Garnett to Bulls?

by kos on Dec 11, 2006 12:45 PM CST Comment 41 comments

The Daily Herald is reporting that the Bulls and Timberwolves are having preliminary talks about Kevin Garnett:

League sources indicated the Bulls and the Timberwolves have had some preliminary discussions about Garnett -- and the price would be Luol Deng, Tyrus Thomas and possibly a first-round draft pick.

P.J. Brown and a couple of other players would be needed to even out the salaries.

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other considerations solved

I'm not sure whether it is a good or bad idea (or whether the first rounder is the Knicks pick), but it would solve:

The Bulls will have a hard time signing both Nocioni and Deng, who essentially play the same position. Trade solves it.
Tyrus hasn't had enough of a chance to play behind more experienced players. Hence, in my opinion, he has gotten WORSE since the start of the season because of the lack of playing time, and resulting loss in timing and confidence.
Wallace: I think Ben needs a skilled big man alongside him to play at his optimum level. From what I recall, Detroit did not really take off in 2004 until they got Rasheed from Atlanta. It also takes the spotlight off of Ben, who may not be comfortable as the face of the franchise.
Trading away a first round pick give the Bulls more roster flexibility because it is a guaranteed contract that doesn't need to go toward the salary cap. Pheonix may have done the same thing when they basically gave the Bulls the #7 pick (Deng). The Bulls already have enough trouble finding minutes for Tyrus and Thabo, so it would be tough to add yet even more youth to the roster.

I'm sick of my name, damn gwkd.

by GWKD on Dec 11, 2006 1:05 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

So, just out of curiosity, if the Bulls wanted to trade Deng and Thomas for KG, and they wanted to trade BG7 and the #1 for Iverson, are there enough additional pieces to make that work? Does that put the Bulls deep in cap hell?

If so (and I'm sorry for not doing the leg work here but I only have a moment), you could have Wallace, KG, Chapu, AI, Hinrich as your starting 5. I must say, that's a pretty impressive starting 5.

B-jizzle my nizzle!

by preverbal on Dec 11, 2006 1:32 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

we dont have enough cap room to make the trades

our big contracts to dump off are sweets, and PJ. we could trade for one of the 2, but not boht (unless you want to get wallace out). Even if we didnt want hinrich (which is stupid speculation) hes still under his team option extension - his big contract doesnt come on the books till next year

only way you can come close to both is dumping like 10 players, including everyone in the core and Wallace

by milesgmsu on Dec 11, 2006 2:26 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

2. Tyrus

I cannot say that I agree with point #2. Tyrus has not gotten worse since he has been with the Bulls. Did you watch the summer camp at all? Tyrus has played some good games as of late and has shown glimpses of what type of player he can be in this league.

The coaching staff has him playing within his limits right now, and I am happy with the young guys progress so far.

Finally, any trade we make would have to involve PJ Brown, so unless we are getting some size back the Bulls are not going to do it.

by Jesse07 on Dec 11, 2006 2:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

just some youtube highlights

from the summer. He seemed much more confident at least. Even if he had no form on his threes, at least he wasn't afraid to put them up.

Saturday night it didn't look like he could do anything offensively. I can't cite anything from memory, but he seemed without any finesse. I'm also left with the indelible memory of Tyrus shooting a 45 J off the side of the backboard in some game about a week ago. Those are plays that I make when I haven't played in awhile. And there's is no excuse for a professional to ever ever ever, shoot a ball off the side of the backboard (unless you are Ben Wallace, apparently).

I'm sick of my name, damn gwkd.

by GWKD on Dec 11, 2006 3:27 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

the fact that he's not throwing up 3's

is testament to how he has gotten better. Anyone who saw him play the first 2 weeks of the season knows the cringing feeling I got when he came on the court, or god forbid when he got the ball around the elbow.

ANyone who watched any games during the 7 game streak (granted it was against atrcious competiton) knows that there wasnt as bad of a crining feelings...t2 felt like he was part of the offense as opposed to a hinderance

by milesgmsu on Dec 11, 2006 3:56 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Not to

mention that Pip is mentoring Tyrus now so I look for great things from him.

Thabo....the accent is sweet!!

by sue369 on Dec 11, 2006 4:40 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't like giving up Deng.

IMHO, he's the one player on our team that could be better than Garnett. Garnett doesn't have enough good years left(though, like Iverson, people have been saying this for years). It turns us completely around from a great young team that needs a couple years to one that doesn't have more than that to win. I would do it for Noce instead of Deng, if we resigned him for a couple years for them. Deng and Thomas is too much, I think.

Who can be a go to scorer for the Bulls?

by cubbybear on Dec 11, 2006 3:18 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Deng is the man but...

