Odom for #2 and #16?

by rquinsee on Jun 14, 2006 9:10 AM CDT Comment 33 comments

[From the Diaries. You guys are fast, I just read this Odom rumor and it was already on the blog. I sincerely doubt this has any validity, LA would be nuts to give away Odom for draft picks, especially after the playoffs he had. In fact, in that same DraftExpress link there's a rumor of Garnett going to the Kings for a pretty awful package (Wells/Miller/Thomas/#19), so I'm not putting too much stock into this. Odom's a guy I'd like to have though, he seemed to really mature over the course of last season and at worst is a rich man's Al Harrington.

As for the second part of this diary, I like the draft choices but it still makes the Bulls an extremely young team. -Matt]

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1341

Recently on draftexpress, at the bottom of the page it says the Lakers are keen on Roy, and he's perfect for Jacksons offence. Rumor has the Lakers sending Odom for the Bulls #2 and #16 picks.

I dont like this at all, I see Odom as more of a 3, and even if he does play the 4, i think Chandler needs to be developed here - as he seems muh more comfortable at the 4 than the 5, and is kinda being wasted playing out of his natural position.

It doesnt solve any of our size problem, in either the 2 or 5 positions, and gives us a big contract for a player that doesnt seem likely to help us win a championship, at all.

If I was GM for a day....

I would draft Aldridge. I see Thomas as a 4 (even a 3), and as I said I think we need to keep developing Chandler at that position. Aldridge gives us a big, with some offence skill, who could develop (with some bulk) into a legit 5 down the track. I'd sign Sefolasha with the #16, giving us a bigger defensive 2 for when Gordon can't control his man (hopefully he will improve in this area)

I'd then sign a natural 5 like Nazr, he seems to have better offence than the others which will complement Chandler better to give us some size down low, and either sign someone else (another big? another taller guard? a vet?) or keep some room to resign our core group in the future:

so...

C: Nazr backup:Aldridge
PF:Chandler backup:Sweetney/Aldridge
SF:Deng backup:Nocioni
SG:Gordon backup:Sefolasha
PG:Hinrich backup:Duhon

at 5 - We have a bigger body - true 5 in Nazr, and a fantastic young 6th man in Aldridge (who has offence abilities to compliment Chandlers defence)

at 4 - Chandler will be in his natural position, and wont have to take the bigger 5, hopefully keeping him out of foul trouble, and get him back on track, also his defence will compliment Nazr. Then Sweetney and Aldridge sharing minutes off the bench here. Aldridge will get good experience at both the 5 and 4, playing meningful minutes in a playoff team.

at 3 - Deng and Noc, nuff said

at 2 - Gordon will keep getting better and better, and hopefully his defence will improve with experience (still very young). Sefolasha is there if Gordon cant keep control of his opponent on Defense.

at 1 - Hinrich and Duhon

This lineup gives us room to sign another player, or save cap to resign our core later on, or even package all this talent for a allstar down the track. It gives us options, while keeping our core and allowing them to develop together.

Any feedback would be great!

FanPosts are user-created posts from the BlogABull community, and are to be treated as the opinions and views of that particular user, not that of the blogger or blog community as a whole.

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Not a bad scenario

Here is the quote from the draft express article above...

The Lakers are talking with teams in the top 5 about trading up, and one rumor has them sending Lamar Odom in return for the rights to the #2 and #16 picks. This trade might have to be consummated after the draft, with the Bulls picking for the Lakers on draft night, when Chicago has cap space to take on a bigger contract. Moving Odom's 40 million dollar contract would give the Lakers room to explore the talented free agent class of 2007. This may be where the obvious Brandon Roy to Chicago at #2 smokescreen started from.

