only took one or two crazy shots a game. If there had been a way of benching him in favor of the young guys they wouldn’t have had to trade him. As it is, Hughes is little better. Takes a ton of shots and likely won’t want to be benched either. The shoulder injury is a temporary solution to the guard logjam.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 23, 2008 8:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you want one of the highest paid players on the team to be a backup PG?
Im all for Hinrich backing up Rose at the 1, but if there’s a trade to be made, GET ER DONE!
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 8:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm of the opinion
that kirk lasts the year and is traded next summer.
since most guys hit a rookie wall because the season is so much longer it’ll be useful to have kirk around. this also lets them find out whether bg is staying or going.
it’s not fair to kirk to have to be behind rose, he’s better than that, but he’s not a starting caliber 2. we can maybe then turn kirk and noc or something into a backup pg and a decent C, especially if gordon ends up staying. if not, we’d probably have to keep kirk unless thabo improves a lot.
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 8:32 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not fair to Kirk to play behind Rose? Seriously?
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
no
what i mean is it’s not fair to kirk because he would start on a lot of teams. it’s selling him short to say he’s a career backup.
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 8:42 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's obviously not a career backup, but there's no way he should be starting on this team. Regardless of position.
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 8:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see him as a backup to both Rose and Gordon
The problem is we won’t have Gordon after this year.
by hhirb on Oct 23, 2008 8:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
agreed.
which is why i said i thought he should be traded since he deserves to start, not just on our team.
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, if Paxson plans on keeping him here past this year to either our
SG or backup PG then he’s dumber than I thought.
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 8:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see, if we trade Hinrich, we have Rose
no Hughes (good), Thabo :(, no Gordon and we are LOOKING for guards!
by hhirb on Oct 23, 2008 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Basically, GUARD (singular). We will be searching for a SG to pair up with Rose
Preferrably a good 3 pt. shooter and defender. Hinrich and Hughes are not a part of this teams future no matter what happens.
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
exactly, we would still be
searching for that Mythical 2-Guard Who can Score and Defend….
sounds very familiar to me.
"Who did we think we were"
by Thirdrock on Oct 23, 2008 9:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
What is the evidence for this statement?
Hinrich is valuable in that the offense seems to flow better with him on the floor as pg
Is there any at all?
by NBA Observer on Oct 23, 2008 8:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Key word - seems
that implies “in my opinion” based only on a few Rose games and a few years of Hinrich games. Yes it’s too early to justify this opinion, but that makes my point. Rose has only had a few games, and most of his “shine” has been attacking the basket. While this is extremely valuable to a team with few players if any who attack the basket regularly, a PG orchestrates an offense. Rose hasn’t played enough to do this often nor against upper tier players.
"Who did we think we were"
by Thirdrock on Oct 23, 2008 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Um...Rose is a ROOKIE
He’s not going to have the offense running like a Mozart symphony within a span of 5 preseason games. Kirk is a freaking 6 year veteran now, if he can’t get the ball to people he’s played with for several seasons then he’d be on the street.
"I’m gonna rise up, gonna kick a little ass. Gonna kick some ass in the USA. Gonna climb a mountain, gonna sew a flag, gonna fly on an eagle. I’m gonna kick some butt, gonna drive a big truck. I’m gonna rule this world. I’m gonna kick some ass. I’m gonna rise up, gonna kick a little ass. Rock, flag, and eagle!"
by Ozzie Montana on Oct 23, 2008 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So far to me, it seems that Derrick is functioning best when Vinny
greenlights the free-flowing, do-whatever-you-can offense when Derrick is on the floor, but struggles a bit to function within a more set offense. That makes sense, considering he’s a rookie PG and the type of offense Memphis ran. It’s also not to say that Derrick won’t improve with running a more structured offense as he gets experience, and will function equally well either way.
Kirk, on the other hand, appears to be the complete opposite, in that one of his strengths is in knowing and executing a set offense (within the limits of his abilities, of course) while he is probably at his worst in any kind of freelancing situation.