It's a really tough call. Garnett has been around the league forever but big men tend to age better than guards. With that in mind I'd much rather trade for Garnett than AI. Garnett may be the one guy it would be worth parting with Deng for. If we could send off anyone else on our team I'd do it in a second, even Kirk. I'd love if we could ship off Tyrus and Gordon for KG. That'd be a steal.

by theundergroundman on Dec 11, 2006 8:52 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i'd take

gasol over garnett. his price is lower and his upside is higher.

by sam on Dec 11, 2006 3:28 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

agreed

I completely agree with that. Gasol is I think only 26 years old. And I think 3-5 million less in the following two years. I have mixed feelings about trading for all these old players and cant we get rid of Ben Gordon instead of Deng? Tyrus Thomas, BG, PJ Brown and the knicks pick (possibly #1 protected but thats dobtful). I would do that although I ahve no idea if that works out. probably have to throw in sweetney and or khryapa or someone.

by Sambossanova on Dec 11, 2006 3:54 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

GASOL SALARY

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/memphis.htm

compare that to garnett's salary

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/minnesota.htm

I think it is fair to say that paying gasol 13 million is a better value than paying Garnett 21 million.

by Sambossanova on Dec 11, 2006 4:21 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Trial Trade

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=99~2381~996&teams=29~29~4

Would you all do this?

by sam on Dec 12, 2006 12:09 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

duh

....hm yea

by Sambossanova on Dec 12, 2006 3:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

it works

but jerry west isnt an idiot...even with the future of the franchrise in limbo...we'd have to throw in the knicks pick protected and a second rounder or 2....west likes the 2nd rounders

by milesgmsu on Dec 12, 2006 4:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

So not worth it.

I wouldn't give up Deng here, especially since Garnett can walk after next year and leave us with jack shit.

I also don't see both Deng and Ty being traded for something that could only last less than two years.

"all the girls loved BJ." -sue369

by Colossus on Dec 11, 2006 4:15 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

And that's the key question

Would Garnett stay? If the Bulls got to the conference finals, it'd be likely. And with Wallace and Garnett on the interior, I have to think the team would get at least that far. Wallace definitely misses having another shotblocker (Rasheed) on the floor right now. The team is adjusting and all, but Garnett would change everything.

I think it's a huge gamble and I agree with the people who have said trade Gordon and/or Nocioni instead of Deng.

Deng 4 MVP, 2008!

by corey williams corey benjamin on Dec 11, 2006 4:18 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Even if

Garnett said, "I want to stay with the Bulls until I retire years and years from now," I still wouldn't believe him. If you don't have it on paper, it's absolutely worthless.

"all the girls loved BJ." -sue369

by Colossus on Dec 11, 2006 4:42 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I can't stand

the thought of losing Deng or Noc. Gordon wouldn't bother me at all. I would hate to see TT leave but if it would help the team then do it. Now I'm not even excited about the game tonight. :(

Thabo....the accent is sweet!!

by sue369 on Dec 11, 2006 4:45 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

deng but Noc

Nocioni is a good player but...hes short and hes expendable and he needs to be resigned and we might not have enough money to do so. Trade him while he is sitll knocking those three pointers.

by Sambossanova on Dec 11, 2006 4:50 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree 100%

Noc is more expendable.

"all the girls loved BJ." -sue369

by Colossus on Dec 11, 2006 5:33 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

correction

its not that they are having discussions.

its that theyve HAD discussions.

BIG DIFFERENCE.

by Option27 on Dec 11, 2006 5:12 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

I know

everyone loves Deng but I think we might be shortsighted if we don't consider this. Stars win championships and Deng / Thomas may never be. Garnett does a lot of things on the court, great defender and can draw double team which would really open it up for Noc, Gordon, Hinrich on outside.

Lose depth but you have 5 guys who can play 30+ mins and would have to be #1 in East.

Hinrich/Duhon
Thabo/Gordon
Noc/Griffin
KG/Krappy
Wallace/Malik

I would be for Bulls getting garnett if they had an extension lined up. I also think Deng / Tyrus plus cap room from Brown/Sweets should be limit. Need to keep that 2007 pick to build behind KG/Wallace.

by NY Chicago Fan on Dec 11, 2006 6:04 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

Exactly

Look, I heart Deng A LOT. Even more than those weird ass Raptor fans. But to say that Deng is more valuable than the Big Ticket makes no sense to me. We're talking about a league MVP, defensive force, and seemingly one of the hardest working and selfless NBA SuperStars in the world.

If you're team has a legit shot at a championship, in any sport for that matter, you do what it takes to make it happen.

In Pax we Trust!

by Jobu on Dec 11, 2006 7:44 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Matt's man

Sam was on CTL tonight and he said AI is not coming to the Bulls and he thinks AI will end up in MN with KG.

Thabo....the accent is sweet!!

by sue369 on Dec 11, 2006 6:41 PM CST reply actions 0 recs

which means

He's probably wrong.