I'm not sure what I would think of this move at all. On the one hand, we'd be getting an all-star that can do a lot. On the other, his salary outstrips his production and he is not a traditional four so our front-court problems would still exist. I view this as a leak from the Lakers camp rather than the Bulls. Although, it could help us if Pax is using Roy as a smokescreen to facilitate a trade with Portland.

by CookDing on Jun 14, 2006 9:27 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

True

Aldridge will work out for us, but he's 3yrs away from being a true 5. I watched him in Texas and he may have trouble banging with the centers in the east. As for Sefolasha, too much of a gamble at 16. The Raptors took Roko Ukic at 16 last year and he's not even in the league now. If Carney slips, we gotta take him. He can play 2 in the nba, and you have to love players that play more than 1 position.

by DannyRange on Jun 14, 2006 10:36 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Roko Ukic

The Raps were rumored to be taking Roko Ukic that high (wound up taking Joey Graham), but he actually fell to the point where they grabbed him at #41 overall. He's still in Europe, true, but they also own his rights so it's not a bad pick by any means, especially since he's playing against top competition over there.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 14, 2006 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Square Peg, Round Hole

I like Odom as a player and his versatility - he just doesn't fit on the Bulls though. Also, if the Bulls are going to shell out $12.5, $13.5, and $14.5 million for a player over the next and crucial 3 years, that money should pay for a perrenial All Star - not a guy who's never won anything and has a drug problem.

In Pax we Trust!

by Jobu on Jun 14, 2006 10:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

drug problem

Marijuana's not a drug!

(I'll stop the "half-baked" quote there and if you don't know it you can read it yourself :) )

Honestly though, I don't think that's a big negative in terms of whether to go after Odom. Plus that 'issue' was a few years ago, right?

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Jun 14, 2006 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're right

I agree, Odom is a nice player but he doesn't fit the Bulls' current needs very well, precisely because of his contract. I also agree that the next two or three years are crucial, because eventually Pax will have to make choices about who to lock up and who to trade. But until that time comes, the Bulls should focus on acquiring maximum talent and flexibility.

LaMarcus Aldridge gets a lot of love on this blog, and that's fine, he'll probably be a fine player. I just wonder about his ceiling. To me he appears soft and unassertive. In the Sun Times today he talked about what it meant to be a high pick this year's draft.
''Every player that could be No.1 is in a great position because there's less pressure. LeBron [James] and Yao [Ming], they had pressure from the first day they threw their names into it. There's less hype this year. [In previous] years, they really knew who was going to be the No. 1 pick by the middle of the college season. Or, in LeBron's case, at the beginning of the high school season.''
I'm probably reading too much into this, but that sounds to me like a guy who'd prefer to hang out in the shadows. In terms of acquiring max talent, I would hope to get more from a #2 pick.

That's why I'm for rolling the dice on Ty Thomas. Of all the top-rated guys, he's the closest thing to being a freak. Plus, he's confident and aggressive. Personality isn't something you can work on in the gym. If people are worried about his "I see myself as a 3" comment, just remember, we have two pretty good SF's already. If he's able to steal minutes there, that would be a great problem to have. Pax can always thin out that position later. He's going to have to anyway; they're not going pay big green to two SF's.

My guess is Thomas will eventually play the 4. If he can float around and do other things, a la Shawn Marion, that would be fantastic. Now you're talking about a serious match-up problem. When the Suns and Bulls played this year, Marion ran our front line into the ground. It'd be nice to see the tables turned.

As for the 16th pick, I'm fine with any of the previously mentioned long-armed 2's. The free agent I'd love the Bulls to nab is Nene.

by jamestkirk on Jun 14, 2006 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sefolosha is a gamble?

I agree that if Carney, or Brewer, slips down to 16, you take them in a heartbeat. But Sefolosha is a great great defender and is pretty athletic. I think he's worth a 16th pick. The Bulls are going to work him out, and if they like him enough, they'll make sure they won't get hurt. If you have all 3 of these guys available at 16, I think you take either Carney or Brewer (both are equally good) and then Sefolosha over any other guard such as Mardy Collins or Shannon Brown or Ager.

by RingItUp26 on Jun 14, 2006 11:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

really?

Have you actually seen him play ball?

by micah on Jun 14, 2006 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Trade up

Would any team with a pick lower than 10 be willing to take duhon and the 16th pick in return for their own pick. I love duhon and he was actually hitting some big threes at times this year, but if gordons gonna stay and we draft a guard...duhons getting practically no minutes. I was thinking that if we trade up for a6-10 pick, we could be sure to land brewer. If we pick roy with our first pick, we can choose O'Bryant, Simmons or Shelden Williams.