Man-slave, bring me my PB&J!
by wjb1492 on Oct 23, 2008 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
When this injury first happened, I was happy (Not that I want to see anyone hurt) because
it meant that the guard rotation would be shorter. Upon second thought, this means that it would now officially take an incredible feat of stupidity for Rose to not be starting come tuesday. What exatly would the other option be? So we have that going for us. Which is nice.
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 6:06 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
heh
“It’s definitely tough because I was getting my touch back,” Hughes said.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 8:59 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
Well the thing
With Larry is that every 7th or 8th game (and I did say this before incidentally on the 7th game he broke out) he’ll hit everything and play D and look solid…..
So in 7-8 games we’ll miss Larry, then in 7-8 games we’ll miss him again. I wish we could play him that way :).
Course I missed all of Larry’s time on the court yesterday because I didn’t think the game was on TV….stupid Dish search guide and stupid unclear CSN+.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought that comment was hilarious as well. Classic Hughes.
When I watch NBA games I often call the fouls before the referees do. Sometimes it’s a gift. Most of the time it's troublesome. - NBA Observer
by Illini15 on Oct 23, 2008 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
even Kirk himself says he shouldn't be playing the 2
well, not really…but he came close
“It’s definitely an adjustment,” Hinrich said. “I’ve played off the ball some before. The way the system is, I’m trying to figure out how I can be effective and apply my game at the offensive end. Everybody’s trying to figure it out.”
VDN should start/needs to start/has to start Gordon in Friday’s game. Gordon and Rose is the only starting combination that he hasn’t seen so far (I’m not even counting Thabo). Plus, with them playing the Bucks, it offers Gordon the perfect chance to get fat & healthy against an ole’-playing Michael Redd (it will take more than a miracle from Skiles to get this guy to play any D).
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 9:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
ugh
the more I read that quote from Kirk, the more it makes me sick. Do you REALLY want your starting 2 guard to be saying stuff like “I’ve played off the ball some before”?? And that he’s trying to figure out how to apply his offensive game?? WTF
I could care less if he isn’t a “career backup” or if he could start on a lot of other teams, this guy needs to be a BACKUP bench-player. He has looked nothing short of horrible the entire preseason and nothing he has done has shown that will change anytime soon.
So the team is supposed to suffer and possibly lose games and wait for Kirk to figure things out?? Give me a break. Sit him down already. Stop giving this guy a pass and start playing to win some games.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 9:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did Kirk not sign an autograph or sttn bud?
Kirk is a combo guard who was forced to play the point full time cause BG can’t play defense. At what he’s gettin right now [declining contract figures into this too] he’s a great back up pg/sg for Gordon and Rose.
And by putting Kirk into the starting line up, you’re also relieving some of the pressure off Rose. Maybe even get him use to playing a little off guard, cause right about now, he looks like our best scorer. Leaving BG to come off the bench firing.
How many backup pg’s can guard starting two guards? Kirk provides versatility, which is oh so valuable.
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kirk's a nice player, but his skills and role do not warrant his contract on this team
While it’s nice his contract is declining in value, it’s size still precludes retaining or obtaining better (both in actual value and in terms of fit on the team) such as BG. His contract and role on the team are not as ill matched as Nocioni, but in the end, Kirk needs to be moved at some point for this team to get better.
We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look.
Ronald Reagan
by snley on Oct 23, 2008 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
It would be great to trade Hinrich if......
we could get something of similar value which we cant OR if Hughes would have proven valuable which he hasn’t OR if Thabo would be effective which he isn’t and MAYBE if we had signed Gordon which we won’t.
by hhirb on Oct 23, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually Noc seems to be matching up a bit better
I still think he needs to be traded, but it’s getting to the point I can live with him again. Kirk’s getting more irritating by the moment.
by Sports2 on Oct 23, 2008 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
now THATs a guy to showcase :)
at least lately.
management sez: recommend fanposts/fanshots/comments! Click 'reply' when replying to a comment! Flag jerkfaces! Be a 'Nazi' when it comes to thread duplication!
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 23, 2008 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Matt
I wonder how long until you say, ya know what, Nocioni when healthy is better than I’ve given him credit for, especially with a true PG….
I predict late Dec/early Jan, though you’ll be wanting to say this sooner—except your pride doesn’t allow it.