I think Pax has tried to talk McHale into trading KG to us - probably a lot this summer, but I don't think McHale has the guts to do it.

by KT on Dec 11, 2006 7:11 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Personally

I'm not a huge fan of this trade. Yes, getting Garnett would be a boon for the Bulls. We'd immediately have an offensive presence in the front-court, a true "leader" for the team to rally around and a pony we could ride deep into the playoffs. However, we'd also have two great players on the downslope of their careers, both in the front court and both hogging ALL of our salary capy (36 mill for TWO players that are like 48 years old, we'd have no youth in the frontcourt and no prospects for adding any in the next couple of years and we'd possibly lose Garnett if things didn't work out as planned. Plus, if we retained Garnett, chances are that it would be for an equally cap-crippling figure and a ridiculously long amount of years.
What would we be losing? Deng, who has been fantastic for us and still has yet to approach his ceiling; Thomas, who is young and raw but definitely seems to have a very bright future on this team and a high pick in what promises to be a historic draft for big men (Oden, Durant, Noah, Harford, Brewer, McRoberts, Hansborough, Davis all being top-tier big men not to mention you're DJ White, Aaron Gray level talents behind them).
Remember, just a few years ago we were arguing whether Garnett could get his team past the first round. When it finally happened, wasn't Sam Cassell more of the driving force?
I think KG is awesome and I actually argued in favor of trading for him before the start of the season. However, I've had time to cool off from the insanity of the off-season and see that we have many years of competitive basketball ahead of us. Given that Deng and Thomas both have uncommonly high potential, why tear it apart?
What other team in the East can say their future is as bright as our's?

by CookDing on Dec 12, 2006 8:23 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

well said

I'm sick of my name, damn gwkd.

by GWKD on Dec 12, 2006 10:07 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

agreed

Also:

Big trades for veteran 'stars' rarely result in a championship. If McRoberts was taller and had a coach who could run an offense he'd be an intriguing Brad Miller-esque talent (No other reason to add that except for a you-heard-it-here-first factor). Yes, they are both white, that's not why, and you win a blogabull themed Nintendo Wii if you know what college Miller went to.

by Paxson Jackson on Dec 12, 2006 10:21 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Purdue

Duh.

Favorite game with two roommates two years ago: When watching any pro football or basketball game, randomly bust out, "What school did he go to?"

I won most of the time. It was considered a victory if they knew the answer. Double bonus points if I asked, they knew, then they asked another player, I didn't know, but they did.

Also, saw Duke play in KC before Thanksgiving (26-year-old cousin (my age, too) has been a huge fan since 1990 (Hurley and Hill) and first time he has seen them live). Anyway, McRoberts is way more athletic than Miller. Not that the stats would ever be that different, 15/9/5, but he is a lot more like a PF than a C. Which I guess is kind of what you said. He just seems a lot quicker, a lot more of a guy who can create his own shot.

by tyger1147 on Dec 12, 2006 11:24 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

rasheeeeeed wallace

(I know you said 'rarely', but still)

Miller went to Purdue. Can I win the blogAbull-themed Wii if I already own it? It comes with customized mii characters of all the Bulls.

by your friendly BullsBlogger on Dec 12, 2006 11:27 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

Purdue. I'll take it a step further. He also went to high school in Indiana, got busted for doing something shady and shipped off to the Northeast. Why do I know this? Because my brother knows his uncle, Tommy Heitz. Tommy played for Kentucky in the 80's when they went as far as the Final Four. Talk about genes, their is nobody in that family under 6'10'' and I think they had like 2 7-footers.

by CookDing on Dec 12, 2006 3:58 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm sorry

the Wii has already been awarded to Matt. Although he should be thoroughly dissapointed that it came with an Xbox Burger King game.

by Paxson Jackson on Dec 12, 2006 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

HEY!!!

If we're giving out prizes, I was actually the first one to say Purdue. I even suggested an entire game. check the timestamps. I want my Wii!! Give credit where credit is due.

by tyger1147 on Dec 12, 2006 6:30 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree too.

Thabo....the accent is sweet!!

by sue369 on Dec 12, 2006 11:15 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Elton Brand Repeat

All, I think everyone can see that Deng has matured a lot since last season and he has developed the ability to make a move and get to the hole. Garnett would certainly be a big initial boost to the team but I don't think we will win it all with him. He is just a bit too old to provide at the highest level for the next couple of years. Plus, when our young team is playing well I think they are one of the most entertaining teams to watch.

If I thought he would provide a better chance of bringing the brass back to Chicago I'd say go for it, but at this price it doesn't make sense.

At least Skiles has struck down any rumors of trading for AI.

by Jud Buechler on Dec 12, 2006 10:09 AM CST reply actions 0 recs