I am starting to drool over brewer. i know hes not perfect but he weighed in at 223 pounds...the guys been adding some muscle. If you ask me, he is as NBA ready as brandon roy.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1342

Side note: by the way thomas weighed in at 217...on the light side even by small forward standards. You would think he has been in the gym lifting a lil to at least get over 220? Aldridge at 234. Thats not too bad. Needs to gain ten pounds and he should be fine...

by Sambossanova on Jun 14, 2006 11:55 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree...

I'm thinking that Aldridge and Brewer are the way to go if we can get them.

Throw in Nazr or Przybilla and I think we'll be looking good coming into next year.

The backboard is your friend.

my blog

by simplesinger on Jun 14, 2006 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

And for the forseeable future.

The backboard is your friend.

my blog

by simplesinger on Jun 14, 2006 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

my picks

Thomas and trade up for Brewer - they can sign both pryzbilla and nazr

by cje on Jun 14, 2006 8:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Here I go again,,, switching my choice for 2

After seeing those measurements, Thomas is just too small for the Bulls. As much upside as everyone says he has, everyone knew he was inexperienced, and now he only measures in at 6'8 with shoes. The Bulls need height and experience, and that is 2 things going against Thomas. After seeing those measurements, you have to say Aldridge or Bargnani is the guy at 2, or even Roy, but I think you go big at 2. You look at this team and all the studs are basically in your 1-3 positions. You need to balance out this team and get a guy bigger than Deng (the biggest of their best players). In other words, a guy taller than 6'9. Aldridge is 6'10 WITHOUT SHOES!! 6'11 with shoes. If Aldridgge is taken at 1, take Bargnani. That's it. Take Sefolosha at 16 if Brewer and Carney aren't there.

by RingItUp26 on Jun 14, 2006 12:22 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Who's Best?

The Raptors will not pass on Aldridge with the first selection. That being said, the bulls have to take the best player available. I think Gay is the next T-Mac type player in the league, with better defense. He can play the 2 for us, and cause matchup nightmares for the smaller 2's in the east. If we dont go with Gay, then go with Adam Morrison. He will contribute right away. Gay will be one of those players that bulls fans will regret not drafting 3yrs from now.

by DannyRange on Jun 14, 2006 1:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

The Bulls NEED SIZE!!!

It's nice that you guys think the Bulls should go big for their SG position with the No. 2 pick. Gay might be able to play SG, but if there is one player that might have the hardest time with Skiles, from what I hear and saw of him in the NCAA tourney, it is him. Carney, from what I hear, is another one, but he is more like a SG. Bulls are not going to draft Morrison at 2 who is horrific at defense and they have enough SFs. Morrison is not a SG. They need SIZE!! It looks like Thomas is a SF after all, unless he does go to a team that will eventually play like Phoenix. He only is 6'8. Get Aldridge or Bargnani who are both close to 7'0 and already have developed offensive games. Just look at what the Bulls need.

by RingItUp26 on Jun 14, 2006 2:24 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Ronnie Brewer

He's the real deal in my opinion and will be snagged easily in the top ten, if not higher. Those measurements are dead on perfect for an NBA two-guard of the Bulls liking. Everything else about him is butter. His game is extremely impressive and by all accounts he's a "team" guy which fits in with what the Bulls are doing. I would be really scared taking him with #2, but it would be SO SWEET if he fell to 16 (although that will definitely not happen).

Are there any scenarios we could trade up for him? I know that sounds outlandish, and maybe stupid, but he seems ideal. It would give us a guy who can legitmately play 1-3 and help out immediately (unlike Sefolosha). If the scouting is there, I would not protest. As long as we don't have to give up Elton Brand to do it...oops, too late.

by Perch on Jun 14, 2006 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

TY2 good, odom bad

screw odom, that would be just an awful awful trade for us.

I know I say this a lot, but I'm praying for Thomas.

If you haven't already, read this: http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=511

by dcarioca on Jun 14, 2006 6:54 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm with ya

With Thomas, a decent pick at 16, and an athletic big in FA, it wouldn't be hard to imagine a roster where the current core shifts from being the most athletic players on the team to the least. And that would be great.

Instead of trying to create magic with the likes of Harrington, Allen and Schenscher, the core would be running and gunning with a bunch of guys bouncing on pogo sticks. I can already see it.

by jamestkirk on Jun 14, 2006 7:45 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree...