In Nocioni I trust
:)—sarcasm intended (not trying to offend, just jibe).
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
whatever
even if he did remember how to (and where/when to) shoot again, he’ll likely always be a terrible defender, and never will have a true position.
Besides, just not enough minutes at the 3/4 to justify having him around at that price. Maybe if you give up on Thabo (not an impossibility) that helps, but he’s better as a 4, but cannot be out there too long as a 4.
management sez: recommend fanposts/fanshots/comments! Click 'reply' when replying to a comment! Flag jerkfaces! Be a 'Nazi' when it comes to thread duplication!
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 23, 2008 1:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know...
He is shooting 50% in the preseason. Seems he is remembering.
Though, he is too highly paid to be a 7th or 8th man. But, it looks like Vinny likes playing small ball, so Noc may get plenty of minutes at the 4.
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Oct 23, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
But in all honesty, Noc is really our 6th man. Gordon’s not starting is crap, he’s more than starting caliber in this league….
Noc too could be a starter, but also is suited well as a 6th man.
If we had a few decent pieces (and not all this tiring “upside” Noc’s contract would be great…..he’s a better Posey.
by majoyenrac on Oct 24, 2008 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you think Noc could guard
McGrady and Kobe-I’m asking
by hlac on Oct 23, 2008 6:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since when does the 4 guard the other teams best perimeter scorer?
… And to be fair.. Hell no, but then again- who can?
by Los on Oct 24, 2008 7:15 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He can
Piss them off and get in their face and might cause them some disruption….
Do you think Deng can guard McGrady and Kobe and James—I’m asking,,,?
The only very good player Deng has consistently guarded well in my opinion has been Paul Pierce, not every game, but the majority….Paul Pierce to Deng is what Dwyane Wade is to Hinrich, though Hinrich stops more guys more consistently than Luol.
by majoyenrac on Oct 24, 2008 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
man please
“by putting Kirk in the starting line up, you’re also relieving some of the pressure off Rose”…HUH? How does Rose have any pressure on him? Kirk didn’t play the entire 4th quarter of the Dallas game and Rose seemed to do just fine on his own.
I’m sure you didn’t see that part though with visions of little Kirks dancing around in your head.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was wonderin which hole you talk out of in real life? cause you type out ya ass..
I think we can agree Rose should play 48 minutes a game, and i’m not advocating starting Kirk over him; hell I barely like the guy after last yr. I’m defending Kirk’s worth as a player.
SOMEONE has to eat up some minutes, and there couldnt be anyone better I dont think. He’s a starting quality point to relieve Rose, and can guard two guards for BG.
.. You’re sorta assuming Rose going to be as effective every game as he was at a preseason game against dallas’ third string. THATS the pressure i’m talkin about. Kinda ironic huh?
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 11:17 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
this would be fine
if he wasn’t averaging $9m for the next 4 years.
management sez: recommend fanposts/fanshots/comments! Click 'reply' when replying to a comment! Flag jerkfaces! Be a 'Nazi' when it comes to thread duplication!
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 23, 2008 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
you don't read very well
where did I say that Rose would be as effective every game as he was in Dallas?? Anyone with a brain knows that he won’t. However, I don’t think he needs Kirk there to “mentor” him or big some sort of big-brother presence.
I would very much welcome a Hinrich trade if the right pieces were returned, but that’s not even a must right now. I’d settle for him coming off the bench instead of starting at the 2. What in your brain tells you that Kirk is an effective starting 2 guard? The world would like to know.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How well do YOU read?
I was citing the example YOU gave. You said lets win games. Then suggested Rose can do that because of what he did in Dallas. Which ‘anyone with a brain knows’ that he won’t do on a nightly..
And I was giving the pro’s of having kirk either on the bench or starting. I get it bud, you don’t hate kirk. You just like arguing about nothing.
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
phonics
“Kirk didn’t play the entire 4th quarter of the Dallas game and Rose seemed to do just fine on his own.”
How does that sound like I said Rose can do what he did on a nightly basis?? I was talking about one quarter, one game. You’re trying to make a point but are making things up in order to do so.
I get that you love Kirk, I think we all do..but making things up in order to proclaim your man-love has to stop
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 12:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Anything can get taken out of context. You said that while arguing why we should get rid of Kirk. You’re backing away from ya original point.. You said, “Lets win some games yadda yadda, sit down kirk” I said, “Keep Kirk to help relieve D.Rose” I wasn’t arguing starting him, I was sayin we should keep him..
The internet gimmick is kinda tired bud, you aint even arguing anything substantial.. Yeah, its sooo far fetched to say Kirk Hinrich is good at defending, shooting the ball and dribbling.. I mean, he only started for an NBA franchise for 5 years. That guy can barely walk straight.
.. And How is there no pressure on Rose when you’re expecting him to be a starting point guard AND play 48 minutes a game? They’re not going to ‘win some games’ Kirk’s a nice guy man, I realize you hate him- but if you write him again, maybe he’ll write you back.
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
again
you make up MORE stuff. Where did I say that Rose should play “48 minutes a game”?? (bangs head on desk). There’s no bantering with you because you don’t really read anyone’s replies. Just like I asked you earlier…What in your brain tells you that Kirk is an effective starting 2 guard? You still haven’t come close to answering that.
Here, I’ll talk in Paxson-bot for you if that helps: Kirk is the savior of the franchise. Kirk is the answer to everything. Kirk is a winner. Kirk is gritty and can do no wrong. Kirk is the best 2 guard in the league.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 2:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
How many players do you use when you play basketball? In the NBA, they use 5.
So if I say, we should keep Kirk. And you argue we should just sit him.
- We weren’t even talkin about startin him, I was just sayin he is a valuable piece on the team. And you think we should just sit him.
Who ELSE is going to play point guard? It would have to be Rose.
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 2:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
And even though I already answered this, I’ll try to go slowly for you this time Norm.
Kirk, good shooter, good defender, can create off the dribble- he’s just use to attacking from the top of the key versus the wing. He’ll be alright. I didn’t proclaim all star game, but he can eat up a few minutes til BG can abuse someone else’s 2nd string.
.. And that much we can agree on, Kirk would be tradable for the right pieces. But right about now, he is a better shooter than Thabo, and a better defender than BG. You can’t expect him to play point for 5 yrs [out of necessity] then revert back to a 2 without some game time.
by Los on Oct 23, 2008 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good shooter? Can create off the dribble? Attacking? I've not seen this Kirk you speak of.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 23, 2008 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kirk's a great defender
And he is very good at attacking….he just can never finish. He can create off the dribble to drive into the lane and get what seems like an easy layup off, but they never hit….which has always been the thing keeping Kirk a good PG and not a very good PG….
It’s the fact that he’s never hit those shots that early on many thought he would hit them and thought he could be a new Nashian type player (less a passer perhaps but a much better defender)….
But it’s safe now to say that’s very likely not ever going to happen.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He drives, dribbles under the basket,
does circles around a bit, and then pops back out again generating neither layup or kicking out a shot to a guy at the perimeter. That is what I see Kirk do over and over again. I wouldn’t think that was a good “attack” by any definition. When Nash does it he actually generates offense from it. Rose seems to be able to as well. Kirk can’t finish so the defense doesn’t collapse to him thus the perimeter shooters don’t get open… Perhaps he’d be better if we had a guy at the post dictating some of the offense.
I never said anything about his defense. When the refs allow him to do his tricks he is good, otherwise he is ineffective and has foul trouble like last year. His defense will be determined by the refs. If they let him get away with stuff he will be back to his Wade-arm-pulling glory. If they don’t it will be last year again. He needs those tricks to be effective against SGs.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 23, 2008 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't blasting you at all
But yeah I think all the previous Buzz (and my own thoughts on Kirk) were because he can drive into the lane at will and often get shots off (easy looking shots too) or at least get a pass off….but he never used to hit those shots….
I thought in 1-2 years he would start hitting them, but now we’re into year 6 and through 5 years it hasn’t happened….