Passing on a guy because he is an inch shorter than first thought is a bit scary. Did everyone see the video posted on this blog about a month ago where Thomas caught a bad lob pass at the top of the square of the backboard and slammed it in? If he can jump to the moon, does it matter if he starts at 6'8" or 6'9"? We can get another big guy with Przybilla, so we'll always have a 7 footer on the court with Przybilla probably sharing a position with Tyson...I don't know if that lost inch in height is going to kill them. The guy can still rebound and block shots.

That said, the weight does concern me...we're still waiting on Tyson to put on that extra 15-20 pounds.

Maybe we can have Sweetney work with Tyson and Tyrus to train them to put on some weight. I can see the three of them now, sharing a booth at White Castle at 2:00 in the morning.

by MMP on Jun 14, 2006 9:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Aldrige fits bull's needs

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=511# Ok, now read this. Thomas is a project, and really not meant to be a powerfoward unless he grows alot more or obtains Ben Wallaces muscles. Aldrigde is a much better choice because he has an offensive presence in the post unlike thomas or anyone on the Bulls as of right now (except for maybe, the small offensive game that sweets showed in the playoffs)

Jordan for three... YES!

by TheDynasty on Jun 14, 2006 7:13 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

if only...

Tyrus Thomas with #2 and Hassan Adams with #16. With Hassan, just imagine a Tyrus Thomas type player with a much better offensive game at the 2. (F Brewer and Collins and Sefalosha) Then sign Nazr or Prysbilla, but I say keep Chandler as the starting 5 and thro Ty2 into the starting mix (Skiles would never do this). Rudy Gay = Luol Deng in my opinion. Brandon Roy is too complacent. Aldridge looks like a big puss. The Bulls are a playoff team and even tho their frontcourt has serious issues, they are in the enviable position of being able to draft the best player available, hence draft Ty2 regardless of him being only 6'8 (only a foot taller than me) because he has allstar potential. Did I mention that Hassan Adams will be the steal of the draft?

by Zac23 on Jun 14, 2006 7:21 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Bargnani

For some reason I would be ok with the Bulls drafting him, I mean Dirk is good...

by Zac23 on Jun 14, 2006 7:24 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Pippen likes Brewer

Former Chicago Bulls star Scottie Pippen, who visited an Arkansas practice last month and spoke 1-on-1 with Brewer, told the Tribune the Bulls ought to give Brewer a look.

"He has a lot of my characteristics," Pippen said. "He's very talented and can be a solid point forward. He works defensively all over the place, more than any of the top players I've seen."

As for Brewer's unconventional shot, Pippen said that "after watching Shawn Marion shoot, I don't judge a High on Weems

by cje on Jun 14, 2006 8:26 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

aldridge

Just a hunch, but from watching him last year, he seems like chandler with offensive game, and less hustle. I could be wrong. But when you saw Ty2 play he was just electric, clearly the best player on the floor. Dare I say, upside? With him in our lineup, plus Nazbilla to give us size and depth, can you imagine kirk, gordon, deng, noce, ty1, and our other rookie guard just flying all over the place? We could be the bizarro suns.

by dcarioca on Jun 14, 2006 9:06 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Suns, etc.

The Suns got far because most west coast teams were easily seduced into playing at their pace, thus negating the height advantage. LAL took 3 games off them by Kobe controlling the pace with Kwame and Odom using their height down low during key stretches. However, they could not maintain the game plan with sub-par role players. If Kobe had a couple sharp shooters he trusted... (What if LA got Reddick? Hmm...)

Offense this season was wacky because of the rule changes. Expect teams to adjust next year.

Rudy Gay and Tyrus Thomas are both 6'8", ~220lbs and can jump through the roof. Why is Thomas the PF and Rudy the SF? Rudy certainly has more skills than Thomas. Does anybody know of a difference in their builds? Maybe Thomas is right and he is more a SF?

Regardless of the current "small ball" fad, as long as the hoop is 10-feet high, the biggest man with skillz is the top commodity.

Roy at #2 has to be a smokescreen.

If Aldridge is still there, the Bulls will select him...

by CRG on Jun 14, 2006 10:05 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Brain hurt

For all the mind changing and confusion this draft is causing I have to admit this is the most "interesting" draft leadup I can remember in the longest time! It just also happens to be the Bulls most "important" offseason in recent memory too, which is good and bad i guess.