So of course guys don’t need to defend that when Kirk shoots probably in the low 30’s on wide open layups he creates…..it’s very strange then that he can be a solid jump shooter at times.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great defender is a bit overblown
he fouls and gets away with it. When he doesn’t get away with it, you get last year’s defense from Kirk.
by messwiththebull on Oct 23, 2008 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well
if Kirk’s D is as bad as you say, why would he be a former 2nd team all defense….despite his not having many steals?
Why would he be able to guard most 2 guards while giving up 3-4 inches in height and a lot of athleticism?
Why would he still be a mention of perimeter defenders on the GM polls even after he played like crap to start last year?
Kirk’s value, now that his offensive shortcomings that many thought would go away but haven’t has been exposed…..Kirk’s value now is that he can handle the ball well, make a nice pass here or there, shoot some jump shots, but mostly what sets him up as a starter quality player instead of the backup that the first 3 points here is his very solid Defense.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gets away with it?
Kirk is called for fouls all the time, without looking it up he has to have easily the highest fou rate on the Bulls. I feel he gets picked on a lot, just that he whines so much afterwards the refs never give him a break.
by CJ Bulls on Oct 23, 2008 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
The year that he was his best
was the year that opposing coaches kept complaining he was getting away with dirty stuff like arm pulling and jersey pulling and hitting arms during shooting. He DOES do those things. And in previous years they didn’t call him on them as much. Last year they did and it made him less effective. He didn’t cope with it well and did do a lot of complaining. He did a double whammy on himself with the refs.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 23, 2008 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well you could say the same about Bowen then
He’s 100x “dirtier” than Kirk, just he gets away with it more. Kirk at least gets respect from other players around the league, unlike Bowen who inspires hatred (see Ray Allen, VC, Kobe).
by CJ Bulls on Oct 23, 2008 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
bowen's hate is well deserved
kicking people in the face, he kicked ray allen in the back as well… etc… it’s pretty pathetic.
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
that and
wasn’t it only riley who complained about kirk?
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes and I don't
think Kirk ever did what Riley said he did.
by sue369 on Oct 23, 2008 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
riley's dirty anyways
he’s not one to talk.
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't he later back off
that statement? I agree he’s dirty too.
by sue369 on Oct 23, 2008 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i've always sensed
riley (secretly?) wants kirk to pair with wade more than he wants gordon. who knows?
by marionette on Oct 23, 2008 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i think he does like hinrich
and calling him dirty was probably his way of recruiting, since he only likes thugs. :D
by Jaina on Oct 23, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has made it clear
In the past that he likes Hinrich, even calling HInrich out as a solid player last year (early last year) in some interviews….
And no Matt, even though we’re finishing off the slow week at work, I’m not going to spend an hour or more trying to find a quote….. :).
by majoyenrac on Oct 24, 2008 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not with Aaron Gray's foul rate.
"The whole leverage thing, it's a difficult thing to gauge" -Paxson
by Dionysus2.0 on Oct 23, 2008 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
talk about typing out ya ass
“good shooter, good defender, can create off the dribble…” – yeah ok.
Ease up on the cough medicine cuz.
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 12:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Xactly!
Also we have him signed on a declining contract. Even Jordan needed a break (thank goodness for Pippen).
I figure we’ll lose Gordon and Rose can’t play 96 minutes!
by hhirb on Oct 23, 2008 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah but you can't pay that much for 2 positions
money needs to be distributed elsewhere, either Kirk or BG need to go.
by CJ Bulls on Oct 23, 2008 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Totally agree, but after all that's gone on with Gordon and his toe
there’s gotta be about a 10% chance of Gordon seeing significant playing time right outta the gate.
by Juiceboxjerry on Oct 23, 2008 9:11 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
LOL, Gordon's toe
more like, Gordon’s contract….His toe is not hurting as much as his pride. And I am pro-Gordon, well, since he is still on the team.
"Who did we think we were"
by Thirdrock on Oct 23, 2008 9:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
here's your friggin link
SEE:
sheesh…the same link was already posted above which I why I did not post it again
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 9:36 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
ahh....you're correct.
management sez: recommend fanposts/fanshots/comments! Click 'reply' when replying to a comment! Flag jerkfaces! Be a 'Nazi' when it comes to thread duplication!
by your friendly BullsBlogger on Oct 23, 2008 11:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
sorry for going off the deep end
I had a moment there
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 11:24 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was so mad yesterday
I saw the CSN+ as the channel and thought there was very little chance the Dish would pick it up (as I remember 3-4 yrs ago when CSN and Dish had a disagreement and none of the CSN games were shown on the Dish until April….)….
But anyway, I did a theme search on basketball and nothing, it didn’t come up. So I regrettfully assumed the game wasn’t on TV, and I was psyched to watch it.
Then at the end of the 3rd quarter or so, I went here to BaB to see if anyone was commenting, and I think Matt’s comment was hopefully you guys can find this on TV…..so I learned by that that the game wasn’t only on NBATV (my assumption), and looked around all alternate channels (which I never thought to do because of CSN+ I thought meant NBA TV) and lo and behold found the game. I only watched the 4th quarter though…..very annoying.
Oh well, it’s just preseason.
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 10:33 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I think Bulls.com
has a search feature to find what channel the game is on based on your supplier. I used it yesterday to find what channel had the HD feed.
by CJ Bulls on Oct 23, 2008 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
i looked but can't find it
let me know if you find that search page
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 11:07 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Matt
When/if this is found, is there anyway you can permalink this on BAB? This is a very useful link in the age of no more WGN (stupid CW-WB)….
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here is a map
you can click on and has all the carriers for CSN in some areas. It only shows three states but the channels they show for Dish and DirecTV should be the same every where if you have the sports tier,
by sue369 on Oct 23, 2008 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
THANK YOU SUE!!
This is exactly what I was looking for. I knew that I should’ve been able to get the game last night, but couldn’t find the channel for the life of me.
I found a page similar to the one you just posted, but it seemed to be out-of-date and didn’t have the HD channel selections.
THANKS!
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is awesome
Totally awesome! I really appreciate it.
It’s funny how hard these things can be to find….
by majoyenrac on Oct 23, 2008 12:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uhhh, I really did not want to read this
“It’s really weird that it’s not bothering me as much as it should or nothing’s really showing up,” Hughes said Thursday. “It’s shocking to our doctors what’s really going on or why nothing’s really showing up. But right now, it’s just kind of sore and it feels like I need a couple days rest.”
by Option27 on Oct 23, 2008 6:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
Someone needs
to step on his toe. Hard.
Everything I post is speculation. I have no insider information nor ideas deemed concrete enough by those who are self-elected to regulate post content.
by cranscape on Oct 23, 2008 8:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
So we should
expect to see him in the starting lineup Oct. 28th? UGH!!!!!
by sue369 on Oct 23, 2008 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Am I the only one who thought the injury was kinda fishy to begin with?
I mean, Mike Miller didn’t land on it, Larry’s arm was twisted up or anything, it just went back wards a bit. I’d really hate to rely on a guy that soft to play major minutes for us.
by Los on Oct 24, 2008 7:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes you are
It looked rough to me. Give him some credit. He’s overpaid and thinks too highly of himself, but that injury didn’t look like it wasn’t an injury.
Bulls reported 6-8 weeks, Larry thinks he’ll be back sooner (unfortunately for our maxed out guard scenario)….
by majoyenrac on Oct 24, 2008 11:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
he wants to keep pace with Candace Parker
by NormVanBeer on Oct 23, 2008 8:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dear John Paxson and Vinny Del Negro,
It could have been different. You could have benched him. Releasing him would have worked. I know nobody wanted him, but that doesn’t mean that you had to play him. Did you think I would just sit idly by and allow him to chuck away this Bulls’ season like so many ill-advised jumpers? Don’t be naive. It didn’t have to be this way. No one had to get hurt.
Sincerely,
God
Cashing checks and having sex.
by MarketMaker on Oct 23, 2008 10:18 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs
I can't find where
but somewhere on this site I commented something like this:
You know, Larry Hughes hasn’t been injured for a while… knock on wood. I’m serious, I di post that. Kinda lke piccolomair’s connection with Hinrich. You know, Larry Hughes has been in the NBA for a while… knock on wood.
by stupidgenius on Oct 26, 2008 12:15 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs
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