Does anyone agree that Chandler must be developed as a 4 to be effective? I just dont see him getting any better at the 5, unless he realy bulks up and 'figures it out' ---- Thats what concerns me most about picking Thomas.

I think The Bulls should pick for a need, especially with his long term contract, hes a great young 4 to build around, and there a playoff team already with such a young team - keep going forward!

by rquinsee on Jun 14, 2006 10:42 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Axioms/Criteria

I haven't seen any agreement on the axioms/criteria that should be guiding the Bulls in this year's draft. Here's mine:

Needs: a two and a four
Next year's draft is loaded with bigs; this years draft has several promising two's.

Corallary: This year draft Roy, Brewer or Sefolsha and see what can be done with the draft pick the Bulls don't need.
3. Sign/trade for a four and/or five as a stop gap measure until next year.

Now we get to player evaluations which is a never ending and on going debate. Once again, here's mine.

Chandler needs to go. He can play some defense, but he is worthless on simple things like a pick and role. He can't catch a return pass and pop a ten foot jumper. Case closed.
Gordon will never be 6'5". QED
Once and for all: Aldridge stunk against Joe Jones of Texas A&M and Tyrus Thomas in the NCAA playoffs.
Ronnie Brewer is BIG, bigger than Thomas. Check out his measurements from the draft camp on DraftExpress. So what's my point? Pax needs to check him out, which of course he will do.

So these are...factors that Pax will put in the pot and stir!

by hlac on Jun 14, 2006 10:51 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree No Alderidge

If Alderidge is a nice guy that's great but he is not going to change - how many years did we wait for Eddy Curry to get an edge (NY is still waiting) Also Alderidge has been injury prone. Brewer is more NBA ready from a defense standpoint than Roy. If his shooting form was not an issue - he would be ahead of Roy. Regarding Chandler - he can be a defensive force at the 4 position - I would like to see how he does this offseason - his excuse last year is his agent told him not to risk injuring himself and he stayed away for the Berto center and working on his game. I actually would sign both Prysbilla and Nazr and move Chandler to 4. Remember that Rodman had limited offensive game but he was a game changer with his defense and his rebounding. I think people need to focus on what Chandler can do rather than what he can't. If his game does not improve this year, than I would say its time for him to go. Philly is looking to trade Samuel Delebert (spelling) - it would be an even trade. Thomas has put on weight and may still be growing - I would not rule him out. Let's not forget the Sam Bouie principle - Never draft for need - you may miss Michael Jordan. The Bulls need to take the best player that has a good work ethic, can play defense and has an edge - at the number 2 spot only roy or thomas fit that description - I take thomas and trade up for Brewer.

by cje on Jun 14, 2006 11:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Spot on

"Regarding Chandler - he can be a defensive force at the 4 position - I would like to see how he does this offseason - his excuse last year is his agent told him not to risk injuring himself and he stayed away for the Berto center and working on his game. I actually would sign both Prysbilla and Nazr and move Chandler to 4. Remember that Rodman had limited offensive game but he was a game changer with his defense and his rebounding. I think people need to focus on what Chandler can do rather than what he can't. If his game does not improve this year, than I would say its time for him to go."

by rquinsee on Jun 14, 2006 11:29 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Ronnie Brewer

Why is everyone so damn high on Brewer? I disagree with the person, who came up with the idea that the bulls need a bigger guard. The Bulls D last year was top-notch, and I thought Hinrich and Gordon did an OK job guarding the taller guards. The only player who really broke down the bulls D was Wade and he isnt even a tall guard. The solution is to trade a player maybe Duhon for a high #2 pick then fill there needs for a tall guard maybe sefolosha if hes willing to play, alot of teams will pass on him because hes not sure if he wants to play right away in the NBA. Most Mock draft have him going in mid to high 2nd round.

Jordan for three... YES!

by TheDynasty on Jun 14, 2006 11:36 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree

That its not as important as our lack of size, and certainly not important enough to draft another 2 guard with our #2 pick. Maybe the #16, but not the #2 - we need a big, a few bigs even

by rquinsee on Jun 14, 2006 11:50 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs